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Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey

Hulk
Gladiator
Hyperion
Supergirl

Mr.Majestic
Jenny sparks
Thragg
Jupiter girl

Batman

Photon Genis Vell
Sentry
Hulk
Dr Strange

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Hulk
Gladiator
Hyperion
Supergirl

All of these guys lose

Originally posted by carver9
Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey
Captain Comet
Blue Marvel
Captain Marvel
Lobo

Originally posted by krisblaze
All of these guys lose

Swap WW out for Supergirl. She's a beast at the moment. Crazy.

maybe a group like sentry or maybe genis, along with classic strange and classic dr fate and flash. if flash lends speed at the start they should be able to pull it off.

I wanted to put in genis but let's be honest. Was he ever really a herald

he has some really good feats. carv definitely has the 4 best and most consistent guys. very hard to find 4 that could take a clear majority. not even sure it can be done if we take all at their best.

Originally posted by carver9
Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey
Err...

Even with their lowest showings, if we take into account their best no one is beating them. Especially those first 3 with their multitude of ridiculously high end showings..

Superman
Supergirl
Superboy
Power Girl

In order for you to find people that would take a clear majority you're probably looking at weakness exploitation or power nullification.

ie people that drain magic, power cosmic, create K-Nite, etc while still having the power to rumble with what's left.

Of course if we take carver's team at their best I doubt you're going to find legit heralds that take a majority.

Dr Doom
Beta Ray Bill
Capt Marvel (DC)
Electro

Genis-Vell
Sentry
Plutonian
Tangent Superman

Originally posted by "Id"
Genis-Vell
Sentry
Plutonian
Tangent Superman

Great.

Not list three heralds

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Hulk
Gladiator
Hyperion
Supergirl Putting Carv in a no-win situation, huh?

Cosigning Newjak. The only lists that have a chance are ones that don't use heralds (i.e. there's 1-2 Trans. thrown in). Unless someone figures out weakness exploitation, and as long as we aren't cherry-picking feats for one team, it might not be possible.

Of actual heralds, Leo's on the best line of thinking. But I also think he uses a couple Trans. characters. Speed Force lending + some power(s) that can work against these guys is the only viable solution I've seen.

i don't see strange or fate as trans guys. both have some uber showings but not enough to put them in trans imo. but yeah, the speed lending is gimmicky which is about the only way to beat the 4 carv chose.

Originally posted by leonidas
i don't see strange or fate as trans guys. both have some uber showings but not enough to put them in trans imo. but yeah, the speed lending is gimmicky which is about the only way to beat the 4 carv chose.

Possibly Genis, and the forum has the better versions of Fate at Trans. So there's a case to be made that you're a touch over. However, I do think you're on the right track. And, in a non-prepped scenario, possibly the only track.

Talisman
Snowbird
Captain Comet (pre 52)
Mantis (New God - pre 52)

KM is close imo.

Not sure how forum Talisman is herald but whatever.

That -K-M- sure does know his stuff.

Way to go -K-M-

or snowbird for that matter. to compete with them she'd need to go all trans-transformation if she was given the chance to do so. anyway, i'd take classic fate and strange over talisman and snowbird for magic. mantis is the drainer but not sure what tier he'd be in overall.

Originally posted by leonidas
or snowbird for that matter. to compete with them she'd need to go all trans-transformation if she was given the chance to do so. anyway, i'd take classic fate and strange over talisman and snowbird for magic. mantis is the drainer but not sure what tier he'd be in overall.

Naaaa base form she hanged with wendigo and hercules physically AND she has her own God blast. Muhahahaha

Originally posted by -K-M-
Talisman
Snowbird
Captain Comet (pre 52)
Mantis (New God - pre 52)
Superman alone can take down both Mantis and Comet. Leaving Talisman and Snowbird to take on all three? Not a good combination.

mantis was more for silver surfer (or thor) and comet was for Nate (or thor). Funny thing is I thought it said supergirl not superman. Whoops

Surfer would beat Mantis solidly, just like Nate would beat Comet.

Thinking something like...

Flash
Cassandra Nova
Dr. Strange (classic)
Baron Zemo w/ Moonstones

Originally posted by Existere
Thinking something like...

Flash
Cassandra Nova
Dr. Strange (classic)
Baron Zemo w/ Moonstones
Zemo and Nova aren't heralds though. Flash is too much of a glass canon and even a weaker version of Surfer has beaten strange who was a huge glass canon.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Surfer would beat Mantis solidly, just like Nate would beat Comet.



