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If Whis is a 15, Beerus a 10 and SSJG Goku a 6, what would

Super Vegetto
SSJ3 Vegetto
Rage Vegeta
Omega Shenron
SSJ4 Goku
SSJ4 Gogeta
Kamiccolo
Bootenks
Master Roshi
SSJ Broly

be?

1



Below Golden Freezer C:<



Less than 0.5



A very big number. Likely in the thousands.



An utterly negligible number.



Less than 1



Oh god. Um...

.000000000001? Something like that?

Edit:

Super Vegito : Less than 1.5
Hypothetical SSJ3 Vegito : Slightly below Bills
Bootenks : Less than 1
Rage Vegita : Less than .5

The GT characters are so far beyond Whis/Beerus that there is no point in even trying to quantify them on a sliding scale. They are hundreds/thousands of times more powerful.

As for Vegetto: I believe as a SSJ he would probably fall around the level of 30% Beerus(that would still make SSJG Goku 2x more powerful, which is fair.) If that is indeed the case, then a theoretical SSJ3 Vegetto(which would be 4x> SSJ) would be more powerful than Beerus, but still below Whis.

As for the rest of the Z characters: they are all weaker than 10% Beerus. The only exception is Bootenks, who would probably be around the level of 15% Beerus.

IMO.

question. If Beerus destroys a universe would you still consider GT superior?

Roshi has moon-busted. Goku hasn't.

Is Roshi>Goku, iyo?

You can give a simple yes or no.

Originally posted by bbrem123
question. If Beerus destroys a universe would you still consider GT superior?

Kinda depends on how it is done I think. But feats aren't the end all in DB as Galan pointed out. Feats aren't what makes people believe GT>Z in power

I know that. But come on now.

What if Goku only increased his power by x10 at the end of DBS. But at this level of power he can vaporize a universe with a gesture or better yet he becomes one with the universe. Would you still consider GT superior?

They are different universes. Different power increases can mean different things.

Don't get me wrong I get where you guys are coming from, but you need to draw a line somewhere...

Thanks for the input guys.

hahahaha. Hey wait Carver isn't even in this thread

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Thanks for the input guys.

Originally posted by bbrem123
hahahaha. Hey wait Carver isn't even in this thread

Oh, he is always watching

Originally posted by bbrem123
I know that. But come on now.

What if Goku only increased his power by x10 at the end of DBS. But at this level of power he can vaporize a universe with a gesture or better yet he becomes one with the universe. Would you still consider GT superior?

They are different universes. Different power increases can mean different things.

Don't get me wrong I get where you guys are coming from, but you need to draw a line somewhere...

In GT they became hundreds of times stronger tho. If in Super they can do all that but are technically weaker than Gt then I guess we would have to attribute it to the big fish small pond thing. Super is uber power in their own universe but if we put the GT squad in Super then they would be able to do all that and more

Kinda like what they do on death battle. Guy one might be the biggest baddest badass in his verse but that don't mean shit in guy two's world. So far GT is guy two. I really hope Super gets to a point that GT is the weaker so we don't have to talk about it as much but for now it isn't there yet

Idk about that though. DBS seems to be getting set up as guy two. They are at the beginning and have character being said to have the power to destroy a universe. Unknown to how they would but still.

These kinds of things only happened at the end of GT. Which has its own context behind it.



It is like an alternate Silver Surfer one shotting Thanos or something. Just because he did this doesn't mean that Surfer is superior to 616 Surfer.

Originally posted by bbrem123
Idk about that though. DBS seems to be getting set up as guy two. They are at the beginning and have character being said to have the power to destroy a universe. Unknown to how they would but still.

These kinds of things only happened at the end of GT. Which has its own context behind it.



It is like an alternate Silver Surfer one shotting Thanos or something. Just because he did this doesn't mean that Surfer is superior to 616 Surfer.

I have no issue with Super becoming stronger than GT. In fact I fully hope they do. But I can objectively say they aren't yet and not even close.

The destroy a universe thing was left ambiguous and it was said about Buu too. Fact is Beerus cannot one shot the universe unless specifically shown or canonized in some way. Saying he could destroy the verse could just as easily mean eventually since only Whis could stop him.

