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This is not a gauntlet. I'm just curious to see how Yall think Adam & Monica would do against these pairs.

1. Ikaris & Sersi
2. Quasar & Captain Marvel (Carol)
3. Hulk & Red She Hulk
4. Lady Thor & Odinson
5. Superman & Wonder Woman
6. Animal Man & Vixen

I think they would do well against all but I think the first three matches would be the most difficult due to versatility. And I think 3,4, and 5 would defeat them though.

too bad we'll never know just how powerful monica was intended to become. she seemed a planetbuster to me anyway. that said, (1) would be a severe challenge. not sure which duo would take the majority, but sersi's transmutation would be extremely difficult for the pair to counter. she's already frozen an intangible vision, so i would think she could do the same to monica. ik has tons of versatility. likely the eternals would take it, but like i said, hard to say what level monica reached for sure.

they'd beat (2) and (3). (4) would be really fun to see. if thor has the hammer as well, i'd give it to them in a close fight. supes and ww would also be very close. monica would be a tough match up for diana so i might go with bm/spectrum for a slight majority there. and def take them against am/vixen.

weird order....

They beat all except team 4, since BFR wasnt taken off the table.

Leo, I don't think Ikaris holds a candle to Blue Marvel. Intangibility is different than what Monica is. Sersi shouldn't be able to do much. The vision is still composed of molecules no matter how dense he is. Quasar would be hell for Monica I think, but Adam would more than even the odd. Red She Hulk, and the Hulk would be troublesome, and could win. The rest of what you wrote I agree completely with.

Did Monica die?

Will she be in the new- Marvel?

Originally posted by leonidas
too bad we'll never know just how powerful monica was intended to become. she seemed a planetbuster to me anyway. She was planning on destroying the Ultimate Universe's Earth by hitting it in hard-light form as hard as she could. She hesitated when she saw the innocent children there and was neutralized by City. Maker asked City why she didn't destroy the world.

So it was heavily suggested that she was capable of single-handedly destroying the planet.

Originally posted by ODG
She was planning on destroying the Ultimate Universe's Earth by hitting it in hard-light form as hard as she could. She hesitated when she saw the innocent children there and was neutralized by City. Maker asked City why she didn't destroy the world.

So it was heavily suggested that she was capable of single-handedly destroying the planet. Does mean she has more Powa than Hulk!!

Originally posted by byrdgang21
This is not a gauntlet. I'm just curious to see how Yall think Adam & Monica would do against these pairs.

1. Ikaris & Sersi
2. Quasar & Captain Marvel (Carol)
3. Hulk & Red She Hulk
4. Lady Thor & Odinson
5. Superman & Wonder Woman
6. Animal Man & Vixen
The only majority wins I give them is against 2. And even that's pushing it.

Imagine what Quasar could do to Monica? Draw all her power into the Q-bands then unleash the mother of all energy blasts directed at BM. Could he even survive that?

Depends in if Quasar could draw her in, and if she in turn could manipulate his bands while in there.

Originally posted by Insane Titan
Does mean she has more Powa than Hulk!!
Not in her fists.

Originally posted by Stoic
Leo, I don't think Ikaris holds a candle to Blue Marvel. Intangibility is different than what Monica is. Sersi shouldn't be able to do much. The vision is still composed of molecules no matter how dense he is. Quasar would be hell for Monica I think, but Adam would more than even the odd. Red She Hulk, and the Hulk would be troublesome, and could win. The rest of what you wrote I agree completely with.

i could def see ikaris giving bm a lot of trouble. he's cl100, with quite a variety of abilities.... as for sersi--magic is magic. she's transformed all the avengers into metal and also has control over energy. i don't see why she couldn't pretty easily affect monica's light form via transmutation. i think these 2 def have the feats to take down bm and monica. for a majority? really hard to say imo.

quasar could be a problem, but i figure for that reason bm would take him. she'd beat carol pretty handily imo while bm held the fort with quasar or beat him outright.

Originally posted by riv6672
Depends in if Quasar could draw her in, and if she in turn could manipulate his bands while in there.
Monica...........manipulate the bands?! No.

The Q-bands are basically instant win vs ANYTHING in the EM spectrum. Quasar's entire series is proof of this. He could easily absorb her in her entirety and unleash the blast against BM. It's not a question of CAN he do this, it's a question of CAN BM survive that blast?

Originally posted by leonidas
i could def see ikaris giving bm a lot of trouble. he's cl100, with quite a variety of abilities.... as for sersi--magic is magic. she's transformed all the avengers into metal and also has control over energy. i don't see why she couldn't pretty easily affect monica's light form via transmutation. i think these 2 def have the feats to take down bm and monica. for a majority? really hard to say imo.

quasar could be a problem, but i figure for that reason bm would take him. she'd beat carol pretty handily imo while bm held the fort with quasar or beat him outright.

Sersi isn't a magical being though, she manipulates molecules to a high degree that makes it seem like she is magical. Am I right? You may be thinking of Circe. Ikaris is a cl 100, but more at the low end, while Adam is a high end cl 100. I really don't think that Ikaris would be up to a slug fest with Adam TBH. We saw how Rulk was throwing him around. Adam is superior to Rulk, if we take Rulk's battle with Simon into consideration. Adam would outright destroy Simon. Adam would beat Quasar pretty quickly as well I think.

Originally posted by zopzop
Monica...........manipulate the bands?! No.

The Q-bands are basically instant win vs ANYTHING in the EM spectrum. Quasar's entire series is proof of this. He could easily absorb her in her entirety and unleash the blast against BM. It's not a question of CAN he do this, it's a question of CAN BM survive that blast?

No they aren't, it takes him time, and he would have to wrestle against her own control over the EM spectrum, which is considerable. While, I believe that the bands would win, they aren't as powerful as you may be alluding to. After all, they aren't as powerful as the CCR. Carol isn't holding up Adam for even an instant, which would be nearly a one shot for him to be done with her. Quasar would be next. He has rarely if ever been able to contend with high end brute strength. Adam brings that kind of strength to the table.

Originally posted by Stoic
Sersi isn't a magical being though, she manipulates molecules to a high degree that makes it seem like she is magical. Am I right? You may be thinking of Circe. Ikaris is a cl 100, but more at the low end, while Adam is a high end cl 100. I really don't think that Ikaris would be up to a slug fest with Adam TBH. We saw how Rulk was throwing him around. Adam is superior to Rulk, if we take Rulk's battle with Simon into consideration. Adam would outright destroy Simon. Adam would beat Quasar pretty quickly as well I think.



