Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

http://bluenationreview.com/report-60000-veterans-will-hit-planned-food-stamp-cuts/

**** all them

Originally posted by Lestov16
http://bluenationreview.com/report-60000-veterans-will-hit-planned-food-stamp-cuts/

From the party who brought us: "You don't support the troops!"

The GOP just wants veterans to become independent and lift themselves up by their bootstraps.

Good.

Maybe this will dissuade the new generation of idiots from enlisting.

If Vietnam couldn't scare people into not enlisting, nothing will.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Good.

Maybe this will dissuade the new generation of idiots from enlisting.

Butthurt much, hey I guess people should not have free will though. I mean gee, if I had known I would not have food stamps after getting out, I prolly would not have joined...(sarcasm).

I guess the GOP theory is to cut all social programs and somehow this will create a lot of fulltime work and folks won't need any social programs no more. Great logic.

It lowers taxes, pumping money into the economy, business grows, & Jobs increase.

Also I'm a veteran.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Butthurt much, hey I guess people should not have free will though. I mean gee, if I had known I would not have food stamps after getting out, I prolly would not have joined...(sarcasm).






I don't know what krisblaze's problem is. Someone needs to remove the stick from his butthurt ***.

Because he thinks that the American military preys on men and women from impoverished areas, promising them a way out of their lives in to something far better, then ends up scarring a lot of them for life when they eventually come back with PTSD?

I have no problem with America having a military, but don't pretend it's some benevolent organisation.

Well, if that's what he thinks then he's the one who's the "idiot". Not all Americans who join the military to serve their country do so because they feel they are forced to for financial reasons. In fact, most do it because it's an honor. I certainly didn't enlist in the US Navy because I thought it was my only option after high school. Also, being able to see the world while in the military is quite rewarding in itself.


Oh, and it's no less benevolent than any other country's military, PR. I have no problem with someone thinking what you claim krisblaze thinks about our military but when he calls people who have chosen to join the military "idiots" then I do.

Originally posted by Star428
Well, if that's what he thinks then he's the one who's the "idiot". Not all Americans who join the military to serve their country do so because they feel they are forced to for financial reasons. In fact, most do it because it's an honor. I certainly didn't enlist in the US Navy because I thought it was my only option after high school. Also, being able to see the world while in the military is quite rewarding in itself.


Oh, and it's no less benevolent than any other country's military, PR. I have no problem with someone thinking what you claim krisblaze thinks about our military but when he calls people who have chosen to join the military "idiots" then I do.

I never said all, though.

And no, not all people who enlist are idiots, obviously. Just a portion of them.

Eh, if these "veterans" cared about their country they would still be fighting and dying for me and my rich buddies' interests /GOP

Originally posted by Star428
Oh, and it's no less benevolent than any other country's military, PR. I have no problem with someone thinking what you claim krisblaze thinks about our military but when he calls people who have chosen to join the military "idiots" then I do.

Come to Norway and sort out this problem of yours tough guy

You can beat me up, go to jail, get an education in jail and return to America as an enlightened individual, not some mudcrawler.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Because he thinks that the American military preys on men and women from impoverished areas, promising them a way out of their lives in to something far better, then ends up scarring a lot of them for life when they eventually come back with PTSD?

I have no problem with America having a military, but don't pretend it's some benevolent organisation.

Bingo bango.

Though I said that this new generation was a bunch of idiots, generation z. Not people who enlisted.

I know a lot of people in the army, they're both idiots and smart people

American military have killed innocents without a battle even going on, our army has gone into homes and killed entire innocent families, even helpless defenseless ones.

Let that sink in for a moment.

... Are you going through a rebellious phase?

Originally posted by Jmanghan
American military have killed innocents without a battle even going on, our army has gone into homes and killed entire innocent families, even helpless defenseless ones.

Let that sink in for a moment.


Prove it. Show me a link to a reliable source that proves our military is the evil bastards you and others are making them out to be. Until then, you're just blowing hot air out your ass, dude.



You sound awfully treasonous. When I think about all the American men and women in uniform who've died so you can enjoy the freedom to say stupid treasonous things like that it makes me sick to my stomach. I think you should be deported and banned from ever setting foot on American soil ever again. You actually call yourself an American? You're a disgrace.



Let that sink for a moment, dumbass.

I'm beginning to think that you're a sock of one of the others who was bashing our military because I've never heard an American say treasonous stuff like that.

