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Nox & Nyriss are in their prime.

Vader as of Rebels; Maul as of Son of Dathomir.

Legends feats are off-limits for Vader. Maul has his saberstaff.

Battle takes place on Dromund Kass.

Team two stomps.

Team two with Vader as the MVP

Team 2 with both as MVP's.

This force only?

Nothing says it is...

Just asking because it would actually be a really good fight if it was. As it is...

Team 1

LMAO.

Team 2 sweeps

Amping Vader is spite against Nyriss

Team 1 honestly stomps. Vader can't keep up with Nyriss in a lightsaber duel and stalemates her in the Force at best, and is two tiers beneath Nox as a Force user, pre-prime Nox was already trumping Thanaton, who is > Vader. Maul can be instantly ragdolled by Nyriss or Nox, he is a non-factor, and would die shortly in a regular duel too.

Nyriss was superior to hindered Meetra Surik and amped Scourge on a nexus, but even on that nexus, this duo managed to defeat a squad of Imperial Guardsmen. Guardsmen so powerfully amped by Vitiate, they were capable of semi-resistance to Revan's telekinesis, the same guy who ragdolled Satele, Marr, Beniko and a few others at once. That general Force flow amplification must have naturally amplified their reactions, speed, physicals, since Force's support just works that way. I can't even imagine how insanely dangerous these Guardsmen must have been, and Nyriss was still better than the people that trumped this team.

Nyriss pretty much stomps Vader in a fight, same with Maul.

Not to mention Nox, the Sith Lord that forced Thanaton into submission with Force alone, with Thanaton demonstrating Top 3 Lightning material in the entire mythos. Nox proven superior to him, and that was even before Nox's prime. Not sure about dueling but Nox could easily ragdoll Maul, or overpower Vader swiftly with the Force.

Team 1 for sure. Vader's TK is a threat, but he has no way of surviving a sorcery attack from either opponent. Same with Maul. Plus team 1 has the homefield advantage here with them knowing the environment much better than either of team 2 (who I doubt have ever visited the Kaas system). Unless Maul can take on Nyriss in sabers, and Vader somehow do the same with Nox, it's a clear win for team TOR. Maul can keep up with Nyriss (IMO) but idk if Vader would given his armor restrictions and such. Vader would beat Nox in a pure saber contest, however people always lowball her saber skills with a saberstaff. Add in Nox's Force ability and she'd probably last a solid while, or just stun him with a blast of lightning and finish him off with sorcery.

I go with team 1, myself. Nyriss can hold off Vader while Nox beats on Maul. While I'm not sure Maul would go down as easily as Thanaton, I can't really justify why not to myself. Probably Maul's fast and skilled enough to put up a fight but when Nox goes ham on him with the Force she should just beat him down Sidious-style.

Also people do lowball Nox's saber ability.

Nyriss would get clowned by Vader

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nyriss can hold off VaderIn what universe.

The universe where Vader has extended fights with people lesser than Nyriss.

As in, the Star Wars universe. Maybe you should try looking into it some time, cupcake.

You walked into that one. I had to do it!

What would have been nice was a good reason.

I'm pretty sure you already know all of Nyriss' shit. She clobbered Meetra and Scourge and has a ton of sorcery she could throw at Vader to keep him on his toes. I never bought into the fanon bullshit that Meetra was weakened. She performed her best feats on a planet vastly darker than Dromund Kaas, don't paint her as some wilting flower. Nyriss kicks ass, end of story. If she can hit Vader with her charged up lightning he'd be in serious trouble.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I'm pretty sure you already know all of Nyriss' shit. She clobbered Meetra and Scourge and has a ton of sorcery she could throw at Vader to keep him on his toes. I never bought into the fanon bullshit that Meetra was weakened. She performed her best feats on a planet vastly darker than Dromund Kaas, don't paint her as some wilting flower. Nyriss kicks ass, end of story. If she can hit Vader with her charged up lightning he'd be in serious trouble. And then Revan tooled her. Vader > Revan as of the novel, and Nyriss is not contending with him in lightsaber combat. She lasts 30 seconds tops, and certainly doesn't manage any spells.

EDIT: And as far as Meetra is concerned personally I see it as a gross misrepresentation of her character, and don't acknowledge continuity between her and KOTOR II.

ABC logic, dickbrain. Revan's tutaminis > Vader. You think he could pull off what Revan did? Hell no. And yes, Nyriss very much can contend with Vader in lightsaber combat. She tooled Meetra and Scourge despite being in the worst position, between two opponents with only one lightsaber. You think some pissant trandoshan can do better than her against Vader, like what happened in the comics recently? Naw, bro, naw.

