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Who can win out of these two? No bfring.

Nate stomps planck time

But then again Man Black stomps cuz superman.

X Man, imo.

Why riv?

shaman nate carver?

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Why riv?
More and better feats i would think.
Black has done some cool stuff, but Nate's been around longer, had a regular series...its adds up.

I could certainly be wrong.

Originally posted by ghostman
shaman nate carver?

He did say xman nate in op. Shaman has less feats

Tiny feats...wakka wakka

Still X-Man.

shaman for sure. x-man version is tougher. i don't see either winning a tp battle--that'd be a stalemate more often than not imo. if someone DID overwhelm the other, i'd say black would take nate out. it would come to tk more often than not i think. tk--black's tk let him go up against superman, nate fought hulk, albeit briefly and it didn't end all that great for nate. i think black has better blunt force tk, but nate takes the fine motor tk skills. breaking things down molecularly (not something i recall black doing) and stopping time (in essence)>giving superman a stroke.

hrm. stalemate or slimmest possible majority to nate i think.

Nate Grey easily.

Black easily.

Good fight.

No clue tbh.

Originally posted by leonidas
shaman for sure. x-man version is tougher. i don't see either winning a tp battle--that'd be a stalemate more often than not imo. if someone DID overwhelm the other, i'd say black would take nate out. it would come to tk more often than not i think. tk--black's tk let him go up against superman, nate fought hulk, albeit briefly and it didn't end all that great for nate. i think black has better blunt force tk, but nate takes the fine motor tk skills. breaking things down molecularly (not something i recall black doing) and stopping time (in essence)>giving superman a stroke.

hrm. stalemate or slimmest possible majority to nate i think.
Black can stop a black hole forming and casually stop Superman's HV. Nate doesn't has that level of control.

Shaman.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Black can stop a black hole forming and casually stop Superman's HV. Nate doesn't has that level of control. If Christ had a stick, he'd beat the sh*t out of you with it Abhi.

Nate has all the control he needs.

Originally posted by emu
If Christ had a stick, he'd beat the sh*t out of you with it Abhi.

Nate has all the control he needs.
facepalm

Originally posted by abhilegend
facepalm
He's a surgeon with his powers, so lol at not having the control to stop Supes HIV blast.

Certainly has the power

Nate's TK has operated at the subatomic level...

Originally posted by abhilegend
Black can stop a black hole forming and casually stop Superman's HV. Nate doesn't has that level of control.

Originally posted by emu
He's a surgeon with his powers, so lol at not having the control to stop Supes HIV blast.

Certainly has the power
He certainly hasn't shown that ability anywhere.

You're welcome to show otherwise. Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Nate's TK has operated at the subatomic level...
And Black can stop quantum rifts collapsing and becoming a black hole AND simultaneously overpowering Superman's HV Nonchalantly.

Grey doesn't has that kind of control or power.

rachel has opened a black hole. been shown that nate>rachel. and that's NOT shaman.

I thought Nate has reality warping feats

Originally posted by leonidas
rachel has opened a black hole. been shown that nate>rachel. and that's NOT shaman.
Did Rachel also stopped Superman's HV at the same time while keeping a quantum rift stable? Not to mention it was with the help of several X-men.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111138516/4327358-x-men.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
Did Rachel also stopped Superman's HV at the same time while keeping a quantum rift stable? Not to mention it was with the help of several X-men.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11113/111138516/4327358-x-men.jpg ???

lol it wasn't with anyone's help:

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/125392/4182748-x-men447_15a.jpg

preceding scan.

she created it herself. the fury was resisting it though, fighting it, so she needed help to keep it up. in effect she created and held open a singularity WHILE battling the frickin fury on her own, albeit briefly. so, yeah, i'd say that def balances out black's feat. but a scan of black's feat would be cool to see anyway.

Manchester seems to be roughly the equal of Supeeman.

Given that Nate is superior to Superman this doesn't bode well for Manchester.

