life after secret wars

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leonidas
just a place to talk about and keep people updated with regards to life in the current marvel universe.

i for one haven't been following much after sw, so anyone feel like sharing some stuff or posting some scans, that'd be cool. maybe get interested enough to start following things again....

Digi
There is nothing, fool. Despair!

no expression

Digi
Realistically, I haven't kept up with it either. I'm not sure I'll be picking up any books, but I too wouldn't mind a Cliff's Notes of what the hell's going on. Ultimate U and 616 merged Flashpoint-style, yeah? And the X-Men are in a different universe or something? Or was that all pre-SW smoke & mirrors? Did characters retain their memories and history? Or was it just the ones in the Ark in Secret Wars that remember anything beforehand? So basically, on a scale of Zero Hour to Flashpoint, how much actually changed?

Kazenji
For the books i've mainly been following

Carnage
All new Wolverine
Thor
Dr Strange
Invincible Iron Man
International Iron Man

with Invincible Iron Man, There was an appearance very early on from Doom without his armor.

leonidas
well...... not much being posted here. no one reading the new marvel stuff?? currently i'm catching up on all new all different avengers and gotta say...i like it quite a bit. ms marvel and nova are a nice addition. some good solid writing. some classic villains and a nice overall feel to the book.

gonna hit the extraordinary x-men next. the apocalypse wars has me intrigued.... as summer comes i'll do more catching up, but it seems like some of the new stuff at least is pretty solid.

AlmightyKfish
I'm still reading a few things.

Ultimates, Slott's Spider-man, Dr Strange, All New Wolverine, a couple of others.

I dropped most Avengers stuff other than Ultimates though. I guess I might go back at some point but I just don't care too much about the new teams.

leonidas
i have to admit i liked the pleasant hill story for the most part, mostly because it finally brought back a young steve rogers to be captain america again. the sentient cosmic cube was a neat idea the way it was used to imprison the villains too. maybe the highlight for me was american kaiju vs the voltron avenger! laughing out loud good classic comic book stuff imo.

leonidas
i'll tell you one book i really dislike: spidey. honestly, ANOTHER book that retells old spidey stories? untold tales was really good, but do we need another spidey book set in the past? between all the movies constantly redoing his origin and now this, it feels sooooooooo old news. teen aged pete fighting an old school doc ock? really?? just so tired and lame imo.... book can't get canceled fast enough you ask me.

btw--how IS everyone with parker at full potential? he's in the baxter building now for those who don't know and he is the head of a huge world spanning company. something people always said he was capable of given that he's one of the smartest characters in marvel, but seeing it now? not sure i'm a fan of the direction. not wholly against it, just...parker was always the little guy. change is good, characters need to grow, just....not sure. something about his success doesn't QUITE ring right with me. thoughts?

blair85
How, in-universe, did the incursions stop? Prior to SW, the incursions only stopped when the last two universes collided and exploded.

I've been reading some Avengers, Captain America and X-men, and only one book has even mentioned the incursions. Has this issue come up in other titles? How much of what happened, if any, are the characters aware of?

SamZED
Can somebody explain how come Ultimate Universe is now a part of 616? I mean how does it work exactly. Miles Morales still goes to school with his friends, but what about his parents and others? Is Ultimate Peter Parker there as well? Is green goblin? Ultimate Nick Fury? How does that work exactly?

blair85
Miles Morales and Old Man Logan were both present on Battleworld when the Beyonder-power changed hands and the multiverse was recreated. ...but then so were a lot of other multiversal characters that aren't around now.

Kazenji
Found out Vision will be saying "Hail Hydra" after September.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by SamZED
How does that work exactly?

From what I know, just a few characters from Ultimate Universe survived.

Miles, Ult. Logan's son and a few others.

Someboy should clear this up in a moment, hopefully.

leonidas
Originally posted by SamZED
Can somebody explain how come Ultimate Universe is now a part of 616? I mean how does it work exactly. Miles Morales still goes to school with his friends, but what about his parents and others? Is Ultimate Peter Parker there as well? Is green goblin? Ultimate Nick Fury? How does that work exactly?

someone already mentioned some of the answer. those ultimates present were saved my owen at the end (spidey-miles-gave him a sandwich so he was saved...) not too sure how many of the ults have been shown aside from the ones named. maker is also still around.....

as for the 'how' of it? that's a little tougher. there hasn't been any official explanation but i'll sort of try and answer it and the following at the same time:

Originally posted by blair85
How, in-universe, did the incursions stop? Prior to SW, the incursions only stopped when the last two universes collided and exploded.

I've been reading some Avengers, Captain America and X-men, and only one book has even mentioned the incursions. Has this issue come up in other titles? How much of what happened, if any, are the characters aware of?

the incursions never really 'stopped'. the multiverse was destroyed and pieces were saved by doom using owen who had the power of the beyonders as seen in the (awful imo) secret wars. frank and owen and reed then...rebuilt the multiverse.

what seems to have happened is that when the new multiverse was formed, the initial incursion was prevented from happening, hence no incursions in the reformed multiverse (this was shown at the end of sw). the whole thing is retroactive--by that i mean this new multiverse already has a history and everything established. i also believe (someone can confirm or correct) that only SOME remember the incursions and the previous incarnation at all. the previous universes were seamlessly blended into an amalgam of sorts that has ALWAYS existed from the pov of the majority of people living in the new multiverse.

now, that may not be exactly what has been going on. i may have missed some issues here or there that have cleared things up a bit more, or maybe poked holes in this, but that is what i've been able to gather. as i said, to my knowledge, there hasn't been a book that has sat down and walked us through everything, so i've pieced together my understanding of things through what i've read.

anyone else who can confirm of correct any of the above, feel free. smile

AlmightyKfish
Yeah I think that's basically the jist of it.

