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All charaters in an prime who wins fight takes place in an eternal throne room

dooku and vader have hearts

revan is heart of the force

revan solos

---

Anyway, probably Team 1. Vaylin's pretty trashy.

dooku dies tho

Vader vs. Revan is honestly a battle dependent on the views; both characters have immense exposure, immense load of feats and it's really difficult stuff to rate in short. Seen arguments for either side with convincing points.

Dooku vs. Vailyn is what would tip the scales for me - basically because Vailyn's inferiority as a combatant is completely clear and indisputable. While Vailyn's power is also obviously superior, problem is, Vailyn didn't show the actual mastery and skill over her raw power to use it directly within heated battle against a considerably powerful combatant. I just can't see Vailyn harnessing direct assaults of enough magnitude to put Dooku out of commission with Force alone. To take out someone with Force alone requires a miraculous opportunity, or superiority of inhuman level, and still the second one requires at least some space for it. Dooku would prevail more often than not.

The other way around, Vader definitely knocks out Vailyn, who isn't that much more powerful and doesn't hold enough superiority for her Force power to be really meaningful, while Vader totally shits on her as a combatant. Then you have either Dooku + Vader vs. Revan, or Vader vs. Revan again.

So yeah, Dooku and Vader take a slim majority.

3/10 an post

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
dooku and vader have hearts

revan is heart of the force

revan solos


no no no vader more machine than man. twisted and evil. no heart, no heart.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
no no no vader more machine than man. twisted and evil. no heart, no heart. Dude, the pansy turned on the emperor for his son. He had a heart. He lost his dark way at the end like a true weakling IMO.

Originally posted by JKBart
Vader vs. Revan is honestly a battle dependent on the views; both characters have immense exposure, immense load of feats and it's really difficult stuff to rate in short. Seen arguments for either side with convincing points.

Dooku vs. Vailyn is what would tip the scales for me - basically because Vailyn's inferiority as a combatant is completely clear and indisputable. While Vailyn's power is also obviously superior, problem is, Vailyn didn't show the actual mastery and skill over her raw power to use it directly within heated battle against a considerably powerful combatant. I just can't see Vailyn harnessing direct assaults of enough magnitude to put Dooku out of commission with Force alone. To take out someone with Force alone requires a miraculous opportunity, or superiority of inhuman level, and still the second one requires at least some space for it. Dooku would prevail more often than not.

The other way around, Vader definitely knocks out Vailyn, who isn't that much more powerful and doesn't hold enough superiority for her Force power to be really meaningful, while Vader totally shits on her as a combatant. Then you have either Dooku + Vader vs. Revan, or Vader vs. Revan again.

So yeah, Dooku and Vader take a slim majority.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
dooku and vader have hearts

revan is heart of the force

revan solos

---

Anyway, probably Team 1. Vaylin's pretty trashy.

dooku dies tho
That fight would be as GOAT as Vader and Sidious vs Revan and Valkorion though.

Originally posted by JKBart
Vader vs. Revan is honestly a battle dependent on the views; both characters have immense exposure, immense load of feats and it's really difficult stuff to rate in short. Seen arguments for either side with convincing points.

Dooku vs. Vailyn is what would tip the scales for me - basically because Vailyn's inferiority as a combatant is completely clear and indisputable. While Vailyn's power is also obviously superior, problem is, Vailyn didn't show the actual mastery and skill over her raw power to use it directly within heated battle against a considerably powerful combatant. I just can't see Vailyn harnessing direct assaults of enough magnitude to put Dooku out of commission with Force alone. To take out someone with Force alone requires a miraculous opportunity, or superiority of inhuman level, and still the second one requires at least some space for it. Dooku would prevail more often than not.

The other way around, Vader definitely knocks out Vailyn, who isn't that much more powerful and doesn't hold enough superiority for her Force power to be really meaningful, while Vader totally shits on her as a combatant. Then you have either Dooku + Vader vs. Revan, or Vader vs. Revan again.

So yeah, Dooku and Vader take a slim majority.

The notion that Vaylin is more powerful than Vader when she barely matches in TK is stupid.

I'd say team 2 tbh.

Revan gets raped, Vaylin follows.

