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Round 1: Sabers

Round 2: All out

Who wins?

Kazdan.
Kazdan.

Aayla has better feats.

Kazdan lost to an early Galen Marek.

none of them can stand up to the power of white race, fodder thread

An early Galen Marek is 100 times better then Aayla.

Originally posted by JKBart
none of them can stand up to the power of white race, fodder thread

But Galen is white. :5

Honestly yeah... Kazdan in both rounds.

Galen stompped the shit out of Paratus tho, not sure how's that beyond Aayla...

Only with force powers tbh, Paratus's speed was actually overwhelming him. And Galen's force powers shit on Aayla's tbh.

lel his speed didn't overwhelm Galen, only he outpaced Galen with the mechanical legs. That's hardly enough to warrant a win.

"Part flesh and part machine, the renegade Jedi Master was proficient with the Force, and quick with it as well. Every blow the apprentice tried to make was instantly blocked by either end of the whirling pike. As fast as he lunged or retreated, the mechanical legs outpaced him. Paratus hopped around the dilapidated chamber like a deranged jumping spider."

Seemed impressive enough to me. Plus Paratus should have a Force edge tbh.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Plus Paratus should have a Force edge tbh.

Because?

Because animating ****ing junk golems with the force along with several other droids across the planet is a greater showing of power in the Force than anything Aayla does.

Kazdan wins.

An Joker timing

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Because animating ****ing junk golems with the force along with several other droids across the planet is a greater showing of power in the Force than anything Aayla does.

He did no such thing:

As he walked cautiously forward, feeling the nearness of Kazdan Paratus but uncertain of his exact location, one of the rubbish piles stirred. From it stepped a humanoid machine made from the junked droid parts he had expected to find on his journey.

The braincase of an FX-8 medical droid was bolted onto a body cobbled together from several types of outdated protocol models. Its limbs appeared to come from a mixture of EV and B1 battle droids, tipped with instruments and tools that wouldn't looked out of place in a workshop. Its sole functioning photoreceptor glared a bright, furious yellow. Its lurching gait achieved an appreciable speed before he sliced its head off.

Not that it would translate into combative prowess. Vaylin was ripping apart mulit-stories high building and was beaten by Senya...

Who do you think was animating said droids? Who do you think rebuilt the Jedi temple?

Also given Kazdan was stated to be a tougher threat then Rahm Kota and proficient in the Force in a scenario where he was not using combative applications of the Force ( aside from augmentation ) I'd say it's pretty impressive.

Animated? They are droids...

And considering Kota laughed at Galen's lightning and tutaminis'd it while Kazdan got roflstomped I doubt he's the tougher opponent.

Kazdan has 4 feats:


Injuring a distracted Galen
Outpacing him with his legs
Not getting blitzed in sabers
Getting roflstompped in the Force


3 of those Aayla can replicate, and running faster hardly warrants a victory in and of itself.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Animated? They are droids...

And considering Kota laughed at Galen's lightning and tutaminis'd it while Kazdan got roflstomped I doubt he's the tougher opponent.

They are junk parts Kazdan was holding together and directing with his will.

Then why would Vader say he didn't expect Galen to survive against Kazdan when he did against Rahm. Unless you're suggesting Vader lied to mess with Galen, he simply grew in power enough to defeat Kazdan as easily as he did. Feel free to have your opinion but I hold the latter.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Kazdan has 4 feats:


Injuring a distracted Galen
Outpacing him with his legs
Not getting blitzed in sabers
Getting roflstompped in the Force


3 of those Aayla can replicate, and running faster hardly warrants a victory in and of itself.

I'd say a speed advantage is a good start and given Marek couldn't outright ragdoll him ( he was electrocuted into submission before Galen gripped him ) and he was indicated to be more powerful then Rahm I'd say he also has a force advantage.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
"Part flesh and part machine, the renegade Jedi Master was proficient with the Force, and quick with it as well. Every blow the apprentice tried to make was instantly blocked by either end of the whirling pike. As fast as he lunged or retreated, the mechanical legs outpaced him. Paratus hopped around the dilapidated chamber like a deranged jumping spider."