I think maybe there's a bit more vague knowledge of something called the incursions that was a problem, but people don't know the specifics, and they may not have actually occured outside of people's memories. I say this because we saw Maria Hill mention 'the incursion crisis' whilst talking to a bunch of people. But yeah, only a few seem to know exactly what happened.

But yeah the big thing is that in actuality the incursions were never stopped. The entire omniverse did collapse and die but then obviously then Doom, Owen and Strange saved it, then later Reed, Owen and Franklin build the new one. Which is why the Beyonders are still dead and not trying to murder everyone again, and why the incursions aren't actually happening. And maybe never did.

For instance, I'm fairly certain Iron Man/Captain America don't remember beating each other to death before the last incursion as that would make things...awkward.

But it seems many of the heavily involved people remember. Molecule Man obviously, Galactus, Black Bolt, Doom I assume by the way he laughs at the end of SW and has been following up on doing things differently. And then a few more dotted across the books who clearly remember too.


But really, the answer is whoever it's convenient for the writers. Which I guess is kinda fair enough for the sake of simplicity.

But yeah the technical how, Owen's speech in Ultimates basically said that the vast majority of lives continued from the old Omniverse into the new one, just there are some differences. The main being Miles from our standpoint I guess, whose life Owen specifically pasted out from the UU (and brought back his mother too).

leonidas
thumb up

one of the things i think was most POORLY explained was panther's use of the time gem, and the impact it had on ensuring the first incursion didn't happen. i wish that would be explored a little better and made more clear. i think sw did an awful job of making that HUGE revelation clear.... i found so much of sw rushed and unclear. erm

leonidas
anyone reading the ultimates? i....don't like it. i find myself rooting to get their a$$es kicked. lol they seem so bloody arrogant to me. blue marvel in particular. and i really hate that they were able to shove galactus in a box and 'evolve' him without batting an eye. i mean they are human, right? galactus is kinda smart and been around a for a bit, but they decide in the space on an issue, that they suddenly know how to 'fix' him? and they succeed?? i dunno but i'm calling bullsh!t on that. seriously, one issue? considering all that galactus has been through that really irritated me for some reason. there are some cool concepts in there but it feels like all of them are getting the panther/iron fist treatment. they're coming across as the annihilators on crack and for some reason i can't quite put my finger on, it's not sitting well at all with me.... erm

AlmightyKfish
I'm actually really enjoying it.

It's nice to have something of a bit different speed to most Avengers or cosmic stuff. I get the whole them being a bit arrogant thing, but to some extent that's in character for a lot of them, and we already saw it get them into huge trouble, seeing as they all almost died if Galactus hadn't saved them in issue #4 or whatnot. I get the feeling that their whole 'taking on the universes problems thing' is only going to get worse for them.

Plus it meant we got that gorgeous Galactus issue which has basically led into this slow burn plot of Galactus: PI, investigating the chaining of the omniverse.

Plus, on a personal note of liking the character, it seems to be about to explain exactly what was going on with Thanos' stupid Civil War 2 scenes, which is satisfying as Bendis' writing of the guy was pretty much a dumpster fire.

leonidas
hopefully thanos has some sort of plan to account for his losing to the ultimates like he did. that is a pretty low feat for him no matter how it's sliced.

anyone reading the new steve rogers book? i was so happy to have young steve back, but this force fitting of him as a hydra agent all along??

not sure i'm liking that idea. seems way WAY WAYYYYY the [email protected]@@ too far gone to try and believably play that kind of card with his character.....

StiltmanFTW
You really didn't need to put that in the spoiler tags, it was announced literally in every corner of the web.

One would have to be a carver not to know about this already stick out tongue

I wasn't surprised - Marvel has plenty of WTF moments like this. It'll probably get retconned or forgotten... or we'll find out that Steve was a double agent.

leonidas
i hope so. i mean literally, he has spent his entire career fighting them and suddenly he's always been one of them? wtf? idiotic even by the lesser standards of today. blink

StiltmanFTW
Punisher killed his own (resurrected) family. With fire.

S.H.I.E.L.D. was actually a tiny fraction of HYDRA.

Xavier wiped Wolverine's mind.

Odin was not the All-Father, just a usurper.

Gwen spread her legs for Norman Osborn.

====
Marvel keeps doing this. They never really stop.

leonidas
meh, just finished #2 of rogers. it's sort of clever and ALMOST works for me. using the kobik to essentially rewrite his history when she made him young is pretty clever imo. the way it was explained was a bit forced but i could see it almost working. it's a great plan by skull--would actually have liked to see the build up play out longer, but no doubt it's about the best way to get true revenge against cap. i'm hooked enough to keep reading to find out where it all goes....

leonidas
i've been surprised to find myself enjoying the new rogers cap series. interesting and curious to see how it plays out.

can't believe the ultimates beat thanos down a second time. lol sure it took some tech, but that's twice they took him out in short order. not sure i'm loving the ultimates though. they keep doing things that it seems others like reed or tony could have or should have thought of before. not sure if thanos's stock has just plummeted or if the ultimates has just over-valued itself....

enjoying the x-books too so far--at least for the most part.

leonidas
so...the ultimates is done and moving onto ultimates2 (squared)?? strange turn of events there....

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