Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Ahsoka as of Rebels; Luke as of Return of the Jedi.

Tyranus as of Revenge of the Sith; Maul as of The Phantom Menace.

Battle takes place here: https://darrenketchumphotography.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/img_7220-hdr.jpg

Round 1: Canon only
Round 2: Legends and canon

Sith team in a good fight

Dooku's force abilities/slightly superior skill tilts it in favor of team 2 and though either Luke or Ahsoka best Maul it would be a difficult fight

Team 2 wins in a decent match

Team 1 surely.

Dooku is going to be easily overwhelmed by Luke's Vader tier Djem So while Ahsoka can stalemate Maul for as long as is needed.

Beni, you're not serious, are you?

Lmao, and if I am?

Dooku can oneshot Ahsoka with lightning

Then I'd expect nothing less.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Then I'd expect nothing less. Good, cause Luke cleans house. Originally posted by carthage
Dooku can oneshot Ahsoka with lightning I giggled.

I giggled when I realized Ahsoka has no experience countering Force lightning

lmao

Originally posted by carthage
I giggled when I realized Ahsoka has no experience countering Force lightning Because there is actual correlation between experiencing lightning and being able to defend against it. mmm

There was for your beloved Luke

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Because there is actual correlation between experiencing lightning and being able to defend against it. mmm

You can't use Kenobi's feats for Ahsoka, that's not how it works. Dooku is also powerful enough to outright ragdoll Tano, seeing as he's one of the most powerful force users in Galactic history and all and regularly dominates Kenobi who can lift massive Airships, redirect his starship from freefall, i,e feats Ahsoka can't replicate.

RotJ Luke is stupid powerful, if he's truly >= Vader and strong enough to make Palpatine nervous.

Originally posted by carthage
You can't use Kenobi's feats for Ahsoka, that's not how it works. Dooku is also powerful enough to outright ragdoll Tano, seeing as he's one of the most powerful force users in Galactic history and all and regularly dominates Kenobi who can lift massive Airships, redirect his starship from freefall, i,e feats Ahsoka can't replicate.

Like how Vader ragdolls her?

If he abuses his force rage I can see him beating Dooku in a sabers bout, but he also doesn't really have any defense against Dooku's TK. I also question the validity of his lightning deflection in the ROTJ novel.

Originally posted by carthage
You can't use Kenobi's feats for Ahsoka, that's not how it works. Dooku is also powerful enough to outright ragdoll Tano, seeing as he's one of the most powerful force users in Galactic history and all and regularly dominates Kenobi who can lift massive Airships, redirect his starship from freefall, i,e feats Ahsoka can't replicate. Lmao. Excuse me for pointing out the flaws in your logic. And Kenobi isn't the only one, Kao Cen Darach had no experience with lighting yet threw it back in Vindican's face, heck, Mace frikken Windu had no experience with Force lightining yet deflected Palpatine's.

Obviously it has nothing to do with experience, but rather a level of ability/general mastery. And I'm inclined to believe that Ahsoka, who became a fully-fledged Jedi Knight and in all but name is Jedi Master level at this point, should be capable.

And I'm pretty sure I disproved otherwise regarding Kenobi's showings in another thread, you should look it up.

Regardless, how is Dooku going to find the time to ragdoll Ahsoka when he's getting his shit pushed in by Luke?

Lets all assume she can deflect lightning when she's never encountered it guys, based off of Beni's sound argument!! Also he shouldn't have too much issue with Luke, I mean he'll be pressed in a duel but smashing Vader's arms was a pretty oneoff moment when Vader mentioned Leia. He isn't going to break Dooku's arms and Luke also similarly has no defense against lightning or Dooku's TK

We kinda assume similar things when we pit Zannah and Nihilus against far stronger opponents. It's a little unrealistic to not expect Anakin to have instructed Ahsoka in it given the dark siders running around, and she certainly has the power to do so, given her performance against Vader.

Originally posted by carthage
Lets all assume she can deflect lightning when she's never encountered it guys, based off of Beni's sound argument!!Solid counter-reasoning there, I accept your concession.
Eh? Why does he need capable of defeating Vader to beat Dooku? Luke's ability to match Vader's strength and technique is all he needs to hand the Count his ass.

