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*Grievous has two sabers only

*Lightsabers only

*Canon versions only

Battle takes place on neutral ground

Even with four sabers Grievous dies

Vader because he is the greatest Lightsaber duelist the Sith Order has ever seen, obviously.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Vader because he is the greatest Lightsaber duelist the Sith Order has ever seen, obviously.

Nope.

Canon > Your opinion lol

Originally posted by carthage
Canon > Your opinion lol


It simply lists the top 5 lightsaber duelists. It never states they are in strength order.

That's some real lologic you got going on there.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That's some real lologic you got going on there.

Pot calling the kettle black if you really think that proves Vader is a superior duelist to Sidious.

That's not the pot calling the kettle black. You're complete disregarding a canon statement because you don't agree with it, where as I am using said statement to support my argument. Nothing hypocritical about that at all. Disney may have some dumb logic, but as the publisher, they're allowed to.

What was the source for that quote?

http://www.starwars.com/news/introducing-star-wars-absolutely-everything-you-need-to-know

http://i.imgur.com/Er6vbAI.jpg

This is incredible.

Vader has now transcended his master.

Only in skill at best, lol. Also, Ventress as a Sith?

Is there a Jedi ranking as well?

I don't know the ranking for the Jedi. Ask Ares he provided the quote.

That source's reliability doesn't seem high based on looks, but I'll accept it (to some level, Ventress is a Sith?).

God I hate Disney

Not technically, but she was allied with them and trained under Dooku. *shrug*

Ahsoka in S5 stated Ventress was a Sith.

Vader turns Grievous into spare parts for R2

Originally posted by SunRazer
Also, Ventress as a Sith?




No. She's a Red Lightsaber wielder.

Yeah, I missed that earlier.

I don't see why she wouldn't be a Sith, unless Disney has abandoned the term Dark Jedi or something.

Any reasons to why she wouldn't be?

Originally posted by SunRazer
Only in skill at best, lol. Also, Ventress as a Sith?

Is there a Jedi ranking as well?

It's a top 5 red lightsaber wielders, it doesn't specify if they're only Sith or darksiders in general.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Yeah, I missed that earlier.

Ah yes, another DK book. We had Vader beating Yoda and Kit beating Maul in the Legends DK books, lol.

So just to make sure SunRazer gets it now. It's not a Sith list

You seem very angry over this new development Nova.

Nope. I looked up some other lists they made and I'm not sure if they're in order.

What was the Jedi one?

Originally posted by SunRazer
Ah yes, another DK book. We had Vader beating Yoda and Kit beating Maul in the Legends DK books, lol.

DK?

Anyway as I said in the other thread:


Originally posted by Darth Thor
Ah it's just a top 5. Not Most Powerful, or Most Skilled, or even Best.

In the top 10 villains on the official site Tarkin was no.3 and Maul was no.4. Obviously doesn't mean Tarkin could take Maul in a fight.

Pretty sure it was red lightsaber wielders, Nova, not just Sith.

Yeah, it's in order of notoriety/fame, not actual rankings. lol

Originally posted by ILS
Pretty sure it was red lightsaber wielders, Nova, not just Sith.

stfu

Except read the actual descriptions. Also, Maul being more notorious than anyone is lulzworthy. And pretty sure he's more popular than Sidious too.

As a duelist Maul probably is more notorious.

All the people who know about Maul as duelist, are dead. Hard to be notorious then.

I meant out-of-universe fame, lol.

So Maul is apparently a better duelist than Dooku...right

Maul was always more skilled than Dooku.
Originally posted by SunRazer
I meant out-of-universe fame, lol.
Like I said. Sidious isn't more popular than Maul to the people Disney is marketing this book to.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That's not the pot calling the kettle black. You're complete disregarding a canon statement because you don't agree with it, where as I am using said statement to support my argument. Nothing hypocritical about that at all. Disney may have some dumb logic, but as the publisher, they're allowed to.

No...I'm not. Like Thor said its a Top 5 list, not a definitive power list. Not to mention all the makers of ROTS made it pretty clear Sidious is the best saber duelist.

Um... Vader a better duelists than Sidious? I wonder where it places Marek now.

Marek isn't canon.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Maul was always more skilled than Dooku.

Really? On what basis? Also, I have no idea whether this is one of those trolling incidents or if you're for real. lol

Originally posted by SunRazer
Really? On what basis? Also, I have no idea whether this is one of those trolling incidents or if you're for real. lol
On the basis that he's stronger, faster, more agile, and mastered all forms, for starters. What does Maul being a better duelist than Dooku have to do with trolling? Is it so unbelievable to you that Maul, someone who's been groomed since birth to be a Dark Lord of the Sith is superior to Palpatine's backup apprentice in sabers?

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
On the basis that he's stronger, faster, more agile, and mastered all forms, for starters. What does Maul being a better duelist than Dooku have to do with trolling? Is it so unbelievable to you that Maul, someone who's been groomed since birth to be a Dark Lord of the Sith is superior to Palpatine's backup apprentice in sabers? Are you seriously arguing that Maul is better then Dooku?

Dooku outdueled ****ing Windu for christ sakes, granted, it was before Dooku turned, but it certainly wasn't before Vaapad.

Originally posted by Jmanghan


Dooku outdueled ****ing Windu for christ sakes, granted, it was before Dooku turned, but it certainly wasn't before Vaapad.