Seemed impressive enough to me. Plus Paratus should have a Force edge tbh. Novels are stupid, and they're no more canon then the games are.

Kazdan on both rounds.

Originally posted by Syndicate
They are junk parts Kazdan was holding together and directing with his will.

No they are just droids. The novel describes them in detail and never mentions that they were animated by the Force.

Then why would Vader say he didn't expect Galen to survive against Kazdan when he did against Rahm. Unless you're suggesting Vader lied to mess with Galen, he simply grew in power enough to defeat Kazdan as easily as he did. Feel free to have your opinion but I hold the latter.

Hmm Vader didn't expect him to survive, yet Galen wtfstomped him. I guess he might not have been honest...

Originally posted by Syndicate
I'd say a speed advantage is a good start and given Marek couldn't outright ragdoll him ( he was electrocuted into submission before Galen gripped him ) and he was indicated to be more powerful then Rahm I'd say he also has a force advantage.

Galen could've one shotted him with Lightning, only because he chose to use lightning first and TK second doesn't mean he couldn't have ragdolled him outright, that's just retarded.

And no, Paratus was never said to be more powerful than Kota by an objective source.

In game they are junk golems animated by the Force, is this anywhere contradicted by the text?

This is their whole descrition:

From it stepped a humanoid machine made from the junked droid parts he had expected to find on his journey.

The braincase of an FX-8 medical droid was bolted onto a body cobbled together from several types of outdated protocol models. Its limbs appeared to come from a mixture of EV and B1 battle droids, tipped with instruments and tools that wouldn't looked out of place in a workshop. Its sole functioning photoreceptor glared a bright, furious yellow. Its lurching gait achieved an appreciable speed before he sliced its head off.

A second patchwork droid emerged from a different rubbish pile, followed by a third. The sound of more droid golems stirring line from elsewhere in the Temple. The apprentice fought them with practiced ease. He had been dueling PROXY all his life; knew the weaknesses and strengths of droids, even one capable, by a clever use of repulsor technologies and a specially adapted antique training lightsaber, of imitating a Jedi. Ones such as these, with barely a matching part among them, were child's play.

If they were glued together and animated by the Force, such as this Galen would've taken note of it:

http://puu.sh/oBEfR/72db5f1eef.jpg

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Novels are stupid, and they're no more canon then the games are.
You just listed Kazdan's only two appearances... What the flying **** are we supposed to judge him off of then?

Originally posted by Beniboybling
In game they are junk golems animated by the Force, is this anywhere contradicted by the text? Who cares, both are as canon as each other, so both can be used.

Unless Disney has changed the levels of canon.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
You just listed Kazdan's only two appearances... What the flying **** are we supposed to judge him off of then? His performance in the game, which is the original source material.

Marek legitimately was stronger then Vader back then, and he also beat Kazdan's ass with little effort.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
No they are just droids. The novel describes them in detail and never mentions that they were animated by the Force.



Hmm Vader didn't expect him to survive, yet Galen wtfstomped him. I guess he might not have been honest...



Galen could've one shotted him with Lightning, only because he chose to use lightning first and TK second doesn't mean he couldn't have ragdolled him outright, that's just retarded.

And no, Paratus was never said to be more powerful than Kota by an objective source.

Was going to address this but Beni seems to have done so already.

Or Vader was expressing his legitimate thoughts and Galen simply improved enough to accomplish the performance he did against Kazdan.

Saying that using lightning on someone that has instantly killed groups of stormtroopers wearing insulated armor wouldn't affect somebodies ability to defend against TK is retarded imo.

He was suggested to be by Vader.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
This is their whole descrition:

From it stepped a humanoid machine made from the junked droid parts he had expected to find on his journey.

