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http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-RZOhA0Q69t0/TW3RN8w1VGI/AAAAAAAAAZM/sM3H3uh5zwM/s1600/nightcrawler1.jpg

Classic Kurt. Pre revamp Dick.
No prep.
No BFR.
Midnight, midtown Manhattan rooftop to start.

http://www.writeups.org/img/inset/Nightwing_DC_h05.jpg

Nightcrawler

Easily?

Dick is a better martial artist, obviously, but Wagner... is better at everything else, including acrobatics.

Plus, NW's is not used to Kurt's teleportation, so that alone could knock him out...

While NW is only human, i (personally) dont think the acrobatic gap is all thst huge, but point taken; sticking to walls and a prehensile tail allow NC to do things a normal man cant.
The teleportation though...I've little doubt NW could compensate. Iron Fist got NCs rhythm down fairly quickly in their first encounter; if NW can survive a half dozen or so shots, he likely could, too.

Originally posted by riv6672
While NW is only human, i (personally) dont think the acrobatic gap is all thst huge, but point taken; sticking to walls and a prehensile tail allow NC to do things a normal man cant.

Not to mention going invisible in shadows.

This is NC fight to lose.

NWs mask does have vision enhancement. Not sure if thats something you're aware of.

Originally posted by riv6672
NWs mask does have vision enhancement. Not sure if thats something you're aware of.
I don't know if it will work. In an issue of Excalibur when his powers were being tested, the guys conducting the tests couldn't 'see' NC when he was in shadows even by checking for his body's heat signature.

Nightwing better have some elite sh|t in his mask to pull it off.

Good fight but if kurt teleports dick its over

Well, his gear is Batman level, for whatever thats worth!
Just wasnt sure if that'd change your view on things.

Originally posted by riv6672
Well, his gear is Batman level, for whatever thats worth!
Just wasnt sure if that'd change your view on things.

His gear shouldnt be batman level

Not that is matters. Nc is attuned to the shadows

Why shouldnt his gear be Batman level?
NW has been shown to have access to Batman's resources (Information, safe houses, specialized equipment. The mask enhancements are pretty much standard.) many times.

And "attuned to the shadows" is not a term i've heard before. It also hasnt stopped NC from being hit before.

Not disagreeing with you, just not sold on how you phrased things.

Originally posted by riv6672
And "attuned to the shadows" is not a term i've heard before. It also hasnt stopped NC from being hit before.

Dude, Flash has been hit by less than speedsters. It's comics. The characters don't use their powers to the best of their abilities for the sake of story.

If NC wanted to, he could TP the upper half of NW's body off. Nothing short of Herald would resist or survive that. Fight over.

Thank you for getting that off your chest, but, whats that have to do with anything?
Are you upset that NC can be hit?
Not my fault.

Somebody probably should post NC fight against Sabertooth. Don't think Riv will turn over so easily with words. I can post it if no one has it.

Originally posted by riv6672
Why shouldnt his gear be Batman level?
NW has been shown to have access to Batman's resources (Information, safe houses, specialized equipment. The mask enhancements are pretty much standard.) many times.

And "attuned to the shadows" is not a term i've heard before. It also hasnt stopped NC from being hit before.

Not disagreeing with you, just not sold on how you phrased things.

Even if it was Batman level, there's no guarantee it would work. Disappearing in to the shadows is, last I checked, an actual power of Kurt's, and I don't recall seeing any equipment being able to see him.

Even without the shadow stuff, it would be a great fight, but i'd pick NC.

Originally posted by riv6672
Why shouldnt his gear be Batman level?
NW has been shown to have access to Batman's resources (Information, safe houses, specialized equipment. The mask enhancements are pretty much standard.) many times.

And "attuned to the shadows" is not a term i've heard before. It also hasnt stopped NC from being hit before.

Not disagreeing with you, just not sold on how you phrased things.


What zop said plus to caveat the fight area benefits kurt more. Plenty of shadows to hid in a out. His ability is passive too btw. If this were solely h2h id give dick the edge.

Originally posted by carver9
Somebody probably should post NC fight against Sabertooth. Don't think Riv will turn over so easily with words. I can post it if no one has it.

