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1. Force.
2. Sabers
3. All out

Zonakin wins everytime. He is simply a more skilled Luke at this point.

Luke in all.

Incoming bias. ^

Zonakin stomps.

Zonakin implies a focused Anakin feeding off his rage being used a tool/weapon for him vs a vastly less trained/experienced Luke's frenzy attack...

Have to go with Anakin at this stage of Luke's Jedi career.

Anakin. There is no ZonAnakin.

RotJ novel says Luke.

Originally posted by Azronger
RotJ novel says Luke.

Originally posted by Azronger
RotJ novel says Luke.


Lucas says Anakin

an akin wins

Originally posted by GM Yoda
Zonakin stomps.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Lucas says Anakin Form your own opinion you Lucas slave.

Sabers: Anakin
Force: Anakin
All-Out Luke: It's close but Luke has more overall control and discipline unlike Anakin.

Anakin crushes him.

Anakin takes them all.

Did Rage!Luke even overwhelm Vader with speed, or just the sheer force of his blows? If the latter, then Anakin's sheer speed would be make it a quick one, I'd imagine.

Anakin murks.

Luke wins going off Canon, dies is Stover's Anakin.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Luke wins going off Canon, dies is Stover's Anakin.


Is Stover's Anakin not also going off Canon?

The RotS novel is Legends.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
The RotS novel is Legends.


Then I'm unsure what Canon you're talking about that states ROTJ Luke is greater than ROTS Anakin.

Rage!Luke >> Vader > Anakin.

Vader's more powerful, but is it ever said that he was outright better than Anakin overall?

Not to my knowledge, we only have the indication that he might be via Vader's vision in the Marvel comics, however in the same way that Vader's skill was rendered moot against Luke's onslaught, I would say the same would be the case for Anakin.

Anakin's greater mobility and speed will probably be a factor here. And Zonakin is pretty damn ferocious. Luke's onslaught doesn't seem like it would get through that.

We're forgetting that at his peak "zone" stage, Anakin was curbing Dooku harder than Luke was Vader.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Rage!Luke >> Vader > Anakin.


Unless of course Vader was holding back against his son.


Originally posted by SunRazer
Vader's more powerful, but is it ever said that he was outright better than Anakin overall?


Well that's what more powerful usually means.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Lucas says Anakin

Lucas says he lives in his own world.

Several sources have indicated to Vader being "conflicted" and giving he gave his life to save his son at the end, I don't think it's a stretch to say he was holding back to some extent.

The fact he neglected to use the Force at all, sans a lightsaber throw is also a glaring sign of not going at it with everything.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Anakin's greater mobility and speed will probably be a factor here. And Zonakin is pretty damn ferocious. Luke's onslaught doesn't seem like it would get through that.

We're forgetting that at his peak "zone" stage, Anakin was curbing Dooku harder than Luke was Vader. Greater mobility and speed? I assume you mean in regards to Vader, who is also pretty ferocious too, yet he was rendered helpless against Luke.

And though Anakin defeats Dooku faster, I find Vader's struggle more pronounced. Dooku at least appears to capably block the majority of Anakin's attacks, whereas Vader was utterly unable to meet Luke's blows from the off. The only difference is that Anakin was able to finish Dooku faster through greater control and finesse, whereas Luke just hammered his (stronger) opponent into submission.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Unless of course Vader was holding back against his son.I wouldn't say it makes much of a difference.

Originally posted by Azronger
Lucas says he lives in his own world.


Yes, the world of Actual Star Wars Canon, Pre-Disney.

Lucas can get dunked.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yes, the world of Actual Star Wars Canon, Pre-Disney.

There was no such thing as "Actual Star Wars Canon," Pre-Disney. There were G, T, C, S, and N. But now that that system is gone, and Lucas is no longer in power, I don't give a crap about what he says, when looking at his words in the context of Legends.

"There are two worlds here. There's my world, which is the movies, and there's this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe—the licensing world of the books, games and comic books. They don't intrude on my world, which is a select period of time, they do intrude in between the movies. I don't get too involved in the parallel universe."

"I don't read that stuff. I haven't read any of the novels. I don't know anything about that world. That's a different world than my world."
-George Lucas

And when it comes to this matchup, I'll take the RotJ novel over anyone's opinion, Lucas' included.

