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Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?

Well, they should be concerned about both.

They really are not though. I know you are, but you are a rare exception and decent person who does not slander himself with hypocrisy.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?

Most of the Atheists with whom you interact live in majority Christian countries, so they are naturally going to be more concerned about the dominant religion in the country in which they live.

Originally posted by Adam_PoE
Most of the Atheists with whom you interact live in majority Christian countries, so they are naturally going to be more concerned about the dominant religion in the country in which they live.

Thats an interesting point. However Islam is the fastest growing religion. More and more Mosques enter American streets. I don't see anyone in Atheists community really caring much at all. Could they know something that is really a bigger issue that Islam is actually a false religion, and they don't concern themselves with it, rather focus on the actual threat?

This is an interesting article.

http://www.salon.com/2014/10/11/ atheism_islam_and_liberalism_this_is_what_we_are_r
eally_fighting_about/

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?


Technically, I'm an agnostic theist, not an atheist, but I stated in a thread in the religious forum why I think Islam gets a deservedly worst reputation than Christianity regarding human rights, so speaking for myself, I do not hold Christianity "in higher concern". I have spoken out against both religions.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?
They don't. You need to distinguish "Atheists" from "mainstream Liberals."

Originally posted by Lestov16
Technically, I'm an agnostic theist, not an atheist, but I stated in a thread in the religious forum why I think Islam gets a deservedly worst reputation than Christianity regarding human rights, so speaking for myself, I do not hold Christianity "in higher concern". I have spoken out against both religions.

Throughout the political arena though, you don't see a acceptance of Islam and a rejection of Christianity?

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?

I do not think they are in the sense that in the West, Christianity is the huge majority religion.

If I wanted to chat with Muslims I would not be able to find many.

I am not an atheist but to Muslims I would be close enough and if they were the predominant religion in my area, the West, then I would be chatting with them more than Christians.

Both religions are homophobic and misogynous and not worthy of modern peoples who have morals.

Regards
DL

You're kind of twisting the question, though it effectively answers itself.

First, the point is, why should atheists concern themselves with any religion? Most don't- they don't care at all. You give the impression that atheists are all militant religion haters who 'concern' themselves constantly.

So if you then push that to the subset of atheists who to actively get involved with trying to debate and/or combat religion, then Adam PoE answered the question- you re interacting with people where the religion they are by a long way most likely to encounter and identify a need for engagement with is Christianity. If I was a politically active atheist in the US and was lobbying to reduce religious influence on the political system, then what is 99% of that influence? Christian, so I would inevitably engage there. If you lived in, say, Turkey, the atheists there (assuming you met one who cared to engage in such debate at all) would concern themselves primarily with Islam.

So, simple as that. Your idea that there is some sort of acceptance of Islam and not of Christianity is entirely false.

As far as the US is concerned, it also seems like the religious right has the anti-islam base covered.

Islamophobia is really pretty popular all through the US and Europe.

Originally posted by Ushgarak


First, the point is, why should atheists concern themselves with any religion? Most don't- they don't care at all. .

If I may.

I am not an atheist but disagree. I think that I and others who fight the mainstream homophobic and misogynous religions do it for altruistic reasons.

I do not mind quoting one of the few words of wisdom in the bible.

Proverbs 3:12 For whom the Lord loveth he correcteth; even as a father the son in whom he delighteth.

We try to correct foolish and damaging thinking. We are not so much against religions as we are against literal reading and what that has done to what were initially decent moral religious traditions.

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

Any and all harmless beliefs are allowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized for good results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the myths that man has created about Gods.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D

When there is a victim is when that view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated Gnostic Christianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To a tyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his new Church was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, his Church, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000 years.

How can a Gnostic Christian, --- and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals when seeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

Can you ignore such things if you have decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the same murderous, freedom stifling ****.

We must discriminate and judge constantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

It is my view that all right wing literalists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- as well as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions --- and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing of religions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals, genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy, miracles and magic. These are all evil.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E2zhlDbMfDg

They also do much harm to their own fellow adherents.

African witches and Jesus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlRG9gXriVI

Jesus Camp 1of 3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac

Death to Gays.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TyuKLyGUHNE

For evil to grow my friend, all good people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your duty to our fellow man.

Regards
DL

Disagree with what? Whether they do concern themselves or whether they should? If the former, you are wrong- that's simply the way it is. They do not concern themselves; they just get on with their lives.

If the latter, that seems a rather militant view. There are more constructive ways to progress than constant confrontation.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Disagree with what?

Whether they do concern themselves or whether they should? If the former, you are wrong- that's simply the way it is. They do not concern themselves; they just get on with their lives.

If the latter, that seems a rather militant view. There are more constructive ways to progress than constant confrontation.

I disagree with, --- "Most don't- they don't care at all."

Logically, if they did not care, they would just ignore those they think are fools.

Not all care of course but most have a decent sense of social conscience and do not like to see their fellow man make a fool of himself by losing his common sense and falling into foolish supernatural and superstitious beliefs.

All humans are altruist and to think that atheists are not is quite disingenuous.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ADgh3yCSdM

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Greatest I am
I disagree with, --- "Most don't- they don't care at all."

