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Who wins

Honestly, this is a good fight.
Kun wins, tho.

Maul mauls him

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Maul mauls him Then why didn't you vote for him?

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Maul mauls him
wtf lmfao

Kun shows him how it's done.

Kun.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
wtf lmfao

Yeah, I prefer Maul over someone who had trouble with Vodo

Maul lost to Kanan.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Maul lost to the Light Side of the Force.

Indeed.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Yeah, I prefer Maul over someone who had trouble with Vodo
Ngl, that's extremely cringw-worthy.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Ngl, that's extremely cringw-worthy.

Why?

It's certainly better then losing to Kanan.

Originally posted by ares834
Why?

It's certainly better then losing to Kanan.
I meant his comment.
I mean, using him winning against a reowned Swordsman, possible the best of the Time(After Exar and Ulic) isn't a bad feat, lmao.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
I meant his comment.
I mean, using him winning against a reowned Swordsman, possible the best of the Time(After Exar and Ulic) isn't a bad feat, lmao.

Sure but not better than Maul's.

But why mention it as lowshowing for Exar then? LMFAO

Originally posted by Petrus
Kun.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
But why mention it as lowshowing for Exar then? LMFAO

Because it's a relative low showing for him compared to Maul's accomplishements.

Maul dies and DD9 cries.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Because it's a relative low showing for him compared to Maul's accomplishements.
No. Vodo Siosk Baas has no upper limits. He is one of the best duelists in history, and Kun has beatdn him pre-pre-pre-pre-prime.
Beating Vodo several times, once nearly curbing him and once far before his prime >>>> losing to a Dog.

Kunt wins.

Kun, lol.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
No. Vodo Siosk Baas has no upper limits. He is one of the best duelists in history, and Kun has beatdn him pre-pre-pre-pre-prime.
Beating Vodo several times, once nearly curbing him and once far before his prime >>>> losing to a Dog.

When was Vodo ever named one of the best duelists in history? Anyway, yeah Kun did beat him pre-prime like Vodo also humiliated Kun at that point and even a Kun in his prime was just stalemating Vodo in the Senate building until used his double-bladed lightsaber to destroy Vodo's staff.

That's hardly comparable to outdueling one of the best Jedi duelist ever (who has 4000 years worth of Jedi to contend with compared to Vodo) in 30 seconds or even eclipsing the combined skill of this same Jedi with his almost equal Padawan.

Lol, DD thinks TPM Maul > Kun.

Kun is so much more powerful than Maul that skill really isn't a factor tbh.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
When was Vodo ever named one of the best duelists in history? Anyway, yeah Kun did beat him pre-prime like Vodo also humiliated Kun at that point and even a Kun in his prime was just stalemating Vodo in the Senate building until used his double-bladed lightsaber to destroy Vodo's staff.

That's hardly comparable to outdueling one of the best Jedi duelist ever (who has 4000 years worth of Jedi to contend with compared to Vodo) in 30 seconds or even eclipsing the combined skill of this same Jedi with his almost equal Padawan.
WTF? Jinn > Vodo?
I justmean that you can't use it as low showing, as Vodo has no upper limits, besides being below Exar, who hasn't an upper limit either.
Also, when ws Jinn stated to be one of the best duelists in history, by an objective Source?
Alos, it is an good feat for Vodo not a bad one for Exar.

Originally posted by Nephthys
Lol, DD thinks TPM Maul > Kun.

Kun is so much more powerful than Maul that skill really isn't a factor tbh.

It's lightsaber only dumbass

Power factors into dueling.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
WTF? Jinn > Vodo?
I justmean that you can't use it as low showing, as Vodo has no upper limits, besides being below Exar, who hasn't an upper limit either.
Also, when ws Jinn stated to be one of the best duelists in history, by an objective Source?
Alos, it is an good feat for Vodo not a bad one for Exar.

It isn't about "upper limits" or anything, it's about accolades and feats. Tell me what makes Vodo or Exar so impressive then?

Here it is and he has others like being better than Anoon Bondara, one of the best fighters of the PT Jedi Order.



--The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

Originally posted by SunRazer
Power factors into dueling.

The hole "superior power, superior duelist" thing doesn't work, there are dozens of contradictions in the mythos and it generally depends on the writers/creative team.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
It isn't about "upper limits" or anything, it's about accolades and feats. Tell me what makes Vodo or Exar so impressive then?

Here it is and he has others like being better than Anoon Bondara, one of the best fighters of the PT Jedi Order.


--The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia
Yes, but you use it as low showing.


Ask Nova or someone, I don't know so much about Exar and co. But, IIRC, severed Ulic blitzed Warb Null. Ulic statlemated Ulic, before he constructed his double-bladed Lightsaber, and grow in power.