Strongly disagree. Any cosmic energy he threw at Mantis he would absorb. He has owned many heralds include Fate (x2), Hal Jordan (x2), Wonder Woman, Martian manhunter, etc

Concerning Nate, this shaman Nate?

Originally posted by -K-M-
Strongly disagree. Any cosmic energy he threw at Mantis he would absorb. He has owned many heralds include Fate (x2), Hal Jordan (x2), Wonder Woman, Martian manhunter, etc

Concerning Nate, this shaman Nate?
That's why he was killed by Orion by energy blasts or twoshotted by a young Superman? When did he beat Diana?

Even non shaman Nate is above Comet.

Originally posted by abhilegend
That's why he was killed by Orion by energy blasts or twoshotted by a young Superman? When did he beat Diana?

Even non shaman Nate is above Comet.

When was he killed by Orion? Same with superman? His fight with Wonder Woman was her, Hal and fate against mantis in Super Powers #3

Disagree with that as well

Flash + 3 herals = win

dr fate > Herald class

Originally posted by -K-M-
When was he killed by Orion? Same with superman? His fight with Wonder Woman was her, Hal and fate against mantis in Super Powers #3

Disagree with that as well
Orion vaporized him in New Gods 5. Superman koed him in two hits in Superman Confidential.

Super Powers isn't canon though. That's also PC Wonder Woman who wasn't that impressive.

Well, why?

Originally posted by Board Walker
dr fate > Herald class

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SuperPowersV2_3of6_17.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SuperPowersV2_3of6_04.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
Orion vaporized him in New Gods 5. Superman koed him in two hits in Superman Confidential.

Super Powers isn't canon though. That's also PC Wonder Woman who wasn't that impressive.

Well, why?

No he didn't. He teleported out and orion was losing until he went into a berserker rage when mantis nearly killed forager. In fact Orion was temp ko'ed and Forager saved him. With superman he was low on energy

Super powers was canon and was referenced in the who's who directory.

Because they have comparable stats and showings and comet has abilities nate doesn't have

Originally posted by abhilegend
Zemo and Nova aren't heralds though. Flash is too much of a glass canon and even a weaker version of Surfer has beaten strange who was a huge glass canon. Zemo and Nova were both ranked as heralds.

EDIT: Obviously the Tiers thread wasn't perfect, but I don't think that either character is obviously Trans tier.

Flash and Strange both have glass cannon showings, but also each have the necessary power displays to win against any of these 4.

It's not a perfect combo, but I think it could work... mmm

Originally posted by -K-M-
Because they have comparable stats and showings Eh, I don't really agree with this.

Originally posted by -K-M-
No he didn't. He teleported out and orion was losing until he went into a berserker rage when mantis nearly killed forager. In fact Orion was temp ko'ed and Forager saved him. With superman he was low on energy

Super powers was canon and was referenced in the who's who directory.

Because they have comparable stats and showings and comet has abilities nate doesn't have
Orion killed him IIRC.

When was he showed to be weakened?

Eh, Comet isn't even close to the power Nate can dish out. What abilities though?

Originally posted by Existere
Zemo and Nova were both ranked as heralds.

EDIT: Obviously the Tiers thread wasn't perfect, but I don't think that either character is obviously Trans tier.

Flash and Strange both have glass cannon showings, but also each have the necessary power displays to win against any of these 4.

It's not a perfect combo, but I think it could work... mmm
Kmc system is hardly trustworthy in that regard. Nova is listed at mid Herald actually. There isn't a high Herald who will win a fight with her in character though.

Yeah, they can. But not in character though. For example, Superman is a particularly bad match up for Flash. He isn't as fast as him but Flash can't evade him for long. Just like both Thor and Surfer are bad match ups for strange.

Nova is a tough call.

Telepathic characters always are.

She doesn't command great destructive forces, couldn't destroy a planet or level a continent. But she could still beat just about anybody in the herald tier.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Nova is a tough call.

Telepathic characters always are.

She doesn't command great destructive forces, couldn't destroy a planet or level a continent. But she could still beat just about anybody in the herald tier.
Just look at Xaviers's feats and keep in mind she mind raped him while he was using cerebro. She is one of the most underrated characters of all time.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Just look at Xaviers's feats and keep in mind she mind raped him while he was using cerebro. She is one of the most underrated characters of all time.

I've been touting this since day 1.

He was in cerebra even.

Mummudrai lore was killed by that ****ing hack who does uncanny x-force now though.

**** remender.

Flash, speed force lending.
Rose Tattoo ('given enough time, she can kill anything'. Well, now she has Speed Force to give her all the time in the world)
Swamp Thing
Nemesis Kid

Originally posted by Reflassshh
Putting Carv in a no-win situation, huh?