And as if Dooku will be able to effectively employ those techniques when he's again, getting his shit pushed in in sabers.

Vader doesn't utilize lightning and you typically don't catch telekinetic attacks with a saber. Ahsoka spent her time primarily killing cannon fodder droids, and the few duels she encountered with darksiders (Ventress/Maul) are both force users that are unable to even use the ability. Why would Anakin teach her about an ability when he was the one who was tasked with fighting Dooku?

An adequate response for your retarded claim she knows how to counter an ability she's never even seen. Burden of proof is on you



Not really considering Dooku handled Anakin's strength in a pure duel with only slight difficulty at best, and Dooku can break up duel at any point by chaining force attacks like he regularly does to Kenobi.



Tell that to Obi Wan, Sora Bulq, or any other duelist he regularly annihilates with his force abilities

Originally posted by carthage
Vader doesn't utilize lightning and you typically don't catch telekinetic attacks with a saber. Ahsoka spent her time primarily killing cannon fodder droids, and the few duels she encountered with darksiders (Ventress/Maul) are both force users that are unable to even use the ability.


You claimed that Kanan could defeat PoD Bane, who can use lightning.

You also think that RotS Anakin could beat Zannah, who can use esoteric sith sorcery, the kind that's probably restricted access within the Jedi Archives that Anakin wanted to access so badly.

So as with most debaters, you make a reasonable assumption that sufficiently powerful Force users either have a general ability to resist such attacks, or have probably studied it in some capacity. Ahsoka was powerful enough to press and not get ragdolled by Vader, so she probably crosses that threshold here.



So obviously Dooku is a gentleman and would avoid using lightning against Ahsoka should they ever meet, for knowledge of Anakin's assumption?

I mean, AotC Obi Wan seemed to know how to block it and Force lightning probably hadn't been witnessed by the Jedi in 1000 years...

Originally posted by carthage
An adequate response for your retarded claim she knows how to counter an ability she's never even seen. Burden of proof is on you.Lel, you continue to assume it's a specific ability that requires experience, when that's clearly not the case, and continue to fail to prove their is any correlation between the two.

Neither Kenobi nor Windu had reason to learn to deflect lightning when the Sith were believed extinct. Nor did Kao-Cen Darach when they had been absent for hundreds of years.

All evidence points to it being a general ability that doesn't require experience, but rather a level of training and ability that Ahsoka acquired. That's called logical proof my friend, and the onus is on you to disprove it, rather than parroting the same flawed reasoning. You mean when Anakin was emotionally unbalanced. Without extenuating circumstances he was left exhausted by Skywalker's attacks, and when Anakin became enraged he was utterly obliterated.

Vader is stronger than Anakin, and Luke is both stated to and observably matched his strength. Go figure.

And Kenobi isn't capable of pressing Dooku in the same manner so that's a moot point.Because Kenobi, Bulq and scrubs have Force feats that compare to matching Vader's Force augmentation, and are capable of pressing Dooku in sabers to any comparable degree.

Ahsoka didn't "match" Vader's Force augmentation.

I was referring to Luke.

I'm basing Kanan beating Bane on him being more skilled, I never denied Bane could kill Kanan on the basis of lightning. Zannah also has a fair shot at beating Anakin with sorcery, its just less likely considering Anakin will kill her in .1 seconds due to being laughably more skilled. Ahsoka also didn't deflect Vader's force abilities she got ko'ed by a single push off the temple side. The fight was primarily a saber duel, not a display of force abilities so her ability to duel with Vader doesn't disprove the fact she was sent flying and ko'ed by a push from Vader. Ahsoka has done nothing to suggest she wouldn't be annihilated by Vader's force abilities if she didn't maintain pressure on a duel, her saber skills are completely unrelated to her ability to defend from his force attacks.



Kenobi learned to deflect the attack after Anakin went charging like a retard into Dooku's lightning (which was unknown to Jedi). So Kenobi had learned from Anakin's mistake per the AOTC Novelization:


http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt255/stevelovesmoonspell/aa1luke2.jpg

http://i617.photobucket.com/albums/tt255/stevelovesmoonspell/aa1luke3.jpg

Kenobi had witnessed Anakin get taken out and learned to use his saber and Ahsoka has no knowledge of FL at all, the two situations are completely different per the quotes. There isn't any basis for Ahsoka having any knowledge or counter to lightning

Originally posted by Beniboybling
I was referring to Luke.

