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Baleman
Captain America
Daredevil
Winter Soldier
Ozy
Bullseye
Elektra
Black Widow
Catwoman (Nolan)
Nite-Owl

Ozy
Cap
Bucky
Baleman
Daredevil
Bullseye
Black widow
Nite owl
Elektra
Catwoman

Captain America / Winter Soldier
Ozy
-Batfleck-
Widow
DD (Netflix)
Elektra (Netflix)
DD / Bullseye (movie)
Nite-owl
Elektra (movie)

Nolanverse was pretty crap

Captain America
Winter Soldier
Black Widow
Daredevil
DCEU Batman
Elektra
Ozymandias
Baleman
Nite Owl
Catwoman


No idea where to rank Daredevil (movie) characters as I haven't seen the film

People actually see captain America as ozy superior fighting wise?

I believe cap can beat ozy because of his strength... but as far as fighting skills ozy clearly had better hands

Let's not forget he usually fights with his shield.

Cap was able to contend with Ultron and Loki, which is so far above killing an Old man and two guys who only beat up Prison thugs.

Ozy is one of the most overrated characters in the versus forum. Cap would humiliate him in a fight. Daredevil and Black Widow have fought more skilled individuals than Ozymandias.

He contended with them because of his shield and his super human stats... that's my point.

Ozy was never touched in watchmen. Hell he even caught a bullet to further illustrate his hand eye coordination.
Cap on the other hand took hits from just about everyone.

let me illustrate... ip man vs hulk... ip man obviously better at h2h but hulk would crush mr.ip... am i making sense?

Get out of your feelings bro

Some of the ratings are more stat based then skill based imo.

I'd like to see Cap catch a bullet.

Cap's only ever been shot when he wasn't paying attention.

If Bucky's fast enough to whip his arm up and block a bullet, I'd say Cap can do something similar.

Also I count avoiding directed and continuous vulcan gun fire while riding a motorcycle in a straight line towards the gun firing at you is more impressive than catching a bullet after a gun is pointed at you in the same spot for 30 seconds.

Originally posted by carthage
Captain America
Winter Soldier
Black Widow
Daredevil
DCEU Batman
Elektra
Ozymandias
Baleman
Nite Owl
Catwoman


No idea where to rank Daredevil (movie) characters as I haven't seen the film

Wait, how is BW and Batman more skilled in h2h than Ozy? I don't agree with some others, but these specifically

Originally posted by KingD19
Cap's only ever been shot when he wasn't paying attention.

If Bucky's fast enough to whip his arm up and block a bullet, I'd say Cap can do something similar.

Also I count avoiding directed and continuous vulcan gun fire while riding a motorcycle in a straight line towards the gun firing at you is more impressive than catching a bullet after a gun is pointed at you in the same spot for 30 seconds.

You can't be serious here? You say it takes great skill to drive in a straight line towards a gun being fired at you? WTF LMAO. that had more to do with operator error of the person firing the gun than any skill. I loved it though.. did you notice Cap's awesome skill driving in a straight line towards gun fire lol. Oh and no, that is not more impressive than catching a bullet... not even close to as skilled.

Originally posted by KingD19
Cap's only ever been shot when he wasn't paying attention.

If Bucky's fast enough to whip his arm up and block a bullet, I'd say Cap can do something similar.

Also I count avoiding directed and continuous vulcan gun fire while riding a motorcycle in a straight line towards the gun firing at you is more impressive than catching a bullet after a gun is pointed at you in the same spot for 30 seconds.

How do you equate Bucky blocking a bullet with ozy catching a bullet?

Im just going to ignore the motorcycle comment :facepalm:

So you're driving a motorcycle going maybe 70. A highly advanced jet with state of the art target acquisition software designed to shoot down fast moving missiles and other jets locks on to you while you're driving at it. And you dodge an extended barrage from a vulcan cannon? Which shoots rounds more than 10 times faster than that one bullet Ozy caught, and it's shooting thousands of rounds all at once?

Yeah, catching a bullet from a 38 special is faaaar more impressive.

Originally posted by KingD19
So you're driving a motorcycle going maybe 70. A highly advanced jet with state of the art target acquisition software designed to shoot down fast moving missiles and other jets locks on to you while you're driving at it. And you dodge an extended barrage from a vulcan cannon? Which shoots rounds more than 10 times faster than that one bullet Ozy caught, and it's shooting thousands of rounds all at once?

