Blue Marvel VS Hulk(DOC GREEN):TO THE DEATH

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LordofBrooklyn
Blue Marvel

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_small/6/66125/3447397-1471971_10151978036002488_1810577142_n.jpg

VERSUS

Hulk- Doc Green

http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/86a6712c5e0d3a5997d02b756dfccbbe.jpg

TO THE DEATH!!!

carver9
Doc

DarkSaint85
Can Hulk even be killed???

StiltmanFTW
Only when carver stops supporting him.

-K-M-
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Can Hulk even be killed???

Rulk killed him with Namor's trident in the Offenders story.

Loeb....nuff said

carver9
That was weird. I thought Loeb also wrote Rulk breaking Hulk's neck with him surviving.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Hulk is stronger, BM can fly and has his Antimatter powers, on top of that he is faster. I think this would be close. BM is strong enough to hurt Hulk and if he keeps his distance he wins more often than not.

Decter
Doc

carver9
Hulk has withstood antimatter. Hulk has blitzed fast opponents. Don't think either of what was said is the deciding factor here. Also, Hulk has long range attacks as well.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk has withstood antimatter. Hulk has blitzed fast opponents. Don't think either of what was said is the deciding factor here. Also, Hulk has long range attacks as well.

Hulk is fast but not as fast as Blue Marvel, Sentry or people with HH speed. If BM keeps his distance and evades Hulks long range attacks, which is simple enough with his speed, he can keep on blasting and hitting Hulk till he goes down.

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Hulk is fast but not as fast as Blue Marvel, Sentry or people with HH speed. If BM keeps his distance and evades Hulks long range attacks, which is simple enough with his speed, he can keep on blasting and hitting Hulk till Hulk becomes more powerful than ever.

Correction.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
Correction.

I disagree, Hulk can be dropped. What you suggest is a no limits fallacy.

zopzop
Blue Marvel. Doc Green is a joke.

carver9
Why is Doc a joke?

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
I disagree, Hulk can be dropped. What you suggest is a no limits fallacy.

He probably can but not the way you are suggesting.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
He probably can but not the way you are suggesting.

How else?

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
How else?

His fist.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
His fist.

So Blue Marvel can fist Hulk down? You know that's why I said? Using his speed and evading Hulk while unleashing blasts and punches on him at top speed. Kind of hit and run.

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
So Blue Marvel can fist Hulk down? You know that's why I said? Using his speed and evading Hulk while unleashing blasts and punches on him at top speed. Kind of hit and run.

Him running in punching Hulk in the face would most Def get him clobbered by someone who hits a lot harder. Remember, Doc has been shaking Planets and continents with his punches, something no Herald has been doing as of late. Doc has also been manhandling people with one arm that is as strong as BM. So yeah, BM gets koed...he isn't strong enough to drop this Hulk in a fist fight, even though that's his best bet.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
Him running in punching Hulk in the face would most Def get him clobbered by someone who hits a lot harder. Remember, Doc has been shaking Planets and continents with his punches, something no Herald has been doing as of late. Doc has also been manhandling people with one arm that is as strong as BM. So yeah, BM gets koed...he isn't strong enough to drop this Hulk in a fist fight, even though that's his best bet.

But how will Hulk hit him, he isn't as fast as BM and can't fly, while you agree that enough blows/blasts will bring Hulk down.

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
But how will Hulk hit him, he isn't as fast as BM and can't fly, while you agree that enough blows/blasts will bring Hulk down.

Unless Blue Marvel has shown he can consistently fight like Barry, then I'm not buying it. I go by on panel showings here and looking at BM fights against Hyperion, Ant Man, etc... he loves to fight up close and personal.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
Unless Blue Marvel has shown he can consistently fight like Barry, then I'm not buying it. I go by on panel showings here and looking at BM fights against Hyperion, Ant Man, etc... he loves to fight up close and personal.

Hyperion and Anti Man have the same level of Superspeed though. This comparision won't work here for the Hulk.

KingD19
A guy who nearly split the moon with a small chunk of metal and caught an asteroid the size of a state with no problem should be able to shake planets and continents with his punches as well.

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Hyperion and Anti Man have the same level of Superspeed though. This comparision won't work here for the Hulk.

A weakened Juggernaut matched Hyperion during a fist cuff. Then you have to prove that Hyperion and BM was moving at super speed. Show me some Anti Man speed fts please. Scans.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
A weakened Juggernaut matched Hyperion during a fist cuff. Then you have to prove that Hyperion and BM was moving at super speed. Show me some Anti Man speed fts please. Scans.

So you are telling me that Hulks only chance to win is Blue Marvel acting like Hyperion against Juggernaut? IOW BM being stupid enough to make it a slugfest, against Hulk? Well if this is your only argument why Hulk wins, sorry not buying it^^. This would require a lot of CIS.

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
So you are telling me that Hulks only chance to win is Blue Marvel acting like Hyperion against Juggernaut? IOW BM being stupid enough to make it a slugfest, against Hulk? Well if this is your only argument why Hulk wins, sorry not buying it^^. This would require a lot of CIS.

What showings of BM are you using that makes you think he will fight the ways you are suggesting?

deathslash
Originally posted by carver9
What showings of BM are you using that makes you think he will fight the ways you are suggesting? using his super speed to fly through Shuma gorath, using his super speed to fly across the world and battle ultimo, using his super speed to counter sentry's super speed?

carver9
Originally posted by deathslash
using his super speed to fly through Shuma gorath, using his super speed to fly across the world and battle ultimo, using his super speed to counter sentry's super speed?

