Spiderman vs Midnighter

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carver9
Whos taking this?

StiltmanFTW
Midnighter makes him relive his Skip Westcott experience.

LordofBrooklyn
Both ANNIHILATE any Hulk!!!

golem370
Sounds like Midnighter takes a few encounters since Pete has no knowledge of him but would over come him eventually.

Zack M
Spider sense vs computer brain. Good fight, but I'll go with the more skilled fighter, Midnighter.

Stoic
Originally posted by golem370
Sounds like Midnighter takes a few encounters since Pete has no knowledge of him but would over come him eventually.

They have basic knowledge of each other. I think that it depends on how hard Spiderman is willing to fight. Midnighter isn't keeping up with a spider blitz attack like the one that he put on Firelord. Anything less, and Pete could be in for some trouble.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
They have basic knowledge of each other. I think that it depends on how hard Spiderman is willing to fight. Midnighter isn't keeping up with a spider blitz attack like the one that he put on Firelord. Anything less, and Pete could be in for some trouble.

He kept up with someone who was faster than Spider-Man, so I don't see why he couldn't.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
He kept up with someone who was faster than Spider-Man, so I don't see why he couldn't.

He's not keeping up with Spiderman okay so just can it. Spiderman can travel in one direction and go in the exact opposite direction due to his ability to stick to most surfaces. Midnighter wouldn't be able to keep up, and Spiderman hit's really hard when he's pissed.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
He's not keeping up with Spiderman okay so just can it. Spiderman can travel in one direction and go in the exact opposite direction due to his ability to stick to most surfaces. Midnighter wouldn't be able to keep up, and Spiderman hit's really hard when he's pissed.

Yes, he can. If he can tag a speedster faster than Spider-Man, he can tag Spider-Man. Don't be silly.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
Yes, he can. If he can tag a speedster faster than Spider-Man, he can tag Spider-Man. Don't be silly.

Speedsters can't do what Spiderman does, and let's not make it seem like Spiderman is the one that lacks feats. He wins this, and quickly if he goes in serious as the intent of the OP. Midnighter is no Wolverine.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
Speedsters can't do what Spiderman does, and let's not make it seem like Spiderman is the one that lacks feats. He wins this, and quickly if he goes in serious as the intent of the OP. Midnighter is no Wolverine.

laughing out loud Midnighter already knows what Spidey is going to do before he even does it. He plays these scenarios in his battle computer a million different times, simultaneously. Wolverine doesn't have that ability.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
laughing out loud Midnighter already knows what Spidey is going to do before he even does it. He plays these scenarios in his battle computer a million different times, simultaneously. Wolverine doesn't have that ability.

Good so then he can scream as he gets what he knows is coming for him, and he's going to get it. Spidey has webs and agility over Midnighter. That's why he gets his ass beaten here.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
Good so then he can scream as he gets what he knows is coming for him, and he's going to get it. Spidey has webs and agility over Midnighter. That's why he gets his ass beaten here.

Disagree.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
Disagree.

So it's impossible for Mignighter to be hit, or webbed up and pummeled by a guy that makes the X-Men look silly. Grayson hit him. Believe you me, if Spiderman hit Midnighter, and he will hit him to be certain, it will hurt. With his agility and spider sense, he can web him up.

The difference between a speedster, and spider speed, is that he can cling to objects creating a number of blind spot openings while taking aim with his webs. In terms of abuse? He can take it. He's taken it from Venom and Carnage, Morlun, the list goes on, and on. He loses like all characters do, but in this scenario there's only one thing on his mind. Beat the crap out of Midnighter. So they are both focused to win.

I'm going with Spiderman for a healthy majority. Midnighter doesn't have the longevity, or feats. He can't compete in a feat war with Spiderman.

From the top of my head, Spiderman has KO'd the Hulk, and Firelord; took on the entire X-Men, FF, Dr. Doom, the list goes on. Speedsters skid spidey sticks and moves.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
So it's impossible for Mignighter to be hit, or webbed up and pummeled by a guy that makes the X-Men look silly. Grayson hit him. Believe you me, if Spiderman hit Midnighter, and he will hit him to be certain, it will hurt. With his agility and spider sense, he can web him up.

The difference between a speedster, and spider speed, is that he can cling to objects creating a number of blind spot openings while taking aim with his webs. In terms of abuse? He can take it. He's taken it from Venom and Carnage, Morlun, the list goes on, and on. He loses like all characters do, but in this scenario there's only one thing on his mind. Beat the crap out of Midnighter. So they are both focused to win.

I'm going with Spiderman for a healthy majority. Midnighter doesn't have the longevity, or feats. He can't compete in a feat war with Spiderman.

From the top of my head, Spiderman has KO'd the Hulk, and Firelord; took on the entire X-Men, FF, Dr. Doom, the list goes on. Speedsters skid spidey sticks and moves.

MA have hit Spidey in the past. Midnighter would kill Spidey for fun.

DarkSaint85
Here's how I see the various 'precogs' and so on (I know Fantomex isn't...).

Let's say I am thinking of a number, and am about to hold that number of fingers up, triggering a trap. If it is even, the trap springs, if odd, it wouldn't.

Spidey will know if it is odd or even. Some extreme outliers may even be able to tell me how many fingers I am about to hold up - but they are extreme. Mostly, it will warn him if the trap is going to be triggered.

Mr X will read my neural impulses, and know how many fingers I am going to hold up before I hold them up. IOW, he would have more warning .

Midnighter can't really read the future. All he knows is, he wants me to hold an odd number of fingers up. So he shoots my fingers off, leaving my index finger. Forcing me to hold an odd number of fingers up.

Fantomex will make me think I've held two fingers up and triggered the trap, when really I'm lying in a pool of my own blood.

That's the difference between all of them.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
MA have hit Spidey in the past. Midnighter would kill Spidey for fun.

Midnighter wouldn't touch Spiderman physically if Spiderman didn't want to be touched due to his longer reach advantage with the webs. Sure he can see it coming, he knows its coming, but he just wasn't able to duck in time. And Midnighter would take a few of those before being trapped by impact webbing, turned upside down all less than 300 lbs of him, and used as a wrecking ball against the wall. He'd see all of this happening and would have no say in the outcome.

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Here's how I see the various 'precogs' and so on (I know Fantomex isn't...).

Let's say I am thinking of a number, and am about to hold that number of fingers up, triggering a trap. If it is even, the trap springs, if odd, it wouldn't.

Spidey will know if it is odd or even. Some extreme outliers may even be able to tell me how many fingers I am about to hold up - but they are extreme. Mostly, it will warn him if the trap is going to be triggered.

Mr X will read my neural impulses, and know how many fingers I am going to hold up before I hold them up. IOW, he would have more warning .

Midnighter can't really read the future. All he knows is, he wants me to hold an odd number of fingers up. So he shoots my fingers off, leaving my index finger. Forcing me to hold an odd number of fingers up.

Fantomex will make me think I've held two fingers up and triggered the trap, when really I'm lying in a pool of my own blood.

That's the difference between all of them.

Thank you. That was really informative brother.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
Midnighter wouldn't touch Spiderman physically if he Spiderman didn't want to be touched due to his longer reach advantage with the webs. Sure he can see it coming, he knows its coming, but he just wasn't able to duck in time. And Midnighter would take a few of those before being trapped by impact webbing, turned upside down all less than 300 lbs of him, and used as a wrecking ball against the wall. He'd see all of this happening and would have no say in the outcome.

He's fast enough to easily do it.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Stoic
Thank you. That was really informative brother.

Am sure some Spidey experts will tell me of the time he totally knew not only the direction a bullet came, but its calibre and what the sniper had for breakfast.

But mostly, it tells him he's about to get shot.

Of course, this is my opinion. So take with a pinch of salt. but glad it helps.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
He's fast enough to easily do it.

He is and he isn't. Spiderman can simply do more things than Midnighter. He has him on nearly every front. He could gum up his feet eventually slowing him down, The movement, strength, reach, agility (due to tactile abilities) all go to Spiderman. Midnighter is a more technical fighter in one respect, but it means nothing at larger distances.

He's going to wind up getting his face and head macked up.

Stoic
http://i.imgur.com/u9WnUxc.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/c2aCsJy.jpg

This shows his agility, and that he can be caught.

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-57f0953203113b6a760bef17a60b98f7?convert_to_webp=true

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
He is and he isn't. Spiderman can simply do more things than Midnighter. He has him on nearly every front. He could gum up his feet eventually slowing him down, The movement, strength, reach, agility (due to tactile abilities) all go to Spiderman. Midnighter is a more technical fighter in one respect, but it means nothing at larger distances.

He's going to wind up getting his face and head macked up.

I respect Spidey, but he's outmatched. Mids battle computer will give him the edge and he has the stats to compete.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Stoic
http://i.imgur.com/u9WnUxc.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/c2aCsJy.jpg

This shows his agility, and that he can be caught.

https://qph.ec.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-57f0953203113b6a760bef17a60b98f7?convert_to_webp=true

Problem is that computer.

Mids will make him dance around, forcing him to jump where he wants him to jump. And will be hitting him. That Spidey Sense will be working against him.

JayDaDon
Originally posted by Zack M
He kept up with someone who was faster than Spider-Man, so I don't see why he couldn't.