Yeah, catching a bullet from a 38 special is faaaar more impressive.

Do you know how fast your hand eye coordination would have to be in order to catch a bullet?

In Ozy's case, fast enough to put his hand in front of the spot where Spectre was about to shoot him at the moment she shot. So fast, but not absurd considering the context. If she'd just came in, whipped out the gun and tried to shoot him in the head, I'd be far more impressed. Instead she pointed it where she intended to shoot, held it there, talked to him and gave him plenty of time to react.

Baleman should be at the very bottom of everyone's list.

Originally posted by KingD19
In Ozy's case, fast enough to put his hand in front of the spot where Spectre was about to shoot him at the moment she shot. So fast, but not absurd considering the context. If she'd just came in, whipped out the gun and tried to shoot him in the head, I'd be far more impressed. Instead she pointed it where she intended to shoot, held it there, talked to him and gave him plenty of time to react.
catch
verb
1.
intercept and hold (something that has been thrown, propelled, or dropped).
"she threw the bottle into the air and caught it again"
synonyms: seize, grab, snatch, take hold of, grasp, grip, trap, clutch, clench.


He intercepted a bullet before it hit him from 9 feet away. No matter how hard you kick and scream this fact won't change bro

Originally posted by KingD19
So you're driving a motorcycle going maybe 70. A highly advanced jet with state of the art target acquisition software designed to shoot down fast moving missiles and other jets locks on to you while you're driving at it. And you dodge an extended barrage from a vulcan cannon? Which shoots rounds more than 10 times faster than that one bullet Ozy caught, and it's shooting thousands of rounds all at once?

Yeah, catching a bullet from a 38 special is faaaar more impressive.

Yet, you yourself admit that he was mostly driving in a straight line. So why would this be so impressive. Operator error doesn't equate to being impressive imo

Veidt
Cap
Bucky
Daredevil
Black Widow
Nite Owl
Baleman
Elektra
Bullseye
Catwoman

Originally posted by Henry_Pym
Captain America / Winter Soldier
Ozy
-Batfleck-
Widow
DD (Netflix)
Elektra (Netflix)
DD / Bullseye (movie)
Nite-owl
Elektra (movie)

Nolanverse was pretty crap Batfleck was touched multiple times by thugs. He's very skilled no doubt but more so relies on stats and armor. Veidt probably would've replicated that feat unarmed and without being touched.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
How do you equate Bucky blocking a bullet with ozy catching a bullet?


Bucky dodged continuous bullet fire from higher velocity bullets than the Ozy catch one.

Being a close range and catching a bullet is exponentially more impressive than aim dodging them.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Being a close range and catching a bullet is exponentially more impressive than aim dodging them.

Don't want to start this again but...

-Bucky has 2 showings of him reacting to bullets ( of higher caliber and velocity than Ozy)

Ozy has the bullet catch showing while NOT in action or fighting. Then we see him out of it for a bit after that feat.

Originally posted by Inhuman
Bucky dodged continuous bullet fire from higher velocity bullets than the Ozy catch one.
That's called aim dodging

Originally posted by Darth Martin
Batfleck was touched multiple times by thugs. He's very skilled no doubt but more so relies on stats and armor. Veidt probably would've replicated that feat unarmed and without being touched. idk about that, but Ozy is above Batfleck so I don't see your issue?

Originally posted by Inhuman
Don't want to start this again but...

-Bucky has 2 showings of him reacting to bullets ( of higher caliber and velocity than Ozy)

Ozy has the bullet catch showing while NOT in action or fighting. Then we see him out of it for a bit after that feat.

Yes blocking and aim dodging... is the concept of Ozy being fast enough to catch a bullet that hard for your to accept? Seriously

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
That's called aim dodging

Great feat. To bad when Ozy fights he doesn't move at that rate. It was a one time deal that he accomplished with specific circumstances.
Again, none of the fights in the film show him moving at the bullet catch rate. In fact he looked rather slow fighting.
The bullet catch thing was a special feat that was accomplished in a non fight or non action situation.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Yes blocking and aim dodging... is the concept of Ozy being fast enough to catch a bullet that hard for your to accept? Seriously

Post Ozy moving at bullet catching speeds in a fight.

We've seen his fighting speed, it's not that great. so it's not like he normally operates at "bullet catching" speed.

Originally posted by Inhuman
Great feat. To bad when Ozy fights he doesn't move at that rate. It was a one time deal that he accomplished with specific circumstances.
Again, none of the fights in the film show him moving at the bullet catch rate. In fact he looked rather slow fighting.
The bullet catch thing was a special feat that was accomplished in a non fight or non action situation.