The braincase of an FX-8 medical droid was bolted onto a body cobbled together from several types of outdated protocol models. Its limbs appeared to come from a mixture of EV and B1 battle droids, tipped with instruments and tools that wouldn't looked out of place in a workshop. Its sole functioning photoreceptor glared a bright, furious yellow. Its lurching gait achieved an appreciable speed before he sliced its head off.

A second patchwork droid emerged from a different rubbish pile, followed by a third. The sound of more droid golems stirring line from elsewhere in the Temple. The apprentice fought them with practiced ease. He had been dueling PROXY all his life; knew the weaknesses and strengths of droids, even one capable, by a clever use of repulsor technologies and a specially adapted antique training lightsaber, of imitating a Jedi. Ones such as these, with barely a matching part among them, were child's play.

If they were glued together and animated by the Force, such as this Galen would've taken note of it:

http://puu.sh/oBEfR/72db5f1eef.jpg

Why would game Galen have noted it?

Originally posted by Syndicate
Or Vader was expressing his legitimate thoughts and Galen simply improved enough to accomplish the performance he did against Kazdan.

Prove it. Vader is a lying **** and Galen struggeled against Kota yet roflstompped Kazdan. Not even Luke has that kind of learning curve...



Except that's not what I said. You say Galen couldn't flat out ragdoll Paratus because he chose not to. That's something Ahsoka wankers say. I guess Sidious can't ragdoll Agen and Fisto because he chose to kill them in lightsaber combat...


Who is not objective

Originally posted by Syndicate
Why would game Galen have noted it?

Kek. Galen goes in detail what parts of the junk droid he recognises but doesn't give a shit it's animated by the Force?

Going to B&N. I'll respond in a few hours.

This isn't Twitter. Feel free to just respond later.

As I recall just before he fights Paratus, he fights something resembling that image.

That was Paratus himself in a droid.

A huge junk golem smashed through a nearby wall, servomotors growling, brandishing two of the biggest vibro-axes he had ever seen, one in each hand. It took two steps toward him and blinked its enormous photoreceptors in barely restrained hostility.

I don't think droids animated by the Force need servomotors

Yeah just read it, your probably right. Paratus still wins though.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Paratus still wins though.

http://i.imgur.com/ZC5JHSH.gif

Lawls. Nah but really, Kazdan outpaces her and Aayla overextends.

>Aayla more powerful
>Aayla more skilled
>Paratus have mechanical legs
>Paratus is insane
>Paratus wins

Yes, you are beginning to understand.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Kek. Galen goes in detail what parts of the junk droid he recognises but doesn't give a shit it's animated by the Force?

Why would he care about why it's moving around? He's pretty single minded. Take out his target and all obstacles in his path. Leave no witnesses.

Originally posted by Syndicate
Why would he care about why it's moving around? He's pretty single minded. Take out his target and all obstacles in his path. Leave no witnesses.

https://media4.giphy.com/media/IMuqnp96sdhyE/200.gif

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
https://media4.giphy.com/media/IMuqnp96sdhyE/200.gif

:I

Aayla just outclasses him in every way possible, shes comparable to Shaak To, who is way out of Kazdan's league.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Aayla just outclasses him in every way possible, shes comparable to Shaak To, who is way out of Kazdan's league.
How the **** is Aayla comparable to Shaak Ti?

Originally posted by Emperordmb
How the **** is Aayla comparable to Shaak Ti?

They are both pretty hot tbh.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
How the **** is Aayla comparable to Shaak Ti?
No seriously... how?
On topic: Kazdan. His telekinesis is better, and him giving Galen Marek(even if early TFU) a good fight would imply at least comparable skill.

Originally posted by MythLord
No seriously... how?
On topic: Kazdan. His telekinesis is better, and him giving Galen Marek(even if early TFU) a good fight would imply at least comparable skill.

What TK? What good fight?

The TK he used to animate thousands of droids and rebuild the Jedi Temple.

Originally posted by Syndicate
The TK he used to animate thousands of droids and rebuild the Jedi Temple.

Tune back tonight for shit that never happened.

But Syn that only happens in the game which has lots of different versions so obviously all of them are inaccurate.

