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CANON FEATS ONLY for Force-sensitives and Grievous. All ships and turrets are considered to be manned and operational without including the ground force soldiers as operators.

The Galactic Empire has destroyed the Rebellion, taken over Hoth and has established full dominance over the entire planet. However, the Empire is now met with a new Rebellion consisting of the Separatists and the Shadow Collective, led by Count Dooku and Darth Maul, respectively. Dooku and Maul have agreed to work together to annihilate Imperial Forces on Hoth and claim the planet for themselves - so during a visit to Hoth by the Emperor and his enforcer Darth Vader to oversee Imperialization of Hoth, Dooku and Maul unleash their fleets and arrive on Hoth. Thanks to the Shield Generator, orbital bombardment is not an option, so they deploy their ground forces in an attempt to destroy the Shield Generator and storm the Imperial Base, killing everybody affiliated with the Imperials. Destruction of the Shield Generator means the planetary shield is disabled, allowing the Shadow Collective/Separatists to unleash orbital bombardment on the Imperial Base.

The Galactic Empire team consists of:

1. Emperor Palpatine
2. Darth Vader
3. 10 All-Terrain-Armored Transports (AT-AT)
4. 30 All-Terrain-Scout-Transports (AT-ST)
5. 50, 000 Stormtroopers (Snowtroopers)
6. All Defense Turrets on Hoth (50)
7. 2 Imperial II-class Star Destroyers (the Avenger and the Stalker)
8. 1 Super Star Destroyer (the Executor)
9. 100 TIE Fighters
10. 70 TIE Interceptors
11. 50 TIE Bombers
12. 30 TIE Defenders

The Separatist Team consists of:

1. Count Dooku
2. General Grievous
3. Asajj Ventress
4. 20 Hailfire-class Droid Tanks
5. 10 OG-9 Homing Spider Droids (Spider Walkers)
6. 20, 000 Super Battle Droids
7. 30, 000 B1 Battle Droids
8. 50 Droidekas
9. 1 Subjugator-class Heavy Cruiser (the Malevolence)
10. 1 Providece-class Carrier/Destroyer (the Invisible Hand)
11. 150 Vulture Droids
12. 50 Droid Tri-Fighters
13. 20 HMP Droid Gunships
14. 30 Droid Bombers

The Shadow Collective Team consists of:

1. Darth Maul
2. Savage Opress
3. Pre Vizla/Ziton Moj/Lom Pyke
4. 300 Death Watch Mandalorians
5. 500 Black Sun Thugs
6. 70 Black Sun Sawbones
7. 50 Black Sun Loader Droids
8. 800 Pyke Syndicate Thugs

The objectives for the following teams are as follows.

For the Galactic Empire:
1. To destroy the combined force of Separatists/Shadow Collective.
2. To prevent the destruction of the Imperial Base at all costs.
3. To prevent the destruction of the Shield Generator.

For the Separatists/Shadow Collective:
1. To eliminate all Imperials.
2. To destroy the Imperial Base at all costs.
3. To destroy the Shield Generator to allow orbital bombardment.

Which team will succeed and why?

Team 2 is gonna have a severe problem with the terrain as I'm pretty sure they aren't equipped for the cold apart from the Collective Mandos. The droids are gonna be having problems with the cold, especially the vehicles, so this might wreck much of the force before they even get in range of the base.

That being said, the GE also have a few other advantages at their disposal.

1. Terrain as I said, but given that they are far better trained and equipped than the Rebellion, ontop of them being in a defensible position gives them a pretty hefty chance to repel the attacking force and destroy them.

2. Knowledge, the Seps wouldn't be anything new to the GE, Stormtroopers alone in training face off against the much more powerful and deadlier B3 Ultra which has given the likes of Windu and Fisto trouble. Given at the academy they also go over military history, they would also know of the vehicles and be able to exploit the weaknesses of the rest that haven't broken down or destroyed by the terrain. That and Vader/Palps would know too.

3. Open field and Firepower, if you notice in the Battle of Hoth, before the Empire was within range of the generator, they first went through a large open field. Compared to the Rebels, the GE have another big advantage in firepower, not only do they have the defense turrets which can wipe out a significantly large portion of Team 2's troops.

Ontop of the AT-AT which could pretty much one shot anything on Team 2, aswell as destroy a large majority of troops, it's gonna be a slaughter there.