Or...

Zoom/Flash
Rogue
Multiple Man (can you see where this is going)
Nemesis Kid.

Originally posted by abhilegend
**** remender.

I think Remender's x-force was good, this is some new idiot.

Flash
Blue Marvel
Sentry
Majestic

I WIN!

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Or...

Zoom/Flash
Rogue
Multiple Man (can you see where this is going)
Nemesis Kid.

but now you're not using heralds. which is against carv's rules. tsk-tsk

Sentry
MM
Zoom
Orion

Originally posted by abhilegend
Just look at Xaviers's feats and keep in mind she mind raped him while he was using cerebro. She is one of the most underrated characters of all time.

you mean this feat:

Originally posted by leonidas


http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/8384/newxmen114page15.jpg

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/8449/newxmen114page16.jpg

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/615/newxmen114page17.jpg


that IS impressive. cassie's a beast, there is no doubt about it. but what no one EVER talks about happens later in the arc. cassie took over xavier's body and was doing all kinds of bad things with it. after a lengthy arc(s), xavier's mind ended up residing in jean for a time--a jean who was once again manifesting PHOENIX powers. cassie's goal was to get to cerebra and use it to contact the minds of all mutants in the world so she could...do bad things to them and with them. but jean had a plan. let's see what happens, and just how cassie met her end....



seriously. think about what happened there. not only was charles' mind too much for phoenix (or ANYONE) to hold, it survived being shattered and placed separately in the minds of every mutant in the world! as if that alone wasn't enough, once it was reconstituted, CHARLES WAS ABLE TO GET INTO THE MIND OF CASSANDRA NOVA WHO WAS USING CEREBRA AND REGAIN HIS BODY! not sure why everyone always brings up the cassie feat, but almost no one ever mentions this equally impressive feat by charles....

^Because, to me at least, it was heavily implied that Cassandra Nova left herself vulnerable to his attack when she connected herself to the remaining mutant minds.

Yeah, I thought Cassandra's feat showed clear domination of Xavier, while his was effectively a psychic sucker punch.

This is reinforced by each showing of Cassandra overpowering or no-selling the combined efforts of Xavier and Phoenix-Jean, and later Emma.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Great.

Not list three heralds
OK I'll take a second shot.
Baron Zemo with Moonstones
Cyborg Superman
Black Adam
Dr. Strange

Originally posted by leonidas
you mean this feat:




that IS impressive. cassie's a beast, there is no doubt about it. but what no one EVER talks about happens later in the arc. cassie took over xavier's body and was doing all kinds of bad things with it. after a lengthy arc(s), xavier's mind ended up residing in jean for a time--a jean who was once again manifesting PHOENIX powers. cassie's goal was to get to cerebra and use it to contact the minds of all mutants in the world so she could...do bad things to them and with them. but jean had a plan. let's see what happens, and just how cassie met her end....



seriously. think about what happened there. not only was charles' mind too much for phoenix (or ANYONE) to hold, it survived being shattered and placed separately in the minds of every mutant in the world! as if that alone wasn't enough, once it was reconstituted, CHARLES WAS ABLE TO GET INTO THE MIND OF CASSANDRA NOVA WHO WAS USING CEREBRA AND REGAIN HIS BODY! not sure why everyone always brings up the cassie feat, but almost no one ever mentions this equally impressive feat by charles....

It's a great feat for Charles as well.

Silver Surfer vs Morg
Thor vs Uni-Powered Spider-Man
Superman vs Blue Marvel
Nate Grey vs Adam Warlock

I thought this was just about Galactus Heralds,but it seems any herald level characters can be used.I will use Morg/with waters of life,Superman enhanced with the power cosmic,Thor enhanced with the power cosmic,and the Surfer enhanced with more power cosmic!No one said this would be cheating.

Its...inventive...

Originally posted by leonidas
but now you're not using heralds. which is against carv's rules. tsk-tsk

My lists - both of them - were BELOW herald level!!

Xavier

Huh, I only needed one.

cassandra nova....

Originally posted by carver9
Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey

Duplicate Boy
Black Alice
Cyborg Superman (w/rings)
Cassandra Nova

Cassandra nova
Constantine
C. Superman
Wally West

Originally posted by carver9
Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey
Kyle (White Lantern) - Silver Surfer
Supreme - Superman
Thor - Plutonian
Nate Grey - Dr. Strange

Zemo w/stones was def Trans Tier character.