No they aren't, it takes him time, and he would have to wrestle against her own control over the EM spectrum, which is considerable. While, I believe that the bands would win, they aren't as powerful as you may be alluding to. After all, they aren't as powerful as the CCR. Carol isn't holding up Adam for even an instant, which would be nearly a one shot for him to be done with her. Quasar would be next. He has rarely if ever been able to contend with high end brute strength. Adam brings that kind of strength to the table.

None of this shows Ikaris being knocked around by Red Hulk in my opinion at least. In fact it looks even to me. Ikaris didn't even finish the fight because he was busy saving the others from the magma.

http://i.imgur.com/T2DTY81.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/H8CCWkA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/fTH34HA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mh2F8QF.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/NDlcJlB.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dON7YNp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/rTTvtY0.jpg

If you scratch your rectum then scratch your penis you can get fungus on your penis

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
None of this shows Ikaris being knocked around by Red Hulk in my opinion at least. In fact it looks even to me. Ikaris didn't even finish the fight because he was busy saving the others from the magma.

http://i.imgur.com/T2DTY81.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/H8CCWkA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/fTH34HA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mh2F8QF.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/NDlcJlB.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dON7YNp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/rTTvtY0.jpg

Red Hulk got the better of that exchange. I have no idea what you were looking at? But like I said, Simon Williams manhandled Red Hulk, and Adam would beat the breaks off of Simon. Ikaris is a cl 100 but at the low end like I stated. Adam is at the high end. It was also stated the Ikaris was below the cl 100 tier in the hand books, but it said the same about Simon. If anything, neither are high end cl 100's.

Originally posted by Stoic
Red Hulk got the better of that exchange. I have no idea what you were looking at? But like I said, Simon Williams manhandled Red Hulk, and Adam would beat the breaks off of Simon. Ikaris is a cl 100 but at the low end like I stated. Adam is at the high end. It was also stated the Ikaris was below the cl 100 tier in the hand books, but it said the same about Simon. If anything, neither are high end cl 100's.

Well like I just said to you, he wasn't being thrown around as you put it. It was a bit more even than Ikaris being thrown around in my opinion is all that I was saying.

I just disagree that he was thrown around.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Well like I just said to you, he wasn't being thrown around as you put it. It was a bit more even than Ikaris being thrown around in my opinion is all that I was saying.

I just disagree that he was thrown around.

Agreed.

Originally posted by leonidas
i could def see ikaris giving bm a lot of trouble. he's cl100, with quite a variety of abilities.... as for sersi--magic is magic. she's transformed all the avengers into metal and also has control over energy. i don't see why she couldn't pretty easily affect monica's light form via transmutation. i think these 2 def have the feats to take down bm and monica. for a majority? really hard to say imo.

quasar could be a problem, but i figure for that reason bm would take him. she'd beat carol pretty handily imo while bm held the fort with quasar or beat him outright.

I don't see her affecting Monica in light form. I don't see her being able to concentrate on her or keep with her speed in that form. Hell, some of her forms are invisible.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Well like I just said to you, he wasn't being thrown around as you put it. It was a bit more even than Ikaris being thrown around in my opinion is all that I was saying.

I just disagree that he was thrown around.

Anyone that Rulk breaks even with (aside from a gamma mutate) is in a tier below Adam's though. That was really what I was getting at. Red hulk got the better of that exchange. Anyone can see that. If that were on a point system, Rulk was the dominant fighter by a god margin. Simon William's did far better than Ikaris, which also goes to show that Ikaris probably wouldn't even beat him. That's based solely on their battles with Rulk. Adam seems to be well above all three being mentioned. He isn't going to have much trouble with Ikaris IMO.

Blue Marvel admitted Namor gave him a good fight, someone that was said on panel as being nothing to Ikaris. Also, the lowballing of Red Hulk.

Originally posted by Stoic
Sersi isn't a magical being though, she manipulates molecules to a high degree that makes it seem like she is magical. Am I right? You may be thinking of Circe. Ikaris is a cl 100, but more at the low end, while Adam is a high end cl 100. I really don't think that Ikaris would be up to a slug fest with Adam TBH. We saw how Rulk was throwing him around. Adam is superior to Rulk, if we take Rulk's battle with Simon into consideration. Adam would outright destroy Simon. Adam would beat Quasar pretty quickly as well I think.
Why would Ikaris need to fight BM? Sersi has been shown to be strong enough to two shot KO Immortal Hercules. She stalemated Exodus in a prolonged psiwar. Sersi has protected her teammates while the ENTIRE UNIVERSE blinked out of existence. She's turned people into inert matter to help them survive a GALAXY BUSTING attack. She's easily the most powerful person in the Eternals vs BM/Spectrum fight.

Ikaris was taking on Namor while being blasted by Hammond Torch (look up his respect thread to get an idea of his power level) and he was more than holding his own.

These Eternals are absolutely no joke.



Quasar would insta gimp Spectrum. Let's not kid ourselves. The Quantum Bands operate on a higher level than Monica.

He's brought a Watcher to his knees, absorbed power from a nearby star to create a solar flare that dwarf the Stranger's lab world. He's held off PF Rachel. Stalemated the Silver Surfer. Bubbled up Binary. Shielded a group of Mourners from an IG blast from Thanos. Almost instantly absorbed the Living Laser. I could go on but you get the point.

Originally posted by carver9
Blue Marvel admitted Namor gave him a good fight, someone that was said on panel as being nothing to Ikaris. Also, the lowballing of Red Hulk.

Did you actually see the fight between Namor and Blue marvel? That's like every time Superman says that this guy or the other was the strongest person he ever faced, while going on to beat them handily.

What low balling? Rulk was defeated by Simon with ease. The Red Hulk was consistently being beaten, or made to look far worse than his Loeb era days. So what low balling are you talking about? The only character that the Red Hulk consistently did well against was the Hulk, and that was because Red Hulk had power over gamma mutates.

Originally posted by zopzop

Why would Ikaris need to fight BM? Sersi has been shown to be strong enough to two shot KO Immortal Hercules. She stalemated Exodus in a prolonged psiwar. Sersi has protected her teammates while the ENTIRE UNIVERSE blinked out of existence. She's turned people into inert matter to help them survive a GALAXY BUSTING attack. She's easily the most powerful person in the Eternals vs BM/Spectrum fight.

