Satele Shan vs. Obi Wan ROTS
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carthage
Both fighters are bloodlusted/morals off
Round 2 Satele gets Agen Kolar, Kenobi gets Darth Malgus
WildBantha88
Satele ragdolls round 1 team 2 takes round 2
Sinious
Round 1: Kenobi takes sabers but Satele takes all out.
Round 2: Team 2 wins.
ILS
Is it even within Satele's morals to ragdoll another Jedi?
Dionysus
Originally posted by Sinious
Round 1: Kenobi takes sabers but Satele takes all out.
Round 2: Team 2 wins.
Based
Originally posted by ILS
Is it even within Satele's morals to ragdoll another Jedi?
Does it matter?
Satele wins round one, Obi-Wan wins team.
NewGuy01
Originally posted by ILS
Is it even within Satele's morals to ragdoll another Jedi?
Yeah, I know! It's almost as if morals were off in this fight.
Emperordmb
Originally posted by Sinious
Round 1: Kenobi takes sabers but Satele takes all out.
Round 2: Team 2 wins.
Agreed, Satele could take Kenobi in single combat. But if you give Kenobi Malgus and give Satele Kolar, the whole thing becomes incredibly lopsided in team two's favor.
ILS
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Yeah, I know! It's almost as if morals were off in this fight. I forgot carthage always has his threads set to bloodlusted. Sue me.
In-character Kenobi wins.
ILS
Pretty much. Satele is in the same ballpark as Quinlan Vos, in terms of quality and fighting style, and we saw what Kolar did to him.
Based
Except her force powers are on a completely different tier than Vos.
carthage
Which has nothing to do with her skill as a duelist
ILS
Originally posted by carthage
Which has nothing to do with her skill as a duelist
Yeah, I don't think he has quite been able to grasp that.
Emperordmb
Unless I missed something, this is an all-out fight.
ILS
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Unless I missed something, this is an all-out fight. Based is developing a habit of leaping into debates about Force power when I'm talking about dueling skill.
Even accounting for Satele's Force power, if she engaged in a duel with Agen Kolar there isn't much to suggest that he couldn't dismember her in roughly the same time he could have done so to Quinlan Vos.
Emperordmb
Originally posted by ILS
Based is developing a habit of leaping into debates about Force power when I'm talking about dueling skill.
Even accounting for Satele's Force power, if she engaged in a duel with Agen Kolar there isn't much to suggest that he couldn't dismember her in roughly the same time he could have done so to Quinlan Vos.
Carthage said Kolar>Satele in the context of an all-out fight, you agreed with him, and Based brought up her force powers. Not really seeing how his point is inapplicable to the argument.
ILS
Originally posted by Emperordmb
Carthage said Kolar>Satele in the context of an all-out fight, you agreed with him, and Based brought up her force powers. Not really seeing how his point is inapplicable to the argument. No, I referenced Satele's quality as a duelist and her use of Ataru in the context of putting her in Vos' place when Kolar thrashed him, which has nothing to do with Force power and everything to do with dueling ability.
Revanchiste
First round, blood lusted.... = Go to force power (Like Luke skywalker in DE when he is so piss off....) And because she is a shan and have Revan blood, eeerr O.P power !! Remember against malgus....
Same for Kolar.. You defeat her in light saber duelling she still have her tutaminis, and O.P power. Kolar will surely cut her light saber staff...
Obiwan against Malgus... The isn't any of malgus force attack couldn't be counter by Obiwan. That's a bit bad said er wrote, but nevermind.
I mean obiwan can resist to all malgus force attacks...... But I don't know in light saber... Malgus is fast and strong obiwan is faster and is guard is more resistant.... Malgus have his armor....
Based
Originally posted by ILS
Is it even within Satele's morals to ragdoll another Jedi?
Originally posted by ILS
I forgot carthage always has his threads set to bloodlusted. Sue me.
In-character Kenobi wins.
Originally posted by ILS
Pretty much. Satele is in the same ballpark as Quinlan Vos, in terms of quality and fighting style, and we saw what Kolar did to him.
I assumed you were talking about an all out fight as what the OP stated. Your previous posts mentioned nothing of only lightsaber combat and skill.
Your first post noted your lack of reading skills.
Your second post admitted a lack of reading skills.
Your third post states that "Satele is in the same ballpark as Quinlan Vos" which I assumed meant an all out battle per the OP. And while I do admit that you say that her "fighting style" was in terms of lightsaber combat I assumed that quality had that to do with force prowess rather than lightsaber skill because your previous posts had nothing to say about the topic and rather about your lack of reading skills.