So he is going to flu fast at Hulk? Do I need to post scans of Hulk busting people in the face attempting this? He also blind sided Shuma. Hulk has fts of slapping people that is coming at him at high speeds. Those speed fts doesn't prove that he will overwhelm Hulk. Also, show me him and Sentry fighting at high speeds.

DarkSaint85
In Carver's world, only if there are speed lines does it mean that speed is being used.

IOW, Damian Wayne is faster in combat than Blue Marvel/Sentry.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
In Carver's world, only if there are speed lines does it mean that speed is being used.

IOW, Damian Wayne is faster in combat than Blue Marvel/Sentry.

Naah, just proof. Do you have that proof?

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Naah, just proof. Do you have that proof?

Yep, of course I do.

Here is Robin, whilst poisoned, punching at superspeed:
http://i.imgur.com/80lyOPx.png

Agreed?

Why do we know it is at superspeed?

Because of the art.

Here is the Sentry/Blue Marvel fight:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7604/1031145-albm_05_009.jpg

They are NOT using superspeed.

How do we know?

Because of the art.

Never mind the fact that no body can punch slowly with that amount of power (imagine how fast your fist has to move to bloody BM). No, speedlines and manga style art is all that's needed.

Therefore, a weakened Damian is > Blue Marvel and Sentry in reaction speed.

deathslash
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yep, of course I do.

Here is Robin, whilst poisoned, punching at superspeed:
http://i.imgur.com/80lyOPx.png

Agreed?

Why do we know it is at superspeed?

Because of the art.

Here is the Sentry/Blue Marvel fight:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7604/1031145-albm_05_009.jpg

They are NOT using superspeed.

How do we know?

Because of the art.

Never mind the fact that no body can punch slowly with that amount of power (imagine how fast your fist has to move to bloody BM). No, speedlines and manga style art is all that's needed.

Therefore, a weakened Damian is > Blue Marvel and Sentry in reaction speed. wooo, logic.

-K-M-
Originally posted by KingD19
A guy who nearly split the moon with a small chunk of metal and caught an asteroid the size of a state with no problem should be able to shake planets and continents with his punches as well.

He did not nearly split the moon with a small chunk of metal (ie his medal). He physically punched the moon.

-----------

Originally posted by -K-M-
This is the "moon splitting feat" for Marvel.

1. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AdamBlueMarvel-013_zps4dded4ec.jpg
2. http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AdamBlueMarvel-014_zpsdc2f0485.jpg

People need to realize he PUNCHED the moon, he didn't throw the medal through the moon. He even returns years later to get the medal back which is still on the surface. Hell he is shown HOLDING the medal after he punches the moon just a few panels later

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yep, of course I do.

Here is Robin, whilst poisoned, punching at superspeed:
http://i.imgur.com/80lyOPx.png

Agreed?

Why do we know it is at superspeed?

Because of the art.

Here is the Sentry/Blue Marvel fight:
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/7604/1031145-albm_05_009.jpg

They are NOT using superspeed.

How do we know?

Because of the art.

Never mind the fact that no body can punch slowly with that amount of power (imagine how fast your fist has to move to bloody BM). No, speedlines and manga style art is all that's needed.

Therefore, a weakened Damian is > Blue Marvel and Sentry in reaction speed.

This applies to Hulk too, right?

DarkSaint85
Yes. Damian is > than Hulk, too. How much faster? I will count the number of fists in the same panel.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yes. Damian is > than Hulk, too. How much faster? I will count the number of fists in the same panel.

Are you saying Damian is faster than Hulk?

DarkSaint85
Based on your criteria of only using manga style speed lines, yes.

Shall I quote you where you use the art style to justify your opinion?

Note: I am only using your argument against you. I don't SERIOUSLY believe that Wayne>Hulk.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Based on your criteria of only using manga style speed lines, yes.

Shall I quote you where you use the art style to justify your opinion?

Note: I am only using your argument against you. I don't SERIOUSLY believe that Wayne>Hulk.

So super fast punches is the reason he is faster?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11111/111113173/4733800-hulk+grows+arms.jpg

celeyhyga17
To the death?
Blue Marvel.

Fisticuffs to the death?
Hulk.

Stoic
Originally posted by -K-M-
He did not nearly split the moon with a small chunk of metal (ie his medal). He physically punched the moon.

-----------

Looked like he threw the medal to me. Do you have that scan of him holding the medal several panels later? Actually why don't you post the entire sequence? Also whether or not he threw the medal, which nearly splits the moon in half or punches it, doesn't that show WW Hulk level strength alone? Is that not enough power to shake the planet?


I think I missed the Doc Green showing of him shaking the planet. Anyone have those scans?

carver9
He did throw a medal.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
So super fast punches is the reason he is faster?

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11111/111113173/4733800-hulk+grows+arms.jpg

So as Robin has 6 punches in the same scan, using your logic, Robin is 2x as fast as Hulk?

Note, again - I never said that the art equals speed. YOU, Carver, are the one arguing that just because there are no manga style speed lines, there is no speed.

How fast do you think BM's fists are when they punch Sentry? When he throws a medal to the moon?

80sBaby
Nearly splitting a moon by throwing a small medal seems more impressive than doing so via punching.

Anyways, "to the death" favors Hulk.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by carver9
That was weird. I thought Loeb also wrote Rulk breaking Hulk's neck with him surviving.