Ikaris was taking on Namor while being blasted by Hammond Torch (look up his respect thread to get an idea of his power level) and he was more than holding his own.

These Eternals are absolutely no joke.



Quasar would insta gimp Spectrum. Let's not kid ourselves. The Quantum Bands operate on a higher level than Monica.

He's brought a Watcher to his knees, absorbed power from a nearby star to create a solar flare that dwarf the Stranger's lab world. He's held off PF Rachel. Stalemated the Silver Surfer. Bubbled up Binary. Shielded a group of Mourners from an IG blast from Thanos. Almost instantly absorbed the Living Laser. I could go on but you get the point.

What were the conditions behind Sersi? Don't try deception Zop. That wasn't an average Sersi. Quasar had to wrestle against opponents that were energetic, and in this case Monica actually has power, and control over the EM spectrum, and to a considerable degree. Quasar isn't insta beating her. He wins, but not as quickly as you're saying. He never had that much control, at least not on par with the CCR, which pwned the shit out of him and the Q-bands. They aren't as powerful as you're trying to make it out. Also many of the things that Quasar did may have been extremely high showings for him, but then again Rulk overwhelmed beings far above his station as well. The Surfer is easily drained as well. Just because he can power drain, does not mean that he can't be drained. This has happened on more than one occasion.

Neither Ikaris or Sersi are beating Adam. At least not at the moment. Try again when he actually loses to someone on their level. As of now, Adam's average is extremely high, so anything that you say negatively about him is simply wrong.

Originally posted by carver9
Blue Marvel admitted Namor gave him a good fight, someone that was said on panel as being nothing to Ikaris. Also, the lowballing of Red Hulk.


Where did it state that Namor was nothing compared to Ikaris? It looks like you're going into Carter mode again. You're going to take one showing, and pass it off as the average? The Hulk has had it out with Ikaris, Thor has had it out with Ikaris, and there is no way in the Marvel Universe that Namor is nothing compared to Ikaris. Namor a guy that actually kayoed the Hulk because hit hit him that hard. When did Ikaris ever, KO the Hulk because he hit him that hard? One showing means a majority right? SMH.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
None of this shows Ikaris being knocked around by Red Hulk in my opinion at least. In fact it looks even to me. Ikaris didn't even finish the fight because he was busy saving the others from the magma.

http://i.imgur.com/T2DTY81.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/H8CCWkA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/fTH34HA.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mh2F8QF.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/NDlcJlB.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dON7YNp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/rTTvtY0.jpg

Cool fight. But it looked close to even to me.

Originally posted by byrdgang21
Cool fight. But it looked close to even to me.

How did that look close to even to you? Rulk had him on the ground, and he could have continued pounding on him near the end, but stopped.

Originally posted by Stoic
Where did it state that Namor was nothing compared to Ikaris? It looks like you're going into Carter mode again. You're going to take one showing, and pass it off as the average? The Hulk has had it out with Ikaris, Thor has had it out with Ikaris, and there is no way in the Marvel Universe that Namor is nothing compared to Ikaris. Namor a guy that actually kayoed the Hulk because hit hit him that hard. When did Ikaris ever, KO the Hulk because he hit him that hard? One showing means a majority right? SMH.

If you read the Ikaris respect thread I made you would understand.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t613247.html

It's stated that he's too powerful for anyone in the group and he's still fighting the mind control.

You're making loads of statements about things that have not even happened.

You are quick to chastise Carver yet what he said although phrased differently actually happened. So I wouldn't chide him because you're wrong.

Thor has never fought Ikaris, so again there is no need to chuck out these type of statements when you're wrong.

Originally posted by Stoic
Sersi isn't a magical being though, she manipulates molecules to a high degree that makes it seem like she is magical. Am I right? You may be thinking of Circe. Ikaris is a cl 100, but more at the low end, while Adam is a high end cl 100. I really don't think that Ikaris would be up to a slug fest with Adam TBH. We saw how Rulk was throwing him around. Adam is superior to Rulk, if we take Rulk's battle with Simon into consideration. Adam would outright destroy Simon. Adam would beat Quasar pretty quickly as well I think.



No they aren't, it takes him time, and he would have to wrestle against her own control over the EM spectrum, which is considerable. While, I believe that the bands would win, they aren't as powerful as you may be alluding to. After all, they aren't as powerful as the CCR. Carol isn't holding up Adam for even an instant, which would be nearly a one shot for him to be done with her. Quasar would be next. He has rarely if ever been able to contend with high end brute strength. Adam brings that kind of strength to the table.

you're right about the magic. i was unintentionally equating her transmutation as magic, but you're right, it isn't. still, imo she is the most dangerous on the field. there really isn't any reason at all to assume she simply couldn't transmute adam OR monica. her power is a bit haxx in that sense. she has so many transmutation feats it's ridiculous and many against high powered organics like the avengers. she's even manipulated a nega bomb. and she really doesn't have 'low feats'. the ones zop mentioned were performed pretty easily and really are consistent with her showings. she does have durability issues at times, but also has high level psi powers and illusions.

as for ikaris--he's more than powerful enough to hold his own imo against bm. he wouldn't win in the end but the figths would be long and tough.

as far as the q-bands--quasar is one of the most consistent characters out there. i think that showing against the ccr is....pretty pi$$y tbh. he's easily matched ss in prolonged battle and done well against phoenix. he has some crazy feats. he'd beat spectrum, but i do agree with you--it wouldn't be as easy as zop says imo. especially given the new level of power it seems she had attained.

Originally posted by Stoic
What were the conditions behind Sersi? Don't try deception Zop. That wasn't an average Sersi.
That was Sersi unleashed. No power ups, no nothing. Just her losing her mind and not giving a phuck.


Annihilus in that arc was destroying High Heralds like it was going out of style. How is Quasar losing to him a bad showing?

Rulk had the Loebforce during that BS. He's running joke now.

Quasar faces off against Watchers and High Heralds. Monica fights Metas. Huge difference. Oh and there's also this :
http://pasteboard.co/1932r2DT.jpg
and this (that's Quasar INSTANTLY absorbing power from ALL the Annihilators and throwing up a shield to protect them from a blast) :
http://pasteboard.co/1933Y4kH.jpg
and remember I mentioned this? :
http://pasteboard.co/1939ub3B.jpg

Monica is completely out of her league here.