Whoever wins between Vader and Revan wins it all for their team, and I'd lean towards a non-jobbing Vader for a very slight, but hard fought, majority.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Whoever wins between Vader and Revan wins it all for their team, and I'd lean towards a non-jobbing Vader for a very slight, but hard fought, majority. I don't think so. With SoR, Revan truly surpassed Vader. It's undoubtedly a good fight, but Revan inevitably wins.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
a non-jobbing Vade.
So, fanfiction Vader?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
So, fanfiction Vader?

He doesn't job all the time ---for instance, in sources such as The Force Unleashed and Coruscant Night trilogy and subsequent books, he was written an absolute Force monster. In others he still is, but he doesn't exercise that advantage nearly as much as he should, otherwise he wouldn't be troubled by the likes of Dark Womam.

Originally posted by Sinious
I don't think so. With SoR, Revan truly surpassed Vader. It's undoubtedly a good fight, but Revan inevitably wins.

That's nice - what's your reasoning for such, though?

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
That's nice - what's your reasoning for such, though? The fact that he was DEFEATING an extremely powerful team on his own. A team so powerful that I can easily wank by linking them to Arcann and of course eventually Valkorion.

Well aware I've read Ant's respect thread----why does that rank him above Vader, though? What would be his win condition against him?

Originally posted by Sinious
The fact that he was DEFEATING an extremely powerful team on his own.

He was defeated, and not a single one of the fighters was killed or incapacitated, including the non-force sensitives. That doesn't give me the impression that they were getting it up their asses.

I believe the spirit Revan factor comes in there.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Well aware I've read Ant's respect thread----why does that rank him above Vader, though? What would be his win condition against him? Revan has insane progression throughout his longass story. The novel makes it clear that he was far more powerful even before the Foundry compared to his KOTOR incarnation(where he already has pretty decent feats). With SoR, he ascends in power again and hiis final showdown proves it.

One of Revan's greatest advantages is his vast knowledge of the force and array of abilities compared to Vader's limited options in force powers. He can unleash various force attacks on Vader until Vader simply can't take it anymore. He is that powerful tbh.

We know that Darth Marr is fast enough to blitz Sith Lords and the protags have all kept up with high level force users. Revan had to keep up with Marr, a protag, and Satele while fighting Shae Vizla, Jakarro, and Theron Shan at the same time. Vader has no advantage here.

Since we already know Revan is capable of simultaneously fighting so many opponents and is confirmed to be an excellent fighter in melee as well, Vader won't be able to gain an advantage big enough to turn the tide even if he closes the gap. Revan way before his prime has humiliated an immensely amped Malak in such a fight.

The question is, what is Vader gonna do to harm Revan while Revan constantly sends powerful force attacks at him? I love Vader more than I do Revan but Revan has reached a point where he can give the likes of Plagueis/Caedus a really good fight imo.

Revan can give two highly overrated Sith Lords a good fight, says Sinious, because he's far more powerful than when he had amnesia. More at 8.

Who isn't overrated in your eyes?

A lot of people. The fact that Caedus and Plagueis roll off the tongue so easily for you as people who are somehow in the same tier is proof enough for me.

Vos doesn't count.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
The fact that Caedus and Plagueis roll off the tongue so easily for you as people who are somehow in the same tier is proof enough for me. And how would you rank them?

Vos counts the most.


Anyone who can give Caedus a good fight is well above Plagueis.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Vos counts the most.


Aight, I'll concede to that. I disagree. Plagueis is relatively unknown, but I don't look at just feats to place characters.

Even his hype and placement in the Banite line would put him well below Caedus.

fresh ur views r shite

Better than anything involving Revan in the last decade tho

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Better than anything involving Revan in the last decade tho
http://memesvault.com/wp-content/uploads/Wait-What-Meme-01.jpg

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
fresh ur views r shite

Dat's kewl. Jazzed up lip service aside, why does this put him above Vader? Vader progression hasn't been a small one either - from start to finish. The guy was canonically stated by God to be 80% the power of the most powerful Sith Lord to ever live. His half dead shape is enough to collapsed Cathedrals decade before becoming "far more formidable". Dude is on par with someone that can move, then obliterate a frigate 150 meters in length while simultaneously erecting barriers that shield himself from drops that hit with the impact of thermal detonators, and rival the the heat put forth by a star which ranges anywhere between 3,500 K - to 7,000 K. Vader in no slouch in the Force either, and I'm willing to bet he has superior telekinetic power to Revan, and the sufficient Force defensive and durability to tank whatever Revan throws at him.




