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Can the dark council present at the beginning of Act I defeat Yoda? They start surrounding him in a 20 meter circle.

Yoda wins.

Who was in the council, again?

Lol Council stomps with ease. Half of them do it

Originally posted by Tondemonai
Lol Council stomps with ease. Half of them do it


Yoda slaughters.

We've already seen two Councillors or Council-tier opponents defeated by non-Force sensitives. They don't compare to Yoda in the slightest.

Yoda stomps

None of the DC members are above Tiin or Kolar as swordsmen. Yoda blitzes quite a few and takes down the rest easily.

Yoda is not defeating an entire Dark Council.

PT fans are getting ridiculous in their assumptions by the hour.

Yes, we've only decided that this hour.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Yes, we've only decided that this hour.


But nah, Vitate did that as well, and Yoda is his superior

Originally posted by Ursumeles


But nah, Vitate did that as well, and Yoda is his superior


It was an impossible task for Revan, who is definitely Yoda TIER.

Vitiate defeated a Dark Council by virtue of Sith Sorcery; a field in which Yoda doesn't specialize in.

When will people start using their brains? Battles in Star Wars are not the same for everyone.

Revan isn't Yoda-tier, lmfao.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Revan isn't Yoda-tier, lmfao.
So what TIER is he? Ventress's?

Even if he isn't as powerful as RotS Sidious, he's in Sidious' tier. And there's all that scaling to put him above Revan.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
So what TIER is he? Ventress's?
Vader Tier. Maybe a bit above. But far from being Yoda Tier, lmfao.

I do not take this third rate ranking seriously.

Yoda's style is not perfect for the entire DC.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Even if he isn't as powerful as RotS Sidious, he's in Sidious' tier. And there's all that scaling to put him above Revan.
Revan is really close.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Vader Tier. Maybe a bit above. But far from being Yoda Tier, lmfao.
So you assume a huge gap between Darth Vader and Yoda? This is based on?

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
I do not take this third rate ranking seriously.

Yoda's style is not perfect for the entire DC.
This is canonical, lawl.

Well, he can blitz several members, and then proceed to ragdoll and stomp the others.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
So you assume a huge gap between Darth Vader and Yoda? This is based on?
The fact that Yoda is vastly about Dooku, who has comparable feats to Vader?
And the fact that Yoda is Sidious equal?
Why do you assume that Vitate is vastly superior to Jadus then, btw?

Originally posted by Ursumeles
This is canonical, lawl.
That ranking is not canon.

Darth Plagueis just has a blurb (from a secondary source) to his name, and I tend to dismiss such blurbs as valid sources of information. James Luceno wisely avoided this aspect in the actual story.

The only sourcebook where Vitiate and Palpatine are both mentioned (the former in brief), does not promotes Palpatine as the most powerful Sith Lord in a definite manner. This sourcebook is Force and Destiny.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Well, he can blitz several members, and then proceed to ragdoll and stomp the others.
Easier said than done.

Dark Council members are not supposed to be mooks.

We are discussing Legends content here.


This is based on what? Valkorion's power level is such that it demands re-assessment of Palpatine's standing in the lore. But this is not going to happen because of Legends - Canon split.

This is from the Force and Destiny Core Rulebook:

Emperor Palpatine, secretly known as Darth Sidious, remains the most powerful Sith Lord and dark side adherent in the galaxy. His power may be in unparalleled in the history of the Sith.

As you can see, Vitiate's entry in the lore, was sufficient to cast doubt on Palpatine's superiority even at official capacity, in newer sourcebooks.

And the word power in that statement isn't necessarily indicative of his strength; it is open to interpretation. Palpatine's power might be unparalleled in history by virtue of his Empire and its dominion over the galaxy at large.

That was a test. And it has no bearing on how this fight would unfold.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
We are discussing Legends content here.
And it is Legends canon

No, if doesn't
Is the accolade reconnected? No? The it's still canon.
Also, Sidious has better feats than Valkorion does.
And we are discussing SWTOR Vitate, not Valkorion atm.
Thi sis just lolworthy. We have quotes, that aren't reconnected. Sidious > Vitate is a fact.

When he can blitz superior combatants to the DC membets, he can blitz them as well.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
And it is Legends canon
Legends content is OFFICIAL but no longer CANON. This distinction grants readers greater flexibility for arguments in the case of Legends content.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
No, if doesn't
Is the accolade reconnected? No? The it's still canon.
My point flew over your head, it seems.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Also, Sidious has better feats than Valkorion does.
Wrong.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
And we are discussing SWTOR Vitate, not Valkorion atm.
Vitiate, by that time, is Valkorion as well.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Thi sis just lolworthy. We have quotes, that aren't reconnected. Sidious > Vitate is a fact.
Because of Legends - Canon split in the continuity, stupid.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
When he can blitz superior combatants to the DC membets, he can blitz them as well.
Shortsighted generalization there.

