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Judged by an omniscient, impartial AI.

How far does he get?

Warm up:

1. Janus
2. SW_Legend
3. Nebaris
4. Jensaarai
5. Sinious

Rounds:

6. Carthage
7. Lord Lucien
8. Nai
9. Silver5871 or whatever his name is
10. Wolfninjajedi

Bosses:

11. Advent
12. The Tempest
13. Michael Wong
14. Master Han
15. Ben Sprung-Keyser

Bonus round: Gideon gets Neph

Hard paineful stop at Wolf.

Stops at the Tempest. Dunno why, I just have this feeling about it.

Also no nexus feats for Gideon.

For real though he loses to Janus. As he always did.

O rilly? How many posters would back Ragnos against DE Palpatine in 2016?


(For real though, every time I stumble upon a pre 2007 thread, I have to cringe through Janus's palpable idiocy. At least nebaris is eloquent.)

Loses to Tempest in round one.

In the bonus round stops at whoever the **** Janus is tho.

So Neph makes Gideon weaker?

Only at the knees.

Anyhow, he might stop at Advent or Tempest. Hard stop at Wong. Dirty, dirty evisceration at Master Han.

There's literally no way he gets past Nai. That man isn't human.

Meh, Nai strikes me as someone whose eloquence makes him sound much smarter than he actually is. Like nebaris, except obviously far greater.

The tempest is at his prime now, he's a far more superior debater than Gideon ever was. Stops there.

I'm not sure about that. Gideon may had already reached his full potential; there comes a certain point when the marginal gains in experience are outweighed by decreasing fluid intelligence/passion/energy/relevance. Not sure exactly where it is for The Shadow.

https://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=119010

For all of my life, I have demonstrated narcissistic and egocentric traits, and this has typically manifested itself when I debate with other people. My family enjoys exchanging stories about how, when I was five- or six- or seven-years-old, I would constantly ask questions and debate with either my parents, grandparents, aunts and uncles -- not necessarily about anything intellectually stimulating (I have been considered "gifted" all throughout my educational career, though I don't think I'm regarded as anything approaching "genius" or "prodigy" -- but about anything. And, a common fact for those who know me seems to be that I am undeniably stubborn and shackled by the strengths of my so-called convictions; by that, I mean, when I absolutely -- positively -- believe that I am right, and I am debating, there is no middle ground, and I have to convince the opposition that I am right. Now, obviously, this has not always worked; I've either been proven to be wrong, or people still refuse to accept what I consider to be an obvious truth. We could go on and on about where I believe this problematic trait derived itself from, but I didn't make this thread with the intent to simply vent on my frustration.

Since October 18th, 2005 (I was 14-years-old), I have been a member of KMC forums. For those three years, I debated in the Star Wars versus section. Admittedly, I have always been a fan of the Emperor since the very first day I watched the movies (for me, the key to a good sci-fi, drama, or action movie is a worthy villain), and so when I arrived, I was in for a surprise: Palpatine was considered an impossibly weak Sith Lord who accomplished his considerable goals through "luck" and by being the "benefactor of circumstance". So, I fought and fought and fought for three years, arguing to the contrary against a cabal of highly intelligent and much older users who were nonetheless gripped by unbelievable bias and dogma (they made tremendous arguments that Dooku, even, was superior to Darth Sidious).

Now, eventually, we managed to convince the rest of the forum about Palpatine's status as the most powerful Sith Lord and this cabal abdicated the forums entirely. But this new user, known as Nebaris (it was his first username) has been repeatedly been banned for being a sock after his original account was removed for rule breaking. Now, he's clearly very intelligent, but has taken the role of "devil's advocate" to a new extreme. We've all tried and tried for the past year to refute his constant assertions that Palpatine is actually a weak Sith Lord. The most recent thread is this (where he has only posted for the last few pages, the rest were posts made by the original cabal -- I am the user Gideon):

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/show ... st10207759

...Basically, to cut it short, I've thrown everything I can at him and he attempts to argue it. Thus back to my original problem: I feel that I've failed somehow, and by not continuing to argue it, by "agreeing to disagree" (the failed tactic I tried here), I am conceding the argument itself, when I know I'm right. But I just lack the ambition, I guess, to argue it.

