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Originally posted by Nephthys
If you made a Nihilus vs Malak thread, I'm pretty sure no one would seriously say Malak wins bro. Beni doesn't need to convince anyone of what they already know.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
1.) Revan, as of the Battle of Malachor V since that was the last time Meetra Surik has ever seen Revan, was more powerful than anyone else she had ever met, meaning he is more powerful than Darth Nihilus:

"It was easy to understand how Scourge could be drawn to him; Revan's command of the Force was greater then that of anyone else she had ever met."

2.) Meetra Surik was in complete and utter awe over Darth Nihilus' destructive capabilities:

"To kill on such a scale... it's impossible. I don't understand - it would have taken several Republic cruisers to destroy the surface of Katarr."

3.) Meetra Surik found Darth Nihilus to be "far more powerful" than she had originally believed above when she confronted him:

"He speaks, his voice roaring, and the player should realize that Nihilus is far more powerful than they had believed."

4.) Revan had become "far more powerful" than the last time Meetra Surik had seen him:

"Revan had grown since then. He was far more powerful now."

5.) I found examples in Star Wars literature where Drew Karpshyn uses "command of the Force" to describe one's connection to the Force / raw power:

"Without proper training, even his enormous command of the Force was unable to anticipate the unfamiliar sequences of the two-handed fighting style."

"The lightsaber was an extension of the user and his or her command of the Force."

"But his command of the dark side was too powerful for it to hold him for more than a split second."

6.) In particular, this passage makes an explicit link between power and command of the Force:

"Was it possible there was some other essential element in the process that he was missing? Was there one more secret waiting to be unlocked that would finally allow him to create a Holocron so he could pass his wisdom and knowledge on to his successors? Or was the failure in him? Did he simply lack power? Was his command of the dark side somehow less than that of the ancient Sith Lords like Freedon Nadd?"

7.) Also in other works, we see "command of the Force" as a synonym for one's potential / raw power:

"Sometimes he felt there was so little he need to teach his Padawan. Even to Obi-Wan, who knew him so well, Anakin's command of the Force could be astonishing."

"His sensitivity was far from perfectly attuned and he sincerely doubted he would ever attain half the command of the Force that Kenobi had possessed? though the old man had expressed great confidence in Luke's potential. "

8.) Darth Malak was believed to may have eventually surpassed Darth Revan, meaning he also surpassed Darth Nihilus:

"When Revan fell we had hoped the Sith threat was ended. But Malak quickly assumed Revan's role, and has embraced the dark side power as fully as his old master ever did. Now Malak leads the Sith armada against the Republic. Hate and vengeance for his master's death draw Malak ever further down the path of the dark side, fueling his powers until they surpass those of his old master."

http://media.giphy.com/media/3BSk6i59RURDa/giphy.gif

Malak gets utterly pancaked.

Canonically, Malak.

Malak - 1.
Nihilus - 1.

Malak stomps via lightsaber since he's a more skilled duelist than Yoda.

So is Nihilus though, that's not exactly high praise bro.

Nihilus - 1
Malak - 2

That wasn't a serious post btw

Shouldn't be tallied in the official vote count.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Nihilus - 1
Malak - 2

Does Malak get le Star Forge amp?

1.) No amp
2.) Gets amp

Darth Nihilus

KEK if Malak needs an amp despite being "far more powerful".

Malak has absolutely no way to deal with Nihilus' drain and even if we restrict that ability, Malak still gets vaporised by TK.

Close fight, LeGenD?

Originally posted by Nephthys
KEK if Malak needs an amp despite being "far more powerful".

Malak has absolutely no way to deal with Nihilus' drain and even if we restrict that ability, Malak still gets vaporised by TK.
He's not, though. Just more powerful. Revan's the "far more powerful" one.

Nah, he resisted the drain from the Star Forge that raped anyone short of himself and Revan.