If they corroborate they're not. If they contradict each other they are. Thought you would have understood such a simple concept by now.

Cherry picking is always convincing

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Tune back tonight for shit that never happened.

"He builds a replica of the Jedi Temple from debris gathered from an abandoned industrial quarter of Raxus Prime and he holds council sessions there with "Jedi Masters" fashioned from debris and guarded by an army of ANIMATED junk droid sentries also constructed for junk."

:>

http://static8.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11120/111205740/5184195-screen+shot+2016-05-01+at+12.32.54+pm.png
http://static7.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11120/111205740/5184198-screen+shot+2016-05-01+at+12.33.15+pm.png

I happen to have no doubt that Kazdan wins this fight, no question.

Originally posted by Syndicate
watch?v=H-vw8Ex_-vA

Originally posted by Syndicate
"He builds a replica of the Jedi Temple from debris gathered from an abandoned industrial quarter of Raxus Prime and he holds council sessions there with "Jedi Masters" fashioned from debris and guarded by an army of ANIMATED junk droid sentries also constructed for junk."

:>

https://media3.giphy.com/media/1vAaDWLvujuCI/200.gif

Where does it say by the Force?

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
https://media3.giphy.com/media/1vAaDWLvujuCI/200.gif

Where does it say by the Force?
Originally posted by Emperordmb
http://static8.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11120/111205740/5184195-screen+shot+2016-05-01+at+12.32.54+pm.png
http://static7.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11120/111205740/5184198-screen+shot+2016-05-01+at+12.33.15+pm.png
watch?v=f991gJOP47c

Nice rape Emp.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
watch?v=f991gJOP47c

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
That was Paratus himself in a droid.

A huge junk golem smashed through a nearby wall, servomotors growling, brandishing two of the biggest vibro-axes he had ever seen, one in each hand. It took two steps toward him and blinked its enormous photoreceptors in barely restrained hostility.

I don't think droids animated by the Force need servomotors

That also doesn't say it runs on the Force, just that Paratus used it to strengthen it.

Some of the droids could very well have both tbh. So what you have is two or three sources saying they were force imbued, and once source not mentioning it but not contradicting it either.

I'd say it's substantiated in enough sources and not directly contradicted by any source to be legit, so you saying its invalid because servomotors just seems like you grasping at straws tbh

^ Tbh.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Some of the droids could very well have both tbh. So what you have is two or three sources saying they were force imbued, and once source not mentioning it but not contradicting it either.

I'd say it's substantiated in enough sources and not directly contradicted by any source to be legit, so you saying its invalid because servomotors just seems like you grasping at straws tbh

It is contradected by the book when it goes into detail of their description and no Force is mentioned.

Absence of proof is not proof of absence Zoltan, especially when you have two other sources substantiating it.

The book not mentioning it is very shaky ground to dismiss evidence provided in multiple sources over.

lel that would only work if there is no description at all...

Not like Force imbuding droids is a combative showing. You could say Paratus beats Kenobi by the same principle...

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
That also doesn't say it runs on the Force, just that Paratus used it to strengthen it.

It says force imbued and animated. Not strengthened though they likely were as well.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
It is contradected by the book when it goes into detail of their description and no Force is mentioned.

So it's contradicted because Galen doesn't note it? I guess they're not force imbued either even though that's mentioned in another source. I mean Galen didn't mention it in his monologue so it couldn't be.

No, it just says imbued in one source and that they are animated in another. Whereas we know how they're animated.

Originally posted by Syndicate
So it's contradicted because Galen doesn't note it? I guess they're not force imbued either even though that's mentioned in another source. I mean Galen didn't mention it in his monologue so it couldn't be.
Exactly.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
lel that would only work if there is no description at all...

Not like Force imbuding droids is a combative showing. You could say Paratus beats Kenobi by the same principle...

It's a demonstration of his capabilities as a force user that he was able to animate possibly thousands of them at once.

Originally posted by FreshestSlice
No, it just says imbued in one source and that they are animated in another. Whereas we know how they're animated.