DBGT universe can be bigger and stronger than Z's or just operate differently. Doesn't mean it isn't currently more powerful. Mario is a good example here I think. He can do pretty much any darn thing in his verse but he would still get ripped apart by Kratos or Superman or or Goku or some other guy that can't do all the same stuff in their verse

Originally posted by juggerman
I have no issue with Super becoming stronger than GT. In fact I fully hope they do. But I can objectively say they aren't yet and not even close.

The destroy a universe thing was left ambiguous and it was said about Buu too. Fact is Beerus cannot one shot the universe unless specifically shown or canonized in some way. Saying he could destroy the verse could just as easily mean eventually since only Whis could stop him.

DBGT universe can be bigger and stronger than Z's or just operate differently. Doesn't mean it isn't currently more powerful. Mario is a good example here I think. He can do pretty much any darn thing in his verse but he would still get ripped apart by Kratos or Superman or or Goku or some other guy that can't do all the same stuff in their verse

I agree for the most part. DBS is very new. Not much has been established yet with it. I just wanted to clarify that these kinds of debates are very up in the air.

I get the multipliers and how they make GT uber but there is really nothing to back up that power. Which is why I brought up the destroying a universe example. Just shows that you really have to draw a line with GT power levels and how somebody "weaker" in multiplier terms can actually far superior power wise.

The any character in Super destroys the universe than Super will be more powerful than GT. Numbers be damned.

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Thanks for the input guys.



I hope carvie sees it.

Why do people think GT characters are >?

SSJ4 seemed roughly as strong as SSJGSSJ

Originally posted by NewGuy01
1



Below Golden Freezer C:<



Less than 0.5



A very big number. Likely in the thousands.



An utterly negligible number.



Less than 1



Oh god. Um...

.000000000001? Something like that? H...How powerful do you think SSJ4 Gogeta is?

Fusing with the Potara earring is a stronger fusing then with the Fusion dance.

Dozens of times stronger than a guy who's ten times stronger than SSJ4 Goku. Who's ten times stronger than SSJ3 Goku. Who's a couple hundred times stronger than his DBZ counterpart.

I do figure that he'd be a very large number.

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Thanks for the input guys.



Nice figures

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Dozens of times stronger than a guy who's ten times stronger than SSJ4 Goku. Who's ten times stronger than SSJ3 Goku. Who's a couple hundred times stronger than his DBZ counterpart.

I do figure that he'd be a very large number. He's... not that much stronger then SSJ3 Vegetto.

Also, Vegetto > Gogeta.

Originally posted by Damborgson


Nice figures

Unfortunately I couldn't find Roshi but yeah Piccolo and Vegetto rock^^.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Dozens of times stronger than a guy who's ten times stronger than SSJ4 Goku. Who's ten times stronger than SSJ3 Goku. Who's a couple hundred times stronger than his DBZ counterpart.

I do figure that he'd be a very large number.



Originally posted by Jmanghan
He's... not that much stronger then SSJ3 Vegetto.

Also, Vegetto > Gogeta.

It's not a hypothetical GT Vegetto. It's Z Vegetto.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW




It's not a hypothetical GT Vegetto. It's Z Vegetto. Gogeta still isn't THOUSANDS of times above him as NewGuy said.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
Why do people think GT characters are >?

SSJ4 seemed roughly as strong as SSJGSSJ

Base Goku was already superior to Buu, early in GT. He only got stronger after that.

Originally posted by Galan007
Base GT Goku~base Rildo, who was confirmed to be "even more powerful than Majin Boo." This means base GT Goku ~/> SSJ3 Z Goku.

That said, when GT Goku transformed into a SSJ, his PL would have increased by 50x. When he transformed into SSJ2, his PL would have increased by an additional 2x. When he transformed into SSJ3, his PL would have increased by an additional 4x.

As for SSJ4: we also know that Super Baby Vegeta 2(who was >> SSJ3 GT Goku) gained a 10x power increase when he became a Golden Oozaru. This is important because n00b SSJ4 Goku was on par with Golden Oozaru Baby. Subsequently, this means SSJ4 was more than 10x> SSJ3.

