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Darth Maul and Count Dooku

vs.

Legolas and Prince Nuada



Darth Maul has his twin sabers and Dooku has 2 lightsabers.
Legolas has 2 swords and Nuada has his spear.
Sith are not allowed to use force powers, pure sword fight only.
Lightsabers can't cut through elven weapons.

Fight is to the death.

Sith ftw, FL from Dooku and crazy bladework from both Lords with Lightsabers that can cut through anything the elves have as defence make this a easy fight to win for the Sith, plus lets not forget the tk and pre cog involved. The elves are good and thy may be able to dodge a couple saber strikes but in after that its end of the line for them.

PS Dooku doesnt need 2 sabres, he'd do just fine with one

As mentioned in the OP, no force powers, meaning no TK. Elven swords are also immune to being cut through with lightsabers. Precog is fine because I believe it should be equalized by the Elves' heightened reflexes.

Also forgot to mention, please take into consideration only the movies for Star Wars. Thank you.

ah sorry, didn't read it carefully enough. Still give a healthy majority to the Sith, especially considering Dookus mastery with the blade, Maul isn't a pushover either, he took on two Jedi and was beating their asses

and yet lost to a Padawan one v one

Are the jedi able to amp their strength as well as their speed?

Sith should take this.


Dooku has a lot of lightsaber experience as well as blaster bolt and other weapons as seen how he knew how to deflect the light whip.

Maul is also a trained combatant who came back from getting sliced in half. I'm not seeing the two go down and I'm not sure the elves can pull anything good enough that the Sith can't counter.

I'm going Sith.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
and yet lost to a Padawan one v one


that is true, but he stood there like a retard..call it PIS, at any rate when Maul WAS actually fighting he had both their numbers

Sith take this..

unless the elves have something that prevents them from being chopped in half

Jeeze people. Please read the OP. The lightsabers in this match cannot cut through the elven weapons. The Sith can only amp their strength and speed in as much as what we see them do in the movies regularly. What I mean is, they basically look like what they normally look like in fights. No 20 foot jumps or anything. Also, only Star Wars movies count. Episodes I to VII.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Jeeze people. Please read the OP. The lightsabers in this match cannot cut through the elven weapons. The Sith can only amp their strength and speed in as much as what we see them do in the movies regularly. What I mean is, they basically look like what they normally look like in fights. No 20 foot jumps or anything. Also, only Star Wars movies count. Episodes I to VII.


so you gimped them... shame.. shame...

Well, I take it the point of this thread was to see which team was superior in terms of pure bladework/swordsmanship, hence the stips. Otherwise it would be a monumental mismatch.

I'd rate Nuada a bigger threat than Legolas though, considering how he schooled Hellboy. Hellboy only managed to win that last fight because he had insane durability, which allowed him to keep going despite the massive whooping Nuada was putting on him. Neither of the Sith are anywhere near as durable as he is.

Edit: Actually, Hellboy did perform better than I remembered in the last fight (I was remembering their first encounter where Nuada DID beat his ass badly), but his durability did come into play. And based on that fight, Nuada is at least as fast and agile as any of the Sith are shown to be:

rYr0BJUbi2s

Docks swordsman ship more than makes up for Narudas agility, look at his fight with Yoda for instance; full coverage with his fighting technique.

Do we think the Sith are as strong as the Elves? I know the Sith have amped strength but we do have some decent strength feats for the Elves, just wondering how people though they stacked up?

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
so you gimped them... shame.. shame...

Yes, because I wanted it to be a pure swordfight.

They are vastly stronger than Elves when using force powers. It's like Luke partially lifting the x-wing, or Yoda doing it later, is that considered strength? Granted, they didn't physically grab the object and lift it, but they still lifted it non the less. If somebody asked me to lift a car, and I did so via a gesture, does that mean I'm not that strong? No, I actually am, I lift it. Besides if they can TK it, why couldn't they be touching it, and still do the same thing? They are technically touching it and lifting it.