^I'm beginning to think you'll be banned long before he is

Oh, and by the way, IF (and that's a big "if" our military has done anything questionable it's because they were ordered to by the government. The men and women in uniform are just following orders from the top. But I stil wanna see some proof of our military willingly murdering innocent families. Our military is no more evil than any other country's military.

Star, Krisblaze is a troubled youth who thinks his ass is high and mighty because he is Norwegian. Truth is most people here who trash talk about military never walked a day in their shoes and pretty much pussy's in general. Norway was completely run over by Germany in 1940, shows how strong they are as a people. Now they have a stick up their ass cause they are a rich country but still regarded as a welfare state. I can see why he is all pissy that veterans might lose welfare benefits. He does not care, he just around to "No you" the situation.

Don't worry though, when Putin run's them over they will be calling for our help to save them, much like everyone else does.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Because he thinks that the American military preys on men and women from impoverished areas, promising them a way out of their lives in to something far better, then ends up scarring a lot of them for life when they eventually come back with PTSD?

I have no problem with America having a military, but don't pretend it's some benevolent organisation.

Actually most wear PTSD as a badge of courage and I like myself would do it again. Anyone can get PTSD from anything. No one is promised to be a millionare from the military but its simple to understand why low income and impoverished people join. They most likely see it as a better opportunity and way out of the situation they were in. Everyone joins for their own reason. I myself dropped out of school to join cause of 9/11. After I got out and went back and got a better degree then the one I was previously pursuing and GI Bill paid for both my Undergrad and now working on my Graduate. Its not a bad trade off.

Best job I ever had.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Star, Krisblaze is a troubled youth who thinks his ass is high and mighty because he is Norwegian. Truth is most people here who trash talk about military never walked a day in their shoes and pretty much pussy's in general. Norway was completely run over by Germany in 1940, shows how strong they are as a people. Now they have a stick up their ass cause they are a rich country but still regarded as a welfare state. I can see why he is all pissy that veterans might lose welfare benefits. He does not care, he just around to "No you" the situation.

Don't worry though, when Putin run's them over they will be calling for our help to save them, much like everyone else does.


LOL. Yeah, I know. Then after we do help them their ungrateful asses will go back to talking trash about us and our military like they always do till they need us again... Rinse. Repeat. Then do it all over again. LOL.

Originally posted by Star428
Oh, and by the way, IF (and that's a big "if" our military has done anything questionable it's because they were ordered to by the government. The men and women in uniform are just following orders from the top. But I stil wanna see some proof of our military willingly murdering innocent families. Our military is no more evil than any other country's military.

Tiger Force in Vietnam.

The American military has done plenty good. You just don't get to forget the bad and sweep it under the rug.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Actually most wear PTSD as a badge of courage and I like myself would do it again. Anyone can get PTSD from anything. No one is promised to be a millionare from the military but its simple to understand why low income and impoverished people join. They most likely see it as a better opportunity and way out of the situation they were in. Everyone joins for their own reason. I myself dropped out of school to join cause of 9/11. After I got out and went back and got a better degree then the one I was previously pursuing and GI Bill paid for both my Undergrad and now working on my Graduate. Its not a bad trade off.

Best job I ever had.

So your experience = everyone else's, right?

You don't get PTSD from anything. Sure, there are more ways to get it than combat, but there are plenty of ways not to get it by staying out of the military too.

LoLz, anyhow. The US military (like other militaries) has awful people in its ranks who willfully commit crimes while under the uniform/on duty, this is just a fact.

Star428 lives in some fantasyland, it's so odd, yet entertaining at times to see.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Tiger Force in Vietnam.

The American military has done plenty good. You just don't get to forget the bad and sweep it under the rug.



So your experience = everyone else's, right?

You don't get PTSD from anything. Sure, there are more ways to get it than combat, but there are plenty of ways not to get it by staying out of the military too.

Well let's see I prolly have 1000 people fb that i served with over the years. I never seen one Vet complain or talk bad about his service. Am and and those people an island? Pretty sure anyone who went to war is proud of it. How many US military War veterans do you know?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Well let's see I prolly have 1000 people fb that i served with over the years. I never seen one Vet complain or talk bad about his service. Am and and those people an island? Pretty sure anyone who went to war is proud of it. How many US military War veterans do you know?

Out of the thousand veterans you know, you don't know one that has anything bad to say about his service?

Not as many as you I'm guessing, seeing as I'm not an American. I'm sure that will disqualify me in your eyes, even though I have so many forms of information gathering at my disposal.

