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I know Cain and Abel describes the first murder, but is there a reference to the first suicide?
Both killing and killing yourself are sins, so, does suicide have a story or a name attached to it i'm unaware of?

no idea but i want to see where this goes

probs just something along the lines of "for only god may decide when to take life" Blah Blah Blah "to take a life or that of your own is not your divine right"

Is suicide actually a sin in the bible?

Originally posted by Mindset
Is suicide actually a sin in the bible?

It is technically. You sin against your body when you take your own life, although even this sin can be forgiven for those that have been saved. The bible however warns against dying in your sins so there's that as well. The bible is clear though, it clearly makes mention that only the sin of blasphemy is the one unforgivable sin, it also clearly states that besides that particular unforgivable sin that all sins are forgiven to those that love the lord and are saved under the blood of the lamb being Christ.

I don't want my words to be taken out of context, so I want to go a little further in saying that being saved isn't just confessing your sins, and undergoing the baptism of the Saints. A person must also repent of their sins, which is turning their backs on certain aspects of this world like fornication, lying, committing evil deeds for their own gain, etc.

Originally posted by Mindset
Is suicide actually a sin in the bible?

I'm not sure, but I do know that it says that suicide is painless. It brings on many changes.

Originally posted by Bardock42
I'm not sure, but I do know that it says that suicide is painless. It brings on many changes.

suicide is rarely painless


all i got from stoic is wibbley wobbley timey wimey

Thanks, Stoic.
Since there's no suicidal equivalent of Caine, i guess the answer isnt as cut and dried as i'd thought.

does it need to be the equivelent of cain
or even a old testiment verse for perople to believe god is saying we shouldnt?


like legit

Originally posted by riv6672
I know Cain and Abel describes the first murder, but is there a reference to the first suicide?
Both killing and killing yourself are sins, so, does suicide have a story or a name attached to it i'm unaware of?

I don't know about the first suicide, but the most prominent ones are definitely Samson and Judas, I think.

Huh!
I didnt even realize either had killed themselves. In Judas' case i assumed he'd gotten hung.

Samson basically suicide bombed himself to kill a whole bunch of Philistines (breaking the pillars of a large temple with his incredible strength and dying in the process).

For Judas there's multiple conflicting accounts, but the most common one is that he hung himself. To be honest I always thought Judas got a bad rap, like Jesus literally tells him he will betray him...talk about a self fulfilling prophecy.

Originally posted by Stoic
It is technically. You sin against your body when you take your own life

What about in cases where someone is terminally ill and in a lot of pain and so they take their own life?

On that note, what is the stance on euthanasia?

I also wonder about killing being a sin. The commandment says "thou shalt not kill" not "thou shalt not murder". Does this mean that killing someone is a sin no matter what? Even in self defense?

Originally posted by Surtur
What about in cases where someone is terminally ill and in a lot of pain and so they take their own life?

On that note, what is the stance on euthanasia?

I also wonder about killing being a sin. The commandment says "thou shalt not kill" not "thou shalt not murder". Does this mean that killing someone is a sin no matter what? Even in self defense?

It comes down to whether you know right from wrong, and treating others as you would be treated. I mean when you go fishing, you re technically killing to survive, but that was not what the bible meant by Thou shalt not kill. I'm pretty certain that it meant not to commit murder. As for euthanasia? It's a question of conviction. If your convictions are telling you that it is wrong, then it is. If you have no convictions over it then it isn't wrong. Sin begins within our minds, so if you believe that what you are doing is right, your judgement isn't the same as someone who believes the opposite.

Nothing negative in the bible about it. Samson killed himself and was a hero.

Nothing about maturbation, either. I masturbate constantly and I'm a hero!

