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In each fight Cage gets 2 min of prep before the bell. Cap is fighting to ko or kill (whichever is easiest) and doesn't know Cage's abilities.


Fight 1.
Nicholas Cage gets brass knuckles while Cap is in street clothes without shield. Fight starts 15ft apart. Who wins?

Fight 2.
Cage gets a 9mm fully loaded handgun. He knows how and is willing to use it (even to kill). Cap gets standard equipment. Fight starts 50m away from each other.

Who wins?

Cap wins.

cap round 1
cage round 2

Originally posted by Silent Master
Cap wins. Why do you think Cap wins in scenario 1?
Why do you think he wins in scenario 2?

Because I've seen the movies.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Because I've seen the movies.

I've seen the movies too.
Deduce from the movies why Cap should be able to beat Cage in both scenarios.

Mr X vs Quicksilver.

Originally posted by h1a8
Why do you think Cap wins in scenario 1?
Why do you think he wins in scenario 2?

Cap has way too much of a physical advantage and technique for cage to keep up even with his power.

Cage in both.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Mr X vs Quicksilver. Cage has dodged bullets. Thus the bullets aren't quicksilver.

He didn't dodge bullets. He sent out copies to take the bullets so he'd know how to move. But that was all while trying to save Liz, so he doesn't have that level of power normally according to the film.

Originally posted by h1a8
Cage has dodged bullets. Thus the bullets aren't quicksilver.

Post a clip of that feat so everyone can see how badly you're lying

Originally posted by Silent Master
Post a clip of that feat so everyone can see how badly you're lying

https://youtu.be/RC5ZiK6o7uQ


Originally posted by KingD19
He didn't dodge bullets. He sent out copies to take the bullets so he'd know how to move. But that was all while trying to save Liz, so he doesn't have that level of power normally according to the film. There were no copies. Those were future visions. He corrected the movement each time he saw he got shot. He can do the same for a punch (which is slower).

You do realize that you just posted a clip that proves his powers didn't make him any faster, right?

Originally posted by Silent Master
You do realize that you just posted a clip that proves his powers didn't make him any faster, right? Irrelevant. He can use his powers to not get by a bullet. thus he can use them to not get hit by anything slower. Cap will only tag Cage's future visions of himself.

Originally posted by h1a8
Irrelevant. He can use his powers to not get by a bullet. thus he can use them to not get hit by anything slower. Cap will only tag Cage's future visions of himself.

Moving out of the way before a bullet is fired isn't a speed feat.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Moving out of the way before a bullet is fired isn't a speed feat. of course it isn't. I never claimed it was.

Originally posted by h1a8
of course it isn't. I never claimed it was.

Then we are back to Mr X vs Quicksilver.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Then we are back to Mr X vs Quicksilver. No we are not. Cage can see the future, X can read minds. X has only one chance to dodge while Cage has hundreds if not thousands of chances to dodge. Also Quicksilver is far faster than X than Cap is faster than Cage. Quicksilver is many times faster than a bullet (even faster than lightning) where Cap is many times slower than a bullet.

Yes we are, Cage doesn't have superspeed, he can only dodge at normal human speed, which is slower than Captain America.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Yes we are, Cage doesn't have superspeed, he can only dodge at normal human speed, which is slower than Captain America.

Which is slower than a bullet too. But he still managed to dodge without superspeed.

Originally posted by h1a8
Which is slower than a bullet too. But he still managed to dodge without superspeed.

He dodged the shooter, not the bullet.

Originally posted by Silent Master
He dodged the shooter, not the bullet. Correction! He dodged the aim of the shooter right before the shooter pulled the trigger. Cage can dodge the aim of Cap before Cap pulls the trigger.

He knew when and where the shooter would fire his weapon. So he dodged right before that happened. He just wasn't where the guy was going to shoot at because he knew where he'd aim. He didn't dodge a bullet.

Cris Johnson's ability to foresee the future and react accordingly should net him a win in both rounds, especially when he's armed with a gun.

He could potentially lose the first, as he's probably not strong enough to take down Cap with punches even if he has brass knuckls.

Cap can just outlast Cage in round 1. No amount of precog can give you superhuman stamina (which Cap has in spades), so he can predict and dodge until he gets tired, at which point he is screwed. And regular human + knuckleduster is not going to seriously hurt Cap when it has taken things like repeated blows from WS' metal arm to do genuine damage.

