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Same circumstances as Clark had in Man of Steel

Can Banner beat both Kryptonians?

The two together are too much. Nam-Ek threw a train a half mile. Hulk has a healing factor to help, but kryptonians are sooo hard to hurt. And there is two of them. The only move that could make a significant difference would be hawk breaking off their protective masks if this was held in the same way that Superman fought the two, right after they first arrived at earth. If they have any time to adapt it all, he is a goner for sure.

Hulk would smash faora as soon as he gets hands on her. Her face plate would be gone and she'd be knocked out in sensory overload.
NamEk is a real threat, but apart from throwing a train ENGINE , he didn't have any impressive feats. Hulk bringing down a leviathan by pure strength seemed more impressive to me (I'm not talking about the punch)
Hulk would eventually defeat NamEk

Nope. He couldn't even beat Hulkbuster when enraged.

Team kills him. He barely did any damage to Thor.

Faora could solo Hulk. She's the fastest of the Kryptonians.

Originally posted by Robtard
Faora could solo Hulk. She's the fastest of the Kryptonians.

If Faora had Zod's flight and heat vision, I'm convinced she would have demolished Superman.

Cause clearly heat vision really did anything to them when he used it on them. Another convincing byte blunder.

Yes he could beat them being that they have masks to exploit. Not sure he would though because of the speed disparity

And yet he could not convincing put Thor down in one on one, or Hulkbuster when enraged.

HulkBuster showing doesn't count because he was being mindraped firstly. Secondly, it was done clearly when he wasn't enraged anymore. He was looking around at all the damaged he had caused with a sad look on his face. Clearly indicating he wasn't enraged anymore... sees some soldiers and cops pointing guns at him.. seems like he's about to get annoyed and BAM. That showing is almost a non factor here.

The Thor showing is more of a factor, but again, Thor didn't beat him. Hulk was clearly the stronger of the two, and that had one of his best reaction feats showing he can deal with speed i.e. catching the hammer.

Put it this way, if he can exploits their mask, to the point where Zod could barely stand and they had to drag him away. Or when Faora got KO'd by a mere missile. Yeah, Hulk would have no issue KOing them if he got a hold of um imo

I'm convinced that Faora alone could take on Hulk, but KT has a point though. The mask weakness can be exploited.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
HulkBuster showing doesn't count because he was being mindraped firstly. Secondly, it was done clearly when he wasn't enraged anymore. He was looking around at all the damaged he had caused with a sad look on his face. Clearly indicating he wasn't enraged anymore... sees some soldiers and cops pointing guns at him.. seems like he's about to get annoyed and BAM. That showing is almost a non factor here.

The Thor showing is more of a factor, but again, Thor didn't beat him. Hulk was clearly the stronger of the two, and that had one of his best reaction feats showing he can deal with speed i.e. catching the hammer.

Put it this way, if he can exploits their mask, to the point where Zod could barely stand and they had to drag him away. Or when Faora got KO'd by a mere missile. Yeah, Hulk would have no issue KOing them if he got a hold of um imo

Hulkbuster had Hulk on the ropes the entire fight. The fight does count. If you are going to say that whole doesn't count cause he was blood lusted then we don't have anything else to talk about cause now we are ignoring showings to favor your pick. But I can get a mod ruling if need to to say a movie showing counts based on someone trying to toss it out.

You're not understanding what I'm saying. Him being mindraped invalidates the entire showing. If he was being mindraped, that means by proxy, he wasn't in control of his actions. Hulk, even when enraged has shown he is capable of thinking out there. After all, he is one of he smartest men on the planet as Banner. Granted, some of that goes out the door in his Hulk state, but he is still thinking out there to varying degrees. So when you're mindraped, and you're not in control of your thoughts or actions that ISN'T what a normal Hulk would fight like. That is what invalidates the showing. To say nothing of the fact that he had IM beat... ripped his armor to complete shreds... only through tech was IM not destroyed as he had spare parts flown in mid fight. Make no mistake though, he would've gotten owned. It was a good showing for IM and you can take a little away from that showing In Re: Hulk, but really, not all that much

BTW try and get whatever ruling you want. I'll win. Him being mindraped automatically isn't applicable to a non mindraped Hulk. Nobody is saying it didn't happen. But what is clear, is that it doesn't count for a non mindraped Hulk. Sure though, if you want to use a mindraped Hulk in a fight... it will count.

No it does not invalidate the whole fight. And I have requested a mod ruling. Till then, see ya.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
You're not understanding what I'm saying. Him being mindraped invalidates the entire showing. If he was being mindraped, that means by proxy, he wasn't in control of his actions. Hulk, even when enraged has shown he is capable of thinking out there. After all, he is one of he smartest men on the planet as Banner. Granted, some of that goes out the door in his Hulk state, but he is still thinking out there to varying degrees. So when you're mindraped, and you're not in control of your thoughts or actions that ISN'T what a normal Hulk would fight like. That is what invalidates the showing. To say nothing of the fact that he had IM beat... ripped his armor to complete shreds... only through tech was IM not destroyed as he had spare parts flown in mid fight. Make no mistake though, he would've gotten owned. It was a good showing for IM and you can take a little away from that showing In Re: Hulk, but really, not all that much

BTW try and get whatever ruling you want. I'll win. Him being mindraped automatically isn't applicable to a non mindraped Hulk. Nobody is saying it didn't happen. But what is clear, is that it doesn't count for a non mindraped Hulk. Sure though, if you want to use a mindraped Hulk in a fight... it will count.

ScarletWitch wasn't actively controlling the Hulk though, she just put visions in his head (like the others) and those visions made him uncontrollably mad. Which being mad, we all know adds to Hulk's strength/power.

Could be argued that she effectively gave Hulk a power-boost, considering his powers are fueled/amped by rage/stress.

Cool

Originally posted by Robtard
ScarletWitch wasn't actively controlling the Hulk though, she just put visions in his head (like the others) and those visions made him uncontrollably mad. Which being mad, we all know adds to Hulk's strength/power.

Could be argued that she effectively gave Hulk a power-boost, considering his powers are fueled/amped by rage/stress.

I thought this was pretty obvious.

Originally posted by Robtard
ScarletWitch wasn't actively controlling the Hulk though, she just put visions in his head (like the others) and those visions made him uncontrollably mad. Which being mad, we all know adds to Hulk's strength/power.

Could be argued that she effectively gave Hulk a power-boost, considering the his powers are fueled/amped by rage/stress.

Which again Bud, is a mindraped. A normal Hulk doesn't have visions and thoughts going on in his head telling him to do something or pulling him in one direction to do something. He's free to act as he sees fit or destroy whatever he sees fit.

Further, when IM did KO Hulk he CLEARLY wasn't in that state anymore. He was looking like a Sad Panda on the ground and looking at all the damage he caused. He was unquestionably not enraged anymore. When he was, IM never came close to KOing him.

The point here is, you can't use a Hulk being mindraped as analogous to a non mindraped Hulk. That simply can never work no matter how little one thinks the mindrape was

You are saying that, but you don't get to decide that. It's not your call to make.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Which again Bud, is a mindraped. A normal Hulk doesn't have visions and thoughts going on in his head telling him to do something or pulling him in one direction to do something. He's free to act as he sees fit or destroy whatever he sees fit.

Further, when IM did KO Hulk he CLEARLY wasn't in that state anymore. He was looking like a Sad Panda on the ground and looking at all the damage he caused. He was unquestionably not enraged anymore. When he was, IM never came close to KOing him.

The point here is, you can't use a Hulk being mindraped as analogous to a non mindraped Hulk. That simply can never work no matter how little one thinks the mindrape was

But "mindraped" = more rage and rage powers Hulk.

Agreed and I don't think I implied to the contrary, Hulk lost those visions and wasn't raging anymore when his ass got knocked the **** out. But he was still Hulk.

My point was just that when IM fought Hulk, he was a Hulk at one of his most powerful levels for 99.99% of the fight, similar when Thor fought Hulk and he was buttmad due to the scepter's influence.

Originally posted by Robtard
But "mindraped" = more rage and rage powers Hulk.

Agreed and I don't think I implied to the contrary, Hulk lost those visions and wasn't raging anymore when his ass got knocked the **** out. But he was still Hulk.

My point was just that when IM fought Hulk, he was a Hulk at one of his most powerful levels for 99.99% of the fight, similar when Thor fought Hulk and he was buttmad due to the scepter's influence.

