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Whats the deal with that?

I've read a lot of fiction where (lower case g) gods derive power from the number of worshippers they have and so on, but whats going on with the biblical God?
Asking those who, unlike me, may have read the bible more recently than 35 years ago.

From what I understand, God needs nothing from us. But he makes himself "finite" in order to give us some understanding of him and gives us the chance to get closer to him through worship. At least that's the Jewish belief.

He loves us and he wants his love answered. That's pretty much it.

Conditional love?

God's love for us is not "conditional" or else he wouldn't have sent His only Son to die for us/pay for our sins.

What does God get out of being worshipped?
This is what I believe:
Worship is for people.
God is complete and without want or need.
God is the cup that overflows. How can you add to that?

A boner? I like to believe its erectile girth is directly proportional to the volume and intensity of worship. Weekends are basically Him using Universal Google to find porn.

Originally posted by Star428
God's love for us is not "conditional" or else he wouldn't have sent His only Son to die for us/pay for our sins.

Riv's post is saying our love would be the conditional love. He wasn't applying that modifier to God's love.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What does God get out of being worshipped?
This is what I believe:
Worship is for people.
God is complete and without want or need.
God is the cup that overflows. How can you add to that?



It definitely serves a psychological and/or emotional need for many.

i don't think god is the cup that overflows

cause he's supposed to be infinite

so you can keep pouring as much into his cup as you want, it will never fill up

thats why he loves getting props from lesser beings such as ourselves

somewhat similar to donald trump

Originally posted by Digi
Riv's post is saying our love would be the conditional love. He wasn't applying that modifier to God's love.

^^^

Thanks for the responses, folks.

Riv, not that it's the worst of sins (it's not at all, actually), but you don't always have to act like you're putting together a masters dissertation. Thankfulness is nice and all, but this is the internet. Half the time we're just sh*t-posting to kill time.

However, I do hope my God-boner hypothesis makes it into your future musings on the subject.

fdog

^^^I cant help being polite, Digi.

Its nice to have the fact that i am, pointed out though. Usually the opposite fact gets brought up by fellow posters/those in charge on various sites.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What does God get out of being worshipped?
This is what I believe:
Worship is for people.


It's not what 'God' gets out of it; it's what people get out of it, and IMHO the intent of worship (or in general, a reverent outlook) is to remind us to think outside the ego box.

Of course, like with so much humans do, the road to hell is paved with good intention.

I'm okay with my knowledge of what people get out of it.
Thats why i asked what God gets out of it.

Originally posted by Mindship


It's not what 'God' gets out of it; it's what people get out of it, and IMHO the intent of worship (or in general, a reverent outlook) is to remind us to think outside the ego box.

Of course, like with so much humans do, the road to hell is paved with good intention.

Originally posted by riv6672
I'm okay with my knowledge of what people get out of it.
Thats why i asked what God gets out of it. From a panentheistic POV: as humanity, 'God' reaps the benefits noted above.



But this is probably not what you meant either. For me, the Biblical God is a metaphor serving a specific purpose, limited in what it can convey, and one can go virtually anywhere with that depiction (eg, 'God needs to be worshipped cuz he's a vengeful God').

Is it possible just for once to discuss God without using puns, cliches or quoting the bible like it's your own thoughts?

Just asking.

Hey, whatever lets you post a cool smilie, guy.

Just pointing out, as you pointed out, so already knew, that what you touched on wasnt what i asked about.

This is more what i was hoping to see explored...

Originally posted by Mindship
For me, the Biblical God is a metaphor serving a specific purpose, limited in what it can convey, and one can go virtually anywhere with that depiction (eg, 'God needs to be worshipped cuz he's a vengeful God').

...but no thread idea ever survives first contact with the internet!

Originally posted by riv6672
Whats the deal with that?

I've read a lot of fiction where (lower case g) gods derive power from the number of worshippers they have and so on, but whats going on with the biblical God?
Asking those who, unlike me, may have read the bible more recently than 35 years ago. God's' derive power from worship.

God just kinda enjoys it.

Odds are we'd do it regardless of what the bible says.

God is essentially like a Kardashian. The Kardashians don't really do what they do strictly for money, but because they obviously crave and love attention.

God is the opposite of the kardashians. He doesn't need your attention.

^^^Then why does he ask for it? Not a joke question.

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Then why does he ask for it? Not a joke question.

He doesn't. He's giving us the chance to get closer to him and understand him through prayer and all that stuff. He doesn't need our affection or attention.

Originally posted by psmith81992
God is the opposite of the kardashians. He doesn't need your attention.