So forgive my assumptions but there was a reason for them in the first place.
Carthage's post "Kolar> Satele" I assumed again was within his style of lowball trolling which he does in every thread. Since the OP again was an all out battle and not purely sabers I assumed he meant in totality Kolar> Satele.
I don't know y u so mad here, ILS.
carthage
Your butthurt is duly noted Based, but maybe if you had bothered reading instead of spouting off. ILS was referencing my post and speaking solely about dueling skill not force abilities. Continue wanking TOR though lmao
Based
Originally posted by carthage
but maybe if you had bothered reading instead of spouting off. ILS was referencing my post and speaking solely about dueling skill not force abilities.
wtflol read what, exactly? You mean your only post in this thread?
Originally posted by carthage
Kolar> Satele
Neither of you even used the words "lightsaber combat" in this entire thread until after I posted. I mean reading simpleminded posts are easy but not to the point where I can guess what specifically you are arguing without mentioning it.
Are you kidding me? I attack Legend on his bullshit almost every time he posts, I am not remotely close to being on that side.
WildBantha88
Originally posted by ILS
Based is developing a habit of leaping into debates about Force power when I'm talking about dueling skill.
Even accounting for Satele's Force power, if she engaged in a duel with Agen Kolar there isn't much to suggest that he couldn't dismember her in roughly the same time he could have done so to Quinlan Vos. let's just say Kolar did put satele on her back foot in a lightsaber duel. What them? Satele resorts to her force powers, trying to crush him under a tree or palming a lightsaber. Satele utterly outranks Kolar in the force so he wins a lightsaber duel just to get defeated with the force.
The folly of your argument is that you are trying to say dueling skills trump force abilities because a duelist can kill an opponent before they resort to the force, and that is simply untrue.
carthage
I'm guessing your reading comprehension is still shit. Neither ILS or I denied that Satele would take Kolar or Kenobi out via the force, we were speaking specifically about dueling. Maybe you should not judge by a single post, but given that you always wank Satele (usually showing up in every thread of hers)I know it must be hard.
Lol
Right
ILS
Originally posted by Based
I assumed you were talking about an all out fight as what the OP stated. Your previous posts mentioned nothing of only lightsaber combat and skill.
Your first post noted your lack of reading skills.
Your second post admitted a lack of reading skills.
Your third post states that "Satele is in the same ballpark as Quinlan Vos" which I assumed meant an all out battle per the OP. And while I do admit that you say that her "fighting style" was in terms of lightsaber combat I assumed that quality had that to do with force prowess rather than lightsaber skill because your previous posts had nothing to say about the topic and rather about your lack of reading skills.
So forgive my assumptions but there was a reason for them in the first place.
Carthage's post "Kolar> Satele" I assumed again was within his style of lowball trolling which he does in every thread. Since the OP again was an all out battle and not purely sabers I assumed he meant in totality Kolar> Satele.
I don't know y u so mad here, ILS. Dude, why do you care so much about it? You assumed wrongly about what I meant, and I wasn't even talking to you in the first place - simple as that. You rarely produce anything worth reading as it is, little rants like this aren't helping matters.
ILS
Originally posted by WildBantha88
let's just say Kolar did put satele on her back foot in a lightsaber duel. What them? Satele resorts to her force powers, trying to crush him under a tree or palming a lightsaber. Satele utterly outranks Kolar in the force so he wins a lightsaber duel just to get defeated with the force.
The folly of your argument is that you are trying to say dueling skills trump force abilities because a duelist can kill an opponent before they resort to the force, and that is simply untrue. On her back? Why wouldn't he cut her in half? When he was fighting Quinlan Vos he could have easily taken his arm off. In a fight with a stranger who he isn't trying to apprehend you can bet that that arm is coming off. Which is my point - Satele is generally someone who likes to duel, so if she does that with Kolar for even the briefest of durations she's going to end up dismembered. There is potential for her lashing out with the Force but I don't see it.
Based
Originally posted by carthage
specifically about dueling. Maybe you should not judge by a single post
You never mentioned light saber combat at all. I'm actually trying desperately to understand how your mind works here.
The winner of this macthup in any facet is irrelevant. Since when did you at all mention that you were only talking about saber combat? Answer the question ffs.
Originally posted by ILS
Dude, why do you care so much about it?
Unless I'm missing out on some deleted posts, the sequence of posts in this thread talked about all out combat. Not once did you use the word lightsaber at all which is why I'm confused.
yeah u mad.
carthage
facepalm
I never disagreed that She would win in an all out match against Kolar. Again he mentioned their skill relating to dueling, none of us mentioned anything about force abilities you were the only one that did:
Originally posted by Based
Except her force powers are on a completely different tier than Vos.