Sersi would end Adam if she was serious about it. Don't kid yourself.

Originally posted by Stoic
How did that look close to even to you? Rulk had him on the ground, and he could have continued pounding on him near the end, but stopped.

To me it looks like they both were able to get some good shots in. Rulk may have seemed to be in control when the fight ended but IMO that doesn't show Rulk dominating that fight.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
You're making loads of statements about things that have not even happened.

You are quick to chastise Carver yet what he said although phrased differently actually happened. So I wouldn't chide him because you're wrong.

Thor has never fought Ikaris, so again there is no need to chuck out these type of statements when you're wrong.

What statement did I make about things that did not happen? I may be unaware of a rise in Ike's power levels as of late, but then again you may be unaware of things that happened in the past.

Thor and Ikaris have fought before, he also fought against the Hulk. So no, I'm not wrong. If Ikaris has recently gotten an upgrade, I was unaware of that even happening. I was talking about the Ikaris that fought Rulk, and his power levels before that fight. Thor also easily showed dominance over Ikaris when they fought.

Originally posted by leonidas
you're right about the magic. i was unintentionally equating her transmutation as magic, but you're right, it isn't. still, imo she is the most dangerous on the field. there really isn't any reason at all to assume she simply couldn't transmute adam OR monica. her power is a bit haxx in that sense. she has so many transmutation feats it's ridiculous and many against high powered organics like the avengers. she's even manipulated a nega bomb. and she really doesn't have 'low feats'. the ones zop mentioned were performed pretty easily and really are consistent with her showings. she does have durability issues at times, but also has high level psi powers and illusions.

as for ikaris--he's more than powerful enough to hold his own imo against bm. he wouldn't win in the end but the figths would be long and tough.

as far as the q-bands--quasar is one of the most consistent characters out there. i think that showing against the ccr is....pretty pi$$y tbh. he's easily matched ss in prolonged battle and done well against phoenix. he has some crazy feats. he'd beat spectrum, but i do agree with you--it wouldn't be as easy as zop says imo. especially given the new level of power it seems she had attained.

I don't think that she could transmute Monica in solid light form. there would be no molecules to manipulate. As for Adam, I'm also not certain that he isn't resistant to molecular manipulations. I wouldn't be at all surprised if he wasn't, when he had the ability to heal Monica in her energy form.

As for Quasar, yes he has some pretty good showings, but again Monica has very strong control over the EM spectrum. Even though it isn't canon to forum matches, Monica was overwhelming a GL by matching the rings output. Quasar would win but he'd have to fight for it. Carol is a non factor. BM would do away with her, and possibly be able to stop Quasar from beating Monica, because i don't see Carol doing well against BM at all. Carol wouldn't so well against either Monica or BM. Quasar isn't beating the both of them alone.

Originally posted by zopzop

That was Sersi unleashed. No power ups, no nothing. Just her losing her mind and not giving a phuck.


Annihilus in that arc was destroying High Heralds like it was going out of style. How is Quasar losing to him a bad showing?

Rulk had the Loebforce during that BS. He's running joke now.

Quasar faces off against Watchers and High Heralds. Monica fights Metas. Huge difference. Oh and there's also this :
http://pasteboard.co/1932r2DT.jpg
and this (that's Quasar INSTANTLY absorbing power from ALL the Annihilators and throwing up a shield to protect them from a blast) :
http://pasteboard.co/1933Y4kH.jpg
and remember I mentioned this? :
http://pasteboard.co/1939ub3B.jpg

Monica is completely out of her league here.


Sersi would end Adam if she was serious about it. Don't kid yourself.

If Rulk is a running joke these days or before he was injected and reduced back down to his human self, what was Ikaris when they fought? Scott put up some scans of their brief scuffle, and at the end Rulk had the advantage. From what I saw, Rulk could have continued pounding on his face, but then stopped. If we compare that showing to what Simon Williams did to Rulk I would say that Simon would beat the crap out of Ikaris at that point in time. If Ikaris has risen in power since then, that's another story, but then again i had no idea that Ikaris had a drastic power spike over the past 2 or 3 years.

Originally posted by Stoic
What statement di i make about things that did not happen? I may be unaware of a rise in Ike's power levels as of late, but then again you may be unaware of things that happened in the past.

Thor and Ikaris have fought before, he also fought against the Hulk. So no, I'm not wrong. If Ikaris has recently gotten an upgrade, I was unaware of that even happening. I was talking about the Ikaris that fought Rulk, and his power levels before that fight. Thor also easily showed dominance over Ikaris when they fought.


Trouble is you are wrong, he has never fought Thor. If you ventured over to the respect thread you would see that.

If you also bothered to go there you would also see I included the Hulk fight there. So yes you are wrong.

Stop being complacent for the sake of it. Whenever Ikaris saw Thor they have only spoke together. Never fought each other.

I could throw a guess and perhaps say Virako may have fought Thor but I never read up on him.

Here it is again just in case you missed it.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t613247.html

Originally posted by Stoic
Did you actually see the fight between Namor and Blue marvel? That's like every time Superman says that this guy or the other was the strongest person he ever faced, while going on to beat them handily.

What low balling? Rulk was defeated by Simon with ease. The Red Hulk was consistently being beaten, or made to look far worse than his Loeb era days. So what low balling are you talking about? The only character that the Red Hulk consistently did well against was the Hulk, and that was because Red Hulk had power over gamma mutates.



What were the conditions behind Sersi? Don't try deception Zop. That wasn't an average Sersi. Quasar had to wrestle against opponents that were energetic, and in this case Monica actually has power, and control over the EM spectrum, and to a considerable degree. Quasar isn't insta beating her. He wins, but not as quickly as you're saying. He never had that much control, at least not on par with the CCR, which pwned the shit out of him and the Q-bands. They aren't as powerful as you're trying to make it out. Also many of the things that Quasar did may have been extremely high showings for him, but then again Rulk overwhelmed beings far above his station as well. The Surfer is easily drained as well. Just because he can power drain, does not mean that he can't be drained. This has happened on more than one occasion.

Neither Ikaris or Sersi are beating Adam. At least not at the moment. Try again when he actually loses to someone on their level. As of now, Adam's average is extremely high, so anything that you say negatively about him is simply wrong.

