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I'm talking about Force power only, and not raw power, but the type of power you can bring consistently to bear in a fight.

Who does Knightfall Anakin best compare with?

He's in Vader's tier. Possibly at the edge of Plagueis Tier.

You think there's only a tier between Vader and Plagueis? Interesting.

More than a Tier, at least 1,5.
Plagueis is at the upper end of his tier (or we just put him in Yoda's tier, that would be easier lol) and Vader relative low in his tier.

Palpatine/Yoda-tier.

Just under ROTS Palps, honestly

Yoda tier, probably.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
More than a Tier, at least 1,5.
Plagueis is at the upper end of his tier (or we just put him in Yoda's tier, that would be easier lol) and Vader relative low in his tier. Lol. Plagueis doesn't even scratch Vader's behind.

Originally posted by chingchangwalla
Just under ROTS Palps, honestly Mainly due to the fact that Sidious knows more and has more experience with Force techniques.

Lucas did say "If Anakin hadn't got all beat up, he could've beat the Emperor."

And he was planning on killing him after exterminating the Jedi (for the sake of peace kek).

Originally posted by Beniboybling
Lol. Plagueis doesn't even scratch Vader's behind. What do you mean?

I mean that Plagueis wouldn't be able to scratch Vader's butt cheeks, because he is wearing armour.

I meant the other way around kek.

Originally posted by Beniboybling
I mean that Plagueis wouldn't be able to scratch Vader's butt cheeks, because he is wearing armour.

Plagueis can still penetrate it with his fist.

anakin can take anyone at least up until rots save for yoda and sidious. He has greater raw power+greater saber skill+greater strength+greater speed than anyone not named yoda/sidious which Ino can definitely make up for a mastery gap. He also has drain resistance and can deal with lightning by virtue of his blade.

^He has more of a couple of those things than anyone including people named Yoda and Sidious.

Strength+drain resistance?
Raw power?

Knightfall Vader is probably the strongest iteration of Vader in terms of his combative skills. Later versions of Vader are obviously more powerful in the Force, but I just view KnightVader as a complete wrecker who couldn't be stopped.

Unless you want to argue vader is yoda level

Hella.

He's one-shotting a Jedi who's listed as possibly the greatest swordsman in the Jedi Order after cutting through hordes of other Jedi.

A literal juggernaut.

Originally posted by MythLord
Hella fine.

In force? between Bane and Plagueis

Originally posted by Kurk
In force? above Bane and Plagueis fixed

Originally posted by Geistalt
fixed Bane and Plagueis are on the same tier for me so...

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
He's one-shotting a Jedi who's listed as possibly the greatest swordsman in the Jedi Order after cutting through hordes of other Jedi.

A literal juggernaut.
Source?

For him one-one-shotting Drallig or Drallig being the finest swordsman in the Temple?

For possibly bring the greatest duelist in the Jedi order....

Vader level in the force, almost Sidious level in sabers

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Source?

You should check out Ant's Anakin VS Cin Drallig Examination

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
For possibly bring the greatest duelist in the Jedi order....

He's one of, not the greatest.

Sure, but it's still ridiculous to assume Knightfall Anakin isn't a slaughtering powerhouse.

Knightfall Anakin's definitely > Tyranus. As in, never losing any out of 10.

Is it really that far-fetched to claim he was as powerful as Yoda?

Originally posted by Geistalt
Knightfall Anakin's definitely > Tyranus. As in, never losing any out of 10.

Is it really that far-fetched to claim he was as powerful as Yoda? Anakin is still emotionally skewed up and vulnerable to dun moch attacks

Good point.

Knightfall Anakin is potentially >> Dooku

Originally posted by Kurk
Anakin is still emotionally skewed up and vulnerable to dun moch attacks
Yup and dooku's vulnerable to having his head chopped off

Originally posted by Zenwolf
He's one of, not the greatest. Ant said "possibly the greatest duelist in the order"
Though I'm assuming that was a typo

Wasn't a typo. A quote does state he is / possibly the greatest

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Yup and dooku's vulnerable to having his head chopped off of course the nice thing about Star Wars match-ups is that it's not Yu-gi-oh or Pokemon. In other words, the highest stats doesn't always grant you the win. Individual characters have their own mental strengths, weaknesses, morals which can turn the tides of a fight.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Wasn't a typo. A quote does state he is / possibly the greatest his third leg clearly got too excited thinking about Cin and ultimately stretched the truth XD

Originally posted by Kurk
of course the nice thing about Star Wars match-ups is that it's not Yu-gi-oh or Pokemon. In other words, the highest stats doesn't always grant you the win. Individual characters have their own mental strengths, weaknesses, morals which can turn the tides of a fight.
Dooku's neck is a weakness

Originally posted by TenebrousWay
Knightfall Anakin is potentially >> Dooku Not potentially, he'll win that fight every time.