Kardashians don't need our attention either, but they still want it. So that's not the opposite of God, who also doesn't need attention but quite obviously craves it as well.

Originally posted by Surtur
Kardashians don't need our attention either, but they still want it. So that's not the opposite of God, who also doesn't need attention but quite obviously craves it as well.

But he doesn't crave our attention, nor want it. And the Kardashians both crave and need it.

Only an idiot like Surtur would compare the Kardashians to God Himself. What a fool he is. Hope he likes fire.

Well, what about the "no other gods before me" thing?
Thats got to mean something in this context, yes?

Originally posted by riv6672
Well, what about the "no other gods before me" thing?
Thats got to mean something in this context, yes?


I don't understand. Are u replying to what I said about Surtur stupidly comparing the Kardashians to an omnipotent and omniscient being? Yeah, your quote above is correct in that it's a commandment of God but don't see what that has to do with the spoiled Kardashians.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
What does God get out of being worshipped?
This is what I believe:
Worship is for people.
God is complete and without want or need.
God is the cup that overflows. How can you add to that?

Obviously people need worship, but actually the reason to worship God in particular should be clear for you of all people

Through worship of God, we learn to love all things he created, for loving God means that you see him on everyone and everything. But we don't make those people and those things our rulers, we don't become dependant to them, because we know they need God to fully be something.

Originally posted by psmith81992
He doesn't. He's giving us the chance to get closer to him and understand him through prayer and all that stuff. He doesn't need our affection or attention. dunno. when i read the OT he seems to really care about people's attention and devotion

i don't even get the idea that he shouldn't care about what humans think of him... sounds like something some self loathing humans made up to me

i mean aren't we supposed to be like god's children? what kind of parent doesn't crave a bond with his or her children?

Originally posted by Star428
I don't understand. Are u replying to what I said about Surtur stupidly comparing the Kardashians to an omnipotent and omniscient being? Yeah, your quote above is correct in that it's a commandment of God but don't see what that has to do with the spoiled Kardashians.
Nooo, definitely not replying to that. More to what smith was saying.

Originally posted by Bentley
Obviously people need worship, but actually the reason to worship God in particular should be clear for you of all people
Why me of all people, and why the afterwards? If there's a joke there, i dont get get it.

Originally posted by riv6672
Why me of all people, and why the afterwards? If there's a joke there, i dont get get it.

That was a wink to Shaky who I was quoting. Sorry for the unwanted confusion

Nah, i get it now]/i].
I wasnt quite awake enough earlier, MY bad!

Judaism and Christianity claim that the biblical God is perfect. Therefore he cannot "gain" anything from any source, especially from the flawed, "sinful" creatures from whom he so illogically demands worship. But he does demand it, at the cost of the destruction of willful non-worshipers.

YHVH was perceived as a Middle Eastern monarch-tyrant, who demanded worship, obedience, and sacrifice. He was based on the Middle Eastern model of the king - a terrible model, because just like human kings, YHVH's mercy is only occasional, and his "justice" savage, grotesque, and inconsistently applied.

No he doesn't.


Just because you think his mercy was only occasional and his justice was savage doesn't make it so. But keep applying your human principles to a God.

THE god.

Originally posted by Bentley
Obviously people need worship, but actually the reason to worship God in particular should be clear for you of all people

Through worship of God, we learn to love all things he created, for loving God means that you see him on everyone and everything. But we don't make those people and those things our rulers, we don't become dependant to them, because we know they need God to fully be something.

I don't worship. I believe in God in the same way I believe in gravity. Rather I have a good life of not is fully dependent on me.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I don't worship. I believe in God in the same way I believe in gravity. Rather I have a good life of not is fully dependent on me.

Oh yes, you're most definitely the master of your fate.

Originally posted by psmith81992
Oh yes, you're most definitely the master of your fate.

I except responsibility for all things in my life. I believe that I chose it all "long" before I was born. Every person is the master of their fate.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I don't worship. I believe in God in the same way I believe in gravity. Rather I have a good life of not is fully dependent on me.

My phrase was more about the reason than about the worship. The fact of recognizing everything in the universe is linked by a similar nature is something you can benefit from.

Also discussing about worship would be too depending on definitions for my taste. Use veneration if it better fits your relationship with the world.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Every person is the master of their fate.
There are times when i've found that hard to believe, but in the end, yeah, thats true.

Originally posted by psmith81992
But he doesn't crave our attention, nor want it. And the Kardashians both crave and need it.