In a nutshell:
n00b SSJ4 Goku SSJ3 GT Goku SSJ2 GT Goku SSJ GT Goku base GT Goku base Rildo Majin Boo SSJ3 Z Goku base Z Goku.

OR we can simplify it by saying that n00b SSJ4 Goku was at least 4,000x> SSJ3 Z Goku.

Stupid as it sounds, that is the type of absurd power we're dealing with in GT.

And considering the fact that SSJ Baby Vegeta (before ascending to SBV1 and SBV2 forms) was not impressed at all with SSJ3 Goku, the SSJ4 amp had to be way more than 10x over SSJ3.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
And considering the fact that SSJ Baby Vegeta (before ascending to SBV1 and SBV2 forms) was not impressed at all with SSJ3 Goku, the SSJ4 amp had to be way more than 10x over SSJ3. When SSJ3 Goku fought SBV the first time, he was tailless. After regaining his tail, Goku's power increased across the board--so the multiplier is still applicable.

That said, SSJ4 IS more than 10x> SSJ3, because SSJ4 stalemated Oozaru-Baby, who was 10x> SBV2, who was >> SSJ3 Goku(peak.) So if we assume that SBV2 was between 1.5-2x> SSJ3, then it means SSJ4 would have gleaned him a 15-20x boost--which would make SSJ4 Goku between 6,000-8,000x> SSJ3 Z Goku... And remember: SSJ4 isn't a static transformation/multiplier--every Saiyan's boost is different. That's why we saw an even more insane increase when Vegeta went SSJ4.

However, I just like sticking with the 10x multiplier for SSJ4 Goku because it doesn't rely on speculation, and can be substantiated with concrete evidence as a baseline low-end figure.

This reading gave me a headache.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Base Goku was already superior to Buu, early in GT. He only got stronger after that.



And considering the fact that SSJ Baby Vegeta (before ascending to SBV1 and SBV2 forms) was not impressed at all with SSJ3 Goku, the SSJ4 amp had to be way more than 10x over SSJ3. 10x is still a whole lot depending on what his power level already was.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym


You question was stupid that's why no one answered.

You know jack shit about DBZ, apparently.

Originally posted by Henry_Pym

GT i will admit was shitty but currently Gogeta+Omega Shenron aint nothing to Beerus or Whis those who still believe it is a GTtard.

Originally posted by Galan007
The GT characters are so far beyond Whis/Beerus that there is no point in even trying to quantify them on a sliding scale. They are hundreds/thousands of times more powerful.

As for Vegetto: I believe as a SSJ he would probably fall around the level of 30% Beerus(that would still make SSJG Goku 2x more powerful, which is fair.) If that is indeed the case, then a theoretical SSJ3 Vegetto(which would be 4x> SSJ) would be more powerful than Beerus, but still below Whis.

As for the rest of the Z characters: they are all weaker than 10% Beerus. The only exception is Bootenks, who would probably be around the level of 15% Beerus.

IMO.

More or less I agree with you bar the fact that Ssj3 Vegetto would be 8X his Ssj counterpart, and not 4X: if you thus put Ssj Vegetto at 30% of Beerus, then his Ssj3 form would surpass even Whis by a decent margin (Ssj3 Vegetto would fall at 24 against Whis' 15).
Not that I've got anything against that.

Whoops, typo.

8x is correct.

Back in my day thousand-fold increases were as nothing in Dragon Ball.

http://i.imgur.com/JBllMby.jpg

And then you realize that Kami was only ~40% stronger than Popo.

That is also a non-canon scanlation.

Here's the VIZ dialogue:
http://i.imgur.com/YkLZEIX.jpg

What happened to Popo's legendary lips in the VIZ scan?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
What happened to Popo's legendary lips in the VIZ scan? I suppose Popo canonically doesn't have lips. http://i.imgur.com/jM7tLvm.png

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
What happened to Popo's legendary lips in the VIZ scan? VIZ went a more "PC" route with Popo, and downsized his lips in the manga.

Apparently they didn't want him so closely resembling this:
http://i.imgur.com/MKXY1wb.png

srug