Only arm.

http://i.stack.imgur.com/Tgy1h.jpg

He got choked out after that.

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
He did throw a medal.

That's what it looked like to me. But no matter how he hit the moon, it still shows planet shaking power. Do you have any scans of Doc Green shaking the planet? My attention span for most things Marvel has diminished. The new Secret Wars was really handled very poorly.

-K-M-
Originally posted by -K-M-
Wow he didn't throw the medal through the moon, he is shown a few panels later still HOLDING the medal (of bravery) and then he tosses it to the ground gently and flys away. Years later he returns and finds the medal exactly where he threw it.

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j165/A_Flight10/AdamBlueMarvel-015_zpsee6b0978.jpg

That medal sure must be pretty durable to be able to split a moon in half

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So as Robin has 6 punches in the same scan, using your logic, Robin is 2x as fast as Hulk?

Note, again - I never said that the art equals speed. YOU, Carver, are the one arguing that just because there are no manga style speed lines, there is no speed.

How fast do you think BM's fists are when they punch Sentry? When he throws a medal to the moon?

This is when context must supersede the artwork. Let's all remember
that the artist attempts to follow the story and not the story trying to
follow the artwork.

DarkSaint85
This is what people are referring to:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/4/40000/1306707-adam_blue_marvel__013.jpg

So no, he COULD have. But he didn't.

StiltmanFTW
What is that f*cking medal made out from? laughing out loud

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So as Robin has 6 punches in the same scan, using your logic, Robin is 2x as fast as Hulk?

Note, again - I never said that the art equals speed. YOU, Carver, are the one arguing that just because there are no manga style speed lines, there is no speed.

How fast do you think BM's fists are when they punch Sentry? When he throws a medal to the moon?

Hulk has 6 punches as well.

Also, do you think Blue Marvel and Sentry are fighting at super speed? If so, why?

-K-M-
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
What is that f*cking medal made out from? laughing out loud

Bravery!!!! But he is shown still holding it later and gently tosses it to the ground

Stoic
Originally posted by -K-M-
That medal sure must be pretty durable to be able to split a moon in half

Thank you. I fully agree with you. i never noticed that detail. Great catch
you should take up photography, and I'm not saying that to be sarcastic
you have decent spacial awareness skills. Again great catch.

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
That's what it looked like to me. But no matter how he hit the moon, it still shows planet shaking power. Do you have any scans of Doc Green shaking the planet? My attention span for most things Marvel has diminished. The new Secret Wars was really handled very poorly.

He did it when fighting the Alternate Hulk and did it here as well.

Originally posted by carver9
Hulk and Rulk fight again and Hulk shows some martial arts skill. He also stomps Rulk proving he is the Omega and the planet is shaking during their scuffle. Hulk has shown time and time again that he has the best punching power in comics.


http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952948_Hulk_2014-_015-004.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952950_Hulk_2014-_015-005.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952952_Hulk_2014-_015-006.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952954_Hulk_2014-_015-007.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952956_Hulk_2014-_015-008.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952958_Hulk_2014-_015-009.jpg http://s5d1.turboimagehost.com/t1/22952960_Hulk_2014-_015-010.jpg

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk has 6 punches as well.

Also, do you think Blue Marvel and Sentry are fighting at super speed? If so, why?

In total.

Look at Robin's again. He has six punches just with his right hand. Five with his left. Prob one off panel, so let's round up to 12 punches in one panel.

Whereas Hulk has 6 total. So 12, vs 2, is 2x as fast.

Let me focus in for you. Note, I am not using the later panel, which shows even MORE punches - because it makes Hulk look worse.

Bear in mind, too, that Robin is poisoned.

http://s5.postimg.org/6lwkgodg7/80ly_OPx.png

Again, this is using your logic of relying on art.

Why do I think they are at speed? Go get a punching bag. Try and punch it hard. Imagine you are punching/throwing a medal hard it enough to potentially crack the moon in half.

How fast do you think your fist is moving then?

Imagine how fast the Sentry can fly. Now imagine him being punched so hard he flies into orbit, through a space station (at the end of his flight), and he still continues along his flight path. All against his will.

Imagine how fast BM's fist was flying at the moment of impact. Going back to my example, imagine trying to send that punching bag flying away from you. Punch fast, then slow. Which speed makes the bag fly further?

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
He did it when fighting the Alternate Hulk and did it here as well.

Carver, not to scrutinize the hell out of that scene, but Rulk was
a part of the reason behind all of that shaking going on.

StiltmanFTW
@carvster

That fight was pretty awesome.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Stoic
Looked like he threw the medal to me. Do you have that scan of him holding the medal several panels later? Actually why don't you post the entire sequence? Also whether or not he threw the medal, which nearly splits the moon in half or punches it, doesn't that show WW Hulk level strength alone? Is that not enough power to shake the planet?


I think I missed the Doc Green showing of him shaking the planet. Anyone have those scans?
Naw..

He punched the moon. He threw the medal after.

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
Carver, not to scrutinize the hell out of that scene, but Rulk was
a part of the reason behind all of that shaking going on.

Yeah. It was a shared ft.

carver9
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
@carvster

That fight was pretty awesome.

Loved it. It was a good showing for Rulk as well who needed that.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
In total.

Look at Robin's again. He has six punches just with his right hand. Five with his left. Prob one off panel, so let's round up to 12 punches in one panel.

Whereas Hulk has 6 total. So 12, vs 2, is 2x as fast.

Let me focus in for you. Note, I am not using the later panel, which shows even MORE punches - because it makes Hulk look worse.