Edit: Oh, and he was was "regarded". No objective source.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Yes, but you use it as low showing.


Ask Nova or someone, I don't know so much about Exar and co. But, IIRC, severed Ulic blitzed Warb Null. Ulic statlemated Ulic, before he constructed his double-bladed Lightsaber, and grow in power.

Do you know what the term "relatively" means? I said it's a low showing when you look at what Maul has accomplished, doesn't mean it's low showing compared to other characters.

So you actually aren't fully aware of Exar's prowess (or Vodo's) yet you claim he wins? Weird.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
I don't know so much about Exar and co. But, IIRC, severed Ulic blitzed Warb Null. Ulic statlemated Ulic, before he constructed his double-bladed Lightsaber wat

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Do you know what the term "relatively" means? I said it's a low showing when you look at what Maul has accomplished, doesn't mean it's low showing compared to other characters.

So you actually aren't fully aware of Exar's prowess (or Vodo's) yet you claim he wins? Weird.
That isn't what low showing means .
Getting floored by a dog is one.

I am actually aware what Exar did, but I can't explain it an are prolly forgeting details.

Nvm, Ulic bested Warb Null while weakened, and still a novice.
Still better thn Rebels Maul's showings

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
The hole "superior power, superior duelist" thing doesn't work, there are dozens of contradictions in the mythos and it generally depends on the writers/creative team.

Superior power doesn't necessarily make you outright more skilled, because there are other factors, but it's actually generally the rule, rather than the exception, that greater power affords you greater natural talent with a blade.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Superior power doesn't necessarily make you outright more skilled, because there are other factors, but it's actually generally the rule, rather than the exception, that greater power affords you greater natural talent with a blade.

How are you going to draw the line between characters that fall under your general rule or those that are exceptions? Even Drew's Bane Trilogy, which heavily favors the "better connection to the Force, better skill" idea someone like Zannah, who's potential is greater than Bane's, would never be his better in lightsaber combat

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Nvm, Ulic bested Warb Null while weakened, and still a novice.
Still better thn Rebels Maul's showings

And what has Warb Null done besides being a skilled fighter to make this oh so impressive?

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
How are you going to draw the line between characters that fall under your general rule or those that are exceptions? Even Drew's Bane Trilogy, which heavily favors the "better connection to the Force, better skill" idea someone like Zannah, who's potential is greater than Bane's, would never be his better in lightsaber combat

Sorry but where is that stated? Zannah was about evenly skilled with Bane in DoE, except her Form III can't bring her victory against the more powerful Form V, as Fightsaber says of Ben Kenobi vs Vader.

Exceptions are exceptions because they're few and far between. I think you can generally class people under the rule. That's why it is a rule.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Sorry but where is that stated? Zannah was about evenly skilled with Bane in DoE, except her Form III can't bring her victory against the more powerful Form V, as Fightsaber says of Ben Kenobi vs Vader.

Exceptions are exceptions because they're few and far between. I think you can generally class people under the rule. That's why it is a rule.

Zannah evenly skilled? Oh please, not this Soresu shit again and she admitted herself that Bane was the superior warrior and this was before she witnessed his full prowess. There is still something called talent which has little to do with connection to the Force, it's the reason why Zannah's more talented in Sorcery than Bane while the latter is better in things like Lightning or why Luke was instantly learning Djem So by just fighting Vader while Anakin never showed that kind of progress despite having at least equal connection to the Force.

Again, where do you draw the line?

Anyways, Kun's "superior augmentation" should already be taken into account when we look at his feats so it doesn't really matter.

That's because Luke was older than Anakin when he started training and the Force had more time to mature within him. Anakin has shown some pretty insane growth himself.

Bane being the superior warrior doesn't necessarily make him skilfully superior. As I recall, he was unable to break Zannah's defense. That's even dueling.

And by the way, there's a point at which your power is so great that you don't need an inherent talent for things - which was explored in Darth Plagueis. Most talents are derived either from mindset or strength in the Force anyways.

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
And what has Warb Null done besides being a skilled fighter to make this oh so impressive?
Dunno. So he's the same as Bondara, at very least.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
So he's the same as Bondara, at very least.

Being skilled/formidable isn't the same as being one of the greatest swordsmen in the Jedi Order's history.

Originally posted by MythLord
Being skilled/formidable isn't the same as being one of the greatest swordsmen in the Jedi Order's history.
Does it give an objective Source for that?
I only know that a padawan says that he's the best.

Originally posted by SunRazer
That's because Luke was older than Anakin when he started training and the Force had more time to mature within him. Anakin has shown some pretty insane growth himself.

Bane being the superior warrior doesn't necessarily make him skilfully superior. As I recall, he was unable to break Zannah's defense. That's even dueling.