Post it scan daddy

He has access to thr same resources but im sure they dont have the same level gear. I dont think anyone would compare nw gear to say bruces utility belt

Originally posted by carver9
Somebody probably should post NC fight against Sabertooth. Don't think Riv will turn over so easily with words. I can post it if no one has it.

Classic Kurt, not Current.

Powerset may be the same, but Creed did say that Kurt was never fighting like that. He was pissed by Logan's death, that's not the scenario we have here.

Anyway, since Dick has no HF, super-stamina or experience with Kurt's 'ports, he's getting beaten by being teleported alone...

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Classic Kurt, not Current.

Powerset may be the same, but Creed did say that Kurt was never fighting like that. He was pissed by Logan's death, that's not the scenario we have here.

Anyway, since Dick has no HF, super-stamina or experience with Kurt's 'ports, he's getting beaten by being teleported alone...

I understand that. People tend to argue "best of abilities" so much on the forum, why not give Kurt the same love.

Its interesting how some of you debate your characters the way you'd like them to be.
Characters usually arent as invincible as we'd like them to be.
You can debate them that way, but others will disagree.

As for me, i like to give both sides of a fight equal credence when possible.
I post my threads at 2 sites, and have often argued both sides at once, usually in response to posters using the trite "stomps easily" response.
If you guys were saying NW escrima sticked NC and tied his tail in a knot 10/10, i'd be disagreeing.

Originally posted by riv6672
Its interesting how some of you debate your characters the way you'd like them to be.
Characters usually arent as invincible as we'd like them to be.
You can debate them that way, but others will disagree.

As for me, i like to give both sides of a fight equal credence when possible.
I post my threads at 2 sites, and have often argued both sides at once, usually in response to posters using the trite "stomps easily" response.
If you guys were saying NW escrima sticked NC and tied his tail in a knot, i'd be disagreeing.

I can tell.

Anyways, the blending in shadows thing, Kurt tends to do this all of the time. Its one of his more consistent abilities that he never forgets.

Originally posted by carver9
I can tell.
Impressive how much sarcasm can come through in a post.

@original super senior member

Lol, no. It's one of his most forgotten abilities. Major screw-up, never fixed by writers/editors.

I'm not talking about stealth here - he literally used to be able to become invisible in the shadows.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
@original super senior member

Lol, no. It's one of his most forgotten abilities. Major screw-up, never fixed by writers/editors.

I'm not talking about stealth here - he literally used to be able to become invisible in the shadows.
Thats been pointed out here before, talking about. "Forgotten" powers. It was most prominent under Claremont in NCs case.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
@original super senior member

Lol, no. It's one of his most forgotten abilities. Major screw-up, never fixed by writers/editors.

I'm not talking about stealth here - he literally used to be able to become invisible in the shadows.

So it's stealth that he use now instead of melting into the shadows?

Originally posted by riv6672
Thats been pointed out here before, talking about. "Forgotten" powers. It was most prominent under Claremont in NCs case.

The problem with saying something was most prominent under Claremont is that he wrote X-Men for over a decade, and set the bar for a lot of how we understand the X-Men and their powers.

He wrote the definitive versions of several of the characters, among which you could include Nightcrawler.

Originally posted by carver9
So it's stealth that he use now instead of melting into the shadows?

Yeah, unless I missed writers suddenly bringing that power back after his "resurrection".

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, unless I missed writers suddenly bringing that power back after his "resurrection".

Has it actually been retconned?

^^^Good question.
As far as i can tell its just ignored for some reason.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Has it actually been retconned?

Don't think so. Nobody ever cared enough to clear up that mess.

Sigh.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Don't think so. Nobody ever cared enough to clear up that mess.

Sigh.

So like Colossus with magic, then. Shame.

Originally posted by -Pr-
So like Colossus with magic, then. Shame.

People actually like Nightcrawler, though.

Originally posted by -Pr-
So like Colossus with magic, then. Shame.
Oh wow, I'D forgotten that.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, unless I missed writers suddenly bringing that power back after his "resurrection".

Has an instance come up where its been mentioned

Sin for you.