Though, this is going off topic, so feel free to reply. I'd like to wind this down if it's all right with you.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
American military have killed innocents without a battle even going on, our army has gone into homes and killed entire innocent families, even helpless defenseless ones.

Let that sink in for a moment.

Proof?

Oh, wait, you don't have any. Do you also believe in Santa Clause?

Originally posted by Star428
Oh, and by the way, IF (and that's a big "if" our military has done anything questionable it's because they were ordered to by the government. The men and women in uniform are just following orders from the top. But I stil wanna see some proof of our military willingly murdering innocent families. Our military is no more evil than any other country's military.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haditha_killings

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Star, Krisblaze is a troubled youth who thinks his ass is high and mighty because he is Norwegian. Truth is most people here who trash talk about military never walked a day in their shoes and pretty much pussy's in general. Norway was completely run over by Germany in 1940, shows how strong they are as a people. Now they have a stick up their ass cause they are a rich country but still regarded as a welfare state. I can see why he is all pissy that veterans might lose welfare benefits. He does not care, he just around to "No you" the situation.

Don't worry though, when Putin run's them over they will be calling for our help to save them, much like everyone else does.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_resistance_movement

If you actually read the part about the invasion, you'll see that the Norwegians put up a hell of a fight considering they barely had an army and had no plan for resisting the Germans. And after the fall of Norway, the resistance movement was vital in disrupting the German atomic bomb project.

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haditha_killings did your read the article? They investigated it and charged multiple soldiers and because evidence came to light that the media was incorrectly reporting what had happened the charges were dropped....

So yeah, the Marines also wiped out Bigfoot.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
did your read the article? They investigated it and charged multiple soldiers and because evidence came to light that the media was incorrectly reporting what had happened the charges were dropped....

So yeah, the Marines also wiped out Bigfoot.

It doesn't say that's why the charges were dropped at all.

The only thing that happens that matters was that a group of marines went on a murderous rampage that resulted in the deaths of 24 Iraqis, and that the only thing that came out of this was Sgt. Wuterich being demoted and given a pay cut for crimes against humanity.

No he got a demotion for dereliction of duty.

If he "commited crimes against humanity" they would have hung him...
Please do read the article.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_resistance_movement

If you actually read the part about the invasion, you'll see that the Norwegians put up a hell of a fight considering they barely had an army and had no plan for resisting the Germans. And after the fall of Norway, the resistance movement was vital in disrupting the German atomic bomb project.


Point is they fell, resistance or not, then America came and bailed out Europe and the South Pacific. I am from Texas and a sharpshooter, not you my friend.

You're Chris Kyle?

Originally posted by Tzeentch
You're Chris Kyle?

http://www.thedailysheeple.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/obama-shhhh-600x300.jpg

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
No he got a demotion for dereliction of duty.

If he "commited crimes against humanity" they would have hung him...
Please do read the article.

Slaughtering civilians isn't a crime against humanity?

Alright.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Point is they fell, resistance or not, then America came and bailed out Europe and the South Pacific. I am from Texas and a sharpshooter, not you my friend.

But it was Soviet Russia that liberated Europe from the Nazi war machine.

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
But it was Soviet Russia that liberated Europe from the Nazi war machine.

Lol, I guess Europe had it handled and US could have stayed home and let everyone die. Literally no one had it under control and like 6 million Russian deaths alone, no one could stop them with out America's intervention.

Six million deaths to Soviet Russia is like four people by the standards of anyone else, to be fair.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Point is they fell, resistance or not, then America came and bailed out Europe and the South Pacific. I am from Texas and a sharpshooter, not you my friend.

ah, the old "you'd be speaking german if not for us" argument. Wonderful.

Originally posted by -Pr-
ah, the old "you'd be speaking german if not for us" argument. Wonderful.

Not what I said. Have some pizza, you are being a diva.

Originally posted by -Pr-
ah, the old "you'd be speaking german if not for us" argument. Wonderful. I believe you mean Wundabar

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Not what I said. Have some pizza, you are being a diva.

"Bailed out Europe".

Your words.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
I believe you mean Wundabar

Man sometimes humor is lost on this place even with an emoji at the end. The word bailout is a word in common usage.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Man sometimes humor is lost on this place even with an emoji at the end. The word bailout is a word in common usage.

You really think that, given your previous posts, that if you were joking, it wasn't an easy mistake to make?

Yes, we all know what the word means.

Originally posted by -Pr-
You really think that, given your previous posts, that if you were joking, it wasn't an easy mistake to make?

Yes, we all know what the word means.

