Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Does anyone know why the tax due date is the 18th and not the 15th this year? The clue is in the subject line...warning some might be upset others will be indignant.

http://bit.ly/1VlDdgT

"Freeing the slaves" is only half of this act...the other half, which I'm guessing would upset some and make others indignant, is that certain people received compensation, a "reparation" . Guess who and for what reason?

Originally posted by Gadabout
"Freeing the slaves" is only half of this act...the other half, which I'm guessing would upset some and make others indignant, is that certain people received compensation, a "reparation" . Guess who and for what reason?

That is a much better point to find bizarre and stupid, especially in light of discussions about reparations in the 20th and 21st century.

May I ask why this is happening?

BTW I am all for reparations. Just as soon as we perfect necromancy we can raise the people who were actually enslaved from the dead and give them their due.

Originally posted by Surtur
May I ask why this is happening?

BTW I am all for reparations. Just as soon as we perfect necromancy we can raise the people who were actually enslaved from the dead and give them their due.
I'm against broad cash-handout reparations too, but I also think that "well, all the slaves and slave owners have been dead for decades" is an easy excuse to get away with not doing ANYTHING to make up for the country's legacy of slavery.

One suggestion my girlfriend made (she's Jamaican) is that the US could offer free college tuition to all black students who can pass admissions. I still don't know if that's a fair and proper way of doing it, but it's better than just depositing $100,000 in every black American's bank account and might actually improve the economic/social outlook of black America.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
I'm against broad cash-handout reparations too, but I also think that "well, all the slaves and slave owners have been dead for decades" is an easy excuse to get away with not doing ANYTHING to make up for the country's legacy of slavery.

But uh dude, we didn't enslave these people. If we are to pay for the sins of our ancestors then that shouldn't just apply to slavery. Nor should it just apply to whites.



Except no..blacks don't actually deserve free college anymore then ANY other race does. That's pretty ridiculous. A black guy deserves free tuition because 150 years ago blacks were enslaved? Really?

So in the 1940s we put Asians in friggin concentration camps. Why are they not owed free tuition? Or did they not suffer enough to meet the requirements for free shit that isn't deserved?

Oh and how do you handle reparations to the blacks who were enslaved by other blacks? Are we going to charge the NAACP with paying them or paying for their tuition?

Originally posted by Surtur
But uh dude, we didn't enslave these people. If we are to pay for the sins of our ancestors then that shouldn't just apply to slavery. Nor should it just apply to whites.

No "we" didn't, but our country did. And I actually agree with you, I think we as a country should own up to ALL our mistakes (treatment of Native Americans for one thing) and anyway in any reparations situation, the money would come from taxpayers: black, white, asian, etc.


A statistically negligible percentage. And anyway, I never said I supported her idea, just that it was better than the idea of just giving out cash.

Like I said: if we play the game of holding people accountable for shit their ancestors did then it needs to be applied all across the board. Not just to whites.

Which remember: there would be a LOT more then just white's peoples mistreatment of people. Every race in this country would be owing reparations to someone if we did that.

As for cash vs tuition. We shouldn't be giving them cash or free college. These people were not enslaved. They don't deserve free college anymore then anyone else does.

Originally posted by Surtur
Like I said: if we play the game of holding people accountable for shit their ancestors did then it needs to be applied all across the board. Not just to whites.

Which remember: there would be a LOT more then just white's peoples mistreatment of people. Every race in this country would be owing reparations to someone if we did that.
Just curious, why can you never admit that white people have done bad things without prevaricating and bringing up other things?

I'm not saying you're wrong, because you're absolutely right that everyone has done shitty things, but to act like white Americans haven't been overwhelmingly responsible for the systematic abuse of minorities is disingenuous.

But who said we don't do bad things? I just said if we're going to play the "hold people accountable for shit their ancestors did" then we apply it to everyone, not just whites.

I never said we didn't anything wrong, I said we weren't the only ones who did wrong. Why bring this up? Because if we're giving one group of people free shit for the stuff another group did in the past it is not fair to limit that to just one race. That is why it needs to be brought up.

So in the context of giving people free shit for stuff done a long time ago..it's actually almost disingenuous to pretend like it's just whites, correct?

You also wouldn't find it really f*cking disturbing if we're having blacks pay other blacks reparations because blacks were enslaved? That is all kinds of messed up. It wouldn't just be blacks paying, but they'd be part of it, and that is just odd. It's outright wrong actually, since just like you and I..the blacks of today enslaved nobody. I find that actually highly disturbing, how could you not? How could any sane rational person think having blacks be paying part of the reparations is not an awful thing?

Wouldn't that lead to some people actually more or less..paying themselves reparations? If I'm set to get reparations, but the money from reparations comes from my tax dollars...well, I've essentially partially paid myself. You don't find that a little silly?

Also when slavery was a thing not all whites supported slavery. So what if a white person traces their ancestry all the way back to that era and finds they were descended from hardcore abolitionists? Do they still owe reparations?

I mean doesn't this sort of remind you of when a teacher punishes the entire class merely because a few of the kids misbehaved? It's punishing innocent people for shit other people did.

Why should America punish innocent Americans? Which yep, it's a punishment..money does not grow on tree's. Are you fine with the idea of punishing innocent people? Are you prepared to say that is okay? You kind of have to be if you think the people of the current generation should give anything more then an apology, right? There is no way you could support this unless you support punishing the innocent.