Did you see the Red Hulk and Thor fight? Was a good one that ended in a stalemate and I'm not talking about their first fight either. Are you suggesting that Simon is more powerful than Thor? Because the Thor and Red Hulk fight lasted some pages. Let me know. By the way, this was Rulk fighting Thor without the power absorption. By the way, who beat up Rulk?

Almost all these fights will be tough and could fall either way.

1. Ikaris & Sersi - Sersi is straight up powerful. She can manipulate energy to some extent as well as matter and it's quite possible she could take either opponent one on one. If all else fails try holding both inside adamantium or create some sort of prism trap to hold or disperse Monica. Ikaris is no joke either lately and would pull his weight. Leaning toward the eternals.

2. Quasar & Captain Marvel (Carol). Quasar could give BM a fight, and I'm pretty certain he can take Monica out of the game quickly. But paired with Captain Marvel I think BM/M have the distinct advantage because Carol will be the weak link. But at some point Carol could absorb energy - if she still has those powers it's more even.

3. Hulk & Red She Hulk. Depends on the version of the Hulk, but I can see some levels of Hulk beating down BM eventually or at least holding out. Neither Hulk has an easy way of taking out Monica, Hulk teams aren't versatile enough (but if it was during the WWH arc somehow a thunderclap would disperse her). Maybe a draw, I don't see the Hulks gaining outright victory because of Monica.

4. Lady Thor & Odinson - I'm not sure that Odinson can give BM a fight when it's basically strength vs comparable strength + flight + energy powers. The way Lady Thor wields her hammer she could probably give BM a fight and maybe do something to Monica's energy form with it. Leaning towards BM/M, but give Odinson a hammer too and I'd give advantage to the Thors.

5. Superman & Wonder Woman - I think this pairing should win a majority, but again Monica might be tricky to take out.

6. Animal Man & Vixen. Unless they've got some higher end abilities I'm not familiar with, like channeling the entire power of the Red, BM/M will win.

@basilisk:
Only version of Animal Man/Vixen that can have a go are pre-DCnU, when he was channeling Sun-Eaters and she was copying powers and skills from anyone and everyone - and stacking them.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Trouble is you are wrong, he has never fought Thor. If you ventured over to the respect thread you would see that.

If you also bothered to go there you would also see I included the Hulk fight there. So yes you are wrong.

Stop being complacent for the sake of it. Whenever Ikaris saw Thor they have only spoke together. Never fought each other.

I could throw a guess and perhaps say Virako may have fought Thor but I never read up on him.

Here it is again just in case you missed it.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t613247.html

OK. I'm back. I had to run a few errands. You could be right, I really could have swore that Ikaris and Thor had a brief scuffle. Now about your tone, you might want to tone it down because whatever you're saying has nothing to do with Namor being nothing to Ikaris. Was Namor nothing to Thanos? Nothing means ignoring being struck by another character much like WB Hulk no sold and ignored Wendigo, and Bi-Beast. Thanos actually got his mouth busted open, and slightly staggered by Namor.s punch. Would Ikaris be able to reproduce similar results in a battle with Namor? Choose you words wisely.

Originally posted by carver9
Did you see the Red Hulk and Thor fight? Was a good one that ended in a stalemate and I'm not talking about their first fight either. Are you suggesting that Simon is more powerful than Thor? Because the Thor and Red Hulk fight lasted some pages. Let me know. By the way, this was Rulk fighting Thor without the power absorption. By the way, who beat up Rulk?

The Red Hulk Thor fight? Which one? Loeb era Rulk isn't the same as the one that fought Ikaris. Like I mentioned to Scott, in order to be nothing to another character, one would have to be able to no sell a punch from them much like WB Hulk no sold Wendigo, and Bi-Beast. Not even Thanos no sold namor's punch. Namor busted his mouth open. So what are you saying exactly?


Originally posted by basilisk
Almost all these fights will be tough and could fall either way.

1. Ikaris & Sersi - Sersi is straight up powerful. She can manipulate energy to some extent as well as matter and it's quite possible she could take either opponent one on one. If all else fails try holding both inside adamantium or create some sort of prism trap to hold or disperse Monica. Ikaris is no joke either lately and would pull his weight. Leaning toward the eternals.

2. Quasar & Captain Marvel (Carol). Quasar could give BM a fight, and I'm pretty certain he can take Monica out of the game quickly. But paired with Captain Marvel I think BM/M have the distinct advantage because Carol will be the weak link. But at some point Carol could absorb energy - if she still has those powers it's more even.

3. Hulk & Red She Hulk. Depends on the version of the Hulk, but I can see some levels of Hulk beating down BM eventually or at least holding out. Neither Hulk has an easy way of taking out Monica, Hulk teams aren't versatile enough (but if it was during the WWH arc somehow a thunderclap would disperse her). Maybe a draw, I don't see the Hulks gaining outright victory because of Monica.

4. Lady Thor & Odinson - I'm not sure that Odinson can give BM a fight when it's basically strength vs comparable strength + flight + energy powers. The way Lady Thor wields her hammer she could probably give BM a fight and maybe do something to Monica's energy form with it. Leaning towards BM/M, but give Odinson a hammer too and I'd give advantage to the Thors.

5. Superman & Wonder Woman - I think this pairing should win a majority, but again Monica might be tricky to take out.

6. Animal Man & Vixen. Unless they've got some higher end abilities I'm not familiar with, like channeling the entire power of the Red, BM/M will win.

Whate are they doing while Sersi is doing all of this and Ikaris is doing all of that? Should I remind you of which team is actually faster?

Quasar is strong against energetic opponents, but weak against mega bricks. BM would defeat him. carol is a non factor. Quasar isn't beating both of them, and would have to wrestle with Monica. It won't be an insta win.

The rest that you wrote I agree with.

Originally posted by Stoic
OK. I'm back. I had to run a few errands. You could be right, I really could have swore that Ikaris and Thor had a brief scuffle. Now about your tone, you might want to tone it down because whatever you're saying has nothing to do with Namor being nothing to Ikaris. Was Namor nothing to Thanos? Nothing means ignoring being struck by another character much like WB Hulk no sold and ignored Wendigo, and Bi-Beast. Thanos actually got his mouth busted open, and slightly staggered by Namor.s punch. Would Ikaris be able to reproduce similar results in a battle with Namor? Choose you words wisely.