They are a part of the Legends continuity. And all the quotes that put Sidious > Vitate are Legends. Your point?

LOL. When he can blitz someone who is better than, lets say, Zash, he can blitz her as well.

Originally posted by SunRazer
None of the DC members are above Tiin or Kolar as swordsmen. Yoda blitzes quite a few and takes down the rest easily.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
It was an impossible task for Revan, who is definitely Yoda TIER.
So now, Revan is in the same league with Viatiate? or Even more powerful? Because Yoda's equal would be

Originally posted by Ursumeles
They are a part of the Legends continuity.
Doesn't negates my point.

By virtue of demonstrated showings and other details, Darth Plagueis is not in the league of Valkorion. Not even close.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
And all the quotes that put Sidious > Vitate are Legends. Your point?
Not a single quote of Palpatine covers Valkorion in its assessment. Your brain fails to comprehend this simple real-world perspective, I wonder.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
LOL. When he can blitz someone who is better than, lets say, Zash, he can blitz her as well.
Again, a shortsighted assessment.

Darth Zash doesn't fights like that; her talents and approach to combat are vastly different from that of let's say Agen Kolar.

More importantly, superior dueling skills do not translate into superior combat prowess. This is an huge misconception. Otherwise, Agen Kolar should be able to defeat Revan in a fight which is virtually impossible for the former.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Even if he isn't as powerful as RotS Sidious, he's in Sidious' tier. And there's all that scaling to put him above Revan.

Erm. And that scaling would be this here:



?

You do realize, that this kind of reasoning totally falls apart on several levels, right?

1)
Darth Plagueis either > or = TPM Sidious, according to James Luceno (since you always seem to factor authorial intent in, do it there). This can also possible be concluded by Sidious words from RotS regarding his own master (which make it even possible that Plagueis > or = RotS Sidious).

2)
The only source for the notion that Plagueis > Vitiate is Plagueis himself, when we don't even know wether he considered Vitiate's "feats" as legit when he made that statement or viewed them as "legends" and "myth". The fact remains that Vitiate has developed Sith magic and alchemy far further than Plagueis has, even if the latter thinks that isn't the case. After all: Vitiate was capable of granting "immortality" to others and transcended the mortality of his body entirely. So he seems to be more powerful than Plagueis.

Which takes us back to square one. Power scaling based on character thoughts is nonsense. We have to look at feats, accolades, implications, facts. In all of those, Vitiate makes anything short of DE Sidious look rather not impressive.

3)
Even accepting the power-scaling as shown above, this says next to nothing about the actual combat abilities of characters. You'd still be comparing the relatively combat shy PT era Sith with their SW:TOR era counterparts, that were participants and products of a year long war between Jedi and Sith. It appears only logical, that people that actually had an active war between force using factions going on, would be better suited for combat than people from eras of relative peace (at least in terms of force users vs force user confrontation).

Non of that, however, is the reason for Yoda losing this fight.
He loses the fight because of the number of opponents, even assuming low-end abilties for those Dark Council members. They are, after all, the most powerful Sith in the current Empire. Thus, it has to be assumed that they are at least moderately skilled in combat and have at least some mid-powerful force abilities up their sleeves.

Now while I could see people making an argument for Yoda managing to tear them apart one by one in a lightsaber only fight, I really don't see him avoiding force attacks and llightsaber attacks from a dozen individuals. And I most certainly don't see him winning this, provided he lacks the offensive options in terms of force attack hat would permanently remove opponents from the fight.

Don't have time for a long response, but:

1. There are many sources directly stating Palpatine > Plagueis, which absolutely take precedence over Luceno's personal opinion. You can find them on my RT's.

2. I'm referring to the back cover.

Vitiate doesn't make non-DE Sidious look unimpressive, but I'd rather not construct a case under such a restrictive timeframe. I'll make a more detailed response later.

3. Except Sidious is obviously better than Vitiate as a combatant (not in direct reference to anyone's post, just the implication you were making about criticizing the scaling). And if there's enough of a power gap, you can afford to be a worse fighter.

And no, the Jedi aren't better suited for combat during the Great Galactic War. They did fight more Force-users, but were trounced by non-Force sensitives all the same. Besides, PT Jedi frequently spar with one another, fight Dark Jedi etc. and their Trial of Skill involves beating simulacrums of ancient Sith Lords. That, and GL has stated that the PT era is the prime of the Jedi with respect to combat.

Yoda prolly blitzes most of them and then takes out the remaining ones via saber ownage or Force superiority.