And which one of those "vast array of powers" are going to crack Vader's chin for a win? Lightning? I doubt it. Vader could repel it with his Lightsaber, or possibly absorb it. Pre-prime Vader was casually repelling laser fire with a wave of his hand. TP? Doubt it. Not only do Vader sport decent TP feats himself---but his will is sufficient enough for him to will himself to live, despite the fact his respirator was completely shot.

Drain? Vader was able to resist the Dark Reaper in a much weaker state than he is now. I doubt if Revan's drain would accomplish anything at all; taking that into consideration and everything. I'm pretty sure Revan has other powers that could be useful here, but do you mind actually listing some, so I can form a rebuttal against it?



So Vader doesn't have the speed advantage here - so what?




I consider Vader to be a superior melee combatant and duelist to Revan, yeah.
Vader is an army buster, and strike team plower (albeit an inferior one) himself, and has dueled on even grounds with people who have fought through hordes of highly skilled Force sensitives, adroit in the most dangerous fighting styles in the galaxy far before his prime.



"Humiliates" implies it was a stomp - it wasn't.



I like how you think Vader is completely defenseless against Revan's Force attacks.



Giving Plagueis and Caedus a hard fight isn't out of the capabilities of Vader, yeah.

Welcome back.

Yeah, Revan's in the same tier as Vader. Maybe a bit higher, but not outright beyond Vader's level.

Vader was never called the heart of the Force though, DC.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
Vader was never called the heart of the Force though, DC.



Revan never smashed Natalie Portman, tho.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Dat's kewl. Jazzed up lip service aside, why does this put him above Vader? Vader progression hasn't been a small one either - from start to finish. The guy was canonically stated by God to be 80% the power of the most powerful Sith Lord to ever live. His half dead shape is enough to collapsed Cathedrals decade before becoming "far more formidable". Dude is on par with someone that can move, then obliterate a frigate 150 meters in length while simultaneously erecting barriers that shield himself from drops that hit with the impact of thermal detonators, and rival the the heat put forth by a star which ranges anywhere between 3,500 K - to 7,000 K. Vader in no slouch in the Force either, and I'm willing to bet he has superior telekinetic power to Revan, and the sufficient Force defensive and durability to tank whatever Revan throws at him.
Please, that %80 thing is BS. If not BS, then it is definitely not a straight numbers calculation as that would make 2 Vaders >>> ROTJ Sidious, which is a thought I disagree with for obvious reasons. Not to mention the "Revan way before his prime > Nihilus" quote Ant got.

Everything he threw at the SoR strike team concentrated at him would be sufficient. I don't think you understand that the members of that strike team were no weaklings. The protag himself is pretty powerful as he managed to stand against Arcann despite being overwhelmed eventually. Unlike Arcann, Revan had to fight the the protag while he had the support of a strong strike team and still managed to dominate the fight better than Arcann did.
He might have a disadvantage

Indeed, and I never said this wouldn't be a really good fight. The problem with the Revan/Vader discussion is that Revan's top feats are usually based on his performance against other characters where Vader's feats usually display his raw power more explicitly. That is why I mentioned Arcann and Valkorion earlier. The lightning strike Valky unleashed on Arcann displays how powerful Arcann is as he defended against it with his bare hands. The attack was so powerful that its mere collateral damage was enough to harm dozens of ships possibly a hundred meters away. Arcan was the focus of that attack and he took it for a pretty decent amount of time. Revan in SoR proved that he is superior to that level of power and I don't think Vader is there yet.

Yeah, after soloing the SF, Revan defeated him several times in a row while he was amped. That is kinda humiliating.

I never said that. I do believe that Revan's superior command of the force and combat prowess will give him the victory though.

Like I said, perhaps Arcann vs Vader is an interesting topic but I don't see how Vader takes this one.