Previous posts to you? My understanding was everything was cool. Now when talking about kris immature understanding of American military, two different things.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Previous posts to you? My understanding was everything was cool. Now when talking about kris immature understanding of American military, two different things.

I was speaking generally.

Kris might have gone over the top with his assessment, but your rebuttal wasn't exactly a sterling achievement either.

Honestly, no, I have no problem with anyone unless they're racist, mysoginist/misandrist, or really a bigot in any real sense of the word. If you're not one of those, then cool.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norwegian_resistance_movement

If you actually read the part about the invasion, you'll see that the Norwegians put up a hell of a fight considering they barely had an army and had no plan for resisting the Germans. And after the fall of Norway, the resistance movement was vital in disrupting the German atomic bomb project.

You and your "facts"

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Lol, I guess Europe had it handled and US could have stayed home and let everyone die. Literally no one had it under control and like 6 million Russian deaths alone, no one could stop them with out America's intervention.

It's difficult to say what would have happened. I think most likely it was going to war with Russia that led more to Germany's defeat in WWII than America getting involved. Once they declared war on Russia they were waging war on too many fronts and started getting pushed back. America helped with the death blow, but really I think Germany probably would have lost regardless, it just would have taken longer. Hitler was just too much of a gambler and eventually it was bound to catch up with him.

Not unlike how Backfire got herpes. Too much of a gambler.

Eventually everyone's luck runs out.

TI is so bad at history it's adorable

Originally posted by BackFire
Eventually everyone's luck runs out.

Candles that burn twice as bright 313

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Point is they fell, resistance or not, then America came and bailed out Europe and the South Pacific. I am from Texas and a sharpshooter, not you my friend.
So anything short of completely defeating a much more powerful military makes them a weak nation in your book?

Lol, you being from Texas and a sharpshooter makes you an authority on European history? That's the funniest thing you've ever said.

Originally posted by BackFire
It's difficult to say what would have happened. I think most likely it was going to war with Russia that led more to Germany's defeat in WWII than America getting involved. Once they declared war on Russia they were waging war on too many fronts and started getting pushed back. America helped with the death blow, but really I think Germany probably would have lost regardless, it just would have taken longer. Hitler was just too much of a gambler and eventually it was bound to catch up with him.



Perhaps Germany would've lost anyway and it would've just taken longer for the allies to defeat them but it would've taken A LOT longer without America and MANY more Russian and British soldiers, airmen, and sailors would have been killed in that case. Point is America helped immensely in saving many Russian and British lives while having to sacrifice many American lives to do it.

I think it's also likely that had America not gotten involved, the war would have ended in 1943 or 44, with Britain signing an armistice on fairly bad terms (but retaining its independence) and the Soviet Union ceding Ukraine and the Baltic States to Germany.

Although that would have depended on Hitler being realistic with his ambitions for the Soviet Union. There were certainly points early in the war where Stalin would have been prepared to accept these terms to avoid complete defeat.

Why is America the only country who needs to be constantly praised for intervening?

Their intervention and subsequent economic help allowed them a corporate foothold in Europe and is a great deal of the reason why they maintained a superior economic advantage the follow decades.

That and the fact that they were phucking johnny come lately's to the party.

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haditha_killings



Thanks for the link. I read the article and it seems that those particular Marines were looking for payback for the killing of one of their own. They probably thought that insurgents and/or those responsible for the killing were hiding among those that they killed. It's not like they just decided to go and murder innocent civilians for fun.


In any case, one rogue incident of marines looking for retribution for the murder of one of their own is not indicative of the character of our entire military.

Originally posted by Robtard
LoLz, anyhow. The US military (like other militaries) has awful people in its ranks who willfully commit crimes while under the uniform/on duty, this is just a fact.

Star428 lives in some fantasyland, it's so odd, yet entertaining at times to see.



LOL. Whatever. Keep telling yourself that, idiot. Considering some of your posts that I've read, I'd say you're the one living in the fantasyland, dumbass..


No shit our military has people in it who commit terrible acts, dummy. Did I ever say otherwise, Einstein? I said "our military is no more evil than any other military". And as you've just admitted, other militaries have those kinds of people as well so get off your high horse you "know-it-all."



You've probably never even served. You just sit behind your computer like a coward talking trash to people you know that you will never meet face-to-face. Like TI pointed out, most people like you are pussy's in general. LOL. Get over yourself, dude. I don't even know why I waste my time conversing with insignificant people like you.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Why is America the only country who needs to be constantly praised for intervening?