That's Legends we're talking Canon here.


But I agree it's baseless to think TPM Maul > Dooku or even his Equal as a Saber duelist, just given their performances in Saber fights.


And yes, the list is talking about TPM Maul, as it mentions his lethality with his Saber Staff.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Are you seriously arguing that Maul is better then Dooku?

Dooku outdueled ****ing Windu for christ sakes, granted, it was before Dooku turned, but it certainly wasn't before Vaapad.
lol

No he didn't. He beat him in a sparring match and they are considered equals. The list being dumb, however doesn't really change the fact that it certainly isn't unbelievable. Maul is an excellent duelist and can definitely contend with the best in the mythos in sabers.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Maul is an excellent duelist and can definitely contend with the best in the mythos in sabers.


Well clearly not. We saw what happened when he went up against the best (or 1 of the 2 best)- Sidious.


Whilst Dooku's performance against the Other Best- Yoda seemed much more like "contending."

Dooku can't contend with Sidious either. When I say "the best of the mythos" I mean the higher tiers. Not the literal best.

The amount of butthurt I the SW community regarding this new ranking is hilarious.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Dooku can't contend with Sidious either. When I say "the best of the mythos" I mean the higher tiers. Not the literal best.


Point being Dooku's Saber performances are just superior to Maul's period. Maul's not even proven he's better than Kenobi, consistently stalemating him, whereas Dooku's trounced Kenobi 3/3 times.



Originally posted by carthage
The amount of butthurt I the SW community regarding this new ranking is hilarious.


Since I prefer Maul to Dooku, and Vader to Sidious, I really don't know what you're talking about.

I would happily accept those ranking when the combatants in question can prove that through feats, instead of just taking a "Top 5" ranking at face value.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Point being Dooku's Saber performances are just superior to Maul's period. Maul's not even proven he's better than Kenobi, consistently stalemating him, whereas Dooku's trounced Kenobi 3/3 times.

Maul's proven he's better than Kenobi on several occasions, the one time he's actually had a lesser showing is when he and Savage fought Kenobi in a place where they were at a clear disadvantage, and Kenobi at an advantage. That said, Kenobi's able to keep up with Anakin, who's above Dooku in Sabers.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Maul's proven he's better than Kenobi on several occasions,


Not in Sabers, no. The one time Maul was beating Kenobi in a Saber fight (Post-AOTC) was in Revenge. And Kenobi was winning that fight until he got distracted helping Ventress, and then started losing further when Maul Dun Moch'd him about Qui-Gon.


Originally posted by FreshestSlice
the one time he's actually had a lesser showing is when he and Savage fought Kenobi in a place where they were at a clear disadvantage, and Kenobi at an advantage.


I'd say being outnumbered is the bigger disadvantage. He was actually defending against both of them out in the Open for a short time as well.

Regardless in the same episode Maul and Kenobi had a 1 v 1 out in the open and Maul was not portrayed as superior in any way. They were fighting pretty evenly.




Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That said, Kenobi's able to keep up with Anakin, who's above Dooku in Sabers.


A very different fight considering they(Obi-Wan and Anakin) knew each others moves inside out, according to both the ROTS Novel, and Nick Gillard in the Making of ROTS.

Not buying the quote at all tbh.

Not sure why people think it's acceptable to start using this as solid proof, yet never use the old head to head series. We ignored that for a reason, just like we should with this one too.

Though tbh ROTJ Palpatine could very well be Vader's inferior with a blade.

^
100% agree <3

Originally posted by Selenial
Not buying the quote at all tbh.

Not sure why people think it's acceptable to start using this as solid proof, yet never use the old head to head series. We ignored that for a reason, just like we should with this one too.

Though tbh ROTJ Palpatine could very well be Vader's inferior with a blade.






Funny thing is it's not even a quote. It's a Top 5 list. Which is pretty meaningless IMO.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Not in Sabers, no. The one time Maul was beating Kenobi in a Saber fight (Post-AOTC) was in Revenge. And Kenobi was winning that fight until he got distracted helping Ventress, and then started losing further when Maul Dun Moch'd him about Qui-Gon.

Again, wasn't that in tight spaces?

And he was constantly on the retreat.

True.

That's great, but without skill to back it up, it really doesn't matter. Obi-Wan would need skill to match Anakin's to keep up with him in any capacity.

Originally posted by Selenial
Not buying the quote at all tbh.

Not sure why people think it's acceptable to start using this as solid proof, yet never use the old head to head series. We ignored that for a reason, just like we should with this one too.

Though tbh ROTJ Palpatine could very well be Vader's inferior with a blade.
No one's taking a comment from a children's book seriously, but the amount of butthurt over it is disgustingly high. The fact that no one can deny it's there also helps.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Again, wasn't that in tight spaces?


Didn't really think of that tbh. Either way, Maul has still failed to take Post-AOTC Kenobi in a fair Saber match up.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
And he was constantly on the retreat.


Well I wouldn't expect him to take them both on head on when out in the open.



Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That's great, but without skill to back it up, it really doesn't matter. Obi-Wan would need skill to match Anakin's to keep up with him in any capacity.

Oh I'm not trying to take credit away from Kenobi. He is one of the top level Council Members. But he needed that advantage against Anakin. And he's clearly not as good as Dooku.

Meh. http://images.killermovies.com/forums/customsmilies/uhuh.gif