Hmm, fair enough. Luke's an exception, though.

Originally posted by carthage
I'm basing Kanan beating Bane on him being more skilled, I never denied Bane could kill Kanan on the basis of lightning.

How does Kanan's skill outweigh Bane's lightning, which obviously outranges his bladework, unless if that skill somehow facilitates being able to defend against it?



Sorcery and lightning are both ranged attacks, which is presumably why you're weighing the former so heavily here.



If Vader could've ragdolled Ahsoka, why didn't he just do that from the start? Yes, he was able to get a Force push in - she likely let her guard down or was too preoccupied with defending against his attacks.



So all you need to do to be able to block Force lightning is to see it once and figure "maybe I should hold up my lightsaber"? And you don't think Ahsoka has ever seen a video recreation of Force lightning, learned about it from talking with Anakin, heard about its name and guessed what it was, or otherwise have any knowledge of it? How the f*ck is that possible? Anakin never guessed that it was worth the eight seconds needed to prepare Ahsoka against Dooku's lightning by saying "hold your lightsaber up" if she happened to run into him (and gosh, I wonder why that might happen)?

Even if she had mysteriously never even heard of the idea of Force lightning despite fighting a war against the Dark Lord of the Sith, putting her saber out is probably her instinctive reaction to someone pointing their hand out and her precog telling her she was about to get hit by something.

I'm sorry you'll have to be more clear, I'm not seeing how that can be inferred from the text without making assumptions. Especially when in the novelisation Dooku doesn't even employ lightning against Kenobi.

Anakin was gimped by Dooku's lightning because he was evidently stupid and his training incomplete, Kenobi was not, so he was not.

Though the idea that Kenobi could adapt to Dooku's Sith lighting so quickly only without prior knowledge of the power, proves it an intuitive application of powers one already possesses, rather than a technique you have to be instructed in.

Why would Ahsoka be incapable of adaptation and intuition in this regard, when, as Eliminist points out, she'll very likely see it coming? Seems like you disproved your own argument there.

Kenobi learned to deflect lightning when Anakin was taken out by Dooku's lightning, I posted the quotes. Also Kao likely learned to deflect lightning in a similar fashion seeing as of 3:07 in the Return trailer we see Satele get sent flying by Vindican's lightning, Kao could've very well used the same method of learning as Kenobi did. Obviously they had to have seen it happen to their student, derp





Kao and Anakin both saw lightning when their students were hit by it, obviously using their sabers to deflect it. Experience=their knowledge to deflect it.



Skywalker was calling fully on his potential in his prior duel in ROTS, in TCW under normal circumstances Dooku has fought him off as per usual



That has nothing to do with the fact he generally removes Kenobi with the force instead of outdueling him. Luke also has no defense against lightning or telekinetic attacks, try to keep up here. Luke doesn't normally use his overwhelming force power to beat down guards, the situation with Vader was a unique one



Because a strict saber duel between Vader and Luke totally disproves the notion Vader wouldnt've oneshot Luke with telekinesis, right? Lol. Force augmentation and force defenses are two completely different things, Dooku also uses lightning which Luke in the film got downed by. Try again

Ahsoka: Sky guy, what happened the first time you met Dooku?

Anakin: Oh, I charged at him like an idiot and got electrocuted and tossed aside like a punk.

Ahsoka: electrocuted?

Anakin: sorry, I can't tell you any more. The Jedi strictly forbid padawans from learning the "hold your lightsaber up relatively perpendicularly from your face to stop the blue lightning" technique, and you know me, I always follow the rules over helping my friends.

Ahsoka: Touche.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
I'm sorry you'll have to be more clear, I'm not seeing how that can be inferred from the text without making assumptions. Especially when in the novelisation Dooku doesn't even employ lightning against Kenobi.

Anakin was gimped by Dooku's lightning because he was evidently stupid and his training incomplete, Kenobi was not, so he was not.

Though the idea that Kenobi could adapt to Dooku's Sith lighting so quickly only without prior knowledge of the power, proves it an intuitive application of powers one already possesses, rather than a technique you have to be instructed in.