As Rogers said in CA:TFA and CA:CW, "I can do this all day."

Even with precog, I don't think he can move fast enough to evade more than a few hits from Cap before his speed becomes too much for him.

qXPOl6EjbWg

They were fighting as fast as the actors could move their bodies, no SFX was used to make it seem like they were fighting at enhanced or superspeeds.

Rogers' durability and stamina would net him the win in R1; not his speed, imo.

Originally posted by h1a8
Correction! He dodged the aim of the shooter right before the shooter pulled the trigger. Cage can dodge the aim of Cap before Cap pulls the trigger.

Cap won't be shooting at him.

Cap takes both, 'nuff said, end this shit faced thread

Originally posted by Silent Master
Cap won't be shooting at him.

Trigger = synapses in brain. The moment Cap triggers the synapse in his brain to punch at Chris face.

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
Cap takes both, 'nuff said, end this shit faced thread

How? Cris would easily murder Cap in 2. Fight 1 is a debate.

Cage always wins. Always.

Originally posted by h1a8
How? Cris would easily murder Cap in 2. Fight 1 is a debate.

LOL!!!

Originally posted by Silent Master
Yes we are, Cage doesn't have superspeed, he can only dodge at normal human speed, which is slower than Captain America.

To dodge an attack you only need to move a fraction of the attack's speed. Punches are faster than dodges and parries and dodges/parries can happen after the attack is launched.

Caps fist must accelerate from 0 to full speed. That means the moment he first moves his hand to punch Chris will have time to dodge the aim. Cage can begin to dodge a microsecond before Cap hands even move.

Stepping to the side really only helps avoid attacks that move in a straight line, are you under the impression that Cap is only going to be using jabs and front kicks?

Besides, Cap is faster and a better fighter than Cris, that means he'll be able to dodge or block every attack Cris tries.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Stepping to the side really only helps avoid attacks that move in a straight line, are you under the impression that Cap is only going to be using jabs and front kicks?

Besides, Cap is faster and a better fighter than Cris, that means he'll be able to dodge or block every attack Cris tries. Chris will only throw a punch if he sees Cap getting hit. It will mostly be a counterattack. Chris has experience fighting as shown in the diner scene. Any attack can be parried, blocked, or dodged. Chris can duck, block, parry any attack from Cap.

Chris can also hit Caps wrist or ankles with the brass with the block. Basically, the block becomes the strike.

Plus Cap will probably be holding back somewhat because he thinks he's fighting a normal human.

Cage after many trial and error in scenario 2 only. In the first instance...he doesn't have the power to put cap down. Cap has eaten multiple blows from ultron, iron man and bucky's arm. None of them have knocked Steve out. Cage with brass knucks can hit him till his arms get tired. Then no future sight will save him once he is exhausted.

Why are we debating this?

Nick can see 2 min into the future, that means anything Cap does will be nullified by Nick's future sight.

The only reason Cap wins round one is because Nick's character doesn't have neither the strength or stamina to outlast Cap.

He might be able to see what's coming, but he doesn't have the strength, skill or speed to actually stop it for long.

We see him use his powers against a regular guy, and while he dodges everything. The guy is slow, sloppy, and has no skill or technique. If he tried that against Cap, he'd dodge a few hits, but no way he could keep it up against Steve.

Originally posted by KingD19
We see him use his powers against a regular guy, and while he dodges everything. The guy is slow, sloppy, and has no skill or technique. If he tried that against Cap, he'd dodge a few hits, but no way he could keep it up against Steve. He needs to counter attack. Cage can't keep dodging and parrying. If the brass knuckles have little effect then Cap wins. I believe the brass will have a decent effect (draw blood too).

Cap is more skilled and faster, he's not getting hit.

Are people really this dense?

Nick's character has the ability to see 2 full minutes into his own future. Did anyone here even watched that filmed?

It doesn't matter if Cap is stronger, faster, more durable, Nick's character will see anything that Steve does because oh his ability to see the future.

In the movie, we've seen Nick's future self getting killed left and right, and everytime one die, he sees were to step.

The only reason Steve wins the first round is because of his stamina. At the end of the day, Nick's character is still human.