Do you want to live in a country that punishes innocent people for things that happened 150 years ago? I don't know about you, but to me that doesn't sound like a great place to live. We need to be mindful of our past so we don't make the same mistakes we did before, but punishing innocent people has no place in this country. Or at least it shouldn't have any place.

Since you can sit there and talk about the various atrocities committed in the past and you'd be 100% correct America did a lot of shit(of course no more or less then the rest of the world). But at the end of the day you'd still need to agree that innocent people should be punished.

Originally posted by Surtur
May I ask why this is happening?

Why is what happening? The tax day extension or the compensation to the slave owner? The first is answered already the second was just a fvcked since of justice.

I'm just not clear what you even mean, because you mention a slave owner and then someone else says this:

Originally posted by Gadabout
the other half, which I'm guessing would upset some and make others indignant, is that certain people received compensation, a "reparation" . Guess who and for what reason?

What does this mean? A slave owner was compensated? How would we compensate a slave owner when nobody owns slaves anymore in this country? What were the circumstances? Did we compensate a slave owners descendants? If so, what was the justification for it? The main way freeing the slaves even harmed slave owners was that they no longer got free labor. But surely we wouldn't compensate someone because their ancestor was super bummed out about losing his slaves.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
One suggestion my girlfriend made (she's Jamaican) is that the US could offer free college tuition to all black students who can pass admissions. I still don't know if that's a fair and proper way of doing it, but it's better than just depositing $100,000 in every black American's bank account and might actually improve the economic/social outlook of black America.

hmm


Holy f*ck, that's actually a good idea. Make it state schools, right? I mean, forcing private universities to do this might be too much but state funded schools should be okay for a program like this, right? Make it last 10 years?

Also, I'd add VoTech schools to that list, too.



And congrats on finding love, sir!

Originally posted by Surtur
But uh dude, we didn't enslave these people. If we are to pay for the sins of our ancestors then that shouldn't just apply to slavery. Nor should it just apply to whites.

Anytime someone tells me I should have to pay them reparations, I tell them it is the other way around: they should pay my family because my ancestors fought (and two (?) of them died in the ACW) to free the slaves. None of my family were slave owners and almost all of them were vocally opposed to it.

So where's my reparations? We lost some money earners and this has negatively impacted the economic prosperity for my family for many generations. We lost our primary money earners. We've been poor for generations since then.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Anytime someone tells me I should have to pay them reparations, I tell them it is the other way around: they should pay my family because my ancestors fought (and two (?) of them died in the ACW) to free the slaves. None of my family were slave owners and almost all of them were vocally opposed to it.

So where's my reparations? We lost some money earners and this has negatively impacted the economic prosperity for my family for many generations. We lost our primary money earners. We've been poor for generations since then.

But paying for their college is more or less still giving them reparations. Why do they deserve a free education anymore then any other kids today?

Are we really going to say because slavery was a thing 150 years ago certain children deserve a free education while others don't? Sure it's better then putting 100 grand in someone's account but..giving someone 100 k for this is EQUALLY insane to me. Actually no it's way more insane.

There really isn't any one race in this country that deserves free college more then the others. Nope, blacks don't deserve it anymore then whites. Or latino's, or asians, etc. Just like there isn't one race that deserves free money more then the others. I also feel it is a huge problem if there is anyone belonging to any race that do not agree and feel they *should* get these things over other races.

Originally posted by dadudemon
hmm


Holy f*ck, that's actually a good idea. Make it state schools, right? I mean, forcing private universities to do this might be too much but state funded schools should be okay for a program like this, right? Make it last 10 years?

Also, I'd add VoTech schools to that list, too.



And congrats on finding love, sir!
Thanks

i"m getting the feeling that a few of you are missing the point here....I'm not asking or looking to debate "reparations". I'm pointing out the fact that the slave owners were the ones who received compensation from the feds when slavery ended. That to me is / was a great travesty of justice.
Or am I being insensitive to the plight of those poor slave owners. I mean how could a person maintain an extravagant life style when you most suddenly have to pay people for their labor?

The problem is you didn't actually tell us what the hell you were talking about until just now. So you are saying 150 years ago slave owners got reparations from the feds? Okay, it's shitty and stupid, but has no bearing on the current state of affairs in the world, right?

If you want people to say it's silly, it is. Just like giving out reparations to people in the present day, giving it to slave owners is stupid too.

Originally posted by Surtur
The problem is you didn't actually tell us what the hell you were talking about until just now. So you are saying 150 years ago slave owners got reparations from the feds? Okay, it's shitty and stupid, but has no bearing on the current state of affairs in the world, right?

If you want people to say it's silly, it is. Just like giving out reparations to people in the present day, giving it to slave owners is stupid too.

It has a lot of bearing on the current state of the world. Financial and societal standing doesn't just reset with the next generation it ripples through time and compounds as well.

Originally posted by Bardock42
It has a lot of bearing on the current state of the world. Financial and societal standing doesn't just reset with the next generation it ripples through time and compounds as well.

Ok sure, the fact 150 years ago we gave slave owners reparations will have major effects on us today. Awesome. Lets talk about it some more. What do you want to do about it? Give a solution that doesn't involve giving people currently alive today reparations., since that is never the solution, but I'm sure you have one, so what would you have us do?