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pre-Plagueis death Sidious

Who wins?

I take Luceno's opinion on the matter at face value; Plagueis wins.

He just said Plagueis might have won in a duel.

Plagueis; superior feats with no inferable low showings.

Originally posted by Deronn_solo
I take Luceno's opinion on the matter at face value; Plagueis wins.

Plagueis

Sidious has already replicated every single showing Plagueis has done in lightsaber combat (except for beating Venamis, but unless you think he's incapable of that for some reason, I'd say he pulls it off too), and has comparable showings in physical augmentation. He also rarely trained after this, so his skill showings from later incarnations could also be attributed to this Palpatine. Not sure who wins; probably a stalemate.

For Force, Sidious, eight years before TPM, already pulled off the unbalancing feat alongside Plagueis. It should be noted the text described neither Sith doing more work than the other, indicating equality. It's likely Sidious surpassed Plagueis in the eight years following this. He's also stated to know every single Force power Plagueis knows.

For feats, he has tanked Plagueis' Maladian-pulverizing Force wave to the face. While it is true Plagueis wasn't in peak condition, it is also equally true Sidious didn't even flinch.

I might support Sidious for Force and all-out.

Either way.

Sidious

Sheevites are really going down a peg these days.

Not really. Plagueis > novel Vitiate has become well accepted, and Plagueis > Valkorion is gaining lots of ground.

Is this all in a concerted effort to make Sheev look greater than Vitiate ?

Originally posted by The Ellimist
Plagueis > Valkorion.
How?

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
How?

Unbalancing the Force.

Even split.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Even split.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Even split. I would like to hear your reasoning since you've been known to go out of your way to use double standards and to change the goalposts in favor of Sheev.

Plagueis no question. No other reason to kill him why he is asleep (ROTS) or while he is heavily inebriated (Plagueis novel) if he can just do it directly.

Based on the canon explanation it's very telling he'd kill him in his sleep like a woman. Sheev is very cowardly.

Originally posted by Dark-Kenshin
No other reason to kill him why he is asleep (ROTS) or while he is heavily inebriated (Plagueis novel) if he can just do it directly. Because he wants to ensure victory rather than leaving it to chance?

Or because you doubt your chances against him in one on one combat and kill him like a woman. It doesn't in any way imply superiority by killing someone in their sleep.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Or because you doubt your chances against him in one on one combat and kill him like a woman. It doesn't in any way imply superiority by killing someone in their sleep. I didn't suggest that killing him in his sleep is a sign of superiority. Nor is it an admission of inferiority when, as I said, it could just be because Sheev is smart and would like to ensure victory.

If there was an explicit reason for why he killed Plagueis the way he did, there wouldn't be years worth of debate as to who would win in a fight.

Then again, you're quanchi so what the hell am I doing speaking to you rationally. Star Trek is garbage.

Originally posted by ILS
I didn't suggest that killing him in his sleep is a sign of superiority. Nor is it an admission of inferiority when, as I said, it could just be because Sheev is smart and would like to ensure victory.

If there was an explicit reason for why he killed Plagueis the way he did, there wouldn't be years worth of debate as to who would win in a fight.

Then again, you're quanchi so what the hell am I doing speaking to you rationally. Star Trek is garbage. It implies you can't beat them straight up. But then again you'd abandon the same logic is a woman poisoned her husband. Let's forget Palaptine's own words about his former master and just pretend Sidious is this clever genius who never takes unnecessary risks.

1. Yoda. He didn't unnecessarily prance about while Yoda was down or anything. No, that certainly didn't happen. He didn't try to leave the room half a minute later or so when Yoda recovered and returned the favor with an attack.

2. Luke. Palpatine sure didn't leave anything to chance while he stood over Vader's son torturing and eventually trying to kill him. I mean he was cold, calculating and not foolish at all. I mean how did that turn out for him ?

Then again you're Ils and Trek has no bearing on this issue. Trek isn't garbage the same director who brought it to greatness Star Wars sought out. See unlike you I actually make tangible points not just baseless, emotionally driven conjecture.

The point that Sidious deciding to assassinate Plagueis instead of dueling him is moot. There're several reasons as to why he did it:

1. He wasn't sure of his own victory. The two were very close in their lightsaber skill and Force power at the time. He didn't want to risk it.

2. Sidious meeded Hego Damask to assure his political victory to Chancellorship as Palpatine. He only killed him when his position was assured, and Damask's - Palpatine's close friend - death also garnered Palpatine sympathy in the Senate, making his chances even stronger. That is why he didn't kill him earlier

3. If Damask had been allowed to live a day longer, Palpatine would have had to officially appoint him Co-Chancellor, as had been their deal. Sidious had to kill Plagueis on that specific day. No other would've sufficed.

4. They were on Coruscant. Two decades earlier, when Plagueis had been the target of an assassination attempt, he unleashed his full combative might in the Force (that he could unleash in his injured state). Said demonstration actually caused a dark side nexus and alerted every Jedi on the planet to his presence. Now imagine two Valkorion+ Force users going at it at full power. A thousand years of planning would have been for nothing.

I hope this proves Sidious choosing not to duel isn't a sign of inferiority.

Originally posted by NewGuy01
Either way.

Keep running, ILS.