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The answer, for me at least, is yes. Krayt is almost certainly faster than Sidious. This is based on a comparison of their most prominent feats, and what stipulations come attached with them. Pictured below, Sidious' blitzing of the B-team is outdone due to several important premises, all which come together in a fashion that paints clear picture, to just how much quicker Krayt really is.

http://static5.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11121/111212701/4636350-screen+shot+2015-06-02+at+11.35.12+pm.jpg

Premise 1) Krayt blitzes around four Imperial knights. I missed the previous page that can be found here - credit to SasukeDC. He does so without much resistance, unlike Palaptine with Fisto. The latter of whom can block at least three oncoming strikes from the Sith Lord. None of Krayt's enemies put up such a fight.

Premise 2) Appeals to the absence of feats for the imperial knights in question, is an illogical way to conclude wether they're as competent - or less competent - than Fisto, Tinn and Kolar. The B-team were essentially a group of people from a shortened list of Jedi. This does preclude the Masters already on other missions, who would have certainly made better replacements, such as Plo Koon and Kenobi. On the other hand, the warriors above were the close and personal guards of the Emperor, and were considered 'elite' amongst their special faction of Force sensitives. They are their Era's B-team.

Premise 3) Imperial gaurdsmen have been likened to Jedi in a favourable way that relates to combat by the Legacy Campaign Guide. Which states that the they were warriors rather than negotiators, and how their training saw them learn how to use the Force to transform themselves into "living weapons". They did expect saber-to-saber combat with the Sith, because such confrontations were common. Unlike Kit Fisto, the most competent B-teamer, who looses handily to a mere Dark Jedi.

Premise 4) The Vong implants - do in fact - dull Krayt's Force connection severely. This I think, is the crucial point. Vong implants are not some sort of arbitrary hindrance, when it comes to one's ability to wield the Force. They are quantifiable. Jacen Solo was cut off completely from the result of his seed implants in Traitor. So for Krayt to use any measure of augmented speed under their influence, is extremely impressive. He's also suffering from a terminal illness, which would widen the gap from Krayt in this state, to his Reborn self later in the comic.

Premise 5) The B-team are disadvantaged from a Galactic unbalancing of the Force towards the darkside. Naysayers haven't ceded to the fact it affected their ability as a whole - as per Mace Windu in Attack of the Clones. But they do admit that it diminished their ability to use Force sense. Seen as precognition comes under the same family as 'sense' it's stands to reason that their reactions were lessened too.

Just out of curiosity, where do you see 8 Imperial Knights?

Originally posted by Trocity
Just out of curiosity, where do you see 8 Imperial Knights?

My apologies. There is four.

No worries, more Krayt wank is always welcome.

I think the one panel blitzing of the Emperor's guards is an underrated feat as well, especially considering his connection to the Force was dampened at the time.

I think the image you posted in the thread is a revised version of the fight, because the original has Krayt blitz the three Knights but we don't actually ever see Roan's cousin die. That one has the three Knights all dying the exact same way, then Krayt proceeds to kill Roan's cousin. The art style looks different, too.

I do think that Krayt's feat is comparable to Sidious' when you factor in that Krayt improved dramatically after this point. They about on the same tier of speed for me.

Honestly Krayt in probably in the top 5 greatest duelists in the mythos with his speed, power and skill.

I don't know if he's faster or not but I've always maintained that he's overall stronger.

Based strictly on the main Legacy series I'd say he's already equal to Vader(and I was not even aware the Vong implants diminished one's connection to the Force). He was able to contend with someone as powerful as Karness Muur while basically on his death bed. He was also stronger than Cade, who is perhaps even more prodigious than Luke.

But it's his appearance and portrayal in FOTJ: Apocalypse that places him above Sidious.

Then there's his Dark Transfer. Something Plagueis and Sidious(and probably every other Sith) salivated after for decades and never achieved. But it's not just that he has it. It's the fact that he's back from the dead for 10 minutes and he's already better at it than Cade. The same Cade that
a)has an innate ability for the Dark Transfer
b)has the Skywalker bloodline

That's what's most impressive.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Honestly Krayt in probably in the top 5 greatest duelists in the mythos with his speed, power and skill.

Hmm... yeah, definitely. He might even make top 3 with everything factored in.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Hmm... yeah, definitely. He might even make top 3 with everything factored in. LOL

I'm probably forgetting one or two, but name the peeps above him?

Yoda, Luke, Anakin, Sidious.

I'm referring to Sith only, my bad.

