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No range attacks or Mjlonir. No flying. This is a punch and kick fight. Straight up physical. The goal of this is for Thor to pull at least 2 wins against Superman. He doesn't have to pull a majority, just two wins is sufficient enough for this thread. Can he pull this off (made this so that we will not derail threads).

This is Superman before the reboot.

Do you think he could achieve this against New Superman as well?

Well, if someone like Aquaman, the King of Halibuts could one-shot Superdouche...

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Well, if someone like Aquaman, the King of Halibuts could one-shot Superdouche...
PR gonna rain on your parade soon.

What do you think Celey? Can Thor do it?

superman beats the living shit outta thor. not the new superman though. thor must be outta gat damn mind fighting superman without mjolnir

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
PR gonna rain on your parade soon.

True...

http://i.imgur.com/b0jk2S0.gif

Originally posted by carver9
What do you think Celey? Can Thor do it?
Yep.

Btw is this a slugfest? Kal is faster and Thor w/o Mjolnir is an even bigger disadvantage since it can negate some of the speed advantage.

Superman is stronger and will hit harder in a fist fight. And if speed is still on for him it'll cover the skill gap.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Yep.

Btw is this a slugfest? Kal is faster and Thor w/o Mjolnir is an even bigger disadvantage since it can negate some of the speed advantage.

Its a slug fest. Speed is equalized. Wouldn't be fair if it wasn't. It would just be Superman without flight vs Thor without anything.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Superman is stronger and will hit harder in a fist fight. And if speed is still on for him it'll cover the skill gap.

Speed is equalized.

Superman beats the shit out of Thor. And no, Thor doesn't gets even one win.

Originally posted by carver9
Speed is equalized.

Oh, okay it's closer then. He might pull off one or two if he uses his skill to its best. Seeing as how he'll likely go into "hulk mode" though, chances are slim.

Originally posted by carver9
Its a slug fest. Speed is equalized. Wouldn't be fair if it wasn't. It would just be Superman without flight vs Thor without anything.
Well in that case...
Probably split or edge to Supes.


Originally posted by abhilegend
Superman beats the shit out of Thor. And no, Thor doesn't gets even one win.
nope.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Well in that case...
Probably split or edge to Supes.



nope.
Heh, you just live in denial.

How is he getting a single win nevermind a split?

Which Herald has koed Superman in a fistfight?

Originally posted by Damborgson
Oh, okay it's closer then. He might pull off one or two if he uses his skill to its best. Seeing as how he'll likely go into "hulk mode" though, chances are slim.

I lost faith in you.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Heh, you just live in denial.

How is he getting a single win nevermind a split?

Which Herald has koed Superman in a fistfight?
No I ain't.

Er... By being nearly as strong, nearly as durable, but having a skill edge,

Why don't you go ahead and tell us?

Originally posted by ghostman
superman beats the living shit outta thor. not the new superman though. thor must be outta gat damn mind fighting superman without mjolnir



More fanboy vomit. Thor goes .500.

A low Herald named Doomsday did it once.

Ehem, the Annointed One.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
No I ain't.

Er... By being nearly as strong, nearly as durable, but having a skill edge,

Why don't you go ahead and tell us?
By nearly as strong? Not really.

By nearly as durable? Not really.

Skill edge? Nope.

Like I said Superman doesn't loses to heralds in h2h.

Thor doesn't gets a single win until you show a single ko of Superman from a Thor level being. It simply doesn't happens.

Even people stronger than Superman have trouble knocking him out.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
A low Herald named Doomsday did it once.
Doomsday got killed once Superman cut loose. And Doomsday is low Herald just like Kurse us mid Herald.

Aka not really.

http://i.imgur.com/cenrryD.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/SE804aj.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/coq33nu.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/gKAbttJ.jpg

mmm

And that was featless Glads from alternate timeline, right?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW


And that was featless Glads from alternate timeline, right?

Alternate, yes, featless, no. Him and Thor had to work together to stop a crashing plane.

He doesn't want to get down and dirty with Gaea's baby boy with Kal's measure.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW


And that was featless Glads from alternate timeline, right?
Yes, he said Thor was too strong for him afterwards for some reason.

I've seen below Herald level characters oneshot Thor twice in the same issue.
Originally posted by abhilegend
Watch kids, Thor demonstrating his dynamic strength.

Ultimus oneshots Thor.

http://imageshack.us/a/img832/6681/zdlo.th.jpg http://imageshack.us/a/img818/2892/jgac.th.jpg http://imageshack.us/a/img832/3335/2mqk.th.jpg


<Thor> "You knocked me out once, but now I have your measure!"


http://imageshack.us/a/img28/3158/ffnr.th.jpg http://imageshack.us/a/img594/8799/b8kr.th.jpg http://imageshack.us/a/img35/8858/hpj1.th.jpg http://imageshack.us/a/img11/9043/8li5.th.jpg

<Superma--err--Demon Druid> *knocks out Thor, again*

<Thor> :That's it, I'm going to pull out all the stop and fight you to a double KO with energy blasts and all that where Ultimus wakes up earlier"*

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/844/r61v.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/189/sxo0.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/834/73x9.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/853/7e4r.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/189/nxdn.jpg/

Whew.

Thor's other equal Hercules didn't fare any better. Who came to the rescue and taught how to get the job done?


http://i.imgur.com/VEvDsv3.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ZjI2KRN.jpg

Why? Our good ol' captain america, who else? Hell of a dynamic factor Thor, you're almost as strong as Cap.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
He doesn't want to get down and dirty with Gaea's baby boy with Kal's measure.

For the sake of curiosity even though a mod will eventually tell us to get back on topic(since JLA/AVENGERS being used is against the rules), what exactly do you think Thor would do? He boasted he "has his measure," and for the sake of the argument, let's assume it was fact instead of him being egotistical, but the fight was primarily hand-to-hand, and Thor lost. And he doesn't have Mjolnir here to try and compensate for the physical disadvantage.

How could anybody think Thor gets even one win here is baffling.

Thor is quite capable of winnng a normal fight, but not really a fistfight. He will lose to Superman the same way he loses to Hulk in those fights where he just punches and such. Thor isn't quite in their class on standard showings. Now, in a regular fight Thor can win for sure. But it'd be hard for him to win 2 straight up slugfests without Mjolnir.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Well, if someone like Aquaman, the King of Halibuts could one-shot Superdouche...

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
PR gonna rain on your parade soon.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
True...

http://i.imgur.com/b0jk2S0.gif

I LOLed.

With speed equalized then Thor's skill will help greatly in trying to overcome the strength deficit. Thor may get a win or so if he uses his best skill shown (no punch brawling crap he usually does) while Clark just using punch brawling, similar to how Cap, Bats, or BP can get wins over much stronger (lesser skilled) beings.

See that's the diff b/n you and me Abhi.. Sure you can go ahead and just focus on low showings.. Right on cue... Sigh...

Btw that alt Gladz was willing to kill while Thor was holding back(as we learned later on) and at the same time watching for the human's safety.

And to answer your question. Atlas phukked him up I guess mainly because he derives his strength from magic.

And I'm pretty sure Anointed One not only physically knocked him the phukk out, but also killed him in the process. Iirc....

