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Angel from BTVS and his self titled spin-off show.

I've been rewatching Angel recently and his stats seem comparable to Steve's in many areas.

Fighting after sunset, whatever misunderstanding is required for both to go for a win.

1. No weapons
2. Standard gear - Shield for cap, a sword and retractable stales for Angel.

Angel in both.

Stales ~~~~~ Stakes

Originally posted by Scoobless
Fighting after sunset, whatever misunderstanding is required for both to go for a win.


He found out Angel hooked up with Peggy, some time while he was frozen.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
He found out Angel hooked up with Peggy, some time while he was frozen.

The implication: she's a bad lay.... at least not good enough to break Angel's curse.

Steve finds out Angel's given name is James so they stop fighting and go eat some schwarma

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
Steve finds out Angel's given name is James so they stop fighting and go eat some schwarma

Liam, actually.

Originally posted by Scoobless
The implication: she's a bad lay.... at least not good enough to break Angel's curse.



Angel is only interested in jailbait.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Liam, actually.

i knew that

Angel has good damage soak, and a few good feats of speed, but overall I'd say Cap is better.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Angel is only interested in jailbait.

The original Edward Cullen.

That's the problem with immortality. After you hit 200+, everything is jailbait.

Jeez Cap stomps.

His stats are ways above Angel's.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
The original Edward Cullen.

Pretty much yeah. The dude was spying on Buffy even when she was a freshmen in high school. That shit is creepy as f*ck.

Also yeah Cap's high end strength feats are far above Angels so..he just can beat him down.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Jeez Cap stomps.

His stats are ways above Angel's.

Are you sure?

As mentioned by KR, Angel has extremely good damage soak:
he has gotten up and continued his night after being impaled through the neck and tossed off a skyscraper.
Gotten up and functioned more or less ok after a shotgun blast to the back from a couple of meters away.
He's been stabbed, shot and impaled while fighting and continued on to win those fights.
He deliberately set off a grenade right in front of himself to aid his escape from a gang of demons.:

Agility:
Has performed standing vertical leaps up to and beyond 20 meters (in one instance through a skylight to attack a helicopter)

Reflexes:
On multiple occasions caught or deflected arrows from crossbows, sometimes after they were fired from behind him where he couldn't see immediately
Caught a cup of coffee after it fell without dropping a drop.

Strength:
Punched through walls a bunch of times.
Thrown people over significant distance.
Actually having trouble recalling any decent strength feats beyond throwing/punching people around the place.

Experience:
250ish years of fighting and killing, many of whom have been super-powered demons and monsters.

We all know Cap's stats are pretty sweet, but I wouldn't put either of these guys "way above" the other in any category other than damage soak.

^^^^^^ this



Angel has soaked far worse than Cap will put out and has come out on top

Angel's best strength feat on-screen was probably hurling a two-hundred pound vampire straight through a brick wall. As for speed, his best would probably be out-racing a lightning bolt while still severely weakened from his time in hell.

This is only if we limit him to TV, however. If we use the recent comics (which are confirmed by Whedon himself to be 100% canon) then this starts to become a stomp in Angel's favour.

Originally posted by Martian_mind
Angel's best strength feat on-screen was probably hurling a two-hundred pound vampire straight through a brick wall. As for speed, his best would probably be out-racing a lightning bolt while still severely weakened from his time in hell.

This is only if we limit him to TV, however. If we use the recent comics (which are confirmed by Whedon himself to be 100% canon) then this starts to become a stomp in Angel's favour.

When Cap first woke up he tossed 2 SHIELD agents through a wall to escape out into New York.

If we start using Angel comics, then we could bring Cap comics into the mix, and Cap will come out on top.

Originally posted by KingD19
When Cap first woke up he tossed 2 SHIELD agents through a wall to escape out into New York.

If we start using Angel comics, then we could bring Cap comics into the mix, and Cap will come out on top.

Well, the "Angel: After the fall" comics were canon as a follow up to the TV show.... but no comic feats admissable here.

Even with Angel's experience, I'd still give Cap the edge in skill and probably tactical thinking.

Angel does have a nice damage soak. He's been thrown off buildings and then gotten up(though not exactly quickly). But when he has come up against beings with strength on Caps level he usually gets beat down. He can still be beaten bad enough to where he can't get up for a while.

Though about he speed, he does have some pretty good speed feats compared to Cap. I'm not talking about catching arrows, but about things like..when he appeared in Kate's car and she didn't even hear him come in or hear any doors open. He also leaves in the same manner, almost as if he is teleporting. But stuff like that is hard to quantify, so I'd say Cap should be able to hit him.