Bear in mind, too, that Robin is poisoned.

http://s5.postimg.org/6lwkgodg7/80ly_OPx.png

Again, this is using your logic of relying on art.

Why do I think they are at speed? Go get a punching bag. Try and punch it hard. Imagine you are punching/throwing a medal hard it enough to potentially crack the moon in half.

How fast do you think your fist is moving then?

Imagine how fast the Sentry can fly. Now imagine him being punched so hard he flies into orbit, through a space station (at the end of his flight), and he still continues along his flight path. All against his will.

Imagine how fast BM's fist was flying at the moment of impact. Going back to my example, imagine trying to send that punching bag flying away from you. Punch fast, then slow. Which speed makes the bag fly further?

So if I provide a scene of Hulk punching someone out of orbit...Doc Green, that should suffice huh?

Stoic
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Naw..

He punched the moon. He threw the medal after.

Yes I agree, it was a detail that I didn't notice when I first read it. Still
though, to hit the moon once and nearly split it shows a decent amount
of punching power.

carver9
Does it here as well.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22837414/Hulk_2014-_014-012.jpg.html

Remember, Rulk was amped to the 9th degree.

Stoic
Earth weighs 81 times more than the moon. The moon's density is 3.34 grams per cubic centimeter (3.34 g/cm3). That is about 60 percent of Earth's density.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
So if I provide a scene of Hulk punching someone out of orbit...Doc Green, that should suffice huh?

Erm, I don't think you know what you're arguing, lol.

Your original point was asking where were Sentry/BM fighting at superspeed.

My point was, just because they didn't have manga style speed lines and afterflickers, doesn't mean they weren't at high speed. The fact they were drawing blood and punching fliers into orbit is proof that their fists were moving at superspeed (you can't punch hard and slow at the same time).

So not sure what your Doc Green orbit punches have to do with Sentry/BM's fight, lol.

carver9
Blue Marvel didn't split the moon in half though. It was said he could've did it. That's completely different than him doing it.

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
Does it here as well.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22837414/Hulk_2014-_014-012.jpg.html

Remember, Rulk was amped to the 9th degree.

Rulk shook the planet when he hit A-Bomb as well. Do you remember?

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Erm, I don't think you know what you're arguing, lol.

Your original point was asking where were Sentry/BM fighting at superspeed.

My point was, just because they didn't have manga style speed lines and afterflickers, doesn't mean they weren't at high speed. The fact they were drawing blood and punching fliers into orbit is proof that their fists were moving at superspeed (you can't punch hard and slow at the same time).

So not sure what your Doc Green orbit punches have to do with Sentry/BM's fight, lol.

You brought up BM punching Sentry out of orbit as a speed ft. Anyways, the reason you gave of them fighting at high speeds isn't legit.

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Erm, I don't think you know what you're arguing, lol.

Your original point was asking where were Sentry/BM fighting at superspeed.

My point was, just because they didn't have manga style speed lines and afterflickers, doesn't mean they weren't at high speed. The fact they were drawing blood and punching fliers into orbit is proof that their fists were moving at superspeed (you can't punch hard and slow at the same time).

So not sure what your Doc Green orbit punches have to do with Sentry/BM's fight, lol.

Yes let's deal with first things first. my point was just to say that BM has
comparable punching power to even the best out there.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
You brought up BM punching Sentry out of orbit as a speed ft. Anyways, the reason you gave of them fighting at high speeds isn't legit.

Yes, because it is.

Try punching something hard, but slowly at the same time. Go on. Make it out of tinfoil if you want.

Let me guess, you HAD to punch with your fist moving quickly, correct?? Yes or no.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Stoic
Yes let's deal with first things first. my point was just to say that BM has
comparable punching power to even the best out there.

thumb up

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yes, because it is.

Try punching something hard, but slowly at the same time. Go on. Make it out of tinfoil if you want.

Let me guess, you HAD to punch with your fist moving quickly, correct?? Yes or no.

So him punching someone out of orbit is the speed ft?

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
Yes let's deal with first things first. my point was just to say that BM has
comparable punching power to even the best out there.

Naah, he really doesn't.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
So him punching someone out of orbit is the speed ft?

Yup.

Now, please answer my question.

Why do you NOT think there was any speed present? Is it because of the art?

Don't dodge. Everytime you ask a point blank question, I answer it. So answer mine.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yup.

Now, please answer my question.

Why do you NOT think there was any speed present? Is it because of the art?

Don't dodge. Everytime you ask a point blank question, I answer it. So answer mine.

I don't think any speed was going on during their battle because nothing was given to me to make me believe either were moving super fast.

So BM punching him out of orbit is the speed ft? So if I post Hulk doing the same, that means he can match BM?

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
So him punching someone out of orbit is the speed ft?

No fighting someone that has super speed and staying at their level is considered to be a character capable of moving at super speed. When Gladiator fought Hyperion in space, it may not have appeared to be them moving at super speed but they probably were. Why wouldn't they be if they were both trying to beat each other? if they were trying to beat each other, and they both possess super speed, then why wouldn't they be using it? i mean they are trying to win right? BM has legit super speed, as does the Sentry, and King Hyperion.

Also when you say that BM doesn't have comparable punching power to the best out there, this kind of sort of paints you into a corner, especially since some of the best have yet to even nearly split the moon with one punch.

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
I don't think any speed was going on during their battle because nothing was given to me to make me believe either were moving super fast.