That alternate Glads also woke up moments later from a blast that rivaled Odin in power. He was beastly.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
See that's the diff b/n you and me Abhi.. Sure you can go ahead and just focus on low showings.. Right on cue... Sigh...

Btw that alt Gladz was willing to kill while Thor was holding back(as we learned later on) and at the same time watching for the human's safety.

And to answer your question. Atlas phukked him up I guess mainly because he derives his strength from magic.

And I'm pretty sure Anointed One not only physically knocked him the phukk out, but also killed him in the process. Iirc....

I'm going to guess you didn't read THE COMING OF ATLAS and the New Krypton stuff it was a prelude to.

Originally posted by Delta1938
I'm going to guess you didn't read THE COMING OF ATLAS and the New Krypton stuff it was a prelude to.
Read Atlas.

Some new kryp.

Originally posted by abhilegend
By nearly as strong? Not really.

By nearly as durable? Not really.

Skill edge? Nope.

Like I said Superman doesn't loses to heralds in h2h.

Thor doesn't gets a single win until you show a single ko of Superman from a Thor level being. It simply doesn't happens.

Even people stronger than Superman have trouble knocking him out.

Agreed. Thor is nowhere as durable or strong as Superman.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Read Atlas.

Some new kryp.

If you only read some of the New Krypton stuff, you most likely didn't see them looking back at the Atlas thing. They were using those satellites for magick with different effects. I'm fairly certain Thor doesn't have a similar effect just being there.

Originally posted by Delta1938
If you only read some of the New Krypton stuff, you most likely didn't see them looking back at the Atlas thing. They were using those satellites for magick with different effects. I'm fairly certain Thor doesn't have a similar effect just being there.
Like the ones used on Kara and Krypto?

Originally posted by carver9
I lost faith in you.

Youre not giving me much man! He's too gimped 😂 let him wrap those hands in lightning and it's much better for him.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Like the ones used on Kara and Krypto?

Yeah, they explained things more later on, once about the satellites themselves, further down the source.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Youre not giving me much man! He's too gimped 😂 let him wrap those hands in lightning and it's much better for him.

This branched from an argument that was starting to derail the Superman vs Namor/Hercules topic(good move on carver's part making this, actually). About how Thor would do in just hand-to-hand against Superman. So considering why this started, no, it's not really gimping Thor.

Originally posted by Delta1938
Yeah, they explained things more later on, once about the satellites themselves, further down the source.



This branched from an argument that was starting to derail the Superman vs Namor/Hercules topic(good move on carver's part making this, actually). About how Thor would do in just hand-to-hand against Superman. So considering why this started, no, it's not really gimping Thor.
You'll have to refresh my memory. What about the New Krypton arc?

Originally posted by Delta1938
For the sake of curiosity even though a mod will eventually tell us to get back on topic(since JLA/AVENGERS being used is against the rules), what exactly do you think Thor would do? He boasted he "has his measure," and for the sake of the argument, let's assume it was fact instead of him being egotistical, but the fight was primarily hand-to-hand, and Thor lost. And he doesn't have Mjolnir here to try and compensate for the physical disadvantage.


By being unrelenting, focused and knocking him the **** out. And for you guy talking craziness, Thor has matched strength with both Thor and Hercules. His strength is not a question. And Superman hard durability isn't and advantage over Thors Teflon durability in this sort of fight.


Oh, and let's not forget how the louded detractor here, the Abster, was arguing vigorously that Thor was not amped in B and T. I see you Abby.

Supes smashes him.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
You'll have to refresh my memory. What about the New Krypton arc?

General Lane made a deal with the chick who was in charge of the realm that was the source of all magick.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
By being unrelenting, focused and knocking him the **** out. And for you guy talking craziness, Thor has matched strength with both Thor and Hercules. His strength is not a question. And Superman hard durability isn't and advantage over Thors Teflon durability in this sort of fight.


Oh, and let's not forget how the louded detractor here, the Abster, was arguing vigorously that Thor was not amped in B and T. I see you Abby.

So in other words, Thor is going to work really hard to get knocked the **** out again. Gotcha. Accept that Superman>>Thor.

Also, Thor has matched strength with both Hercules and THOR?

Originally posted by Juntai
Supes smashes him.

I give Thor a win or 2 because speed is equalized and Thor can use his skill to block or dodge and counter into some nasty combos. But Thor would have to fight at his best skill shown in comics and avoid being hit by Superman for the most part. If he fights like he mostly does (punch brawling) then he cant win any.
To win, Thor would probably have to hit Superman 7-10 times for every hit he receives from Superman. It's possible, just not likely.

Originally posted by h1a8
I give Thor a win or 2 because speed is equalized and Thor can use his skill to block or dodge and counter into some nasty combos. But Thor would have to fight at his best skill shown in comics and avoid being hit by Superman for the most part. If he fights like he mostly does (punch brawling) then he cant win any.
To win, Thor would probably have to hit Superman 7-10 times for every hit he receives from Superman. It's possible, just not likely.

Superman pressure points FTW!!!

Originally posted by Delta1938
General Lane made a deal with the chick who was in charge of the realm that was the source of all magick.



So in other words, Thor is going to work really hard to get knocked the **** out again. Gotcha. Accept that Superman>>Thor.

Also, Thor has matched strength with both Hercules and THOR?






Sorry, meant to type Hulk. And no, not in others words. Try to keep up or go home.

Supes knows how to treat blonde mistresses.

Originally posted by h1a8
I give Thor a win or 2 because speed is equalized and Thor can use his skill to block or dodge and counter into some nasty combos. But Thor would have to fight at his best skill shown in comics and avoid being hit by Superman for the most part. If he fights like he mostly does (punch brawling) then he cant win any.
To win, Thor would probably have to hit Superman 7-10 times for every hit he receives from Superman. It's possible, just not likely.


You are hopeless. Even when you try not to wank Superman, you end up wanking him harder. 7-10 blows to match 1? Not even your brethren believe that!

Originally posted by Adam Grimes
Supes knows how to treat blonde mistresses.

You love that little dark haired butch to death, don't you?

Originally posted by Delta1938

This branched from an argument that was starting to derail the Superman vs Namor/Hercules topic(good move on carver's part making this, actually). About how Thor would do in just hand-to-hand against Superman. So considering why this started, no, it's not really gimping Thor.

No it's gimping Thor alright. He loses a lot more of his ability to win from this match up than Superman does.

Originally posted by Damborgson
No it's gimping Thor alright. He loses a lot more of his ability to win from this match up than Superman does.



Ya think? Just play along.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
You love that little dark haired butch to death, don't you? I'm pretty sure you'd like to play the mistresses part, wouldn't you?

Originally posted by Adam Grimes
I'm pretty sure you'd like to play the mistresses part, wouldn't you?


No, that would be your natural dad jobbing to your stepdad.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
See that's the diff b/n you and me Abhi.. Sure you can go ahead and just focus on low showings.. Right on cue... Sigh...


Right.

What does that has to do with Gladiator knocking him out with two punches?

Both were due to magical weakness of Superman. And Anointed One didn't kill him. It was Gemnanae.

Not that any of that is relevant here.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Like the ones used on Kara and Krypto?

Yup.

