Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

DOS Superman:

http://comicsbeat.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/superman-death-of.jpg

vs.

Amped Kurse:

http://static3.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/11352/606247-kurse.jpg

So yeah, this is bloodlusted Superman.

Who wins this fight?

So this is Kurse that was given the strength to be 4x Thor strength.

2 Questions.

Is his iron vulnerability a well known fact?

What battlefield are they fighting on? What I'm asking is, are they in a scrap yard, a park, or is this just a featureless environment begging the question of whether or not DOS Superman would be able to defeat Kurse?

From what I recall, Superman was far weaker during the DOS era, than he was a little less than 10 years later than the event. My guess would be that he may have a chance, but I think that without the knowledge of Kurse's vulnerability that he could be in for a lot of trouble, plus if this is a featureless environment, he'd likely have no way of permanently putting Kurse down. Kurse after all had Beta Ray Bill, and Thor beat.

Man of Steel (Steel is an alloy made of Iron and others) vs someone wirh an Iron weakness.

Kurse. he doesnt even need to be Amped. an average Kurse who is 2 times stronger than thor will defeat superman. he is also magically enhanced isnt he? if so then its almost a stomp.

Kurse kills him every single time.

Superman's too smart to die against Kurse tbh.

Didn't realize bfr wasn't turned off. Superman could win this every single time just by tossing Kurse out of the city.

Kurse wins.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Superman's too smart to die against Kurse tbh.

So he would run away.

Lol. Kurse in a ultra beatdown. Superman loses his head to any version of Kurse. Spite.

Superman if he is willing to kill.

Guys I don't think even weakness exploitation will work. Remember, Power Pack dropped an entire building frame composed of iron on him and he yelled in pain but wasn't KOed. Then (later) Energizer combined the powers of BOTH Mjolnir and Stormbreaker to finally put him down.

I don't see how Kurse loses.

Kurse's 'weakness' to iron is massively overrated.

Despite his plethora of appearances, said 'weakness' has only been exploited ONE time on panel -- and that was when Power Pack dropped the framework of a f*cking skyscraper on top of him(ie. hundredS of tonS of material.) But even in that case, Kurse was still able to dig himself out of the rubble later in the same issue, and appeared none the worse for wear.

My point is just that some people tend to act like iron is akin to Kurse's Kryptonite... Which is simply not the case.

Originally posted by Galan007
Kurse's 'weakness' to iron is massively overrated.

Despite his plethora of appearances, said 'weakness' has only been exploited ONE time on panel -- and that was when Power Pack dropped the framework of a f*cking skyscraper on top of him(ie. hundredS of tonS of material.) But even in that case, Kurse was still able to dig himself out of the rubble later in the same issue, and appeared none the worse for wear.

My point is just that some people tend to act like iron is akin to Kurse's Kryptonite... Which is simply not the case.

I did say vulnerability, not weakness. There's a difference. Well, just in case your post was directed at anything that I wrote. I don't believe that it is overrated in any way. It is a vulnerability of his, which could be exploited if the character fighting him knew about it. This is why I asked if it were a well known fact. If it is, then Superman (depending on battlefield) could use it to hurt him. In a featureless environment though... Well you know.

No, no. It wasn't directed toward you at all.

Bloodlusted Superman was at least 4 times more powerful than his average self. Also Superhuman is actually many times faster than a bullet. If Kurse fought a character with the speed and reflexes of a bullet then he wouldn't be able to land a blow.

Superman should view Kurse as a statue or at least in very slow motion.

Superman's hv could mess him up too.

I think Superman would put on a great showing, but I still think Kurse would be too much for him in the end.

Originally posted by h1a8
Bloodlusted Superman was at least 4 times more powerful than his average self. Also Superhuman is actually many times faster than a bullet. If Kurse fought a character with the speed and reflexes of a bullet then he wouldn't be able to land a blow.

Superman should view Kurse as a statue or at least in very slow motion.