So has everyone in DC. These arguments REALLY need to be taken with a grain of salt.

JayDaDon
Originally posted by Zack M
MA have hit Spidey in the past. Midnighter would kill Spidey for fun.

MA is no longer a weakness for Spidey since he learned Spider-fu. And since Slott hasn't come close to leaving spider-man since he introduced it I KNOW that still holds true lol

Zack M
Originally posted by JayDaDon
So has everyone in DC. These arguments REALLY need to be taken with a grain of salt.

Not the way Midnighter did. He took it head on.

golem370
Spider-Man is a badass not only physically but very smart good at using his environment in a fight. Spider-Man has dodged gun fire and laser fire his reaction time is superior to gun fire which is what between 900-2000 feet per second. Does Midnighter's agility and reflexes match his computing speed?

cdtm
Originally posted by JayDaDon
So has everyone in DC. These arguments REALLY need to be taken with a grain of salt.

And in Marvel.

In fact, so has Peter himself (Speed Demon..)

leonidas
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Here's how I see the various 'precogs' and so on (I know Fantomex isn't...).

Let's say I am thinking of a number, and am about to hold that number of fingers up, triggering a trap. If it is even, the trap springs, if odd, it wouldn't.

Spidey will know if it is odd or even. Some extreme outliers may even be able to tell me how many fingers I am about to hold up - but they are extreme. Mostly, it will warn him if the trap is going to be triggered.

Mr X will read my neural impulses, and know how many fingers I am going to hold up before I hold them up. IOW, he would have more warning .

Midnighter can't really read the future. All he knows is, he wants me to hold an odd number of fingers up. So he shoots my fingers off, leaving my index finger. Forcing me to hold an odd number of fingers up.

Fantomex will make me think I've held two fingers up and triggered the trap, when really I'm lying in a pool of my own blood.

That's the difference between all of them.

i mostly agree with spidey--only one of the options would indicate danger so he would know which was held up, but not UNTIL it was held up...then he is the fastest on the list and so can react to whatever the danger is most quickly.

x sounds reasonable. cassie would do likewise.

i don't agree with nighter--nighter wouldn't care which option was held up because his computer would already have run 1000s of solutions to BOTH scenarios. nighter would then simply follow the computer's plan depending on what happened. at least authority nighter would have. but i thought there was something about purely random situations that were impossible to compute though at one point. maybe digi knows. if dcnu nighter works differently then you may very well be right.

fantomex thumb up

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by leonidas
i mostly agree with spidey--only one of the options would indicate danger so he would know which was held up, but not UNTIL it was held up...then he is the fastest on the list and so can react to whatever the danger is most quickly.

x sounds reasonable. cassie would do likewise.

i don't agree with nighter--nighter wouldn't care which option was held up because his computer would already have run 1000s of solutions to BOTH scenarios. nighter would then simply follow the computer's plan depending on what happened. at least authority nighter would have. but i thought there was something about purely random situations that were impossible to compute though at one point. maybe digi knows. if dcnu nighter works differently then you may very well be right.

fantomex thumb up

DCnU Mids goes up against Deadshot. Runs millions of scenarios, to find the ONE outcome he likes - even if it means getting shot, just so he can get closer to Deadshot.

Then makes it happen.

https://lowbrowcomics.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/img_9993.jpg
https://lowbrowcomics.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/img_9994.jpg

IOW, he does whatever it takes to make sure the outcome where he walks away the winner, happens.

cdtm
And in many, if not most cases, that should be enough.

Like Martian Manhunter proved, even the BC can't account for certain random factors. (And imo, there "should" be inwinnable scenario's, but listening to MN proponents it kind of sounds like he has Batman level luck keeping that from happening.

You know, like how Superman could have flash frozen Batman in every encounter, and just never does..)

JayDaDon
Sounds dangerously close to a no limits fallacy...

DarkSaint85
He has failed before.

He failed against Afterthought, a guy who could see 5 seconds into the future.

He got clocked by Dick Grayson, who had Hypnos implants (similar to Fantomex).

He was clocked by Harley Quinn, after Parasite drained his HF.

So no, not infallible. It can be fooled, it can be bypassed.

DarkSaint85
However, this is what happens with Afterthought (the guy who can see 5 seconds into the future) when they had round 2:

https://s5.postimg.org/jwpf7v9qv/29_15.jpg
https://s5.postimg.org/5rjm620pj/29_16.jpg

He again forces the situation, to get hit where he wants to get hit. In this thread, Spidey will jump around and land where Midnighter wants him to land, punch where he wants to be punched etc etc. The BC doesn't predict the future - it tells him the steps needed to get to a winning conclusion.

Digi
I've had this debate numerous times. I side with Spider-Man, but intelligent arguments exist for both.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Digi
I've had this debate numerous times.

You don't know a thing about current nighter, though.

krisblaze
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You don't know a thing about current nighter, though.

thumb up

Digi hasn't read a book in 5 years. Embarrassing.

StiltmanFTW
What worse, he thinks that photos of dogs molested by mungi are going to appeal to us...

leonidas
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
DCnU Mids goes up against Deadshot. Runs millions of scenarios, to find the ONE outcome he likes - even if it means getting shot, just so he can get closer to Deadshot.

Then makes it happen.

https://lowbrowcomics.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/img_9993.jpg
https://lowbrowcomics.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/img_9994.jpg

IOW, he does whatever it takes to make sure the outcome where he walks away the winner, happens.

i'd disagree with what you're saying happens there. he says there is ONLY one way to make lawton scream. that IS what he does--or rather his computer does. the computer runs millions of scenarios and comes up with solutions. if there IS only one, it finds it. had there been a 1000 ways to beat deadshot he would have chosen (most likely) the most EFFICIENT way to win and lured deadshot into the moves that his computer predicts are necessary to reach that end. same with your fingers scenario--his computer would have come up with scenarios that covered what if 1 OR 2 comes up and assigned solutions for either and he would act them out, choosing which scenario he wanted. sometimes, in the past, he would choose scenarios that were the most cruel, or especially cruel to reach an end he could have reached in a different way.

but yes, there are absolutely unwinnable scenarios. lock him in a room with superman and his computer wouldn't be able to figure out a way to win unless he had an effective weapon within reach. it's not no limits--he is restricted by his own physical limits, which is why, in a ring, with standard gear, i'd take spiderman more often than not in this. nighter would have nothing special to call into play but his own abilities and spidey outclasses him physically in every way. put them out in the open city and i think nighter has a better chance.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by leonidas
lock him in a room with superman and his computer wouldn't be able to figure out a way to win

Only if it happens in America.

Outside of it, Superdouche is a pathetic z-lister.

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
DCnU Mids goes up against Deadshot. Runs millions of scenarios, to find the ONE outcome he likes - even if it means getting shot, just so he can get closer to Deadshot.

Then makes it happen.

https://lowbrowcomics.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/img_9993.jpg
https://lowbrowcomics.files.wordpress.com/2016/03/img_9994.jpg

IOW, he does whatever it takes to make sure the outcome where he walks away the winner, happens.

Except that with Spidey, the durability edge goes way up beyond Deadshot's, as does the strength. Spiderman has feats that indicate that he wouldn't have even been hit by Deadshot. Spiderman is stronger than Midnighter, and far stronger still than Deadshot in every way, and has taken hits that would crush normal humans to signify damage that he has taken, or can take. Venom, Carnage are a lot stronger than Midnighter. Spiderman in this case would be the dominant physical specimen. Unless Midnighter can pick up train cars.

The Battle computer does not nullify the Spider sense. It wrestles against it, while Spiderman physically dominates him on every other front. Deadshot is no Spiderman.

leonidas
thumb up

carver9
I didn't make this thread due to ft war because Midnighter doesn't compare at all to Spiderman in that scene. There's no competition at all if you did a ft war between the two. With hat said, let's focus on other things than that.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by carver9
With hat said, let's focus on other things than that.

Like what?

Powerset comparison?

Lipservice?

What exactly?

Digi
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
You don't know a thing about current nighter, though.

Not quite true. I've read random books and always read the stuff that interests me in the weekly Ownage postings. It's just not as regular as it once was.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
Except that with Spidey, the durability edge goes way up beyond Deadshot's, as does the strength. Spiderman has feats that indicate that he wouldn't have even been hit by Deadshot. Spiderman is stronger than Midnighter, and far stronger still than Deadshot in every way, and has taken hits that would crush normal humans to signify damage that he has taken, or can take. Venom, Carnage are a lot stronger than Midnighter. Spiderman in this case would be the dominant physical specimen. Unless Midnighter can pick up train cars.

The Battle computer does not nullify the Spider sense. It wrestles against it, while Spiderman physically dominates him on every other front. Deadshot is no Spiderman.

Midnighter will find a weak point. He did so in Martian Manhunter, Apollo, and even staggered Etrigan the Demon. Spidey would be dead.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Digi
Not quite true. I've read random books and always read the stuff that interests me in the weekly Ownage postings. It's just not as regular as it once was.

Ah, ok. So you did catch up. Damn.

Have you read his encounter with dick? shifty

carver9
Originally posted by Zack M
Midnighter will find a weak point. He did so in Martian Manhunter, Apollo, and even staggered Etrigan the Demon. Spidey would be dead.

