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It is easy to think of it as simulating the whole world. But much suggests it is more local than that.

It is 'the' city and 'the' mountains. I think it is also 'the' freeway in a literal sense. Everyone always seems to hack into the same place no matter where they go in their ships.

If Xion has a quarter of a million citizens and this is meant to be a 1% who do not accept the Matrix PLUS the natural born humans then the Matrix cannot have more than 25 million people in it. A big city alone can have millions; we know 'the' mountains are some 500 miles from the city- easily enough room to fit everyone.

So I think the Matrix covers a relatively small area, do you agree?

Yeh I guess I never thought about it that way - and if there are 6 billion people on earth, would that make most of them programs or what?

But then again I dont believe the 250 000 people are those that don't accept the program - they were just freed, am I right in saying this?

i have thought about it. The thing is. DOes it cover a part of space also?

I tried thinking about that... I think my brain hurts...

I hope Revolutions will reveal exactly how many people live in the Matrix, and I hope we get to see more of the machine world.

Only people who are suitable are freed. They don't free tham at random, only those who sunconsciously reject the programme.

I think there ISN'T a rest of the world in the Matrix, btw, programmes or otherwise. There is no 6 billion people. People don't notice this in the same way they don't notice that they have been through the end of the 20th/start of the 21st century several times.

well..i should think that the program renders the whole planet...in order for them to live questionless. let's say outer space is out of their tech possibilities

I think it does just cover a relatively small space, now that I think about it.

I think life would be different in the matrix if there would be only one town so I think its more than that, in the first matrix when neo came to work his boss said they had one of the most respectible companies in the world

Yes, but he only THINKS that. I don't think there is a rest of the world at all, I think it is all obfuscation. One city and the area around it thinking it is part of something bigger.

The Agents could easily block off the roads, and maybe the robots have instilled in them that they do not want to go to other countries or continents.

Easily done. They have control, after all.

Exactly.

Wow I never really thought about it. Now that you mention it, the numbers don't seem to add up? I'm going to ponder this some and hope my brain doesn't have a meltdown.

So what you're saying, Ush is a Dark City analogy. Seems really feasable. I've thought about it myself a little. First off, if it is one city, what city is it taking place in? I think it's fair to say it's in the US...(they drive on the right hand side of the road)

and as for the 1%...not everyone who won't accept the programming is freed. Plus you have to consider how many people die in Zion as well. I'm sure people die all the time in missions within the matrix.

Even if they have a thousand ships with eight-man crews and a horiffic 50% mortality rate a year that's still only 4000 a year. And as it is the casualty rate wouldn't be anywhere near that high; the ships they have are closer to 100, I think. So the death rate most likely does not have a huge impact.

Mind you, they are probably spawning like rabbits. What if fully HALF of Zion is natural born? The Matrix could be relatively tiny compared to the real world.

It is a US city because they are trying to re-create the height of late 20th/early 21st century civilisation and the US is the obvious place to do that. But that it is the ONLY city where anything seems to happen is a big hint, and as soon as Link said Neo was in 'the' mountains I became certain the Matrix was a relatively small construct.

What you guys are forgetting is what Morpheus said in the first film.

Quote, 'the machines have fields of billions of human beings which give off enough energy to power a lightbulb and combined with a form of fusion they have all the power they need'.

in that case explain how the matrix could only be a large city and mountains, I think oje of you got it wrong somewhere.

ANY MORE PLAUSABLE EXPLANATION?!?

I agree. At some point it is said that approximately four billion people live in the Matrix so I think that the Matrix covers an entire world/globe rather than just a city - after all, people might think it a bit peculiar to leave the city and reach nothingness.

The fact brought up that the first film takes place in the one city is just to avoid confusion methinks, and allows people to connect with the area (like the Heart O' theCity Hotel as a main set) rather than everyone jumping around between cities all the time. As no name is given to this city, it could just be a random city allowing people to make up their own minds as to where it is.

Also, in my opinion people are getting to obsessed with the idea that 1% are rejected by the Matrix and 99% accept it. I think that the Architect just says 99% to indicate the majority, like I would say that 99% of the time I get up at 8am - I mean almost all the time rather than exactly 99 days out of a hundred. This is backed up by the numbers. If 250,000 live in Zion then there can't be billions of people in the Matrix. The Architects number is closer to 99.9999375% but it would be ridiculous for him to come out with a huge decimal, so he keeps it simple.