Post Ozy moving at bullet catching speeds in a fight.

Why would i need to? We've all seen ozy catch a bullet... we've all seen him fight 2 skilled opponents without so much as being touched... and still somehow you question his hand speed and fighting skills

What did ozy do to you?

You're right, we have seen him fight and in sed fight we can clearly see he isn't moving at bullet catching speed.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Why would i need to? We've all seen ozy catch a bullet... we've all seen him fight a 2 skilled opponents without so much as being touched... and still somehow you question his hand speed and fighting skills


So again like ive said before concerning this issue...

Now we are "again" getting into the realm of "imagination" and things we don't see in the movie. So your asking me to imagine and assume.

Originally posted by Inhuman
So again like ive said before concerning this issue...

Now we are "again" getting into the realm of "imagination" and things we don't see in the movie. So your asking me to imagine and assume.

Ok. "Imagine" Bucky mind raping Ozy and turning him into a penguin.
Just imagine Bucky doing that ok.





Imagination? So ozy hasn't beaten two opponents without being touched, then proceed to catch a bullet shortly afterwards?

Originally posted by Inhuman
Don't want to start this again but...

-Bucky has 2 showings of him reacting to bullets ( of higher caliber and velocity than Ozy)

Ozy has the bullet catch showing while NOT in action or fighting. Then we see him out of it for a bit after that feat.

So I'll ask you again, and see if you'll answer now... So is it your claim that Ozy can only move his arm that fast when catching bullets and not punching or blocking strikes? I'm curious if you actually believe that....

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn



Imagination? So ozy hasn't beaten two opponents without being touched, then proceed to catch a bullet shortly afterwards?

Ozy beats down 2 opponents that their greatest feat was beating up thugs and prisoners. Then in a "NON" fight situation, while having a gun pointed at him, and having time to anticipate and prepare in his head ( He is real smart), he catches the bullet from a not so powerful handgun.Then we see him on the floor. The bullet catch probably took all the wind out of him and he needed time to recover.

Impressive feat non the less, but it isn't WAAAYY out of the league of the Bucky dodges.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
So I'll ask you again, and see if you'll answer now... So is it your claim that Ozy can only move his arm that fast when catching bullets and not punching or blocking strikes? I'm curious if you actually believe that....

I would have an easier time believing that if his speed in all his fights weren't so methodical and slow. So according to movie feats , Ozy doesn't move at that speed in fights.
If I missed something. Post it.

So because he caught a bullet while not fighting he isn't fast H2H? despite the fact that he fought 2 people without being touched once we will disregard that as a testament to his h2h speed and skill because NO and Ror only fought some thugs?

Not the question I asked you. I asked you a very clear thing. I want to get your stance straight here. You seem to be saying Ozy can't punch or block that fast cause he didn't "seem" that fast. Okay... So my question stands... So you believe Ozy can only move his arm that fast when catching bullets.. True or False? Very simple question.

Originally posted by Inhuman
Ozy beats down 2 opponents that their greatest feat was beating up thugs and prisoners. Then in a "NON" fight situation, while having a gun pointed at him, and having time to anticipate and prepare in his head ( He is real smart), he catches the bullet from a not so powerful handgun.Then we see him on the floor. The bullet catch probably took all the wind out of him and he needed time to recover.

Impressive feat non the less, but it isn't WAAAYY out of the league of the Bucky dodges.



I would have an easier time believing that if his speed in all his fights weren't so methodical and slow. So according to movie feats , Ozy doesn't move at that speed in fights.
If I missed something. Post it.

The only point you're missing is that ozy is in fact so fast he could toy with his opponents... which he did in every altercation

Go ahead and post a vid of Ozy punching or blocking at bullet catching speeds during a hth fight.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Not the question I asked you. I asked you a very clear thing. I want to get your stance straight here. You seem to be saying Ozy can't punch or block that fast cause he didn't "seem" that fast. Okay... So my question stands... So you believe Ozy can only move his arm that fast when catching bullets.. True or False? Very simple question.