Originally posted by leonidas
but a scan of black's feat would be cool to see anyway.
https://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/34983078_Superman_024-004.jpg
___________________________________

https://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/34983081_Superman_024-008.jpg https://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/34983084_Superman_024-009.jpg https://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/34983267_Superman_024-010.jpg https://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/34983274_Superman_024-011.jpg https://s6d1.turboimg.net/t1/34983278_Superman_024-012.jpg

Originally posted by leonidas
lol it wasn't with anyone's help:

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/12/125392/4182748-x-men447_15a.jpg

preceding scan.

she created it herself. the fury was resisting it though, fighting it, so she needed help to keep it up. in effect she created and held open a singularity WHILE battling the frickin fury on her own, albeit briefly. so, yeah, i'd say that def balances out black's feat. but a scan of black's feat would be cool to see anyway.
Yes, she created a micro black hole and needed help from other X-men to keep control of it.

Black is keeping the quantum rift stable for months casually.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Damn, Manchester Black is ****ing awesome.

https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-ZlOZ-aOe8hY/WTe98WLHK9I/AAAAAAAD_z8/IctVuyAfE7IsTpF3sxdwAh4v1pX_M89LwCLcB/s1600/006_009.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v86imn9XSKo/WTe98SQLNgI/AAAAAAAD_0A/MwvdPr1PJH4CY_FQrbhL0vbEO062y3LzgCLcB/s1600/006_010.jpg

He can take away powers as well.

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-SJjkUszTQwI/WTe98wKzh5I/AAAAAAAD_0I/FTZVd1ddtLg27ZAs6TACDNbgWnsmgmz3wCLcB/s1600/006_012.jpg

Once again, kryptoninan powers are shown to be controlled by mind.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Manchester seems to be roughly the equal of Supeeman.

Given that Nate is superior to Superman this doesn't bode well for Manchester.
Pfft, Grey ran away from that pussy Ares and Norman Osborne was too much for him to handle.

Black would make mincemeat out of his brain.

those more recent scans of black are sweet. still, not entirely sure how difficult keeping a rift open is so it doesn't really matter. creating a singularity or stopping something from collapsing into one? not sure which is better, but i'll still call them comparable at the least.

black is stronger than rachel, but so is nate so back to this being nothing but very close. black MAY be able to turn off nate's powers, but nate may be able to do the same:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_super/11115/111152067/3924015-xmanannual1996page15imagc4.jpg

along with stopping time, guess this could be viewed as a quickdraw. nate also has the option of simply draining black's psi energy dry if he chose.

and he didn't run away from osborne. lol ares did have a nice showing against him, but nate wasn't even trying to hurt anyone, really. he stopped his axe with ease then tried...countering him, whatever that was intended to mean. there are endless ways he could have handled ares were he actually po'd. he did handle sentry pretty effortlessly. /shrug

there really isn't anyway to see this that isn't really close.

I'm not sure what AOA Magneto got to do with Black?

doesn't matter who the opponent is, the point is nate (and that is 616 nate) shut off his power.

Nate wins imo

Chester has too few feats.

We want to use his N52? Fine. But that negates using his pre 52.

IOW, this is precisely the kinds of threads that Golgo makes.

And Carver attacks him for.

Nate has all the power to compete. He blocked Qabiris blast, went toe to toe with Modt. And his fine level control goes past down subatomics pucking with reality and space/time.

Originally posted by leonidas


black is stronger than rachel, but so is nate so back to this being nothing but very close. black MAY be able to turn off nate's powers, but nate may be able to do the same:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_super/11115/111152067/3924015-xmanannual1996page15imagc4.jpg

along with stopping time, guess this could be viewed as a quickdraw. nate also has the option of simply draining black's psi energy dry if he chose.


I dont understand what energy draining has to do with Black doe....

OH WAIT!

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Chester has too few feats.

We want to use his N52? Fine. But that negates using his pre 52.

IOW, this is precisely the kinds of threads that Golgo makes.

And Carver attacks him for.

I thought REBIRTH made them both valid? ****ing ****ity **** is this a headache.

That's true for Superman.

But what Rebirth has done is chopped and changed, cherry picking certain events etc.

Did it really happen the same way as pre 52? Don't know.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
That's true for Superman.

But what Rebirth has done is chopped and changed, cherry picking certain events etc.

Did it really happen the same way as pre 52? Don't know.

But that would apply to Superman too--

Originally posted by Delta1938
****ing ****ity **** is this a headache.