Superman's hv could mess him up too. Please don't polute this thread with this 4 times more powerful crap. The speed things is acceptable, but again, please don't polute this thread with this 4 times more powerful crap

Originally posted by JBL
Please don't polute this thread with this 4 times more powerful crap. The speed things is acceptable, but again, please don't polute this thread with this 4 times more powerful crap Well how many times more powerful would you estimate?
Going from hours of fighting to not being able to damage DD to killing him in a few panels.

Originally posted by h1a8
Well how many times more powerful would you estimate?
Going from hours of fighting to not being able to damage DD to killing him in a few panels. Z.E.R.O.... 0.... Zero... Zero times more powerful. You think just because superman gets bloodlusted he gets 1 2 3 or 4 times more powerful?? Who told you that??

Originally posted by JBL
Z.E.R.O.... 0.... Zero... Zero times more powerful. You think just because superman gets bloodlusted he gets 1 2 3 or 4 times more powerful?? Who told you that?? Semantics. Obviously he hits harder bloodlusted than when holding back his full might.

Let me rephrase the question. How much harder did Superman hit DD in the last few panels to kill him than in the hours of fighting where he couldn't even manage to hurt DD?

Originally posted by JBL
Z.E.R.O.... 0.... Zero... Zero times more powerful. You think just because superman gets bloodlusted he gets 1 2 3 or 4 times more powerful?? Who told you that??
The writers?Originally posted by zopzop
Guys I don't think even weakness exploitation will work. Remember, Power Pack dropped an entire building frame composed of iron on him and he yelled in pain but wasn't KOed. Then (later) Energizer combined the powers of BOTH Mjolnir and Stormbreaker to finally put him down.

I don't see how Kurse loses.
By punching him out? Superman actually killed Doomsday who was even stronger than him at normal levels when he went all out.

What has Kurse done to match that level of strength?

Originally posted by abhilegend
The writers?
By punching him out? Superman actually killed Doomsday who was even stronger than him at normal levels when he went all out.

What has Kurse done to match that level of strength? So you and h1a8 now write for DC comics? Congrats, hope to read more of your comic's.

Originally posted by JBL
Z.E.R.O.... 0.... Zero... Zero times more powerful. You think just because superman gets bloodlusted he gets 1 2 3 or 4 times more powerful?? Who told you that??

Carver has.

Originally posted by carver9
http://static4.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11128/111283034/5670704-5649676-9944290360-42355.jpg

'Bizarro may actually be stronger....but because of the way his brain functions...or DOESN'T function...he can't access his power like I could!'

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Carver has.



'Bizarro may actually be stronger....but because of the way his brain functions...or DOESN'T function...he can't access his power like I could!' Actually, this scan proves my point. Lol.

How did I know Dark post would involve me, lol?

Is there are reason to suspect that Superman would be unable to use his massive speed/perception/reaction advantage(s) to BFR Kurse, like he could have done to Doomsday?

http://i.imgur.com/3sXo3Ib.jpg


mmm

Originally posted by carver9
How did I know Dark post would involve me, lol? He doesn't understand what that scan means. It destroys his entire argument.

Originally posted by JBL
He doesn't understand what that scan means. It destroys his entire argument. May and Is are too different words. Also Superman was referring to POTENTIAL. Bizarro can't access his full potential strength.

Originally posted by JBL
Actually, this scan proves my point. Lol.

It shows Superman is well versed in the technique of unlocking mental barriers.

As soon as he was in Bizarros body, he used that experience to full use, unlocking Bs potential.

What did I not understand? I hope you....surely....didn't think i was implying something else, did you?

Because misunderstanding other peoples arguments and crowing is....kinda funny.

Originally posted by h1a8
May and Is are too different words. Also Superman was referring to POTENTIAL. Bizarro can't access his full potential strength. NO. Totally wrong. Stop adding words to that statement.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It shows Superman is well versed in the technique of unlocking mental barriers.

As soon as he was in Bizarros body, he used that experience to full use, unlocking Bs potential.

What did I not understand? I hope you....surely....didn't think i was implying something else, did you?