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/sabretooth-vs-nightcrawler-1.jpg

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/sabretooth-vs-nightcrawler-2.jpg

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/sabretooth-vs-nightcrawler-3.jpg

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/sabretooth-vs-nightcrawler-4.jpg

https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/sabretooth-vs-nightcrawler-5.jpg

It was post-Axis, right?

Axis Revolutions #2.

Nightcrawler's character is vastly changed. REVERSED, you might say.

Carver once more does not understand the difference between 'in character' and using their abilities to the fullest.

Flash and Superman have heightened reactions. If you play a game, and realise mid game that your tactics are not working, you have the reaction speeds to switch tactics.

They are using their abilities to the fullest - but it does not mean they start the match with the intent to kill. they just have the ability to switch tactics quicker than their opponents, usually.

Nightcrawler has the same powerset - but not the character.

Sabretooth was changed, too

He still is, no? As in why is he a hero now?

Yeah, Axis affected him.

Pretty stupid, tbh. I mean... which attempt at redeeming Sabretooth it is? It never works for long, lol.

It was bloody awful. Then again, that whole arc was kinda crap.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, Axis affected him.

Pretty stupid, tbh. I mean... which attempt at redeeming Sabretooth it is? It never works for long, lol.

It did change him but that is Kurt using his ability to the fullest and even without the temptation to kill, the teleportation maneuver he was doing there is enough to get him the win here. That's IF we follow the wordings that has been going around the forum with people fighting with the mind of robots.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Axis Revolutions #2.

Nightcrawler's character is vastly changed. REVERSED, you might say.

Carver once more does not understand the difference between 'in character' and using their abilities to the fullest.

Flash and Superman have heightened reactions. If you play a game, and realise mid game that your tactics are not working, you have the reaction speeds to switch tactics.

They are using their abilities to the fullest - but it does not mean they start the match with the intent to kill. they just have the ability to switch tactics quicker than their opponents, usually.

Nightcrawler has the same powerset - but not the character.

Honestly Kurt could just get in close and tele-blitz him. A constant has been "If you don't build up a resistance, Kurt's teleportation will leave you sick and immobile." So he could just port him like 20 times in a row.

.

Kurt wins this btw. But carver loses.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
.

Kurt wins this btw. But carver loses.

this fight shouldn't even be close

And yet it is.

Not here on KMC

Three pages of back and forth beg to differ with you.

Nobody has picked Dick yet.

That wasnt my point.

I dont blame you for not getting it, though. I know half a page of "character A stomps" "character B stomps" is much easier for you to follow.

You should learn to relax sometime.

Dick doesn't have any good way of taking NC down.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Nobody has picked Dick yet.

Such low hanging fruit...

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You should learn to relax sometime.

Dick doesn't have any good way of taking NC down.



He's doing this because he made the thread. He wants it to last, but, he made a spite thread.

Here's a clue, Carver.
Just because you arent smart imaginative enough to figure out how one character might beat another, doesnt make it s spite thread.

Its not a spite thread but nc shouldnt lose. A better thread would have beem nc vs nw h2h only..but u neuter kurt by taking away his tp

Agreed. Has NC ever ranked on a top 10 MA list here? I honestly dont think so.

No, but the truth is that nine times out of ten, he doesn't need to be.

Kind of like Wolverine. Except Logan actually gets ranked.

Originally posted by -Pr-
No, but the truth is that nine times out of ten, he doesn't need to be.

This. His tp is one shot kill depending on his mindset

Originally posted by riv6672
Kind of like Wolverine. Except Logan actually gets ranked.

That and he can't teleport. It's an absolutely massive advantage, and Nightwing can't smell the sulphur or shift in the air like someone like Logan or Creed can.

Originally posted by Sin I AM
This. His tp is one shot kill depending on his mindset

Yup.

I meant Logan's damage soak and the need to duck. Or not to.
And again, NCs ports have been anticipated. Its a great combat power, i'm not low balling it, but its not fool proof.
NW surely has the skill and mental acumen to figure out NCs rhythm. That keeps getting overlooked.