Yeah, I ****ing hate it. But I don't debate fan headcanon's because if I did I'd just flip off the whole power hierarchy and start arguing Revan is Yoda level.

Hardly, Revan doesn't possess any innate talent in tutanimis, what he did was a display of raw power intended to demonstrate the disparity between their abilities. If Nyriss can't handle a Force user as powerful as Revan, she cannot handle Vader.

And as far as lightsaber ability is concerned, Scourge has above average ability (and its arguable his ability to draw on emotions would have been ineffective) and Meetra has no feats in the novel that put her above him. I'm serious when I say I don't acknowledge continuity with KOTOR II, because I see no reason to assume her KOTOR II dueling feats are applicable to the Drew's Meetra, when her Force feats clearly are not.

So we have Nyriss schooling two above-average duelists she's much faster than, cool, a Ventress-tier showing, if that.

You're putting the cart before the horse. That Revan pulled off that feat is indicative of immense ability with tutaminis. That lightning was powerful enough to vaporise a very powerful Force user even after having to shatter her force defenses. And Revan palmed that shit like it was piss-water. That's beyond anything Vader's capable of with defense. If you think all it indicates is raw power, then I guess Revan's raw power is just better than Vaders. And like I've said, Vader's gone round for round with people far below Nyriss. Has he ever destroyed someone on her level like Revan did? Pretty sure the answers no.

Lmao, why would Scourges ability be ineffective against a Sith who was fuming over getting royally ****ed over and being doomed? And frankly, I don't give a shit if you've decided to ignore certain parts of canon because you don't like them. I'm not actually trying to convince you here, I'm just giving you what you asked for. And since it has the backing of actual canon behind it, I think my reason should be good enough for you.

Ventress can contend with Vader in sabers, so nice that you agree with me. GG 2 EZ.

Originally posted by Nephthys
You're putting the cart before the horse. That Revan pulled off that feat is indicative of immense ability with tutaminis. That lightning was powerful enough to vaporise a very powerful Force user even after having to shatter her force defenses. And Revan palmed that shit like it was piss-water. That's beyond anything Vader's capable of with defense. If you think all it indicates is raw power, then I guess Revan's raw power is just better than Vaders. And like I've said, Vader's gone round for round with people far below Nyriss. Has he ever destroyed someone on her level like Revan did? Pretty sure the answers no.The lightning never vaporised anyone but her depleted self, so not inclined to believe its anything more than hyperbole. And seeing as we've no reason to believe Revan has extraordinary talent in tutanimis that exceeds what his raw power would imply possible, yeah its raw power.

How this makes Revan better than Vader I don't know, since Vader lacks comparable feats but matches Revan in all comparable respects.

And yes he has, Dooku, well before his prime, pushed his shit within 15 seconds as I recall. He may not be as mobile as he once was and had a form advantage but the former he makes up for in power, and the latter is irrelevant in the face of Nyriss having nothing on Dooku's skill - and with the nexus leveling the playing field, she doesn't even have his power. Girl is done.

As for these individuals Vader has gone "round and round with" name them, I can think of none.Because Scourge wasn't even able to mount a proper attack? He was caught completely off guard and pushed onto the defensive, no way did he have a chance to settle in his form.

And without it he can't even handle a dozen patrol drones.I'm not ignoring anything. You are assuming continuity between KOTOR II and Revan and I'm asking you to prove it. It's no different from assuming TCW Grievous capable of his OCW feats. He ain't. Ventress would be obliterated by Vader in combat 10/10. Lmao.

I have to.... prove continuity between KOTOR II and Revan?

What?

Do you surrender?

10/10 post Beni. Neph clearly has to prove that there is continuity between KOTOR II and the novel.

Its pretty simple bro, Drew is not writing Meetra to be as powerful as she is in KOTOR II, there is no continuity between their abilities.

I'd say he was actually submitting to KOTOR's hype. You know, KOTOR wanked 2 things the most: Revan and hidden sith. The novel also wanks those two things.

Hell, according to KOTOR II, Vitiate's empire is the descendant of Sith who had multiple Nihilus level drainers, and was >>> KOTOR in dueling.

The novel doesn't portray all powerful gods that can solo the Republic in a day.

Neither do the sourcebooks that appear before said novel.

Also again, where is Nyriss beating Meetra solidly? She won physically not in skill or power, Meetra's defenses largely held regardless of Scourge's POV.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
The novel doesn't portray all powerful gods that can solo the Republic in a day.