And by the way, there's a point at which your power is so great that you don't need an inherent talent for things - which was explored in Darth Plagueis. Most talents are derived either from mindset or strength in the Force anyways.

Fair enough.

Let's not do mental gymnastics here Nova, he's very much likely more skillful and no it isn't, dueling evenly is matching each other in all areas to the point nobody can get a permanent advantage throughout the fight. Zannah only defended from Bane's attacks, hardly means that she's dueling evenly or do you want to assume Ahsoka's Vader's equal because the latter couldn't break her defenses?

Point still stands that Zannah and Bane were rough equals yet still were talented in different areas.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Does it give an objective Source for that?
I only know that a padawan says that he's the best.

Bondara's considered one of the best fighters the Jedi Order had during the PT Era and he's even a weapon's master IIRC marking him one of the best in the Jedi Order's history.

Following quote gives you a good idea of the hype Weapon's Masters generally receive:

"Only a handful were ever elevated to the rank of Jedi Weapons Master, and these were revered for their skills."

--Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Does it give an objective Source for that?
I only know that a padawan says that he's the best.

Actually, more than a padawan... And yeah, other sources have recokened him as one of the best swordsmen of the Order, and he is a Jedi Weapon's Master, which is the highest rank of warrior that masters some of the most difficult disciplines of fighting in the Order.

Originally posted by MythLord
Actually, more than a padawan... And yeah, other sources have recokened him as one of the best swordsmen of the Order, and he is a Jedi Weapon's Master, which is the highest rank of warrior that masters some of the most difficult disciplines of fighting in the Order.

More Maul hype, jeej!

Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Fair enough.

Let's not do mental gymnastics here Nova, he's very much likely more skillful and no it isn't, dueling evenly is matching each other in all areas to the point nobody can get a permanent advantage throughout the fight. Zannah only defended from Bane's attacks, hardly means that she's dueling evenly or do you want to assume Ahsoka's Vader's equal because the latter couldn't break her defenses?

Point still stands that Zannah and Bane were rough equals yet still were talented in different areas.

There's no mental gymanstics, lol. Banite Sith challenge their Masters when they're on the same level. As for Zannah only defending - that's part of Soresu and why I quoted Fightsaber. Zannah vs Bane is similar to Ben vs Vader in that Soresu allowed her to hold off Bane and prevent Bane from penetrating her defenses, but couldn't bring her victory in actual dueling.

The fact that there are talents in different realms of the Force doesn't mean that it applies to lightsaber combat as well. There's obviously more factors to it than just power, but as of yet it's a rather well established principle in SW that the powerful have a natural, innate talent for a lightsaber, and that makes sense considering it's the Force that allows you to wield a lightsaber to good effect to begin with. What was the evidence in your mind to suggest otherwise?

And the Bane trilogy doesn't just suggest that power is heavily involved in dueling - it outright states it.

Originally posted by SunRazer
There's no mental gymanstics, lol. Banite Sith challenge their Masters when they're on the same level. As for Zannah only defending - that's part of Soresu and why I quoted Fightsaber. Zannah vs Bane is similar to Ben vs Vader in that Soresu allowed her to hold off Bane and prevent Bane from penetrating her defenses, but couldn't bring her victory in actual dueling.

The fact that there are talents in different realms of the Force doesn't mean that it applies to lightsaber combat as well. There's obviously more factors to it than just power, but as of yet it's a rather well established principle in SW that the powerful have a natural, innate talent for a lightsaber, and that makes sense considering it's the Force that allows you to wield a lightsaber to good effect to begin with. What was the evidence in your mind to suggest otherwise?

And the Bane trilogy doesn't just suggest that power is heavily involved in dueling - it outright states it.

Well that's unfair, I mean Vader can push back Ahsoka and everyone's agreeing that he's winning because he's gaining ground etc but when we put Ben (or Zannah) in Ahsoka's place, he's (or she's) just employing his fighting style and generally considered equal because Vader can't penetrate Ben's defenses while Vader never penetrated Ahsoka's defenses either. I understand of course that Soresu fighters are defensive but the whole "he's willingly giving ground" argument is just unfair when looking at other characters.

Yes, I agree with that but (again) where do you draw the line? Because if you can't properly use your theory then it's worthless on these boards. I was mainly considering Maul vs Obi-Wan, Vader vs Ben, Luke vs Vader, ... In all those fights there is one character considerably more powerful than the other yet that doesn't completely translate wen looking at their lightsaber duels.

Voila, yet even there Bane's still Zannah's superior in martial combat (before even showing his full prowess in that area) so the gap between them is pretty noticeable. Anyway, it actually shouldn't matter that much, I mean Kun's superior power would already be taken into account when examining his feats right so why make a different discussion of it?

Kun trashes him.