Why would Ahsoka be incapable of adaptation and intuition in this regard, when, as Eliminist points out, she'll very likely see it coming? Seems like you disproved your own argument there.

What does "intuitive ability" have to do with the fact that Kenobi saw Anakin got taken out and by logical inference would've learned to raise a defense? The text already said that lightning was unknown to Jedi prior to Anakin being hit. Anakin didn't have any "intuitive application of raising his saber" and was KOED, and Kenobi deflected it in the film. This isn't hard to figure out

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Ahsoka: Sky guy, what happened the first time you met Dooku?

Anakin: Oh, I charged at him like an idiot and got electrocuted and tossed aside like a punk.

Ahsoka: electrocuted?

Anakin: sorry, I can't tell you any more. The Jedi strictly forbid padawans from learning the "hold your lightsaber up relatively perpendicularly from your face to stop the blue lightning" technique, and you know me, I always follow the rules over helping my friends.

Ahsoka: Touche.

The text says lightning was unknown to Jedi before Anakin got hit by it. Apparently Kenobi is obviously too retarded to defend himself based off of Anakin getting hit. He obviously would've run into it because of "intuitive applications of powers" and not the fact his padawan got layed out before, right?

Originally posted by carthage
The text says lightning was unknown to Jedi before Anakin got hit by it. Apparently Kenobi is obviously too retarded to defend himself based off of Anakin getting hit. He obviously would've run into it because of "intuitive applications of powers" and not the fact his padawan got layed out before, right?





This reply is a fascinating case of epic failure. It manages to both spectacularly miss the point and not even hit its misguided target well.

1. The text is comically outdated/wrong - Yoda, for example, knew how to absorb lightning with tutaminus. Of course he did - he had access to the most comprehensive collection of sith holocrons ever. Force lightning is repeatedly referenced as a well known dark side power that the Council expressively forbid Jedi from using. The AotC novel was just written before the backstory of the Jedi/Sith had been cohesively fleshed out.

2. Even if it were true that none of the Jedi knew what Force lightning was as of AotC, Ahsoka by Rebels sure has f*ck does, given that her master had encountered it firsthand multiple times, knew Ahsoka might run into Dooku, and would have taken the eight seconds needed to say "hold out your lightsaber."

3. Even if that were incorrect for some asinine reason, if Dooku holds his hands out and Ahsoka's precog warns her of an imminent attack, holding her lightsaber out would be her intuitive reaction. That Anakin was charging like a dumb idiot doesn't mean an older, wiser Ahsoka would.

Seriously, the notion that Ahsoka wouldn't have even known of the existence of Force lightning, like Anakin and Obi Wan were conspiring to keep it hidden from her, is absurd and I do wonder if you're trying to troll.

Again show me any evidence that she even knows about the ability, that she was ever taught and or instructed by Yoda or Anakin about it, or was given any sort of hint about how to defend against it, and I'll happily concede the point.

I've provided counter examples, neither you nor Beni have produced any sort of evidence. But have at it and continue making **** all effort to counter my arguments with anything substantive

You clearly suck at analyzing and synthesizing data. Absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence, and this commonly used cliche has its merit. If we have to figure out what someone's proficiency in X category is but lack direct observations, we do not assume an absence of it. Rather we, try to consider the probability distribution of possible levels and kinds of proficiencies based on the contextual evidence that we have. We try to create a theory of what their abilities are that best fits with the available evidence and creates the most plausible story.

In this case, we have access to several data points and simple deductive arguments to support the idea that Ahsoka knowing about lightning is a far more likely and plausible possibility than her being ignorant of it. Likewise, we can reasonably infer that Leia goes pee, despite having never seen her do so.

I hope you don't employ your idiotic logic in your everyday life. When you get mad at that 300 pound linebacker, I hope you don't punch him in the face and assume that he doesn't know how to thrust his arm in a motion towards your face because you've never seen him do it before.

Of course, I'm pretty sure you're going to repeat your evidentiary standard verbatim without bothering to respond to my specific criticisms of it, given that's what you just did.

Originally posted by carthage
Again show me any evidence that she even knows about the ability, that she was ever taught and or instructed by Yoda or Anakin about it, or was given any sort of hint about how to defend against it, and I'll happily concede the point.