But in the second round, Nick's put a bullet to Steve's brain.

Seeing into the future doesn't really help when you're slower and less skilled and Cap has plenty of feats of blocking bullets.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Seeing into the future doesn't really help when you're slower and less skilled and Cap has plenty of feats of blocking bullets. Cap aim blocks bullets. Most of the time he's shown just to put his shield up and hope they don't aim for his legs. In fight 1, he doesn't have a shield. So what you said is irrelevant.

You don't have to be of equal speed to block an attack. It only takes a fraction of the speed of the attack in order to dodge, duck, bob and weave, parry, or block it.

Cage can counter miss attacks with punches. It all depends on how much Cage can effect Cap.

Cap is faster and more skilled than Cris, any counters or attacks that Cris tries are either going to be blocked or dodged.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Cap is faster and more skilled than Cris, any counters or attacks that Cris tries are either going to be blocked or dodged. Counters can't be blocked or dodged. It would go against the definition.

Originally posted by h1a8
Counters can't be blocked or dodged. It would go against the definition.

LOL!!!!

Are you saying you've never seen someone counter a counter attack before?

Come on dude.

Originally posted by h1a8
He needs to counter attack. Cage can't keep dodging and parrying. If the brass knuckles have little effect then Cap wins. I believe the brass will have a decent effect (draw blood too).

Lol ultron wasn't drawing blood from cap on top of that truck, cage certainly isnt.

It took Bucky several full force shots to the nose to just barely split it.

1. Cap 10/10

2. Cap more often than not I would think but Cage can win here too imo

Originally posted by wallman77
Lol ultron wasn't drawing blood from cap on top of that truck, cage certainly isnt. That's because Ultron didn't hit Cap in the face with blunt force. That Ultron was weak as shit. His blasts didn't do much to Cap's Chest Armor.

I think the brass knuckles will damage and stun Cap significantly. Unless someone can show Cap getting hit in the head with a blunt force object of equal or greater magnitude where it does little to nothing.

You mean like getting hit by Bucky's metal arm or Loki? maybe if you'd watched the movies you'd be aware of these feats.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You mean like getting hit by Bucky's metal arm or Loki? maybe if you'd watched the movies you'd be aware of these feats.

Learn to read. ..."does little to nothing".
Loki never struck Cap in the face

It's sad that you think that you've made a point, but even Bucky >>> normal human with brass knuckles and Cap took multiple hits to the face without being ko'd.

Cris has zero chance of ko'ing Cap.

Originally posted by Silent Master
It's sad that you think that you've made a point, but even Bucky >>> normal human with brass knuckles and Cap took multiple hits to the face without being ko'd.

Cris has zero chance of ko'ing Cap.

I disagree. Bucking normal punches = human level punches. Show me some punch feats to prove me wrong.

Originally posted by h1a8
I disagree. Bucking normal punches = human level punches. Show me some punch feats to prove me wrong.


Interesting how you make a claim that Bucky was massively holding back in the scene and then demand I prove your claim wrong. It's like you've never been in a debate before.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Interesting how you make a claim that Bucky was massively holding back in the scene and then demand I prove your claim wrong. It's like you've never been in a debate before. I didn't claim Bucky was holding back.

Originally posted by h1a8
I didn't claim Bucky was holding back.


Yes you did, I mentioned the scene where Cap withstands several hits of Bucky's metal arm and you respond by saying "I disagree. Bucking normal punches = human level punches." in order to low-ball the feat.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Yes you did, I mentioned the scene where Cap withstands several hits of Bucky's metal arm and you respond by saying "I disagree. Bucking normal punches = human level punches." in order to low-ball the feat.

That doesn't mean Bucky was holding back. It means that Bucky can't punch harder than a human can with his real arm. That's what I'm claiming. Prove me wrong.

How far in the future can this dude see? He could conceivably evade Cap for that amount of time, but it doesn't really matter since some regular guy isn't going to be able to hurt Steve.

Originally posted by Khazra Reborn
How far in the future can this dude see? He could conceivably evade Cap for that amount of time, but it doesn't really matter since some regular guy isn't going to be able to hurt Steve. he can see 2 minutes which always add. Meaning, as each second passes he can see another second into the future. It doesn't run out. He can continue to avoid Caps attacks. He can only lose if he fails to put Cap down before he tires.