Because misunderstanding other peoples arguments and crowing is....kinda funny. Still don't get it huh? Superman didn't unlock anything. Bs was too stupid to go full strength, Superman can go full strength because he's not retarded. Neither one of them can get 1 2 3 or 4 times stronger UNLESS they use an outside force. Do you know what you ( among many ) are implying? If superman engaged kurse in hand to hand combat ALONE, no speed and no running ( he going to wish he did) just duking it out with Kurse, your mythical superman is going to drop mental blocks, get atleast 3 times stronger and beat Kurse. Yet this same superman went all out against Thor and BARELY won ( won't ever do it again) yet Kurse beat the hell out of a belt of strength wearing Thor who would have stomped superman.

I think the scan just shows that Superman have a limit. If he didn't, he wouldn't believe that Bizzaro is stronger than him.

Originally posted by JBL
Still don't get it huh? Superman didn't unlock anything. Bs was too stupid to go full strength, Superman can go full strength because he's not retarded. Neither one of them can get 1 2 3 or 4 times stronger UNLESS they use an outside force. Do you know what you ( among many ) are implying? If superman engaged kurse in hand to hand combat ALONE, no speed and no running ( he going to wish he did) just duking it out with Kurse, your mythical superman is going to drop mental blocks, get atleast 3 times stronger and beat Kurse. Yet this same superman went all out against Thor and BARELY won ( won't ever do it again) yet Kurse beat the hell out of a belt of strength wearing Thor who would have stomped superman.

When was the Thor incident?

Originally posted by carver9
I think the scan just shows that Superman have a limit. If he didn't, he wouldn't believe that Bizzaro is stronger than him.

Every herald being has a limit. Superman doesn't have infinite strength, otherwise he would disintegrate anything with a punch when not holding back.

Bizzaro limit COULD be higher but he can't access that limit, which is the whole point.

Originally posted by h1a8
Every herald being has a limit. Superman doesn't have infinite strength, otherwise he would disintegrate anything with a punch when not holding back.

Bizzaro limit COULD be higher but he can't access that limit, which is the whole point.

Seems like his base is higher as well.

Originally posted by Galan007
Is there are reason to suspect that Superman would be unable to use his massive speed/perception/reaction advantage(s) to BFR Kurse, like he could have done to Doomsday?

http://i.imgur.com/3sXo3Ib.jpg


mmm



Or he can just throw him in orbit, as he has done to Lobo repeatedly.

People are seriously underestimating Superman's resourcefulness. He's one of the smartest high powered fighters in comics.

kurse wouldn't be able to even hit superman if he didn't allow it. supes would get hit once, realize 'da fuq', then fight smart then as phil and galan have said, simply lob him into space, or into the sun. just because thor and bill stood and fought it out h2h doesn't mean someone smart and in a forum setting would do the same. this really isn't in doubt in any way, unless you assume superman is a moron.

Jesus. I can post scans showing the opposite of everything he just said in his post but what's the point? He is going to say it again in another post. Ridiculous.

So now we have superman in bfr mode and not being able to be hit. BUT!! The same people vote against Hyperion, Gladiator, Black Adam, Captain Marvel when they are put up against the same or similar opponents. Only superman gets the bfr or not being hit treatment. Yet by FEATS, he gets hit ALL the time by far slower opponents. But when it is necessary to give superman the win, he's taken out of character to meet that objective by his fans. The Royal treatment is stronger than ever before when it comes to superman. JBL points this out. Yet gets called a hater. What I hate is the fact that only superman gets SPECIAL powers, unknown abilities, misconceptions and flat out lies about what he can, have or is going to do. Same class of fans every single day for forever and a day. You cannot for the love of debating debate against a character that has fans in bulk that has THEIR own version of Superman that does not match up to the actual comic superman that disappears when someone attempts to use him in a thread.

Originally posted by JBL
Z.E.R.O.... 0.... Zero... Zero times more powerful. You think just because superman gets bloodlusted he gets 1 2 3 or 4 times more powerful?? Who told you that??