Generally you're supposed to support your claims with evidence, and hell even a quote to suggest that the Jedi regularly taught their students to combat force abilities like lightning from a canon sourcebook would help your case.

Again any sort of proof would be nice, until then I'll happily take your concession while you try to save face.

Carthage: You need to demonstrate X!
Me: that makes no sense because of Y and Z!
Carthage: You need to demonstrate X!
Me: What about reasons Y and Z I just gave for why your burden of proof isn't-
Carthage: Carthage: You need to demonstrate X!

You obviously don't think that Leia goes pee, or that the scientific method exists, given that its entire purpose is to use past data points to make predictions about untested events.

Then again, this is a more complicated concept in epistemology than I've seen you grasp with to date, so it doesn't surprise me that you lack the intellect to understand me.

Carthage edited his post:

Originally posted by carthage
Generally you're supposed to support your claims with evidence,

You didn't understand a single concept I just tried to teach you, did you?

You suggested the possibility Ahsoka saw a hologram of force lightning or talked to Anakin about it.

Again show me even the slightest implication of that having occured, even something as small a passing mention. Come on bro, the ball is in your court.

Nice job at selectively responding to things. Apparently Anakin never told her "hey, if that Dooku guy points his hand at you, he's about to blast purple lightning out of his fingertips. Don't worry though, all you gotta do is hold your lightsaber in front of you. Any idiot could figure that out."

Then again I've never seen you get laid before; this obviously has never happened, going by your own logic.

> text in quote I provided on page 2 says lightning was unknown to Jedi=Anakin in AOTC getting ko'ed by it as a result
> Kenobi learns to use the force/to catch it on his saber as a result of Anakin's first encounter with it.

Its almost like I have a basis for my arguments, and you have nothing and are butthurt.

Because obviously there's no reason to think that Ahsoka in Rebels would know more about the sith from, like, talking to Anakin about his half dozen fights against Dooku, than an Anakin who had no such insider info, right?

Wait, isn't the reason that I've repeated this point like five times to you?

Luke totally talked to Old Ben about deflecting lighting too I mean Kenobi encountered Dooku's lightning too and there is no reason to believe that he wouldnt've told Luke to use his saber to catch Sidious's lightning like in the movie, amirite?

Yeah cause obviously Luke talked to Obi Wan for just as long as Ahsoka talked with Anakin...

And Luke did deflect Palpatine's lightning with tutanimus for a few seconds with Yoda's instruction. And he trained there for a few months.

Originally posted by The Ellimist


T

2. Even if it were true that none of the Jedi knew what Force lightning was as of AotC, Ahsoka by Rebels sure has f*ck does, given that her master had encountered it firsthand multiple times, knew Ahsoka might run into Dooku, and would have taken the eight seconds needed to say "hold out your lightsaber."

3. Even if that were incorrect for some asinine reason, if Dooku holds his hands out and Ahsoka's precog warns her of an imminent attack, holding her lightsaber out would be her intuitive reaction. That Anakin was charging like a dumb idiot doesn't mean an older, wiser Ahsoka would.

Seriously, the notion that Ahsoka wouldn't have even known of the existence of Force lightning, like Anakin and Obi Wan were conspiring to keep it hidden from her, is absurd and I do wonder if you're trying to troll.

Holy **** its almost like Luke's precognition didn't kick in at 2:38 to help Luke from getting owned by Sidious's lightning in this clip and prevented Luke from intuitive reaction or something? Obviously Kenobi had experienced Dooku's lightning multiple times, but obviously Luke must've just forgot what Kenobi might've told him in a conversation or maybe his intuitive reactions didn't kick in time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZ_j3s5xj8I



Originally posted by The Ellimist
Yeah cause obviously Luke talked to Obi Wan for just as long as Ahsoka talked with Anakin...



Obviously its far more likely Kenobi may have talked to Luke about Sidious's lightning because he encountered it multiple times. Its not like Luke was never aware of lightning in the first place or something unlikely due to Kenobi's dilligence, you can't prove me wrong!

Dooku solos

^ Not if Ahsoka is Dooku level

Tyranus isn't beating this version of Luke, lol. He might beat Ahsoka, though. And she's the weak link here, so I'll side with Team 2 in a close fight.