I think Ozys reaction time is real fast, especially if he has time to anticipate what is going to happen like the bullet catching thing. As far as using this kind of speed in a fight, well from what we have seen , he doesn't fight at those speeds.
If Ozy didn't have slow fight scenes and just had the bullet catching feat, then yes, I would assume that he would fight with bullet catching speeds. BUT we do see him fight and he looked slow.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
The only point you're missing is that ozy is in fact so fast he could toy with his opponents... which he did in every altercation

Yes he toyed with his opponents in a slow manner. Thats probably a knock at Rorch and Nite Owl , as those 2 being not too impressive.

"Slow manner"
So your issue is with how he looks and not what hes doing

So he slowly caught a knife mid battle, slowly beat up two guys at once, and slowly caught a bullet...

You're embarrassing yourself

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
"Slow manner"
So your issue is with how he looks and not what hes doing

So he slowly caught a knife mid battle, slowly beat up two guys at once, and slowly caught a bullet...

You're embarrassing yourself


If im lying then post a vid that shows Ozy fighting in super speed.

Notice how they still haven't posted a clip of him using "bullet-catching" speed in a fight?

Originally posted by Inhuman
If im lying then post a vid that shows Ozy fighting in super speed.

Hes obviously fighting at a level where 2 opponents couldn't hope to touch him...he can clearly catch a bullet.

Yet you want a DBZ style fistfight

Clown

Originally posted by Silent Master
Notice how they still haven't posted a clip of him using "bullet-catching" speed in a fight?

This would be a short argument if they can actually back up their claims with evidence instead of assumption or imagination.

For example I can post a vid of Ozy fighting at NON super speeds. In fact slower than Cap or WS fighting speeds.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Hes obviously fighting at a level where 2 opponents couldn't hope to touch him...he can clearly catch a bullet.

Yet you want a DBZ style fistfight

Clown

I don't need DBZ type fights. I can post a Cap or Bucky fights that the fighting speed looks faster than any Ozy fight.

Originally posted by Inhuman
This would be a short argument if they can actually back up their claims with evidence instead of assumption or imagination.

For example I can post a vid of Ozy fighting at NON super speeds. In fact slower than Cap or WS fighting speeds.



I don't need DBZ type fights. I can post a Cap or Bucky fights that the fighting speed looks faster than any Ozy fight.

Because they're throwing more strikes does not mean the are punching fast

Visually they're fighting at the same speed ozy is... only difference is ozy fights at that speed when toying around

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Visually they're fighting at the same speed ozy is...

Visually they are not fighting at the same speed. Should I assume or use my imagination to make it appear so?

Originally posted by Inhuman
Visually they are not fighting at the same speed. Should I assume or use my imagination to make it appear so?

So you have some type of evidence Cap is punching faster than Ozy? Or are you just talking out of your ass?

Not that it matters ozy catches bullets... but i would like to see this evidence.


And remember, caps punch would have to be coming in faster than that 38, or it'll be blocked, or avoided like NO and Ror

A lot of people here don't understand the definition in skill and speed. Sad.

Originally posted by Inhuman
Visually they are not fighting at the same speed. Should I assume or use my imagination to make it appear so?

He's probably either watching Cap's fights at half speed or Ozy's at double.

Originally posted by quanchi112
A lot of people here don't understand the definition in skill and speed. Sad.

I assume they don't watch fights other than superhero movies or something

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
I assume they don't watch fights other than superhero movies or something Who is the most skilled here ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Who is the most skilled here ?

Overall skilled BW easily

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Overall skilled BW easily Over WS and Cap ? Are you sure ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Over WS and Cap ? Are you sure ?

Oh you mean H2H... Ozy.

Fought two opponents... not a single scratch.

The rest have been tagged 1v1 at some point... even by fodder

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Oh you mean H2H... Ozy.

Fought two opponents... not a single scratch.

The rest have been tagged 1v1 at some point... even by fodder So you can't deduce the difference between skill and speed. Based off your logic Flash is more skilled than Batman in hand to hand fighting. I hope you finally grasp how awful your logic is.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So you can't deduce the difference between skill and speed. Based off your logic Flash is more skilled than Batman in hand to hand fighting. I hope you finally grasp how awful your logic is.
No, that would be based off your logic.

Flashes power is superspeed. Nobody in this thread possesses that type of power.
Flash doesn't need to know how to fight


The characters in this thread however all have shown great fighting skill... bye bye quan

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
No, that would be based off your logic.