Logically, if they did not care, they would just ignore those they think are fools.

Not all care of course but most have a decent sense of social conscience and do not like to see their fellow man make a fool of himself by losing his common sense and falling into foolish supernatural and superstitious beliefs.

All humans are altruist and to think that atheists are not is quite disingenuous.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ADgh3yCSdM

Regards
DL

Regardless of what you think of their logic, you are still wrong. Most atheists do not care enough about religion to engage with it in any form. Incidentally, most people do ignore people they think are fools.

This has no connection to the word 'disingenuous' in any shape or form. Most people just aren't militant, and it is absurd to expect them to be.

I should note that people like Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens are/were harsher on Islam than they are/were on Christianity.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
Regardless of what you think of their logic, you are still wrong. Most atheists do not care enough about religion to engage with it in any form. Incidentally, most people do ignore people they think are fools.

This has no connection to the word 'disingenuous' in any shape or form. Most people just aren't militant, and it is absurd to expect them to be.

I agree with this last.

Your denigration of atheists I do not agree with.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Ushgarak
I very much doubt that you being super-confrontational in such an extreme example would help either. You're also just latching onto Christianity as the source of all evil here, whereas this is really much more of a deeply engrained cultural issue in areas with poor human rights records.

In the long-term, simply building decent secular human rights constructions will win out. The world is already better than it was for such efforts.

Yours is dangerously close to the language of the fanatic- which would make you part of the problem.

You just ran from showing how your methods would work or if they even exist.

Seems we are done.

I was hopping to lose this debate/chat and learn something but you have nothing to teach in terms of a working methodology.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
I should note that people like Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens are/were harsher on Islam than they are/were on Christianity.

Yet if you gather the talks they do, most are on Christianity and not Islam.

Unless you have something you would like to show to back your statement.

Was Hitchens and Dawkins book against Yahweh or Allah?

Yahweh. I rest my case.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Greatest I am
I agree with this last.

Your denigration of atheists I do not agree with.

Regards
DL

You weirdly see this as denigration (I am an atheist, btw) which pretty much just shows your lack of human understanding. I am actually very disturbed by your idea that people must get militantly involved with causes else they are inviting evil- like I say, this is the language of the fanatic. I think you are apt to cause great harm with what you want. You need a better understanding of people.

Incidentally, you are not debating at all- you are basically preaching, just as much as any Christian.

I imagined we could fairly much take it as read that the struggle for human rights over the 20 and 2st centuries has been pretty much a positive one. These things work far better via encouragement and inspiration than needless confrontation. It's also tremendously hypocritical of you to talk about methods when you provide none- you seem to think some random stretch of popular confrontation would do something about Ugandan human rights issues instead of, say, simply widening the confrontation and making it look like a colour and/or post-colonial thing, which makes your ideas cack-handed as well as morally disturbing.

And like I say, mis-attributed. Areas with poor human rights records have these issues regardless of Christianity. Massive human rights abuses in Africa are also are committed in the name of Islam- but then when Ethiopia was communist, they massacred up to half a million Christians there too. You are trying to blame a specific ideology, but that just speaks to your own biased hatred. This is a much broader issue.

I would certainly say atheists, or indeed people in general, are more minded to want something done about human rights in general- as opposed to your weird idea of everyone stepping up in some giant anti-Christian crusade (irony intentional). You are caught up in your own hate.

This is why this whole thread is wrong from the outset- this strange idea that there is a broad anti-Christian campaign going on. Nearly every time some Christian-based idea gets defeated in the courts in the US (for it is generally, in the west, only in the US that Christianity has enough influence for such legal showdowns to happen), it;s not 'Christianity vs. atheists' but 'Fanatic Christianity vs human rights and legal process', which are concepts as much enshrined by other Christians than they are by some massive atheist effort.

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Yet if you gather the talks they do, most are on Christianity and not Islam.

Unless you have something you would like to show to back your statement.

Was Hitchens and Dawkins book against Yahweh or Allah?

Yahweh. I rest my case.

Regards
DL
First minute of this video:
yyNv8kvd2H8

16:35
jyoOfRog1EM

True, most of their books are against Christianity, but the reasons for that have already been aptly stated in this thread. And let's not forget that Yahweh is Allah.

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
First minute of this video:
yyNv8kvd2H8

16:35
jyoOfRog1EM

True, most of their books are against Christianity, but the reasons for that have already been aptly stated in this thread. And let's not forget that Yahweh is Allah.

Yahweh never promised a bunch of virgins in heaven.

Sure both authors spoke against Islam.

As a secondary target.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?

Probably because countries in which Islam is more popular have less atheists in them. I've never actually debated a Muslim, perhaps outside brief encounters on KMC. I don't know many of them. But the country is predominantly Christian, that's what my upbringing was, and the questions/attacks on my beliefs generally come from Christians. So that's where more of my knowledge and focus lies. It's out of necessity. I've never had to answer "Why is Mohammad not God's prophet?" but I've frequently had to answer why I don't believe in the divinity of Jesus.