Now name the people Spiderman has either beaten or done extremely well against. Spiderman fts are FAR better.

JayDaDon
Originally posted by Zack M
Midnighter will find a weak point. He did so in Martian Manhunter, Apollo, and even staggered Etrigan the Demon. Spidey would be dead.

If you think there's a weak point the onus should be on the poster to describe exactly how Midnighter could win.

Stoic
Originally posted by Zack M
Midnighter will find a weak point. He did so in Martian Manhunter, Apollo, and even staggered Etrigan the Demon. Spidey would be dead.

J'onn takes it because he's a masochist. There's no reason that J'onn should logically be defeated or even touched by a guy that he can mind rape while remaining intangible. Sell that to the guy up the street. Apollo wasn't going all out, and again doesn't fight like Spiderman. The same thing goes for Etrigan. The Hulk would beat the shit out of Etrigan if they ever came to blows. Firelord would give Etrigan a good fight.

Although the story was PIS, the in close beating that Spiderman gave to Firelord wasn't. He's not going to get the chance to find a weakness that would allow him to win against Spiderman, because Spiderman would be the one webbing his ass up, as he says I knew that you were going to do that as he gets macked up.

Zack M
Originally posted by Stoic
J'onn takes it because he's a masochist. There's no reason that J'onn should logically be defeated or even touched by a guy that he can mind rape while remaining intangible. Sell that to the guy up the street. Apollo wasn't going all out, and again doesn't fight like Spiderman. The same thing goes for Etrigan. The Hulk would beat the shit out of Etrigan if they ever came to blows. Firelord would give Etrigan a good fight.

Although the story was PIS, the in close beating that Spiderman gave to Firelord wasn't. He's not going to get the chance to find a weakness that would allow him to win against Spiderman, because Spiderman would be the one webbing his ass up, as he says I knew that you were going to do that as he gets macked up.

There is also nerve strikes, too. Spidey isn't going to survive this.

h1a8
Spidey wins

JayDaDon
Originally posted by Zack M
There is also nerve strikes, too. Spidey isn't going to survive this.

Spidey has martial arts knowledge himself. AND rock hard musculature, its questionable that would even work on him.

Zack M
Originally posted by JayDaDon
Spidey has martial arts knowledge himself. AND rock hard musculature, its questionable that would even work on him.

Midnighter has used it on more durable beings, such as that spider monster he faced, with the armored exoskeleton.

Scarlet315
I don't see a way that Midnighter computer could find a way against that spidey sense b/c it'll just warn Pete of midnighter a plan. It'll just be a continuous chess game btwn those two abstract abilities with spidey edging out in spades on account of his superhuman strength, speed, reflexes, agility, reaction time, spiderfu which exists in current timeline and also a suit strong and durable enough to withstand re-entry from space. What makes spiderman good is that he's no one trick pony. A fight btwn him and deathstroke would also be good b/c he doesn't have a power ring to crush, or a voice box to disable. Spideys got too many variables

Zack M
Originally posted by Scarlet315
I don't see a way that Midnighter computer could find a way against that spidey sense b/c it'll just warn Pete of midnighter a plan. It'll just be a continuous chess game btwn those two abstract abilities with spidey edging out in spades on account of his superhuman strength, speed, reflexes, agility, reaction time, spiderfu which exists in current timeline and also a suit strong and durable enough to withstand re-entry from space. What makes spiderman good is that he's no one trick pony. A fight btwn him and deathstroke would also be good b/c he doesn't have a power ring to crush, or a voice box to disable. Spideys got too many variables

His Spiderfu isn't more advance or better than Midnighter's. Midnighter is actually one of the best fighters on the planet. Spidey isn't. On top of that, Midnighter also has enhanced strength, speed, and agility. Not to mention the ability to find weak points, just like Karnak and Karate Kid.

DarkSaint85
Since the onus is on Midnighter supporters....can you hear it?

Door.

JayDaDon
Originally posted by Scarlet315
I don't see a way that Midnighter computer could find a way against that spidey sense b/c it'll just warn Pete of midnighter a plan. It'll just be a continuous chess game btwn those two abstract abilities with spidey edging out in spades on account of his superhuman strength, speed, reflexes, agility, reaction time, spiderfu which exists in current timeline and also a suit strong and durable enough to withstand re-entry from space. What makes spiderman good is that he's no one trick pony. A fight btwn him and deathstroke would also be good b/c he doesn't have a power ring to crush, or a voice box to disable. Spideys got too many variables

Forgot about the suit. It doesnt matter that much if Midnighter is a better martial artist, its no longer a weakness for Spidey. The ss being the equalizer it could come down to who's physical stats are better and Spidey gets that nod.

DarkSaint85
Why would the SS be an equaliser?

And with regards to skill....surely not!

Stoic
Skill becomes nullified by distance. This isn't going to be one of those long drawn out fights. Spidey webs him up, slows him down by impact webbing, and turns him into the human wrecking ball until he passes out. Using the door simply means that he can't deal with Spiderman and must go for BFR. Carver always removes that option, unless he's left it open. In that case Mids can win via BFR. Spidey wins everything else.

carver9
I never use bfr in my threads. Dark knows this.

Stoic
Originally posted by carver9
I never use bfr in my threads. Dark knows this.

I know, but the OP... And DS knows that it's well past the time to allowed to alter the thread's Opening Post rules.

Lizard, Rhino, Venom, Morlun, Carnage, Vulture, Green Goblin's, Hobgoblin, Firelord, Namor, X-Men, Fantastic Four, Hulk, Thunder Strike, Scorpion, Daredevil, Juggernaut just to name several of the characters that Spiderman has tangled with. I realize that people don't want to get into a feat war, but I can't, nor should anyone forget the wars that Spiderman has waged. What has Midnighter done? He's beaten up on jobbers and hacks? And Lulz at Karnak beating a serious and focused Spiderman for a majority. Karnak would be webbed up and one shot, by a serious Spiderman.

DarkSaint85
Doors do not necessarily mean BFR (even if Carver did not turn it off - silly boy).

Props to riv for inspiring me.

Here, Midnighter says that he can BFR specific body parts (in this case, kneecaps).

Doesn't have to BFR them 2 blocks away. He could open doors, and send Spidey's spine 5 meters away.

Let me explain what is happening in the following scans. Mids is allowing the Bat family use of his doors, and they are being creative with its use. Red Hood gets all cocky, and tells Midnighter 'that's how you do it' (IOW, use doors).

Midnighter retorts that if he does it, their kneecaps would be 2 blocks away.

https://s5.postimg.org/iikgqpn9z/33_03.jpg
https://s5.postimg.org/xskbxwis7/33_04.jpg
https://s5.postimg.org/3p5t5yfiv/33_05.jpg

Carver, if someone threatens to do something without actually doing it (like Surfer did with Gladiator), would you accept it?

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Doors do not necessarily mean BFR (even if Carver did not turn it off - silly boy).

Props to riv for inspiring me.

Here, Midnighter says that he can BFR specific body parts (in this case, kneecaps).

Doesn't have to BFR them 2 blocks away. He could open doors, and send Spidey's spine 5 meters away.

Let me explain what is happening in the following scans. Mids is allowing the Bat family use of his doors, and they are being creative with its use. Red Hood gets all cocky, and tells Midnighter 'that's how you do it' (IOW, use doors).

Midnighter retorts that if he does it, their kneecaps would be 2 blocks away.

https://s5.postimg.org/iikgqpn9z/33_03.jpg
https://s5.postimg.org/xskbxwis7/33_04.jpg
https://s5.postimg.org/3p5t5yfiv/33_05.jpg

Carver, if someone threatens to do something without actually doing it (like Surfer did with Gladiator), would you accept it?


Yeah, so once again, without the option of using an external device to win, Midnighter loses. Not to mention that Spidey may just be able to avoid it altogether. BFR of limbs or his entire body is his best bet. Carver turned it off though so there's that.

DarkSaint85
He's not BFRing though.

He's ripping it out of him. Like I said, he's not sending it 2 blocks away...I mean, sending it 2 feet away is enough.

carver9
Desperation. With that said, when it comes down to someone using doors to rip limbs off, this means that the other character have the advantage in straight up combat. Thanks everyone for participating in this thread. I finally got the answer I needed. In a physical confrontation, Spiderman destroys 10/10.

DarkSaint85
Make the thread, it's not my fault you made a whack thread.

If you need to handicap one side, go for it. Just shows that Midnighter, as written, is too much for many streets without proper powersets.

Edit: Next thread: Midnighter with hands tied vs X. Midnighter with no legs vs Panther. Midnighter with no fighting skills vs Shang Chi.

Then you can claim whatever you like smile

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
He's not BFRing though.

He's ripping it out of him. Like I said, he's not sending it 2 blocks away...I mean, sending it 2 feet away is enough.

In that case, he'd end up defeating many characters outside of his weight class, but it still does not answer the question of who would win using their typical weaponry, and physical tools. Heck Midnighter can say Door to Black Adam, and cut his head off if it appears in the right place. So, sure that is a viable win, but an incredibly cheap one.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Make the thread, it's not my fault you made a whack thread.

If you need to handicap one side, go for it. Just shows that Midnighter, as written, is too much for many streets without proper powersets.