Flashes power is superspeed. Nobody in this thread possesses that type of power.
Flash doesn't need to know how to fight


The characters in this thread however all have shown great fighting skill... bye bye quan You are equating speed with overall skill. That isn't how it works. Flash wouldn't be touched but Batman is the far more skilled fighter he just doesn't move anywhere near as fast. You use double standards and aren't very clever to boot.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You are equating speed with overall skill. That isn't how it works. Flash wouldn't be touched but Batman is the far more skilled fighter he just doesn't move anywhere near as fast. You use double standards and aren't very clever to boot.

No you're equating skill to speed by bringing up flash

This thread is simply asking h2h skill only
Who fights better.
Given that ozy has beaten 2 people at once without being touched and his clear speed advantages.

He'd be the obvious candidates for top spot.

All of these characters are superheroes and would by default have superhuman feats to add towards their skill feats regardless if the TC posted the stips as regular ass humans...bye bye quan

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
No you're equating skill to speed by bringing up flash

This thread is simply asking h2h skill only
Who fights better.
Given that ozy has beaten 2 people at once without being touched and his clear speed advantages.

He'd be the obvious candidates for top spot.

All of these characters are superheroes and would by default have superhuman feats to add towards their skill feats regardless if the TC posted the stips as regular ass humans...bye bye quan So based off your own logic flash fights better than batman so why do you insist on trying to argue semantics with me. Ozy's opponents aren't Cap or Bucky either.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So based off your own logic flash fights better than batman so why do you insist on trying to argue semantics with me. Ozy's opponents aren't Cap or Bucky either.

No, by your own logic the flash is even considered a H2H fighter.

You're bringing up superpowers when this thread is H2H... bye bye quan

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
No, by your own logic the flash is even considered a H2H fighter.

You're bringing up superpowers when this thread is H2H... bye bye quan Yes, he is. He doesn't have a high skill he's just faster. That isn't a superior skill or technique just superior speed.

So you want to ignore speed for the flash but highlight it for Ozy. How stupid are you ?

So in your head someone can't be more skilled due to the fact they're faster, stronger, or say more agile than their opponent?
The fact that ozy has better speed than cap is completely applicable to this debate...would you argue Ali couldn't outbox Tyson because of his reach and speed advantage?
When those factors are what makes him a skilled boxer.

Speed, power, and alot of things are what determine your skills in fighting.

You're bringing up flash which would be an extreme case because his power is literally speed...therefore non applicable since that speed makes normal means of fighting him would be completely useless.



And how stupid am I? I guess very stupid

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
So in your head someone can't be a better fighter due to the fact they're faster, stronger, or say more agile than their opponent?
The fact that ozy has better speed than cap is completely applicable to this debate...would you argue Ali couldn't outbox Tyson because of his reach and speed advantage?
When those factors are what makes him a skilled boxer.

Speed, power, and alot of things are what determine your skills in fighting.

You're bringing up flash which would be an extreme case because his power is literally speed...therefore non applicable since that speed makes normal means of fighting him would be completely useless. I am saying that in a hand to hand skill thread someone who is just way faster isn't more skilled in fighting they are just way faster. Take Quicksilver for example from three Fox films. He's just really fast.

People in boxing don't hit another level of speed in which they can lap the guy three times before he throws a punch.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I am saying that in a hand to hand skill thread someone who is just way faster isn't more skilled in fighting they are just way faster. Take Quicksilver for example from three Fox films. He's just really fast.

People in boxing don't hit another level of speed in which they can lap the guy three times before he throws a punch.

Still using people whose power is literally speed
You can't fight a speedster by normal means therefore they're a shit example...

And again Speed and strength are things (among others) used to determine ones fighting skill. On a human level anyways

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Still using people whose power is literally speed
You can't fight a speedster by normal means therefore they're a shit example...

And again Speed and strength are things (among others) used to determine ones fighting skill. On a human level anyways That has nothing to do with anything. We are judging by hand to hand skill not speed. Forget about what their powers are and try to stay consistent and true to the spirit of the thread.

The flash is a human.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That has nothing to do with anything. We are judging by hand to hand skill not speed. Forget about what their powers are and try to stay consistent and true to the spirit of the thread.

The flash is a human.

Speed is a factor in skill you trashbag

Nobody is bringing uo powers that would be you and this flash nonsense llf

I have forgotten about their powers but ozy is still peak human without powers...whereas without powers cap would be his equal strength wise

Idgaf what flash is...

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Speed is a factor in skill you trashbag

Nobody is bringing uo powers that would be you and this flash nonsense llf

I have forgotten about their powers but ozy is still peak human without powers...whereas without powers cap would be his equal strength wise

Idgaf what flash is... Yes, but if it's the only skill you really show then you aren't up there in the hand to hand department as in the examples already clearly show.