Their intervention and subsequent economic help allowed them a corporate foothold in Europe and is a great deal of the reason why they maintained a superior economic advantage the follow decades.

That and the fact that they were phucking johnny come lately's to the party.
In the case of World War I, they definitely were "Johnny Come Latelys." Early in the conflict, American public opinion was firmly divided between Germany and the UK, and it wasn't until the sinking of the Lusitania and the Zimmerman telegraph that public opinion became decidedly pro-British. With WW2, the Americans were economically and diplomatically in the Allied camp more or less from the go, but FDR lacked a political justification (and compelling interest) for getting more thoroughly involved until Pearl Harbor. If you call America "Johnny Come Lately" for joining the war late in 1941 after being attacked, you might as well apply the same critique to the Soviet Union, as it was only the German invasion with Operation Barbarossa that brought them into the fray. England and France entered the war on Poland's behalf, but they made such a lackluster effort that they didn't really start fighting in earnest until Germany launched its invasion of France. I'd say there was a lack of will to fight all around, Germany and Japan being the only nations that really wanted a war--even Italy basically got dragged into the fight against its best interests.

I'm not saying America is any better or worse than Soviet in the regard of joining out of self-interest, I'm simply saying that it wasn't done as some grand favour to Europe. And that the US not joining until 1941 massively helped its position during the post-war period.

If you think Japan wasn't forced into that war then I think you should reconsider. I can suggest some literature.

Originally posted by krisblaze
I'm not saying America is any better or worse than Soviet in the regard of joining out of self-interest, I'm simply saying that it wasn't done as some grand favour to Europe. And that the US not joining until 1941 massively helped its position during the post-war period.

If you think Japan wasn't forced into that war then I think you should reconsider. I can suggest some literature.
I think it's more like America not being on the same continent as Europe helped its position post-war. America's isolated location meant that it alone among the great powers came out of the war unscarred.

I don't see how America joining in 1939 or 1940 would have changed much of anything. The extent to which the Germans could hurt America (with U-Boats) was effectively already in full swing by the time of Pearl Harbor due to unrestricted submarine warfare. An extra year wouldn't have bled America dry, nor would it have effected the outcome of the Battle of France as America wasn't in any position to send significant forces even if they'd had the political will to do so. So really, nothing would have changed except the War in the Pacific would have begun differently (who knows how, who knows when, but it was bound to happen). Maybe the Battle of Britain would have been an easier victory for the allies if the Americans sent fighter squadrons and planes rather than just a squadron of volunteers, and maybe the allies would have launched their invasion of North Africa in 1941 instead of 1942, but that wouldn't change the situation on the European continent, which is what you're talking about. Italy would have still been devastated by the allied invasion and the collapse of the government. Ditto for Germany.

What do you mean by "forced?" (Are you referring to the economic war between America and Japan in the 1930s that drove it to attempt seizing Southeast Asia and Indonesia?) And what do you mean by "Japan?" Japan as in the country, as in the people, or as in the government?

If anyone was a Johnny Come Lately it was the Turks, who only declared war on Germany as a symbolic gesture when the armistice was all but signed. Or the Bulgarians, Romanians, and Hungarians who tried to switch sides in 1945 after fighting on the Axis side for most of the war, only to get steamrolled anyway by the Soviets.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
The GOP just wants veterans to become independent and lift themselves up by their bootstraps.

Well, this is the joke-political post of yours that finally made me laugh.

Congrats. Have my upvote, +1, and like.

Originally posted by Star428
Thanks for the link. I read the article and it seems that those particular Marines were looking for payback for the killing of one of their own. They probably thought that insurgents and/or those responsible for the killing were hiding among those that they killed. It's not like they just decided to go and murder innocent civilians for fun.

In any case, one rogue incident of marines looking for retribution for the murder of one of their own is not indicative of the character of our entire military.

You really are brainwashed, to try and justify the murder of civilians.

It was a revenge-killing against people who took no part in the killing of one American soldier. Not twenty one by the way. Because that's how many Iraqis were killed. Several being children.

But it doesn't matter because they were brown, right?

All eight marines in Haditha were exonerated of all charges.

I thought this was common knowledge.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/01/breaking-final-haditha-marine-exonerated-wuterich-reaches-plea-deal-for-misdemeanor/

Yes, what's your point?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
All eight marines in Haditha were exonerated of all charges.

I thought this was common knowledge.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/01/breaking-final-haditha-marine-exonerated-wuterich-reaches-plea-deal-for-misdemeanor/ Tell me more about how that justifies killing children.