The Red Hulk Thor fight? Which one? Loeb era Rulk isn't the same as the one that fought Ikaris. Like I mentioned to Scott, in order to be nothing to another character, one would have to be able to no sell a punch from them much like WB Hulk no sold Wendigo, and Bi-Beast. Not even Thanos no sold namor's punch. Namor busted his mouth open. So what are you saying exactly?




Whate are they doing while Sersi is doing all of this and Ikaris is doing all of that? Should I remind you of which team is actually faster?

Quasar is strong against energetic opponents, but weak against mega bricks. BM would defeat him. carol is a non factor. Quasar isn't beating both of them, and would have to wrestle with Monica. It won't be an insta win.

The rest that you wrote I agree with.

Trust me I don't believe he did fight Thor. I downloaded every comic Ikaris ever appeared in and he never fought Thor. Spoke to him a few times yeah, but never did they fight.

Again I didn't state anything out of the ordinary. It did have something to say that Namor was Ikaris's better. The respect thread has it there for you to see. I can't really explain it any better.

The battle in question.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot


http://i.imgur.com/XeuYfHi.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/bZjyIII.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/wz0ipAa.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/pz9SB6K.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/pio1uHQ.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/UKm95fC.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/mSJPwra.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/RQDIMZy.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/CTQ2qLY.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/0PE1d19.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/igu7OGs.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/UJihycv.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/12YE3yf.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vP8PpD4.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/KYkqwmf.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/wniMNtu.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/CZQZgvX.jpg



From The All-New Invaders #3 and The All-New Invaders #5

You're talking to me about how Carver phrased it not me. I didn't say he was nothing to Namor. I expect Carver meant he was more powerful than Namor (which he is as it is stated) rather than it being like either me or you facing off an ant.

@Stoic...

It was the same Red Hulk Wonderman fought. Not Loeb RH and he was not using any absorption.

Red Hulk jumps in to help Cap and Thor.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk1.jpg

Thor remembering their last encounter attacks Rulk. A Rulk that isn't fighting back.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk2.jpg

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk3.jpg

How do we know Rulk wasn't fighting back? He tells us.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk5.jpg

A pissed Thor attacks him again.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk6.jpg

After this beating, Red Hulk is ok and went on to save Earth by destroying a comet.

https://p.dreamwidth.org/abe618c8b757/img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/Lamashtar/RulkHulk26-4.jpg

Wonderman took Rulk out in a couple of panels. Now let's use your logic here that you are trying to throw on us. Is Wonderman more powerful than Thor?

Did the city capture Monica or kill her ?

Originally posted by carver9
@Stoic...

It was the same Red Hulk Wonderman fought. Not Loeb RH and he was not using any absorption.

Red Hulk jumps in to help Cap and Thor.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk1.jpg

Thor remembering their last encounter attacks Rulk. A Rulk that isn't fighting back.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk2.jpg

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk3.jpg

How do we know Rulk wasn't fighting back? He tells us.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk5.jpg

A pissed Thor attacks him again.

https://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/thorredhulk6.jpg

After this beating, Red Hulk is ok and went on to save Earth by destroying a comet.

https://p.dreamwidth.org/abe618c8b757/img.photobucket.com/albums/v216/Lamashtar/RulkHulk26-4.jpg

Wonderman took Rulk out in a couple of panels. Now let's use your logic here that you are trying to throw on us. Is Wonderman more powerful than Thor?


That scan came around the time that Rulk was still riding off of the Loeb force though. It's not at all within the time period that Wonder man beat him, or when he fought against Ikaris. You're trying be be sneaky, but I know the time periods of Rulk's decline. He had not yet begun his descent into mediocrity at that point in time Carver.

Thor pretty much one shotted Worthy Thing, and the Thing nearly killed Rulk. Let's not get away from the point that pissed me off in the first place. You said that Namor was nothing to Ikaris, so unless Ikaris got a major spike power, I don't recall him rivaling Thanos in power. Maybe I should have just asked. If Namor punched Ikaris in his face, would he no sell the punch? Yes or No will suffice. If not then Namor is more than just nothing to Ikaris.

We can also go the comparative route on in a slightly different direction. Thor vs Pagan. I remember you saying that Pagan wasn't a mega brick, but if that was the case, why wasn't Thor able to put him down? I'm not saying that Pagan beats Thor, I'm just saying that i never saw Thor with the hammer beat Pagan. Blue Marvel beat Pagan though. So if Thor was unable to beat Pagan, how in the world is Namor going to give Blue Marvel the fight of his life?

Let's talk about lifting. How many Hydrobase's do you think would fit in a state? Blue marvel was flying around with a state sized comet, and he was doing it with ease. So we know that a state sized object isn't anywhere close to is max strength if he was carrying it around with ease right? If we look at it under that light, Blue Marvel may be stronger than the Savage Hulk was during the first Secret Wars when he was only able to brace that mountain. But let's not get away from the subject. How is Namor nothing to Ikaris? Please explain what you meant by that, because you may not have used your words properly.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Trust me I don't believe he did fight Thor. I downloaded every comic Ikaris ever appeared in and he never fought Thor. Spoke to him a few times yeah, but never did they fight.

Again I didn't state anything out of the ordinary. It did have something to say that Namor was Ikaris's better. The respect thread has it there for you to see. I can't really explain it any better.

The battle in question.



You're talking to me about how Carver phrased it not me. I didn't say he was nothing to Namor. I expect Carver meant he was more powerful than Namor (which he is as it is stated) rather than it being like either me or you facing off an ant.

Well that is what got me on Carver's case in the first place. You should have really read what i was saying to him, instead of jumping in. I may have been wrong about Thor vs Ikaris, I really thought that they had a brief scuffle back in the day, and Thor was able to pretty much over power him on every level. Matter of fact, the more I think about it, the more that I am certain that they did have a brief scuffle. I'll have to ask Rage if he recalls a time, or the time that I am referring to. Carver's whole thing seemed to me to be him defending a gamma mutate once again. Then he goes on to state that Namor was nothing to Ikaris based on one showing from the perspective of one idiot writer. Again if Namor is nothing to Ikaris, he would be greater than Thanos. If this is what you think, or anyone thinks let's hear it. Carver already dug that hole for himself, and is currently in the process of trying to move the goal posts. Would you like to join him on that field?

it's funny. i'd thought thor and ikaris had squared off as well, but i couldn't find any battles when i went back to look...weird.

Can someone post the wonder man vs Rulk scans?