I just re-read Traitor the other day, and I'd like to point out that Jacen was stripped of the Force prior to receiving the implants mentioned here.

That said, there's also a number of sources that allude to the fact that Krayt was weakened severely by his worsening condition by the time of Legacy.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Yoda, Luke, Anakin (zone mode only), Sidious.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Yoda, Luke, Anakin, Sidious.

Jesus, Anakin is nowhere near the top 5.

He slaughtered Dooku, of course he is.

Originally posted by AncientPower
He slaughtered Dooku, of course he is.

If nobody will point out some of the discrepancies here i will...

Originally posted by Syndicate
If nobody will point out some of the discrepancies here i will... dew'it

Alrightie then. After my morning Cheerios.

Admittedly that did make me blink skeptically when I read it.

Why are we comparing 4 randoms, to some of the greatest swords masters the Jedi Order produced?

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Why are we comparing 4 randoms, to some of the greatest swords masters the Jedi Order produced?

'Cause numbers are more important. That's why Kun's TK feat > Vader's.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Why are we comparing 4 randoms, to some of the greatest swords masters the Jedi Order produced?

Imperial Knights are hardcore af. According to Q99, who's the Legacy scholar around here, to become a Knight you have to be equivalent to a Jedi Master. These weren't just standard Knights either, they were elites chosen to guard the Emperor as well as the Emperor's cousin. Krayt butchered them with no opportunity to respond.

Sidious' feat is better, because the B team is still better to those IK's, but Krayt dramatically improved after that so it easily evens out imo.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Why are we comparing 4 randoms, to some of the greatest swords masters the Jedi Order produced?

When it comes to deflecting blaster bolts and cutting down defenseless batlledroids, then yeah, they might be some of the best of their era. When it comes to duelling with actual Sith Warriors? Nah. They're pretty far from being the 'best', or even being 'competent'.

deflecting blaster shots is more relevant than dueling skill when it comes to not being blitzed lol

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
'Cause numbers are more important. That's why Kun's TK feat > Vader's.

Yeah, I've been noticing this kinda shitty logic on multiple Forums now.

Unless blaster bolts can change trajectory at any time from their starting point, then no. Blocking a lightsaber from someone channelling the Force, is far more unpredictable then positioning your blade to deflect something that can only go in a straight line. lol.

Fak u Jack.

but there r multiple blaster shots they have to move around and block

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Why are we comparing 4 randoms, to some of the greatest swords masters the Jedi Order produced?

Originally posted by Nephthys
Imperial Knights are hardcore af. According to Q99, who's the Legacy scholar around here, to become a Knight you have to be equivalent to a Jedi Master.

http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/ip1kq0.gif

Considering that Sidious was moving too fast for even Windu to initially react, nor could he be perceived by Darth Maul when supposedly holding back, no, Krayt does not compare lol.

And lol @ assuming blitzing the B-Team is remotely the best he can do.

this feat is not even remotely Sidious level

Krayt is only better than Palpatine after his rebirth, and that's better than regular Palpatine. DE Palpatine is a different story.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Imperial Knights are hardcore af. According to Q99, who's the Legacy scholar around here, to become a Knight you have to be equivalent to a Jedi Master. These weren't just standard Knights either, they were elites chosen to guard the Emperor as well as the Emperor's cousin. Krayt butchered them with no opportunity to respond.

Sidious' feat is better, because the B team is still better to those IK's, but Krayt dramatically improved after that so it easily evens out imo.

So, they were the cream of the crop fodder? Magnaguards have recieved similar hype, and Fisto, one of the Jedi Masters here, has virtually blitzed them.

I'm not saying the Imperial Knights sucked, but no way are nameless randoms anywhere near the likes of Fisto, Agen, or Tiin. Again, not only famed to be the greatest at the time, but the greatest in the history of the Order.

Who gives a shit about Magnaguards.

They aren't the greatest anything, lol. The B team is above them, but Krayt is vastly superior in his strongest incarnation as well.

Kas'im could near blitz trainee Bane who moved faster than near Sith Masters could even see. Not arguing Kas'im is Krayt level by any means, but it takes more than feats like this to place one on Sidious's speed tier.

Point is, Magnaguards are similar to random Imperial Knights KEK.

After all, they were stated to be "more than a match for most (Jedi)" with "near relativistic reflexes". Both were compared to Jedi favaroably, and both were, at the time, some of the best their faction had to offer. How are the Imperial Knights so much better?

Even scaling, this doesn't put Krayt anywhere near Palpatine in speed.

Cancer.