Arguably it did show a Sith absolutely curbstomping someone who massacred Kreia, Sion and legions of Trayas Assassin's on a immensely powerful nexus + gravity well, after surviving a crash and fighting through storm beasts.

'Curbstomp'? No offense Neph but the only one who got 'stomped' was Scourge.

Freshest missing the point, and Neph wording it better than I do is my KMC usual now.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Arguably it did show a Sith absolutely curbstomping someone who massacred Kreia, Sion and legions of Trayas Assassin's on a immensely powerful nexus + gravity well, after surviving a crash and fighting through storm beasts.
Which goes back to what Beni is saying about Meetra not being as powerful as she was in KotOR II, not that this has a point because the Sith of the Sith Empire still aren't nearly as powerful as they're hyped to be in KotOR II. Except Hord I guess.

Which is still very arguable, because in all three of Meetra's fights she is still suffering a week's worth of terrible conditions, starting with nearly losing her mind and very existence on Nathema and followed by four days of no sleep or sustenance before landing on a nexus that is stated to significantly diminish her connection to the light side of the Force.

Despite that she completely out-performs Scourge twice.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Which is still very arguable, because in all three of Meetra's fights she is still suffering a week's worth of terrible conditions, starting with nearly losing her mind and very existence on Nathema and followed by four days of no sleep or sustenance before landing on a nexus that is stated to significantly diminish her connection to the light side of the Force.

Despite that she completely out-performs Scourge twice.
Not really important. As great as defending the Exile must be, her performance against Nyriss and how much of a fight she could have put up then is.

It's called context Fresh.

Sure, but it's not what matters when you're trying to claim the Sith in TOR balls-to-the-wall gods.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Which is still very arguable, because in all three of Meetra's fights she is still suffering a week's worth of terrible conditions, starting with nearly losing her mind and very existence on Nathema and followed by four days of no sleep or sustenance before landing on a nexus that is stated to significantly diminish her connection to the light side of the Force.

Despite that she completely out-performs Scourge twice.

Nathema did no permanent damage to her, in fact I don't think it actually did anything to her except psyche her out, she sustained herself with the Force as was mentioned in the story (and theres no real indication that she didn't eat something or get some rest after researching the data on Nathema) and Malachor makes Kaas look like a picnic by comparison.

5 votes for N&N?

Time to an hero

Originally posted by Sinious
I'd say he was actually submitting to KOTOR's hype. You know, KOTOR wanked 2 things the most: Revan and hidden sith. The novel also wanks those two things.

Hell, according to KOTOR II, Vitiate's empire is the descendant of Sith who had multiple Nihilus level drainers, and was >>> KOTOR in dueling. Considering how powerful they actually are, that really doesn't make it any less logical to assume that Drew was portraying Meetra as an individual who, as Neph pointed out, defeated Traya after wading through legions of assassins and Sith on an immense DS nexus, when she's getting her shit pushed in by Nyriss in seconds. Understand that he admits to not having even played the game.

If we follow that to its logical conclusions it makes Darth Nyriss vastly more powerful than Traya, Revan Yoda-tier for stomping her and Vitiate equal to the Father (or Traya was just a parlour trick lady and a scrub). If that's acceptable in your books, cool, but I'll politely agree to disagree and you can go join Legend in the corner.

EDIT: Double post.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Nathema did no permanent damage to her, in fact I don't think it actually did anything to her except psyche her out, she sustained herself with the Force as was mentioned in the story (and theres no real indication that she didn't eat something or get some rest after researching the data on Nathema) and Malachor makes Kaas look like a picnic by comparison.

She was going to be mentally husked by the void... how is that not damaging? Yes sustained herself with the Force over a number of days, as a pro-Bane supporter like me I'd assume you'd recognise why that is very difficult.

The indication is that as soon as she'd gotten the appropriate coordinates from T3 she went straight to Dromund Kaas, and started her scouting mission. Four days of fatigue, insomnia and starvation can only be partially remedied by repeated sessions of Force meditation. What worsened this is that the first time she had any time to recover, she attempted meditation to gain enlightenment but was incapable due to the darkness of the planet.

To actually recover she'd need a day of recuperation, the closest she gets to that is after fighting Nyriss where she spends hours watching Bastila's holo on repeat with Revan, after this they went to the citadel and started their assassination attempt in the midst of chaos. During this travel Surik enters a form of Battle Mind, this is the only time she manages any recuperation.

Believe me, I over-analysed the novel like hell the last few weeks.