Not that I have a dog in the fight, but...

http://i.imgur.com/aWtZIuT.jpg

http://imgur.com/a/9wOU7

Could go either way.

Supes will win a majority of them though.

Originally posted by deathlife
Could go either way.

Supes will win a majority of them though.
Not really. Thor isn't knocking out superman with punches.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Sorry, meant to type Hulk. And no, not in others words. Try to keep up or go home.

It doesn't matter if you typoed or wrote it correctly. Thor loses H2H against Supes. I predict you're going to troll instead of make arguments backed by evidence.

Originally posted by Damborgson
No it's gimping Thor alright. He loses a lot more of his ability to win from this match up than Superman does.

So, this started from arguments in a Superman vs Namor/Hercules topic about Superman in hand-to-hand against Hercules, which brought-up comparisons to Thor, which means we're comparing overall hand-to-hand capability(which includes strength and durability), yet, Thor is being badly gimped because we want to compare how they go in a H2H fight.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
No, that would be your natural dad jobbing to your stepdad. Scans?

Originally posted by Adam Grimes
Scans?

perfect comeback

Originally posted by abhilegend
Right.

What does that has to do with Gladiator knocking him out with two punches?

Both were due to magical weakness of Superman. And Anointed One didn't kill him. It was Gemnanae.

Not that any of that is relevant here.


Buuuuuttttt, you've argued in the past that he overcomes his so called magical weakness.

Originally posted by Rao Kal El
perfect comeback

Really? I guess that answers any linger questions about you. boxed2

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Buuuuuttttt, you've argued in the past that he overcomes his so called magical weakness.
Yes, he does. It's still a weakness for him.

Originally posted by Adam Grimes
Scans?

Here's a gif of their role play. Fair warning to everyone, it's brutal.

doctor

Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, he does. It's still a weakness for him.

So what's the point? If he overcomes it, then how can you use it as an excuse? Just say Atlas beat his ass.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
So what's the point? If he overcomes it, then how can you use it as an excuse? Just say Atlas beat his ass.

Unless you can prove that Thor emits a similar thing as was going on in that comic, this doesn't help your case. If you cannot prove that, it actually hurts your case as Atlas could not easily KO Superman despite that.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
So what's the point? If he overcomes it, then how can you use it as an excuse? Just say Atlas beat his ass.


Like Taurus oneshotting Thor, I presume?

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/11533051/09.jpg.html

No weakness exploited, just oneshotted.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Really? I guess that answers any linger questions about you. boxed2

Come on! It was good, don't enter into meltdown mode ove this silly thing dude.

Please.

Originally posted by abhilegend


Like Taurus oneshotting Thor, I presume?

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/11533051/09.jpg.html

No weakness exploited, just oneshotted.

That scan of Thor has nothing to do WHATSOEVER with the topic. The topic was Superman's supposed magical weakness and you vasillating back and forth on the merits of how magic affects superman. When Superman is significantly hurt by or loses to a magical being (or some cases, beings who aren't magical who you claim are like Triumph), you point to magic as the reason Superman lost. At the same time, you often claim that Superman can beat magical character A because he has been shown to overcome magical weakness. It's completely contradictory. Who are you to say which fights he wins and loses with magical characters? You aren't the writer.

Originally posted by Rao Kal El
Come on! It was good, don't enter into meltdown mode ove this silly thing dude.

Please.

Get out of the cheerleader zone and back to the friend zone.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
That scan of Thor has nothing to do WHATSOEVER with the topic. The topic was Superman's supposed magical weakness and you vasillating back and forth on the merits of how magic affects superman. When Superman is significantly hurt by or loses to a magical being (or some cases, beings who aren't magical who you claim are like Triumph), you point to magic as the reason Superman lost. At the same time, you often claim that Superman can beat magical character A because he has been shown to overcome magical weakness. It's completely contradictory. Who are you to say which fights he wins and loses with magical characters? You aren't the writer.
Did I? Where did I say that Superman overcomes magic everytime?

Post that and then talk. It's a weakness for a reason.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Get out of the cheerleader zone and back to the friend zone.

That's how meltdowns start

Unless someone arguing for Thor can prove that just being around Thor will have the effect people are trying to argue, this is getting off-topic. The fight with Atlas had Superman straight-up saying there was something wrong, and it wasn't Atlas himself. There's several more examples of Superman not being effected in that way against Wonder Woman, Etrigan, Captain Marvel, Black Adam(minimum two fights for each character mentioned) and other, less known examples. He doesn't get effected like that JUST because an opponent is mystical in nature.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Did I? Where did I say that Superman overcomes magic everytime?

Post that and then talk. It's a weakness for a reason.

You say it every time someone pits a character with magic based power against Superman. Don't play games.

Originally posted by Delta1938
Unless someone arguing for Thor can prove that just being around Thor will have the effect people are trying to argue, this is getting off-topic. The fight with Atlas had Superman straight-up saying there was something wrong, and it wasn't Atlas himself. There's several more examples of Superman not being effected in that way against Wonder Woman, Etrigan, Captain Marvel, Black Adam(minimum two fights for each character mentioned) and other, less known examples. He doesn't get effected like that JUST because an opponent is mystical in nature.

No one is arguing that Superman gets weakened by simply being around a magic based character (that is, beside Abby referencing Triumph), it's the attacks that matter. Nice straw man argument. And who gives a damn about some dubious comment made by Superman that wasn't born out in the showing? "Something was wrong?" Yeah, until further notice, he got his ass handed to him, plain and simple.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
No one is arguing that Superman gets weakened by simply being around a magic based character, it's the attacks that matter. Nice straw man argument. And who gives a damn about some dubious comment made by Superman that wasn't born out in the showing? "Something was wrong?" Yeah, until further notice, he got his ass handed to him, plain and simple.

Except, people are indeed arguing Atlas fighting Superman, and they don't know the context. I actually read everything there, unlike you. That was one of multiple reasons. It's not a strawman. You're simply ignorant, and trying to defend your ignorance.

So, unless anybody can prove that Thor would have a similar effect, it's worthless for the Thor side. Are you going to actually argue feats/showings for Thor, or resort to arguing examples you know nothing about?

I always looked at it like this, Superman tends to have an easier time overcoming damaging magic. By this I mean, like a fireball or a lightning bolt or anything, a magic missile. I think his resistance to these things is actually above a normal persons, he just isn't outright invulnerable to them. Case in point: he's taken repeated bolts of magical lightning in the past and not died. A normal human isn't going to really do the same. He's been hit by magical fire and commented about how he could feel the heat, but wasn't burned by it. He's also inhaled magical poison without dying. This is all pre Nu DC obviously, it could be different now.

More esoteric stuff, soul rips, transmutation, that is the type of magic he's going to have no real defense against at all.

Surtur, the topic is for Pre-FLASHPOINT Superman.

Okay so that is good, those feats should apply then. But yeah.. Etrigan created magical poison and Supes just slurped that shit up more or less.

EDIT: I will also point out he was able to resist mental abilities of a magical origin via his training from J'onn.

Also, this is just hand-to-hand. No weapons, flight, super speed, heat vision, ect.

Okay so since this is essentially coming down to strength, durability, and fighting skill..I have to go with Thor here. I think they are close enough in strength and durability that skill the key, and that should go to Thor.