Lol...door is an ability that has been handed down to the bat family before. It's not Midnighter who's beating Spiderman, it's a plot device used for traveling that is beating Spiderman. No one mentions in a Darkseid vs Thanos thread Darkseid pulling out a mother box to defeat Thanos because that is WHACK and desperate. Stop finding the easy route to every battle and debate for a change.

Anyways, you answered my question already. Spiderman stomps 10/10 unless Midnighter use a plot to change the tide. You rock!!!

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Stoic
In that case, he'd end up defeating many characters outside of his weight class, but it still does not answer the question of who would win using their typical weaponry, and physical tools. Heck Midnighter can say Door to Black Adam, and cut his head off if it appears in the right place. So, sure that is a viable win, but an incredibly cheap one.

But its....typical weaponry lol. And his usual tools....

carver9
Originally posted by Stoic
In that case, he'd end up defeating many characters outside of his weight class, but it still does not answer the question of who would win using their typical weaponry, and physical tools. Heck Midnighter can say Door to Black Adam, and cut his head off if it appears in the right place. So, sure that is a viable win, but an incredibly cheap one.

Exactly. It's sad that I have to provide so much detail so that one person on this site won't mention bfr every chance he gets. He's known for it.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Lol...door is an ability that has been handed down to the bat family before. It's not Midnighter who's beating Spiderman, it's a plot device used for traveling that is beating Spiderman. No one mentions in a Darkseid vs Thanos thread Darkseid pulling out a mother box to defeat Thanos because that is WHACK and desperate. Stop finding the easy route to every battle and debate for a change.

Anyways, you answered my question already. Spiderman stomps 10/10 unless Midnighter use a plot to change the tide. You rock!!!

Lol through the blessing of Midnighter.

Shall we go through the number of times DS has used a motherbox vs the number of times Midnighter has used a door? We can go scan for scan.

Easy route? Almost like....Midnighter would, in character. We debate characters here, not powersets smile

You sound butthurt, which is the first time I've ever seen lol.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Exactly. It's sad that I have to provide so much detail so that one person on this site won't mention bfr every chance he gets. He's known for it.

Almost like its a forum rule!!!!

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Lol through the blessing of Midnighter.

Shall we go through the number of times DS has used a motherbox vs the number of times Midnighter has used a door? We can go scan for scan.

Easy route? Almost like....Midnighter would, in character. We debate characters here, not powersets smile

You sound butthurt, which is the first time I've ever seen lol.

I'm not butthurt. I just told you I received the answer I needed. Spiderman wins 10/10. You and Stoic can continue if you two want to keep the thread going. Sending Bada a pm to close the thread. I'm satisfied.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
I'm not butthurt. I just told you I received the answer I needed. Spiderman wins 10/10. You and Stoic can continue if you two want to keep the thread going. Sending Bada a pm to close the thread. I'm satisfied.

Thanks.

Handicap threads are fine, unless you deliberately opened a spite thread.

And you accuse poor Zack of doing it sad

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by carver9
I'm not butthurt. I just told you I received the answer I needed. Spiderman wins 10/10. You and Stoic can continue if you two want to keep the thread going. Sending Bada a pm to close the thread. I'm satisfied.

The thread stays OPEN GAMMITE!!!!!!

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Thanks.

Handicap threads are fine, unless you deliberately opened a spite thread.

And you accuse poor Zack of doing it sad


Lol...Naah, you're the master of picking and choosing (DC and Marvel). I like how you brought up bfr here.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=635874&pagenumber=3

I can post more threads where you fail to mention it when it is highly possible it could be used (Marvel vs DC)

carver9
Originally posted by LordofBrooklyn
The thread stays OPEN GAMMITE!!!!!!

laughing out loud

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Almost like its a forum rule!!!!

Admit that Thor can beat Pre Crisis Superman 10/10.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Lol...Naah, you're the master of picking and choosing (DC and Marvel). I like how you brought up bfr here.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=635874&pagenumber=3

I can post more threads where you fail to mention it when it is highly possible it could be used (Marvel vs DC)

I never brought up BFR there?

Nor did I bring up BFR here, after you (belatedly) changed the OP....

I said he could remove kneecaps and body parts.

Which ISN'T bfr.

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I never brought up BFR there?

Nor did I bring up BFR here, after you (belatedly) changed the OP....

I said he could remove kneecaps and body parts.

Which ISN'T bfr.

Scans of him doing this. I want to see limbs separated. Also, how many wins would you give Thor over Pre Crisis Superman?

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
Scans of him doing this. I want to see limbs separated. Also, how many wins would you give Thor over Pre Crisis Superman?

Oh a wiser poster than me claimed that since Surfer threatened Glads, even though he never actually did it (just threatened), I don't have to actually need scans.

I think the same poster said we don't need to use feats in this thread either?

Its so confusing, flipping one way, then the other.

If Thor can BFR someone who is bloodlusted and using his speed, I'd give him 10/10.

DarkSaint85
You forget, carver, when it came to choosing one power, I chose a Marvel character, who could BFR (Spot).

Not sure why you're turning this into Marvel vs DC, lol. I pick characters like Shadowcat, Magik, Pixie, Blink etc. All Marvel.

Make a thread. Manifold vs Superman, equalised speed, no flight. Let's see who I pick!

leonidas
meh, spidey would certainly sense a door opening and likely know the general area it is going to open in, at least in some cases. it would depend on whether you believe his spider sense and reflexes would allow him time to avoid a door. i'm also not sold that his using the doors in the way you're describing is in character. if it is, well, he'd beat guys like hulk and thor 10/10. thor would throw his hammer and it would disappear, or even have his axe bfr'd before being beheaded. neither would survive beheading. he could even conceivably kill superman if he didn't blitz since it's possible his computer could predict a non-blitz and he could just open a door and straight bfr kal or just bfr his body in half. when the majority of people think of midnighter, they don't think of doors. /shrug

DarkSaint85
I'm special.

LordofBrooklyn
Originally posted by leonidas
he could even conceivably kill superman if he didn't blitz since it's possible his computer could predict a non-blitz and he could just open a door and straight bfr kal or just bfr his body in half.

WATCH YOURSELF!!!!

mad

carver9
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Oh a wiser poster than me claimed that since Surfer threatened Glads, even though he never actually did it (just threatened), I don't have to actually need scans.

I think the same poster said we don't need to use feats in this thread either?

Its so confusing, flipping one way, then the other.

If Thor can BFR someone who is bloodlusted and using his speed, I'd give him 10/10.

What wiser poster claimed this? You debated pages on statements not being valid. I want to see limbs separating. Remember, per Darksaint who also posted a quote from me saying the same thing...on KMC, we don't accept what she/he said, we want to see the showing happening. Unless you concede the argument you was having with Goober?

I didn't ask if they were bloodlusted. So you admit Thor beats Pre Crisis Superman 10/10? Thor does have more than 1 showing proving he can bfr.

carver9
Originally posted by leonidas
meh, spidey would certainly sense a door opening and likely know the general area it is going to open in, at least in some cases. it would depend on whether you believe his spider sense and reflexes would allow him time to avoid a door. i'm also not sold that his using the doors in the way you're describing is in character. if it is, well, he'd beat guys like hulk and thor 10/10. thor would throw his hammer and it would disappear, or even have his axe bfr'd before being beheaded. neither would survive beheading. he could even conceivably kill superman if he didn't blitz since it's possible his computer could predict a non-blitz and he could just open a door and straight bfr kal or just bfr his body in half. when the majority of people think of midnighter, they don't think of doors. /shrug

thumb up

Scarlet315
I don't think doors will make a difference. The bigger the threat the more active and direct the spider sense. There was a spidey comic I think during the clone saga where Parker wanted to commit suicide and jumped off a rooftop. His spider sense caused his arm to reach out and stick to the wall of a building. Besides Spideys faced nightcrawler and spot whose abilities are like door with relative ease.

leonidas
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I'm special.

http://i1214.photobucket.com/albums/cc490/pentopaper1/wiggum-1.jpg

Zack M
Originally posted by Scarlet315
I don't think doors will make a difference. The bigger the threat the more active and direct the spider sense. There was a spidey comic I think during the clone saga where Parker wanted to commit suicide and jumped off a rooftop. His spider sense caused his arm to reach out and stick to the wall of a building. Besides Spideys faced nightcrawler and spot whose abilities are like door with relative ease.

Nightcrawler was able to surprise Spidey and take him down. Doors would do the same. Especially since Midnighter can open up a ton of them.

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/NGF_zpseen4k77v.jpg

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by carver9
What wiser poster claimed this? You debated pages on statements not being valid. I want to see limbs separating. Remember, per Darksaint who also posted a quote from me saying the same thing...on KMC, we don't accept what she/he said, we want to see the showing happening. Unless you concede the argument you was having with Goober?

I didn't ask if they were bloodlusted. So you admit Thor beats Pre Crisis Superman 10/10? Thor does have more than 1 showing proving he can bfr.

So you ARE conceding the Surfer statement with Glads, then? Or are you flipflopping to suit your argument?

IF statements are as valid as feats (which I originally did not think they were), then Surfer's statement holds as much weight as Midnighter's. I even made reference to Surfer, when posting the Midnighter statement:
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Carver, if someone threatens to do something without actually doing it (like Surfer did with Gladiator), would you accept it?