Originally posted by riv6672
I meant Logan's damage soak and the need to duck. Or not to.
And again, NCs ports have been anticipated. Its a great combat power, i'm not low balling it, but its not fool proof.
NW surely has the skill and mental acumen to figure out NCs rhythm. That keeps getting overlooked.

It's not being overlooked, as much as it's being considered to be unlikely due to Nightwing needing time to work it out. Time when he's going to apparently dodge all of these attacks.

The only people who tend to predict it with any real success are people who've either trained with him enough to work out his habits (like Cyclops), or people with better senses.

How's about Iron Fist? He managed it with no prior knowledge of NC. It was even on a rooftop iirc.
For the record, i see it almost an even split.

Its not. And youre the only one that sees it that way. I give Kurt the strength, speed, agility, endurance edge over dick. Dick has a slight edge in h2h being a batman spawn but nc has teleportation which nullifies that.

Youd have to level the playing field like giving him prep

One bamf dazed Wolverine himself, when he wasn't used to it.

Imagine what it would do to someone with no healing factor or enhanced stamina.

Yeah, this in not a fight Nightwing can win. Riv, just stop bro.

Carver is the new authority in KMC! Beware of unintended shockwaves when he flexes.

^^^I'll take my chances.

Originally posted by riv6672
Agreed. Has NC ever ranked on a top 10 MA list here? I honestly dont think so.

Neither has Nightwing.

http://gifstumblr.com/images/come-at-me-bro_1132.gif

Why would u come at you over such a silly remark?
I'm not quite that bored today.

Seriously. The way Kurt fights will have Nightwing on edge. And he's proven plenty of times if he needs to or just feels like it, he can end a fight instantly by jumping you around. Dick has no defense against that, and unless you can prove he has no way of even so much as touching him with Kurt's superior...everything aside from h2h skills, and an unpredictable third arm. You're lying.

Riv's gonna keep riving

Wait...if Barry/Zoom time travelling to attack people as they're babies is considered self-BFR.....

Would Kurt be self-BFRing the instant he teleports to his dimension? Or has that been retconned?

Forum rules have obliterated the forum itself

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Wait...if Barry/Zoom time travelling to attack people as they're babies is considered self-BFR.....

Would Kurt be self-BFRing the instant he teleports to his dimension? Or has that been retconned?


It's not BFR. He teleports and is back a split second later. It's not like he teleports to his dimension and just hangs out there.

Originally posted by KingD19
It's not BFR. He teleports and is back a split second later. It's not like he teleports to his dimension and just hangs out there.

Then Zoom/Barry et all time travelling to the past to kill them as they're babies (admittedly, more a Zoom thing lol) is perfectly legal, as they can return to the battlefield the very moment they left - timey wimey!!!

Originally posted by KingD19
Seriously. The way Kurt fights will have Nightwing on edge. And he's proven plenty of times if he needs to or just feels like it, he can end a fight instantly by jumping you around. Dick has no defense against that, and unless you can prove he has no way of even so much as touching him with Kurt's superior...everything aside from h2h skills, and an unpredictable third arm. You're lying.
And you're charming.
You cant read very well, but, you're charming.
Classic NC can and has been hit.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/5/55750/2595892-759140_ironfist15enterthexmen113wb_super.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/61327/1387202-727367_ironfist15enterthexmen131in_super.jpg

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Riv's gonna keep riving
I never get tired of being right. And fair to both characters. And right.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Then Zoom/Barry et all time travelling to the past to kill them as they're babies (admittedly, more a Zoom thing lol) is perfectly legal, as they can return to the battlefield the very moment they left - timey wimey!!!

Okay I never mentioned Zoom. But that's not correct. Traveling through time to stop a fight from ever starting by killing someone in the past would be considered a BFR.

Teleporting from Point A to Point B two feet to the left in the span of a second isn't.

Originally posted by riv6672
And you're charming.
You cant read very well, but, you're charming.
Classic NC can and has been hit.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/5/55750/2595892-759140_ironfist15enterthexmen113wb_super.jpg
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/61327/1387202-727367_ironfist15enterthexmen131in_super.jpg


I never get tired of being right. And fair to both characters. And right.