Whew. So... what should I do (in both this problem and in the obvious mentality I have)?


Oh my...oh my god...this revelation...HOLY SHIT I'M DYING!!!!!!!!!!!

The Shadow severs.

lmfao

Originally posted by The Ellimist
I'm not sure about that. Gideon may had already reached his full potential; there comes a certain point when the marginal gains in experience are outweighed by decreasing fluid intelligence/passion/energy/relevance. Not sure exactly where it is for The Shadow.

^^ apparently not, seeing as how Gideon would only be 24-25 now, .ie around the time fluid intelligent peaks. But it's also possible that he's drifted away from the activity, ceding finally that The Ellimist has overtaken his specter.

http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/originals/c8/a0/b6/c8a0b60df193f2e5d40ac3a18333d98b.jpg

Very few are not, particularly younglings like yourself. The olden days of the arena featured many contestants.

Lucien was luminous, a gilded idol, a swirl of eloquence for a meek whisper of intelligence.

Advent was the night, a sky consumed by the illuminated suns, cascading in the luminous brilliance of her tongue.

And then there was Gideon, of course: he was beyond logic. His posts showed nothing of what might have been reasoned within. Though seen with the very essence of analysis, Gideon was an event horizon. Beneath his entirely ordinary surface was absolute, perfect intellect. Genius beyond measure. A black hole of human knowledge.

I always found him to be slightly flaccid myself.

The key to Advent's departure is the moment when she and Nai realize The Shadow is no longer defined by his IP address, but has become a chaotic nexus of factual deductions that swell and burst open the fabric of logic, tearing apart every argument in its vicinity, unpopular and believed.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I always found him to be slightly flaccid myself.


I'm not entirely sure what catalyzed the rift between you and the dearly departed Gideon, but I don't think that's always been the case.

Gideon has spent years studying the most piercing and sophisticated debating methods. It is believed that he has mastered nearly all the known arguments, previously unknown insights, and devises new deductions at his pleasure.


- Dark Debater Sourcebook

He doesn't think Heath Ledgers Joker performance is the greatest bad guy role ever put to screen (rivaled only by Kylo Ren). He's dead to me.

Originally posted by Nephthys
(rivaled only by Kylo Ren) Just to be clear cause I heard people say this, are you serious?

Originally posted by Nephthys
(rivaled only by Kylo Ren)

Ledger's convulsing in his grave. Congratulations, you've incited post-mortem epilepsy.

If you sincerely believe that, you only confirm my theory that you're attracted to weak, ineffective villains.

Beyond the vision of the forum moderators, somewhere within the fandom, the greatest master debater ever to see Killer movies bides his bandwidth. As his wit grows, his arguments begin to shape the course of the forum, and his rebuttals await the antediluvians.


- The Complete Debating Dictionary

I cause post and pre-mortem convulsions in many people just walking down the street, big deal (I guess live next to a graveyard?).

Lol.

i'm not sure if u all fuggots don't know tempest=gideon or just trolling or just committing some retarded poetry

ohmygod whaaaaaaaaat????

No way Gideon was Tempest all along?

Originally posted by Nephthys
I cause post and pre-mortem convulsions in many people just walking down the street, big deal (I guess live next to a graveyard?).

Lol.

wat

Originally posted by The_Tempest
http://media-cache-ec0.pinimg.com/originals/c8/a0/b6/c8a0b60df193f2e5d40ac3a18333d98b.jpg I still hear his voice

Originally posted by Nephthys
ohmygod whaaaaaaaaat????

Not sure if u didn't notice but Bart just 10/10 trolled you

Yeah, I already knew.

Gideon was brilliance incarnate. It was like staring into the heart of Star Wars.