You never replied to that question.

Moreover, OP has specified feats are not allowed:

Originally posted by carver9
There's no competition at all if you did a ft war between the two. With hat said, let's focus on other things than that.

Are you conceding? I mean, you SPECIFICALLY said let's NOT focus on feats, lol.

And I asked, can Thor open portals faster than a speeding Pre Crisis Superman? I can't answer your question, when you keep changing things and moving goalposts - first you never specified BFR, then you say feats aren't allowed, then now you're saying you WANT feats....I mean, how am I supposed to give you a straight answer, when you can't even ask a straight question?

leonidas
Originally posted by Zack M
Nightcrawler was able to surprise Spidey and take him down. Doors would do the same. Especially since Midnighter can open up a ton of them.

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/NGF_zpseen4k77v.jpg

for each one like that, i could show something like this:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/3853/1265341-scannedimage_2.jpg

dodging friggin ironfist without being able to see him attacking (ie relying PURELY on spider sense) is damn impressive. hell, he does better against fist in the dark. sneer

doors could def work. i don't think they are auto wins though. spidey has some spider sense feats and speed feats to say he could avoid them. i think without the doors in a forum setting though, pete takes a very solid majority.

Scarlet315
Originally posted by Zack M
Nightcrawler was able to surprise Spidey and take him down. Doors would do the same. Especially since Midnighter can open up a ton of them.

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/NGF_zpseen4k77v.jpg

An argument can be made here being that nightcrawler wasn't trying to maim or cut off any of his limbs. And Spidey did get the warning ahead of time. There are scans where off the top of my head black car gets the jump on him b/c she wasn't being a threat but playful

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Scarlet315
I don't think doors will make a difference. The bigger the threat the more active and direct the spider sense. There was a spidey comic I think during the clone saga where Parker wanted to commit suicide and jumped off a rooftop. His spider sense caused his arm to reach out and stick to the wall of a building. Besides Spideys faced nightcrawler and spot whose abilities are like door with relative ease.

The Spot?

He specifically does not set Spidey's Spider Sense off, because he is not in the same dimension as him.

That's actually the worse example you could've used, lol.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589009_zps916a9d3e.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589014_zps6bada220.jpg

Imagine if Spot didn't just have human level strength/speed....

POW THWOCK WOCK CHOCK indeed.

leonidas
lol stupid spot....

Zack M
Originally posted by leonidas
for each one like that, i could show something like this:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/3853/1265341-scannedimage_2.jpg

dodging friggin ironfist without being able to see him attacking (ie relying PURELY on spider sense) is damn impressive. hell, he does better against fist in the dark. sneer

Spot also made Spidey look like a fool with his teleportation, too. Midnighter has tagged a bloodlusted speedster (Who is almost as fast as the Flash), which is BETTER than that Iron Fist feat. Now match that feat!

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/dfdsf_zps6kervfgf.jpg
http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/nnsd_zpsv7425nsw.jpg
http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/dfsd_zpsgtexjbw3.jpg

Scarlet315
Originally posted by leonidas
for each one like that, i could show something like this:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/3853/1265341-scannedimage_2.jpg

dodging friggin ironfist without being able to see him attacking (ie relying PURELY on spider sense) is damn impressive. hell, he does better against fist in the dark. sneer

doors could def work. i don't think they are auto wins though. spidey has some spider sense feats and speed feats to say he could avoid them. i think without the doors in a forum setting though, pete takes a very solid majority.

Wow that SS feat against iron fist is a good example of what I'm talking about. I'm not knocking midnight and some of his feats do match and maybe even cancel Spideys out but the SS packed with his other superhuman abilities nails it.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by leonidas
lol stupid spot....

If Stilt is watching, this is just for him.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589015_zpsa201736d.jpg

@Scarlet: His SS doesn't work against other dimensional teleporters. Like Spot.

Scarlet315
Originally posted by JayDaDon
Forgot about the suit. It doesnt matter that much if Midnighter is a better martial artist, its no longer a weakness for Spidey. The ss being the equalizer it could come down to who's physical stats are better and Spidey gets that nod.

True suit doesn't make a difference but would nullify some hits from Midnighter I he were to land them

Zack M
More PROOF that Midnighter has super speed.

"I'm fast. You didn't even see me put on my uniform"

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/MF_zpslnp4zonu.jpg

Zack M
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If Stilt is watching, this is just for him.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589015_zpsa201736d.jpg

@Scarlet: His SS doesn't work against other dimensional teleporters. Like Spot.

This fight does NOT look good for Spidey. He gets murdered here.

leonidas
Originally posted by Zack M
Spot also made Spidey look like a fool with his teleportation, too. Midnighter has tagged a bloodlusted speedster (Who is almost as fast as the Flash), which is BETTER than that Iron Fist feat. Now match that feat!

http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/dfdsf_zps6kervfgf.jpg
http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/nnsd_zpsv7425nsw.jpg
http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/dfsd_zpsgtexjbw3.jpg

that....doesn't even make sense. no expression seriously. that is as dumb as the scene where stroke took down flash. in the time it took to DRAW the weapon, that guy should have hit midnighter a 100 times (IF he's as fast as he claimed). he would literally (like flash against ds) have run INTO the blade. nighter wouldn't be faster at any point. he might predict an action, but that's not the same as being faster. unless you're telling me he can take flash now too.....? he also obviously prepped for the encounter since he was carrying a straight razor to use specifically on that guy's achilles..... you're really in love with midnighter for some reason, eh? it's a little weird....

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Zack M
This fight does NOT look good for Spidey. He gets murdered here.

The previous fight between the Spot and Spidey, the Spot was a loser dweeb scientist who was only after money - he didn't want to take over the world or anything like that. Just human level stats, and no fighting skills or fighting mindset.

The second time, though? He had a killer instinct. That was the only difference. And Spidey was getting curbed.

Zack M
Originally posted by leonidas
that....doesn't even make sense. no expression seriously. that is as dumb as the scene where stroke took down flash. in the time it took to DRAW the weapon, that guy should have hit midnighter a 100 times (IF he's as fast as he claimed). he would literally (like flash against ds) have run INTO the blade. nighter wouldn't be faster at any point. he might predict an action, but that's not the same as being faster. unless you're telling me he can take flash now too.....? he also obviously prepped for the encounter since he was carrying a straight razor to use specifically on that guy's achilles..... you're really in love with midnighter for some reason, eh? it's a little weird....

He STILL reacted to a speester. That's all that matters. Gotta give credit where credits due.

leonidas
he can't detect spot directly because there are a hundred spots and he doesn't know where he's coming from--his senses wouldn't let him sense spot through the holes. that is nothing at all like what the doors are....nighter isn't attacking THROUGH the doors. the doors ARE the danger and he would sense them just fine. this love affair you're starting up with midnighter is awkward. no expression

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by leonidas
that....doesn't even make sense. no expression seriously. that is as dumb as the scene where stroke took down flash. in the time it took to DRAW the weapon, that guy should have hit midnighter a 100 times (IF he's as fast as he claimed). he would literally (like flash against ds) have run INTO the blade. nighter wouldn't be faster at any point. he might predict an action, but that's not the same as being faster. unless you're telling me he can take flash now too.....? he also obviously prepped for the encounter since he was carrying a straight razor to use specifically on that guy's achilles..... you're really in love with midnighter for some reason, eh? it's a little weird....

I thought he just used that crowbar. He didn't know about the speedster before they tussled.

Difference between him and Flash, Flash could've (would've? should've?) vibrated through DS' blade. Whereas this guy ran into a spot where Mids knew he would run to, and was waiting for him.

leonidas
Originally posted by Zack M
He STILL reacted to a speester. That's all that matters. Gotta give credit where credits due.

sure. it just doesn't make sense. but he did it. i wouldn't say that was the norm though. you're going all no limits.

Zack M
Originally posted by leonidas
he can't detect spot directly because there are a hundred spots and he doesn't know where he's coming from--his senses wouldn't let him sense spot through the holes. that is nothing at all like what the doors are....nighter isn't attacking THROUGH the doors. the doors ARE the danger and he would sense them just fine. this love affair you're starting up with midnighter is awkward. no expression

I don't care if he uses the doors, because he can take Spidey without it. I've shown you on panel evidence of his super speed, weak spot detecting, nerve strikes, proof that he's one of the best fighters, enhanced stats, etc...

DCnU Midnighter doesn't have a losing record. In fact, he's only lost ONCE, and that was to a precog. Spider-Man won't win the majority.

Zack M
Originally posted by leonidas
sure. it just doesn't make sense. but he did it. i wouldn't say that was the norm though. you're going all no limits.

Well, sure, but you'd have to show me what his averages are. He's nearly batting a thousand.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by leonidas
he can't detect spot directly because there are a hundred spots and he doesn't know where he's coming from--his senses wouldn't let him sense spot through the holes. that is nothing at all like what the doors are....nighter isn't attacking THROUGH the doors. the doors ARE the danger and he would sense them just fine. this love affair you're starting up with midnighter is awkward. no expression

I know. I'm just saying to Scarlet, using the Spot was THE worst example to ever use.

Because the Spot was beating Spidey quite handily.