Here's is where we disagree though friend. Hulk has shown, even when raging he's capable of thinking to varying to degrees. Norton's Hulk should that on many occasions. So did Avengers Hulk. Even mid fight and raging... he still wasn't going around like a mindless beast destroying everything including his teammates. He was even shown taking orders on what to do. My point is, THAT version of Hulk that is totally in control of his faculties, yet is still raging doesn't equal a Hulk being pulled in a certain direction by mindrape. For example, in football you could have the best most powerful offensive line. Who get mindraped into a raged state. Good in some ways sure, they'll be beasting on the field. Bad, because they can't pick up audible calls switching out of plays, or commit dumb moves i.e. penalties.

Point here is, somebody mindraping another to be artificial mad and pulled in a certain direction can never be analogous to a Hulk raging on his own and in control imo. Can a little be inferred, I guess, but it's not the same Hulk

I'm not arguing that they're interchangeable, I'm arguing that Hulk in the S. Africa fight was more powerful compared to when he's in control of himself, due to the nature of Hulk's powers being regulated by his emotional state.

Look at it this way, do you think normal Hulk being in a lower state of rage would have done better against IM/HB?

Originally posted by Robtard
I'm not arguing that they're interchangeable, I'm arguing that Hulk in the S. Africa fight was more powerful compared to when he's in control of himself, due to the nature of Hulk's powers being regulated by his emotional state.

Look at it this way, do you think normal Hulk being in a lower state of rage would have done better against IM/HB?

Yes, because that was an artificial mad, it wasn't concrete legit mad. Those are worlds apart. It's akin to somebody telling you something they heard someone else say about you. Sure, you'll be mad but it's somewhat artificial because you don't know for sure. Now compare that to you actually hearing them say that, you'd be mad with no doubts. As we've seen, Hulk does have TP resistance, so if he was being pushed to being mad via mindrape, he would also be constantly fighting said control to some degree. Who knows how much, nobody does, but he certainly be trying to fight that off or have spells of it not working or having total control. That would be in stark contrast to Hulk genuinely being mad on his own accord without being forced to be artificial mad. Imo those are two different types of mad.

You have now come up with your own theory and offered no proof to back it up besides a completely subjective opinion. He has had no TP resistance in any movie. That is another character misrepresentation.

Movie feats prove he was stronger as mindless Hulk.

KT,

I don't follow your "artificial mad" scenario, as far as Hulk knew, those visions that where making him go buttmad were real. He seemed more crazy/mad/upset than we've ever seen him before (in the MCU).

The fight scene with HB Iron Man is valid canon material.

MCU Hulk is at a level where he can be KO'd, calm or angry. Screen feats are valid.

^ Confirmed by a mod. Nice.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
BTW try and get whatever ruling you want. I'll win.

Originally posted by Impediment
The fight scene with HB Iron Man is valid canon material.

MCU Hulk is at a level where he can be KO'd, calm or angry. Screen feats are valid.

You were saying?

Originally posted by Impediment
The fight scene with HB Iron Man is valid canon material.

MCU Hulk is at a level where he can be KO'd, calm or angry. Screen feats are valid.

Not sure what you were told to rule on, but seemingly you were given wrong information. As you'll notice on page 1, I never said it wasn't canon to the MCU and Hulk. Never disputed that. What I did dispute was that, THAT particular showings is analogous to an enraged Hulk without being mindraped. That is what I'm disputing. If you're being mindraped you're not fighting like you normally would. Mindrape implies you're being controlled and pulled in a particular direction by the person doing the raping. This can't be disputed. So, how would that be the same as a non mindraped Hulk? That is the question at hand here. Not whether it's canon to MCU Hulk. Let's examine

That particular Hulk was being mindraped and fed visions to make him angry. We have no idea how often these visions were coming in. For example, if they were being constantly fed to him, and if so, that further proves my case. Part of a fight is using your brain during a fight. Even somebody like Hulk, while enraged has shown the ability to think during a fight and isn't aimlessly fighting his team. So then, how if you're being mind controlled and fed visions of things constantly, you aren't thinking during a fight , and non thinking automatically equals not fighting to the best of your ability. How can it be viewed any other way. Just because Hulk gets stronger anger, doesn't mean we just follow that slippery slope to, well, he was artificially being fed visions to make him angry, thus he was stronger, That is blatantly false on many levels

First, as I just talked about, if you're not thinking to the best of your ability, you're not fighting to the best of your ability. This is explicitly why we factor that in to our debates as an example of somebody not fighting to the best of their abilities. We see this in all threads across the forum. Yet here, we just forget that part and say Hulk was even better and stronger? No way, that logical progression doesn't work, and exactly why we made rules stating that isn't somebody fighting their best.

Second, Hulk has feats explicitly better than anything he did in that fight. His feat in the first avenger Movie of stopping that giant monster thing with a punch right after changing. That pooos on anything he did against Hulkbuster. Which further goes to invalidate this artificial method of making Hulk angry and what he did in that fight. He has others that are better as well. Point is, both of those factors imo show that a mindraped Hulk can't be the best Hulk

That is all I've been saying this entire time, and what the ruling should be about. Sure we can use a mindraped Hulk on the forum and then that cool. What I'm saying is, in now way, can a mindraped be Hulk be the same as a non mindraped Hulk. Those are the same person nor Caliber of fighter. T.I. trying to say it's the same Hulk and that is the Hulk we use in fights. I don't agree. So please rule on this matter. Are you saying a mindraped Hulk sent visions to make him angry is the same as a non mindraped Hulk who's angry on his own?

I'm also confused on what you mean a calm or angry Hulk has been KO'd. When was an angry Hulk KO'd? It certainly wasn't in the scene in questions. As others have pointed out, he had calmed down right before the KO. He was literally looking all sad and depressed on what he had done moments before. That is the discussion here. T.I. is trying to say that was a normal angry Hulk and he was KO'd, and thus can be KO'd like that. That is what is blatantly false. He was normally angry, nor was he angry right before the KO. He was literally on the ground looking sad, so how can that be a normally enraged Hulk that was KO'd?

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
You were saying?

So you told him to rule on something I never said LOL. Okay, that isn't out discussion. I clearly have to tell him the discussion at hand. We'll see what he says.

I didn't tell him anything but to make a ruling on the thread, now you are assuming he didn't read the thread based on what proof?

Just give up for once and take the loss ok? Is it worth 100 page thread you know you are already wrong in?



Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
HulkBuster showing doesn't count because he was being mindraped firstly.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
You're not understanding what I'm saying. Him being mindraped invalidates the entire showing.

BTW try and get whatever ruling you want. I'll win. Him being mindraped automatically isn't applicable to a non mindraped Hulk. Nobody is saying it didn't happen. But what is clear, is that it doesn't count for a non mindraped Hulk. Sure though, if you want to use a mindraped Hulk in a fight... it will count.

Originally posted by Impediment
The fight scene with HB Iron Man is valid canon material.

MCU Hulk is at a level where he can be KO'd, calm or angry. Screen feats are valid.

Originally posted by Robtard
KT,

I don't follow your "artificial mad" scenario, as far as Hulk knew, those visions that where making him go buttmad were real. He seemed more crazy/mad/upset than we've ever seen him before (in the MCU).

As you know, the rule is very clear on these matters, if you're being altered mentally you're not fighting to the best of your abilities. As you say, these Hulk's aren't interchangeable. So you agree with what I've been saying this whole time. That state Hulk isn't analogous to a normally pissed Hulk simply by the fact that he was being altered mentally. However, to go further on what you said.

The reason it clearly wasn't madder than anything we've seen is because his feats don't support that distinction in the least. That is exactly the problem. If he was truly the most enraged than we've ever seen, we'd see feats to support that. We don't. So no, that correlation can't be made, to say nothing of the clear rule we have on these forums and others; being altered mentally isn't them fighting to the best of their abilities. Further, more proof Hulk wasn't more angry is that we'd see him then be much harder to calm down. Yet here, where you're saying he's angrier then we've ever seen him.. He goes to sad panda nigh instantly? Even when we've seen him calm down, he just casually strolls over, still looking pissed but he's calm. There we see him siting on the ground, almost crying, yet he was more enraged than he ever was before? That isn't 'the proper logical progression there imo. I can't see how that is even possible. Then when you couple the above i.e. him not doing anything better than he ever had before, when less angry, it all doesn't jive or make sense.