Originally posted by carthage
Kenobi learned to deflect lightning when Anakin was taken out by Dooku's lightning, I posted the quotes. Also Kao likely learned to deflect lightning in a similar fashion seeing as of 3:07 in the Return trailer we see Satele get sent flying by Vindican's lightning, Kao could've very well used the same method of learning as Kenobi did. Obviously they had to have seen it happen to their student, derp.

Kao and Anakin both saw lightning when their students were hit by it, obviously using their sabers to deflect it. Experience=their knowledge to deflect it. I'd hardly call that experience, more like forewarning. It's really not possible to learn anything from seeing your partner fail to deal with a power you yourself have never seen before, other than to be more prepared when that power is turned upon you.

So Kenobi and Darach were able to anticipate and react to Force lightning given forewarning of its use, enabling them to apply abilities they already possessed to deflect it, why would it be any different for Ahsoka here?

You say that Force lightning would remain unknown to the Jedi, despite the reemergence of the Sith, despite Dooku's repeated use of it (specifically against Ahsoka's master, whose job it is to impart all the knowledge he can to) despite it being referenced in the Jedi Path, a book Ahsoka has read, and despite Windu, who has no experience of lightning, having the foresight to raise his saber to deflect Palpatine's use it. Sorry, but I don't find that argument very convincing.

Ahsoka has the precognitive powers to anticipate such an attack, and she is not at all as brash and unthinking as Anakin was in AotC, so why wouldn't she just raise her sabers and block it?Isn't this the second time I'd told you Anakin became "vastly" more powerful since TCW? Nor was he calling on his "full potential", that's baseless, he was merely tapping in to the dark side.

Regardless Dooku was being exhausted by his attacks before Anakin even did that, goodness have you even read the RotS novel?Of course it does, Dooku's telekinetic and FL abilities are irrelevant if he's unable to apply them in combat, and he's going to be too pressed by Luke in sabers to really do that.

And lmao, he wields Djem So, the staple of which is using an overpowering offense to batter through an opponent's guard, a technique Dooku admits he is highly vulnerable to. The only reason he didn't achieve that against Vader was because they were equally matched.

Regardless, he actually does drive Vader back in this manner on Bespin, so you'd be wrong.

https://j.gifs.com/mZ0ExR.gifI don't believe that was my point. Force defences are determined by power in the Force. Luke matching Vader in Force augmentation demonstrates power in the Force exceeding the likes of Kenobi, Sora Bulq and frankly anyone Dooku as ever beaten.

So the idea he could rekt Luke Skywalker with his powers is both baseless and silly. Especially when Luke's offense is going to leave his Force reserves depleted on top of this.When he had no lightsaber to defend himself with.

That said according to both the script and novel Luke was able to in part deflect that lightning with tutaminis, something it's said only the most powerful masters could accomplish, which if anything indicates blocking an infinitely weaker strain with his saber is well within his abilities.

Yoda was teaching the Jedi to refight the Battle of Ruusan. Obviously that involves deflecting Lightning.

Originally posted by carthage
Holy **** its almost like Luke's precognition didn't kick in at 2:38 to help Luke from getting owned by Sidious's lightning in this clip and prevented Luke from intuitive reaction or something?

WTF does that have to do with whether he knows tutanimus (which the novel and script both say he does)? We're debating how widespread knowledge of sith lightning is, not whether Luke's reflexes compare to Palpatine's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9DI8kkR9G0Q

0:35 - omg Yoda doesn't block Sidious's Force lightning, haha weakling doesn't know what it is, I bet Bane could kill him.

The canon movie-novel has settled this issue; you're trying really hard to lowball Ahsoka here Bane-style, and failing horribly at it.



Yeah, because it's totally just as likely that Obi Wan would have taught a guy who hadn't learned telekinesis yet about Force lightning in the few hours of a trip to Alderaan, as it is for Anakin to teach a full fledged padawan who was eventually offered the title of Jedi Knight in the several years they were fighting a galactic war against the Dark Lord of the Sith. You know, just like how Yoda and Mace Windu were both able to defend against Force lightning. But clearly, Anakin getting blindsided by it at the very beginning of the Clone Wars means that he never bothered to tell Ahsoka about it.