And Mids can also attack through doors, if he wishes to. Hence, the scans about kneecapping and discarding them two blocks away.

Like you said, and I agree. No doors, purely h2h, Spidey has good odds. All I am saying, is if as the Spidey supporters are claiming, he has ZERO chance of beating Spidey....doors will be used.

Whereas I am claiming that it is a good fight either way.

leonidas
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I thought he just used that crowbar. He didn't know about the speedster before they tussled.

Difference between him and Flash, Flash could've (would've? should've?) vibrated through DS' blade. Whereas this guy ran into a spot where Mids knew he would run to, and was waiting for him.

thumb up

you're right. not sure why i saw that thing he threw as a straight blade....anyway, i agree. BUT, you could say the computer would know he's vibrate and then he'd just adjust to that.... no limits is no limits. i know the judges weren't buying it when i tried using him in that bz against you. lol

i'd say that guy was (a) a moron, (b) it's pis, or (c) it's def not the norm. either way, not sure i showing like that would count for more than a win or 2 given the...odd nature of it.

leonidas
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I know. I'm just saying to Scarlet, using the Spot was THE worst example to ever use.

Because the Spot was beating Spidey quite handily.

And Mids can also attack through doors, if he wishes to. Hence, the scans about kneecapping and discarding them two blocks away.

Like you said, and I agree. No doors, purely h2h, Spidey has good odds. All I am saying, is if as the Spidey supporters are claiming, he has ZERO chance of beating Spidey....doors will be used.

Whereas I am claiming that it is a good fight either way.

oh i get you're stance--and carv CAN bring us all to...extremes lol i was talking about JUST the doors. has he actually attacked through doors ala spot? if he could open multiple doors and attack through them, then...sure. you're, er, spot on. not sure that's in character though. i think we generally agree. without doors i think spidey wins more than you maybe, but not far off. i just hate the doors. lead to too many problems in these scenarios.

Zack M
Is anyone currently following Apollo & Midnighter? Midnighter is about to kick some demon/Neron ass. wink


http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/MH_zps0sdxjip4.jpg
http://i1149.photobucket.com/albums/o589/lupinw45/NN_zpsdt0f9j4s.jpg

Stoic
Originally posted by leonidas
oh i get you're stance--and carv CAN bring us all to...extremes lol i was talking about JUST the doors. has he actually attacked through doors ala spot? if he could open multiple doors and attack through them, then...sure. you're, er, spot on. not sure that's in character though. i think we generally agree. without doors i think spidey wins more than you maybe, but not far off. i just hate the doors. lead to too many problems in these scenarios.

Exactly, if Midnighter is going to take an ass whipping just leave it at that. There's no reason to bring up the Door tactic, because then it wouldn't truly be Midnighter winning but it will instead be his Door tactic that takes the win. Also if you really want to get technical about it, the Door tactic would and should be considered as outside help. It's not like he's carrying around the hardware that he depends on to produce these Doors right?

cdtm
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If Stilt is watching, this is just for him.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589015_zpsa201736d.jpg

@Scarlet: His SS doesn't work against other dimensional teleporters. Like Spot.

It worked against Nightcrawler...?

leonidas
Originally posted by Stoic
Exactly, if Midnighter is going to take an ass whipping just leave it at that. There's no reason to bring up the Door tactic, because then it wouldn't truly be Midnighter winning but it will instead be his Door tactic that takes the win. Also if you really want to get technical about it, the Door tactic would and should be considered as outside help. It's not like he's carrying around the hardware that he depends on to produce these Doors right?

he has the controls for the doors on his person. or he did anyway....

Originally posted by cdtm
It worked against Nightcrawler...?

maybe because nc leaves and returns instantly? spot varies his appearances and can attack from multiple places at the same time or at different times. maybe...?

pretty sure his spider sense helped him beat solo, who is also a teleporter, but can't recall the details.

Zack M
Yeah, he still has the Doors. Not that he needs it.

Scarlet315
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The Spot?

He specifically does not set Spidey's Spider Sense off, because he is not in the same dimension as him.

That's actually the worse example you could've used, lol.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589009_zps916a9d3e.jpg

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b52/qwirtle/Spider-Man589014_zps6bada220.jpg

Imagine if Spot didn't just have human level strength/speed....

POW THWOCK WOCK CHOCK indeed.

Oh my bad but I never read that comic. I was actually referring to that fight in the animated series

Zack M
Originally posted by Scarlet315
Oh my bad but I never read that comic. I was actually referring to that fight in the animated series

Animated doesn't count. lol

cdtm
Originally posted by leonidas
he has the controls for the doors on his person. or he did anyway....



maybe because nc leaves and returns instantly? spot varies his appearances and can attack from multiple places at the same time or at different times. maybe...?

pretty sure his spider sense helped him beat solo, who is also a teleporter, but can't recall the details.

Spidey's dealt with grids of lasers controlled by advanced computer targeting. He can do instant.

Was it stated Spidey can't deal with extra dimensional tp, or is it assumed? Because, I'll bet you there's far more examples of mooks hitting him (Especially in the kung fu fighting 70's-80's), and nobody says the SS doesn't work against non meta's/martial artist's.

JayDaDon
Comparing spot to the doors is one hell of a stretch. The methods of attack arent the same. I dont remember it being stated as a rule that other dimensional threats dont register the Ss as Im sure hes faced his fair share of other dimensional threats.

carver9
http://i.imgur.com/G2uIeeS.jpg

DarkSaint85
Oh, are we allowing feats now?

Because OP said:
Originally posted by carver9
I didn't make this thread due to ft war because Midnighter doesn't compare at all to Spiderman in that scene. There's no competition at all if you did a ft war between the two. With hat said, let's focus on other things than that.

Besides, Mids too has dodged lasers. So....yeah.

Originally posted by JayDaDon
Comparing spot to the doors is one hell of a stretch. The methods of attack arent the same. I dont remember it being stated as a rule that other dimensional threats dont register the Ss as Im sure hes faced his fair share of other dimensional threats.

Not comparing the two. It was a direct reply to Scarlet, who said that Spidey has dealt easily with the Spot. When in fact, he hasn't. Besides, the scan shows that if an extramidensional portal opens, Spidey cannot predict WHERE it's going to open, not just that an attack is coming through. Otherwise, predicting attacks is easy a phuck, lol. 'Hmm, a black hole is going to open here, as my Spidey sense has warned me, but it hasn't warned me what is going to come through, so I wouldn't do anything'.

Really, you guys are thinking too two dimensionally. THIS was originally how I envisaged a fight (not THE fight, but one way it can go down).

Ding, bell starts.

Midnighter starts spouting off. I'm the Midnighter, yadda yadda.
Spidey: man, you talk too much. Webs his face up.
Midnighter gets mad, jumps in, throws punches and kicks.
Spidey easily dodges them all, pulls Mids' coat over his face, kicks him a bit so he's flat on his face.
Midnighter: why can't I hit you?
Spidey: proportional strength of a spider, agility yadda yadda, oh, and Spidey sense.
Midnigher: that confirms the basic info I had on you. Door.

The arena gets covered in doors, where Spidey is about to land. He swings/jumps out of the way.

Spidey: Gotta do better than that, tall dark and ugly!

This keeps happening. Everytime he is about to land, a new door opens, and he jumps out of the way. Seems random. But it isn't. He lands exactly where Midnighter wants him to land. Gets tagged.

And again. And again. And again.

Repeat, and rinse.

End fight.

Now, I am no Midnighter. I didn't run a million scenarios in my head. Nor did I jump into this thread and scream 'Door' as soon as Carvy posted the OP. I am NOT BFRing. My dialogue admittedly can use a lot of work, but I am only using the doors to force the Spidey sense to make Spiderman do what I would want, if I wanted to tag him. He wouldn't be able to leap and dodge around, because there'd be limited places he'd be able to jump to. The SS would actually be working AGAINST Spidey, because it means it can be manipulated.

That was the original way I saw Mids could win. Sure, Spidey can jump to point A, B, C, D, E etc around the battlefield. But if doors were opened at all those points, except for point C, and Mids was ready with a punch at that point.....

Scarlet315
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Oh, are we allowing feats now?

Because OP said:


Besides, Mids too has dodged lasers. So....yeah.



Not comparing the two. It was a direct reply to Scarlet, who said that Spidey has dealt easily with the Spot. When in fact, he hasn't. Besides, the scan shows that if an extramidensional portal opens, Spidey cannot predict WHERE it's going to open, not just that an attack is coming through. Otherwise, predicting attacks is easy a phuck, lol. 'Hmm, a black hole is going to open here, as my Spidey sense has warned me, but it hasn't warned me what is going to come through, so I wouldn't do anything'.

Really, you guys are thinking too two dimensionally. THIS was originally how I envisaged a fight (not THE fight, but one way it can go down).

Ding, bell starts.

Midnighter starts spouting off. I'm the Midnighter, yadda yadda.
Spidey: man, you talk too much. Webs his face up.
Midnighter gets mad, jumps in, throws punches and kicks.
Spidey easily dodges them all, pulls Mids' coat over his face, kicks him a bit so he's flat on his face.
Midnighter: why can't I hit you?
Spidey: proportional strength of a spider, agility yadda yadda, oh, and Spidey sense.
Midnigher: that confirms the basic info I had on you. Door.