Which begs the question, why didn't he do anything more impressive or look more impressive than times he was supposedly less angry; why did he look all sad and upset so quickly if he was supposedly angrier than we've seen? Odd, well, it's because it was artificial anger. It was being fed to him, he wasn't feeling it to his entire core of his body. Think about it, you hear somebody tell you what somebody said about you (fed visions) compared to actually hearing something that person said for yourself. One you're being told you should be angry but it's all mostly mental and supposition. the other you feel it to your core, you know it's true. It's like the difference of Hulk seeing Betty in danger. He loves her, he feels it to his inner being. How could that compare to a Hulk being fed visions to try and make him angry? It wouldn't. So I disagree with any notion that this was the angriest we've seen him and more enraged on most levels. It just doesn't jive on many levels imo.

Think about it, how much was SW feeding him those visions? How frequently? If it was just send him some visions, well that pales in comparison to a usually enraged Hulk. There's a huge difference in my view to somebody being feed visions to make them angry, as him being pissed for a legit reason. So then if it was visions here and there, how could that be the most enraged Hulk or even remotely powerful? Now if it was constant and extreme, that doesn't help either, cause then we'd be left with a Hulk extremely altered mentally. Which again, isn't a pissed Hulk nor the best Hulk. So that doesn't work. My entire issue here, is trying to use that showing to show that Hulk can be KO'd when enraged as TI was implying. You agree he wasn't enraged when KO'd, so then it seems we're just discussing the severity of the mindraped. Well that, is impossible to answer. You seem to believe it was extreme and thus a really enraged power Hulk, and I simply can't get behind that progression as I stated above. This all started with that feat being used to show Hulk can be KO'd be IM while enraged. I disagree, and I think you agree it's not valid, but then you seem to think it's analogous to a enraged Hulk.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
I didn't tell him anything but to make a ruling on the thread, now you are assuming he didn't read the thread based on what proof?

Just give up for once and take the loss ok? Is it worth 100 page thread you know you are already wrong in?

Wrong? Okay LOL. Look at these quotes. I wasn't saying the showing DOESN"T count. It does. I even said it's canon to MCU Hulk. But ONLY canon to a Hulk being mindraped. THAT is the discussion. You tried to say IM KO'd him thus he can be KO'd while pissed. I disagree with that entirely. There is a reason we have rules on these forums. There is a reason why mindraped is considered a negative to somebody fighting to the best of their abilities. As a supes fan, you should know this very well. I've seen you and others argue that Superman, even though he's being mindraped to be bloodlusted, isn't fighting to the best of their ability. Why? Because he's being mindraped, that means he's not fighting the best. Yet here, Hulk is being mindraped and you're trying to use that as proof that a normally enraged Hulk can be KO'd by Hulkbuster level punch. No way. There is a reason we have rules in place for mindrape. They aren't excused because you want it to be. I have ZERO issue with you using that as proof of what can KO'd a Hulk that was being mindraped, but then even has calmed down, sure you can use it. But to try and conflate that with a Hulk who's enraged, can never work. Isn't possible. Even without the mindrape it's still not a pissed Hulk that as KO'd. Moments before he was LITERALLY sitting on the ground almost crying and sad. Yet, you're using that to show the force required to KO a pissed Hulk? That is the discussion here, and in now way am I wrong, nor did he even rule on the discussion

Mod already made a ruling. That's it. It doesn't require pages and pages of explanation.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
You're not understanding what I'm saying. Him being mindraped invalidates the entire showing. If he was being mindraped, that means by proxy, he wasn't in control of his actions. Hulk, even when enraged has shown he is capable of thinking out there. After all, he is one of he smartest men on the planet as Banner. Granted, some of that goes out the door in his Hulk state, but he is still thinking out there to varying degrees. So when you're mindraped, and you're not in control of your thoughts or actions that ISN'T what a normal Hulk would fight like. That is what invalidates the showing. To say nothing of the fact that he had IM beat... ripped his armor to complete shreds... only through tech was IM not destroyed as he had spare parts flown in mid fight. Make no mistake though, he would've gotten owned. It was a good showing for IM and you can take a little away from that showing In Re: Hulk, but really, not all that much

BTW try and get whatever ruling you want. I'll win. Him being mindraped automatically isn't applicable to a non mindraped Hulk. Nobody is saying it didn't happen. But what is clear, is that it doesn't count for a non mindraped Hulk. Sure though, if you want to use a mindraped Hulk in a fight... it will count.

As you even see here, I said it counts. Nobodyu said it wasn't canon. What it isn't, is show of a normal Hulk fighting to the best of his abilities. Period. That is the disuccsion here. It counts, it happened. but that wasn't a normal Hulk there that can be used as an example of what a normal Hulk would fight like or what it would take to KO him

He was losing the fight before the KO.

Take it up with Imp, he made the ruling you are ignoring.

Faora and Nam-Ek win this one. Faora has her speedblitzes, Nam-Ek threw a train engine like a javelin, and they fought a foe who (again, I know certain people don't agree, but the proof is in the screen feats' puddin') is MCU Hulk's superior in Cavillman.

Only thing that can make it go in Hulk's favor is a Loki ragdoll special to destroy Faora and Nam-Ek's masks followed up by another Loki ragdoll special. I could see Hulk taking a win via knockout that way if it was 1-on-1, but it's both Kryptonians vs Banner. Banner loses while Hulk fans and comic book movie lovers like myself continue to count down the days till Thor: Ragnarok drops.

Originally posted by John Murdoch
Faora and Nam-Ek win this one. Faora has her speedblitzes, Nam-Ek threw a train engine like a javelin, and they fought a foe who (again, I know certain people don't agree, but the proof is in the screen feats' puddin') is MCU Hulk's superior in Cavillman.

Only thing that can make it go in Hulk's favor is a Loki ragdoll special to destroy Faora and Nam-Ek's masks followed up by another Loki ragdoll special. I could see Hulk taking a win via knockout that way if it was 1-on-1, but it's both Kryptonians vs Banner. Banner loses while Hulk fans and comic book movie lovers like myself continue to count down the days till Thor: Ragnarok drops.

It's not as far fetched as you believe. Just reference Hulk catching Thor's hammer in The Avengers. We all know how fast Thor can throw his hammer, Hulk caught it. Reference the ejecting fighter pilot. We know how fast those airplanes can eject the pilot... Hulk, point blank, caught the chair and the pilot. I would even reference the fight with Hulk and the IM Hulkbuster... There's a scene where Hulk appears to be a good 30 to 40 feet away.. and then almost in an instant he's right on top of IM.. exhibiting great closing distance. I think he might be able to grab a hold of them and when he does, they'll get the Loki treatment and their mask will be compromised.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
It's not as far fetched as you believe. Just reference Hulk catching Thor's hammer in The Avengers. We all know how fast Thor can throw his hammer, Hulk caught it. Reference the ejecting fighter pilot. We know how fast those airplanes can eject the pilot... Hulk, point blank, caught the chair and the pilot. I would even reference the fight with Hulk and the IM Hulkbuster... There's a scene where Hulk appears to be a good 30 to 40 feet away.. and then almost in an instant he's right on top of IM.. exhibiting great closing distance. I think he might be able to grab a hold of them and when he does, they'll get the Loki treatment and their mask will be compromised.

Those are good points, especially the fighter pilot ejection seat catch. The fight with Hulkbuster from AoU, IMO, really showcases Hulk's combat speed and just absolute frenetic, furious nature when he gets into a scrap. He's like a rabid dog. One of the things that Hulk keeps on Tony throughout the fight is pressure: he's on top of him on the ground, he's on top of him on the side of the building, he's on the top of him in the air.

Hulk can make Faora and Nam-Ek have a really tough day if he can
A) keep that insane level of pressure on them, and
B) get those masks compromised.

It really comes down to Hulk's speed, agility, strength, and fighting "style" being enough to combat Faora and Nam-Ek long enough to damage their suits and masks.

The two main issues I see:
- Both Faora and Nam-Ek, individually, have capabilities greater than Iron Man, and
- Hulk's fighting both of them as a team.

Hulk wins but Kt is a retard.

Originally posted by John Murdoch
Those are good points, especially the fighter pilot ejection seat catch. The fight with Hulkbuster from AoU, IMO, really showcases Hulk's combat speed and just absolute frenetic, furious nature when he gets into a scrap. He's like a rabid dog. One of the things that Hulk keeps on Tony throughout the fight is pressure: he's on top of him on the ground, he's on top of him on the side of the building, he's on the top of him in the air.