This matrix is a another matris .. good ?

good point

Maybe the reason they always connect to the same town is because they are always in the same place when they connect. Maybe where they are in the Real World dictates where they will arrive in the Matrix?

ya i always though the matrix was the whole world. but Ush brings up a good point. the only thing i can think about the 1 percent is that not even close to all of them have been freed yet. many of that 1 percent are still wired in like neo was. morpheus did say that they rarely free someone as old as neo was, so my guess is that the vast majority of that one percent is still wired in.

That 'quote' redhotchillis gives is wrong, I believe. As I remember Morpheus says 'endless' fields, not fields of billions.

The ONLY person who says billions is Smith and as a problem with my theory that is granted but I think much else contradicts that.

And I think the Architect would tend towards precision. Not LITERAL precision, but he would not be as vague with his fractions as you suggest. I think the number of people who do not accept it is indeed close to one in a hundred. If it was actually something like 99.999% accepted the architect would have said something like "all but one in a hundred thousand."

Regardless, I think the thematic set-up of the films really does have the Matrix as smaller than would otherwise be assumed.

it's just a movie.
I don't think Wachowski brothers could ever avoid every mistake in their story,you're taking it too seriously.

No I am not, I am discussing what I think is an interesting point. Feel free to stay out if it does not interest you.

well Ush your right in the fact that it does seem very localized and everything that is taking place is taking place in this one city. the only comparison i can think of that would support a larger world would comparing it middle earth, a very large world but all the events that shape it take place in a comparatively small area. who knows, right that one down for us to ask the wachowski's.

I think Ush is right....but this thought leads me to another...one of the ideas behind quantom physics is that if no one is oberving a certain object, it does not exist...now would this be true for the matrix? if, for example, no one is observing a car parked on the street, would the mainframe computer running the matrix still process the code that makes the car "exist" or would it not bother to?

The city may be the only population centre.

A quote from FHM in a 6 page story on the Matrix. Before it was released.

'the network of human hives seen in the first movie is actually a megacity 10 times the size of New York'

Very interesting...

how big is new york? 5 million? so that would be up to about 50 million people, one percent would be 500,000 thousand, lets asume only half of that one percent has been freed from the matrix leaving our number at 250,000 people, which i believe is the size of zion. humm nice call Ush. i would have thought that for beleivablity for people in the matrix it would be a complete world. there does have to be programs simulating events that would be taking place outside of what the matrix is designed to show or people would become suspicious when they receive no news from the outside. plus there would have to be programs that simulate individuals from outside that say come into the designed world or have an effect on it.

Well Ushgarak I feel the Matrix itself after about 200 years may be a global entity. Sitting on every major continent. If not then the humans not affected by the "big machine" would have found a way to destroy if not cripple it.

The great war destroyed much of the earth and I think after 2 centuries the A.I. would have expanded itself with its primary centers in North America and/or Europe with satellite cores on the other continents. Using the rest of the earth as tremendously gigantic human harvesting fields.

exactly - for those who believe the 'one city' thing......

Explain french people

Plus - Mervingian says 'I have tried every language in the world...' hmmmmmmmmm, well?

Meaning?

Yes. what is it you wish us to explain about french people? I'd be happy to ablige... I'm half french myself...

Ribbet...

(Its ok if its at the expense of myself! No one who is not french - in full or in part - is permitted to make frog jokes!)

He means it if was not global there would be no France for there to be French. But the uber-city idea gets around that.

And there would be no point in the machines collecting more than they need. Their own civilisation may be taking up the rest of the world.

does anybody believe that there is more than one matrix? i think its possible.

hte architect said "...99.9% of all test subjects accepted the program..."


The Architect - Please. As I was saying, she stumbled upon a solution whereby nearly 99.9% of all test subjects accepted the program, as long as they were given a choice, even if they were only aware of the choice at a near unconscious level.

Please, all conversations about there being more than one Matrix in the thread designed for that purpose.

I seem to recall from the first Matrix movie that Neo was looking at a screen showing newpaper reports of Morpheous slipping past police at Heathrow Airport... This surely suggests that the Matrix is a construct designed on the "real" world circa 1999. The fact that they've chosen to base the action in modern day USA probably stems from the fact that it makes it more recognisable to international audiences than London, Moscow or wherever....

What I meant was that in absolute reality, the A.I. is global. Physically global. It's main core is based in one place on Earth, but that on all the other continents there are satellite core systems. This is the method of global control. It physically "sits" on all the major continents. That is also the method by which the population of "free" humans is kept under control. There cannot be a continent of free humans above ground because that would threaten the survival of A.I. So the human were "driven" below ground. A very finite living condition. Humans would need machines in order to exist below the earth's surface. Control.