Knightfall wrecks Dooku lol

Originally posted by TenebrousWay
Knightfall Anakin is potentially >> Dooku

I started off thinking that "Knightfall Anakin takes 10/10" suggestion was hyperbolic.

Glad to find most of you agree.

As per novelization, even Standard Anakin may take 10/10 against Dooku. Dude was almost losing conscience just to block Anakin's blows.

Originally posted by TenebrousWay
As per novelization, even Standard Anakin may take 10/10 against Dooku. Dude was almost losing conscience just to block Anakin's blows. nah, cause like I pointed out, Anakin is emotionally immature and vulnerable to dun moch. The novelization states that Dooku started winning in the end until Sidious intervened.

10/10 means stomp, and Anakin was working just as hard as Dooku to defeat him.

More like 7/10

How hard Anakin was working is irrelevant, 'cause Tyranus wasn't going to win. Especially if they somehow fought each other afterwards.

'cause once Sidious talked him into using rage, there was no way in hell anyone else was talking him out of it.

I really wish they had shown Anakin at the Jedi temple easily cutting down multiple Jedi at once... oh well

So we agree that he's not above Palpatine in spite of the quotes about his "unparalleled power/ablities" and "unmatched skill"? There are certainly ways around either quote.

He would take a slight majority in sabers against sheev

Originally posted by Kurk
10/10 means stomp

Wrong.



Also wrong.

Originally posted by SunRazer
So we agree that he's not above Palpatine in spite of the quotes about his "unparalleled power/ablities" and "unmatched skill"? There are certainly ways around either quote.
Yeah. And Palpatine was the one who said both those things anyways

Originally posted by Rebel95
Yeah. And Palpatine was the one who said both those things anyways

The "unparalleled Force abilities" accolade is from an objective, third person source. It was not stated by Palpatine.

Ah, thought he said that too for some reason. What's the source?

The 2008 SW.com databank

Anakin > Sidious ~ Yoda in raw power. #confirmed

Right, but this thread isn't about raw power, per the OP.

Yeh I'm just pointing out that being unparalleled, along with Lucas' statenent that Anakin could have fought Sidious if not for his injuries, altogether paints Skywalker a very pretty picture.

Mhm. Although, that quote is a bit ambiguous, as it doesn't elaborate on timeframe.

Given the topic on-hand, Mustafar Anakin before he gets deep fried.

Knightfall Vader was well on his way to being more powerful than Sidious. If he had killed Obi Wan, he should be very close, if not more powerful than Sidious. Logically, killing Obi Wan would complete his path to the dark side and probably rid him of some of the confliction he was struggling with

Or it could've turned him into Kylo Ren and amplified that mental conflict.

I agree they're close.

"Unparalleled Force abilities" to me does not sound like raw power, but Sidious has other quotes of supremacy among the Sith (Anakin falls under that jurisdiction by Knightfall) that take precedence.

Yeah that's also a possibility. Unfortunately we'll never know, he had to be an arrogant little shit and get half his body cut off

"A fatal transformation."

Knightfall Vader deigns himself greater than or = RotS Sidious confirmed.

That's factually untrue though. Probably just his ego speaking.

Factually untrue? In what way?

Sidious is factually more powerful per the sources that list him as the most powerful Sith/dark side practitioner - Vader falls under the jurisdiction of those quotes.

Yeah...

Maybe Anakin could've been stronger if he'd just beaten Obi-Wan (or fled unscathed).

He would've surpassed Palpatine in the forseeable future, definitely. Gillard already calls him "far more dangerous than anybody in this universe", which is a reference to his potential to surpass even the best of the era in due time.