Hulk can make Faora and Nam-Ek have a really tough day if he can
A) keep that insane level of pressure on them, and
B) get those masks compromised.

It really comes down to Hulk's speed, agility, strength, and fighting "style" being enough to combat Faora and Nam-Ek long enough to damage their suits and masks.

The two main issues I see:
- Both Faora and Nam-Ek, individually, have capabilities greater than Iron Man, and
- Hulk's fighting both of them as a team.

Solid post man. You were fair to both sides and were using logical deduction to form your opinions on the fight could play out. We could use more posters like this around here, welcome aboard.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Solid post man. You were fair to both sides and were using logical deduction to form your opinions on the fight could play out. We could use more posters like this around here, welcome aboard.

Appreciate it, KT. I'd make a good politician I guess. John Murdoch 2020.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Solid post man. You were fair to both sides and were using logical deduction to form your opinions on the fight could play out. We could use more posters like this around here, welcome aboard. Kt trying to kiss another posters ass due to his incoherent posts and laughable reputation.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Hulk wins but Kt is a retard.

Don't mind our resident shortbus here, we all just point and laugh at him usually

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Don't mind our resident shortbus here, we all just point and laugh at him usually The same typical, boring response from one of the most incoherent men alive.

Originally posted by Robtard
Faora could solo Hulk. She's the fastest of the Kryptonians. This. She takes it alone.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
This. She takes it alone.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11112/111124037/3441652-ibefzmqcb9qe11.gif

Speed is important in a fight

I could see Hulk possibly winning one on one if he gets to smash the Kryptonian mask and overloads their senses. But even then, I'd probably still bet against him especially if it was Faora he was fighting. He stands a better chance winning against Nam-ek.

But 2 on 1, yeah I can't see him winning that one.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
This. She takes it alone.

Nah, she gets the Loki treatment

Originally posted by Robtard
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11112/111124037/3441652-ibefzmqcb9qe11.gif

Speed is important in a fight

Enhanced reaction times and perception go a lot further than normal humans being unable to react. Couple that with an exploitable weakness, that will matter even more. Feat showing Hulk shouldn't have too much issue reacting to the feat posted. The pilot was likely traveling faster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gg-s_4wUgPo

Originally posted by FrothByte
I could see Hulk possibly winning one on one if he gets to smash the Kryptonian mask and overloads their senses. But even then, I'd probably still bet against him especially if it was Faora he was fighting. He stands a better chance winning against Nam-ek.

But 2 on 1, yeah I can't see him winning that one.

Nah, they both lose one v one, and convincingly

Nope, Loki was just standing there.

Hulk could never put down Thor or Hulkbuster even when bloodlusted. And your arguement has failed this entire time.

Do you ever think about these things, if you apply the same logic you try and use in the Ozy vs WS thread, that same logic here says Faora wins convincingly.

You said over and over, Ozy was faster then WS. Faora is no doubt faster then Hulk.

You have beaten yourself really.

She's no doubt faster you say? Based on what? Her blitzing normal humans? Yeah I'd hope she'd appear faster. Yet even in THAT scene Hulk reacted to somebody moving even faster in the fighter pilot ejection scene. Further, we know Thor can throw his hammer at light speed. However, let's say it was far less than let when he threw it at Hulk, cool, that is still faster than she was moving to blitz those Soldiers... Hulk caught the Hammer... thus was able to react to it.

His fight with Thor was never finished, so your theory of him being unable to put him down is sorely lacking context. Same with the IM situation, which again isn't valid to a non mindraped Hulk.. again, the fight was interrupted and Hulk was calming down before he was KO'd. Further, even in that fight, Hulk would've taken out IM if not for him dropping extra parts to replace the ones Hulk had destroyed. That isn't typical for IM.

Point is, Hulk has feats reacting to the best speed movement shown by Faora. In STARK contrast, WS never showed any feats on the level of Ozy's speed. Which again, is the point. I'm curious though, if we take your argument to its conclusion, then you'd be saying Ozy beats WS correct? You're saying I defeated my own argument here, so by proxy that would mean, if Faora can beat Hulk based on speed... Ozy beats WS according to you... Hmmmm

It has nothing to do with her blitzing humans, she was blitzing Superman. Anything else you going to ignore, or do we need another mod ruling? Every person in this thread has said you are wrong. Or is this another time where you are smarter then everyone else?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Enhanced reaction times and perception go a lot further than normal humans being unable to react. Couple that with an exploitable weakness, that will matter even more. Feat showing Hulk shouldn't have too much issue reacting to the feat posted. The pilot was likely traveling faster.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gg-s_4wUgPo

She's still moving at super-human speeds, regardless.

I'd also argue that catching inanimate objects (hammer and chair) moving in a singular direction towards you is easier than catching something that can think and adjust their direction. Difference between catching say a fly and a small fast moving object coming towards you.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
It has nothing to do with her blitzing humans, she was blitzing Superman. Anything else you going to ignore, or do we need another mod ruling? Every person in this thread has said you are wrong. Or is this another time where you are smarter then everyone else?

I'm not sure if reading comprehension is the issue here, or math, but you should recheck your numbers if you think everybody disagreed with me. Further, and more importantly, I'm not sure you know what a speed blitz is... Let's examine the fight you're referring to. The first action his her rushing him with a punch/shove... Problem here is.. that isn't a speed blitz, he wasn't even looking at her. Second move, she dodges a rush from him but doesn't counter but instead talks. Again, not a speed blitz. The next move, Superman rushes her and throws a normal looking punch speed wise.. she blocks and counters him. Next, Superman tries to bulrush her, she again dodges and grabs him and slams him. None of that is a true speed blitz. She doesn't attack him with her speed that he is unable to react to. He attacks her, she dodges and counters. So while she might have been able to speed blitz him, she doesn't actually do so.

I'm asking again, which speed feats of Faora, when attacking someone, was she moving faster than the fighter pilot being ejected and the Hammer toss feat? Which sequence?

Recheck my numbers? Name one person in the thread that agrees with you besides Quan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Hulk wins but Kt is a retard.

Originally posted by Robtard
She's still moving at super-human speeds, regardless.

I'd also argue that catching inanimate objects (hammer and chair) moving in a singular direction towards you is easier than catching something that can think and adjust their direction. Difference between catching say a fly and a small fast moving object coming towards you.

Problem is, he's shown he can react to speed. If he can perceive it, then he can react to it. It can be moving in all directions, if he can perceive it, he can perceive it. Also, we'd still be left with how faora has shown to use her speed. In almost every instance, it was direct line speed. It wasn't moving all over the place at a target. The biggest thing here, that can't be gotten around is, Faora has an exploitable weakness and Hulk will have zero issue causing damage to the mask. Once he gets a hold of her, it's loki treatment time.

Thor's hammer toss means he is moving faster then Faora..what on earth are you smoking?? The hammer was't moving at bullet speed, it was barely moving at anything that would be called super speed.

So you are lying as usual..how about you stop lying and start debating off facts.

advsN-DfY2k

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Problem is, he's shown he can react to speed. If he can perceive it, then he can react to it. It can be moving in all directions, if he can perceive it, he can perceive it. Also, we'd still be left with how faora has shown to use her speed. In almost every instance, it was direct line speed. It wasn't moving all over the place at a target. The biggest thing here, that can't be gotten around is, Faora has an exploitable weakness and Hulk will have zero issue causing damage to the mask. Once he gets a hold of her, it's loki treatment time.

Cause clearly when he got ahold of Thor, it really did anything to him..again you are lying.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Recheck my numbers? Name one person in the thread that agrees with you besides Quan.

You explicitly proved your own post wrong. You said NOONE agrees with me. That was blatantly false, just as my post illustrated. The new gentleman, John M, also could see Hulk winning. Froth, said it's possible for Hulk to win based on Mask exploitation, said this was a good point and it was possible. He also says, he'd likely still give the team the win, but it wasn't a blanket disagreement with me. That is only what I can remember, but it's still more than the zero you claimed.

Like you claimed Thors hammer was moving at some awesome speed and that proved he could beat faora by catching a slow moving hammer?

Back to your old tricks as usual, take everything everyone else says like a surgical strike while vastly exaggerating your own claims.