- Sidious666

Gideon clears with absolute ease. Your false idles don't hold a candle.

^ lol @ him passing Wong or Han.

On Publius, The Gideon's master:

Publius was the most brilliant debater who ever lived. But could he be the only one who was never banned?

^ presumably the "most brilliant" title refers to before 2010 Gideon, since that's when Gideon begins receiving the GOAT accolade.

Caseiden > Tempest either way

Did Caseiden ever join KMC? Gideon's GOAT quotes are binding for anyone's debating level pre-2010.

Oh, wait, you said Tempest. Yeah, he's good, but not a GOAT contender; probably early DE hewhoknowsall level.

Caseiden one-shotted Skillz with Kenth Hamner & Valin Horn > Freedon Nadd and proceeded to an hero right after the debate not giving a fug

You can't really surpass that

Kek, I remember that.

That was an weakened SKILLZ

still best feat known to SW debating

Yeah, he totally didn't do that on a nexus, with respect threads or anything...

Without nexuses and respect threads he's Nai or Silver level at best.

EDIT: maybe I'm being a little harsh on him...but he's still not = Gideon. I'd say he's slightly below Tempest.

Nah, no respect threads, just full authorial analysis

I still can't believe he literally ended his own life

The world is lesser without him.

And to think he provided so much without even mastering English above google-translator-tier

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Kek, I remember that.

That was an weakened SKILLZ

What were you weakened by?

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Gideon was brilliance incarnate. It was like staring into the heart of Star Wars.

- Sidious666

lmao

Unleashing the full power of his hatred, he conjures a wall of text that threatens to dominate all of the internet, including the antediluvian fleet.

Gideon = internet-buster confirmed.

Originally posted by Nephthys
There's literally no way he gets past Nai. That man isn't human.

While I agree with the first sentence, I can't agree with the second one. Still profiled, though.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Meh, Nai strikes me as someone whose eloquence makes him sound much smarter than he actually is. Like nebaris, except obviously far greater.

That's quite ironic for three reasons.

1)
I'm not even utilizing my primary language here (that would be German).
That leads to the question: Doesn't mastering a second language to an extend, where my eloquence can make me look smarter than I am, require me to be rather smart in the first place?

2)
Eloquence and smartness aren't mutually exclusive. If anything, the opposite is the case. That doesn't mean that people can't use their talent in rhetorics for wrong reasons. And I'm not excluding myself from that line of inquisition.

3)
I wonder how I could have made that impression, provided we have never interacted.

And back to the topic: Gideon would stop at Janus.

Nai's back?

Da hell am I(Wolfninjajedi) on the list for? I hardly debate.

Originally posted by Col. Valerian
Nai's back?

Have I ever been away?
My visits here have just become infrequent for various reasons.

Or is this some question regarding my reverse side?

Originally posted by Nai
Have I ever been away?
My visits here have just become infrequent for various reasons.

Or is this some question regarding my reverse side?

It definitely is regarding your reverse side.




Nah, make those visits frequent.

Originally posted by Nai
While I agree with the first sentence, I can't agree with the second one. Still profiled, though.

Originally posted by Nai
And back to the topic: Gideon would stop at Janus.

https://media.giphy.com/media/dC9DTdqPmRnlS/giphy.gif

Originally posted by Nai

1)
I'm not even utilizing my primary language here (that would be German).
That leads to the question: Doesn't mastering a second language to an extend, where my eloquence can make me look smarter than I am, require me to be rather smart in the first place?

2)
Eloquence and smartness aren't mutually exclusive. If anything, the opposite is the case. That doesn't mean that people can't use their talent in rhetorics for wrong reasons. And I'm not excluding myself from that line of inquisition.


Eloquence and intelligence are not mutually exclusive; they're probably positively correlated with one another. I just suggested that in your case, the former is disproportionately impressive to the latter. It doesn't mean you're stupid; TBH everyone here is probably at least smarter than average so we're all evaluating these terms by arbitrary reference points anyway.