Originally posted by Star428
LOL. Whatever. Keep telling yourself that, idiot. Considering some of your posts that I've read, I'd say you're the one living in the fantasyland, dumbass..


No shit our military has people in it who commit terrible acts, dummy. Did I ever say otherwise, Einstein? I said "our military is no more evil than any other military". And as you've just admitted, other militaries have those kinds of people as well so get off your high horse you "know-it-all."



You've probably never even served. You just sit behind your computer like a coward talking trash to people you know that you will never meet face-to-face. Like TI pointed out, most people like you are pussy's in general. LOL. Get over yourself, dude. I don't even know why I waste my time conversing with insignificant people like you.

Look how mad you are over being wrong. LOL! Anyhow.

Yes, you in fact did say as much:

Originally posted by Star428
Oh, and by the way, IF (and that's a big "if" our military has done anything questionable it's because they were ordered to by the government. The men and women in uniform are just following orders from the top.

You just talked the same "trash" as I apparently did by noting that there's awful people in the military as well. Good job

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
Yes, what's your point? Originally posted by NemeBro
Tell me more about how that justifies killing children. ...the charges were dropped because it didn't happen....

Uhh not sure how much more you need there.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Tell me more about how that justifies killing children. Those kids were just terrorists in training anyway. Think about how many future American soldier lives were saved by those savages being put down now.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
...the charges were dropped because it didn't happen....

Uhh not sure how much more you need there.

The guy himself admitted it happened. The case was dropped because some saw it as not a war crime. Most of them were given immunity and he got a slap on the wrist.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
...the charges were dropped because it didn't happen....

Uhh not sure how much more you need there.

LoL, this guy. The deaths did in fact happen.

"The court martial of Wuterich, the only defendant to stand trial for the Haditha killings, took place in January 2012. During the trial Sgt. Sanick Dela Cruz testified that he urinated on the skull of one of the dead Iraqis. He also testified, after describing how Wuterich shot the passengers of the car himself from close range, "Sergeant Wuterich approached me and told me if anyone asks, the Iraqis were running away from the car and the Iraqi army shot them". In a plea deal, Wuterich pled guilty to dereliction of duty, while charges of assault and manslaughter were dropped. He was convicted of a single count of negligent dereliction of duty on January 24, 2012, receiving a rank reduction and pay cut but avoiding jail time"

The military/courts ending up accepting a plea deal which dropped the murder charges to DoD. Cos "innocents murdered in cold blood" is really bad PR for the US.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
...the charges were dropped because it didn't happen....

Uhh not sure how much more you need there.

Yeah maybe you should actually read the article.

Originally posted by Robtard
LoL, this guy. The deaths did in fact happen.

"The court martial of Wuterich, the only defendant to stand trial for the Haditha killings, took place in January 2012. During the trial Sgt. Sanick Dela Cruz testified that he urinated on the skull of one of the dead Iraqis. He also testified, after describing how Wuterich shot the passengers of the car himself from close range, "Sergeant Wuterich approached me and told me if anyone asks, the Iraqis were running away from the car and the Iraqi army shot them". In a plea deal, Wuterich pled guilty to dereliction of duty, while charges of assault and manslaughter were dropped. He was convicted of a single count of negligent dereliction of duty on January 24, 2012, receiving a rank reduction and pay cut but avoiding jail time"

The military/courts ending up accepting a plea deal which dropped the murder charges to DoD. Cos "innocents murdered in cold blood" is really bad PR for the US.

in addition.

"Some of the most damaging testimony for prosecutors came from Wuterich's immediate superior at Haditha, former Marine 1st Lt. William Kallop, who testified that he gave the order to "clear" houses where the 19 Iraqis died."

from the NYtimes http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/us/18haditha.html

The man himself admitted he did have them clear the houses (like the man above testified), and that civilians were there. The only argument one can make is weather it was intentional, not that it didn't happen.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Tell me more about how that justifies killing children.

I never said it did. It's called war, bad shit happens on both sides.

People act like things are just the **** and there is naked women running around handing out hand jobs.

Bad shit happens

Originally posted by Lek Kuen
The guy himself admitted it happened. The case was dropped because some saw it as not a war crime. Most of them were given immunity and he got a slap on the wrist. some? You mean the Judge? I also feel like you don't know what he pleaded guilty too.Originally posted by FinalAnswer
Yeah maybe you should actually read the article. I did... You may want to aswell. Originally posted by Lek Kuen
in addition.