Originally posted by Stoic
It comes down to whether you know right from wrong, and treating others as you would be treated. I mean when you go fishing, you re technically killing to survive, but that was not what the bible meant by Thou shalt not kill. I'm pretty certain that it meant not to commit murder. As for euthanasia? It's a question of conviction. If your convictions are telling you that it is wrong, then it is. If you have no convictions over it then it isn't wrong. Sin begins within our minds, so if you believe that what you are doing is right, your judgement isn't the same as someone who believes the opposite.
Thanks for keeping things on track. Appreciate the thought you put in.

Originally posted by long pig
Nothing negative in the bible about it. Samson killed himself and was a hero.

Nothing about maturbation, either. I masturbate constantly and I'm a hero!

1 Corinthians 6:19

What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

Originally posted by riv6672
Thanks for keeping things on track. Appreciate the thought you put in.

Although I believe in what I wrote is correct, the idea/s did not come from me, or I wasn't the first to say so. I was just trying to give examples of what was stated in the bible. Masturbation is a sin if anyone wanted to know, because you sin against your own flesh. The bible would call it abusing yourself from what I gather. It's one of those sins that apparently allows demons to legally bind themselves to people, because while other sins are done from outside of the temple, masturbation is done directly to the temple. This is one of the many reasons for marriage. So isn't it strange to see so much enmity between the sexes? On the other hand, suicide is most certainly a sin against your temple.

Riv you know what I find really funny? Well if we are unable to sense certain things, or scientifically prove the existence of something, it must not exist. It's kind of funny then that we are unable to see mental illnesses, but we all have them to one extent or the other.

Originally posted by Stoic
It comes down to whether you know right from wrong, and treating others as you would be treated. I mean when you go fishing, you re technically killing to survive, but that was not what the bible meant by Thou shalt not kill. I'm pretty certain that it meant not to commit murder. As for euthanasia? It's a question of conviction. If your convictions are telling you that it is wrong, then it is. If you have no convictions over it then it isn't wrong. Sin begins within our minds, so if you believe that what you are doing is right, your judgement isn't the same as someone who believes the opposite.

I see, but I thought the church was against stuff like euthanasia.

Originally posted by Surtur
I see, but I thought the church was against stuff like euthanasia.

They are, but it all really boils down to conviction. You aren't supposed to work on the Sabbath either, but Jesus spoke of reasons why such a law could and should be broken if the need arose.

As for work I thought it was that you are supposed to take one day of rest, but it doesn't necessarily have to be on a Sunday.

But wasn't the punishment for not taking a day of rest death?

Agreed, Stoic. Big time.
I believe the only normal people you know, are people you dont know very well.

Originally posted by Stoic

Riv you know what I find really funny? Well if we are unable to sense certain things, or scientifically prove the existence of something, it must not exist. It's kind of funny then that we are unable to see mental illnesses, but we all have them to one extent or the other.

We can sense and scientifically prove mental illnesses though.

Originally posted by Bardock42
We can sense and scientifically prove mental illnesses though.
No.

Originally posted by Bardock42
We can sense and scientifically prove mental illnesses though.
Technically.
I think its a gray area. Charles Manson is just an evil person. No matter what any psychiatrist says.

Originally posted by riv6672
Technically.
I think its a gray area. Charles Manson is just an evil person. No matter what any psychiatrist says.



But he also claims that he's both God and the devil. Of course, I guess to him Satan is God.

He just likes to talk shit.

Uh guys, Charles Manson believed there was going to be a race war between blacks and whites. He believed blacks would win(despite being vastly outnumbered) and he believed once they won they would not be skilled enough to run the country..so they would then hand over the reigns of power to Charlie and the family.

You can call him evil and he was, but he also most definitely held some beliefs that are more or less insane.

Having insane beliefs and being insane are different things.

We're tangenting, though; the point is, Bardock posted:



Long Pig replied:



I said it was a gray area (using Manson as an example). Which means i believe in mental illness, i just dont think everyone who does something terrible suffers from it.

He was at least partially insane though. Remember this guy thought the Beatles were talking specifically to him in their songs. He was not playing with a full deck.

Never got that Beatles thing; i'm an Elvis man.