Of course, I'm only guessing your intelligence through the quality of your arguments as a proxy, so maybe the former is disproportionately great to the latter. Or perhaps I'm biased because I'm a Sidious-is-the-strongest guy. Or maybe I was baiting you to see if you were still around. Beats me.



Well, I am known as someone who knows all.



Janus is as much of an ******** as Gideon, but unlike his nemesis lacks the eloquence or debating ability to compensate.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Meh, Nai strikes me as someone whose eloquence makes him sound much smarter than he actually is. Like nebaris, except obviously far greater.

You have it the other way around. It was actually that Nebaris's smartness made him seem much more eloquent than he actually is.

Originally posted by appletonia
You have it the other way around. It was actually that Nebaris's smartness made him seem much more eloquent than he actually is.

Sorry, I mean Nai and Nebaris are similar in the ratio of their eloquence to their substance, but Nai's absolute scores are much higher.

Originally posted by Nephthys
For real though he loses to Janus. As he always did.

https://media1.giphy.com/media/26AHLBZUC1n53ozi8/200_s.gif

Stealth Moose beats him.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Stealth Moose beats him.

Wow, your head's so far up his ass you're wearing his colon for a hat

Lel.

Originally posted by Selenial
Wow, your head's so far up his ass you're wearing his colon for a hat You aren't wrong.

Originally posted by Col. Valerian
Nai's back? He is too cowardly to stay.

Originally posted by Col. Valerian
Nai's back? He posted this yesterday, so yeh.

Done at Silver

Originally posted by Nephthys
For real though he loses to Janus. As he always did.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
He posted this yesterday, so yeh. Key word is stay. If the definition of that word stay confuses you pm me ASAP.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
https://bbs.stardestroyer.net/viewtopic.php?t=119010

For all of my life, I have demonstrated narcissistic and egocentric traits, and this has typically manifested itself when I debate with other people.
Self awareness is the first step.

Silver.

Someone lure this silver onto kmc. Can it be done ?

Silver's pretty much retired at this point, but yeah Silver's better.

Silver went ghost again. He prolly won't appear again for another 1-2 years, unfortunately.

Someone contact him and make him come out of retirement. I want to see this chap on kmc. Someone force his hand. What is it with everyone retiring from what a few years of debating ? This angers me.

Silver's been around for a while, and on top of being a good debater, unlike so many others he doesn't act like an egotistical **** or a condescending prick.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Silver's been around for a while, and on top of being a good debater, unlike so many others he doesn't act like an egotistical **** or a condescending prick. We need more people like Silver.

We need more people like Quanchi tbh

Originally posted by Sinious
We need more people like Quanchi tbh There can be only one.

Originally posted by |King Joker|
We need more people like Silver. Bring him to me.

http://rs1263.pbsrc.com/albums/ii635/Xenandgabrielle/Misc/tumblr_lpomiiIJHN1qii6tmo1_400.gif~c200

Ah, this thread.

Also, Silver probably wouldn't spar with you, Quan.

So tempest knows this elusive silver. We need a universal forum to bridge together the various online worlds out there.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So tempest knows this elusive silver. We need a universal forum to bridge together the various online worlds out there.

Yeah. He was ComicVine's reigning Sheevite and MVP, a worthy disciple of the most glorious cause of all.

He preferred the scholarly wall-of-text approach of yore. Didn't mock, didn't troll.

Boss should be Ant or making his own versus video.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Yeah. He was ComicVine's reigning Sheevite and MVP, a worthy disciple of the most glorious cause of all.

He preferred the scholarly wall-of-text approach of yore. Didn't mock, didn't troll. So this no good son of a ***** would doubt Khan's superiority over the geriatric with poor posture. He seems to debate the same way I do!!!!!

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Yeah. He was ComicVine's reigning Sheevite and MVP, a worthy disciple of the most glorious cause of all.

He preferred the scholarly wall-of-text approach of yore. Didn't mock, didn't troll. We need more of those types.