Malak wins.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
Darth Nihilus

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Close fight, LeGenD?
He has Nihilus on tier 1 and Malak on tier 5. I doubt he thinks it's close.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Malak wins.
http://r35.imgfast.net/users/3513/11/32/39/smiles/841309534.gif

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
He's not, though. Just more powerful. Revan's the "far more powerful" one.

Nah, he resisted the drain from the Star Forge that raped anyone short of himself and Revan.

Your essay suggests Malak > Mando Revan tho. Cmon bro, you gotta commit.

Who gives a shit? That's not remotely comparable and are you really telling me it was a drain? Malak can't resist planet-wide drain attacks.

Nihilus speaks; Malak dies.
/thread

Nihilus pwns him like he did Traya, then Sion rapes him for good measure.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Close fight, LeGenD?
Question should be how Darth Malak would protect himself from one of the most potent expressions of Force Drain. What options does he have in this regard.

Ant is reaching.

Nihilus stomps.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Malak wins.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Malak wins.

lol

here's a link to make sure that nobody is actually buying this trolling as actual consensus:
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=15464900&highlight=userid%3A108686#post15464900

(N. stomps just like he did to the entirety of the Jedi Order)

Scroll down for people making fun of his arguments and then (eventually) a response (coming tomorrow).

Malak loses so badly it's jaw-dropping.

Up

If we're using the WotC quote, then Nihilus wins an excellent fight. If not, though:

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Nihilus speaks; Malak dies.
/thread

What about Nihilus scaling from the Revan novel (and KOTOR II game)? Especially if we assume that Darth Malak>Mando Wars Revan.

Why do you subscribe to the Nihilus scaling Nfactor?

Malak, tbh

Oh, look. It's that guy that only shows up in Nihilus threads every year or so.

Originally posted by Azronger
Malak, tbh

Malak getting the respect he deserves.
Nerds just annoyed, that he was beaten by a pre prime Revan, so they lowball him.

Malak dies horribly.

Originally posted by MythLord
Malak dies horribly Against Palpatine.
I agree.

Nihilus fodderizes.

Nihilus even with the quotes.

Originally posted by slayne
Why do you subscribe to the Nihilus scaling Nfactor?

Unless one uses a feats only perspective, why wouldn't one subscribe to it?

Is anyone really taking Drew K. and the Revan novel seriously though? The guy couldn't even be bothered to read a wookipedia summary of the game that made up half of the ****ing source material for his own novel, just to keep a semblance of continuity.

Drew played KOTOR 2 before writing the novel.

Sure he did. George Lucas probably played it too.

Originally posted by nfactor1995
Unless one uses a feats only perspective, why wouldn't one subscribe to it?
Because it's flawed, fallible, and its source gets pretty much everything about KotOR 2 incorrect (the Triumvirate being composed of post-JCW renegade Jedi, Meetra freaking out on Nathema due to the lack of the Force despite having lived without it for 10 years, etc.)

AP did an excellent deconstruction of the quote in question here.

Originally posted by slayne
Meetra freaking out on Nathema due to the lack of the Force despite having lived without it for 10 years)

You do realise its a resistance feat not, just the lack of the force. It's just the effects of Nathema a few hundreds years after the ritual, Ulic didn't complain about being affected on the sub atomic level, after being cut off from the force.

Originally posted by slayne
Because it's flawed, fallible, and its source gets pretty much everything about KotOR 2 incorrect (the Triumvirate being composed of post-JCW renegade Jedi, Meetra freaking out on Nathema due to the lack of the Force despite having lived without it for 10 years, etc.)

AP did an excellent deconstruction of the quote in question here.

I mean, he's basically just dismissing the Revan novel quote because of a quote in KOTOR II...despite the Revan novel coming out afterwards (therefore it is later in both real time continuity and the SW continuity) and her stating at that point that Revan had superior command of the Force than anyone she'd met (command = overall Force power, and why wouldn't the more recent source for the same subject take precedence here?).