Superman is not some unskilled fighter or anything like that, but I don't quite think he is as good as Thor though.

Originally posted by Delta1938
Except, people are indeed arguing Atlas fighting Superman, and they don't know the context. I actually read everything there, unlike you. That was one of multiple reasons. It's not a strawman. You're simply ignorant, and trying to defend your ignorance.

So, unless anybody can prove that Thor would have a similar effect, it's worthless for the Thor side. Are you going to actually argue feats/showings for Thor, or resort to arguing examples you know nothing about?

You read the issue and you still can't define what "Something is wrong means", correct? Thanks.

I am attacking his inconsistency in debating, you are just around to bear witness. When debating, you can't hope to establish a point when you contradict the point you are trying to make. That's exactly what he's doing. He says Superman is weak to magic during loses, just like he did with Triumph. The fact that he wasn't even magic based is secondary in this case. Yet he claims Superman won't be beaten because of his magical weakness because he will overcome it. Even a drooling idiot understands that something does not compute with those two diametrically opposed notions.

Originally posted by Surtur
Okay so since this is essentially coming down to strength, durability, and fighting skill..I have to go with Thor here. I think they are close enough in strength and durability that skill the key, and that should go to Thor.

Superman is not some unskilled fighter or anything like that, but I don't quite think he is as good as Thor though.

WrjwaqZfjIY



If Orion isn't beating Post-Mongul trained Superman hand-to-hand, I'm not seeing Thor do it.

Originally posted by Surtur
Okay so since this is essentially coming down to strength, durability, and fighting skill..I have to go with Thor here. I think they are close enough in strength and durability that skill the key, and that should go to Thor.

Superman is not some unskilled fighter or anything like that, but I don't quite think he is as good as Thor though.

Oh my gawd in heaven, the voice of reason!

Originally posted by Delta1938
WrjwaqZfjIY



If Orion isn't beating Post-Mongul trained Superman hand-to-hand, I'm not seeing Thor do it.


Superman fights the exacts same way before and after whenever training he's had, stupid. It simply does not show up on paper and you know it.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
You read the issue and you still can't define what "Something is wrong means", correct? Thanks.

I am attacking his inconsistency in debating, you are just around to bear witness. When debating, you can't hope to establish a point when you contradict the point you are trying to make. That's exactly what he's doing. He says Superman is weak to magic during loses, just like he did with Triumph. The fact that he wasn't even magic based is secondary in this case. Yet he claims Superman won't be beaten because of his magical weakness because he will overcome it. Even a drooling idiot understands that something does not compute with those two diametrically opposed notions.

I read the entire STORYLINE, not just the issue. Reading comprehension fail.

And I read what Abhi said. This is another reading comprehension fail for you, too. Or did you understand when he said to post when he said Superman always overcomes it, because your argument falls apart without it?

Originally posted by Delta1938

So, this started from arguments in a Superman vs Namor/Hercules topic about Superman in hand-to-hand against Hercules, which brought-up comparisons to Thor, which means we're comparing overall hand-to-hand capability(which includes strength and durability), yet, Thor is being badly gimped because we want to compare how they go in a H2H fight.

I get what you're saying, but when I say he's gimped it's because the stips for this fight take away from Thor vastly more than Superman. It's why i he's gimped, because he's fighting under conditions that are his to lose. /shrug.

So, you said Fist fight, then i'd say Supes wins because he one punch thor

Originally posted by Damborgson
I get what you're saying, but when I say he's gimped it's because the stips for this fight take away from Thor vastly more than Superman. It's why i he's gimped, because he's fighting under conditions that are his to lose. /shrug.

How? There's no advantages to either of them. It's fist vs fist...no speed advantage. Just two guys going at it. What should I have given Thor to make this fair?

I bash superman constantly but I am still objective
Superman will beat thor down in a straight up fight

Originally posted by Delta1938
I read the entire STORYLINE, not just the issue. Reading comprehension fail.

And I read what Abhi said. This is another reading comprehension fail for you, too. Or did you understand when he said to post when he said Superman always overcomes it, because your argument falls apart without it?

You can say it another 50 times if you wish, if you don't know what was wrong as Superman alluded to, it's not the least bit relevant to the discussion. What's comical is that are the one that's lagging behind intellectually. I understood his point well when I made my counter point, it's you that doesn't understand the counterpoint. As matter of fact, skip all this and go about your business since you weren't part of the discussion.

Originally posted by carver9
How? There's no advantages to either of them. It's fist vs fist...no speed advantage. Just two guys going at it. What should I have given Thor to make this fair?

Who said anything about fair? What I'm saying is, because of these stips, Thor loses a lot more than Superman does. The purpose of the thread, the results, they're not relevant. I'm saying that under these stips it's very hard for Thor to win, even 2/10. It's not a critique or a complaint, but an observation.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
Superman fights the exacts same way before and after whenever training he's had, stupid. It simply does not show up on paper and you know it.

Missed this. This is yet another example of your utter ignorance of Superman, and I predict that if you don't go into meltdown mode, you'll try to justify it with mental gymnastics.

The training I was referring to, while did include some hand-to-hand combat, wasn't strictly that. Superman's mind was actually reducing his powers, and Mongul was training him to overcome them. But, you, being a Superman hater who bandwagon rides and leeches off others, cheerleading their arguments and scans, wouldn't know bubkiss about this.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
You can say it another 50 times if you wish, if you don't know what was wrong as Superman alluded to, it's not the least bit relevant to the discussion. What's comical is that are the one that's lagging behind intellectually. I understood his point well when I made my counter point, it's you that doesn't understand the counterpoint. As matter of fact, skip all this and go about your business since you weren't part of the discussion.

Actually, I already covered it. My point about what Superman said was in reference to even from his words it showed there was something else in there. If you actually read the comic, you'd have known about what happened, and if you read the storyline you'd know the details. But again, a Superman hating bandwagon rider who, being a parasite, has to feed off what everybody else says instead of make his own arguments.

I already covered it in prior posts, and you missing it just proves me right about your reading incomprehension. Carry on, you debate stud you. Carry on.

Blue Area Melt MAY not be very sharp to understand those complex ideas, you know?

Originally posted by Rao Kal El
Blue Area Melt MAY not be very sharp to understand those complex ideas, you know?



If you mistake being wordy for being intelligent, well.....you probably don't understand the argument either. I love how each of you feel obligated to speak for Abby.

I don't give a damn about you, deltawing or the very fictional. Superman. No, I don't actually read his comics nor will I, nor am I obligated to, nor will I consider your opinion on the matter. Is not reading Superman looked down upon in Smalldickville? Well it's not in the real world. You and your partner can choose how to waste your own time, but unless the two of you can smash you worthless brains together and squeeze out an actual defense to my criticism of the techniques Abby employs, you won't be wasting any more of my time.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
If you mistake being wordy for being intelligent, well.....you probably don't understand the argument either. I love how each of you feel obligated to speak for Abby.

I don't give a damn about you, deltawing or the very fictional. Superman. No, I don't actually read his comics nor will I, nor am I obligated to, nor will I consider your opinion on the matter. Is not reading Superman looked down upon in Smalldickville? Well it's not in the real world. You and your partner can choose how to waste your own time, but unless the two of you can smash you worthless brains together and squeeze out an actual defense to my criticism of the techniques Abby employs, you won't be wasting any more of my time.