"Some of the most damaging testimony for prosecutors came from Wuterich's immediate superior at Haditha, former Marine 1st Lt. William Kallop, who testified that he gave the order to "clear" houses where the 19 Iraqis died."

from the NYtimes http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/18/us/18haditha.html

The man himself admitted he did have them clear the houses (like the man above testified), and that civilians were there. The only argument one can make is weather it was intentional, not that it didn't happen. you clear houses after an attack... It sucks that "innocent" people get hurt but it prevents ambushes.

Your whole point was it never happened. It did unarmed people were killed. Weather or not you believe it was a war crime is a separate argument. all sources admit that they did kill those people under his order to shoot anyone you see.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
some? You mean the Judge? I also feel like you don't know what he pleaded guilty too. I did... You may want to aswell. you clear houses after an attack... It sucks that "innocent" people get hurt but it prevents ambushes.

A mother died trying to shield her daughter from the soldiers, who died immediately afterwards anyway. Men, women, children and elderly were all executed, mostly from close range, in cold blood. There was no evidence that they had anything to do with any insurgents, and the only gun that was found was a home defense AK-47 that had not been fired. The only reason they went out there was to avenge the soldier that had been killed earlier, whether those Iraqis had anything to do with the insurgents or not.

Those soldiers deserve to be put up against a wall and shot for what they did, but I guess since the lives of American soldiers are more valuable then brown Muslims and they shouldn't take any chance no matter the circumstances, who cares right?

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
A mother died trying to shield her daughter from the soldiers, who died immediately afterwards anyway. Men, women, children and elderly were all executed, mostly from close range, in cold blood. There was no evidence that they had anything to do with any insurgents, and the only gun that was found was a home defense AK-47 that had not been fired. The only reason they went out there was to avenge the soldier that had been killed earlier, whether those Iraqis had anything to do with the insurgents or not.

Those soldiers deserve to be put up against a wall and shot for what they did, but I guess since the lives of American soldiers are more valuable then brown Muslims and they shouldn't take any chance no matter the circumstances, who cares right?



Not that I necessarily disagree with EVERYTHING you say but yeah, American lives should be more important than Muslims. Just look at what muslim extremists are doing to people today. And please don't give me that "not all muslims are bad" BS. The ones who claim that they do not support ISIS wouldn't hesitate to side with them if ISIS attacked here in the US.




Also, poster is right who said that that area over there is a breeding ground for terrorists and other slime. I would never advocate the slaughtering of innocent women and children but if you knew anything about Marines you would know how they feel about one of their own being murdered. What they did was wrong, I agree, but it was an act of revenge not one of pure evil like a lot of people are making it out to be.




You can say "there was no evidence of insurgents there" all u like but maybe those marines who were filled with vengeful anger didn't think it thru and perhaps they thought that even if there was no evidence of insurgents there that those people they killed were possibly aiding them somehow.

Originally posted by Star428
Thanks for the link. I read the article and it seems that those particular Marines were looking for payback for the killing of one of their own. They probably thought that insurgents and/or those responsible for the killing were hiding among those that they killed. It's not like they just decided to go and murder innocent civilians for fun.


In any case, one rogue incident of marines looking for retribution for the murder of one of their own is not indicative of the character of our entire military.

Nobody said it was. It's just not one rogue incident. The US military has been doing bad shit for years now. It being the minority of troops doesn't make it any less horrible.

Nobody is saying they're the sickest army in the world. But they're still an army.

Originally posted by Star428
Not that I necessarily disagree with EVERYTHING you say but yeah, American lives should be more important than Muslims. Just look at what muslim extremists are doing to people today. And please don't give me that "not all muslims are bad" BS. The ones who claim that they do not support ISIS wouldn't hesitate to side with them if ISIS attacked here in the US.

What, committing acts of terror and murdering innocent civilians? You mean... just what those US Marines did?



Who can blame them for becoming terrorists? After all, they have to deal with the US of A murdering their friends and families on a bloodthirsty whim.



Why do you feel that being angry justifies killing civilians, including the elderly and children?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
I never said it did. It's called war, bad shit happens on both sides.

People act like things are just the **** and there is naked women running around handing out hand jobs.

Bad shit happens Right, which is why you shouldn't blame people who won't pretend that the US military is some shining beacon of hope and goodness who can do no wrong. They're not.

