Originally posted by The Ellimist
Concession accepted.
You can't dismiss a plethora of in and out of universe declarations just because you don't like them. Sorry, not sorry.
I don't dismiss them, but potential is as irrelevant as it comes if he didn't achieve it. Kyp didn't.
Originally posted by The Ellimist
OK, so the only actual argument that you make here is that it was done in a "meditative state". That does matter, yes, but it's hardly as if we never consider feats performed under such conditions, or as if just meditating magically lets any Force user do anything. It's still a matter of fact that basically nobody else in the mythos has pulled off a comparable TK feat, meditation enabled or no. The monstrous showing of collapsing black holes capable of generating gravitational fields comparable to what we'd see from planetary bodies is not taken away because he had to concentrate a little bit.
But even beyond the feat itself is the comparison with Luke struggling to do the same thing.
It matters, because Kyp clearly can't actualize that power in a combative scenario. It might be news to you, but force users can't always bring their full power to bear in a duel. Kyp never demonstrated he could.
That's why he's < Jaina.
Kyp could win a "who can lift the bigger rock" contest, but that's not what we are discussing.
Originally posted by The Ellimist
You're welcome to show me which Young Earth Creationist textbook told you that there's no pressure (.i.e. force per area) in space. As with the rest of your response, you ignored the actual argument to just repeat yourself emphatically. The absence of a gravitational field doesn't negate the feat because in order to have used the freighter as a useful projectile, he would've had to accelerated it by far more than one g anyway, seeing as how starships maneuver at far more agile rates. Ergo, his feat is still more impressive than Cade's, even when you take into account gravity, and yes, even when you ignore the size difference between a shuttle and a freighter.
I mean, I don't think it's occurred to you that the acceleration of an object is still proportional to the force applied to it in "space", and there's no constant being added when air molecules aren't around. Your stance here is just unintelligible. What were you trying to get at?
First of all I was talking about air pressure, you could've guessed from the context, but it seems you rather just attack my intelligence. Good for you.
Anyhow everything you just said is a big pile of crap
And yes gravity matters, it's a force which against you have to act when you TK something. Air resistance matters, it slows things down in case you didn't know that.
It's even noted in the text how it was easier:
Now he reached out with the Force and took hold of the dead freighter.
It shot forward with astonishing ease, moving steadily through the vacuum of space toward the shielded coral-skipper.
And as for your fanon on how much Kyp accelerated it to hit coralskipper I'd like you to prove it, since he actually needed help from a squad of x-wings to herd the ship so he can hit it:
The lieutenant spun off in a tight turn, his two surviving pilots following closely. They darted around the big coralskipper, cutting off its retreat, taking and returning fire from the other enemy skips. Their daring maneuvers soon exacted a price-lan's ship got caught in a Yuuzhan Vong crossfire. The double blast of plasma proved too much for his shields, and the ship dissolved in a bright splatter of plasma and superheated metal.
The pilots Lan had commanded doggedly held the course he'd plotted. The XJs continued to harry the big skip, forcing it to keep up its stuttering shields as the dead freighter closed in. At the last moment, the surviving X-wings shot away toward safety.
The freighter never got close.
Originally posted by The Ellimist
So Jaina ~ Luke now? But what does this prove exactly - if Jaina really is Luke tier, how the hell would Kyp not being on her level be a mark against him?
Luke wasn't part of the Order, nice try tho.
Originally posted by The Ellimist
Well when you learn middle school physics you might think differently.
So we've clearly gone over the:
1. Plethora of accolades from both trusted in-universe characters and out-of-universe narrators placing Kyp near the top in potential, and the knowledge that he a) learns incredibly fast and b) is middle aged by FotJ.
2. Ability to pull off spectacular feats in telekinesis such as manipulating artificial black holes with greater ease than Luke himself did, and ragdolling freighters for use as projectile weapons.
3. A lack of comparable feats on Cades's end.
I think this is a done deal.
1. Irrelevant.
2. All of them with concentration and in space.
3. Actually every feat other than the Black Hole one Cade exceeds. By quite a bit.
and his other monstrous telekinetic demonstrations.