That seems like a meltdown

Anyhow, Thor doesn't get a win under this stips.

I will like to explain to you why, but... COMICS!

And you don't read them, so, no point on spoon feed you this one too.

It never cease to amaze me on how people constantly underestimate SM. SM has had yrs of training under Batman & WW at HTH, plus training under KK, plus what he learned on his own. So before we go here's another SM fanboy jocking SM, lets look at some facts SM has defeated Kobra a A list MA who once beat Batman at HTH, Another great example is during the New Krypton story-line when the bottle city of Kandor created a new Krypton SM fought another Kryptonian at HTH in which SM beat him by using a mixture of MA styles. So this idea tat SM hass never demonstrated skill at HTH is a falacy.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcvc8pvyas1qbw77k.gif

Calm down stud. It's just the Internet.

Originally posted by Damborgson
Who said anything about fair? What I'm saying is, because of these stips, Thor loses a lot more than Superman does. The purpose of the thread, the results, they're not relevant. I'm saying that under these stips it's very hard for Thor to win, even 2/10. It's not a critique or a complaint, but an observation.



Understood.

Originally posted by Surtur
Okay so since this is essentially coming down to strength, durability, and fighting skill..I have to go with Thor here. I think they are close enough in strength and durability that skill the key, and that should go to Thor.

Superman is not some unskilled fighter or anything like that, but I don't quite think he is as good as Thor though.
How is he close to Superman in strength and durability but better in skill?

Superman has actually beaten martial artists.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
You say it every time someone pits a character with magic based power against Superman. Don't play games.
So no posts?

Stop melting down.

Again: Superman mops the floor with thor here.

Originally posted by Kryptoniano
Again: Superman mops the floor with thor here. He doesn't mop the floor with him. Thor is a skilled fighter, but yes, Superman will Win under this scenario.

Originally posted by CPT Space Bomb
He doesn't mop the floor with him. Thor is a skilled fighter, but yes, Superman will Win under this scenario.
Yes, he does.

Now where is Rage when you need him?

Superman wins. And it wont be pretty.

Originally posted by Delta1938
General Lane made a deal with the chick who was in charge of the realm that was the source of all magick.


So in other words, Thor is going to work really hard to get knocked the **** out again. Gotcha. Accept that Superman>>Thor.

I know about his alliance and all his black hat dealings. I always thought Atlas was giving Clark trouble because he was mystically empowered.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yup.

Not that I have a dog in the fight, but...

http://i.imgur.com/aWtZIuT.jpg

http://imgur.com/a/9wOU7
I've already read the arc.

What about these rays?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Right.

What does that has to do with Gladiator knocking him out with two punches?

Both were due to magical weakness of Superman. And Anointed One didn't kill him. It was Gemnanae.

Not that any of that is relevant here.
Just adding context to his fight with future Gladz.

Now it's a weakness all of a sudden? For as long as I can remember you tout that magic does not make him weak with all kinds of scan blitzes.. Now he's weak to magic because he got his @$$ handed to him?
Anyways... Different writers, different portrayals. I always believed he was never weak to magic, but more vulnerable.

Wait... Anointed One beat the shiet out of him.. He got beat up to death. Unless I missed something or read a different comic, you are wrong. I hope it's the former because you then would be lying.

http://oi59.tinypic.com/w1uzva.jpg

http://oi57.tinypic.com/2r2yz46.jpg

http://oi61.tinypic.com/20h0a5u.jpg

http://oi58.tinypic.com/nqcmtj.jpg

Originally posted by Delta1938
WrjwaqZfjIY



If Orion isn't beating Post-Mongul trained Superman hand-to-hand, I'm not seeing Thor do it.

The thing is Mongul never really showed any super amazing fighting skill. We know he trained Superman, but in some ways it seems like the training was more about utilizing his powers better as opposed to teaching him certain fighting styles. You could almost say Mongul was more or less attempting to slap the PIS right out of Superman with that training, but I don't think it made him that skilled. Since he actually remembers "hey super speed is a thing that exists" in that comic and uses it to easily avoid Monguls punches.

Originally posted by Surtur
The thing is Mongul never really showed any super amazing fighting skill. We know he trained Superman, but in some ways it seems like the training was more about utilizing his powers better as opposed to teaching him certain fighting styles. You could almost say Mongul was more or less attempting to slap the PIS right out of Superman with that training, but I don't think it made him that skilled. Since he actually remembers "hey super speed is a thing that exists" in that comic and uses it to easily avoid Monguls punches.
Not bad..

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Just adding context to his fight with future Gladz.


Which doesn't makes Thor getting koed in two punches any better.

Where have I ever said that? Not all the writers agree on that. Under Kelly he was quite susceptible to magic. He was killed and staked later on in the comic.

And even Anointed one koed him in a large explosion off panel. Not exactly a h2h showing when they were matched evenly while fighting across world. And it's Anointed one's only showing. So not exactly a low showing if you have nothing else to compare it with.

I wish you read comics more carefully from now on. These are worthless.

When you can show an established herald koing Superman in h2h via sheer strength, Thor may get one win here out of 10.

Originally posted by Surtur
The thing is Mongul never really showed any super amazing fighting skill. We know he trained Superman, but in some ways it seems like the training was more about utilizing his powers better as opposed to teaching him certain fighting styles. You could almost say Mongul was more or less attempting to slap the PIS right out of Superman with that training, but I don't think it made him that skilled. Since he actually remembers "hey super speed is a thing that exists" in that comic and uses it to easily avoid Monguls punches.
You must've never read Superman comics then if you think that was the only thing Superman learned.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I know about his alliance and all his black hat dealings. I always thought Atlas was giving Clark trouble because he was mystically empowered.


I've already read the arc.

What about these rays?
Read again.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Which doesn't makes Thor getting koed in two punches any better.

Where have I ever said that? Not all the writers agree on that. Under Kelly he was quite susceptible to magic. He was killed and staked later on in the comic.

And even Anointed one koed him in a large explosion off panel. Not exactly a h2h showing when they were matched evenly while fighting across world. And it's Anointed one's only showing. So not exactly a low showing if you have nothing else to compare it with.

I wish you read comics more carefully from now on. These are worthless.

When you can show an established herald koing Superman in h2h via sheer strength, Thor may get one win here out of 10.
Again protecting innocents and holding back against a bloodlusted Gladz.

Of course you do.

Anointed One not only ko'd him, he beat him to death. What, you're making the rules now? It shows that Superman is not some invincible unbeatable character like the one in your dreams. You are right. They seemed evenly matched in a battle that was most likely and predominantly a physical one. I mean come on. Superman punches things and takes punches in like 99% of his fights. The difference is he lost. Plus the last panel looks like the fight ended in a divebomb(so not physical lol). It's funny how you keep throwing around it has to be ONLY h2h or it doesn't count type of bullshiet. Yes in a perfect world that would be best, but this is comics brah. We are pitting 2 characters that have a multitude of super powers after all. You and your ridiculous stipulations.