So BM punching him out of orbit is the speed ft? So if I post Hulk doing the same, that means he can match BM?

The Hulk is certainly fast, and he does have super speed. I don't think he moves as fast as the Sentry, or BM does though. He has crazy reaction time feats as well.

LordofBrooklyn
Carver, a warning.

If you continue down this path you will leave me no choice.

I will don my FOOLKILLER ARMOR and do what must be done!!!

StiltmanFTW
That won't bring Boardwalker back, LoB.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Stoic
No fighting someone that has super speed and staying at their level is considered to be a character capable of moving at super speed. When Gladiator fought Hyperion in space, it may not have appeared to be them moving at super speed but they probably were. Why wouldn't they be if they were both trying to beat each other? if they were trying to beat each other, and they both possess super speed, then why wouldn't they be using it? i mean they are trying to win right? BM has legit super speed, as does the Sentry, and King Hyperion.

Also when you say that BM doesn't have comparable punching power to the best out there, this kind of sort of paints you into a corner, especially since some of the best have yet to even nearly split the moon with one punch.
Actually narration catalogued their speed in one of the panels (in the nanoseconds). It kind of gives you the idea that their encounter was happening at super speed.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-BkMQI5H6ts0/TeX33kElppI/AAAAAAAABAE/87Z_BqVGEa4/s1600/Quasar-54-20.jpg

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
No fighting someone that has super speed and staying at their level is considered to be a character capable of moving at super speed. When Gladiator fought Hyperion in space, it may not have appeared to be them moving at super speed but they probably were. Why wouldn't they be if they were both trying to beat each other? if they were trying to beat each other, and they both possess super speed, then why wouldn't they be using it? i mean they are trying to win right? BM has legit super speed, as does the Sentry, and King Hyperion.

Also when you say that BM doesn't have comparable punching power to the best out there, this kind of sort of paints you into a corner, especially since some of the best have yet to even nearly split the moon with one punch.

Hulk has fought everyone in M.U (minus abstracts of course) and kept up fine with them. If fighting someone is all it takes to prove that someone is a high speed pacer then Hulk beats everyone in this field. Hulk has fought Sentry and Hyperion as well. Don't understand what this have to do with the discussion at hand.

He didn't split the moon though and even then, those fts are not comparable at all to the best of punchers out there. You are literally comparing him to a being that has reversed time with a punch, punch through a time stream, punching...you get the point. BM is good but that moon showing doesn't compare to what Hulk has done. Not even close.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk has fought everyone in M.U

No.

He has fought your mom, though stick out tongue

carver9
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
No.

He has fought your mom, though stick out tongue

Lol...whatever Stilt.

StiltmanFTW
Hulk has yet to fight guys like Magneto, Ikaris or Mister Sinister.

Stoic
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Actually narration catalogued their speed in one of the panels (in the nanoseconds). It kind of gives you the idea that their encounter was happening at super speed.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-BkMQI5H6ts0/TeX33kElppI/AAAAAAAABAE/87Z_BqVGEa4/s1600/Quasar-54-20.jpg


All without the multiple punches and speed lines no less. BM is also
cataloged as a being capable of near light speed, but his upper limits
have yet to be tested. I recall that Quasar had faster flight speed than
Hyperion as well, so draw your own conclusions.

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk has fought everyone in M.U (minus abstracts of course) and kept up fine with them. If fighting someone is all it takes to prove that someone is a high speed pacer then Hulk beats everyone in this field. Hulk has fought Sentry and Hyperion as well. Don't understand what this have to do with the discussion at hand.

He didn't split the moon though and even then, those fts are not comparable at all to the best of punchers out there. You are literally comparing him to a being that has reversed time with a punch, punch through a time stream, punching...you get the point. BM is good but that moon showing doesn't compare to what Hulk has done. Not even close.


We have no idea how much force was used to break or overload
the time dilation device, or to pierce dimensional barriers though.
Those feats can not be quantified for good or ill. I know that the Hulk
has a level of super speed this is not the question, and it wasn't my
argument as you recall. What I'm saying is that there are some top
tiers than have yet to nearly split the moon with one punch. PIS
dictates that the writers aren't going to allow any one character to
split the moon, unless they have a means of fixing it up after.

Now if you want to go an extra mile, Black Bolt (Skrull) put out less
power than BM when he fought WW Hulk on the moon. Just something
to mull over.

Sin I AM
Originally posted by carver9
You are literally comparing him to a being that has reversed time with a punch, punch through a time stream, punching...you get the point. BM is good but that moon showing doesn't compare to what Hulk has done. Not even close.

Well if u think about it. BMs feat is better because it's quantifiable and not riddled with context

Stoic
@Carver, I have to agree with you on one thing. Blue Marvel does not have the feats to defeat WW Hulk, but I can see him beating Doc Green, and doing extremely well against Savage Hulk, perhaps taking him out before he ramps up enough strength to make the mightiest irrelevant in a punch out, but Grey Hulk, and merged Hulk who are not in this thread would lose IMO. Doc Green? The more I think about it, the more I really can not see him winning. You can post all of the Savage Hulk scans you want to, but that's not Doc Green. Indestructible Hulk isn't Doc Green either.

carver9
Originally posted by Sin I AM
Well if u think about it. BMs feat is better because it's quantifiable and not riddled with context

Doesn't make sense. Quantify Blue Marvel ALMOST breaking the moon in half. I'll wait.