Even if we exclude their TK feats, I'd still submit Anakin falling from great heights and catching a speeder and holding on. At those speeds and the speed of the vehicle, I'd say the Elves would likely have gotten their arms ripped off, let along strong enough to hold on. Granted, I think Elves are stronger than most here, but I don't think they are as strong here.

I think they are JUST as skilled as the sith, if not more so actually. The moves I saw them do with a blade is every bit as good if not good. The difference to me here is speed. The sith can amp their speed to beyond Elf level imo, and that is the difference.

I don't recall any Jedi or Sith ever amping their speed. They have precog which allows them to see things happen a second or two before they do... but all that gives them is very fast reflexes which the elves should be able to match. Jango Fett was able to keep up with Obiwan after all.

What I'm saying is, I don't recall any Jedi or Sith ever adjusting their precog, enhancing it or whatever, or specifically enhancing their speed.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I don't recall any Jedi or Sith ever amping their speed. They have precog which allows them to see things happen a second or two before they do... but all that gives them is very fast reflexes which the elves should be able to match. Jango Fett was able to keep up with Obiwan after all.

What I'm saying is, I don't recall any Jedi or Sith ever adjusting their precog, enhancing it or whatever, or specifically enhancing their speed.

They enhance all those things. We see Kenobi run back after maul when he had been temporarily kicked away. He was running well above peak human. Same with his jump getting him back on the right platform.... That was probably a 20 ft. jump directly upwards.

We see an old man Dooku do a double or triple flip in ROTS right before confronting Kenobi and Anakin. Palps killed three acclaimed Jedi Masters using a speed blitz. Mace had to emerge himself in Vaapad just to compensate for Sids speed enhancement thanks to the force. Them deflecting blaster fire from multiple opponents takes incredible speed. Faster than any elf was shown blocking. I'd say they are faster

I don't know. Nuada was able to cut through a water drop. There's a difference between having enhanced reflexes and actually being able to amp speed. The examples you gave seem more like simply enhanced reflexes and great skill as compared to being able to actively amp speed. I know they can amp their jumps, but that's disabled here in OP as well as considering only feats from movies.

Well see, that's the thing, the books (also edited by Lucas) go over expanded details of what we are watching in the movies. So to me, the book just expands on Lucas vision of the movie. Some examples of this:

1. The Kenobi run I was referring to, is specifically referenced in the book as him traveling extremely fast. Same with his run up the ramp after Dooku where he kills the 2 magnaguards.

2. Sids speed blitzing of the acclaimed Jedi masters is attributed to his speed enhancement. Mace is specifically noted to use Vaapad to match the emperor's said amp

3. Also when Mace and Sids are fighting, Anakin witnesses the fight through the window. Yet, they are moving so fast (through the force) that they appear as nothing but a dark mist to him. This is somebody with enhanced reflexes and vision himself... he couldn't even perceive them they were moving so fast.

4. The blaster fire takes speed to be able to react AFTER shots are fired. Blasters are certainly faster than Arrows or the like in LOTR. The Jedi were able to react to multiple blaster fire from multiple directions. Just witness mace blocking Jango in the area. He blocks point blank blaster fire... then leaps down.. probably 5 stories and blocks more fire WHILE falling. That would take incredible speed to execute.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmR1ee223zQ

Starts about 6:24

I don't think we should bring the books into this, because if we do that then we'll have to bring in LOTR books into this, then it becomes a lot more complicated than I intended.

How bout you simply base your argument on pure movie feats of all characters. The speed and strength they have will be dependent on how they look on screen and based on feats.

Again, just witness the Mace feat I referenced. He blocks multiple blaster fire and point blank range. Jumps at least 5 stories down and blocks more fire while falling down. That would take incredible speed to execute.

Again with Sids and the blitzing of the masters. He's shown moving too fast for them to react. Sure we don't see blurry lines, but we can barely make things out in that scene and we see him kill them. Clearly intended to show his speed. There is no other way to kill 3 of the best the Jedi had to offer that fast, who themselves have enhanced speed-reflexes-and precog

I'd also cite the Anakin falling incredibly far and still having the strength to catch and hold onto a moving speeder. I'd say any elf who tried that would have their arms tore off.