Also does everything have to revolve around low showings for you? I'm not calling it a low showing. It's a valid loss to an evenly matched character. The insecurity of this guy.. Smh...

And you are wrong. Anointed One fought a seemingly amped Gamemnae. One panel actually shows Gam shattering his jaw with a punch taking him down.

Just realize something. It looks like you tried to attribute Clark's loss to AO because of "magical weakness"....

And how did Gam kill Clark when we see him dead by AO's hands?

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Again protecting innocents and holding back against a bloodlusted Gladz.

Of course you do.

It doesn't matter at that point. It might have stopped Thor using full power at gladiator but it didn't lower his durability.

Simple as that.

No, he didn't.

He died by Gamnanae when she staked him along with all the other Leagures.

http://s5d4.turboimagehost.com/t/23903483_jla_74_-_kebbin_14.jpg

There is no indication or information that Superman was dead before that.


WTF are you babbling about now? Off panel with a huge explosion. Not a h2h fight. Divebomb that makes an explosion? Yeah, right? Why not? This is a h2h fight, isn't it?

Not in this thread. You can make a separate thread if you want.

Its a valid loss sure. Its a not a h2h fight and thus not qualified here.



She was powered by entire league of ancients and had used quagmire spell at that point. Not to mention absorbed the entire magic of atlantis.

Its funny how little you know about comics and how they work.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Just realize something. It looks like you tried to attribute Clark's loss to AO because of "magical weakness"....

And how did Gam kill Clark when we see him dead by AO's hands?
We see? Point me out where Superman was said to be dead.

Originally posted by abhilegend
It doesn't matter at that point. It might have stopped Thor using full power at gladiator but it didn't lower his durability.

Simple as that.

No, he didn't.

He died by Gamnanae when she staked him along with all the other Leagures.

http://s5d4.turboimagehost.com/t/23903483_jla_74_-_kebbin_14.jpg

There is no indication or information that Superman was dead before that.


WTF are you babbling about now? Off panel with a huge explosion. Not a h2h fight. Divebomb that makes an explosion? Yeah, right? Why not? This is a h2h fight, isn't it?

Not in this thread. You can make a separate thread if you want.

Its a valid loss sure. Its a not a h2h fight and thus not qualified here.



She was powered by entire league of ancients and had used quagmire spell at that point. Not to mention absorbed the entire magic of atlantis.

Its funny how little you know about comics and how they work.
I'm not denying he was taken out there. I was merely adding extra info. That of him holding back while keeping the girl's safety. Period, end of story.

Wait what!? Take off your Superman blinders for a sec and read the comic again. The League Ancients' were tasked to kill them. One by one they all died in the confrontation except for Plas. Look at the scans again. Superman is lying lifeless with both eyes open. Do you know how pathetic you are right now? He was beaten to death. I know it must be excruciatingly painful for you, but accept it and move on. Be a big boy.

Of course it's qualified. It would be idiotic not to accept it.

No. Gamemnae was not yet powered by the whole League of Ancients since she was in the process of killing one(AO) right there. What is your point anyway? Are you trying to sound informed as proof that you know what you're talking about? You are bringing up irrelevant info. Your ruse is not working btw.

You already claimed he lost due to magical weakness and now you are trying to stick with another false claim. Do yourself a favor and let this one go. It's going to make you look even more ridiculous if you continue down this path.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I'm not denying he was taken out there. I was merely adding extra info. That of him holding back while keeping the girl's safety. Period, end of story.

The extra info is pretty worthless. So no, not the end of story.

You just want to obfuscate a very simple scene as something like "Thor held back his durability."

Did they? Wonder Woman and Batman were not dead. J'onn wasn't dead. Wally wasn't dead. Only Kyle got his heart ripped out. That's what happen when you are koed too. Are you always this daft? Post a single panel where Superman was supposed to be dead by Anointed One's hands. One.

It really isn't. Go cry somewhere else.

She had already absorbed Rama Khan and only two were remaining, Anointed One and Monitou. Rama Khan by himself was able to take on the whole league.

Simply making excuses will not work here.



Haha, this is always how you whine? Superman's loss to Anointed One isn't valid for this thread.

My challenge still stands. Post a single herald beating Superman in h2h and Thor may get one win.

Untill then? Superman beat the holy hell out of him.

Originally posted by abhilegend
The extra info is pretty worthless. So no, not the end of story.

You just want to obfuscate a very simple scene as something like "Thor held back his durability."

Did they? Wonder Woman and Batman were not dead. J'onn wasn't dead. Wally wasn't dead. Only Kyle got his heart ripped out. That's what happen when you are koed too. Are you always this daft? Post a single panel where Superman was supposed to be dead by Anointed One's hands. One.

It really isn't. Go cry somewhere else.

She had already absorbed Rama Khan and only two were remaining, Anointed One and Monitou. Rama Khan by himself was able to take on the whole league.

Simply making excuses will not work here.


Haha, this is always how you whine? Superman's loss to Anointed One isn't valid for this thread.

My challenge still stands. Post a single herald beating Superman in h2h and Thor may get one win.

Untill then? Superman beat the holy hell out of him.
Held back his durability? No. Holding back while keeping the safety of an innocent a fight is a huge detriment. Pretty much common sense that for some reason escapes you.

Wtf? I don't know what bizzaro world comic you are reading, but nothing right is coming from you. Read it again. Like I said, the more you deny the more you'll look ridiculous. In fact if you don't believe me, ask one of your Superbuds. There's no way the scene can be interpreted any other way. Iirc, DC encyclopedia entry stated that the Ancients killed the JLA and not Gamemnae alone.

Your challenge? hysterical

Before you issue dumb challenges, learn how to read a comic first.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Held back his durability? No. Holding back while keeping the safety of an innocent a fight is a huge detriment. Pretty much common sense that for some reason escapes you.

You still haven't answered how that helps Thor when he got Koed by Gladiator in two punches? If he wasn't saving the girl, what would boost his durability?

Does it? Then why don't you post it? Rest of your gibberish is worthless.


So you concede that Thor can't win a single fight here.

Here's how you beat a Herald in h2h. Valor was actually stronger than Superman at that point, was out to kill, Superman was asphyxiating and Valor used heat vision.

http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar1.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar2.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar3.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar4.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar5.jpg

That was a weaker, less experienced Superman. I will wait for a similar showing in h2h from Thor.

Regardless of whether she killed him or not, AO def KOed him.

Not that it matters. The dialogue in the story from Manitou specifically said if they had matched them in ferocity, the League would have won. Superman spent the entire fight trying to save civvies and talk AO down...

Originally posted by abhilegend
You still haven't answered how that helps Thor when he got Koed by Gladiator in two punches? If he wasn't saving the girl, what would boost his durability?

Does it? Then why don't you post it? Rest of your gibberish is worthless.


So you concede that Thor can't win a single fight here.

Here's how you beat a Herald in h2h. Valor was actually stronger than Superman at that point, was out to kill, Superman was asphyxiating and Valor used heat vision.

http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar1.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar2.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar3.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar4.jpg
http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/SupesvsEclipsoLar5.jpg

That was a weaker, less experienced Superman. I will wait for a similar showing in h2h from Thor.
Already explained my points to you on that fight. Not going to keep repeating myself.