Im confused .. Can we label fate amd strange as heralds? Their highs are REALLY high

Doctor Strange
Sentry
Plutonian
Hunter Zoloman

Sentry
Flash
Dr. Strange
Blue Marvel

Just like when this first got made, most lists skirt the line between HH and Trans., and probably use 1-2 Trans. characters, thus invalidating them. That said, I think a few have come closer than others, and there's a team to be made that could likely do it.

Are we really still considering Black Alice's haxx powers to be high herald? Didn't she stalemate full-God-powered Spectre or something stupid? Plenty of others on the line: WL Kyle, Zoom, Plutonian, Sentry (depending on depiction), Genis, Zemo, etc.

Strange and some versions of Fate remain good choices. Same with Flash for gimmick reasons. Blair had a good idea with Cyborg Supes + rings.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Im confused .. Can we label fate amd strange as heralds? Their highs are REALLY high

Their lows are also comically low. Strange has been labeled HH for some time after initially appearing on the list as Trans. With Fate, it's trickier, because there have been numerous people to wear the helmet, and some were lots better than others. I do think Fate at his best is Trans., but others disagree.

Fate (Kent + Inza) = Skyfather or higher.
Fate (Kent) = Trans Level.
Fate (Hector) = High Herald
The rest are at mid Herald or below.

Hector as Fate was far above Herald level. He beat down Mordru who was able to own Thunderbolt and entire JSA together.

who the **** is zemo with moonstones?? feats for this guy? ive heard soo much about this dude but NEVER any feats get posted, at this point im starting to think he is lobo lifting the box with a universe status.

Stable minded sentry
Majestic
Flash
Blue marvel

Or sub any one of them cor photon

Loki
Dr Doom
Dr Strange
Dr Fate

I've won this challenge on April 4

Flash
Blue Marvel
Sentry
Majestic

I WIN!

AGAIN!!!

Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
I've won this challenge on April 4

Flash
Blue Marvel
Sentry
Majestic

I WIN!

AGAIN!!!

How would you pair your fight up?

Originally posted by carver9
How would you pair your fight up?

Silver Surfer- Majestros is a nightmare matchup for Norrin.

Thor- Blue Marvel, the strength, speed and versatility of Adam takes down the Blonde whore known as The Odinson.

Superman - Flash. He can't win but provides enough interference through the speed force to give the others time.

Nate Grey- Sentry beat Owen. Grey finds peace.

WBH
WWH
Unipower Hulk
Rulk

Originally posted by Inhuman
WBH
WWH
Unipower Hulk
Rulk

They all die!

BRUTALLY!!!

Originally posted by carver9
Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey
Energy Superman
Superman
DCNU Superman
Tangent Superman

Originally posted by carver9
Silver Surfer
Thor
Superman
Nate Grey
Photon (Genis)
Dr. Strange
Plutonian
Tangent Superman

Originally posted by Digi


Are we really still considering Black Alice's haxx powers to be high herald? Didn't she stalemate full-God-powered Spectre or something stupid? Plenty of others on the line: WL Kyle, Zoom, Plutonian, Sentry (depending on depiction), Genis, Zemo, etc.



She took his power and held her own for a page or two but couldn't hold on to the power. The only other person who she's been shown having difficulty holding onto and using the power of was Dr Occult. Though that IMHO is more due to his magic immunity. The issue of Secret Six where she took Occult's power she couldn't control a teleport and had no idea where she was. She had a spat about working out how to use Occult's power in seconds but that had never been an issue before.



Absorbing man
Amazingman II
Zoom (can't believe he's listed as Herald on the Tiers list, but I'll take it)
Flash

Both Absorbing man and Amazingman copy Zoom's power at the onset of the battle which allows them to run rings around whoever.

AM drains the enemy team members one at a time (the same way he drained Overmaster who was a Galactus rip off) while the two of the other three blitz the shite out of them with IMP's and the third keeps the rest of the opposition off AM.

NOONE above herald level (if that's where we're saying Zoom is)

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Or...

Zoom/Flash
Rogue
Multiple Man (can you see where this is going)
Nemesis Kid.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqjpTIPHPE8

Quasar
Weird
Beta Ray Bill
Maelstrom

Suck it!

Invincible
Doc Strange
Lobo (during his time with blood clones)
Spawn

Originally posted by Magnon
Superman
Supergirl
Superboy
Power Girl

Originally posted by Horrificus
Quasar
Weird
Beta Ray Bill
Maelstrom

Suck it!

Maelstrom >> herald

Blue Marvel
White Lantern (Kyle)
Photon (Genis-Vell)
God Cable

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Maelstrom >> herald r u sure? Is that the general consensus here on the boards?

Because after all, he WAS the herald of Oblivion. Which makes him very, well, "Heraldy".