The only threats as I see that are on Team 2 are

- Force Users/GG obviously

- DW Mandos

The vehicles and droidekas CAN be an issue, but honestly I don't see that much if they go through the harsh terrain of Hoth which could negate much of it. Then they would have to overrun and very defensible position by a highly trained force which has a large amount of firepower from said position.

One thing Sun, is Veers in this match considering he was leading the AT-AT force on Hoth?

@Zenwolf - Yeah, the respective commanders of the ships/tanks will be involved, so General Veers is being considered.

The droids are upgraded with cold-resistant plating before the battle. Vehicles have all specially designed to last in the cold weather.

Also, you didn't really consider the space-related aspects of the fight, but a fair analysis nonetheless.

Eh well I'm more of a ground person. But I guess I can do space too if wanted.

That said alright I guess, though it's kinda lame the terrain isn't much a factor as far as conditions of what it would have. But fair enough I suppose. Though some of the vehicles and droids could fall to avalanches and the Wampas too.

Alright with Veers in play then, that gives a big boon to the GE forces. With him commanding the AT-ATs and other forces, he could work well in this considering he's noted

1. As the best cunning and ruthless efficiency ground commander in the entire Imperial Army. Having also remarkable initiative and intellect

2. Has been on several missions that were deemed as suicidal and coming out ontop each and every time.

3. There's also the point that Veers chose only the best Imperial Army pilots to man his AT-AT force, being noted as a flawless walker trained group.

Not saying this puts him over Vader or Grevious, but it's a hefty advantage considering he's working with his Hoth force and could utilize it to its full effectiveness.

So I feel all in all with the defensible terrain, training and firepower the GE have along with their commanders and own Force Users, they can win this.

The defending position + firepower the GE is gonna pour on are probably the two biggest advantages as I see it.

Alright. Good points. I will mention that the Empire is more versatile in space (with specialized ships), but the droids and Shadow Collective should be more versatile on the ground in terms of their array of units (healers, Mandalorians, droids with deflector shields, ships like Vulture Droids and the HMP Gunships being able to participate in the land battles as well as in space, etc). Whether or not that can circumvent the Empire's greater raw firepower is up to you to decide, though.

And again, just knocking out the Shield Generator is basically a win for the Separatists because their fleet can wreck the Imperial base from above unless the fleet has already been severely crippled. Still, I think it's arguable whether or not the Imperial fleet can hold off or cripple the Separatist fleet.

I didn't want to inherently disadvantage the droids with the environment, so I added the anti-cold armor.

The TIE fighters and Bombers can also be used for the ground yes? Otherwise I don't see much a versatility they have apart from the gunships but those could be shot down by the AT-ATs. The DW would have versatility yes, but nothing too huge I feel to swing things in their favor, especially since it's only 300 of them.

So the Collective does have versatility i'll admit that, but I don't think it's enough to counter what the GE has. The defense location is a pretty big advantage for them.

They could in theory but I don't recall them really doing so - or at least not as often as the HMP Droid Gunships and the Vulture Droids.

How durable are the Gunships?

Hmm... If I added those flying battle droids with the blast-resistant shields, would this fight be closer? Say, if I added 5000 of them.

They have been, don't see why they wouldn't be.

I'm not recalling on the Gunships, I think they were taken out by Wookiees though with their bombs during the Battle of Kashyyyk though.

The battle is fine as is imo, was just merely going over my opinions on the matter. Plus I'm not really in the mood for debating anyhow, was just throwing in my 2 cents.

@ Zenwolf



Originally posted by Zenwolf

The only threats as I see that are on Team 2 are

- Force Users/GG obviously

Not much of a threat, really.

Its basically Palpatine & Vader vs Savage, Maul, Ventress, GG, Dooku

Team 2 has no advantage. Not to mention Palpatine's superior intelligence for the entirety of the battle + his other abilities that can boost the army.

Originally posted by Sinious
@ Zenwolf





Not much of a threat, really.

Its basically Palpatine & Vader vs Savage, Maul, Ventress, GG, Dooku

Team 2 has no advantage. Not to mention Palpatine's superior intelligence for the entirety of the battle + his other abilities that can boost the army.

Well I was meaning by comparison of the other forces on Team 2. As a whole, they aren't spectacular but still.