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Fight.

Kamiccolo stomps.

What if Future Trunks aided Vegeta?

The Nameless Namekian still stomps, givin' them the "#18 Treatment", only this time even harder:

Nameless Namekian = #17 >= #18 > Ssj Vegeta > Ssj Trunks.

It probably goes something like this.

*Vegeta powers up*

"Foolish, Namekian! I am Vegeta! Crown prince of the Saiyan race and I will-

"Hellzone Grenade"

"Hellzone what?"

*vegeta blows up*

Yeah, Vegeta flat out said Piccolo is stronger then him, and #18 claimed he was fighting her brother on an even level.

The difference in how they were treated speaks volumes.. Vegeta with a mix of amusement and boredom, while Piccolo was considered a serious rival.

I'd say that SSJ Vegeta was probably a little bit stronger than #18 initially. The reason #18 ended up dominating is because she possesses infinite stamina, whereas Vegeta obviously does not:
http://i.imgur.com/lEuZuDu.png

However, #17 was confirmed to be > #18 in a few different sources. That said, I believe the difference between #17 and #18 was > the difference between SSJ Vegeta(fresh) and #18. This is important because Kamiccolo was equal to #17.
IOW: Kamiccolo=#17>SSJ Vegeta(fresh)~/>#18.

It's also worth noting that Kamiccolo must have better energy reserves/stamina than SSJ Vegeta did, as he was able to fight on par with #17 for an extended period of time without #17 ever gaining a clear advantage.

So yeah, even if their power was equal initially, Kamiccolo would still stomp, imo.

Also I recall 16 being outright concerned about Piccolo's strength while he was more or less indifferent to Vegeta.

Piccolo easily.

God dammit op, you're making me remember how much of a bad ass my boy Piccolo was in the early stage of DBZ.

Piccolo held his own with first form cell, Vegeta got demolished by 18 who wasn't fighting seriously.

What's sadder is that Kid Trunks did better vs her than that Vegeta did.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
Piccolo held his own with first form cell, Vegeta got demolished by 18 who wasn't fighting seriously.

What's sadder is that Kid Trunks did better vs her than that Vegeta did. That was before Imperfect Cell was at his peak, though. Once at his peak, Piccolo was absolutely nothing in comparison to him.

Sad? Not at all. Kid Trunks is ridiculously powerful... He'd stomp the n00b SSJ Vegeta who fought #18.

He's 8, and apparently doesn't train with Vegeta so that means he only trains a few times a week at best with Goten.

Vegeta trains his whole life including technology enhanced training and he was still weaker at that point. Hell even the Buu arc Vegeta was blowing himself for being stronger than child Gohan.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
He's 8, and apparently doesn't train with Vegeta so that means he only trains a few times a week at best with Goten.

Vegeta trains his whole life including technology enhanced training and he was still weaker at that point. Hell even the Buu arc Vegeta was blowing himself for being stronger than child Gohan.

I always saw Vegeta as a big baby that whine and moan when he doesn't get his way.

I think he would have been better off if He had stayed dead after Frieza killed him. To me, that final scene made you feel a little sorry for him. Not much, but a little.

I mean the guy was evil enough to kill Nappa off just like that when he knew there were only 3 full blooded Saiyans left plus a half breed.

Toriyama probably enjoyed drawing and writing for Vegeta since he is a perfect foil for Goku and he needed to phase Piccolo out from being the rival. After all, at the time Piccolo's death meant no Dragonballs. And unlike Piccolo, Toriyama probably didn't have any inclination to turn Vegeta into a good guy.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
He's 8, and apparently doesn't train with Vegeta so that means he only trains a few times a week at best with Goten. The boys are prodigies, though. They are already FPSSJ at such a young age, and regarded as the most powerful heroes on earth aside from Goku/Gohan/Vegeta.

That's pretty damn impressive.

Originally posted by Galan007
The boys are prodigies, though. They are already FPSSJ at such a young age, and regarded as the most powerful heroes on earth aside from Goku/Gohan/Vegeta.

That's pretty damn impressive.

That's his problem with them. They basically spit in the face of hard work by being so naturally powerful.

Well Vegeta should blame himself. It was clear that something about humans and saiyans making babies = ridiculously strong babies.

Yeah, 50% human 50% saiyan hybrids had that "perk".

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, 50% human 50% saiyan hybrids had that "perk".

Genetically Trunks and Future Trunks are the same. The child achieved SSJ significantly earlier with less training and less experience. Heck, if he IS a FPSSJ like Galan believes then he was stronger than Trunks when he killed Freeza.

Originally posted by AuraAngel
That's his problem with them. They basically spit in the face of hard work by being so naturally powerful.

One thing that bugs me is how as the sagas go on, becoming powerful gets increasingly easy.



And, well, Buu saga was just a decline in quality.

Cell would've been a good ending point.

I have a theory that because Saiyans are purely a warrior race, they pass their power-related traits onto their offspring when they breed.

IOW, if Vegeta/Goku were capable of reaching SSJ when Trunks/Goten were conceived, perhaps the ability to unlock the form became that much easier for the boys... Almost like it was part of their natural growth process. That would explain why Goten, who had extremely limited ki-control(he couldn't even fly, ffs), could still access SSJ. Additionally, both Goten and Trunks were already full-power Super Saiyans(as evident by their calm/playful/relaxed demeanors), despite having very little training with their SSJ states.

So yeah, things like that just make it seem like accessing SSJ had become part of their natural growth cycle--akin to puberty, except much earlier.

...There's also the fact that Saiyan/human breeding begets very powerful offspring(as noted by Vegeta)--so they'd already have one-up on purebred Saiyans.

Wonder how powerful Pan (Non GT, of course) and Bra would become then? Was it Bra who flew around the world at 4 or 5 years old?

Also, you'd think there'd be a cutoff point where the gains are diliuted.. Like, it woukd be odd if Gohan as a half Saiyan, has kids who are less then half Saiyan, who in turn have kids with even less Saiyan in then, and every generation is more and more powerful..

If it worked like that, a drop of Saiyan blood should make a warrior some thousands of times above Whis.

Yeah, Pan flew around the world at the age of 4.

Perhaps the remaining Saiyan genes become more and more potent as they become diluted by generational breeding--this way the 'warrior' aspect of the race still shines through no matter what..? /shrug

And I know it doesn't mean anything in regards to Z, but I always liked the '100 years later' sequence at the end of GT--the one that shows Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr. fighting at the 64th WMAT. Not only were they both able to become SSJ at will, but they both looked identical to Goku and Vegeta, respectively. Additionally, since Goku Jr. was stated to be the great-great grandson of Pan, it would make him 1/64 Saiyan... Yet he and Vegeta Jr.'s Saiyan heritage was still abundantly clear. Crazy.

That theory works for Goten but not Trunks. I highly doubt Vegeta achieved SSJ before conceiving Trunks and even if he could his son would logically be weaker than the one conceived by a FPSSJ.

Hard to say.

Trunks was only a few months old when the Cell/Android saga began--meaning that he would have been conceived ~1 year prior to the start of the saga. And since Vegeta was already accustomed to his SSJ state at the start of the arc, and had become substantially more powerful than Namek/Yardrat Goku(which means he trained a lot), an argument could be made that he may have discovered SSJ right before Trunks was conceived... Hell, perhaps unlocking SSJ is what got Vegeta excited enough to f*ck Bulma in the first place..?