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
@Carver, I have to agree with you on one thing. Blue Marvel does not have the feats to defeat WW Hulk, but I can see him beating Doc Green, and doing extremely well against Savage Hulk, perhaps taking him out before he ramps up enough strength to make the mightiest irrelevant in a punch out, but Grey Hulk, and merged Hulk who are not in this thread would lose IMO. Doc Green? The more I think about it, the more I really can not see him winning. You can post all of the Savage Hulk scans you want to, but that's not Doc Green. Indestructible Hulk isn't Doc Green either.

Doc Green was said to be Indestructible Hulk with intelligence. Indestructible Hulk fts PLUS Doc Green fts (same being) poops on anything Blue Marvel has done. Also, Hulk is Hulk.

Sin I AM
Originally posted by carver9
Doesn't make sense. Quantify Blue Marvel ALMOST breaking the moon in half. I'll wait.

Well that would be easy. But id have to use rl math which is an exercise in semantics...bit it's an easy enough number to ascertain

carver9
Originally posted by Sin I AM
Well that would be easy. But id have to use rl math which is an exercise in semantics...bit it's an easy enough number to ascertain

Ok. Don't forget the word "almost".

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by carver9
Hulk is Hulk.

You're even talking like the Hulk now...

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
Doc Green was said to be Indestructible Hulk with intelligence. Indestructible Hulk fts PLUS Doc Green fts (same being) poops on anything Blue Marvel has done. Also, Hulk is Hulk.

And Merged Hulk is just Savage Hulk with intelligence, and the killer instinct of Mr. Fixit. Hulk is not Hulk, and his strength durability, speed and other stats depend on his particular mind set. The Green Scar was the only Hulk to date capable of consciously controlling his strength-o-meter.

So same body different mind. Was Rulk amped to the 9th degree when he turned Doc Green around and broke his arm like he did to Savage Hulk? Sentry, King Hyperion, and Blue Marvel would beat the life out of Rulk, I mean Wonder man kicked his face in. My entire argument is that regardless of the nay sayers, Blue Marvel is one of MU's top tier characters. All of the low balling and BS is just haters not liking him for whatever reason. Most likely being a Black top tier pee's in a lot of bowls of cereal.

Sin I AM
Originally posted by carver9
Ok. Don't forget the word "almost".

Hulk almost cracked the eastern seaboard u dont see me pissin in your coffee

celeyhyga17
Hulk IS Hulk..

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
And Merged Hulk is just Savage Hulk with intelligence, and the killer instinct of Mr. Fixit. Hulk is not Hulk, and his strength durability, speed and other stats depend on his particular mind set. The Green Scar was the only Hulk to date capable of consciously controlling his strength-o-meter.

So same body different mind. Was Rulk amped to the 9th degree when he turned Doc Green around and broke his arm like he did to Savage Hulk? Sentry, King Hyperion, and Blue Marvel would beat the life out of Rulk, I mean Wonder man kicked his face in. My entire argument is that regardless of the nay sayers, Blue Marvel is one of MU's top tier characters. All of the low balling and BS is just haters not liking him for whatever reason. Most likely being a Black top tier pee's in a lot of bowls of cereal.

Doc Green ALLOWED Rulk to do that and beat up on him so that he could get a sample of how to revert him back to Ross. If Blue Marvel allowed Rulk to break his arm, yes, it is happening. He is strong enough to do it.

Also, the second fight, yes, Rulk was amped. Amped to the point that Doc (who pretty much knows every hero and villain on Earth) said that no force on Earth would be able to stop him if he doesn't do it right then. And yes, Doc knows about Blue Marvel.

When Rulk broke Savage Arm, he was using his absorption abilities during that time. He was powerful enough to stomp Odin Force Thor.

No one said BM wasn't top tier but he hasn't done anything to put him above Hulk or give him an advantage against Hulk. Hell, Shield didn't even think Blue Marvel could stop Hulk. They had to send another Hulk out to fight Doc Green and Blue Marvel was on the ship as one of the recruits.

Like I've said before Doc Green aka indestructible Hulk; his fts poops on Blue Marvel.

carver9
Originally posted by Sin I AM
Hulk almost cracked the eastern seaboard u dont see me pissin in your coffee

Who brought up the Eastern sea board? That happened with him just taking a footstep. If he would've started walking, as he stated, it would've cracked the planet in half. Doesn't matter since I did not bring that ft up.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by carver9
Doc Green ALLOWED Rulk to do that and beat up on him so that he could get a sample of how to revert him back to Ross. If Blue Marvel allowed Rulk to break his arm, yes, it is happening. He is strong enough to do it.

Also, the second fight, yes, Rulk was amped. Amped to the point that Doc (who pretty much knows every hero and villain on Earth) said that no force on Earth would be able to stop him if he doesn't do it right then. And yes, Doc knows about Blue Marvel.

When Rulk broke Savage Arm, he was using his absorption abilities during that time. He was powerful enough to stomp Odin Force Thor.

No one said BM wasn't top tier but he hasn't done anything to put him above Hulk or give him an advantage against Hulk. Hell, Shield didn't even think Blue Marvel could stop Hulk. They had to send another Hulk out to fight Doc Green and Blue Marvel was on the ship as one of the recruits.

Like I've said before Doc Green aka indestructible Hulk; his fts poops on Blue Marvel.
Blue Marvel poops on your face.

Btw, Rulk beat Doc Green...

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
Doc Green ALLOWED Rulk to do that and beat up on him so that he could get a sample of how to revert him back to Ross. If Blue Marvel allowed Rulk to break his arm, yes, it is happening. He is strong enough to do it.