You made up his level which has no bearing here.


Same basic principle.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, but if it's the only skill you really show then you aren't up there in the hand to hand department as in the examples already clearly show.

You made up his level which has no bearing here.


Same basic principle.

What did i make up you trashbag

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
What did i make up you trashbag Peak human. You act as if there's some official tier these movies follow.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Peak human. You act as if there's some official tier these movies follow.


I merely say that to describe what i see... and its pretty accurate from what we know of him

Originally posted by Inhuman
I think Ozys reaction time is real fast, especially if he has time to anticipate what is going to happen like the bullet catching thing. As far as using this kind of speed in a fight, well from what we have seen , he doesn't fight at those speeds.
If Ozy didn't have slow fight scenes and just had the bullet catching feat, then yes, I would assume that he would fight with bullet catching speeds. BUT we do see him fight and he looked slow.



Yes he toyed with his opponents in a slow manner. Thats probably a knock at Rorch and Nite Owl , as those 2 being not too impressive.

Again, you're still not answering the question at hand. You keep dancing around it. I'm just trying to figure out your stance here. It "sounds" like you're saying that blocking a punch or punching somebody is beyond what Ozy can do with the same level of speed as the bullet feat.

Well, what's odd about that line of thinking is; that would mean that it's somehow easier to move your hand so fast, that you can catch an object much smaller than a hand, and use much more precision in doing so..

yet he can't

catch or block a much larger object thrown a far slower speeds than a gun pointed 3 feet from you?

See I can never get behind that kind of logic, it simply makes zero sense. What makes more sense is that the following:

You equate Ozy appearing to be slow with how it visual looks on screen to you. yet you're forgetting one important thing. You can see his hand move in the bullet timing speed. Odd, if the director actually wanted it to be real looking, as a human we'd see nothing. He'd show basically nothing. Well that is no fun is it. Yet in that scene I don't hear you going on and on about how you can see it and it seems slow. LOL.

What's more logical is, any appearance of him being "slow" in h3h can easily be described as him only needing to do what he needed to do and go as fast as necessary. You think it's slow, yet we see Nite-Owl taking out big huge dudes EASILY and with speed and power. Sending people flying back. Clearly faster than your average thug, and decidedly so. Yet Ozy never has a blow landed on him, even while is back is turned. Casually just talking and having a good time. Does it appear to you that Ozy needed to be faster to you? He was destroying them and easily so. Does that make much more sense than what you propose

Well, I just think he can move his arm that fast in h2h combat.. well.. because.. well.. it's different and a much bigger object with less precision is required. That makes zero sense. If you can move your arm that fast, you can move your arm that fast.

Then prove him wrong by posting a clip of Ozy fighting at bullet-time speed.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
And remember, caps punch would have to be coming in faster than that 38, or it'll be blocked, or avoided like NO and Ror

So are you also saying that the Comedian moves as fast/faster than a .38 round, considering he managed to grab and knock Ozy into a wall during their fight?

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
So are you also saying that the Comedian moves as fast/faster than a .38 round, considering he managed to grab and knock Ozy into a wall during their fight?



1.He was standing about 2 feet away from him in a crouched position.
2. Comedian is also a badass mf
3. He clearly was toying with the poor fella

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
So are you also saying that the Comedian moves as fast/faster than a .38 round, considering he managed to grab and knock Ozy into a wall during their fight?

He's actually saying that the Comedian is faster.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Again, you're still not answering the question at hand. You keep dancing around it. I'm just trying to figure out your stance here. It "sounds" like you're saying that blocking a punch or punching somebody is beyond what Ozy can do with the same level of speed as the bullet feat.

Well, what's odd about that line of thinking is; that would mean that it's somehow easier to move your hand so fast, that you can catch an object much smaller than a hand, and use much more precision in doing so..

yet he can't

catch or block a much larger object thrown a far slower speeds than a gun pointed 3 feet from you?

See I can never get behind that kind of logic, it simply makes zero sense. What makes more sense is that the following:

You equate Ozy appearing to be slow with how it visual looks on screen to you. yet you're forgetting one important thing. You can see his hand move in the bullet timing speed. Odd, if the director actually wanted it to be real looking, as a human we'd see nothing. He'd show basically nothing. Well that is no fun is it. Yet in that scene I don't hear you going on and on about how you can see it and it seems slow. LOL.