Clearly you can't read very well. Because if you could, you'd realize in my post I was saying unless you can prove Nightwing has a way to not get hit by Kurt at all, then he has no defense against his teleportation blitz. As all he needs to do is touch him. And he has two arms, two legs, and a prehensile tail strong enough to lift and throw grown men like ragdolls.

Originally posted by KingD19
Okay I never mentioned Zoom. But that's not correct. Traveling through time to stop a fight from ever starting by killing someone in the past would be considered a BFR.

Teleporting from Point A to Point B two feet to the left in the span of a second isn't.

What's the difference?

Bear in mind, I am simply trying to initiate a discussion about forum rules.

From the battlefield's point of view, Zoom for example would never have left the field. 1 picosecond he's there, the next, he blinks out, then is back again. All in the blink of an eye.

He's left the battlefield, true. But so has Nightcrawler.

In Riv-verse, Nightwing's secret identity is Lord Rand.

He has a point.

Batman has tagged Kid Flash before.

Deathstroke has tagged Big Flash.

I bet Red Arrow would beat Wally West.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Bear in mind, I am simply trying to initiate a discussion about forum rules.

PM Bada, I'm sure he'll passionately talk about it with you.

Maybe he'll even fill the carv-void in your soul.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
What's the difference?

Bear in mind, I am simply trying to initiate a discussion about forum rules.

From the battlefield's point of view, Zoom for example would never have left the field. 1 picosecond he's there, the next, he blinks out, then is back again. All in the blink of an eye.

He's left the battlefield, true. But so has Nightcrawler.


Zoom using his speed to move around the battlefield wouldn't be BFR. But using his speed to actually not only leave the area, but go through time and outcome the effect of the fight is Self-BFR and cheating. As he actually has to leave, go somewhere else, do a thing, and then come back.

Teleportation is simply one of Kurt's powers that can be used in a fight., and it just so happens to need to go through another dimension to work, as 99% of teleporation in comics does. Counting that would count any teleporter using their powers as bfr. Or anyone who can fly going up into the air while their opponent is still on the ground.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Neither has Nightwing.

http://gifstumblr.com/images/come-at-me-bro_1132.gif

Well to be fair, he wouldn't be in the top ten, so...

^^^Haha

For the record, i've no problem changing my mind on the outcome of a thread (6/10 either way in this case). I just havent seen anything in this thread to compel me to do so:
The erroneous opinion that NC simply cant be touched.
That it takes enhanced senses to track his 'ports.
References to versions of NC that arent applicable here.
Feats he could perform if he were fighting out of character (blood lusted or under CBR rules).
So, fairly even split it is.

Originally posted by zopzop
Not to mention going invisible in shadows.

This is NC fight to lose.



Nightcrawler should win without much effort...

Someone post Nightwing get hit by a street thug.

Would that make you feel better, Carver?

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Haha

For the record, i've no problem changing my mind on the outcome of a thread (6/10 either way in this case). I just havent seen anything in this thread to compel me to do so:
The erroneous opinion that NC simply cant be touched.
That it takes enhanced senses to track his 'ports.
References to versions of NC that arent applicable here.
Feats he could perform if he were fighting out of character (blood lusted or under CBR rules).
So, fairly even split it is.

Well it does take enhanced senses as evidenced by dd, if, sabes etc..noone said he cant be touched (at least no serious poster). all it takes is a port and nw is either winded or out of the match. Not sure if you're just trolling or just completely out of touch with the characters

Iron Fist does it with common sense, and smelling brimstone.
If you think it takes enhanced senses to smell brimstone, or that Batman's top student lacks common sense, thats on you.


Nooice.



Neither.
What i am is dealing with posters who arent capable of changing their minds on a subject, and get progressively more irate in the face of simple truths.
Luckily, that tends to be pretty entertaining.

Originally posted by riv6672
Iron Fist does it with common sense, and smelling brimstone.
If you think it takes enhanced senses to smell brimstone, or that Batman's top student lacks common sense, thats on you.


Nooice.



Neither.
What i am is dealing with posters who arent capable of changing their minds on a subject, and get progressively more irate in the face of simple truths.
Luckily, that tends to be pretty entertaining.