He could never put down Thor, or Hulkbuster and couldn't even KO Loki who wasn't even trying to fight back.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Thor's hammer toss means he is moving faster then Faora..what on earth are you smoking?? The hammer was't moving at bullet speed, it was barely moving at anything that would be called super speed.

So you are lying as usual..how about you stop lying and start debating off facts.

advsN-DfY2k

Wasn't moving at bullet speed even... based on what are you claiming this? Prove it. I'm going to love watch this. Before you even try and talk about how it looks... I'd be careful with that line of logic... I'll then easily counter said faulty logic and post clips of Superman vs. Faora, Nam and Zod.. Clearly demonstrating they were mostly punching at human level speed. This is especially true in the Zod vs. Superman fight. We see humans perceiving the fight just fine. They "appeared" to be fighting at human level speed. I've often sided with they were most likely moving much faster than human level speed. The director wants us to see the action, thus he's going to show the fight and punches. If he did it at real speed, we'd see nothing. Now, by all means, dig your Superman grave here and tell me the Thor hammer "appeared" to be moving slower than a bullet... ready set go

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Further, we know Thor can throw his hammer at light speed.

Prove he can throw his hammer at light speed.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Like you claimed Thors hammer was moving at some awesome speed and that proved he could beat faora by catching a slow moving hammer?

Back to your old tricks as usual, take everything everyone else says like a surgical strike while vastly exaggerating your own claims.

He could never put down Thor, or Hulkbuster and couldn't even KO Loki who wasn't even trying to fight back.

Actually if you read my post, I was VERY clear. Thor has been shown, in the movies, to be able to throw his hammer incredibly fast. In comics, he can throw his hammer at lightspeed. What I said is, Thor has been shown to be able to throw his hammer at great speed, NOW let's say it was far slower than that, it would still be faster than Faora was moving against those soldiers. That is what I said. I never quantified it, and I even said it could be far less than lightspeed, and it's still faster than Faora was moving.

Prove he throws it faster then bullets. Acting like that throw is faster then Faora's reactions is laughable. You just lost.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Wasn't moving at bullet speed even... based on what are you claiming this? Prove it. I'm going to love watch this. Before you even try and talk about how it looks... I'd be careful with that line of logic... I'll then easily counter said faulty logic and post clips of Superman vs. Faora, Nam and Zod.. Clearly demonstrating they were mostly punching at human level speed. This is especially true in the Zod vs. Superman fight. We see humans perceiving the fight just fine. They "appeared" to be fighting at human level speed. I've often sided with they were most likely moving much faster than human level speed. The director wants us to see the action, thus he's going to show the fight and punches. If he did it at real speed, we'd see nothing. Now, by all means, dig your Superman grave here and tell me the Thor hammer "appeared" to be moving slower than a bullet... ready set go

Still waiting on you to prove this claim. How do you want this? Please tell me it "appears" to be moving slower than a bullet as you claimed.

Because of the time it took to go from thor to hulk.

Proved

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Prove he throws it faster then bullets. Acting like that throw is faster then Faora's reactions is laughable. You just lost.

You made the claim it was slower than a bullet... I'm waiting for your proof.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Because of the time it took to go from thor to hulk.

Proved

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Thor's hammer toss means he is moving faster then Faora..what on earth are you smoking?? The hammer was't moving at bullet speed, it was barely moving at anything that would be called super speed.

So you are lying as usual..how about you stop lying and start debating off facts.

advsN-DfY2k

This was your claim. Now prove it was moving slower than a bullet and was at NOTHING we'd call super speed as you claim

Because of the time it took to go from thor to hulk.

Proved

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial


Cool, then Superman fights at human level speed. See how that works. I've have tons of clips showing him punching like a normal human would and normal human speed. So you're saying what it appears to be to the viewing audience is what we go by. Cool. I told you this wouldn't go well for your favorite character.

Further, by your own logic here, you're claiming Ozy does in fact beat WS based on speed. I agree.

You made the claim that hammer toss was faster then a bullet, its on your to prove it.

Cap is my favorite character, are we talking about Captain America here?

Incorrect, let me explain how debating works, if I make a claim I can either support said claim with evidence or I don't. Now, if you DISPUTE said claim, and make a claim about what it is REALLY showing, than that part is up to YOU to prove.

1. I claim it was moving at this speed - needs proof
2. You claim no it was moving slower than a bullet - needs proof

There is this common misconception that only the first needs to be proven, that is blatantly false. It would be like me claiming the death penalty is more costly than just keeping them in jail forever. That is something I would need numbers for to try and prove it. If they opposing side goes, no, it's actually more costing to keep them in jail than to execute them... So that is still your argument to prove.

So tell me, what proof do you have that it was moving slower than a bullet?

Screen feats.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Problem is, he's shown he can react to speed. If he can perceive it, then he can react to it. It can be moving in all directions, if he can perceive it, he can perceive it. Also, we'd still be left with how faora has shown to use her speed. In almost every instance, it was direct line speed. It wasn't moving all over the place at a target. The biggest thing here, that can't be gotten around is, Faora has an exploitable weakness and Hulk will have zero issue causing damage to the mask. Once he gets a hold of her, it's loki treatment time.

I'm not saying he'd absolutely unable to hit her, it's just going to be hard and he'll he taking a lot more hits, wearing him down.

I'd also argue that just because Hulk was able to ragdoll Loki, doesn't mean he'll be able to do the same to Faora. She's stronger than Loki.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Screen feats.

So you can't prove your claim that it was moving slower than a bullet. Cool

Screen feats prove that the distance it traveled and time it took, it was moving slower then 2500 feet per second. Way slower.

Now prove it was moving faster the 2500 fps.

Come on, dude. We can easily see the hammer flipping end-over-end, it's clearly not moving like a bullet, even a slower bullet.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
You made the claim it was slower than a bullet... I'm waiting for your proof. Wait did you just ask someone else for proof ?

Kt you can't be serious since you've been unable to back any of your claims. You have zero credibility.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Incorrect, let me explain how debating works, if I make a claim I can either support said claim with evidence or I don't. Now, if you DISPUTE said claim, and make a claim about what it is REALLY showing, than that part is up to YOU to prove.

1. I claim it was moving at this speed - needs proof
2. You claim no it was moving slower than a bullet - needs proof

There is this common misconception that only the first needs to be proven, that is blatantly false. It would be like me claiming the death penalty is more costly than just keeping them in jail forever. That is something I would need numbers for to try and prove it. If they opposing side goes, no, it's actually more costing to keep them in jail than to execute them... So that is still your argument to prove.

So tell me, what proof do you have that it was moving slower than a bullet? Irony since you've been unable to prove a claim in all your years. You're a massive hypocrite highlighted by this thread. In one thread speed matters in this thread it doesn't at all. At least try and least try to appear intelligent. Granted we know you better than that but please for your own dignitys sake do something.

Originally posted by Robtard
I'm not saying he'd absolutely unable to hit her, it's just going to be hard and he'll he taking a lot more hits, wearing him down.

I'd also argue that just because Hulk was able to ragdoll Loki, doesn't mean he'll be able to do the same to Faora. She's stronger than Loki.

Don't disagree with most of this. I think she would be landing more on him... I just saw nothing that would indicate to me it would take him out. Normal humans weren't even killed by her punches. We see a few of them moving later. The punches she hit superman with, didn't put him down. Now we don't need to get into a durability argument between Hulk and Superman, as that has been done to death... but suffice to say... I believe Hulk could take these hits and keep coming. I agree she'd land more, but honestly, he'd land some as well and his blows sill do more damage.

I agree she's stronger than Loki, problem is, this isn't a bench press contest or a tug of war. Once somebody grabs a hold of her, especially somebody much bigger than her and a beast.. her strength is virtually nullified. He could likely wrap his entire hand around her body, it will be tough for her strength to come into play there and stop him from slamming her. It's the nature of the move that nullifies her strength to some degree. That is what I'm saying.

As I said earlier, I think he can win, but it all depends on how he deals with her really. He'll take Nam with little issue imo. If Faora fights smart, she could possible wear him down. Problem with her is, she doesn't fight smart and using tactics.. she goes right at them head on. That isn't the way to beat Hulk. People don't beat Hulk in a long drawn out fight.

Originally posted by Robtard
Come on, dude. We can easily see the hammer flipping end-over-end, it's clearly not moving like a bullet, even a slower bullet.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Normal humans weren't even killed by her punches. We see a few of them moving later.

