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Hey I'm all for not having to pay interest on loans..as long as it is not just Muslims who can get it.

Surely this law would never ever actually get passed?

Originally posted by Surtur
Hey I'm all for not having to pay interest on loans..as long as it is not just Muslims who can get it.

Same here, I have a mortgage as well, but now we are giving special treatment to Sharia Law? So instead of white privilege, its now turning to Muslim privilege.

I don't think this has any feasible chance of becoming a law. It would be really hard to sell to the people that now you can get out of paying interest, etc. due to religion.

Originally posted by Surtur
I don't think this has any feasible chance of becoming a law. It would be really hard to sell to the people that now you can get out of paying interest, etc. due to religion.

The fact that its even being talked about is sicking.

We have Islamic banks in the UK. They serve non Islamic customers. They label themselves as 'sharia compliant'.

Your issue is that you see the word 'sharia' and instantly equate it with oppression and terrorism.
http://www.theguardian.com/money/2013/oct/29/islamic-finance-sharia-compliant-money-interest

Oh please, this is silly, preferential treatment for home loans now?

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Oh please, this is silly, preferential treatment for home loans now?

It's not preferential treatment. The bank still makes profit equivalent to interest. Just not from interest. Read the link.

An example of how it differs.

A normal bank would lend you the money to buy a house and you would pay the bank back over the agreed period with interest.

An Islamic bank would buy the house and sell it to you for an agreed amount above the market value using agreed instalments over an agreed period.

To get non Islamic business they'd have to remain competitive so their agreed mark up would have to be based on equivalent interest rate mortgages. They take risk on both the house value side as they could agree to sell you the house at a lower price than what the house would be worth at the end of the payment schedule and the buyer takes a risk on paying more than if there was a interest rate drop on a variable rate mortgage . Given that interest rates can't really get much lower than they currently are and house prices tend to always trend up in the short to medium term excluding localised issues then it seems pretty good from a consumer POV

Originally posted by jaden101
An example of how it differs.

A normal bank would lend you the money to buy a house and you would pay the bank back over the agreed period with interest.

An Islamic bank would buy the house and sell it to you for an agreed amount above the market value using agreed instalments over an agreed period.

To get non Islamic business they'd have to remain competitive so their agreed mark up would have to be based on equivalent interest rate mortgages. They take risk on both the house value side as they could agree to sell you the house at a lower price than what the house would be worth at the end of the payment schedule and the buyer takes a risk on paying more than if there was a interest rate drop on a variable rate mortgage . Given that interest rates can't really get much lower than they currently are and house prices tend to always trend up in the short to medium term excluding localised issues then it seems pretty good from a consumer POV

"Historically, Christian law also regarded charging any interest for loans as sinful. Making unethical monetary loans that unfairly enrich the lender is called usury, but obviously, that practice has long since been discarded in nations where Christians are the majority."

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
"Historically, Christian law also regarded charging any interest for loans as sinful. Making unethical monetary loans that unfairly enrich the lender is called usury, but obviously, that practice has long since been discarded in nations where Christians are the majority."

Well done on putting something entirely unrelated.

Originally posted by jaden101
Well done on putting something entirely unrelated.

It was in OP article.

Christians had to abandon their principles in their own country, but now exceptions are to be made for Muslims?

The Amish get certain legal accommodations. Catholics get certain legal accommodations. Give me a good reason why doing the same for Muslims will ruin the country.

Originally posted by Shinobi Popcorn
The Amish get certain legal accommodations. Catholics get certain legal accommodations. Give me a good reason why doing the same for Muslims will ruin the country.

Amish are constantly harassed by the IRS and they don't get Social Security, so what the hell are you talking about?

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
It was in OP article.

Christians had to abandon their principles in their own country, but now exceptions are to be made for Muslims?

1. If you've got a problem with christians abandoning their principles at the behest of greedy banks then take it up with those banks. Don't demand that everyone else abandon their principles just cos your country/religion did.