At best, he'll avoid a few attacks. But he just doesn't have the speed or stamina needed to keep dodging.

Originally posted by h1a8
he can see 2 minutes which always add. Meaning, as each second passes he can see another second into the future. It doesn't run out. He can continue to avoid Caps attacks. He can only lose if he fails to put Cap down before he tires.

It doesn't work like that. It was shown in the beginning when he used his powers to pick Liz up that he basically sees 2 minutes into his future from the time he uses his powers. He can see variables within that 2 minutes(like he beat the guy up and then restarted when Liz didn't like his macho attitude, so he let himself get punched instead). But there's no evidence that he can see beyond 120 seconds.

And there is proof Bucky can hit harder than a normal person with his normal arm. The fact that with that normal arm, he was visibly affecting Cap, and has casually booted men 30 feet as well as outran cars and not getting his arm snatched off by a speeding motorcycle shows he's enhanced similar to Cap.

Originally posted by KingD19
And there is proof Bucky can hit harder than a normal person with his normal arm. The fact that with that normal arm, he was visibly affecting Cap, and has casually booted men 30 feet as well as outran cars and not getting his arm snatched off by a speeding motorcycle shows he's enhanced similar to Cap.

Hits from his normal arm also had a more notable effect on suited up Black Panther than the fire from the helicopter did. Also, the blow that sent unarmoured Stark sailing across the table and out of the fight, when Bucky was mind-controlled, came from his human arm. And people should know he is enhanced by now in anyways. The Winter Soldier program is a key plot point in Civil War.

Again ppl taking h1's bait. Who cares how strong his normal arm is. Cap withstood blows from his metal arm like a champ. Cage won't hurt him. He has also taken blows from ultron and IM.

Originally posted by KingD19
It doesn't work like that. It was shown in the beginning when he used his powers to pick Liz up that he basically sees 2 minutes into his future from the time he uses his powers. He can see variables within that 2 minutes(like he beat the guy up and then restarted when Liz didn't like his macho attitude, so he let himself get punched instead). But there's no evidence that he can see beyond 120 seconds.

And there is proof Bucky can hit harder than a normal person with his normal arm. The fact that with that normal arm, he was visibly affecting Cap, and has casually booted men 30 feet as well as outran cars and not getting his arm snatched off by a speeding motorcycle shows he's enhanced similar to Cap.

I never claimed he can see beyond 2 min at a time. At 8pm he can see up into 8:02pm . At 8:01pm he can see until 8:03pm. As each minute passes he can see another minute (but always 2 minutes from the time he's looking from).

Kicking someone 30ft has no bearing on punching strength if catching a bullet has no bearing on fighting and reflex speed.
Outruning slow cars isn't a wonderful feat. Its an ok feat.

Barely affecting Cap. IMO, any strong human can barely affect Cap.

Originally posted by wallman77
Again ppl taking h1's bait. Who cares how strong his normal arm is. Cap withstood blows from his metal arm like a champ. Cage won't hurt him. He has also taken blows from ultron and IM. You never really seen the movies. Ultron never hit him in the face. I don't remember Bucky hitting Cap in the face with the metal arm.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Hits from his normal arm also had a more notable effect on suited up Black Panther than the fire from the helicopter did. Also, the blow that sent unarmoured Stark sailing across the table and out of the fight, when Bucky was mind-controlled, came from his human arm. And people should know he is enhanced by now in anyways. The Winter Soldier program is a key plot point in Civil War. Bullets and punches have different momenta. Bullets can never send a human back like a punch can. That's not a good comparison.

Originally posted by h1a8
You never really seen the movies. Ultron never hit him in the face. I don't remember Bucky hitting Cap in the face with the metal arm.

You can't say "you never saw the movies" and then not realize in Winter Soldier during the final fight, Bucky got Cap in a full mount and Steve gave up because he didn't want to fight his friend anymore. Bucky went to work on his face with his robo arm and all he got was a slightly split nose.

Originally posted by h1a8
Bullets and punches have different momenta. Bullets can never send a human back like a punch can.

Regular humans don't have those bullets ricocheting off them. Those bullets punch right through them. So obviously they won't knock anyone back, as they go through instead. Panther's suit can withstand the piercing power, so it then becomes a situation of dealing with the amount of energy in the bullet or blow. Hell, someone can be made to budge/react with a hard enough finger poke. Same principle. So it is comparable.