Originally posted by ILS
Pretty much. Satele is in the same ballpark as Quinlan Vos, in terms of quality and fighting style
Originally posted by ILS
No, I referenced Satele's quality as a duelist and her use of Ataru in the context of putting her in Vos' place when Kolar thrashed him, which has nothing to do with Force power and everything to do with dueling ability.
You were the only one that brought up force abilities genius
Fated Xtasy
Originally posted by ILS
On her back? Why wouldn't he cut her in half? When he was fighting Quinlan Vos he could have easily taken his arm off.
Except that version of Vos, was considered by Dooku to be of Atrocious skill
People forget that Quinlan only "beat" Bulq after training for awhile. Satele could beat Kolar in force and sabers.
Based
Originally posted by carthage
facepalm
Again he mentioned their skill relating to dueling
Here's the disconnect, where was this ever stated? Like quote it unless that's too hard.
Emperordmb
Based is 100% right here. He's being unfairly shit on for "not grasping a point" that was never even made to begin with. The whole insulting of Based in this thread is unjustified bullshit.
NewGuy01
Originally posted by Fated Xtasy
Except that version of Vos, was considered by Dooku to be of Atrocious skill
People forget that Quinlan only "beat" Bulq after training for awhile.
Dooku considers Grievous to have atrocious technique as well. It's not that people have forgotten, it simply that you have yet to prove that he's gained substantially enough for it to be relevant.
carthage
lmao
Try reading the quoted posts or going to the first page, neither of the two posts ILS made had anything to do with him bringing up force ability. But I'm not going to speak for him, he can defend himself.
Based
Originally posted by Based
Like quote it unless that's too hard.
Your troll game is improving carthage.
carthage
I already brought up the quotes. Are you blind?
Emperordmb
The claim was made that Kolar>Satele in an all out fight. ILS agreed with that by talking about how Kolar is her superior in lightsaber combat. Based responded by pointing out Satele's superior force powers in the context of an all out fight.
The context was never changed from that of an all out fight, Based responded to the context of the all-out fight, Based got unfairly shit on, and despite numerous attempts to try and explain this very simple thing, Based is still getting unfairly shit on.
Fated Xtasy
Originally posted by NewGuy01
Dooku considers Grievous to have atrocious technique as well. It's not that people have forgotten, it simply that you have yet to prove that he's gained substantially enough for it to be relevant.
He goes from being defeated by Kolar, to holding his own against a Vaapad master that fought against Mace Windu
carthage
DMB you're on ignore for a reason. Nothing you say is worth reading, go back to your forum
Based
And your troll game decreased yet again. A lot of inconsistent showings here.
ILS
Pretty much this.
Oh cry me a river. The guy prances around in every thread trying to catch people out, and when unsuccessful says "yeh u mad" a few times before leaving. Not only is he a troll, he's an exceptionally shite one.
Dooku has spoken ill of Maul, Ventress, Grievous, and more in terms of their dueling - his word carries no weight, plus he's usually referencing their approach to combat and choice of technique rather than skill. For instance, he detests Ataru because of it's pointless energy consuming acrobatics, which is the Form Vos uses primarily. He detests Grievous' lack of finesse in his dueling. He hates the way Ventress, Maul and Grievous choose to use more than one blade in combat.
Vos did improve by the time he was taking on Bulq, and I believe even after the fight with Bulq he improved due to the fact he became better at keeping a clear head. But that's not to say he was an abhorrent duelist before being trained by Dooku. He has feats like casually subduing Tol Skorr and Cadrian Sey on a Dark Side nexus. Not to say they are amazing duelists, but the nexus, their number advantage, and the nature in which Vos defeated them makes the feat more impressive. There's also the fact Vos was superior to Aayla Secura around this time period, judging by their fights against common opponents (the Morgukai), and Aayla was able to defeat Aurra Sing, who has accolades like being one of the most deadly beings in the galaxy, and has been able to challenge various Jedi, even TPM Jinn and Kenobi simultaneously from what I hear.
The main point being - Vos, even at this point, was roughly as skilled as Satele, and Kolar pretty much could have left him in pieces if he really wanted to. Satele shouldn't really be any different, especially because she has an affinity for dueling. She can use the Force in some scenarios but more often than not I would see Kolar dismembering her before she got the chance.