Well first of, Silver's not a mere disciple for any cause, he's done enough in recent times to be considered the champion of it. He's a lovely dude and comes off as unbiased as possible and really knows how to explain himself thoroughly. That I think, is the crucial point. Which is why so many of his Ideas are repeated today.

That's not to say he's the strongest arguer right now. Because right now, ILS might be a little tougher.

Opinions vary. I'd like to have this poster but I doubt it'll ever happen unless one of you contacts him to extend the invitation. Kmc needs new lifeblood.

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
Well first of, Silver's not a mere disciple for any cause, he's done enough in recent times to be considered the champion of it. He's a lovely dude and comes off as unbiased as possible and really knows how to explain himself thoroughly. That I think, is the crucial point. Which is why so many of his Ideas are repeated today.


Originally posted by Ziggystardust
That's not to say he's the strongest arguer right now. Because right now, ILS might be a little tougher.

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
Well first of, Silver's not a mere disciple for any cause, he's done enough in recent times to be considered the champion of it. He's a lovely dude and comes off as unbiased as possible and really knows how to explain himself thoroughly. That I think, is the crucial point. Which is why so many of his Ideas are repeated today.

That's not to say he's the strongest arguer right now. Because right now, ILS might be a little tougher.

Disciple and champion aren't mutually exclusive. Silver is a loyal Sheevite.

In his absence, ILS is definitely CV's reigning champion.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Opinions vary. I'd like to have this poster but I doubt it'll ever happen unless one of you contacts him to extend the invitation. Kmc needs new lifeblood.

Quan, while I adore you for your ability to incite nerd shitstorms, Silver wouldn't give you the time of day. He doesn't enjoy your kind of shenanigans as I do, let alone be willing to partake in them. He's pretty much got a zero tolerance policy for people he considers to be trolls, unreasonable, or dishonest.

He basically told Neph of all people to go fvck off after one or two exchanges.

Originally posted by The_Tempest
Quan, while I adore you for your ability to incite nerd shitstorms, Silver wouldn't give you the time of day. He doesn't enjoy your kind of shenanigans as I do, let alone be willing to partake in them. He's pretty much got a zero tolerance policy for people he considers to be trolls, unreasonable, or dishonest.

He basically told Neph of all people to go fvck off after one or two exchanges. Well maybe he'd accept a battlezone a judged debate then so he's so super sensitive. Maybe a little Trek vs. Wars action.

Nah. You'd have to modify your approach so utterly that you wouldn't even vaguely resemble the quan. And the quan would never be so weak as to compromise.

Silver's a true paragon. He's a sass-free scholar. Dude shits out every post as though it were a college dissertation. That combination of dedication, thoughtfulness, and general serenity is exceedingly rare.

If the mighty Tempest finds Silver worthy of His words, I must prostrate myself now. *bows to Silver*

Ignorant AND a follower? What a combination

Originally posted by Emperordmb





Seriously DMB, I do think that. In a 1 on 1 situe Silver would be on the receiving end in a debate with him. And I'm aware that might not be the most popular opinion right now, given some of the weird stances ILS has pledged himself to as of late. But I can't see many others defending themselves or those ideas as eloquently or as powerfully as him. Now, Silver is a far more influential figure, especially when it comes to the fundamental Lore of Star Wars fighting - the Force and external aid; such as "amps, nexuses ect". And when you look at his postings, it's pretty easy to see why that is. His knowledge of the universe is very broad; and to elaborate, he's possibly read more literature than anyone else on the subject.

So when you have a nice library stacked up, and more sources to draw upon when a situation calls, you can use larger variety of quotes to prove your points from every era. For this reason alone, Silver has the most informative blogs. He's good at coming up with ideas based on that source material and generally getting people to agree with his interpretations. But that's where Silver's edge rests. When you can relax on producing the most amount of citations at any given point, there isn't much need for further debate. That's not to say he's inept in that regard; because he's far from it. But ILS is simply better.