"Had he sustained none of his injuries on Mustafar, he would have most likely been twice as powerful as the Emperor and four times more powerful than even Galen Marek. In fact, it is estimated that if he was as strong as he was when he purged the Jedi Temple when facing Galen Marek, he would have easily outmatched and killed him."
Taken from http://theforceunleashed.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Vader

I don't know how reliable this source is or where it got this information from, but still

It's neither interesting nor reliable.

I'm interested in where it got that information from or if it just made it up lol

Completely made up.

Made up but probably true tbh

Originally posted by AncientPower
Anakin = Sidious ~ Yoda in raw power. #confirmed Fixed.

Nah in raw power Anakin has more than anyone in the sw universe

We now know that the intent was for him to be exactly as powerful as RotS Sidious.

"off"

Still screwed up by quoting Rebel95.

Above Dooku, bellow Jerec.

On Yoda's level

Originally posted by Petrus
Knightfall Vader is probably the strongest iteration of Vader in terms of his combative skills. Later versions of Vader are obviously more powerful in the Force, but I just view KnightVader as a complete wrecker who couldn't be stopped.

Totally agree

He's in the same tier as the likes of Revan, Caedus, Nihilus, Kun and Plagueis.

Originally posted by Azronger
The "unparalleled Force abilities" accolade is from an objective, third person source. It was not stated by Palpatine.


Nah it's from Palpatine in LOTS.

Originally posted by Rebel95
I really wish they had shown Anakin at the Jedi temple easily cutting down multiple Jedi at once... oh well


That's what we were all hoping for Lol

Between Dooku/Mace and Sidious/Yoda

Below Windu, slightly.

Nah, he's above Windu in Knightfall.

Originally posted by Kurk
Between Valkorion and Sidious/Yoda fixed

Originally posted by Kurk
nah, cause like I pointed out, Anakin is emotionally immature and vulnerable to dun moch. The novelization states that Dooku started winning in the end until Sidious intervened.

10/10 means stomp, and Anakin was working just as hard as Dooku to defeat him.

More like 7/10

11/10 would be a stomp.

Originally posted by Petrus
Nah, he's above Windu in Knightfall. IF he is, it's by no sizeable margin.

Stronger than ROTJ Vader.

What Ant said.

Also Anakin hadn't eat or slept for several days as noted in the ROTS novelization. This was probably countered by him having to protect Palpatine. From what we saw in the video his rage wasn't prompted.

~TPM Sheev as a duelist, just below as a Force user. Overall ~ Plagueis

Mace level. Approaching Dooku level.

Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Mace level. Approaching Dooku level.

Originally posted by TheNuisanceBird
Anakin hadn't eat or slept for several days as noted in the ROTS novelization. This was probably countered by him having to protect Palpatine. From what we saw in the video his rage wasn't prompted.
They did have him 1v1 Tyranus during Palpatine's ritual in TCW (and he won all on his own).

Either way, where Vader stood before Sidious talked him into drawing on his rage has no bearing on how strong he was by the end of Operation: Knightfall.

3 months max and Vader would've pushed Sidious' sh!t in, if only Mustafar hadnt happened....

Originally posted by Geistalt
They did have him 1v1 Tyranus during Palpatine's ritual in TCW (and he won all on his own).

Either way, where Vader stood before Sidious talked him into drawing on his rage has no bearing on how strong he was by the end of Operation: Knightfall. Dooku had just killed Rex and Anakin's buddies. Same effect as when Dooku downed Kenobi in RotS.

Anakin wasn't enraged by Obi-Wan's defeat. It was either Dooku's Dun Moch simply backfiring on him, or Palpatine encouraging him to draw upon his hate, depending on the source.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Nah it's from Palpatine in LOTS.

No, that was from Tarkin,IIRC and I'm talking about Knightfall Vader here. The old SW databank states his Force abilities are unparallelled. That's an objective source.

Originally posted by Azronger
No, that was from Tarkin,


Ah might be.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Anakin wasn't enraged by Obi-Wan's defeat. It was either Dooku's Dun Moch simply backfiring on him, or Palpatine encouraging him to draw upon his hate, depending on the source. In the film you can notice Anakin yelling out a cry as he jumps to kick Dooku in the face; almost as if seeing his life-long fatherly figure friend nearly killed renewed his mental energy after just being kicked onto his ass by Dooku.