Kolar is a better duelist than Bulq. The main reason Bulq dueled evenly with Mace Windu was due to their familiarity with each other's fighting style, akin to how Anakin and Obi-Wan can prolong fights due to their intrinsic knowledge of how one another fight. When Bulq lacked this knowledge against a duelist of equal calibre - Dooku - he and Tholme were wrecked simultaneously. Admittedly partly by the Force, but Dooku disarmed Bulq despite being confronted by the two of them. Kolar absolutely wrecking Quinlan puts him closer to Dooku than Bulq. And I do believe regardless that Bulq is, at this moment in time, somewhat more skilled than Vos, but Vos is at least good enough to hold his own against him.
Based
Originally posted by ILS
Oh cry me a river. The guy prances around in every thread trying to catch people out
lolwtf. I go in a thread, say who I think will win and that's pretty much it. =/
I did that like three times (prior to tonight) so I honestly don't understand what's going on but I'm actually very amused. Ant once called me out on it but I can at least understand his rationale then.
Did carthage wake his boyfriend up so you can get angry together?
carthage
Accuses someone of being mad=drags on thread onto third page
ILS
Have fun being on ignore, bro.
Based
Originally posted by ILS
Have fun being on ignore, bro.
Ironically the coolest end to this is also the most reactionary.
Based
Now THIS guy can troll. How are you?
Nephthys
The idea that Kolar can demolish Satele in sabers is hilarious. She's got the strength, speed, power and skill to go toe to toe with him and probably win.
ILS
Originally posted by Nephthys
The idea that Kolar can demolish Satele in sabers is hilarious. She's got the strength, speed, power and skill to go toe to toe with him and probably win. I'd love to hear why.
ILS
He would win in roughly the same time he defeated Quinlan Vos. Within a page.
Nephthys
Satele > Vos. The man is basically fodder.
Originally posted by ILS
I'd love to hear why.
Didn't I just say why? Would you like me to just list her feats?
Strength: She held off Malgus with one hand and he couldn't overpower her in a direct physical contest.
Speed: Blitz'd Sith Warriors, killed 3 Sith instantly after she blasted them into the air, kept up with Malgus in speed and Eldon Ax, somebody who has swung her blade like a propeller, remarks that Shan's speed is unbelievable.
Power: Blew apart or crushed Hex droids, shattered blast door, palmed a lightsaber, implicitly more powerful than a Jedi who collapsed two buildings with TK.
Skill: Fodderised elite Sith Warriors, her fights with Malgus, said to be so skilled that violence seemed like life itself to her.
ILS
Eh, to be fair her speed is beyond Vos'. I was probably being hasty with my initial assessment but traits like her strength or skill don't go against my argument. Vos obviously isn't fodder for Satele in a duel, that's nonsense.
Kolar would defeat her in a duel, though. Skill is by far more important than physical stats when there isn't much of a disparity there. She'd hold her own better than Vos, perhaps.. but she would still lose, he's just substantially more skilled than her. Going by accolades or feats.
Nephthys
Power is a very important stat too, remember. Vos seems to be fodder to a lot of people. He sucks in general.
I disagree on both your points. Satele being faster, stronger and more powerful is a more important factor than Kolar's skill. Which I disagree is substantially greater than hers, or greater at all really. That Obi-Wan thought him one of the best duelists ever isn't that great.
ILS
Well, respectfully, I kind of doubt you're open-minded enough to be convinced that Quinlan Vos is anything more than fodder or that a member of the "B-Team" is actually good at something, so we can agree to disagree if you want.
Nephthys
That I think combatants like Malgus and Satele are above them does mean I don't think they're good. Just not as good as you think they are. Perhaps you overestimate them.
ILS
I overestimated Kolar somewhat in this thread but I think it's safe to say you are also guilty of overestimating characters.... particularly ones you enjoy that are put in threads with characters you appear to loathe.
Nephthys
Such as?
And considering you claimed Kolar would demolish her, I'm hardly the only one being close-minded about combatants being good. She's pretty good too.
ILS
Hmmmmm... Bane? Zannah? Any TOR character when it comes to dueling skill debates with PT characters?
If I really was as closed-minded as you I never would have conceded that I overstated his abilities. You can go for pages fruitlessly arguing in favour of your favourites.
Nephthys
I meant who do I loath? :U
Ok, maybe that was unfair. Sorry.
carthage
Originally posted by ILS
Hmmmmm... Bane? Zannah? Any TOR character when it comes to dueling skill debates with PT characters?
If I really was as closed-minded as you I never would have conceded that I overstated his abilities. You can go for pages fruitlessly arguing in favour of your favourites.
He can go on for pages losing. Look up any debate with Tempest or Sidious66 to see what I mean
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