But how does he not crave our attention and yet tells us we can't worship anyone but him? Why would he care if he doesn't want our attention?

Originally posted by Star428
Only an idiot like Surtur would compare the Kardashians to God Himself.

There are a lot more nastier people out there I could just as easily compare him to if you'd like.



I do like fire..it's what lights my weed. But as a Christian shouldn't you not want anyone to be burning eternally in hell? Not kewl.

Originally posted by psmith81992
From what I understand, God needs nothing from us. But he makes himself "finite" in order to give us some understanding of him and gives us the chance to get closer to him through worship. At least that's the Jewish belief.

Very good statement.

So the Jews don't follow the 10 commandments?

Though keep in mind this topic is specifically about the biblical God. Which is why I asked about the commandments, because saying God gives us the "chance" to become closer to him through worship makes it seem like we have a choice, and the commandments make it seem like..nope, you don't really have a choice in the matter. If you want to worship someone it has to be God and only God.

^^^exactly what made me ask the question. WHY does he want to be worshipped? Why so adamant about it in the commandments?
What does he get?

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^exactly what made me ask the question. WHY does he want to be worshipped? Why so adamant about it in the commandments?
What does he get?

Well, if you respect the spirit of the commandments you shouldn't be destroying the rest of Creation. According to the Bible Creation is good, so you're at least keeping it in shape.

Not sure if God needs such thing, you can think it as a bonus.

You lost me.

Originally posted by riv6672
You lost me.

The Commandements preach respect on the Creation and according to the Bible the Creation is good, so the Commandements should protect it to some degree.

Color me dumb. Just not getting it.

Originally posted by Bentley
Well, if you respect the spirit of the commandments you shouldn't be destroying the rest of Creation. According to the Bible Creation is good, so you're at least keeping it in shape.

Not sure if God needs such thing, you can think it as a bonus.

You talk about not destroying creation, but then what was God doing when he flooded the world and killed everyone save one guy. Oh and the animals of course, the sweetheart spared the animals.

Which either means God is very confused, or he just feels "well, this shit doesn't actually apply to me".

But yes God doesn't technically *need* anything. Maybe a good therapist. But he definitely "wants" things, and it's hard to say he doesn't want us to worship him. If he didn't want that he wouldn't create specific rules saying how we totally need to worship him.

Don't get me wrong if I had god-like power I'd demand worship, but then..I'm a dick.

It's also time to be brutally honest with ourselves: if there is some immortal nigh omnipotent being in existence then whatever it does..it most likely does out of boredom. Not out of love or some grand plan or because it cares specifically about us as individuals. The universe is what..13-15 billion years old at the very least? Gotta pass the time somehow.

If we are going to be truly honest with ourselves, it's time we stop pretending we know what a nigh omnipotent being is thinking.

We have to try, otherwise there'd be no point in replying to the thread.

No, that's being both arrogant and ignorant. You either subscribe to a God or you don't. If you don't, you don't get to sit there and dissect his motives if he theoretically existed. I've had this discussion ad nauseam. The fallible don't get to pretend they understand the infallible.

Then you should stay the hell out of this thread, now that you've made your point, or you risk being part of the problem.

He is omnipotent/omnipresent/omniscient, he has his reasons, it's just none of us are allowed to know.

I tend to agree, but the whole point of this forum is to ask and conjecture, anyway.

All I could say is I believe in God.

He masturbates to all the worship.

So much for your last post.

Originally posted by psmith81992
No, that's being both arrogant and ignorant. You either subscribe to a God or you don't. If you don't, you don't get to sit there and dissect his motives if he theoretically existed. I've had this discussion ad nauseam. The fallible don't get to pretend they understand the infallible.

I don't see why they have a say. Atheists have as much of a say as anyone else.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I don't see why they have a say. Atheists have as much of a say as anyone else.

Sure but atheists like surfur are as ignorant as theists like star.

Originally posted by psmith81992
Sure but atheists like surfur are as ignorant as theists like star.

If the universe is infinite, then there is an infinite number of possibilities, and God must be one of them. However, there should also be a Superman and the flash. Perhaps the universe isn't infinite.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If the universe is infinite, then there is an infinite number of possibilities, and God must be one of them. However, there should also be a Superman and the flash. Perhaps the universe isn't infinite.

Uh...Pass what you're smoking?

Originally posted by psmith81992
Uh...Pass what you're smoking?

I didn't smoke anything.

Your point: No one should talk about something they cannot understand. Is that right? How could I talk about infinity when there is no way I could ever truly understand it? The fact is, I can. So, you are wrong. We can talk about things we can't understand.