The agents are a method of control over the "free" human population. Keeping the numbers manageable.

99% of the test subjects accepted the program.

We have to also remember that humans are a colony species. A heard species. It would be easy to subjugate us in that way with a successful progam like that than do it if humanity was a independent minded species. We are not. We are quasi-hive mentality.

Errm.... I just cant get my head around an uber city.

I mean from America to France you cross the Atlantic - so you're saying this mega city extends into the ocean??

No, just that all cultures are represented there.

perhaps there are seperate modules for each city or country in the matrix. When they hack into the matrix, they hack exclusively within that paticular module

You are all totally over analyzing this. First off, it's really a meaningless fact but for the sake of argument...

In the first matrix movie, Agent Smith makes a comment to Morpheous "Billions of people living out their lives... oblivious..."

This tells me that the matrix is made of millions of people (probably the 6 billion that live on earth now). It doesn't make much sense that the machines would kill off almost all the humans and leave a few million for power sources alone. As to the reference to the 1% who don't accept the matrix, it's probably just an estimation to show that there are a small number of people who refuse the programming. It's kind of like saying "I'm 99% done with my work": you could be close to 97% or 99.021342937% or something. IT'S AN ESTIMATION. It's easier to say 1% than some astronomically small number.

As for why the rebels always appear to jack into New York (and I'm assuming it's New York for lots of reasons, like the badges on the cops, the fact that no other American city has as many buildings or dirty alley ways or hackers), I guess they just do and we have to accept that.

Actually it isn't New York City. It's a city but not NYC. In reality (outside of the movie itself) this is either Sidney or Melbourne, or some other big Australian city. There were no landmarks or anything else indicating this is NYC.

Anyway I would say the Matrix itself is a global entity. It sits on all the continents of Earth. Smith didn't give an exact number of humans hooked into the system even though he said billions. The number may be greater than 6 billion because the system itself is hundreds of years old. Possibly 200. Anyway, 6 billion or not, the system started out with just the remnant of humanity to start and rapidly multiplied the needed human batteries in a short period of time. An extremely sophisticated machine.

Mithrandir, will you PLEASE read the thread properly as your points have already been a. made and b. addressed and it was VERY irritating to have them repeated.

don't get upset.

I need to be firm else a thread can simply become the same things repeated over and over and that tends to ruin any development of it.

No it doesn't. Modern physics only talks about an objects PROBABILITY of being somehwere, not its non-existence. And it is not when no-one is looking at it, it is when it is unobserved, which in scientific terms is VERY different. My physics Masters Degree friend is giving me this...

Yes, 'picks a slit', as in beforehand we do not know what slit it picks, hence me talking of PROBABILITY, not existence.

And you must not confuse 'observes' with 'someone looking at it'. 'Reality observing' means that it is somewhay interacting with the universe. The car that no-one is looking at is still being 'observed' because it is interacting with the ground it rests on, the dust that blows against it, the air it obstructs and the countless amount of light it is reflecting.

This is why Schroedinger's cat was in a box that was sealed off from the rest of the universe. That was the only way it could be 'unobserved'.

So you are only really confirming what I say.

Remember when Morph showed the city on the TV as Neo Knows. It was NY coz i saw the Twin Towers in a close-up. They he showed the world as it now and there were the Twin Towers broken.

ya, or atleast two buildings that looked very similar.

Actually it doesn't matter. The human "believes" what it sees as being real. So the System itself can sit on all seven continents, but all the incarcerated humans see themselves as living and breathing in this one particular city. The A.I. doesn't have to tell the human mind that there are other satellite cores around the planet. It's methods are "perfection". To keep the billions subjugated and their bodies healthy and functional it creates this multidimensional delusion of dreams and worlds within dreams and worlds.

It doesn't matter. The A.I. made it so that all the minds absolutely believe what they see is real. The absolute real world exists regardless of our individual perceptions. The universe exists and doesn't need the human mind to make it substantial. When humans no longer exists the universe will still be substantial. It is never a matter of biological perception.

This is a very good point. I agree with you serpent. There is no real way of knowing. I will continue on the computer game analogy. I think the matrix is as big as it needs to be. Its like in a game if you are not playing that level than it is not loaded on your system. It is only when you come to the next level (in lets say enter the matrix) that it even loads. I think the same can be said for the matrix.