Yep. They're stated to be force imbued and animated which suggests they're being animated by the Force Kazdan is imbuing them with.

Originally posted by Syndicate
It's a demonstration of his capabilities as a force user that he was able to animate possibly thousands of them at once.

Even if it'd be legit so what? Quantify it. You say it's definitely enough to beat Aayla, where does it stop? Luminara? Fisto? Kenobi? Zonakin?

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Exactly.

I honestly don't know what to say. You either don't know the definition of contradicted or you're acting ignorant for no apparent reason.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Even if it'd be legit so what? Quantify it. You say it's definitely enough to beat Aayla, where does it stop? Luminara? Fisto? Kenobi? Zonakin?

Given he's suggested to be more powerful then Rahm and the feats of rebuilding the Jedi Temple and animating thousands of droids I'd say he's pretty up there as a force user.

Originally posted by Syndicate
I honestly don't know what to say. You either don't know the definition of contradicted or you're acting ignorant for no apparent reason.

I could say the same. Force animated droids are not exactly common. It seems like a thing someone would mention when describing something in detail. Not to mention he then went ahead and called them childs play:

The apprentice fought them with practiced ease. He had been dueling PROXY all his life; knew the weaknesses and strengths of droids, even one capable, by a clever use of repulsor technologies and a specially adapted antique training lightsaber, of imitating a Jedi. Ones such as these, with barely a matching part among them, were child's play.

Originally posted by Syndicate
Given he's suggested to be more powerful then Rahm and the feats of rebuilding the Jedi Temple and animating thousands of droids I'd say he's pretty up there as a force user.

I love your repeating arguments. Paratus was never said to be more powerful than Kota by an objective source. For him to be more powerful than Kota Galen would have to posses a learning curve that shits on Luke's. Seems far fetched.

Kek nowhere was it stated he rebuilt the Temple with the Force. His obvious love for tech suggest otherwise...

An Imperial assassin droid loaded with programs of the greatest combatants in Galactic history and who's capabilities were specifically improved by Vader being superior to animated junk droids? That's crazy talk.

He was stated to be more of a challenge for Galen then Rahm was by Vader. Vader has no reason to lie. Kazdan has the feats to suggest he is. I don't see why you are so adverse to acknowledging his superiority. Given Galen was suggested to essentially be Luke if he had been raised by Vader I don't see a problem with that line of reasoning.

"He builds a replica of the Jedi Temple from debris gathered from an abandoned industrial quarter of Raxus Prime."

So he built it with his hands?

Going to watch Game of Thrones. Se ya on da flippity flop.

http://replygif.net/i/114.gif

This is the last time I'm addressing you, I gotta watch out for my mental health.



I'm not sure why you take Vader's blatant lie that was meant to pump up Galen over the actual evidence. Oh wait I know why. Because you love furiously wanking TFU.

No way in hell did Galen improve enough in the span of a few days to go from struggling with Kota to godstomping a more powerful opponent. If you just gona bring up "Buuuuuut Vader said so hurr durr" again than rather an hero yourself.



Kek. So we should just presume he did it with the force because of no apparent reason? He had 17 years and a ****ton of tech lying around to build that damn Temple. Unless you have a specific quote saying he did it with TK just let it go. Or an hero yourself.

Well since is the last time I might as well end it here.

And I don't see why you think Vader was lying when he had absolutely no reason to do so.

Given Galen is stated by the writers to have been a mirror of Luke in different circumstances and Luke's own progress I don't see why his progress is so unbelievable. Also it wasn't a few days it was weeks between each of his missions.

Can I ask you how exactly you think he built it then?

Whatever, sanity is overrated anyway.

Originally posted by Syndicate
Well since is the last time I might as well end it here.

And I don't see why you think Vader was lying when he had absolutely no reason to do so.

I told you the reason, you just conveniently ignored it. But it doesn't matter if he was lying or not, he was wrong. Simple as.