Here's the DCE entry for the Ancients. They "fought and killed" the JLA(except for Plas who survived for a few thousand yrs).
http://i.imgur.com/wjhxKVp.png

Lol. No. Superman is not the be all end all found in your wet dreams. Really idiotic to think he wins Thor has 0 chance. Thanos or SBP would win every single time. Supes? That's a resounding no.

See if you only would have started like this earlier, we could have gotten off on the right foot. Instead you always barge in with lowball tactics to put anyone pitted against Supes in a bad light.
Nice scans.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Regardless of whether she killed him or not, AO def KOed him.

Not that it matters. The dialogue in the story from Manitou specifically said if they had matched them in ferocity, the League would have won. Superman spent the entire fight trying to save civvies and talk AO down...
Come on Dark... You actually believe he wasn't beaten to death by AO? That was their mission. If you check it again the book went out of its way to show each Leaguer's death scene. One by one they were executed and culminated in the panel where Kyle heroically dies. I would post it but I'm too lazy.

That may be the case since he's a hero and that may be his compulsion, but they knew going in that they were going to face a team who lived in a different time. More barbaric..
In fact they were briefed by J'onn telepathically regarding this before they engaged.

He didn't necessarily spend the entire time saving innocents. He was more mindful of them and looked as if he tried to take the fight away if they started to threaten lives. Bottom line is he was killed even though he knew his opponent was out to kill.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Come on Dark... You actually believe he wasn't beaten to death by AO? That was their mission. If you check it again the book went out of its way to show each Leaguer's death scene. One by one they were executed and culminated in the panel where Kyle heroically dies. I would post it but I'm too lazy.

That may be the case since he's a hero and that may be his compulsion, but they knew going in that they were going to face a team who lived in a different time. More barbaric..
In fact they were briefed by J'onn telepathically regarding this before they engaged.

He didn't necessarily spend the entire time saving innocents. He was more mindful of them and looked as if he tried to take the fight away if they started to threaten lives. Bottom line is he was killed even though he knew his opponent was out to kill.

To me, he looks dead. But you and I both know, unless it says clearly in the comic, 'Superman was killed by AO', this entire debate will never end with Abhi.

With regards to the mindset, Manitou says how their natures enabled him to craft their spell bringing them back to life. How some would have seen their relatively pacifist natures as a weakness, but in reality, it saved them.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
To me, he looks dead. But you and I both know, unless it says clearly in the comic, 'Superman was killed by AO', this entire debate will never end with Abhi.

With regards to the mindset, Manitou says how their natures enabled him to craft their spell bringing them back to life. How some would have seen their relatively pacifist natures as a weakness, but in reality, it saved them.
Point taken. Can't argue with that.



I will concede that mindsetwise, Ancients prolly had an edge.

It doesn't take away from the initial question, which herald has beaten Superman in a fight.

Alongside DoS Doomsday, a forum ruling calling him a mere Low Herald sneer

Even after having a huge portion of his godly power drained from him by Balder, a beaten and shackled Thor somehow finds the strength to wreck many of Seth's soldiers and Grog the God Crusher.
http://i.imgur.com/cIOLXfx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cNOMSbp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/H6Usekr.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vtQihhs.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dNy4dsB.jpg

Some next level shiet right thurr.

^Loki did lend him some power iirc since Balder siphoned his and was almost turned to mortal.


Edit.. Just double checked.. It was an issue after that scene..
It was actually all Thor there vs Grog.

Originally posted by abhilegend
My challenge still stands. Post a single herald beating Superman in h2h and Thor may get one win.

Lol is this a serious request?

Do you honestly not think Superman's ever lost to a herald in hand to hand?

Unless you have some ridiculous stipulations as to what qualifies as hand to hand that right there is some crazy shit.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Already explained my points to you on that fight. Not going to keep repeating myself.


You mean you've just mindlessly repeated your opinions without any kind of proof?

Yes, they killed League. Not that they were killed on the same spot or Superman died by Anointed One.

By that page Plas should be dead too. This is just laughable at this point.

So nothing but your mindless prattle? Why would Thor win a single fight here?



This is just lulzworthy.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Even after having a huge portion of his godly power drained from him by Balder, a beaten and shackled Thor somehow finds the strength to wreck many of Seth's soldiers and Grog the God Crusher.
http://i.imgur.com/cIOLXfx.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/cNOMSbp.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/H6Usekr.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vtQihhs.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/dNy4dsB.jpg

Some next level shiet right thurr.
Balder had halved Thor's strength. At that point Balder died and Thor was again at full power.

Nothing special there. Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lol is this a serious request?

Do you honestly not think Superman's ever lost to a herald in hand to hand?

Unless you have some ridiculous stipulations as to what qualifies as hand to hand that right there is some crazy shit.
That's what I'm asking about. Without some context, he never loses h2h fights with another Herald level beings.

Originally posted by abhilegend

That's what I'm asking about. Without some context, he never loses h2h fights with another Herald level beings.



If he does, it obviously means the opponent was not herald level, and everyone else is wrong (again, DoS Doomsday).

Originally posted by DarkSaint85


If he does, it obviously means the opponent was not herald level, and everyone else is wrong (again, DoS Doomsday).
Name one Herald level being which can tank Superman, J'onn, Guy, Fire and Booster all at once, no sell punches from J'onn and oneshot both him and maxima and has Superman hurting his hands on him?

Kurse is a mid Herald here FFS.

Originally posted by abhilegend
You mean you've just mindlessly repeated your opinions without any kind of proof?

Yes, they killed League. Not that they were killed on the same spot or Superman died by Anointed One.

By that page Plas should be dead too. This is just laughable at this point.

So nothing but your mindless prattle? Why would Thor win a single fight here?



This is just lulzworthy.
Proof? No one is denying that he was taken out by a future bloodlusted Gladz while holding back and protecting an innocent... Sigh...

Dark was right. You are so far gone in your Supes worship that you are blind to anything in front of you if it means that it puts him in any form of bad light. Read the comic ffs...

I thought you are the DC expert here. It was later revealed that Plas survived after being crushed. He lived on for 3000 yrs in scattered pieces across the Atlantic.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Balder had halved Thor's strength. At that point Balder died and Thor was again at full power.
Nothing special there.

Balder was still alive using Thor's strength vs Seth 2 issues from his battle with Grog. This Loki Liesmith over here. You are awful at this...
facepalm

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Lol is this a serious request?

Do you honestly not think Superman's ever lost to a herald in hand to hand?

Unless you have some ridiculous stipulations as to what qualifies as hand to hand that right there is some crazy shit.


Other examples...

Konvict merked him with one punch. He was stunned/flash ko'd for a few moments lying on the ground with his eyes closed.

Male Cheetah overpowered him and made him pass out Iirc..

Originally posted by abhilegend
Balder had halved Thor's strength. At that point Balder died and Thor was again at full power.

Nothing special there.

That's what I'm asking about. Without some context, he never loses h2h fights with another Herald level beings.

Not true. Are you lying or misinformed? Tbh, I don't know which is worse because you get uppity if someone forgets what color Superman's shoes were in a comic.