Of course there is no evidence backing this issue up either way except for logic. But if the matrix is anything like a video game or computer program it would try to save energy and memory and only render that part as needed.

How do you know it is actually you that is dying? You are not looking back at your death. When you die you feel it. But in the "world-dream" that the A.I. created it is unknown "just how deep the rabbit hole goes..." Especially if it is a multi-layered A.I. generated "reality" created for the human inhabitants. "I had a BAD dream that I died..." that sort of thing. So it keeps the human bodies safe from believing it is dead.

I am talking in terms of "expanded universe" for the MATRIX movies. I don't know what the outcome of REVOLUTIONS will be. I am having tremendous enjoyment out of this kind of speculation. I am exploring all the different dark avenues of the story. Excellent story.

As for your "desk universe", if you are referring to the "electron theory of the universe", then I believe that it is closer to the truth than we can possibly realize. And if it is true then it is true. An observer isn't necessary for it to be substantial. Humans also suffer from delusions and various other debilitating psychological situations so whether or not it sees something is irrelevant for absolute reality. We can never see "absolute reality". We are not psychologically nor spiritually equipped for "absolute reality".

As for the "desk universe" that you have, I will have to concede that it exists because I am incapable of "seeing" it. Regardless of what you tell me.

There is no way of knowing if something is there or not unless it is observed. If it is not then it is in a constant state of flux. It will never be known if it is there or not because the moment you look to see it has to choose.

Now how this relates to the matrix. I think that the rest of the matrix world is not there unless it needs to be. If nobody is observing that part of the matrix it won't be there. There is no purpose in the system creating and substaining something if there is no need. And the program is all about purpose and logic.

The "knowing" doesn't make it unreal or real... the universe exists without us knowing about it just as it always has. It will be in existance eons after all humanity is gone forever. The knowing that it exists makes the sense of its awesomeness and its unimaginable timespan existance all the more acute... but that is only for us. It does not NEED us to be substantial. It is we who are on the road of "discovery" of existance.

We are still in the process of "knowing" who we are. Discovering "who" we are. 1,000 years ago humans believed the world was flat and nothing else existed anywhere else. 1,000 years later we "know" that was incorrect and that the Earth was ALWAYS round. So and so forth. Our perception does not change absolute reality, but absolute reality changes us.

As for the different levels of the Matrix itself, the inhabitants don't have to observe it or even know it exists. That is for the benefit of the A.I.

that is an excelent point, but there is no denying proability. Until the first person observed the earth was round by what ever means they used the earth could have been flat. There is an inherint chance that is given to everything. You only know the earth is round because it has been observed and recorded. In fact the world could still be flat for all you know. Have you been around the world yourself. Maybe all of the books and pics are lies. How would you know that everyone is telling the truth or that it's real.

And that ladies and gents is the main idea behind the matrix movies as stated in m1. What is real; what you can touch, see, feel, or hear? What you can sense? These are all tools of observation. We have know idea what something is until we observe it ourselves. And from the movies, even then we don't know if it is real or not. Very scary when you start to think about it.

Like I said, it is all a matter of absolute reality. It can enhance and elevate or it can destroy. Humanity can either be enhanced by "seeing" absolute reality or humanity can self-destruct because that "knowledge" was too much for it. But in either case, humanity doesn't change what is absolutely real from being that. He may even try to destroy what is real to save itself, just like in the story where it tried to destroy the A.I. when humanity realized "what" it had created. Absolute reality. Yes its scarey because some of it is beyond our comprehension and some of it seems very threatening.

In fact, even now, humans still believe that there is no other life in the universe. Nevermind that the universe is about somewhere around 20 billion light years long in some directions and about 13 billion light years in other directions; with trillions upon trillion upon trillions of galaxies composed of stars and planets and moons. We still believe that there is no life out there but on earth. For many of us it will frighten us to the core if we discovered that there is intelligent life inhabiting a world only 4 light years away. Why? Because reality to us is that God created us in "his" image and nothing else exists.

So the utimate reality in the movies that an A.I. has incarcerated humanity for its own purposes will cause the crashing and bleeding out of the human crop. So illusions and dreamstates are preferable.

I personally believe there other intelligent life forms somewhere. But as a rational scientifc mind i can not rule out that there are none. Your absolute reality is crap. There is only observed and unobsereved. You can not say that there is life in outer space because their are so many planets. There is a chance there isn't any.