But if you're going to go down this route, you really need to alter your view of Bane. After all, you claimed in that gauntlet thread that he'd lose to Kanan. Obviously he wouldn't, since he could just one-shot him with Force lightning. I bet he could one-shot Abeloth too, since she had never fought a sith before. Don't forget about The Daughter!

Wall of text and still no evidence to defend his point Ahsoka knows how to defend against lightning lol

You're ****ing horrible dude, I'm not wasting anymore time replying either find a quote that suggests Ahsoka can defend or just concede the point

You possess the intellectual abilities of a mentally disabled person, but invoke none of the empathy. Even basic epistemology eludes your feeble mind, so you vaguely respond to arguments by repeating yourself and ignoring all of the sub points and contentions embedded in what you're responding to. The idea that evidence can be inferred, and is indeed in these minor areas like modern science and forensics, contains too many polysyllabic words for you to understand. You really shouldn't be allowed to vote.

JK you're right, Leia totally can't pee because we've never seen her do it!

Originally posted by Rebel95
Sith team in a good fight

Team 2 with moderate-hard difficulty depending on who matches up with who.

carthage cleaned house here lol

Ahsoka's clearly the weak link here. Team 2 takes in in a tough fight. If Luke and Ahsoka take down Maul before Ahsoka gets dropped, there's a possibility that the Jedi pair can bring down Dooku together. But as is, I find it more likely that Ahsoka goes down first, and then the two Sith team up against Luke.

Ep6 Luke is on par with Vader by quotes about Ep6, and Vader is above Maul. The biggest thing Maul lifted was Eta shuttle, Vader lifted greater objects. He is also faster as seen by more afterimages in comic scans than Maul produced. Same goes with Dooku, although Dooku lifted objects Savage had problems with, and Savage was able to push a shuttle of the cliff, similiar to Savage.

Luke should be then > Dooku, and Dooku > Maul.

Ahsoka's fight against Maul was a stalemate in Rebels, so since Luke beats Dooku, Team 1 should win.

I am willing to debate this.

Originally posted by AverageDebater
Ep6 Luke is on par with Vader by quotes about Ep6, and Vader is above Maul. The biggest thing Maul lifted was Eta shuttle, Vader lifted greater objects. He is also faster as seen by more afterimages in comic scans than Maul produced. Same goes with Dooku, although Dooku lifted objects Savage had problems with, and Savage was able to push a shuttle of the cliff, similiar to Savage.

Luke should be then > Dooku, and Dooku > Maul.

Ahsoka's fight against Maul was a stalemate in Rebels, so since Luke beats Dooku, Team 1 should win.

I am willing to debate this. You tried.

Originally posted by BestDebaterEver
You tried. Thanks, I think it is more important to provide some arguments, not the best arguments, but solid ones, since most people won't change their mind either way, and longer tangents are not something authors would have in mind either way. It is all fiction after all and we shouldn't try too much, imo.

Originally posted by CactusJoe
carthage cleaned house here lol

You mean he got tooled, no logical person could legit believe he won that, he got dominated by Ell.

Originally posted by AverageDebater
Thanks, I think it is more important to provide some arguments, not the best arguments, but solid ones, since most people won't change their mind either way, and longer tangents are not something authors would have in mind either way. It is all fiction after all and we shouldn't try too much, imo. At least your posts have some kind of merit and reasoning to them. I'm so happy my bed-wetting f*ggot son Timmy got banned. I'm ashamed of that little punk.

Originally posted by BestDebaterEver
At least your posts have some kind of merit and reasoning to them. I'm so happy my bed-wetting f*ggot son Timmy got banned. I'm ashamed of that little punk.


screw u

Originally posted by G-sus
screw u Who the hell are you?

Originally posted by BestDebaterEver
Who the hell are you?

g-sus

Canon Only I definitely give this to the Sith team. Because in Canon it seems Luke is the weak link as of ROTJ.

I assume by Canon and Legends the OP mainly means Legends but has to include Canon because Rebels Ahsoka exists in canon only.

In that case team 1 wins the composite round, given in Legends Luke was =/> ROTJ Vader, and Rebels Vader was clearly > Ahsoka/Maul.

Either fight, I have Ahsoka and Maul approx on par, with the winner of Luke vs Dooku making the difference.

Either on Team 2 could potentially solo

I'm going with team 1, idk pretty ****ed rn