Luke Cage vs. Classic Rogue

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StiltmanFTW
Rogue can't use absorption.

zopzop
Classic Rogue.

Just as strong and durable PLUS flight.

leonidas
yeah i'd say rogue too...she's a tough phukcer. cage could take some under these rules though imo.

carver9
Originally posted by zopzop
Classic Rogue.

Just as strong and durable PLUS flight.

This. I think Rogue is stronger and more durable than Cage though but you're right on.

StiltmanFTW
Handbooks were never 100% accurate, but damn, Cage sure got a huge upgrade in the last decade.

"Class 20". Yeah, right.

Flyattractor
Are we using Classic Disco Luke Cage/Power Man or more Shaved Head with a goatee looks like Sam Jackson/Nick Fury Black Guy?

StiltmanFTW
The latter.

deathslash
Isn't Luke a better fighter than rogue?

leonidas
yeah, but it'd still be a brawl and she'd be considerably faster than he is as well.

deathslash
Not saying he wins, but he's held up against considerably faster and far stronger opponents than her.

vansonbee
Has Luke fair any better against Ms. Marvel? Rogue should be about that strong.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by leonidas
yeah

Hasn't Rogue been trained by Raven...?

And even if not, she's been in countless Danger Room scenarios. X-Men easily offer the best training in Marvel, superior to those of Iron Man simulations, F4 or Avengers.

deathslash
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Hasn't Rogue been trained by Raven...?

And even if not, she's been in countless Danger Room scenarios. X-Men easily offer the best training in Marvel, superior to those of Iron Man simulations, F4 or Avengers. do you consider the x-men training to be better than training with iron fist, the heroes for hire, the thunderbolts, and the avengers?

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by deathslash
do you consider the x-men training to be better than training with iron fist, the heroes for hire, the thunderbolts, and the avengers?

Yes.

Thunderbolts didn't offer any training, Luke was trying to lead the team of psychopaths, murderers and mentally ill guys.

New Avengers. Cage was seen sitting on a couch with Wolverine, drinking as many beers as possible before passing out.

The only training worth mentioning is Iron Fist's -- and it's still not that much, seeing as Daniel only sparred with him, but made sure not to teach Luke anything actually useful. Like the basics of K'un Lun arts.

And he refused to do that because secretly he hates black people. Marvel has a lot of explaining to do, lol.

leonidas
meh, i think the 'skills' are basically a wash, but i've never seen rogue ever exhibit any specific h2h skills. i think cage has a couple of decent ones. skill would certainly not be the deciding factor imo. rogue's flight and speed would be bigger determinants, and i think she has an edge in strength. he probably has the durability edge and they're both tough as nails. it's close, certainly no one is sweeping. i'd take rogue maybe 6-7/10

StiltmanFTW
Rogue actually fared well with absorption touch as her only power in a large chunk of her career. That does require some serious skill.

Cage's best skill feat is beating a "shark-killer"-something z-lister villain who appeared only to make him look good stick out tongue "I know some ninja shit". Terrible book.

warden515
Originally posted by leonidas
meh, i think the 'skills' are basically a wash, but i've never seen rogue ever exhibit any specific h2h skills. i think cage has a couple of decent ones. skill would certainly not be the deciding factor imo. rogue's flight and speed would be bigger determinants, and i think she has an edge in strength. he probably has the durability edge and they're both tough as nails. it's close, certainly no one is sweeping. i'd take rogue maybe 6-7/10

Other than reckoning strength a match, I agree with this. Rogue wins. Poor Luke, what brick can he actually beat?

deathslash
Originally posted by warden515
Other than reckoning strength a match, I agree with this. Rogue wins. Poor Luke, what brick can he actually beat? In a forum fight or on panel? He usually fights a tier or two out of his weight class. Back when he was just a three tonner, he was evenly fighting characters like iron man, the rhino, the living monolith, warhawk, the thing, etc. When he became a 15 tonner, he was going up against wonder man, rhino, ironclad, tombstone, and even the hulk. Now that he's supposed to be a 20 tonner, he's evenly matching she hulk, proxima midnight, namor, etc.

deathslash
Originally posted by leonidas
meh, i think the 'skills' are basically a wash, but i've never seen rogue ever exhibit any specific h2h skills. i think cage has a couple of decent ones. skill would certainly not be the deciding factor imo. rogue's flight and speed would be bigger determinants, and i think she has an edge in strength. he probably has the durability edge and they're both tough as nails. it's close, certainly no one is sweeping. i'd take rogue maybe 6-7/10 I'm actually wondering, how fast is rogue and what are her best durability feats?
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yes.

The only training worth mentioning is Iron Fist's -- and it's still not that much, seeing as Daniel only sparred with him, but made sure not to teach Luke anything actually useful. Like the basics of K'un Lun arts.

And he refused to do that because secretly he hates black people. Marvel has a lot of explaining to do, lol.
Are you referring to this? Where Danny is starting out by teaching cage moves that will and have helped him fight outside of his weight class?

http://thumbnails7.imagebam.com/7429/96471474286729.gif http://thumbnails21.imagebam.com/7429/91e72a74286731.gif http://thumbnails8.imagebam.com/7429/8419ae74286735.gif

warden515
Originally posted by deathslash
In a forum fight or on panel? He usually fights a tier or two out of his weight class. Back when he was just a three tonner, he was evenly fighting characters like iron man, the rhino, the living monolith, warhawk, the thing, etc. When he became a 15 tonner, he was going up against wonder man, rhino, ironclad, tombstone, and even the hulk. Now that he's supposed to be a 20 tonner, he's evenly matching she hulk, proxima midnight, namor, etc.

In a forum fight I guess. On panel he's had some impressive KOs, maybe too impressive for an alleged 20 tonner. I like the premise - streetfighting skills + insane durability means he can hang with and maybe wear down stronger opposition but then he one-shots e.g Ironclad? Or there was a Thunderbolts issue where he's with Doc Strange and up against some giant stone creature and dusts it with a punch (way too lazy to find the issue!). I don't think he's class 20 at all but still going with Classic Rogue for being consistently awesome.

DarkSaint85
Yeah, I would go with Rogue for this. Cage is tough, for sure. Skills? Both seemed to just brawl, really.

carver9
Originally posted by deathslash
I'm actually wondering, how fast is rogue and what are her best durability feats?

Are you referring to this? Where Danny is starting out by teaching cage moves that will and have helped him fight outside of his weight class?

http://thumbnails7.imagebam.com/7429/96471474286729.gif http://thumbnails21.imagebam.com/7429/91e72a74286731.gif http://thumbnails8.imagebam.com/7429/8419ae74286735.gif


Rogue is pretty fast. She caught machine gun fire that was aimed at her team.

deathslash
Originally posted by carver9
Rogue is pretty fast. She caught machine gun fire that was aimed at her team. she caught it or did she move in front of where the bullets would be and let the invulnerability do the work? Either way, may I please see some scans?

carver9
Originally posted by deathslash
she caught it or did she move in front of where the bullets would be and let the invulnerability do the work? Either way, may I please see some scans?

She pulls a Superman. Stands in one spot and moves her arms at super speed while catching bullets. I had the scan but I can't relocate it. Hope an issue number is good enough though: X-Men v2 #102 & 104.

deathslash
Originally posted by carver9
She pulls a Superman. Stands in one spot and moves her arms at super speed while catching bullets. I had the scan but I can't relocate it. Hope an issue number is good enough though: X-Men v2 #102 & 104. thanks. I'll look it up when I get out of class

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