People here do know Angel's a vampire that drinks blood right? He would do to Steve what he did to Hamilton in the series finale, grab him and drain him. Game, set, match.

Give Cap his non pis/cis comic feats, then he has a chance. But add Angel's Comic feats, he murders Steve.

Cap wins normally. And if you give them both comic feats, Cap wins even harder.

Originally posted by KingD19
Cap wins normally. And if you give them both comic feats, Cap wins even harder.

Talk to me when movie Steve can walk around and have a normal conversation with a giant broadsword stuck to his stomach like its nothing.

Or being tossed down a giant skyscraper face first, get back up and instead of being hurt, it just pissed him off.

Face it, movie Steve has nothing on TV Angel. Not only that, Angel would do to him what he did to Hamilton in the series finale, drains him and gets more powerful.

Comic Steve is the same. The only way comic Steve can beat Angel is through PIS/CIS.

Comic Angel is a bigger beast than his TV self. Comic Angel even has a sword that allows hims to fight and hit intangible beings.

Pure human comic Angel survived having his spine broken, his ribs shattered, hi leg broken, his wrist broken. Guess what, in all that pain, he was still conscious.

Angel out performed both movie and comic Steve without even trying. Steve's only a threat to Angel because of PIS/CIS. Remove that from the equation, Angel eats him. Literally.

Why would you assume he can get more powerful by biting just anyone with powers? Hamilton specifically said the power of the Senior Partners flows through his veins. Why does that mean he'd get a boost from any kind of superhuman?

Originally posted by KingD19
When Cap first woke up he tossed 2 SHIELD agents through a wall to escape out into New York.

If we start using Angel comics, then we could bring Cap comics into the mix, and Cap will come out on top. Angels comics are canon to the show, unlike Caps.

Anyway, Angel wins with or without the comics

Originally posted by Surtur
Why would you assume he can get more powerful by biting just anyone with powers? Hamilton specifically said the power of the Senior Partners flows through his veins. Why does that mean he'd get a boost from any kind of superhuman?

That's just how the Whedons verse Vamps works.

Originally posted by Surtur
Why would you assume he can get more powerful by biting just anyone with powers? Hamilton specifically said the power of the Senior Partners flows through his veins. Why does that mean he'd get a boost from any kind of superhuman?

Well, superhuman blood has shown to have had an enhancing effect on vampires on multiple occasions. For example, the Master drinking some of Buffy's blood gave him a temporary strength amp the one time. Angel also described Drogyn's blood (the Keeper of the Deeper Well) as "supercharged warrior juice". So the Hamilton showing isn't just a once off.

But there's no guarantee a scientifically enhanced person would charge them like a magically enhanced one would.

I'm not saying it would work. Just pointing out that the situation with Hamilton wasn't just a once off deal, because of his connection to the Senior Partners.

Angel doesn't need comic feats, he has at times moved/attacked so fast he appeared to teleport in the show. His damage-soak is rediculously high, though Cap could win via decapitation, but Cap would have to be fast enough to tag Angel.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Well, superhuman blood has shown to have had an enhancing effect on vampires on multiple occasions. For example, the Master drinking some of Buffy's blood gave him a temporary strength amp the one time. Angel also described Drogyn's blood (the Keeper of the Deeper Well) as "supercharged warrior juice". So the Hamilton showing isn't just a once off.

It's not a once off, but it also seems to be just demons. Slayers strength=demonic. Drogyn I don't think it ever said what the hell he was, but Hamiltons powers also stemmed from demons as well. Plus since Drogyn knew him from back in the day chances are he's either just mystically empowered or has some demonic power somehow within him(a demonic champion guarding cosmic demons).

But even if we said it would work on just any superhuman, is this really a common tactic for Angel? How many demons has the dude fought? Yet he doesn't chow down on them on a regular basis. Even at times when it could of potentially helped.

In terms of feats Angel whoops that ass. It just doesn't seem like it because shitty 2003 tv cgi <<< Big Budget Cap movies cgi. Not to mention should Angel drink Steve's blood he'll inherit all the super soldier enhancements

Well I am going to borrow an argument that is usually hurled at me in the comic vs forum which is..has Angel ever used super speed in a fight?

I mean, I certainly remember him doing his teleporting act, but never in combat. Either he can teleport or he has the ability to open and close car doors without making a sound. I remember Penn did kind of use super speed when he was being attacked by cops. That is the only time I can recall vamps really..busting out their speed in the times where it would actually be most useful. God..Penn is friggin Hawkeye I just realized.