What's more logical is, any appearance of him being "slow" in h3h can easily be described as him only needing to do what he needed to do and go as fast as necessary. You think it's slow, yet we see Nite-Owl taking out big huge dudes EASILY and with speed and power. Sending people flying back. Clearly faster than your average thug, and decidedly so. Yet Ozy never has a blow landed on him, even while is back is turned. Casually just talking and having a good time. Does it appear to you that Ozy needed to be faster to you? He was destroying them and easily so. Does that make much more sense than what you propose

Well, I just think he can move his arm that fast in h2h combat.. well.. because.. well.. it's different and a much bigger object with less precision is required. That makes zero sense. If you can move your arm that fast, you can move your arm that fast.


To keep it short...

Yes, based on screen feats Ozy can move at or close to bullet time with anticipation.
BUT it puts great strain on him and leaves him open while recovering from the feat.
Its not something he can do continuously.
Again this is based on screen feats.

Originally posted by Inhuman
To keep it short...

Yes, based on screen feats Ozy can move at or close to bullet time with anticipation.
BUT it puts great strain on him and leaves him open while recovering from the feat.
Its not something he can do continuously.
Again this is based on screen feats.

Are you about to start the hand ko argument again

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Are you about to start the hand ko argument again



You're about to catch these hands.

Originally posted by Mindset
You're about to catch these hands.

Don't matter to me... what's good

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Don't matter to me... what's good You tryna square up cuh?

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Don't matter to me... what's good Originally posted by Mindset
You tryna square up cuh?

http://i.imgur.com/lnfp1AX.gif

Originally posted by Mindset
You tryna square up cuh?

Alright we can shoot the five behind quans trash can

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Alright we can shoot the five behind quans trash can

Are you asking him out?

Originally posted by Inhuman
Are you asking him out?

Nah we just gonna shoot that round llf

This thread is going to go nowhere IMO, because people are always going to be inclined to give their favourites the edge... well, nowhere other than some bizarre form of match making?

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
This thread is going to go nowhere IMO, because people are always going to be inclined to give their favourites the edge... well, nowhere other than some bizarre form of match making?

Everyone has already voted... go back to your vault

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
I merely say that to describe what i see... and its pretty accurate from what we know of him It's an irrelevant term. That's my point.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It's an irrelevant term. That's my point.

How is describing his strength level in a term we all can understand irrelevant? Gtfoh

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
Everyone has already voted... go back to your vault

Make me... mind you, it would be preferable to having the same Cap/Watchmen argument for like the millionth time.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
This thread is going to go nowhere IMO, because people are always going to be inclined to give their favourites the edge... well, nowhere other than some bizarre form of match making?

While true, I am still curious how you would rank them VD? We don't need to have a discussion about it at all, I'm just curious how you see it.

Well, thing with something like this is it really is impossible to give a 100% accurate list, because none of these guys have the exact same stat levels either. So you kind of have to take into account that someone like Daredevil or Cap is going to have greater natural capability for things like acrobatics, compared to someone like Baleman, who doesn't have Cap's stats or Matt's perfect balance/equilibrium (by virtue of his super hearing).

Also, are these the movie version of DD & Elektra, considering you included Bullseye as well?

If it's the movie versions, I need to go rewatch a lot of their stuff first, as it has been ages since I watched either Daredevil or Elektra.

Yes Bud, it's all version can be included. Series and Movies. I figure, why not :shrug:

I also understand what you're saying about how it's hard to rank them. It is, and I find it difficult myself to be honest. Especially when it comes to characters like BW.. she doesn't have the stats of others, and that hurts her. So if you view h2h skill as in who would win against who, well she suffers under such straight h2h skill test. However, if you picture everybody with the same stats, and it purely comes down to "skills" who would win. That seems different and like BW would do much better. Which also lame, because that's nerfing everybody kind of, and making them not really them. Anyways, yeah.. it's hard. lol

Yeah, honestly, if you gave Widow SS and gave her like a month to adapt, she would be a total monster, as someone else also remarked in another thread. Her lack of strength compared to her male rivals does her injustice.

But eh, difference between series and movies though is that there is some disparities in ability. Like I would say Movie DD has a notable strength edge over the Netflix version (but is also a lot more susceptible to sensory overload), and movie Elektra totally shits all over the the new one. If you made a movie Elektra vs Netflix version thread, the movie version would stomp hard IMO.