Its the mental blocks thing man. Havent you heard?

I'm with you JBL, its all BS.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/96884/2382074-speedblitz__1_.jpg

Originally posted by JBL
So now we have superman in bfr mode and not being able to be hit. BUT!! The same people vote against Hyperion, Gladiator, Black Adam, Captain Marvel when they are put up against the same or similar opponents. Only superman gets the bfr or not being hit treatment. Yet by FEATS, he gets hit ALL the time by far slower opponents. But when it is necessary to give superman the win, he's taken out of character to meet that objective by his fans. The Royal treatment is stronger than ever before when it comes to superman. JBL points this out. Yet gets called a hater. What I hate is the fact that only superman gets SPECIAL powers, unknown abilities, misconceptions and flat out lies about what he can, have or is going to do. Same class of fans every single day for forever and a day. You cannot for the love of debating debate against a character that has fans in bulk that has THEIR own version of Superman that does not match up to the actual comic superman that disappears when someone attempts to use him in a thread.

This. I agree completely.

Originally posted by JBL
So now we have superman in bfr mode and not being able to be hit. BUT!! The same people vote against Hyperion, Gladiator, Black Adam, Captain Marvel when they are put up against the same or similar opponents. Only superman gets the bfr or not being hit treatment. Yet by FEATS, he gets hit ALL the time by far slower opponents. But when it is necessary to give superman the win, he's taken out of character to meet that objective by his fans. The Royal treatment is stronger than ever before when it comes to superman. JBL points this out. Yet gets called a hater. What I hate is the fact that only superman gets SPECIAL powers, unknown abilities, misconceptions and flat out lies about what he can, have or is going to do. Same class of fans every single day for forever and a day. You cannot for the love of debating debate against a character that has fans in bulk that has THEIR own version of Superman that does not match up to the actual comic superman that disappears when someone attempts to use him in a thread.

Superman can win, but I just don't think it's going to come via slugging it out with a super powered version of Jason Voorhees.

Originally posted by JBL
So now we have superman in bfr mode and not being able to be hit. BUT!! The same people vote against Hyperion, Gladiator, Black Adam, Captain Marvel when they are put up against the same or similar opponents. Only superman gets the bfr or not being hit treatment. Yet by FEATS, he gets hit ALL the time by far slower opponents. But when it is necessary to give superman the win, he's taken out of character to meet that objective by his fans. The Royal treatment is stronger than ever before when it comes to superman. JBL points this out. Yet gets called a hater. What I hate is the fact that only superman gets SPECIAL powers, unknown abilities, misconceptions and flat out lies about what he can, have or is going to do. Same class of fans every single day for forever and a day. You cannot for the love of debating debate against a character that has fans in bulk that has THEIR own version of Superman that does not match up to the actual comic superman that disappears when someone attempts to use him in a thread.

It's not about what some people argue but rather what's true.
Superman is not a moron, even if he sometimes fought like one.
He doesn't purposely turn his speed perception off or completely rule out bfr if he decides that's the only way to win. Bottom line: Superman has options. He will use them if he feels they are necessary.

You can't pick and choose. Characters fight to the best of their ability as shown before. That's for anyone.


With that said, this version of Superhuman hits much harder than his average self (which can compete with any herald). He has speed and perceptions to see the fight many times slower than a normal being. He has bfr options if he decides that's the only way to win.

Originally posted by h1a8
It's not about what some people argue but rather what's true.
Superman is not a moron, even if he sometimes fought like one.
He doesn't purposely turn his speed perception off or completely rule out bfr if he decides that's the only way to win. Bottom line: Superman has options. He will use them if he feels they are necessary.

You can't pick and choose. Characters fight to the best of their ability as shown before. That's for anyone.


With that said, this version of Superhuman hits much harder than his average self (which can compete with any herald). He has speed and perceptions to see the fight many times slower than a normal being. He has bfr options if he decides that's the only way to win. Stop saying "this version of superhuman".. tell it like it is and say " your version of superhuman".