Note: Perhaps if I did smoke something I would have an easier time expressing my self.

You're misunderstanding what God is looking for. He isn't seeking robotic devotion to feed His ego. He's looking for communication. He wants us to communicate with Him through prayer and devotion. He wants us to recognize that we have been separated from Him due to sin and the only way to reestablish the lost connection to Him is through faith in Christ Jesus. With the connection restored, we can communicate with him as a child would his/her parent. He is our Father. He wants us to communicate our problems to Him, express our fears to Him, etc. That is what God wants from us. He wants to be our Father. We need to be as loving and devoted to Him as we would our own parents.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
I didn't smoke anything.

Your point: No one should talk about something they cannot understand. Is that right? How could I talk about infinity when there is no way I could ever truly understand it? The fact is, I can. So, you are wrong. We can talk about things we can't understand.

Note: Perhaps if I did smoke something I would have an easier time expressing my self.

No, my point is don't talk about something as if you understand it when you really don't. IE (god is a mass murderer!!!)

psmith is upset because his god is a tyrant.

So much for him staying out of the thread.

Originally posted by psmith81992
No, my point is don't talk about something as if you understand it when you really don't. IE (god is a mass murderer!!!)

Why? If you take the bible literally, then you can draw that conclusion.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
Why? If you take the bible literally, then you can draw that conclusion.

And those that want to justify that God doesn't exist because A, B, or C or "I don't believe in God because he's a mass murderer", use the literal meanings of the bible to justify their rationale.

Originally posted by psmith81992
And those that want to justify that God doesn't exist because A, B, or C or "I don't believe in God because he's a mass murderer", use the literal meanings of the bible to justify their rationale.
And some Christians use the literal interpretation of the bible to condemn innocent people to a make-believe hell.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
And some Christians use the literal interpretation of the bible to condemn innocent people to a make-believe hell.

You've been there? You can verify hell is all make believe?

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
You've been there? You can verify hell is all make believe?

You have never seen a unicorn, so you can't say they don't exist.

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
You have never seen a unicorn, so you can't say they don't exist.

You just restated my point with a different example.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
You just restated my point with a different example.

I was hopping you would see how silly the argument is. Oh well...

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
If the universe is infinite, then there is an infinite number of possibilities, and God must be one of them. However, there should also be a Superman and the flash. Perhaps the universe isn't infinite.

We've discussed before that while your reasoning is right, the last word in your statement shouldn't be infinite but something more like "exhaustive". Infinite possibilities does not mean every possibility.

maybe god wins our souls from the devil. lets say that god and the devil made a wager, a kind of standing bet for all the souls of human kind. no direct action just influence

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
And some Christians use the literal interpretation of the bible to condemn innocent people to a make-believe hell.

And atheists/secularists use political ideology to condemn innocent people or justify mass murder. Point?

i don't

just saying

Originally posted by Shakyamunison
And some Christians use the literal interpretation of the bible to condemn innocent people to a make-believe hell.
No one is innocent.

You're right, no one is innocent, but Shaky is right in saying some Christians use the literal interpretation of the bible to condemn innocent people people they disagree with.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
You're misunderstanding what God is looking for. He isn't seeking robotic devotion to feed His ego. He's looking for communication. He wants us to communicate with Him through prayer and devotion. He wants us to recognize that we have been separated from Him due to sin and the only way to reestablish the lost connection to Him is through faith in Christ Jesus. With the connection restored, we can communicate with him as a child would his/her parent. He is our Father. He wants us to communicate our problems to Him, express our fears to Him, etc. That is what God wants from us. He wants to be our Father. We need to be as loving and devoted to Him as we would our own parents.



Beautiful post.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
You're misunderstanding what God is looking for. He isn't seeking robotic devotion to feed His ego. He's looking for communication. He wants us to communicate with Him through prayer and devotion. He wants us to recognize that we have been separated from Him due to sin and the only way to reestablish the lost connection to Him is through faith in Christ Jesus. With the connection restored, we can communicate with him as a child would his/her parent. He is our Father. He wants us to communicate our problems to Him, express our fears to Him, etc. That is what God wants from us. He wants to be our Father. We need to be as loving and devoted to Him as we would our own parents.

Communication can include dissent. God does not take kindly to that.

No, he doesnt seem to.

Originally posted by Bentley
We've discussed before that while your reasoning is right, the last word in your statement shouldn't be infinite but something more like "exhaustive". Infinite possibilities does not mean every possibility.

But "ever possibility" cannot be ruled out.

^^^Point.