I believe the Sith takes this. The difference is that while the blades the elves have are immune to the lightsabers, the lightsaber will still be far more dangerous should it slip past the defences of either of the elves (which is imo will). If Nuadu manages to get a good smack in with his staff, it'll hurt but no "major" harm done. If Maul for instance manages to get a smack in with his lightsaber it's game over. It's a pretty good fight though, I see Legolas as the weak link for some reason, he as I recall tended to struggle against characters with some level of skill, but it's been some time since I've seen the hobbit.

Unfortunately, neither Sidius, Mace or Anakin are in this fight. And I'm pretty sure we're all in agreement that Sidius and Mace are some of the top fighters in the Jedi world.

so is Dooku

Originally posted by relentless1
so is Dooku

True, but I'm not giving Dooku feats that only Sidius or Windu have performed.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Unfortunately, neither Sidius, Mace or Anakin are in this fight. And I'm pretty sure we're all in agreement that Sidius and Mace are some of the top fighters in the Jedi world.

True, but you asked this question:

Originally posted by FrothByte
I don't recall any Jedi or Sith ever amping their speed. They have precog which allows them to see things happen a second or two before they do... but all that gives them is very fast reflexes which the elves should be able to match. Jango Fett was able to keep up with Obiwan after all.

What I'm saying is, I don't recall any Jedi or Sith ever adjusting their precog, enhancing it or whatever, or specifically enhancing their speed.

Thus, I was answering your question

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
True, but you asked this question:



Thus, I was answering your question

Not really. You showed me Sidius and Mace being faster than their opponents. I wouldn't call that amping... simply that they're faster.

Okay so we'll ignore the books which add more detail than we can see in the movie.... gotcha

Even then Froth, you still have the Mace feat of blocking point blank blaster fire, even while falling... That would take incredible speed to pull off.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Okay so we'll ignore the books which add more detail than we can see in the movie.... gotcha

Even then Froth, you still have the Mace feat of blocking point blank blaster fire, even while falling... That would take incredible speed to pull off. Films only. Quit breaking the rules. Poor form.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Okay so we'll ignore the books which add more detail than we can see in the movie.... gotcha

Even then Froth, you still have the Mace feat of blocking point blank blaster fire, even while falling... That would take incredible speed to pull off.

Yes, I agree. I never said Jedis were slow, I just don't think they can amp their speed to anything more than what they already have.

My belief is that the elve's heightened reflexes are enough to match the sith. If you don't agree that's perfectly fine. I just don't think the sith can increase their speed at will.

Nuada is the best swords man here. Ppl keep mentioning blocking blaster fire. but that is allowed throw the force and OP removed that. Most speed feats can be argued that it was the force and not their own reflex which makes jedi fights complicated. IF this is a pure skill match up, Nuada, Dooku, Legolas=Maul in that order i think.

The elves id argue are stronger than the sith without the force and quicker too. Legolas has also been seen doing silly things like running on falling rocks so id say elves win due to natural abilities shown without any amps

Originally posted by wallman77
IF this is a pure skill match up, Nuada, Dooku, Legolas=Maul in that order i think.


no way, watch TCW and catch Dooku take on 4 night sisters while drugged, he was able to stalemate then with sword fighting abilities alone, or when he fights Anakin and Obi Wan and totally makes them look like fools when they attack him at the same time. He's way more skilled than naruda. Thats the thing that makes his character stand out in fact; he's head and shoulders above every other Jedi/Sith in regards to swordsmanship with the exception of Sidious, Yoda and Mace...the latter of which is Dookus equal at best.

Originally posted by relentless1
no way, watch TCW and catch Dooku take on 4 night sisters while drugged, he was able to stalemate then with sword fighting abilities alone, or when he fights Anakin and Obi Wan and totally makes them look like fools when they attack him at the same time. He's way more skilled than naruda. Thats the thing that makes his character stand out in fact; he's head and shoulders above every other Jedi/Sith in regards to swordsmanship with the exception of Sidious, Yoda and Mace...the latter of which is Dookus equal at best.

Only Star Wars movies are included for this thread.