^ Do you even know what G and T canon stood for? lol


G was George Lucas Canon. That would override everything else in the old "Canon"

So "C Canon" was never actually canon for the reasons you just pointed out. Lucas didn't acknowledge it. His Canon was the actual Canon. The rest of it struggled to live around Lucas's world give. He always contradicted it, which is why Disney didn't bother acknowledging it either.

Yeah, I knew all that. Your point? Because again, I don't give a crap about what Lucas has said or says anymore, since the Canon system changed.

Originally posted by Azronger
Yeah, I knew all that. Your point? Because again, I don't give a crap about what Lucas has said or says anymore, since the Canon system changed.



Regardless of the change in Canon, it's still his audio commentary there on the canon version of ROTJ, which holds more weight than the pre-prequel ROTJ Novel where Owen and Ben are brothers Lol

Lucas is out. D. Thor can't deal with that.

Azronger is correct tbh. "G-Canon" is now Disney Canon or rather simply Canon, and George has been taken out of it.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Azronger is correct tbh. "G-Canon" is now Disney Canon or rather simply Canon, and George has been taken out of it.


That doesn't mean all his movie commentary goes out of the window. Remember the deal between him and Disney meant all the updated versions of the OT, the Prequels and TCW remain canon. I.e. All of his main contribution to canon with the way he's satisfied with it.

Now if Disney contradicts any of that, like for instance Vader is no longer a cripple, and is considered vastly more powerful than Anakin, then so be it, but that contradictory Disney evidence needs to be presented before just writing off Lucas because you don't like what he's saying Lol.

And let's not forget Dave Filoni is still a big creative force in Disney Canon, and he reiterates Lucas's words on Luke's training and how ROTJ Luke was not on par with Vader. And he actually takes it to a far worse extreme than Lucas ever did.

As for Azronger's personal Canon, this started with him quoting the ROTJ Novel, as if that has more authority than Lucas's movie commentary(which is still on any of the latest versions you buy) in today's canon.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
Several sources have indicated to Vader being "conflicted" and giving he gave his life to save his son at the end, I don't think it's a stretch to say he was holding back to some extent.

The fact he neglected to use the Force at all, sans a lightsaber throw is also a glaring sign of not going at it with everything. Reaching.

@Thor the point is G-Canon doesn't exist anymore, so no it doesn't take precedent over the source material (neither does Filoni's opinion btw) and has zero bearing on Disney Canon.

If you want to take his words to heart your welcome to, but it's not fact.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
@Thor the point is G-Canon doesn't exist anymore, so no it doesn't take precedent over the source material (neither does Filoni's opinion btw) and has zero bearing on Disney Canon.

If you want to take his words to heart your welcome to, but it's not fact.


I never said G-Canon takes precedence anymore. With G-Canon we were talking about how it worked in the pre-Disney days.

But he's still the creator of that source material (Episodes 1-6), so his commentary on those are just as meaningful as Filoni's commentary on TCW & Rebels.

Both commentaries can be contradicted by official sources but still both have more meaning than a Pre-Prequel novel which claims Ben and Owen are brothers

Also let's not be silly and degrade Lucas's commentary to that of a nobody that doesn't count for shit anymore. He's still the creator of the whole damn saga as much as the Lucas haters try to deny it Lol

D. Thor and his George Lucas worship just won't stop.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
I never said G-Canon takes precedence anymore. With G-Canon we were talking about how it worked in the pre-Disney days.

But he's still the creator of that source material (Episodes 1-6), so his commentary on those are just as meaningful as Filoni's commentary on TCW & Rebels.

Both commentaries can be contradicted by official sources but still both have more meaning than a Pre-Prequel novel which claims Ben and Owen are brothers

Also let's not be silly and degrade Lucas's commentary to that of a nobody that doesn't count for shit anymore. He's still the creator of the whole damn saga as much as the Lucas haters try to deny it Lol G-Canon doesn't exist anymore, the pre-Disney days are over, it's all Legends now and we are free to interpret them as we wish.

And you just said that George > the OT novelisations, so yeah, your saying it takes precedence.

Face it, he sold Star Wars to the white slavers, he doesn't love you anymore.

Originally posted by quanchi112
D. Thor and his George Lucas worship just won't stop. Crazy right?