So back to the point of this thread. You can not know if the matrix is a whole earth simulator because we haven't observed it yet. It might very well be. I personally BELIEVE (since that is all we can do until the movie tells us otherwise) that places and objects are only their when they are needed. Rather this is true or not is impossible to be determined because the moment you try to look (observe) than the items have to come out of flux and pick a state.

Jesus, Serpent, you talk an incredible amount of crap in the face of modern scientific knowledge.

Whether a consciousness perceives something or not is irrelevent to any point I was making.

And my whole point was simply saying that you were wrong in saying that things did not happen unless someone was looking at it. I was correcting you and saying that 'observation' does not mean 'people looking'- and to think so REALLY pisses off the people who worked this sort of thing out.

And show you the dead/alive cat? WTF? What kind of non sequitur is THAT? I was simply, again, pointint out that the only stage at which something was uncertain was when it was not connected with anything in the universe, which was the basis of that theory.

Everything else you said in reply to me was COMPLETE irrelevance.

Now, listen, people, these threads are being dragged RIDICULOUSLY off-topic and I do not intend to stand for it any more.

Further attempts to drag ANY thread in this area into a scientific and/or philisophical conversation not relevant to the thread subject will be eidted. There are some people who don;t want to be so ridiculously anal about these things and these threads are being ruined for these peole with this total mush. It ends.

Thankyou, Mac, for at least TRYING to stay on-topic.

Well there is one way to end the debate.

Like i said earlier until it is observed this situation is in flux. Until we see another city, state, country, or continent we have no way of knowing. There maybe only one big city or the whole world. But until it is OBSERVED we won't know.

No matter how much we believe in absolute reality.

Mac, having a rational scientific mind does not believe or entertain the belief that there is no life in the universe but humanity on a small planet somewhere in the outer rim of our galaxy, in a universe with trillions upon trillions of galaxies; Centrillion upon centillions of stars of every kind and planets of every kind and moons of everykind. That is not a logical scientific mode of thought. It would believe in the opposite. 500 years ago thinking that there is no one but us would be acceptable on any score because our knowledge was EXTREMELY limited and threatened by religious edicts.

ya kind of missed the point. Maybe you missed my first line. I do believe it but their is a chance there is none. A scientfic mind would not rule out anything until it has been tested and observed. That was the point i was trying to get across. No matter what my beliefs are I can't impress them on you with out proof. Now do you understand

An enlightened scientific mind isn't rigid. It will also realize that not everything in life and existance can be observe. That would not negate its existance either. Observation is for our benefit and it doesn't change the nature of existance. Our ability to observe anything is at best very very very miniscule.

There are very very rigid "scientific" minds who negate the existance of anything and everything that it cannot prove scientifically. THAT is an arrogance in classical scientific thinking.

Those who negate without proof or evidence are people who don't want to be led any other way. Tunnel vision comes to my mind. A person must always be open to new ideas or that is when they stop progressing. You will never know if something is changing until you can observe it more than once.

There are many things in the universe that cannot be observed. There are things in inner space that cannot be observed, but that does not mean they don't exist in absolute reality. Many humans find it safe and secure to think that if they cannot observe it then it isn't there.

I LOVE science but I am TERRIBLE in math. Love math too but... *sigh*. I love that saying where mathematics is the language of nature. Did you ever see that movie called PI (the symbol for pi). Love it.

Well anyway the foursided triangle is a dimensional theory isn't it? I believe there are many continuums as well, but they cannot be observed but that doesn't mean that the 4th, 5th, and maybe even a 6th dimension is unreal. The 4th dimension is very very real, but we do not yet have the technology to utilize it or observe it. But then who knows what the United States and other advanced western nations know scientifically. We do not make all our knowledge available to the masses.

But in terms of the MATRIX I used that logic to explain some of the things the system was doing to the human subjects. After 200 years such a system would have incredible scientific knowledge, but decided to keep its human subjects at a certain level. For it's own safety?

I would definetly agree with that, but maybe not hide, but repress. The agents could take possession of their body jus tbefore a major discovery.

It is control, but it is also a symbiotic relationship. The A.I. has become one with its human subjects and the humans with the A.I. without them even realizing that it is what the A.I. did. In a way the great machine is biomechanical.

The 4 dimensional triangle wouldn't be a rectangle. It is still a triangle but the 4th dimensional direction cannot be seen by us who are 3 dimension creatures.

I would agree that control is restricting access, so when Neo is realizing what the Matrix is, does that mean the machines are losing more and control of him?

anyone read the title "how big is the matrix?"
and then answered:
this big!
yet?