Originally posted by FinalAnswer
A mother died trying to shield her daughter from the soldiers, who died immediately afterwards anyway. Men, women, children and elderly were all executed, mostly from close range, in cold blood. There was no evidence that they had anything to do with any insurgents, and the only gun that was found was a home defense AK-47 that had not been fired. The only reason they went out there was to avenge the soldier that had been killed earlier, whether those Iraqis had anything to do with the insurgents or not.

Those soldiers deserve to be put up against a wall and shot for what they did, but I guess since the lives of American soldiers are more valuable then brown Muslims and they shouldn't take any chance no matter the circumstances, who cares right? Were you there? Just wondering because you seemed to be jumping to conclusions.

Do innocent people die in war? Yes
Is there any possible way a "crime" scene was preserved at all in a small Iraqi village? Hell no

Originally posted by -Pr-
Tiger Force in Vietnam.

The American military has done plenty good. You just don't get to forget the bad and sweep it under the rug.



Pr, that was nearly 50 years ago. I thought we were talking about the current generation of our military. I'm sure we can dig up a ton of dirt on just about every nation's military in the world if we take into account their entire history and not just the current generation. I really don't think you wanna go there.



As I've already said, every military is always going to have some misguided and sick individuals but that's not representative of that entire country's military.

Originally posted by Star428
Pr, that was nearly 50 years ago. I thought we were talking about the current generation of our military. I'm sure we can dig up a ton of dirt on just about every nation's military in the world if we take into account their entire history and not just the current generation. I really don't think you wanna go there.



As I've already said, every military is always going to have some misguided and sick individuals but that's not representative of that entire country's military.

But we aren't talking about the military of other countries. It isn't some sort of competition to see which country has the biggest scumbags.

Nobody is saying it's representative of the entire military either, unless I missed a post. Just that the American military, even recently, has done some ****ed up things. They do plenty of good too, so it's not like they only do bad things. You just can't pretend the bad doesn't happen.

Acting like that it's a completely honourable, never questionable thing to be involved in, is the problem. There are many decent, wonderful people who sign up for the military for many reasons. Those people deserve nothing but respect.

You want to defend the American military? Go ahead. Just don't stick your fingers in your ears and pretend bad shit doesn't happen. Point out the good to balance things out.

I though this thread was about Republicans trying to lower welfare costs with people trying to use the Veterans as shields? How did it become European posters vs American Posters?

Blame krisblaze. If he hadn't made such an ignorant insult about men and women who choose to join the US military then this thread probably wouldn't have been derailed on the very first page. LOL. He just had to open his ignorant mouth.



Anyway, I'm done wasting my time arguing the same stuff over and over about things that aren't even related to the thread. Maybe that will help this thread get back on topic... Ignorant people can think whatever they like about our military (of course, they'll still cry for our help when they're in trouble, as usual) ... I'm done here.



Edit: I've added 3 people to ignore list from this thread alone. LOL. That's gotta be a record of some kind. At least that's one good thing that came out of thread (me setting a record).

Why does this clown think putting people on his ignore list is something worth bragging about?

Well, I think he's a cutie-pie.

Originally posted by Star428
Not that I necessarily disagree with EVERYTHING you say but yeah, American lives should be more important than Muslims. Just look at what muslim extremists are doing to people today. And please don't give me that "not all muslims are bad" BS. The ones who claim that they do not support ISIS wouldn't hesitate to side with them if ISIS attacked here in the US.




Also, poster is right who said that that area over there is a breeding ground for terrorists and other slime. I would never advocate the slaughtering of innocent women and children but if you knew anything about Marines you would know how they feel about one of their own being murdered. What they did was wrong, I agree, but it was an act of revenge not one of pure evil like a lot of people are making it out to be.




You can say "there was no evidence of insurgents there" all u like but maybe those marines who were filled with vengeful anger didn't think it thru and perhaps they thought that even if there was no evidence of insurgents there that those people they killed were possibly aiding them somehow.

Wow. But why not tell us how you really feel?

(seriously, who actually says this shit with a straight face?)

NeoCons.

Originally posted by -Pr-


Acting like that it's a completely honourable, never questionable thing to be involved in, is the problem.

Truth. Also dislike how any reservation on the military is some how viewed as "Un-American". I'm an American and very happy where I am but doesn't mean I have to agree and it shouldn't make me un-American for doing so.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
NeoCons.

I meant people.

youregood.gif

Originally posted by NemeBro
Why does this clown think putting people on his ignore list is something worth bragging about?
Because he likes to show off his inability to effectively debate.

Originally posted by Tzeentch
youregood.gif

Dillan you son of a *****, What's the matter? The CIA got you pushing too many pencils?