Also, you are absolutely hilarious, telling other people they have not seen the films, yet conveniently forgetting that Bucky hit Steve repeatedly with his metal arm, during the climax of TWS.

Anyway, I am really done with you. Your statement about the punches from Bucky against Cap, in TWS, highlights your ignorance.

The problem is not what he can see.. Think about it. He sees the first future attack, or string of them. Once he dodges it Cap will now come at him differently than before, meaning that what he'd seen is completely useless. He wasn't fighting super humans, he was avoiding the attacks of normal humans. Against someone who will pretty much instantly adapt and come with a new barrage, he will literally be rewinding after every single punch thrown.

Assuming that he plans things so that he can avoid the first strike and then get the gun up, he'd still have to be quick enough with it to get it to a vulnerable point on Steve's head and get a round into his brain.

The only way I see Cap losing is if he not only uses his ability but also employs others with actual powers to aid in taking down Cap.

Originally posted by KingD19
You can't say "you never saw the movies" and then not realize in Winter Soldier during the final fight, Bucky got Cap in a full mount and Steve gave up because he didn't want to fight his friend anymore. Bucky went to work on his face with his robo arm and all he got was a slightly split nose. His face was busted. (eye and forehead). Now I remember. But again, different scenes have characters operating at different levels. Plus his arm wasn't 100% from the damage it endured. I do give Cap some credit for the showing though. So again, it would take many hits by Cage to put him down.

Also know that Cap's skin is significantly less durable than the metal knuckles. Brass knuckles WILL put some major bruising on his face.

Originally posted by Ascendancy
The problem is not what he can see.. Think about it. He sees the first future attack, or string of them. Once he dodges it Cap will now come at him differently than before, meaning that what he'd seen is completely useless. He wasn't fighting super humans, he was avoiding the attacks of normal humans. Against someone who will pretty much instantly adapt and come with a new barrage, he will literally be rewinding after every single punch thrown.

Assuming that he plans things so that he can avoid the first strike and then get the gun up, he'd still have to be quick enough with it to get it to a vulnerable point on Steve's head and get a round into his brain.

The only way I see Cap losing is if he not only uses his ability but also employs others with actual powers to aid in taking down Cap. He will counter the moment Steve misses the first attack. He's not going to sit there and just dodge. A missed attack will result in a head blow to Steve.

He was able to dodge a barrage of bullets. He doesn't have to prepare for the entire sequence, he prepares for each move.

WS >>>>>>>>>> Cris, there is zero chance he'll land enough attacks to ko Cap.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Regular humans don't have those bullets ricocheting off them. Those bullets punch right through them. So obviously they won't knock anyone back, as they go through instead. Panther's suit can withstand the piercing power, so it then becomes a situation of dealing with the amount of energy in the bullet or blow. Hell, someone can be made to budge/react with a hard enough finger poke. Same principle. So it is comparable.

Also, you are absolutely hilarious, telling other people they have not seen the films, yet conveniently forgetting that Bucky hit Steve repeatedly with his metal arm, during the climax of TWS.

Anyway, I am really done with you. Your statement about the punches from Bucky against Cap, in TWS, highlights your ignorance.

It's not comparable. You can stand there with a 1 inch steel plate wrapped in plastic and Kevlar on your chest. A 50BMG bullet will push you back a little. But if I front kick you in that same plate then I assure you that you will go flying backwards.


I admit that was stupid of me to forget that about Cap getting hit by the arm.. But I addressed it in the above post .

Originally posted by Silent Master
WS >>>>>>>>>> Cris, there is zero chance he'll land enough attacks to ko Cap. Depends on how many attacks it will take. If Less than 50 then Cage can win. If it takes more than 100 then Cage loses.
Between 51 and 99 I don't know (depends on Cages upper stamina).

Originally posted by h1a8
Depends on how many attacks it will take. If Less than 50 then Cage can win. If it takes more than 100 then Cage loses.
Between 51 and 99 I don't know (depends on Cages upper stamina).

Cris has zero chance of landing more than 2 or 3 hits, at best.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Cris has zero chance of landing more than 2 or 3 hits, at best. How so? He will never throw a punch unless he sees it connecting. He can dodge or block with his knuckles and counter.