The machine is not losing control of him, it is grooming him for a higher purpose within itself.

Well Serpent, no. The dimensional reference will determine the description of the geometrical shape. One dimension will be only one side and no depth perception. Two dimensions things change, but there is no depth perception. When you get to three dimensions there is depth perception. Kinda like stereo vision.

Yes, I would say that the Matrix is "universe" oriented. It has created its own universe for the purpose of the humans and human perceptions. Has it actually reached into real space and space exploration? That has not be mentioned and in the case of what it is doing, it would not be important. The A.I. and the Matrix system is basically geocentric and geo-oriented above and below the surface.

It is a very great possibility. But we don't have that sense that something is "wrong" about the world. Not like in the MATRIX. I have sometimes thought there is something very very wrong with world governments and that humanity is being played against itself by outside forces. I don't care HOW outside, or WHERE outside is, but that it is there. Our situations are not very logical, and sometimes nonhumanly illogical. Like someone flips a switch and human governments and the people themselves act "psychotic" and destructive on a massive scale. I use Bush as such a incident... here you have one man who have successfully turned the world on its ear and no one has done anything about it. Nor can anyone do anything about it. Bush has also robbed the country blind and set on self destruct mode that will affect the U.S. negatively for the next 30 to 50 years. But no one here seems to understand except for a few and the rest are either oblivious or afraid. But the people in Europe, Asia, Latin America and Africa does see the problem. That is only an example. The same is for THE MATRIX... the people living in the Matrix system sees nothing wrong except for a small minority and they are the ones fighting the system... fighting the dragon. Unknown to them... they are part of the dragon and one with it. Biomechanical... Symbiosis.

Boys will be boys is a cultural concept and prejudice which has caused humanity more trouble than good.

The true reason for the allowance of the mass murder of 3,000 people on U.S. soil by foreigners hijacking commercial airliners has dogged me for a long time. I lost friends there. But I won't go into that, nor the subject of the hijacking. I will say that many people believe that there are powers inscrutable that are moving among us and orchestrating alot of what is going on in the world... the wholesale slaughter of human life and the ecology of the earth. This is something that can never be proved or brought to the light of day, just like in the MATRIX. Maybe this is what the Wachowski's are doing in their movie. This is part of the premise of their story.

What is going on in our world is BIG, just like in the MATRIX. The Matrix system is BIG... GLOBAL... inscrutable to the billions of humans living in it. Our world is the same... above and below the surface.

December 29, 2012.

On that day we shall see what the Amerind actually meant.

Actually I thought it was suppose to be December 21st, 2012?

End of Mayan calender cycle, etc. etc.

But no one has instructed me to pack yet ... In fact I've never heard the Oracle so much as mention it. (wink, wink)

Actually, it was not mentioned when the war with the A.I. took place. It was after the beginning of the 21st century. The year the A.I. chose to show the prosperity of human was 1999.

But it was in the 21st century that the A.I. spread itself across the globe and under the earth.

to Serpent

The Oracle... just think about it. "hey people. it's not in the film, it's for real. a message. listen to me. all will end in 2012 so go and pack for yourself. i'm not joking... really... hey... people... what's the wrong with you". Do you think that this is useful? That people would take it seriously? I hardly beleive. it's not a comfortable theory. people would laugh. anyway, do you know any women who speaks the truth directly?


remember Noe (/Neo/One ?) have a nice day

Could it be that the people who were left from fighting the war are the only ones plugged into the matrix? Alot of people died in the war against the machines and I believe it (the war) covered the globe. So my thoughts are only the people that didn't die in the war and the ones being born now are connected to the Matrix.

Any thoughts?

We're more than 500 years away from the first man-machine war. None of the human survivors from that war are still alive.

also, if you have seen the Animatrix, it shows in "second Renaissance" that the Machines took many of the humans and tortured them for a long time, keeping them right near death but not quite. now i'm not sure but i think they took others and, while conscious, plugged them into the Matrix. those people were middle aged, and could not possibly be alive. Think of the councillors in Zion, and then think of five of them before that. No one lives that long.

In the Matrix comics I the very first seris I think, there was a story about a man from London & a woman who scaled mount Everest. I don't think the W brothers would sign off on these stories if the Matrix is not meant to encompass the entire world.

I'm sure the AI was capable of creating an entire virtual world, but is able to attract alot of them to the city where nearly all are kept under strict watch. I read somewhere that the matrix actually is a huge city, how else could all of reloaded happen when they shut the power grid down and all that stuff. who knows right?