Legends is still better tbh tho imo.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Crazy right? D. Thor is a very close minded individuals who believes the madness he puts into the world.

Yeah, you're right, Thor, Lucas' commentary on the movies is still relevant. But I'm not discussing this from a Canon-only perspective, and whatever Lucas may have said in regards to Luke's training is irrelevant when he's in a bloodlusted frenzy amp mode.

Originally posted by GM Yoda
Zonakin stomps.

Well obviously Quanchi hates Lucas Lol. The guy created Star Wars, the franchise which even at it's least successful was immensely more popular than NUTrek is even today.


Originally posted by Beniboybling
G-Canon doesn't exist anymore, the pre-Disney days are over, it's all Legends now and we are free to interpret them as we wish.

And you just said that George > the OT novelisations, so yeah, your saying it takes precedence.

Face it, he sold Star Wars to the white slavers, he doesn't love you anymore.


Legends is basically glorified fanfic sold by Lucasfilm now so it doesn't matter.

But in the days when it was taken more seriously G Canon took precedent.

Nowadays Legends is fanfic, whereas it's still Lucas's commentary on the canon version of the films, so yeah Lucas's commentary is >>> outdated novels.

He sold it to white slavers to get the haters off his back. Didn't work. He should have realised Haters are just gonna hate regardless.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Well obviously Quanchi hates Lucas Lol. The guy created Star Wars, the franchise which even at it's least successful was immensely more popular than NUTrek is even today.





Legends is basically glorified fanfic sold by Lucasfilm now so it doesn't matter.

But in the days when it was taken more seriously G Canon took precedent.

Nowadays Legends is fanfic, whereas it's still Lucas's commentary on the canon version of the films, so yeah Lucas's commentary is >>> outdated novels.

He sold it to white slavers to get the haters off his back. Didn't work. He should have realised Haters are just gonna hate regardless. Rots is my favorite Star Wars so obviously I don't hate George. I also don't worship him like you do. He sold his franchise to the white slavers. He even said something so petty in an interview. The man lost his way and isn't half as great as you make him out to be. Love that Star Wars is in Disney's hands.

The Kelvin timeline has nothing to do with this so try to keep your personal feelings out of every thread.

Zonakin

Originally posted by EmperorSidious2
Zonakin

lol Anakin lights him uuup

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Well that's what more powerful usually means.

No, it doesn't.

Originally posted by SunRazer
No, it doesn't.


Of course it does. Power in the Force amps all their Physical and TK abilities.

And it's not like Anakin is more skilled than Vader Lol

You'd need quite the power growth to see a noticeable increase in physicals.

As an overall duelist, Anakin's better.

Originally posted by SunRazer
You'd need quite the power growth to see a noticeable increase in physicals.

As an overall duelist, Anakin's better.


He does have a huge power growth.

In Legends, yes Anakin was the better duelist. In Canon that remains to be seen, but I doubt there's a big difference either way.

Sure, but he also had a huge loss in power upon becoming a cyborg. He has to make up for that before he can being to surpass Anakin.

Gillard's quotes hold in Canon as well.

It's not as if Vader's done anything in Canon that's out of Anakin's reach as a duelist, anyway.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Sure, but he also had a huge loss in power upon becoming a cyborg. He has to make up for that before he can being to surpass Anakin.


Well in Canon at least he's overall more powerful after than he was before. So the question is whether the boost in power and strength off the cyborg suit offsets the disadvantages and losses he faced.




Originally posted by SunRazer
It's not as if Vader's done anything in Canon that's out of Anakin's reach as a duelist, anyway.


I agree. I'm just arguing he's probably not below Anakin as a duelist. And if he is then it's not by much.

And him dominating someone on Maul's level, also seems consistent with TCW/ROTS Anakin's level.

He didn't dominate Ahsoka, he just controlled their fight, and on a potential DS nexus to boot. Anakin did similar against Dooku, who's more formidable than Ahsoka.

A hindered Anakin effortlessly cleaved through Drallig one-handed whilst Choking another Jedi at the same time. That's beyond Vader's ability.

Originally posted by SunRazer
You'd need quite the power growth to see a noticeable increase in physicals.

As an overall duelist, Anakin's better. Anakin is far better. He also had more training, more experience, etc. Anakin beats Luke. Ot fanboys just can't seem to accept it such as D. Thor.