As mentioned before, it has been some time since I fully watched the DD & Elektra films, but I did have a look at some of their showings on youtube real quick.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
How is describing his strength level in a term we all can understand irrelevant? Gtfoh You have to by feats and comparisons but proclaiming some random level which means nothing is like saying Thors a god. Who cares. There isn't some power level everyone is paying attention to with these particular words.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You have to by feats and comparisons but proclaiming some random level which means nothing is like saying Thors a god. Who cares. There isn't some power level everyone is paying attention to with these particular words.

But i never said anything like that...

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Yeah, honestly, if you gave Widow SS and gave her like a month to adapt, she would be a total monster, as someone else also remarked in another thread. Her lack of strength compared to her male rivals does her injustice.

But eh, difference between series and movies though is that there is some disparities in ability. Like I would say Movie DD has a notable strength edge over the Netflix version (but is also a lot more susceptible to sensory overload), and movie Elektra totally shits all over the the new one. If you made a movie Elektra vs Netflix version thread, the movie version would stomp hard IMO.

Agreed with most everything here. I would just take the best versions of each and see how you end up. It's not easy, but try and see what you can come up with

I've looked at feats for these guys, and it still isn't much easier. But can have a try at least.

Daredevil, going with the newer version, is quite good in terms of pure skill. If you look at his fights, you can see bits of boxing, karate, muay thai, wrestling, jiujitsu etc. mixed together in such a manner as to create a fluid and effective fighting style, which to me is a mark of a very talented fighter.

Cap and Bucky are also both quite skilled, but I would give Cap an edge there, based on the results of their fights. Cap displays knowledge of various submissions and grappling techniques, as well as training in fighting against knives etc. and more exotic moves like various more elaborate kicks and things. We also see him take down the like 9 out of the 10 SHIELD/HYDRA agents in the elevator scene with precision throat strikes etc. while barely getting touched by anyone. Winter Soldier was able to match him closely, but in the end Cap beat him via submission and a chokehold, rather than brute force, so he outskilled him.

Ozy also displayed a number of actual different counters, reversals, takedowns etc. in his fights, indicating clear martial arts knowledge.

Widow has always been portrayed as being exceptionally skilled as well, but tends to require gadgets to take down tougher guys, due to her lack of brute strength. But she is definitely up there.

So to those, I would say Cap, Ozy, Widow and latest Daredevil have close enough levels in skill that stat differences would be a massive tipping point, and that picking the top dog there would be as much personal opinion as anything else. Winter Soldier is also very very close.

Post "death" Elektra I hold above Bullseye. She was still kind of a noob when he took her out, and he got his ass beaten in the end by a Daredevil who wasn't even in 100% shape. She had decent levels of skill, but she also seemed to have straight up inhuman stats, so hard to gauge how she'd stack up. Improvements in fight choreography over the last decade or so also makes it harder.

Nite Owl I consider above anyone in the Nolan verse but, at the end of the day, he only ever beat some thugs and prisoners. He displayed a lot of strength and decent damage soak, but not as much skill as other people in this thread, considering the only skilled opponent he ever fought made him look like a fool.

Baleman and Catwoman are at the bottom. Baleman struggled hard every single time he fought a noteworthy opponent, and Catwoman didn't appear to be above him.

But again, these are just my personal opinions based on my memory of all their feats, and my best estimates as to how their varying physical stats affect their showings. I can't really claim any of this as concrete fact, nor tell anyone who might disagree that they are conclusively incorrect.

Very well put VD, and I appreciate the time you took looking into feats to better draw some conclusions. It seems we pretty much view these guys much the same. As you say, some of them are close enough in skill, that a stat difference one way or the other would be the tipping point. Good post VD

Good post indeed bro

I might need to rematch those baleman movies since i have him higher on my list

Well, Baleman was skilled for his specific universe, but the two really high end guys he fought, Ra's and Bane, both seemed to have a clear edge on him, barring some kind of environment factor (the whole train scenario thing), or an exploitable weakness (like Bane's mask). So while skilled, he wasn't even the most skilled fighter in his universe IMO. And the general skill level of the Nolanverse is below most others.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Baleman should be at the very bottom of everyone's list.

Originally posted by 0mega Spawn
But i never said anything like that... You said peak level human. Irrelevant term.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You said peak level human. Irrelevant term.

I used that term to describe his strength range... which is accurate... foh clown

Where does Hit girl rank in terms of skill? I have only scene a few parts of the Kick ass films