2. As already stated, Islamic banks operating in non Islamic countries still serve non Islamic customers.

3. Islamic banks still make a profit equivalent to charging interest on a loan of money. They simply do it by one of a few different mechanisms.

Amish don't pay social security because they don't believe in insurance. So they don't pay and in return don't receive. They don't have to educate children past middle school. They use public roads without paying vehicle taxes.

Catholics object to women controlling their own health, so they get to pick and choose health insurance.

I don't see any problem with letting people pay a higher principle for 0%. They do that every day at the Mitsubishi place behind my work.

Originally posted by jaden101
1. If you've got a problem with christians abandoning their principles at the behest of greedy banks then take it up with those banks. Don't demand that everyone else abandon their principles just cos your country/religion did.

2. As already stated, Islamic banks operating in non Islamic countries still serve non Islamic customers.

3. Islamic banks still make a profit equivalent to charging interest on a loan of money. They simply do it by one of a few different mechanisms.


I would if I didn't have to worry about being foreclosed on and killed off.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
I would if I didn't have to worry about being foreclosed on and killed off.

Better move your mortgage to an Islamic bank then. 😂

This is simple hysteria. Nowhere is there talk of making some special Muslim-only law or offer. Instead the idea is to look for, promote and create packages that those bound by such laws would be able to use. There'd be nothing to stop anyone else using the same service- but I imagine others would not want to because I doubt they would be as good value as a simple mortgage.

Note how one option being considered is tying loans to an investment in a physical property and the payment coming out the profits of the property rather than interest. Anyone can do that- it just happens to be ok under Sharia as well.

Incidentally, Christians did not have to do anything, nor was any principle of value abandoned- Christian civilisation realised that usury laws were stupid.

Christians abandoned not eating shellfish even though their bible tells them they can't, and now there are Kosher supermarkets in the US that don't even sell shellfish...this is outrageous...

Originally posted by Ushgarak
This is simple hysteria. Nowhere is there talk of making some special Muslim-only law or offer. Instead the idea is to look for, promote and create packages that those bound by such laws would be able to use. There'd be nothing to stop anyone else using the same service- but I imagine others would not want to because I doubt they would be as good value as a simple mortgage.

Note how one option being considered is tying loans to an investment in a physical property and the payment coming out the profits of the property rather than interest. Anyone can do that- it just happens to be ok under Sharia as well.

Right.

Value-wise, I imagine that the way 'interest' is handled is calculating what the interest is likely to be, probably with some mild rounding up, and then charging a fee of that much.

That's how banks in strongly Muslim countries do it. It's less precise and thus, slightly less efficient than just doing interest directly, but it still functions.





Yea, our ancient religious forebearers were, it turns out, crappy economists.

Originally posted by Ushgarak
This is simple hysteria. Nowhere is there talk of making some special Muslim-only law or offer. Instead the idea is to look for, promote and create packages that those bound by such laws would be able to use. There'd be nothing to stop anyone else using the same service- but I imagine others would not want to because I doubt they would be as good value as a simple mortgage.

Note how one option being considered is tying loans to an investment in a physical property and the payment coming out the profits of the property rather than interest. Anyone can do that- it just happens to be ok under Sharia as well.

Incidentally, Christians did not have to do anything, nor was any principle of value abandoned- Christian civilisation realised that usury laws were stupid.

I disagree

keep panicking over all these deliberately misleading headlines from obviously biased sources, and you're going to end up giving yourself an aneurism.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
I disagree

It's not a matter of opinion.

Hey I have no problem with it as long as technically anyone can do it. Whether or not they'd want to is another story, but they should at least have the options.

We don't need anymore "one group can do something, but another can't" type of things in this country.

Originally posted by Surtur
Hey I have no problem with it as long as technically anyone can do it. Whether or not they'd want to is another story, but they should at least have the options.

We don't need anymore "one group can do something, but another can't" type of things in this country.

You mean like telling muslims they can't do banking in accordance with their beliefs but other people can?

This isn't preferential treatment for Muslims any more than offering a black bean burger at a fastfood place is preferential treatment of vegetarians.