Naw...what Im gathering is you kmow nothing of the character. Theres an atmospheric shift when nc ports. You need enhanced senses to pick that up. Which is what rand has. You dont just smell brimstone or sulfur and automatically know which direction he's coming from..its not that hard to understand. Quit reaching and take the L

Naw, what i'm gathering is you know nothing about how a nose works.
And there's no loss to take.
A fairly even split is what this fight is.
I mean, feel free to keep going, as you already know at this point its just something entrrtaining for me to look in on when i come to the site.

http://40.media.tumblr.com/55d89f1fe2d1c237736b1fef0e613142/tumblr_napbua7W4f1rvm5qqo1_500.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/0/3853/537721-nightcrawlerscan2.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/0/3853/537718-nightcrawlerscan1.jpg

Nightwing's use of his nose/common sense won't help much - unless he has a wingsuit I am unaware of? I know Batman has his cape that he uses to glide...

But in any case, NC outreacted Wolverine there, AND Omega Red.

See, great scans, very entertaining.

And if i wanted to i could post scans of NW doing cool things to opponents and claim thats how the fight would go.
And we'd both be right, because this is a close fight. Fairly even split.

Originally posted by riv6672
See, great scans, very entertaining.

And if i wanted to i could post scans of NW doing cool things to opponents and claim thats how the fight would go.
And we'd both be right, because this is a close fight. Fairly even split.

Would NW's opponents have the rough analogous powers to Kurt?

So for example, Omega Red has super strength, speed (travelling and reaction), agility, ranged physical powers, plus some fighting skills. He's no Nightwing, that's for sure, but he DOES have a HF to let him hang in there. But the point here is, Kurt beat him by outreacting him, then porting into the sky (this ignores his disorientation).

NW's cool scans (which I would love to see, btw) - would his opponents still have lost if they had Kurt's powers/skills? I would say that even if OR had a massive bump in skills to Nightwing's level, he still would have lost the exact same way, for example.

Well, like you said, your scans werent NW. Mine wouldnt be NC.
I see where you're going with this, and i've seen you do it to others quite brilliantly.
You're doing (well) what Carver did (badly) a page ago when he asked someone to post a scan of NW getting hit by thugs.
Still, since i'm not playing the "NW stomps easily" game, but instead saying its a good fairly even fight that can go either way, i'm fine with the tactic.

Again, i've seen nothing in 6 pages to make me think NC would take a significant majority.

Originally posted by riv6672
Well, like you said, your scans werent NW. Mine wouldnt be NC.
I see where you're going with this, and i've seen you do it to others quite brilliantly.
You're doing (well) what Carver did (badly) a page ago when he asked someone to post a scan of NW getting hit by thugs.
Still, since i'm not playing the "NW stomps easily" game, but instead saying its a good fairly even fight that can go either way, i'm fine with the tactic.

Again, i've seen nothing in 6 pages to make me think NC would take a significant majority.

You're saying that it's an even fight because you made the thread. Nightwing doesn't win a single match.

Well this thread was interesting till it got trolled.

Anyway great scans ds

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Well this thread was interesting till it got trolled.

Agreed. Carver's letting his anger cloud his opinion.

Originally posted by carver9
You're saying that it's an even fight because you made the thread. Nightwing doesn't win a single match.

Riv is changing his sig quicker than NC ports.

Dick is lucky he's not fighting riv here.

And Kurt is lucky he's not fighting Batman.

Doing a new sig every day for Black History month. Then back to my usual random pics.

Very specific thing about classic Kurt was that he - consistently - drained stamina from his foes after teleporting. To the point of knocking them out or severely weakening them.

Nowadays, it gets either ignored or most of his enemies/allies are already used to it, having faced/trained with Kurt dozens of times before.

Duncan was great as KP, btw.

He passed away so young.
And yeah, his Kingpin was a high point of a mostly average Daredevil movie outing.

Originally posted by riv6672
Agreed. Carver's letting his anger cloud his opinion.

Wasnt talking about carver

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Very specific thing about classic Kurt was that he - consistently - drained stamina from his foes after teleporting. To the point of knocking them out or severely weakening them.