About as cancer as Krayt being better than Sidious at anything, worth anything.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Why are we comparing 4 randoms, to some of the greatest swords masters the Jedi Order produced? The Imperial Knights are pretty powerful, Antares Draco was able to beat Talon, IIRC.

No, he didn't. Also Draco was the leader of the IKs, that's like saying every jedi is pretty powerful because of Yoda.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
No, he didn't. Also Draco was the leader of the IKs, that's like saying every jedi is pretty powerful because of Yoda. Thats different, because there were hundreds of Jedi, whereas there were only 7-10 IK's.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Thats different, because there were hundreds of Jedi, whereas there were only 7-10 IK's. My mistake, I was thinking of Havok.

Nah, there were a lot more knights than that.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
My mistake, I was thinking of Havok.

Havok oneshotted Draco kek.

Originally posted by Jmanghan
Thats different, because there were hundreds of Jedi, whereas there were only 7-10 IK's.

Lol, there are hundreds of Imperial Knights, and thousands of Jedi.

I think Q said there were around 60 Imperial Knights, not sure if that's correct, but yeah, thousands of Jedi lol.

Not sure where he's getting those numbers, but we saw an army of them in Legacy 2. Whether or not that army encompassed all Imperial Knights, or whether they seemed to number in the dozens or hundreds, I don't remember. I'd be inclined to say I suspect that there's at least 100 IK's out there either way, though.

It doesn't matter much. The point is still that the IK's are an exclusive, elite order.

Who don't compare to four of the most masterful duelists in the Jedi Order, tbh.

Ziggy's done a pretty awful job of arguing this, honestly.

That's true, Neph. AP is right, though; although we can speculate about how capable they were based on the circumstances, there's no decent evidence that condones putting nameless randoms above three of the most accomplished duelists ever produced by the Jedi Order. It's not like Krayt blitzed Antares Draco or Tries Sinde or Ganner Kreig, and I see no reason to assume he could either--of course, I also consider the B-Team going down like they did to be somewhat nonsensical, but that's another matter entirely. Krayt's fast, but by way of feats Palpatine's faster--how much faster, and how much it matters, is up for debate.

Ziggy never argues to support a character, rather Ziggy argues in spite of that character's respect so as to assail the Palpatine status quo. Still, his argument isn't nearly as solid as he could've made it. I can only assume his ignorance on the matter.

That's the impression I got as well, honestly.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Who don't compare to four of the most masterful duelists in the Jedi Order, tbh.

Ziggy's done a pretty awful job of arguing this, honestly.

I don't see why the couldn't at least compare. I think you're overrating how good the likes of Agen Kolar and Sasee Tiin are. If every Imperial Knight is equivalent to a Jedi Master and these guys are apparently the elite given that they're performing the highest calling of their Order in personally defending the Emperor I'd reckon they'd be pretty ****ing legit and at least able to give the likes of the B team a decent duel.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
That's true, Neph. AP is right, though; although we can speculate about how capable they were based on the circumstances, there's no decent evidence that condones putting nameless randoms above three of the most accomplished duelists ever produced by the Jedi Order.

I never put them above the B-team, lol. I've explicitly said they're probably well below them. But I don't think the gap is larger than the amount that Krayt improved from the time of that feat to his prime.

Originally posted by Nephthys
I don't see why the couldn't at least compare.

"Could" is "could". I don't see any logical reason to assume they would even come close.



They're hardly much worse than Antares Draco or Ganner Krieg, who are far and away the best Imperial Knights.



Again, source?



Uh, no, not necessarily.

Coincidentally, in LoE, there were also four Jedi that were charged with Palpatine's defense. They were all slaughtered by Grievous in the space of a page; the fact that these four were guarding Roan Fel's body double doesn't prove they were exceptional (by our standards). Of the group, only one was particularly notable. None of the Imperial Knights we know to be the best were present, at any rate.

Here is a Jedi turn Sith that I also admire.
Darth Krayt imo is more powerful than Sidious.
This Dark Lord came back to life in his own body no clones no out of body experience!!!
He took Niman to another level.
Only two Sith dominated Jedi with Niman.

1.Exar Kun
2. Darth Krayt

Darth Krayt might be faster than Sidious,if he's not then Krayt is seriously more powerful.
imo,of course.

Kolar has nothing bar some good accolades. Vos wasn't going all out at Kolar trying to kill him nor was he ready tbh? Fisto lost to Ventress only due to her having prior knowledge of his style and his form's weakness to Makashi and I think Fisto defeating Grievous is actually impressive because of how he did it, regardless of how useless The General is in TCW. He pushed Grievous back through pure offensive might which is a very impressive feat IMO. Tiin is largely an unknown

GG's cybernetics not being fully charged would pretty significantly impact Fisto's overall prestige imo.