Context =/= You not liking something and claiming it's invalid. If you don't think Superman has ever lost a fist fight with a herald level being why even bother entering threads like this?

There's literally scans about a page ago of the Annointed One killing him btw.

Originally posted by Surtur
The thing is Mongul never really showed any super amazing fighting skill. We know he trained Superman, but in some ways it seems like the training was more about utilizing his powers better as opposed to teaching him certain fighting styles. You could almost say Mongul was more or less attempting to slap the PIS right out of Superman with that training, but I don't think it made him that skilled. Since he actually remembers "hey super speed is a thing that exists" in that comic and uses it to easily avoid Monguls punches.

There was some actual Martial Arts skills given(statements and a showing) and we saw Mongul was teaching Superman to better fight with his powers, but that's not what I was referring to.

I had mentioned it, but not gone into detail, earlier with BAV. That Mongul's training was primarily about increasing Superman's powers because of the mental blocks.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG02.jpg

Mongul talks about Superman holding back, also stating, "you quell your rage!!"


http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG04.jpg

Telling Superman to use his anger.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG05.jpg

Superman felt his powers surge.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG07.jpg

Mongul tells him to use his telescopic vision to confirm Warworld was destroyed. Superman says he can't look that far with Earth's atmosphere blocking it. Mongul says he can, he chooses not to.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG09.jpg

Lois narrates about Clark has talked about his concerns on his limits and weaknesses. And now the worry is about the opposite.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG12.jpg

Lois states Mongul's training is to make Superman "more super."

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG15.jpg

Clark talks about how he always instinctively holds back, and since his powers developed, the only time he ever didn't hold back was against Doomsday.

So, Superman's mind literally limited him, not just he doesn't hit as hard as he could. His mind suppresses his powers. Mongul's training was meant to get around that.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Not bad..

Originally posted by Delta1938



Lemme ask u... Did Anointed One from League of Ancients beat Clark to death? Just curious..

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Lemme ask u... Did Anointed One from League of Ancients beat Clark to death? Just curious..

Can't really tell since we see little actual on-panel fighting, and the fight ends in a way that doesn't apply to the topic, even if there wasn't something other than pure force involved.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17


Other examples...

Konvict merked him with one punch. He was stunned/flash ko'd for a few moments lying on the ground with his eyes closed.

Male Cheetah overpowered him and made him pass out Iirc..

The answer to the question is AO and Konvict at a minimum and these fanboy made excuses are as worthless as the time spent dreaming them up. They've created a little see no evil hear no evil speak no evil pocket universe for themselves. Must be nice and cozy in there.

Originally posted by Delta1938
Can't really tell since we see little actual on-panel fighting, and the fight ends in a way that doesn't apply to the topic, even if there wasn't something other than pure force involved.
So u can't tell even though Anointed One is the resident powerhouse of the Ancients and other than the thing from his mouth(which seemed ineffectual if I may add), he doesn't really have any other esoteric abilities? Even though we see the fight seemingly ending in a divebomb? Interesting...

I wonder do you think all AO did was "mouth blast" him to death?

Do you at least acknowledge that he offed boy blue?

Also not sure why you can't see their fight applying to the topic at hand.

Originally posted by Blue Area Vet
The answer to the question is AO and Konvict at a minimum and these fanboy made excuses are as worthless as the time spent dreaming them up. They've created a little see no evil hear no evil speak no evil pocket universe for themselves. Must be nice and cozy in there.

Just curious, are you going to concede to your error on your response to me bringing-up Mongul training Superman? Here's it in more depth to cure you of your ignorance to it.

Originally posted by Delta1938
There was some actual Martial Arts skills given(statements and a showing) and we saw Mongul was teaching Superman to better fight with his powers, but that's not what I was referring to.

I had mentioned it, but not gone into detail, earlier with BAV. That Mongul's training was primarily about increasing Superman's powers because of the mental blocks.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG02.jpg

Mongul talks about Superman holding back, also stating, "you quell your rage!!"


http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG04.jpg

Telling Superman to use his anger.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG05.jpg

Superman felt his powers surge.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG07.jpg

Mongul tells him to use his telescopic vision to confirm Warworld was destroyed. Superman says he can't look that far with Earth's atmosphere blocking it. Mongul says he can, he chooses not to.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG09.jpg

Lois narrates about Clark has talked about his concerns on his limits and weaknesses. And now the worry is about the opposite.

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG12.jpg

Lois states Mongul's training is to make Superman "more super."

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa466/Delta1938/Misc/DynamicNature/MongulTraining/SUPERMAN_V2_152-PG15.jpg

Clark talks about how he always instinctively holds back, and since his powers developed, the only time he ever didn't hold back was against Doomsday.

So, Superman's mind literally limited him, not just he doesn't hit as hard as he could. His mind suppresses his powers. Mongul's training was meant to get around that.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
So u can't tell even though Anointed One is the resident powerhouse of the Ancients and other than the thing from his mouth(which seemed ineffectual if I may add), he doesn't really have any other esoteric abilities? Even though we see the fight seemingly ended in a divebomb? Interesting...

I wonder do you think all AO did was "mouth blast" him to death?

Do you at least acknowledge that he offed boy blue?

Also not sure why you can't see their fight applying to the topic at hand.

We don't really see much of them hitting each other, and the fight ends with them slamming to the ground. Even if you're not assuming he beat him in the air and then they both slammed into the ground for shits and giggles, the fight being ended by the divebomb invalidates it from this.

Looks like it.

Originally posted by Delta1938
We don't really see much of them hitting each other, and the fight ends with them slamming to the ground. Even if you're not assuming he beat him in the air and then they both slammed into the ground for shits and giggles, the fight being ended by the divebomb invalidates it from this.

Looks like it.
How does a divebomb (physical act) invalidate the scene from this topic? Doesn't this showing vs AO help paint a picture of what closely matched opponents can possibly do to Clark when the question of strength, durability, and skill are involved? I think it's perfectly valid.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
How does a divebomb (physical act) invalidate the scene from this topic? Doesn't this showing vs AO help paint a picture of what closely matched opponents can possibly do to Clark when the question of strength, durability, and skill are involved? I think it's perfectly valid.

Originally posted by carver9
No range attacks or Mjlonir. No flying. This is a punch and kick fight.

I don't think a divebomb qualifies as punch/kick.

Originally posted by Delta1938
I don't think a divebomb qualifies as punch/kick.






Desperate times in New Krypton. Scratch Sentry KOing Blue Marvel, he used the exotic attack known as the God Divebomb!

Originally posted by Delta1938
I don't think a divebomb qualifies as punch/kick.
Err.. U serious? Ure gonna nitpick using the op's use of words to describe a fight that does not allow weapons or esoteric abilities to justify your stance? You think in a physical confrontation against two super powered individuals that there will be zero chances for leaps, bull rushes, charges, jumps, and the like? Maybe even grappling? Even I don't think the op meant it's going to be literally just "punch and kick".

And even then didn't his battle with AO at least include strength, durability, and fighting skill?

Originally posted by Delta1938
Just curious, are you going to concede to your error on your response to me bringing-up Mongul training Superman? Here's it in more depth to cure you of your ignorance to it.



There isn't anything to address. I said he fights the same before and after the training, mostly idiotic. Hiw about you address that.