Also, Revan hid quite a bit of his power (in terms of how he used it, especially the dark side power) from Meetra during the Mando Wars, therefore she wouldn't be aware of the ways Revan could apply his power. However, she would still be able to sense his innate power. With Nihilus, she sees his full power on display, and to her, she would've never known before that this kind of power could actually be used in such a way. This doesn't mean that Revan didn't have this power and more (as the Revan quote insinuates), rather it just means that Meetra didn't know that that level of power could be used in such a way as Nihilus used it.

There's also the KOTOR II statement by Sion that Kreia is still waiting to train one as great or as powerful as Revan (and by that point she'd already trained the likes of Sion and Nihilus). Another thing is especially if you take the Malak>Kun quote seriously, and given that Kun appears to be at least on the level of Nihilus overall, it makes the argument for Nihilus being far beyond Revan a bit ridiculous.

Originally posted by slayne
Because it's flawed, fallible, and its source gets pretty much everything about KotOR 2 incorrect (the Triumvirate being composed of post-JCW renegade Jedi, Meetra freaking out on Nathema due to the lack of the Force despite having lived without it for 10 years, etc.)

AP did an excellent deconstruction of the quote in question here.
Damn, I don't think I've ever seen AP make a solid argument before.

Also, isn't Nihlus weakened when he faces Surik?

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Also, isn't Nihlus weakened when he faces Surik?
Remember the state Plagueis was in when fighting the Maladians? Nihilus was in that same condition while fighting Surik and co.

@Nfactor:


As I said in my post, the source in question gets quite a lot of things in KotOR II hilariously wrong, and thus wouldn't exactly be a reliable source to definitively place one character over another, especially when that character originates from KotOR II.

Regardless, even if the reliability of the quote's source wasn't in question, her opinion would still be flawed, because she only meets Nihilus when he's mere inches from death and his Force abilities are utterly exhausted. If that was the version of Nihilus that Surik had in mind when she made the judgement, then by all means, it's perfectly correct.

The same can't be said for Nihilus at full power, though, considering how Surik could not believe that a pre-prime Nihilus' obliteration of Katarr (purely through the Force) was even possible. Obviously, since she never felt the power of Nihilus at that level of strength, she's going off the only version of the Nihilus that she did feel - the one she encountered on the Ravager. There's nothing wrong with the quote at all if she's making her judgement off the version of Nihilus she came face-to-face with, but this absolutely can't be applied to Nihilus at full power.

Not his full power, no. Far from it, in fact.

Whom she both considered failures because they represented the very thing she hated - the Force. Even so, this quote still doesn't put Revan > Nihilus because, again, she never experienced Nihilus at the absolute height of his power; only when he was substantially pre-prime and is therefore in no place to make the judgement.

If we took the Kun quote seriously, then obviously Revan'd be far more powerful than Nihilus yeah. But since I'm kind of opposed to the monumentally retarded lines of scaling which result from it, I don't hold it as definitive - especially considering that it's just one quote.

When Obi-Wan fough Maul in TCW, he did quite well in their 1v1 duels, especialy in S05E01. They were evenly matched and Maul was unable to overhelm Kenobi with his Force powers. When he fough him again, with Savage on his side, kenobi was overhelmed by his Force choke. It seems that, for Kenobi, it was much harder to fight both Maul's bros.
That might be very similar in Kreia vs Nihilus fight. Perhaps Sion's mere presence was enough, to distract Kreia, which might makes Nihilus able to break her Force guard. There must be a reason, that he attacked her along with Sion.
And besides that fight, Nihilus has never fought someone above Meetra's level (and Meetra was fodderized by Nyriss, who was fodderized by Revan).

Perhaps Yoda was the only jedi in canon, that could block Sidious FL with his bare hands. If he was, and if he would never met Sidious in battle, Sidious FL could be consideres as unblockable. Just like Nihilus' GD is now.

Darth Nihilus wins.

How on Earth is Malak going to compete with Nihilus' monstrous power?

he cant. that is plain it. has malak have the capability of sucking a planet of its power? no.