Originally posted by Nephthys
GG's cybernetics not being fully charged would pretty significantly impact Fisto's overall prestige imo.

That argument is valid but Fisto kinda dominated him. After Grievous gets force pushed into the ground, Kit could have very well ended him (debatable) but instead just pulled an arrogant smile lmao. It shows him being in complete control and on top but is perhaps more focused on escaping rather than killing.

Lol, the "B-Team" were handpicked by Windu well in advance, and he regarded them, along with Shaak Ti, as some of the best of the Order.

Mace has also stated that he might be the only Jedi capable of stopping his apprentice Depa Belaba, should there be reason to do so and his further thoughts reveal that her bladework might even surpass his own.

Going by the binding fact that is Mace Windu's opinion, Depa should be > Yoda, no?

Mace told me that he'd seen Kylo Ren in the shower and he had an 8 pack. That he was shredded!

Originally posted by Ziggystardust
Mace has also stated that he might be the only Jedi capable of stopping his apprentice Depa Belaba, should there be reason to do so and his further thoughts reveal that her bladework might even surpass his own.

Going by the binding fact that is Mace Windu's opinion, Depa should be > Yoda, no? Guess Depa must be really good then.

On the other hand when Windu is handpicking Jedi for an extremely deadly mission, and his thoughts are supported by both Shaak Ti's and Obi-Wan Kenobi's, they are indeed binding.

But yeah he was probably just high or something.

Sounds like just opinions, hyperbole and facts relative to one's contemporaries to me.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Sounds like just opinions, hyperbole and facts relative to one's contemporaries to me.

Saved it for future use every time Neph is trying to make an argument for a TOR character.

How ironic.

Ziggy... you're still missing the singular most important source for your argument.

Ziggy for christs sake, if you're going to wank Krayt do it right:

"However, the Imperial Knights are also masters of two unique lightsaber combat forms that place greater emphasis on teamwork than one's individual prowess. The more aggressive style, known as praetoria vonil, focuses on moving quickly and striking hard. The more defensive style, known as praetoria ishu, emphasizes protecting one's allies to allow them to find openings in an opponent's defences."

The point isn't even that the Imperial Guards individually > B-Team, but the fact all four of them are a tight-nit unit trained from birth to defend each other as a whole, and still couldn't stop Krayt massacring them, is the important part.

Which really doesn't come into play if you're killed before you can react. So, they either are better than the B-Team, or comparable, and just lost, or you don't really have a point.

They weren't killed before they could react

Perhaps some aid is required:



He tricked Tiin into dropping his guard, killed him and then Kolar.

Originally posted by Selenial
They weren't killed before they could react
He killed most of them at once. That's before you react, fam. Pulling out your lightsaber isn't some advanced saber form, if that's what you're implying.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Perhaps some aid is required:



He tricked Tiin into dropping his guard, killed him and then Kolar.
The movies are a higher source. Kolar got gutted first and there was no telepathic bullshit.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Saved it for future use every time Neph is trying to make an argument for a TOR character. i.e when it's relevant.

Originally posted by cs_zoltan
Saved it for future use every time Neph is trying to make an argument for a TOR character.

lol

Originally posted by Nephthys
Sounds like just opinions, hyperbole and facts relative to one's contemporaries to me.
http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/2013/02/mj-laughing.gif

Bump. No refutations have been made here.

Oh Ziggy... I used to respect you.

Everyone missed the point of my burn. I was echo'ing something Beni said.

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Oh Ziggy... I used to respect you.

I imagine you still do. Any thoughts on Krayt's speed vs Sidious?

Not as much as before admittedly.

If you really want to have a discusssion about this I will oblige you.

Can you provide me the quote that says the other members of the Imperial Knights Krayt defeated aside from Antares Draco were the best of their Order?

Originally posted by Selenial
"However, the Imperial Knights are also masters of two unique lightsaber combat forms that place greater emphasis on teamwork than one's individual prowess. The more aggressive style, known as praetoria vonil, focuses on moving quickly and striking hard. The more defensive style, known as praetoria ishu, emphasizes protecting one's allies to allow them to find openings in an opponent's defences."

Where's this from?

I think Krayt Can tie with Sidious. Hell if he dominated Cade (yes im using him) in his Vong state then yes I can see that happening.

Reborn Krayt IMHO can go against DE sidious in speed.

Sidious nearly speedblitzes Vong Krayt