Where do we see this? Or another one of your lies?

UkK7_FsJE7Q

Originally posted by Robtard
Come on, dude. We can easily see the hammer flipping end-over-end, it's clearly not moving like a bullet, even a slower bullet.

That's the problem, again you're going by what the AUDIENCE perceives. It doesn't always work that way. As I illustrated numerous times, by that logic, Superman punches at human level speed. I can visually see all the punches, most look human level. I don't think you consider him to be punching at that speed, yet here, you go strictly by how it appears? That's called a double standard my friend. I can cite numerous examples of a bullet being visually shown in a movie... does that mean it was much slower than a normal bullet? Of course not, it simply means the director wanted us to see to bullet for visual effect. When we see Ozy catch the bullet... we see his arm move.. if the director was trying to shoot it at real time... we'd see nothing but an absolute blur. Instead he wanted us to see it. This is a common theme in movies, happens all the time and I know you're aware of that, I'm just unclear why you're ignoring it.

Ok so no proof the hammer was moving 2500 feet per second. And no, we don't see a blur, Stop trying to make this about Ozy, another one of your failed arguments.

Didn't Kt cite comic books a trollish move done by another troll LoM. The guy is a joke who has no common sense or credibility.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That's the problem, again you're going by what the AUDIENCE perceives. It doesn't always work that way. As I illustrated numerous times, by that logic, Superman punches at human level speed. I can visually see all the punches, most look human level. I don't think you consider him to be punching at that speed, yet here, you go strictly by how it appears? That's called a double standard my friend. I can cite numerous examples of a bullet being visually shown in a movie... does that mean it was much slower than a normal bullet? Of course not, it simply means the director wanted us to see to bullet for visual effect. When we see Ozy catch the bullet... we see his arm move.. if the director was trying to shoot it at real time... we'd see nothing but an absolute blur. Instead he wanted us to see it. This is a common theme in movies, happens all the time and I know you're aware of that, I'm just unclear why you're ignoring it.

Don't think I've ever argued that film Superman punched at super-speed when it wasn't implicitly shown via SFX, be it him moving at a blur or using slow-mo to illustrate what he's doing to viewer, or even heavily implied that he could. Hell, I don't even give him Faora's fighting speed, even though he should technically have it.

I don't believe Whedon intended for us to believe Mjolnir was moving faster or as fast as a bullet in that scene. I believe the speed we see the hammer moving is the speed intended. As it and Hulk are CGI, they could have made it differently, it that were the intention.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Where do we see this? Or another one of your lies?

UkK7_FsJE7Q

Post the entire clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsqAJKFc59w

Reference points 2:24 ish and then later 3:07... You see brief images of a few faces, and these are the guys Faora disposes of. Then, I can't find the clip, where the soldiers find superman coming out from behind the Train... and they say he's not their enemy. One guy looks the same, and possibly another. That is what I'm referring to.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Don't disagree with most of this. I think she would be landing more on him... I just saw nothing that would indicate to me it would take him out. Normal humans weren't even killed by her punches. We see a few of them moving later. The punches she hit superman with, didn't put him down. Now we don't need to get into a durability argument between Hulk and Superman, as that has been done to death... but suffice to say... I believe Hulk could take these hits and keep coming. I agree she'd land more, but honestly, he'd land some as well and his blows sill do more damage.

I agree she's stronger than Loki, problem is, this isn't a bench press contest or a tug of war. Once somebody grabs a hold of her, especially somebody much bigger than her and a beast.. her strength is virtually nullified. He could likely wrap his entire hand around her body, it will be tough for her strength to come into play there and stop him from slamming her. It's the nature of the move that nullifies her strength to some degree. That is what I'm saying.

As I said earlier, I think he can win, but it all depends on how he deals with her really. He'll take Nam with little issue imo. If Faora fights smart, she could possible wear him down. Problem with her is, she doesn't fight smart and using tactics.. she goes right at them head on. That isn't the way to beat Hulk. People don't beat Hulk in a long drawn out fight.

Hulk was injured by Hulkbuster's punches, I believe it's within reason Faora's Kryptonian strength (eg easily tearing Kryptonian ship metal) will both harm and wear down Hulk in time.

I'd say giving her strength, she could potentially wrestle out of Hulk's grip, should he be able to grab her in the first place, which considering her speed and martial prowess, will not be easy.

Nam would be an easier target, but he's not going down easily and he's strong enough to casually throw a train engine. We've seem them fight smart, when tag-teaming Superman.

Kt is doing a very poor job of articulating his points.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Post the entire clip.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsqAJKFc59w

Reference points 2:24 ish and then later 3:07... You see brief images of a few faces, and these are the guys Faora disposes of. Then, I can't find the clip, where the soldiers find superman coming out from behind the Train... and they say he's not their enemy. One guy looks the same, and possibly another. That is what I'm referring to.

And you think those are the same people?

After being punched in the face and hurled into a pile of dead meat and then a missile torching the whole area?

The clip you posted doesn't even have her putting them all down..the clip you posted is before she took the soldiers down.

Nice of you to ignore the clip I posted of her one shotting them all, and you post a clip of them before it actually happened.

Again you got caught lying.

Originally posted by Robtard
Don't think I've ever argued that film Superman punched at super-speed when it wasn't implicitly shown via SFX, be it him moving at a blur or using slow-mo to illustrate what he's doing to viewer, or even heavily implied that he could. Hell, I don't even give him Faora's fighting speed, even though he should technically have it.

I don't believe Whedon intended for us to believe Mjolnir was moving faster or as fast as a bullet in that scene. I believe the speed we see the hammer moving is the speed intended. As it and Hulk are CGI, they could have made it differently, it that were the intention.

That defies logic though. how would superman only be able to punch at human level speeds? To me, it's a common theme in movies for us to see things we likely shouldn't. I take the side of superman should clearly be able to fight at faster speeds than human level perception. My view is, logic tells me he can, and he likely was in those scenes. However, much like in other movies, the director wants us to see the fights.. we pay to see the fights. If he did everything at real time or real speed we'd see nothing. A prefect example of this is superman flying. We VISUALLY see him flying and can perceive it. Normal humans in the movie even can perceive it as we're shown. Yet we know, if he's really flying as fast as he should be going.. we'd see nothing or a blur. Yet in almost his flight scenes we see him flying very clearly. By the logic of only going by what we visually see, he's vastly slower than a bullet. Which again, is my point, what they want us to see isn't always real time.

Originally posted by Robtard
Hulk was injured by Hulkbuster's punches, I believe it's within reason Faora's Kryptonian strength (eg easily tearing Kryptonian ship metal) will both harm and wear down Hulk in time.

I'd say giving her strength, she could potentially wrestle out of Hulk's grip, should he be able to grab her in the first place, which considering her speed and martial prowess, will not be easy.

Nam would be an easier target, but he's not going down easily and he's strong enough to casually throw a train engine. We've seem them fight smart, when tag-teaming Superman.

I like KT's "idea" that Hulk fights smart, but the Kryptonians don't

Such blatant lies and bias and misrepresenting

Kt is getting exposed. Kt needs to quit kmc because he is awful at debating without backing a single claim.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That defies logic though. how would superman only be able to punch at human level speeds? To me, it's a common theme in movies for us to see things we likely shouldn't. I take the side of superman should clearly be able to fight at faster speeds than human level perception. My view is, logic tells me he can, and he likely was in those scenes. However, much like in other movies, the director wants us to see the fights.. we pay to see the fights. If he did everything at real time or real speed we'd see nothing. A prefect example of this is superman flying. We VISUALLY see him flying and can perceive it. Normal humans in the movie even can perceive it as we're shown. Yet we know, if he's really flying as fast as he should be going.. we'd see nothing or a blur. Yet in almost his flight scenes we see him flying very clearly. By the logic of only going by what we visually see, he's vastly slower than a bullet. Which again, is my point, what they want us to see isn't always real time.

Prove the hammer was moving at 2500 feet per second which the the average speed of a bullet.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
And you think those are the same people?

After being punched in the face and hurled into a pile of dead meat and then a missile torching the whole area?

The clip you posted doesn't even have her putting them all down..the clip you posted is before she took the soldiers down.

Nice of you to ignore the clip I posted of her one shotting them all, and you post a clip of them before it actually happened.

Again you got caught lying.