Originally posted by leonidas
it's funny. i'd thought thor and ikaris had squared off as well, but i couldn't find any battles when i went back to look...weird.
I think people are confusing the Thor/Forgotten One fight which had Ikaris doing stuff in the background.

Originally posted by Supermex
Can someone post the wonder man vs Rulk scans?
Nothing to see really, Rulk punched Simon twice. Then Simon choked him out. The End.

Stupidly low showing for Rulk and incredibly high showing for Simon (who in a later showing was getting worked over by Venom).

Originally posted by Supermex
Can someone post the wonder man vs Rulk scans?

Here you go.

http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336963_1.jpg http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336964_2.jpg http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336966_3.jpg http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336967_4.jpg

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Here you go.

http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336963_1.jpg http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336964_2.jpg http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336966_3.jpg http://s5d2.turboimagehost.com/t/23336967_4.jpg



Thank you, Angry


Damn WM man-Handled Rulk big time!

@Stoic...

You're not making sense. It's the same Rulk that fought Wonderman. The time period doesn't matter...at all. Sounds like excuses to me. How about this, Rulk withstood an attack from the Phoenix Force...

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/13204090/20.jpg.html

How do we know he was ok?

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/13461283/Avengers_VS-Zone-007.jpg.html

That wasn't the only hit he endured either. He was hit twice during this scene by Phoenix empowered Emma. Now again, does this make Wonderman>>>>The Phoenix Force?

Your logic man.

Originally posted by leonidas
it's funny. i'd thought thor and ikaris had squared off as well, but i couldn't find any battles when i went back to look...weird.

Yes that's what I was saying. I checked as well, but found nothing.

Originally posted by zopzop
I think people are confusing the Thor/Forgotten One fight which had Ikaris doing stuff in the background.

You and Scott may be right, I just could have sworn that they had a small scuffle. I also think that it may have been part of the story that Thor fought the Forgotten One in. It was so long ago.

Originally posted by carver9
@Stoic...

You're not making sense. It's the same Rulk that fought Wonderman. The time period doesn't matter...at all. Sounds like excuses to me. How about this, Rulk withstood an attack from the Phoenix Force...

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/13204090/20.jpg.html

How do we know he was ok?

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/13461283/Avengers_VS-Zone-007.jpg.html

That wasn't the only hit he endured either. He was hit twice during this scene by Phoenix empowered Emma. Now again, does this make Wonderman>>>>The Phoenix Force?

Your logic man.

Yes it does because Marvel only officially nerfed Rulk after the Omegex battle. This happened well before his battle with both Ikaris, and Simon. Maybe that was something that you forgot about? However it still does not make Namor nothing to Ikaris. Ikaris would have to be operating at above trans level to make Namor insignificant. I don't fully blame you because there are writers that refuse to adhere to continuity, and I never read anything about Ikaris undergoing a sharp power spike. I know that there was hyped up forethought that went into the battle that they had in the Invaders, but i would hardly call that a one on one battle, nor were the other Invaders remotely as powerful as Ike and Namor.

My logic. Rulk was pretty much turned into the whipping boy. i'm not the only person that said this. Ths is also not about Rulk, but more about your statement about namor vs Ikaris, and Namor being nothing to him. Let's keep on track, and stop with the deceptions. No one is stupid Carver.

You are the one that used Rulk as an example. Also, to anyone that thinks Rulk sucked at one point, what are they basing this off of?

Namor couldn't scratch Ikaris...a holding back Ikaris. That speaks volumes. And he was teamed with peeps and they still couldn't slow him down.

Let's see where Rulk fits into all of this. He fought Ikaris, and looked to be dominant to me at the end of their exchange. It looked like he could have pounded Ike's head in at the end when he said eat magma.

What are people basing their poor opinion of Rulk on? Well let's see; He goes from tea-bagging Uatu, beating Thor to the point that he could have killed him at the end of their battle, beating the Hulk up on a regular basis, dominating half of the most popular females in Marvel combined, to being beaten up by Thor, embarrassed by Wonder Man, nearly killed by Worthy Thing (who in turn was one shot by Thor). Should I continue? If not why ask?

You're doing it again. You're acting doltish, and expecting other people not to notice the agenda that you're trying to set up. Who on the Invaders were actually even able to compete power-wise with either Namor or Ikaris. They were non factors. How is it that i have to even explain that to you? Thanos was busted open by Namor, and you're telling me that if Namor fought Ikaris that he wouldn't even be able to scratch him? You're basing this off of one showing? Namor has showings against guys that would beat the mess out of Ikaris... The Mess!

Ikaris has absolutely zero showings of taking on a team of guys like Sentry, Wonder Man, Ms. Marvel, and Iron man, but suddenly he is going to be a challenge to a guy that does? Blue Marvel would beat the shit out of Ikaris based on his average. but we should go by the one showing of Ikaris right?

Lol @ me basing something off of one showing. Really? Did you really just say that.

Mjlonir plunged through Worthy Thing and it was a sucker shot. Let's not pretend like Thing was slaughtered in a straight up fight. The only thing you really got is Wonderman and that's one of Rulk lowest showings.

Lol...Namor and Ikaris already fought and Namor couldn't even scratch his skin. Don't take that up with me, speak to Marvel. It happened...let's move on.

Even Iron Man has defeated Monica twice by absorbing her into his armor, twice.

Quasar would stomp her.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
@basilisk:
Only version of Animal Man/Vixen that can have a go are pre-DCnU, when he was channeling Sun-Eaters and she was copying powers and skills from anyone and everyone - and stacking them. Interesting. Those versions sound like they could actually win.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Even Iron Man has defeated Monica twice by absorbing her into his armor, twice.

Quasar would stomp her. Agreed. The Q-bands are just on another level.

they are, and they would be a big problem, no doubt. but monica had a significant power up just before sw, so i'm not sure it would as easy as it may have been at one time....

Originally posted by basilisk
Interesting. Those versions sound like they could actually win.

Agreed. The Q-bands are just on another level.

Animal Man:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/134509/2865159-animal_man_sun_eater.jpg


Vixen:
http://i28.tinypic.com/w8omu0.jpg
http://i26.tinypic.com/2aifpc8.jpg

And stacking:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11112/111122629/3597763-9575142933-21454.jpg

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Animal Man:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/134509/2865159-animal_man_sun_eater.jpg


Vixen:
http://i28.tinypic.com/w8omu0.jpg
http://i26.tinypic.com/2aifpc8.jpg

And stacking:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11112/111122629/3597763-9575142933-21454.jpg Ah, I remember that JLA storyline now. The Animal Man was interesting too, I haven't seen a lot of him. Yeah, that pairing could be dangerous even to BM and Monica.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Even Iron Man has defeated Monica twice by absorbing her into his armor, twice.