The arena gets covered in doors, where Spidey is about to land. He swings/jumps out of the way.

Spidey: Gotta do better than that, tall dark and ugly!

This keeps happening. Everytime he is about to land, a new door opens, and he jumps out of the way. Seems random. But it isn't. He lands exactly where Midnighter wants him to land. Gets tagged.

And again. And again. And again.

Repeat, and rinse.

End fight.

Now, I am no Midnighter. I didn't run a million scenarios in my head. Nor did I jump into this thread and scream 'Door' as soon as Carvy posted the OP. I am NOT BFRing. My dialogue admittedly can use a lot of work, but I am only using the doors to force the Spidey sense to make Spiderman do what I would want, if I wanted to tag him. He wouldn't be able to leap and dodge around, because there'd be limited places he'd be able to jump to. The SS would actually be working AGAINST Spidey, because it means it can be manipulated.

That was the original way I saw Mids could win. Sure, Spidey can jump to point A, B, C, D, E etc around the battlefield. But if doors were opened at all those points, except for point C, and Mids was ready with a punch at that point.....

Again my bad for referencing the animated series with the battle against spot but I just figured that character wasn't drastically different from how he was in the comics. But your fight scenario is just one way things could've turned out. From what you wrote spidey didn't have to stop there from webbing midnighter's face. He could've just continued webbing leaving Midnighter gift wrapped for the cops to take because he has to run back to Parker industries for a meeting. He could also with good measure conceal him with now concrete webbing on top of his regular stuff for good measure. Something you shouldn't forget is that although Parker is given amazing abilities from the bite of a spider he is also a genius and has caught villains, heroes alike in pretty much the same scenario you painted with midnighter. I'm thinking of asking deathbattle if they can take this request

JayDaDon
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Oh, are we allowing feats now?

Because OP said:


Besides, Mids too has dodged lasers. So....yeah.



Not comparing the two. It was a direct reply to Scarlet, who said that Spidey has dealt easily with the Spot. When in fact, he hasn't. Besides, the scan shows that if an extramidensional portal opens, Spidey cannot predict WHERE it's going to open, not just that an attack is coming through. Otherwise, predicting attacks is easy a phuck, lol. 'Hmm, a black hole is going to open here, as my Spidey sense has warned me, but it hasn't warned me what is going to come through, so I wouldn't do anything'.

Really, you guys are thinking too two dimensionally. THIS was originally how I envisaged a fight (not THE fight, but one way it can go down).

Ding, bell starts.

Midnighter starts spouting off. I'm the Midnighter, yadda yadda.
Spidey: man, you talk too much. Webs his face up.
Midnighter gets mad, jumps in, throws punches and kicks.
Spidey easily dodges them all, pulls Mids' coat over his face, kicks him a bit so he's flat on his face.
Midnighter: why can't I hit you?
Spidey: proportional strength of a spider, agility yadda yadda, oh, and Spidey sense.
Midnigher: that confirms the basic info I had on you. Door.

The arena gets covered in doors, where Spidey is about to land. He swings/jumps out of the way.

Spidey: Gotta do better than that, tall dark and ugly!

This keeps happening. Everytime he is about to land, a new door opens, and he jumps out of the way. Seems random. But it isn't. He lands exactly where Midnighter wants him to land. Gets tagged.

And again. And again. And again.

Repeat, and rinse.

End fight.

Now, I am no Midnighter. I didn't run a million scenarios in my head. Nor did I jump into this thread and scream 'Door' as soon as Carvy posted the OP. I am NOT BFRing. My dialogue admittedly can use a lot of work, but I am only using the doors to force the Spidey sense to make Spiderman do what I would want, if I wanted to tag him. He wouldn't be able to leap and dodge around, because there'd be limited places he'd be able to jump to. The SS would actually be working AGAINST Spidey, because it means it can be manipulated.

That was the original way I saw Mids could win. Sure, Spidey can jump to point A, B, C, D, E etc around the battlefield. But if doors were opened at all those points, except for point C, and Mids was ready with a punch at that point.....

As someone else pointed out, there have been many times due to PIS that the SS was outright ignored by writers. Besides that, the door's ability could bring immediate dismemberment or death...Spot doesn't operate on that level of threat to Spider-man. The higher the threat level the louder the spider sense sounds off. These scenarios don't really account for Spider-man throwing webs and attacking AS he dodges. Also if we take into account the punches that Spidey has kept on rolling thru, I doubt midnighter's punch would give him much pause.

DarkSaint85
Leaving him gift wrapped for the cops, or just stopping the battle there, with Mids all wrapped up, well then its debatable if Mids can break out of it. And then, of course, doors, which is where BFR comes into play (or knee capping).

In this thread, I've seen people claim that Spidey is strong enough to KO the Hulk. KO Firelord. Give Doom hell. Durable enough to tank hits from Juggernaut. Hulk. Faster than light.

With all of these advantages, and I am NOT saying they never happened, but if this is indeed the level that Spidey is seen as operating in this thread, then...well, why wouldn't doors be used?

Because if I were to say, oh, but Mids can KO Spidey, people will jump at me, and say oh, are you saying Mids is Juggy/Hulk level???


As for the Spot, he was an idiot in the cartoon. Same powerset, but in the comics, once he developed half a brain and a killer instinct, Spidey was toast.

Edit: And jaydadon proves what I was saying - using Spideys performances against Hulk etc.

And Spot has instakilled before, via blood rip. That's a pretty high threat level.

Scarlet315
Originally posted by JayDaDon
As someone else pointed out, there have been many times due to PIS that the SS was outright ignored by writers. Besides that, the door's ability could bring immediate dismemberment or death...Spot doesn't operate on that level of threat to Spider-man. The higher the threat level the louder the spider sense sounds off. These scenarios don't really account for Spider-man throwing webs and attacking AS he dodges. Also if we take into account the punches that Spidey has kept on rolling thru, I doubt midnighter's punch would give him much pause.

Exactly! If they were written to the best of their abilities then like Parker once told Mary Jane while he was describing his powers there is hardly anything that can catch him by surprise anymore due to his SS. In another comic a cool display of Parker's SS in action was after he had a bad tussle with vulture and was asleep his SS allowed him to know Mary Jane entered the apartment and he somewhat knew what she was doing. Midnighter is no slouch, it's true and they both have strength and speed with spidey edging out a bit, but then Parker is one of the most agile characters in marvel more so than nightcrawler and puck. Now combine that with SS and...

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by JayDaDon
As someone else pointed out, there have been many times due to PIS that the SS was outright ignored by writers. Besides that, the door's ability could bring immediate dismemberment or death...Spot doesn't operate on that level of threat to Spider-man. The higher the threat level the louder the spider sense sounds off. These scenarios don't really account for Spider-man throwing webs and attacking AS he dodges. Also if we take into account the punches that Spidey has kept on rolling thru, I doubt midnighter's punch would give him much pause.

The SS flat out failed to warn him where portals were going to open, until it was too late to do anything.

True, the scenario doesn't. Like I said, its one scnerio that I just thought of, not MILLIONS. I didn't account for Spidey farting on him either etc.

Mids wont give him pause with one punch. Two? Three? We know bullets go through Spideys hands like knife through butter. Mids punches harder than bullets.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Scarlet315
Exactly! If they were written to the best of their abilities then like Parker once told Mary Jane while he was describing his powers there is hardly anything that can catch him by surprise anymore due to his SS. In another comic a cool display of Parker's SS in action was after he had a bad tussle with vulture and was asleep his SS allowed him to know Mary Jane entered the apartment and he somewhat knew what she was doing. Midnighter is no slouch, it's true and they both have strength and speed with spidey edging out a bit, but then Parker is one of the most agile characters in marvel more so than nightcrawler and puck. Now combine that with SS and...

The SS specifically fails against portals that are extra dimensional, so them opening up at the last minute os going to throw him off.

DarkSaint85
Either this is a spite thread (handicapped Mids, Spidey is FTL/HulkJuggy busting) or a bait thread (you've answered the question I wanted you to answer!)

Either way, poor show.

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The SS flat out failed to warn him where portals were going to open, until it was too late to do anything.

True, the scenario doesn't. Like I said, its one scnerio that I just thought of, not MILLIONS. I didn't account for Spidey farting on him either etc.

Mids wont give him pause with one punch. Two? Three? We know bullets go through Spideys hands like knife through butter. Mids punches harder than bullets.

Venom and Carnage punch harder than bullets as well. Spiderman himself punches harder than bullets, and can web his hands up to hit with all of his strength. I don't see how you've seen one guy's ability while leaving out the others. Midnighter isn't the Spot, this really isn't a point worth dancing around. The scan that you also posted shows that bullets can and have penetrated Midnighter.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by Stoic
Venom and Carnage punch harder than bullets as well. Spiderman himself punches harder than bullets, and can web his hands up to hit with all of his strength. I don't see how you've seen one guy's ability while leaving out the others. Midnighter isn't the Spot, this really isn't a point worth dancing around. The scan that you also posted shows that bullets can and have penetrated Midnighter.


I specifically am making use of the SS.

And like I said, its ONE scenario. Out of millions.

Not dancing around. I'm not using the doors like the Spot. Jeez, Louise lol.