Here we go again, clownshoes maneuver 101. You posted showing NOTHING of what I referenced. You were proven false again actually. The clip I posted does show their faces. You don't see their faces when she one shots...YOU DO see some of their faces in the CLIPS I POSTED. Those were the same soldiers going after her. Look at the time stamps. Look at the one gentleman who's face you can clearly see.. pudgy white dude..... She then disposes of them. Then fast forward to the clip of him coming from behind the train and them pointing guns at superman. Looks like the same face. I'm unclear if this is a reading comprehension issue or what is going on here. You clips was pitifully bad, and didn't even reference the scenes I posted, yet in a clownshoes maneuver, you go... look I the clip I posted you don't see them LOL. jesus.

Caught you in a lie, now you mad. The clip you posted is before the fight. End of story.

Kt continues to embarrass himself and show he can't follow along in a film.

KT's argument in a nutshell. "Faora can't kill humans, so she can't hurt the Hulk."

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That defies logic though. how would superman only be able to punch at human level speeds? To me, it's a common theme in movies for us to see things we likely shouldn't. I take the side of superman should clearly be able to fight at faster speeds than human level perception. My view is, logic tells me he can, and he likely was in those scenes. However, much like in other movies, the director wants us to see the fights.. we pay to see the fights. If he did everything at real time or real speed we'd see nothing. A prefect example of this is superman flying. We VISUALLY see him flying and can perceive it. Normal humans in the movie even can perceive it as we're shown. Yet we know, if he's really flying as fast as he should be going.. we'd see nothing or a blur. Yet in almost his flight scenes we see him flying very clearly. By the logic of only going by what we visually see, he's vastly slower than a bullet. Which again, is my point, what they want us to see isn't always real time.

Not the first time a superhero doesn't perform at maximum potential for 'reasons'; Superman is one of the greatest offenders of CIS/PIS use of powers. But PIS/CIS normally doesn't translate to MVF matches, characters fight at maximum shown potential.

But that crapfest BvS did shown Superman reacting at superhuman speeds with his hands, when he easily caught Bat's K-grenade at a close distance.

Originally posted by Robtard
Hulk was injured by Hulkbuster's punches, I believe it's within reason Faora's Kryptonian strength (eg easily tearing Kryptonian ship metal) will both harm and wear down Hulk in time.

I'd say giving her strength, she could potentially wrestle out of Hulk's grip, should he be able to grab her in the first place, which considering her speed and martial prowess, will not be easy.

Nam would be an easier target, but he's not going down easily and he's strong enough to casually throw a train engine. We've seem them fight smart, when tag-teaming Superman.

Right, and superman was able to destroy her mask by rushing into her. I'd say Hulk can generate just as much force with a punch if not more. Once the mask was exploited, a mere missile KO'd her.

I don't think he'll think her punches tickle by any means.. if given enough time, she could likely put him down. However, considering how she fights, she's going right at Hulk, and imo that is suicide for her. She can power out of the grip, but it's much more plausible she couldn't.

Originally posted by Robtard
Not the first time a superhero doesn't perform at maximum potential for 'reasons'; Superman is one of the greatest offenders of CIS/PIS use of powers. But PIS/CIS normally doesn't translate to MVF matches, characters fight at maximum shown potential.

But that crapfest BvS did shown Superman reacting at superhuman speeds with his hands, when he easily caught Bat's K-grenade at a close distance.

I understand, but again, we see Superman flying... humans see him clearly flying. Thus proving the director wasn't concerned about making it visually represent what it would look like correct? So if he doesn't do it in many instances of flight... why is it far fetched to believe he also wanted us to see the fights, but it was moving faster than human level speed?

Kt, if you want people to take you seriously cite sources to back your claims not your infantile opinion.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I understand, but again, we see Superman flying... humans see him clearly flying. Thus proving the director wasn't concerned about making it visually represent what it would look like correct? So if he doesn't do it in many instances of flight... why is it far fetched to believe he also wanted us to see the fights, but it was moving faster than human level speed?

So Faora and Namek can't fight the same way against Hulk, regardless of screen showings proving they know how to fight together.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
However, considering how she fights, she's going right at Hulk, and imo that is suicide for her.

"Faora going after Hulk is not a smart way to fight"

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
KT's argument in a nutshell. "Faora can't kill humans, so she can't hurt the Hulk."


Ps. He also can't afford designer jeans.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Caught you in a lie, now you mad. The clip you posted is before the fight. End of story.

Before the fight LMAO... Those were the SAME people she KO'd a short time later. Or did you not see the movie? I accept your concession in full. You posted the wrong clip, I posted the correct one showing what I was saying. You then covered up your eyes and ears and go... "That was before the fight" LOL WUT??? haha. She it was, and the she one shot them.. and then we see that same guy later pointing a gun a superman. Nice try though

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Right, and superman was able to destroy her mask by rushing into her. I'd say Hulk can generate just as much force with a punch if not more. Once the mask was exploited, a mere missile KO'd her.

I don't think he'll think her punches tickle by any means.. if given enough time, she could likely put him down. However, considering how she fights, she's going right at Hulk, and imo that is suicide for her. She can power out of the grip, but it's much more plausible she couldn't.

IIRC, the mask took several hits throughout the battle and was finally damaged when Superman slammed her face-first into the concrete.

Thing about the battle-masks (I covered this before using screen shots), they have three settings, fully-armoured (like we see Nam), partially-armoured (we see Faora using this at the farmhouse) and full-visual(clear). When Faora's was damaged, it was in its most vulnerable position, clear.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Before the fight LMAO... Those were the SAME people she KO'd a short time later. Or did you not see the movie? I accept your concession in full. You posted the wrong clip, I posted the correct one showing what I was saying. You then covered up your eyes and ears and go... "That was before the fight" LOL WUT??? haha. She it was, and the she one shot them.. and then we see that same guy later pointing a gun a superman. Nice try though Is this paragraph supposed to make sense ?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Before the fight LMAO... Those were the SAME people she KO'd a short time later. Or did you not see the movie? I accept your concession in full. You posted the wrong clip, I posted the correct one showing what I was saying. You then covered up your eyes and ears and go... "That was before the fight" LOL WUT??? haha. She it was, and the she one shot them.. and then we see that same guy later pointing a gun a superman. Nice try though

When you have to resort to I accept your concession already, its you who has conceded. You posted the clip of them getting off the chopper. That was before the fight.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Where do we see this? Or another one of your lies?

UkK7_FsJE7Q

No one is getting up from this. Also regardless of them being human or not, that is super speed.

Kt is taking a long time to formally concede. Just get it over with.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
So Faora and Namek can't fight the same way against Hulk, regardless of screen showings proving they know how to fight together.



"Faora going after Hulk is not a smart way to fight"

Of course they can, but I don't think that is a smart idea... They just tried to rush Superman and overwhelm him. I don't think that is a great tactic against Hulk no. I don't even think it was a good tactic against superman. They should've fought smart. Let Nam and Superman go at it.. Faora just comes in here and there to tip the scales. They weren't using their numbers as well as they could have... nor did she use her speed like she was earlier. I'd give them marginal marks as a team. It wasn't horrible, they got the job done in some respects, but it wasn't the benchmark for fighting smart like you seem to believe.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
No one is getting up from this.

Odd, because in the clip I posted, we SEE the men who go to attack her... Then we later see one of them pointing a gun at superman later. clearly indicating he did get up from that. Whether it makes sense or not, that is what we see.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Of course they can, but I don't think that is a smart idea... They just tried to rush Superman and overwhelm him. I don't think that is a great tactic against Hulk no. I don't even think it was a good tactic against superman. They should've fought smart. Let Nam and Superman go at it.. Faora just comes in here and there to tip the scales. They weren't using their numbers as well as they could have... nor did she use her speed like she was earlier. I'd give them marginal marks as a team. It wasn't horrible, they got the job done in some respects, but it wasn't the benchmark for fighting smart like you seem to believe. Nothing in this paragraph is evidentiary based and just your opinion. This isn't debating, Abe.

You ran from the hammer toss being faster then a bullet. When are you going to prove it?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Odd, because in the clip I posted, we SEE the men who go to attack her... Then we later see one of them pointing a gun at superman later. clearly indicating he did get up from that. Whether it makes sense or not, that is what we see.

The clip you posted is before she attacked them..you are assuming its the same people in the later scene. So she has enough power to punch through concrete, but when she punches humans in the face, it doesn't do anything?