Also, the second fight, yes, Rulk was amped. Amped to the point that Doc (who pretty much knows every hero and villain on Earth) said that no force on Earth would be able to stop him if he doesn't do it right then. And yes, Doc knows about Blue Marvel.

When Rulk broke Savage Arm, he was using his absorption abilities during that time. He was powerful enough to stomp Odin Force Thor.

No one said BM wasn't top tier but he hasn't done anything to put him above Hulk or give him an advantage against Hulk. Hell, Shield didn't even think Blue Marvel could stop Hulk. They had to send another Hulk out to fight Doc Green and Blue Marvel was on the ship as one of the recruits.

Like I've said before Doc Green aka indestructible Hulk; his fts poops on Blue Marvel.

I'm talking about the first fight that they had, not when Rulk was amped
in the second fight. What you're saying makes little sense. If Doc Green
was dominant enough to beat Rulk in the first showing, he would have
knocked him out, and taken the sample forcibly. Rulk wouldn't have
broken BM's arm, not if he can't even defeat Wonder Man. Or are you
saying that Wonder Man is above BM as well? Why not go the extra
and say that Wonder man is above King Hyperion as well? You seem
ready to spin the tale to suit a skewed perspective, but unable to do
the same for BM when he beat King Hyperion up. The only difference
here is that Rulk beat Doc Green in the first fight, while King Hyperion
only stunned Blue Marvel only to get hit with more force than he could
take. Doc Green and the Indestructible Hulk are two different Hulk's.
Same body different mind set. The Hulk gets his power from his mind.
But if you want to play that game, I guess we should say that Merged
Hulk and Indestructible Hulk are also the same. Or that Indestructible
Hulk is the Green Scar.

Doc Green struggled against Rulk, while BM beat King Hyperion. We
saw Doc Green pushed to the limit by Rulk. There is no way that Rulk
is beating BM. Not even close.

Genii96
blue marvel wins this....

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Ok. Don't forget the word "almost".

Why should she?

The words from the Watcher clearly state you COULD have split the moon in two, not you ALMOST split the moon in two. YOU'RE the one changing the text.

Others have calculated it. The answer is 3x10^28 Joules. Or, IOW, 10^13 large nukes of a megaton in energy.

So the Watcher was telling BM, you COULD have split the moon, so he believes BM is fully capable of outputting that amount of energy.

The Sorrow
Doc Green doesn't have many feats but he is still the Hulk. Snapping an amped Rulks arm like he did was impressive, if he is that enraged against Blue Marvel I don't see him losing this.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Why should she?

The words from the Watcher clearly state you COULD have split the moon in two, not you ALMOST split the moon in two. YOU'RE the one changing the text.

Others have calculated it. The answer is 3x10^28 Joules. Or, IOW, 10^13 large nukes of a megaton in energy.

So the Watcher was telling BM, you COULD have split the moon, so he believes BM is fully capable of outputting that amount of energy.

So "could have" is a solid argument to you?

StiltmanFTW
Hulk is Hulk!

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
So "could have" is a solid argument to you?

Hell of a lot of difference to 'almost', which is what you were saying he said.

You almost had a point.
You COULD have had a point.

See the difference?

Not to mention, it's also the person saying it which makes a difference.

If Reed says, 'Hulk, you could have destroyed the Eastern Seaboard', that is a hell of a difference than Carver9 saying 'Hulk almost destroyed the Eastern Seaboard'.

StiltmanFTW
HULK

IS

HULK

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
HULK

IS

HULK

Nana na nana

HULK IS HULK

Nana na nana

StiltmanFTW
laughing out loud

thumb up

http://thefifthbranch.com/images/oldies/bravebold/bathulk.jpg

DarkSaint85
hULK iS hULK?

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
I'm talking about the first fight that they had, not when Rulk was amped
in the second fight. What you're saying makes little sense. If Doc Green
was dominant enough to beat Rulk in the first showing, he would have
knocked him out, and taken the sample forcibly. Rulk wouldn't have
broken BM's arm, not if he can't even defeat Wonder Man. Or are you
saying that Wonder Man is above BM as well? Why not go the extra
and say that Wonder man is above King Hyperion as well? You seem
ready to spin the tale to suit a skewed perspective, but unable to do
the same for BM when he beat King Hyperion up. The only difference
here is that Rulk beat Doc Green in the first fight, while King Hyperion
only stunned Blue Marvel only to get hit with more force than he could
take. Doc Green and the Indestructible Hulk are two different Hulk's.
Same body different mind set. The Hulk gets his power from his mind.
But if you want to play that game, I guess we should say that Merged
Hulk and Indestructible Hulk are also the same. Or that Indestructible
Hulk is the Green Scar.

Doc Green struggled against Rulk, while BM beat King Hyperion. We
saw Doc Green pushed to the limit by Rulk. There is no way that Rulk
is beating BM. Not even close.

The first fight they had, you are correct, Rulk wasn't amped but Hulk allowed him to pound on him to get samples of turning him back to Ross. They had a total of 3 fights and during 2 of those, Rulk was amped.

The second fight, Rulk tells us he was absorbing large quantities of radiation and yes, he temp koed Hulk who thrashed him the second go round. So, Rulk wasn't amped during the first fight and Doc allowed him to pound on him for access on how to depower him. The second and 3rd fight, Rulk was amped.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by carver9
The first fight they had, you are correct, Rulk wasn't amped but Hulk allowed him to pound on him to get samples of turning him back to Ross. They had a total of 3 fights and during 2 of those, Rulk was amped.