Nowadays, it gets either ignored or most of his enemies/allies are already used to it, having faced/trained with Kurt dozens of times before.

Duncan was great as KP, btw.

Grayson doesn't have the luxury of training with him or building up ths stamina. Does anyone have a viable argument for nw winning? Id love to hear it

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Wasnt talking about carver
Oooooooh....!
Grayson doesn't have the luxury of training with him or building up ths stamina.
Neither did Iron Fist.
Does anyone have a viable argument for nw winning?
Been giving it over and over.
Id love to hear it
No, you wouldnt.
Your whole argument consists of NC fighting out of character and blitz porting right off the bat, ignoring the fact that the version being debated was often hit in battle, and acting like calling this fight fairly even is somehow saying NC gets stomped.
But hey, i'll be checking in this afternoon, by all means keep posting into the wind

Sigh. We already discussed if. Rand has enhanced senses. It's already been shown characters with enhanced senses can predict his ports so unless you can prove dick has enhanced senses you make no point.

Secondly if youd read any of his encounters thats how nc fights. He ports all over you till you're down. Shrugs. You seriously should brush up

NC wins every round.

@Sin
Haha, you're really pushing the posted scan as IF using heightened senses as opposed to skill and good training, IE, something NW couldnt replicate?
Nooice. Very entertaining.
Looks like the posting you're doing into the wind is blowing all over Carver, too.

Originally posted by riv6672
@Sin
Haha, you're really pushing the posted scan as IF using heightened senses as opposed to skill and good training, IE, something NW couldnt replicate?
Nooice. Very entertaining.
Looks like the posting you're doing into the wind is blowing all over Carver, too.

Well would you care to post a scan showing nightwing outreacting a teleporter...or better yet having skills on par with Iron Fist? U can even give an issue number id look it up myself

Originally posted by riv6672
^^^Haha

For the record, i've no problem changing my mind on the outcome of a thread (6/10 either way in this case). I just havent seen anything in this thread to compel me to do so:
The erroneous opinion that NC simply cant be touched.
That it takes enhanced senses to track his 'ports.
References to versions of NC that arent applicable here.
Feats he could perform if he were fighting out of character (blood lusted or under CBR rules).
So, fairly even split it is.

Not really. It isn't that 'Crawler can't be touched, just that he's not likely to be, all things considered.

He does have enhanced durability, btw.

Unlike some certain soft dick.

Plus, my scans were of normal Kurt AFAIK.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Plus, my scans were of normal Kurt AFAIK.

Normal, sure, but if one wants to nitpick, one can say modern =/= classic, because of experience and blahblahblah.

Classic Kurt wouldn't have the strength to telespam Red after being tortured.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Not really. It isn't that 'Crawler can't be touched, just that he's not likely to be, all things considered.

Not sure what things are being considered, but its not NCs appearances at the time of the version in this thread.
This is obviously attracting Mod attention, so i'll leave it at, "fairly even split could go either way/havent seen anything to change my mind".
Not worth getting warned over.

Classic Nightcrawler was still pretty good though.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1720889-nightcrawler_spider.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1720890-nightcrawler_spider2.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1720891-nightcrawler_spider3.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1720893-nightcrawler_spider4.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/36657/1720894-nightcrawler_spider5.jpg

Wait classic is meant by what?

I mean, even showings in the 90s (relatively recent to some of us) is still a good 20 years ago!

Interesting scans and good question.
As the non participatory thread starter i heartily approve.

Originally posted by riv6672
Not sure what things are being considered, but its not NCs appearances at the time of the version in this thread.
This is obviously attracting Mod attention, so i'll leave it at, "fairly even split could go either way/havent seen anything to change my mind".
Not worth getting warned over.

Who said anything about a warning?

What bracket are you saying "Classic" Kurt exists within?

Originally posted by -Pr-
Who said anything about a warning?

What bracket are you saying "Classic" Kurt exists within?
No offense, you've always been cool, but usually Mod appearances in (my) threads are like
http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--OmGh2gok--/mocoflnjc6ldegzhex4z.jpg
So, posters are free to interpret the OP as they wish. DS posed the question, too, i'm sure it'll get sussed out.