Is Kt going to cite the comics again like an LoM level troll.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
When you have to resort to I accept your concession already, its you who has conceded. You posted the clip of them getting off the chopper. That was before the fight.

Do you honestly know how you look? Nobody is saying that wasn't before the fight... LOL. This is painful sometimes. It was before the fight, then those SAME people go to attack faora and get one shot. So it's entirely relevant and doesn't matter if it was before the fight. They were the same people later shown being one shot.

No, you know it's bad when you post the wrong clip and then claim victory in posting the wrong clip. That is losing the argument 101

You know you lost when you you have to lie. You are acting like that clip proves your argument?

Kt, you are the one who looks inept, moronic, and unable to back a single claim. No one respects you on the board and running from my posts also suggests cowardice so we can add that negative trait to the list.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Do you honestly know how you look? Nobody is saying that wasn't before the fight... LOL. This is painful sometimes. It was before the fight, then those SAME people go to attack faora and get one shot. So it's entirely relevant and doesn't matter if it was before the fight. They were the same people later shown being one shot.

No, you know it's bad when you post the wrong clip and then claim victory in posting the wrong clip. That is losing the argument 101

So why did you post it? This is what you do, you try and muddle the waters by going down irrelevant rants, you still have not proven Thor's hammer toss is bullet speed.

I am calling that Kt will once again log out very soon due to crumbling under the pressure

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
The clip you posted is before she attacked them..you are assuming its the same people in the later scene. So she has enough power to punch through concrete, but when she punches humans in the face, it doesn't do anything?

Are you new to movies or something man? Jesus. You act like this is the first movie you've ever seen in your life. Ever notice how people are point blank at an explosion and yet they aren't knocked down and can still hear? If that was realistic, we'd see blood coming from their ears from having their eardrums ruptured, yet we don't. We see people hit over the head with bricks, rocks, boards, you name it; yet they are still able to get up and walk way when that would likely have killed them or seriously hurt them. Look at any action hero you can think of.. do you really think they'd survive some of what we see them take in real life? Of course not. Why is this such a surprise to you? Happens all the time.

Ok thats means nothing, stick to the screen feats. And prove your claim that Thor threw his hammer at bullet speed.

Kt says this and that without any real proof. Hs the guy with the hunch he's unable to prove. The hunches change from thread to thread showing he doesn't have any semblance of objectivity just stupidity.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
So why did you post it? This is what you do, you try and muddle the waters by going down irrelevant rants, you still have not proven Thor's hammer toss is bullet speed.

What I said is, I don't know how fast it was traveling, but it's logical to assume it was traveling pretty damn fast considering what we know about Thor and Mjolnir. You claimed it was slower than a bullet and reference what we PERCEIVE. I've explicitly shown you can't only go by what we see as often times directors don't go by real time. There si no getting around this point. Who knows, maybe the director did want Thor to throw a slow hammer blow, I suppose it's possible, but that would defy logic. Why would he slow down his potential throwing power? That makes sense?

The funniest part of this debate is seeing quan try to insult-cheerlead from the corner like he usually does; this time trying to kiss-up to TI. "Be my friend, please!"

*laughing right now*

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Ok thats means nothing, stick to the screen feats. And prove your claim that Thor threw his hammer at bullet speed.

Ummm you seemed confused on how a normal human could've got up from her blows. That is what I was addressing. If you weren't so confused about things we see all the time, I wouldn't have to explain them to you. Then when I prove my point, and show these things happen all the time so you shouldn't be surprised.. you go... stick to the subject. LOL ok.

Prove your claim it was moving much slower than a bullet. I await your proof.

Originally posted by Robtard
The funniest part of this debate is seeing quan try to insult-cheerlead from the corner like he usually does; this time trying to kiss-up to TI. "Be my friend, please!"

*laughing right now* I never attack Kt for being an idiot. Oh Roberta still sore over my superior Trek knowledge. Unlike you I'm fantastic at backing my claims.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Ummm you seemed confused on how a normal human could've got up from her blows. That is what I was addressing. If you weren't so confused about things we see all the time, I wouldn't have to explain them to you. Then when I prove my point, and show these things happen all the time so you shouldn't be surprised.. you go... stick to the subject. LOL ok.

Prove your claim it was moving much slower than a bullet. I await your proof. What claims have you backed ?

Originally posted by Robtard
The funniest part of this debate is seeing quan try to insult-cheerlead from the corner like he usually does; this time trying to kiss-up to TI. "Be my friend again, please!"

*laughing right now*

So I wasn't the only person to get a laugh at of that. He's like that nerdy kid in schools who jumps up and down wanting to be picked on a kickball team... only for people to not even notice his existence cause he sucks. I think T.I. has learned from his mistakes in the past. He knows Quan is a clown and beneath him, but Quan will keep trying to win him back, and we'll all laugh at him for it.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
So I wasn't the only person to get a laugh at of that. He's like that nerdy kid in schools who jumps up and down wanting to be picked on a kickball team... only for people to not even notice his existence cause he sucks. I think T.I. has learned from his mistakes in the past. He knows Quan is a clown and beneath him, but Quan will keep trying to win him back, and we'll all laugh at him for it. Kt your points and your intelligence are being attacked here without one legitimate counter argument. What's worse is you keep writing this incoherent mega paragraphs that no one reads.


Ps. You also can't afford designer jeans.

Great so you can't win a actual argument so you go to flaming

Par for the course KT.

Bingo!!!

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Ummm you seemed confused on how a normal human could've got up from her blows. That is what I was addressing. If you weren't so confused about things we see all the time, I wouldn't have to explain them to you. Then when I prove my point, and show these things happen all the time so you shouldn't be surprised.. you go... stick to the subject. LOL ok.

Prove your claim it was moving much slower than a bullet. I await your proof.

I already gave you my proof, it was not moving anywhere close to 2500 feet per second.

KT logic, everyone else is wrong besides him. Still waiting on proof that hammer was moving anywhere near 2500 fps.

Kt is fleeing because even morons realize when they are beaten. I think it just occurred.

Hey Kt remember when you said Maul wasn't a Sith Lord.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=636205&pagenumber=1

Poor Kt it just isn't his day.

He assumes cause he says it, that makes it true. He bases his proof on his claim, he doesn't base his claim on any proof though.

Originally posted by Robtard
Come on, dude. We can easily see the hammer flipping end-over-end, it's clearly not moving like a bullet, even a slower bullet.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
KT logic, everyone else is wrong besides him. Still waiting on proof that hammer was moving anywhere near 2500 fps.

So it is a comprehension thing.. I never claimed it was moving at lightspeed. I EVEN said it can be moving far slower than that. So why would I have to prove something I never claimed.

However, you DID claim it was moving MUCH slower than a bullet. I've still yet to see proof of this. Post it.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Hey Kt remember when you said Maul wasn't a Sith Lord.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=636205&pagenumber=1

Poor Kt it just isn't his day. I want Kt to see another one of his embarrassing defeats. Next page it.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
I already gave you my proof, it was not moving anywhere close to 2500 feet per second.

That wasn't your claim... you claimed it was moving much slower than a bullet

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Great so you can't win a actual argument so you go to flaming

Par for the course KT.

Odd, Quan comes into the thread and does nothing but flame, isn't contributing to the discussion, and yet you don't say anything about flaming? Hypocrite much? Or let me guess, you've forgiven him and you two have kissed and made up.. thus you can be a hypocrite?

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That wasn't your claim... you claimed it was moving much slower than a bullet You cited the comics, dude. This is the movie forum.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
That wasn't your claim... you claimed it was moving much slower than a bullet

Because it was moving much slower then a bullet.

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Thor's hammer toss means he is moving faster then Faora..what on earth are you smoking?? The hammer was't moving at bullet speed, it was barely moving at anything that would be called super speed.

So you are lying as usual..how about you stop lying and start debating off facts.

advsN-DfY2k

Now prove it was moving slower than a bullet and nothing what we'd call super speed.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
So it is a comprehension thing.. I never claimed it was moving at lightspeed. I EVEN said it can be moving far slower than that. So why would I have to prove something I never claimed.

However, you DID claim it was moving MUCH slower than a bullet. I've still yet to see proof of this. Post it.

The proof you keep ignoring

How long does it take a bullet to travel 20ft if it's going 2500fps?

Originally posted by Time-Immemorial
Because it was moving much slower then a bullet.

Cool, so Superman can only fly slower than a bullet. Is that your claim? Good to know if it is.