Except is not Luke level of learning curve. It's like The Ones level. Luke went from being beaten by Vader to being a match for him in a span of a year. You suggest Galen went from struggling with Kota to eclipse a Kota+ opponent in a week...



Lel. So the only way to build a temple over 17 years is the Force? How about his thousands of droids? I bet they were just serving him drinks while he used TK to build the Temple, all 1 thousand of them.

Lol.

Or he was telling the truth and Galen simply grew in power in the weeks between those missions.

No I suggest that Galen lasted 6 hours in a spar against Vader and in a year was able to defeat him similar to Luke. While Kazdan is more powerful then Rahm he's probably not that much above him given their comparative feats and if that's the case a few weeks of power growth and Galen actually having experience facing a real Jedi opponents should adequately explain his performance against a superior foe then Rahm Kota.

Thousands* Also probably the first believable point you've made in this thread. It's possible the droids he animated and imbued with the Force built the temple.

Going to watch GoT now. Have fun with your insanity.

Originally posted by Syndicate
Or he was telling the truth and Galen simply grew in power in the weeks between those missions.

No I suggest that Galen lasted 6 hours in a spar against Vader and in a year was able to defeat him similar to Luke. While Kazdan is more powerful then Rahm he's probably not that much above him given their comparative feats and if that's the case a few weeks of power growth and Galen actually having experience facing a real Jedi opponents should adequately explain his performance against a superior foe then Rahm Kota.

You must be the only person to take an in-universe quote so seriously when it's blatantly contradicted by actual showings. I guess you also believe Ben Kenobi > Sidious then?

Back on the Rebel base on Coruscant, Luke Skywalker tested Kyp's Jedi power potential. What he discovered was the strongest presence he had known since his Masters Obi-Wan and Yoda.
Source: The Essential Guide to Characters

Vader had no way to know their exact combative prowess. Accept already that he was wrong, you are just grasping at straws. And here I thought you take feats over accolades

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
You must be the only person to take an in-universe quote so seriously when it's blatantly contradicted by actual showings. I guess you also believe Ben Kenobi > Sidious then?

Back on the Rebel base on Coruscant, Luke Skywalker tested Kyp's Jedi power potential. What he discovered was the strongest presence he had known since his Masters Obi-Wan and Yoda.
Source: The Essential Guide to Characters

Vader had no way to know their exact combative prowess. Accept already that he was wrong, you are just grasping at straws. And here I thought you take feats over accolades

Considering I don't believe it be contradicted by showings...

Vader has access to the Jedi archives and the resources of an entire Galactic Empire at his disposal. I don't think it would very difficult for him to get a good understanding of Kazdan's capabilities.

I'm done running in circles with you. If your only argument is that Vader said so then you have no argument.

You ain't convincing anyone that Galen improved that much over a week.

How bout that TK feat on Raxus Prime? Seems legit enough to me.

What TK feat?

The one with a bunch of droids or something. I don't have the quote cause I'm on my phone, but I'm sure someone like Syn can hook you up.

Kazdan didn't use TK in the book.

No I'm talking about a feat for Marek that could be used to show his improvement.

Over what? He gathered energies to TK thousand of droids on Raxus, on Nar Shaddaa he just walked through everything without a hint of strain until he met Kota.

It wasn't on Nar Shadaa it was on the TIE factory above the planet.

Also there's a difference between making your way through hostile forces and TKi'ing possibly thousands of droids at once.

There's also a difference between exertion

Given the Force is what allows force users to exert themselves to the capacity that they do and that while a force user might be capable of sustaining themselves for hours yet not capable of accomplishing a feat of telekinesis that impressive... I'd have to disagree.

Tbh what Vader says about Marek's opponents is clearly inaccurate, and supposed to intimidate, downplay his abilities etc. for example about Paratus he says:

"Kazdan Paratus is far more powerful than you I do not expect you to survive."

Then after Marek stomps him he's all like:

"You have defeated a tired old man and an outcast. You will not be ready to face the Emperor until you have faced a true Jedi Master."

Or in other words, he's evidently chatting shit.