Quasar would stomp her.

Not 100% true

Actually, she overloaded his armor the first time they met. IIRC, the second time he was only able to hold her for a couple of seconds before he had to expelle her energy. The last time in Mighty Avengers, he needed Wanda to help him contain her new powered up energy form. When she finally overcame his suit he lied and said he was mind controlled... Lol

Originally posted by HandOfFate
Not 100% true

Actually, she overloaded his armor the first time they met. IIRC, the second time he was only able to hold her for a couple of seconds before he had to expelle her energy. The last time in Mighty Avengers, he needed Wanda to help him contain her new powered up energy form. When she finally overcame his suit he lied and said he was mind controlled... Lol

Abhi likes to mislead people.

Originally posted by Stoic
Abhi likes to mislead people.
Really?

Look's like Abhi was telling the truth on at least this match :
http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2015/05/09/the-wrong-side-captain-marvel-monica-rambeau-vs-iron-man/2/
http://s7.postimg.org/uqenn9353/captainmarvelironman1.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/6b6fm7487/captainmarvelironman2_620x924.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/r9clka42v/captainmarvelironman3.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/613iglezr/captainmarvelironman4.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/q9qw2beav/captainmarvelironman5.jpg

Not the only time Ironman absorbed her either. He did it again not too long ago.

Originally posted by zopzop
Really?

Look's like Abhi was telling the truth on at least this match :
http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2015/05/09/the-wrong-side-captain-marvel-monica-rambeau-vs-iron-man/2/
http://s7.postimg.org/uqenn9353/captainmarvelironman1.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/6b6fm7487/captainmarvelironman2_620x924.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/r9clka42v/captainmarvelironman3.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/613iglezr/captainmarvelironman4.jpg http://s7.postimg.org/q9qw2beav/captainmarvelironman5.jpg


Would you call that showing PIS? What I mean is this; Monica sat there talking to Tony the entire time allowing plat to give him the win. What would have happened if she wasn't talking to him, and operating at light speed constantly bombarding him? What I meant by misleading, is that his statement made it seem as if there was no contest at all, when there was. Not to mention that she pretty much gave him the win on a silver platter. She has also had an upgrade since those days. We also recently saw what a character that operate at light speed could do to Tony. He wasn't even capable of reacting, and had his armor ripped off of him in moments. PIS happens a lot in comics.

Originally posted by carver9
Not the only time Ironman absorbed her either. He did it again not too long ago.

With Wanda's help.
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/908/YZTUxU.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/673/slvMVj.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/537/TrrbF5.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/540/HA8qmB.jpg

@Hand...

Wrong scene buddy...

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111118857/4327594-7571628096-Comic.jpg

Originally posted by Stoic
Would you call that showing PIS? What I mean is this; Monica sat there talking to Tony the entire time allowing plat to give him the win. What would have happened if she wasn't talking to him, and operating at light speed constantly bombarding him? What I meant by misleading, is that his statement made it seem as if there was no contest at all, when there was. Not to mention that she pretty much gave him the win on a silver platter. She has also had an upgrade since those days. We also recently saw what a character that operate at light speed could do to Tony. He wasn't even capable of reacting, and had his armor ripped off of him in moments. PIS happens a lot in comics.
That's the thing though, the Quantum Bands >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tony in terms of energy control.

And both Tony and Monica have had upgrades since that fight but the Q-bands are beyond either of them in terms of energy manip.

Monica about to mess up Ultraverse Earth.

https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/911/YBl1xc.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/633/yb6TQQ.jpg
https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/320xq90/r/673/3s3B5c.jpg

Originally posted by HandOfFate
Not 100% true

Actually, she overloaded his armor the first time they met. IIRC, the second time he was only able to hold her for a couple of seconds before he had to expelle her energy. The last time in Mighty Avengers, he needed Wanda to help him contain her new powered up energy form. When she finally overcame his suit he lied and said he was mind controlled... Lol
It's like comic characters are inconsistent!

What a novel concept, right?

Lol....

I actually would give Monica and BM more win if this was a morals off debate.

Only Quasar auto shields and maybe Superman could withstand a 30 megaton explosion inside their heads.

Originally posted by HandOfFate
Lol....

I actually would give Monica and BM more win if this was a morals off debate.

Only Quasar auto shields and maybe Superman could withstand a 30 megaton explosion inside their heads.
Only 30 megtons? Quasar pumped out a 100 megaton blast vs Thanos.
http://s28.postimg.org/mxehddokp/117qjyb.jpg

He actually destroyed IG Thanos head there.

It's a stupidly high end feat for Quasar.

Originally posted by carver9
@Hand...

Wrong scene buddy...

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111118857/4327594-7571628096-Comic.jpg

I was meaning to ask where is this from? I have a lot of Monica's appearance in the 616 and I have never seen this encounter.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He actually destroyed IG Thanos head there.

It's a stupidly high end feat for Quasar.

I would consider both kill moves. Monica could easily enter someone's head and explode with the force of a nuclear bomb.

Originally posted by zopzop
That's the thing though, the Quantum Bands >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tony in terms of energy control.

And both Tony and Monica have had upgrades since that fight but the Q-bands are beyond either of them in terms of energy manip. And just straight manipulation of her energy isn't the only option. When a Watcher converted into full energy form, Quasar was able to lock on, analyze the energy, and dump him back into corporeal form. Monica is no Watcher.

Also replicating the relatively simple trap used by the Maker to neutralize her isn't out of his powerset.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He actually destroyed IG Thanos head there.

It's a stupidly high end feat for Quasar. I remember reading that the first time and laughing at that scene. It was a fun issue.

Originally posted by abhilegend
He actually destroyed IG Thanos head there.

It's a stupidly high end feat for Quasar.
Believe it or not, that wasn't even Quasar's highest feat in that issue. Remember this?
http://s2.postimg.org/l01tjf7at/3826032_5.jpg
Quasar blocks/absorbs an IG blast from Thanos and uses it's power to create an energy construct to attack Thanos with.

And people still think Monica lasts more than a few seconds against him?