The only way he doesn't land more than 2 or 3 attacks is if Cap simply stops attacking Chris and waits him out.

Originally posted by h1a8
How so? He will never throw a punch unless he sees it connecting. He can dodge or block with his knuckles and counter.

The only way he doesn't land more than 2 or 3 attacks is if Cap simply stops attacking Chris and waits him out.

Which means he'll never throw a punch as Cap is both faster and more skilled.

Originally posted by h1a8
He will counter the moment Steve misses the first attack. He's not going to sit there and just dodge. A missed attack will result in a head blow to Steve.

He was able to dodge a barrage of bullets. He doesn't have to prepare for the entire sequence, he prepares for each move.
That's my point, there isn't a sequence to prepare for. Once Cap misses the first punch he's going to come at him differently. If you're saying that he could map out the entire fight, that's fine, but even with prep there's no way he has the speed to stay out of the way of an entire barrage of Steve's punches, foreknowledge or not.

h1a8 is under the impression that the Next ability makes you faster, when in reality all it did was let him know when to sidestep to avoid where the guy was aiming.

Also, keep in mind that dodging a spray of gunfire when you know where it's going to be coming and when is not the same as having the speed to dodge a superhero's volley of punches, not by any means. Cap only goes down if our time tweaker is aided by villains.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Which means he'll never throw a punch as Cap is both faster and more skilled. Cap isn't that much faster than a human in fighting. His punches were moving slower than Mayweather's punches. After all, the visual speed is the exact speed according to you.

Originally posted by Ascendancy
Also, keep in mind that dodging a spray of gunfire when you know where it's going to be coming and when is not the same as having the speed to dodge a superhero's volley of punches, not by any means. Cap only goes down if our time tweaker is aided by villains. Cage doesn't dodge a volley of punches. He dodges a single one and counters while Cap's is out of position.

Captain America is both faster and more skilled than Cris.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Captain America is both faster and more skilled than Cris.

So? Mayweather was faster and more skilled than some of his opponents. That didn't stop them from dodging and striking Mayweather.

When has Mayweather ever been hit by an unskilled person that was slower than him?

Originally posted by Silent Master
When has Mayweather ever been hit by an unskilled person that was slower than him? You are changing the goalposts. We are talking about being more skilled and faster than someone else.

Since you refuse to back up your claims. Cap wins.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Since you refuse to back up your claims. Cap wins. I did. Chris dodges and counters although Cap is faster and more skilled.

Your speculation and opinions aren't proof.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Your speculation and opinions aren't proof. Well Cap's moves him arms as fast as a normal human being since visual speed is exact speed.

So Cage would have no problem dodging him and countering him.

Show examples of Cris dodging and countering someone that is both more skilled and faster then he is.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Show examples of Cris dodging and countering someone that is both more skilled and faster then he is.

Don't need to. Cap is human speed according to you. And skill is irrelevant once you miss with an attack.

You're claiming that he can counter Cap, so yes, you have to provide proof that he can counter someone of Cap's speed and skill. That is how debates work.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You're claiming that he can counter Cap, so yes, you have to provide proof that he can counter someone of Cap's speed and skill. That is how debates work.

I did. Cap moves with HUMAN BEING since visual speed is exact speed. Chris is a human that visually moves close to the same speed.
Chris has 2 minutes (many tries) to get the timing just right. A dodge and punch to the face will happen.

Again, your speculation isn't proof. now post proof that Cris can land attacks on someone of Cap's speed and skill.

Originally posted by h1a8
I did. Cap moves with HUMAN BEING since visual speed is exact speed. Chris is a human that visually moves close to the same speed.
Chris has 2 minutes (many tries) to get the timing just right. A dodge and punch to the face will happen.


you make me laugh reasding your posts

hahaha

Originally posted by BruceSkywalker
you make me laugh reasding your posts

hahaha You should be laughing at Silent. He's the who claims that visual speed is the actual speed a character fights at.

My post was to him only.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Again, your speculation isn't proof. now post proof that Cris can land attacks on someone of Cap's speed and skill.

I did. Visual speed has Chris and Cap being close. Therefore, Chris can simply dodge and counter Cap.