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I specifically am making use of the SS.

And like I said, its ONE scenario. Out of millions.

Not dancing around. I'm not using the doors like the Spot. Jeez, Louise lol.

My whole thing is that for a guy as new to the comic scenes as Midnighter to flat out kick Spiderman's butt, he'd have to prove that he was better than Wolverine. Wolverine in my opinion is the closest thing in terms of physicality to Midnighter in Marvel without the added durability, while having a weaker healing factor than Wolverine. I've seen Spiderman fight Wolverine, and without the Adamantium bones, I am almost certain that Spiderman would have KO'd him. I can see Midnighter giving Spiderman a tough time, and if he uses the Door, he'd probably win via translocation. However, as I stated before, that still never proved that Midnighter was capable of beating him physically or overcoming all of the tools that he brings to the table.

On paper, Spiderman beats him on nearly every front. Spiderman can fight on nearly every surface. This is something that very few characters can boast. I don't think that Midnighter's form of precog cancels or trumps the Spider Sense. I can't agree that Midnighter's form of physical combat defeats Spiderman's either. I see Spiderman as being more agile due to tactile abilities, which inevitably makes Spiderman faster because he doesn't slip, slide, or skid on most surfaces. i think that Spiderman also edges him out in strength, while the durability of either is just about the same.

Midnighter has a lot of years to put in, in order for him to logically come out on top of a guy that's literally been around for over 50 years, and has taken down characters well above Midnighter's pay grade. This would never be a stomp, and Spiderman would have to work his behind off for the win, but he would win this if we took the both of them at their best which is what the OP is asking. Spiderman does not have to be capable of moving at FTL speeds, because Midnighter isn't a character that moves at FTL speeds himself.

carver9
Darksaint already admitted Spiderman beats Midnighter for a high majority physically.

DarkSaint85
But his powers are very different from Wolverine's. His mindset is completely different, too. Wolverine would think twice about using lethal force on Peter. Midnighter wouldn't.

He has doors. Wolverine doesn't. He has a computer that isn't precog, that Wolverine doesn't.

Spiderman can stick to surfaces, true.... Until those surfaces get doors on them, forcing him to jump where Mids wants him to (using that SS against him).

Younkeep satin, overcoming all the tools that Spidey brings to the table...and yet, want to negate the tools that Mids brings to the table, lol.

DarkSaint85
As for webbing:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/14/141134/3730643-jkjn.png

It's 2.62 time as strong as steel.

Here's Mids with steel (casually, I might add):
http://static6.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11126/111269876/5316260-8277577414-53079.jpg

Nah. What about his striking strength? I know carver will ask for specific scans of how hard he punches.

http://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11126/111269876/5318035-2016-07-09+22_13_50-.jpg

Just for the lulz....he catches Harry Tanner, the Eminence of Blades' sword.
http://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11126/111269876/5316511-5072293582-53126.jpg

What's impressive about that sword? Apart from being wielded by the greatest swordsman in history?

It can cut through atoms:
http://static8.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/11126/111269876/5316514-0787038828-53127.jpg

Stoic
One strand is that strong. If and when he webs him up, he could use wads, and wads of webbing capable of holding even the Savage Hulk.

Here we see him when he pours on the agility

http://static6.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_medium/11114/111144314/4235438-1193019-fl2_1_.jpg

Showing how strong his webs are

https://dougernst.files.wordpress.com/2016/01/asm6-web-cement.jpg?w=750

I know that you can't be arguing that Midnighter is too heavy to be webbed up? All Peter has to do is web him up, whether he tries to break out or not, and use him as a wrecking ball. How long, would Midnighter last against Morlun? Like I said, he'd be a threat to Spiderman, but he can't begin to wage a feat war against Spiderman. I wouldn't attempt it if I were you, because some of the really hardcore Spiderman fans may scan bomb you.

Stoic
Spiderman flexes

http://img15.photobucket.com/albums/v44/guyverjay/Amazing_Spider-Man_32-03.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/1y9t8x.jpg

Zack M
Mids could probably use the doors to get out of the webbing.

DarkSaint85
Agreed.

But that's like me saying how long would Spidey last against Red Lanterns, Apollo, or Etrigan.

And he was Waaaaaay fewer showings then Spidey.

I am arguing that he's strong enough to bust out of the webbing, assuming we take that showing. I'm just saying, a lot of people think he's Batman level in stats. When he's clearly not. Or in your case, Wolverine level in stats such as strength.

Sabretooth, pre upgrade, has also busted out of his webbing....its hardly Hulk level in every encounter.

Mids is strong, has the BC, and doors, and a killer instinct.

Stoic
That webbing. Crazy stuff really.

http://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/4/45351/2901035-amazing_spiderman_v2_11_19.jpg

http://static1.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/8/80103/2894576-blob7.jpg

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Agreed.

But that's like me saying how long would Spidey last against Red Lanterns, Apollo, or Etrigan.

And he was Waaaaaay fewer showings then Spidey.

I am arguing that he's strong enough to bust out of the webbing, assuming we take that showing. I'm just saying, a lot of people think he's Batman level in stats. When he's clearly not. Or in your case, Wolverine level in stats such as strength.

Sabretooth, pre upgrade, has also busted out of his webbing....its hardly Hulk level in every encounter.

Mids is strong, has the BC, and doors, and a killer instinct.

You're mentioning times that Spiderman wasn't blood lusted which is not what the OP is asking for.

DarkSaint85
Op says they're bloodlusted?

Zack M
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Agreed.

But that's like me saying how long would Spidey last against Red Lanterns, Apollo, or Etrigan.

And he was Waaaaaay fewer showings then Spidey.

I am arguing that he's strong enough to bust out of the webbing, assuming we take that showing. I'm just saying, a lot of people think he's Batman level in stats. When he's clearly not. Or in your case, Wolverine level in stats such as strength.

Sabretooth, pre upgrade, has also busted out of his webbing....its hardly Hulk level in every encounter.

Mids is strong, has the BC, and doors, and a killer instinct.

Yeah, he's way ahead of Batman in terms of stats. Mids has shown to be a super speedster. And he's much stronger.

Stoic
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Op says they're bloodlusted?

No but Carver never objected to this post which was on the first page.

Originally posted by Stoic
They have basic knowledge of each other. I think that it depends on how hard Spiderman is willing to fight. Midnighter isn't keeping up with a spider blitz attack like the one that he put on Firelord. Anything less, and Pete could be in for some trouble.

And since Spiderman never blitzes unless he is extremely serious, I can't see why he wouldn't be. But no, it wasn't in the Opening Poster's first post. Do you think that he'd fight Midnighter with anything less than how he fought Wolverine? I highly doubt it.

Zack M
Midnghter would see him coming. Not the same thing.

cdtm
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Oh, are we allowing feats now?

Because OP said:


Besides, Mids too has dodged lasers. So....yeah.



Not comparing the two. It was a direct reply to Scarlet, who said that Spidey has dealt easily with the Spot. When in fact, he hasn't. Besides, the scan shows that if an extramidensional portal opens, Spidey cannot predict WHERE it's going to open, not just that an attack is coming through. Otherwise, predicting attacks is easy a phuck, lol. 'Hmm, a black hole is going to open here, as my Spidey sense has warned me, but it hasn't warned me what is going to come through, so I wouldn't do anything'.

Really, you guys are thinking too two dimensionally. THIS was originally how I envisaged a fight (not THE fight, but one way it can go down).

Ding, bell starts.

Midnighter starts spouting off. I'm the Midnighter, yadda yadda.
Spidey: man, you talk too much. Webs his face up.
Midnighter gets mad, jumps in, throws punches and kicks.
Spidey easily dodges them all, pulls Mids' coat over his face, kicks him a bit so he's flat on his face.
Midnighter: why can't I hit you?
Spidey: proportional strength of a spider, agility yadda yadda, oh, and Spidey sense.
Midnigher: that confirms the basic info I had on you. Door.

The arena gets covered in doors, where Spidey is about to land. He swings/jumps out of the way.

Spidey: Gotta do better than that, tall dark and ugly!

This keeps happening. Everytime he is about to land, a new door opens, and he jumps out of the way. Seems random. But it isn't. He lands exactly where Midnighter wants him to land. Gets tagged.

And again. And again. And again.

Repeat, and rinse.

End fight.

Now, I am no Midnighter. I didn't run a million scenarios in my head. Nor did I jump into this thread and scream 'Door' as soon as Carvy posted the OP. I am NOT BFRing. My dialogue admittedly can use a lot of work, but I am only using the doors to force the Spidey sense to make Spiderman do what I would want, if I wanted to tag him. He wouldn't be able to leap and dodge around, because there'd be limited places he'd be able to jump to. The SS would actually be working AGAINST Spidey, because it means it can be manipulated.

That was the original way I saw Mids could win. Sure, Spidey can jump to point A, B, C, D, E etc around the battlefield. But if doors were opened at all those points, except for point C, and Mids was ready with a punch at that point.....

What stops:

"Doo-" *fwip*. *Combo to KO.*

Spidey's pretty darned accurate and quick with that webbing. Got Matt's entire arm mid leap, and he has radar sense and agility second only to Spidey.

staxamillion
how exactly does Mids use the doors? what does he need to do to open them

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