The second fight, Rulk tells us he was absorbing large quantities of radiation and yes, he temp koed Hulk who thrashed him the second go round. So, Rulk wasn't amped during the first fight and Doc allowed him to pound on him for access on how to depower him. The second and 3rd fight, Rulk was amped.
I thought Deadpool sniped him with something that disabled his radiation absorption powers...

carver9
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
I thought Deadpool sniped him with something that disabled his radiation absorption powers...

He sniped him to prevent him from absorbing more radiation. It didn't take away the amp he already had.

carver9
Here is the scan. The bullet was made to prevent him from absorbing Radiation. Doesn't mean it took away the amp he already received.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22837408/Hulk_2014-_014-006.jpg.html

Also, Stoic, this scan answers your question. Hulk tells us he was playing possum and allowed Rulk to beat him. No denying hard core proof buddy.

Here is more proof.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/21780271/18.jpg.html

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by carver9
Here is the scan. The bullet was made to prevent him from absorbing Radiation. Doesn't mean it took away the amp he already received.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/22837408/Hulk_2014-_014-006.jpg.html

Also, Stoic, this scan answers your question. Hulk tells us he was playing possum and allowed Rulk to beat him. No denying hard core proof buddy.

Here is more proof.

http://www.turboimagehost.com/p/21780271/18.jpg.html
So he wasn't amped..

DarkSaint85
Doc Green could have beaten him....

carver9
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
So he wasn't amped..

Sigh.

HulkIsHulk
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
HULKISHULK
https://38.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcd0czS0191r9h24uo1_250.gif
https://38.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mcd0czS0191r9h24uo1_250.gif
http://media.tumblr.com/ea0ce1d764b8a435e435e7bfd0fd589d
/tumblr_inline_msiuzpIugG1qz4rgp.gif
http://media.tumblr.com/ea0ce1d764b8a435e435e7bfd0fd589d/tumblr_inline_msiuzpIugG1qz4rgp.gif
http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Travis-Bickle-Saying-You-Talking-To-Me-Taxi-Driver.gif
http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Travis-Bickle-Saying-You-Talking-To-Me-Taxi-Driver.gif

DarkSaint85
Doc Green almost beat him

ShadowFyre
I think Blue Marvel can pull some wins. But people are kinda wanking him a little. He is definitely a peer with the big boys and is as every bit as powerful but lets be realistic, yall are literally rehashing the same four feats over and over.

1. Lifting Arkansas- obviously high herald level strength, and can put the dukes up with Thor, Hulk etc. But hardly that impressive when you compare it to some.
2. Sentry fight- harder to judge since Sentry is so inconsistent but damn good showing at least
3. King Hyperion- probably the most impressive to me, that Hype had already killed Sentriea, Thors, Hulks and other Blue Marvels. This right here puts Blue Marvel as close to the top of the food chain imo, really good showing, no reason to believe he couldnt take some wins over Hulk in a K.O match
4.Almost breaking a moon, impressive, but when Hulk and Thor have already broken planets and things. Its not exactly a game changer.

I see these 4 things posted over and over for BM, and thats it. And those are used as pretty much arguments for him beating everybody.

I think BM can possibly kill the Hulk with anti-matter somehow, but he certainly isnt beating him to death. So hulk wins a majority due to stips.
.if this was just BM beating Hulk, then yeah, better versatility and comparable strength should give him some wins. But rehashing the same 4 feats over and over doesent compare to the 60 years or so Hulk has going for him.

Stoic
The Ultimates are on the way (title is going to be awesome). We will see how much of a threat Blue Marvel is. And the Ultimates look like a pretty powerful team. Blue Marvel may or should eventually meet up with the Hulk, or a peer of the Hulk's and then we will see how he measures up. Doc Green has not proven that he is capable of taking on the Sentry like the Green Scar did. I think that this would be a good fight, but Blue Marvel should win before Doc Green ramps up enough to take him out.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by ShadowFyre
I think Blue Marvel can pull some wins. But people are kinda wanking him a little. He is definitely a peer with the big boys and is as every bit as powerful but lets be realistic, yall are literally rehashing the same four feats over and over.

1. Lifting Arkansas- obviously high herald level strength, and can put the dukes up with Thor, Hulk etc. But hardly that impressive when you compare it to some.
2. Sentry fight- harder to judge since Sentry is so inconsistent but damn good showing at least
3. King Hyperion- probably the most impressive to me, that Hype had already killed Sentriea, Thors, Hulks and other Blue Marvels. This right here puts Blue Marvel as close to the top of the food chain imo, really good showing, no reason to believe he couldnt take some wins over Hulk in a K.O match
4.Almost breaking a moon, impressive, but when Hulk and Thor have already broken planets and things. Its not exactly a game changer.

I see these 4 things posted over and over for BM, and thats it. And those are used as pretty much arguments for him beating everybody.

I think BM can possibly kill the Hulk with anti-matter somehow, but he certainly isnt beating him to death. So hulk wins a majority due to stips.
.if this was just BM beating Hulk, then yeah, better versatility and comparable strength should give him some wins. But rehashing the same 4 feats over and over doesent compare to the 60 years or so Hulk has going for him.

He COULD HAVE broken the moon, not he almost broke the moon.

Also, what LOW showings does he have? Sure, Hulk has way more hugh showings...hes pretty popular, after all. But he also has low showings, and averaging them out paints a truer picture of Hulk over the past 60 years.

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