Prove it.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove it. Prove what

I'm waiting.

Prove what?

Originally posted by h1a8
You never really seen the movies. Ultron never hit him in the face. I don't remember Bucky hitting Cap in the face with the metal arm.

Lol is this blatant trolling or autism?

https://youtu.be/Il0-dXYmJ6Y

Pls tell me what happens at 1:38. If that's not called a punch what is? Lol so again if cap can eat punches from robot arm buck and ultron and take them in stride, cage has no chance of downing him.

h1, you've done nothing to show that Chris can do anything to react in the way necessary to dodge a volley of punches once Cap reacts to the first missed strike. You've done nothing to show that even dodging a punch, he has the means to counter quickly enough in an effective way. You've done nothing to refute the questions that were posed to you. Until you do those things arguing any of this further is pointless.

For now, Cap wins in my book.

Originally posted by Ascendancy
h1, you've done nothing to show that Chris can do anything to react in the way necessary to dodge a volley of punches once Cap reacts to the first missed strike. You've done nothing to show that even dodging a punch, he has the means to counter quickly enough in an effective way. You've done nothing to refute the questions that were posed to you. Until you do those things arguing any of this further is pointless.

For now, Cap wins in my book. It doesn't take much but perfect timing to block or parry a Cap attack and counter. Cage can dodge and counter simultaneously. He just has to time it right. Cap isn't that fast. His visual speed on camera isn't much faster than Chris speed.
Remember visual speed is exact speed.

Or Cage can simply block all attacks with the knuckles. Each block is an attack.

Originally posted by wallman77
Lol is this blatant trolling or autism?

https://youtu.be/Il0-dXYmJ6Y

Pls tell me what happens at 1:38. If that's not called a punch what is? Lol so again if cap can eat punches from robot arm buck and ultron and take them in stride, cage has no chance of downing him. Are you crazy or blind? Cap didn't get hit. Can't you see? He dodged.

Cap is faster and more skilled, Cris has zero chance of landing enough hits for a ko.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Cap is faster and more skilled, Cris has zero chance of landing enough hits for a ko. Not faster by much visually. It's very easy to dodge someone faster than you. It happens in boxing all the time.

My statement stands.

Originally posted by Silent Master
My statement stands. mine does too which overpoweres yours. Cap is barely faster than Chris visually. So Chris EASILY dodges and counters him. Or blocks his attacks with the knuckles. This will phuck Cap up.

Cap wins, too fast and skilled.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Cap wins, too fast and skilled. He's not too fast. His visual speed is mid human level, not even professional fighter level.

Then post feats of Cris landing multiple hits on someone with Cap's speed and skill.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Then post feats of Cris landing multiple hits on someone with Cap's speed and skill. I don't have too. Cap moves with normal human speed visually. The guy in the bar moved as fast as Cap visually. And Chris casually messed him up.

Prove that sed guy was as fast and skilled as Cap.

Originally posted by Robtard
As Rogers said in CA:TFA and CA:CW, "I can do this all day."

Pretty much agree with both you and VD on this. Cap likely wins no. 1 for a majority but loses no. 2. Though, I'd just like to point out, while I understand the point you were making with the quote, and stamina is certainly something Cap could use in this fight; he said that line in CW while seemingly out of breath, tired and dazed. Hardly what I'd call validity to the statement. He clearly wouldn't be able to do that all day.

He was fighting Iron Man. I don't believe he'd be in the same condition if he had been taking punches from a normal man.

Completely agree with you. That doesn't change the fact Big Rob, that has made such a statement and truly wouldn't be able to do that all day. Nothing more nothing less.

I don't think we were supposed to take the three scenes where he said that as literal. I personally saw it as humor; I believe you did too.

Originally posted by Robtard
I don't think we were supposed to take the three scenes where he said that as literal. I personally saw it as humor; I believe you did too.

Hmmm humor... I thought of it more like false bravado and not wanting to admit he might have bitten off more than he could chew. I really don't see it as a comedic moment. The set up, the delivery, the circumstances, none of it seemed humorous really. I guess it could be in a way, and I just didn't see it that way. You're right in that I didn't take it literally. In the end though, your point stands and would be a factor in the fight. Especially in no. 1

Originally posted by h1a8
Are you crazy or blind? Cap didn't get hit. Can't you see? He dodged.