And come one now, with regards to ILS, the dude know's how to debate. He's talented, unrelenting and more likely to challenge Silver on certain points that others wouldn't, while simultaneously making his own premises as hard to refute as possible. What's more is he does it naturally. I do think he could use some refinement in certain areas, but the arguing can just look effortless for him.

Originally posted by TheNuisanceBird
Boss should be Ant or making his own versus video.

Oh ILS is a great debater, but I wouldn't put peak ILS (ie. pre weird stances and feats are meaningless paradigm) above Silver, even if I think he'd give him a damn good fight.

Mixed feelings on Silver's merit as a debater, but he's certainly one of the smartest chaps ever to grace the community. That said, ILS is much more my style.

I'm told Silver treated DMB with some measure of civility, if not outright respect. That kind of validation probably means the world to him; it certainly explains his posts here.

ILS style vs. Silver's, Sas?

Silver's unquestionably the most knowledgeable person on CV when it comes to SW and particularly the Force, but I'd put ILS as the best debater.

Where do you guys have JXM, then?

Originally posted by The_Tempest
I'm told Silver treated DMB with some measure of civility, if not outright respect. That kind of validation probably means the world to him; it certainly explains his posts here.

He's done that to everyone, recently. His days of stomping on people seem to have gone, he's a lot more open and respectful to people now.

Not sure if I've missed it, but perhaps the Sheevite Majesty himself might want to announce where he thinks he'd stop in this gauntlet?

I love JXM; he was one of my biggest influences as a debaters, but homeboy is overrated as phuck these days.

He's like, a current level me Star Wars debaters, only half as entertaining, and nowhere near as witty. A lot more articulate and grammaticaly sound, tho.

Sounds like the general consensus on CV, actually. It's interesting, since Silver thought JXM was his equal. I wonder if JXM really was like that when he let it all out.

I am merely His Imperial Majesty's humble acolyte. JediXMan is a moderator, right? Can't say I've seen any arguments from him.

It's funny: Silver was always pretty nice as far as I remember. Was he hostile at one point?

Originally posted by The_Tempest
I am merely His Imperial Majesty's humble acolyte. JediXMan is a moderator, right? Can't say I've seen any arguments from him.

It's funny: Silver was always pretty nice as far as I remember. Was he hostile at one point?

JXM hasn't debated in years. His time was before I arrived on CV. Then again, I remember you debating Janus and Darth Sexy on KMC back in the '05-10 era. I have been around for quite a while, just not on CV.

Silver was never hostile, just not as nice as he has been recently. I mean, if he respects you, he treats you as an equal.

Intriguing.

An quality thread

LMAO, ellimist is the 2nd best thread maker oat, second to only 2015~ era Jack lol.

12, in round one, 6 in bonus.

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Judged by an omniscient, impartial AI.

How far does he get?

Warm up:

1. Janus
2. SW_Legend
3. Nebaris
4. Jensaarai
5. Sinious

Rounds:

6. Carthage
7. Lord Lucien
8. Nai
9. Silver5871 or whatever his name is
10. Wolfninjajedi

Bosses:

11. Advent
12. The Tempest
13. Michael Wong
14. Master Han
15. Ben Sprung-Keyser

Bonus round: Gideon gets Neph
He clears warm-up but is pushed to his limits by SW_Legend not really

In rounds: he possibly clears. Gideon vs. Nai is a classic. I also have a feeling Silver's SW knowlege is broader than Gideon's, perhaps.

In bosses: Dies ether to The Tempest or Master Han in an epic fight.


For bonus:
Neph is a dead weight and Gideon needs to make up for that. He may die at Nai given that Neph will get in the way of logic and reason dished out by Gideon. This may create an oppening for Nai to exploit.

Originally posted by Sirion_Of_Doom
LMAO, ellimist is the 2nd best thread maker oat, second to only 2015~ era Jack lol.

he dies at me reping TOR fodder

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Advent was the night, a sky consumed by the illuminated suns, cascading in the luminous brilliance of her tongue.