On principle, of course, I'm not more or less concerned about either. I simply disagree with both, and I'm not terribly militant about my atheism. But any perceived focus on Christianity is a practical one due to my culture.

Oh, also, this:
Originally posted by Ushgarak
You're kind of twisting the question, though it effectively answers itself.

First, the point is, why should atheists concern themselves with any religion? Most don't- they don't care at all. You give the impression that atheists are all militant religion haters who 'concern' themselves constantly.

So if you then push that to the subset of atheists who to actively get involved with trying to debate and/or combat religion, then Adam PoE answered the question- you re interacting with people where the religion they are by a long way most likely to encounter and identify a need for engagement with is Christianity. If I was a politically active atheist in the US and was lobbying to reduce religious influence on the political system, then what is 99% of that influence? Christian, so I would inevitably engage there. If you lived in, say, Turkey, the atheists there (assuming you met one who cared to engage in such debate at all) would concern themselves primarily with Islam.

So, simple as that. Your idea that there is some sort of acceptance of Islam and not of Christianity is entirely false.

Originally posted by Greatest I am
I do not think they are in the sense that in the West, Christianity is the huge majority religion.

If I wanted to chat with Muslims I would not be able to find many.

I am not an atheist but to Muslims I would be close enough and if they were the predominant religion in my area, the West, then I would be chatting with them more than Christians.

Both religions are homophobic and misogynous and not worthy of modern peoples who have morals.

Regards
DL

So if Canada had more like a 10-20% populace of Islamic believers, you would be quoting disproving the Koran instead of the Bible?

Originally posted by Greatest I am
Yahweh never promised a bunch of virgins in heaven.

Sure both authors spoke against Islam.

As a secondary target.

Regards
DL

Different interpretations of the same character

Dawkins spoke primarily against Islam while Hitchens spoke about freedom of speech and religion in general as a secondary target.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
So if Canada had more like a 10-20% populace of Islamic believers, you would be quoting disproving the Koran instead of the Bible?

If I was speaking to a Muslim, I would not care if it was a majority or a minority. I was just showing that there are not many around.

Those that are, are mostly so far to the right that reasoning with them is practically impossible.

They mostly end up sounding like this one who cannot answer straight questions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIoFiDE2awM

Regards
DL

We have a Muslim that posts here, but I never seen you engage him.

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
Different interpretations of the same character

Dawkins spoke primarily against Islam while Hitchens spoke about freedom of speech and religion in general as a secondary target.

That has not been what I have found while casting through the web.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
We have a Muslim that posts here, but I never seen you engage him.

Or him me.

There are many here I have not interacted with.

Your point was?

Regards
DL

Usually anyone who makes a post about Christianty or God, much like I did here you engage. So it appears to me that you single out Christians and my Op was correct.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Usually anyone who makes a post about Christianty or God, much like I did here you engage. So it appears to me that you single out Christians and my Op was correct.

You show how poorly you judge.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Greatest I am
You show how poorly you judge.

Regards
DL

Very true. He conceders anyone who disagrees with him an attacker.

Originally posted by Greatest I am
You show how poorly you judge.

Regards
DL

When do you debate Allah or the Koran or Mohammad though. Like I said, there are Islamic faith posters here..

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Very true. He conceders anyone who disagrees with him an attacker.

Not at all

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
When do you debate Allah or the Koran or Mohammad though. Like I said, there are Islamic faith posters here..

I get around and take on all I go against regardless of their religion on the moral or belief issue I speak to.

At this point in time, even as I am prolific, there is only one Muslim who I am speaking to. The first one this year I think.

You might like to know that when I first started in these sites, I did go to many Muslim sites but most banned me in quick order just as the more right wing Christian sites have banned me.

The more Right wing the site, the less tolerant they are and you have seen how leftish I am and that is why I get the boot fairly quickly from right leaning sites.

You have seen how I often say that Christian and Muslin religions are both homophobic and misogynous yet no Muslim from this site ever took offence enough to engage.

Regards
DL

Originally posted by Greatest I am
...You have seen how I often say that Christian and Muslin religions are both homophobic and misogynous yet no Muslim from this site ever took offence enough to engage.

Regards
DL

No Muslim here reads anything.

Originally posted by Greatest I am
I get around and take on all I go against regardless of their religion on the moral or belief issue I speak to.

At this point in time, even as I am prolific, there is only one Muslim who I am speaking to. The first one this year I think.

You might like to know that when I first started in these sites, I did go to many Muslim sites but most banned me in quick order just as the more right wing Christian sites have banned me.

The more Right wing the site, the less tolerant they are and you have seen how leftish I am and that is why I get the boot fairly quickly from right leaning sites.

You have seen how I often say that Christian and Muslin religions are both homophobic and misogynous yet no Muslim from this site ever took offence enough to engage.

Regards
DL

Fair enough

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Why are atheists more concern about Christianity than Islam?

Can't speak for all atheists, but when it comes to America..well, Christianity is shoved down our throats a lot more then Islam is. It doesn't say "In Allah We Trust" on our money.

Originally posted by Time Immemorial
Fair enough

Thanks.

Regards
DL