So when cap jumped off the sliding car and yelled come on at the time stated, he didn't get punched in the face. Ok so blatant trolling.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove that sed guy was as fast and skilled as Cap. The guy punches as fast as Cap visually. He's not as skilled as Cap though.

Originally posted by wallman77
So when cap jumped off the sliding car and yelled come on at the time stated, he didn't get punched in the face. Ok so blatant trolling. No, he didn't get punched in the face. He ducked the punch. If he would have gotten hit then he would have got sent flying back, unless Ultron threw a very weak punch.

Originally posted by h1a8
The guy punches as fast as Cap visually. He's not as skilled as Cap though.

Prove that Cris can land hits on someone as fast and skilled as Cap.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove that Cris can land hits on someone as fast and skilled as Cap. Chris can lands hits on anyone he can dodge. Having the speed to dodge automatically gives the speed to counter or intercept.

Once Cap misses, he is open to an attack since his body is out of position. His recovery speed is exactly what we see visually in the movie (slow).

Chris can intercept Cap, hitting Cap before Cap hits him. A stop hit.

Finally, Chris can land attacks by blocking. Each block is the attack. Chris blocks with the knuckles which causes damage to Cap.

Prove he can hit someone that is as fast and skilled as Cap.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove he can hit someone that is as fast and skilled as Cap.

I did. Cap is not that much faster than the guy in the bar (punching speed) yet Chris CASUALLY embarrassed him.

Chris will seemingly do the same to Cap.

Your opinion isn't proof. Now, prove that Cris can hit someone that is as fast and skilled as Cap.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Your opinion isn't proof. Now, prove that Cris can hit someone that is as fast and skilled as Cap. I did. And why you keep saying "as fast as Cap" when he isn't visually faster than the guy in the bar (punching speed).

Also you never addressed the point I made about blocking Cap with the knuckles, making each block an actual attack.

Do you know the difference between opinion and proof?

Originally posted by Silent Master
Do you know the difference between opinion and proof?

about blocking Cap with the knuckles, making each block an actual attack.

Since you didn't answer I'm just going to have to assume you don't know the difference between an opinion and proof.

Originally posted by h1a8
No, he didn't get punched in the face. He ducked the punch. If he would have gotten hit then he would have got sent flying back, unless Ultron threw a very weak punch.

Ur an idiot, cap jumped up on the truck, block a punch with his shield and took one in the jaw that dropped him to his knee.

Originally posted by wallman77
Ur an idiot, cap jumped up on the truck, block a punch with his shield and took one in the jaw that dropped him to his knee. Cap ducked the punch. He never got hit.

Glad to see nothing's changed here. Cap wins.

Originally posted by Ascendancy
Glad to see nothing's changed here. Cap wins.

Originally posted by h1a8
Chris can counter miss hits almost simultaneously as the punch misses.

Chris can intercept Cap, hitting Cap before Cap hits him. A stop hit.

Finally, Chris can land attacks by blocking Caps limbs with the knuckles . Each block is the attack. Chris blocks with the knuckles which causes damage to Cap.

Prove it.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove it.

He can see 2 minutes into the future. He can keep trying until he gets it right.

I didn't ask for your opinion.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I didn't ask for your opinion. That is his ability.

That's your opinion on what he his ability will allow him to do, I want actual proof that he can dodge and hit someone that is as fast and skilled as Cap.

He'll literally be in a never-ending loop if he's going to go back and change his strategy. He dodges the first punch somehow, Cap changes his pattern. He's not fast enough to adapt to that. There's still, as pages ago, no way for him to win this. Present something new or concede.

Originally posted by h1a8
Cap ducked the punch. He never got hit.

Dude so you obviously aren't blind, but can I ask if you're deaf or hard of hearing or perhaps if you watched the clip without the sound on?

If you watch it with the sound on and you listen you can tell by the sound effect that yep Ultron connected with Cap. There is literally no other explanation for where that sound effect comes from if Cap did not get hit.

This isn't something up for debate either: that sound effect flat out exists. You need to explain to us all what that sound is supposed to be if it's not Cap getting hit. Right before it happens Ultron hits Cap's shield and that makes a different kind of sound upon contact, so we know the sound couldn't have somehow been the shield being hit or anything like that.