Originally posted by JBL
Stop saying "this version of superhuman".. tell it like it is and say " your version of superhuman".

So do you believe that Superman at the end of DOS was hitting DD with the same force that he was at the beginning of the saga?

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/96884/2382074-speedblitz__1_.jpg

How fast is this?

Originally posted by tkitna
Its the mental blocks thing man. Havent you heard?

I'm with you JBL, its all BS.

Originally posted by tkitna
Its the mental blocks thing man. Havent you heard?

I'm with you JBL, its all BS.

World of cardboard syndrome. Fear of breaking someone.

Peter Parker has the same problem, as the Sin Eater arc showed. He was abducting children, and Spidey beat him within an inch of his life. Much later, he finds out he's free and goes to confront him, and finds a crippled man who can barely function, and was pathetically telling him he deserved every shattered bone, every severed nerve.. It was enough to make Peter dive out of the building in panic..

And that's Spidey. Now imagine the same phobia when you can move mountains.

Originally posted by h1a8
So do you believe that Superman at the end of DOS was hitting DD with the same force that he was at the beginning of the saga? let me ask you this. ( I fear I already know what you will say) Question: Do you think that superman while holding back is equal to Black Adam, Captain Marvel, Blue Marvel, Hyperion Gladiator and Thor while these characters are using their full strength, but rise FAR above them when he himself stops holding back and use his full strength?? Because that's a certain isolated virus that's affecting certain fans on here because posters with common sense are immune to it.

Originally posted by carver9
How fast is this?

Very close to light speed at the very least. Vibrating through physical attacks takes at least that type of speed.

Originally posted by JBL
let me ask you this. ( I fear I already know what you will say) Question: Do you think that superman while holding back is equal to Black Adam, Captain Marvel, Blue Marvel, Hyperion Gladiator and Thor while these characters are using their full strength, but rise FAR above them when he himself stops holding back and use his full strength?? Because that's a certain isolated virus that's affecting certain fans on here because posters with common sense are immune to it. Answer my question.

Originally posted by h1a8
Very close to light speed at the very least. Vibrating through physical attacks takes at least that type of speed.

WTF

Originally posted by carver9
WTF To vibrate intangible through energy attacks using speed takes at the very least the speed of light.

Originally posted by h1a8
Answer my question. Lol, yeah. He dodged the heck out of that question. Why? Well I'd guess it's because Superman and Doomsday were CLEARLY striking one another with FAR more force at the end of the arc, than they were at the beginning. That much is incontrovertible fact. Here are some blatant examples...

From near the beginning of the arc:
http://i.imgur.com/SiqLL6C.jpg


Same comic, a few pages later:
http://i.imgur.com/yPP6OlQ.jpg




Logical deduction aside, it was also outright stated that Doomsday's strength continuously increased during the battle -- which obviously means Superman's strength did the same:

http://i.imgur.com/nwAdaF5.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/RuUWlrF.jpg



...........http://i.imgur.com/dF1BQKO.jpg





*In short, your point/opinion here is the accurate one.

Penderan disciple JBL crying about Superman as usual.

Originally posted by playa1258
Penderan disciple JBL crying about Superman as usual. Why are you claiming he's a Pendaran disciple ? Pendaran isn't a good person and he's too gutless to leave cbr.

Originally posted by Galan007
Lol, yeah. He dodged the heck out of that question. Why? Well I'd guess it's because Superman and Doomsday were CLEARLY striking one another with FAR more force at the end of the arc, than they were at the beginning. That much is incontrovertible fact. Here are some blatant examples...


I am pretty sure the caption to his pic was that punch could have destroyed a mountain. Also I believe in this arc kinda show a Gladiator type confidence fade and power fade.

From near the beginning of the arc:
http://i.imgur.com/SiqLL6C.jpg




*In short, your point/opinion here is the accurate one.

Galan,

Post the scan after the first scan you posted. I feel confident that Doomsday second hit sent Superman flying.

Both of them are in a house.

Originally posted by carver9
Galan,

Post the scan after the first scan you posted. I feel confident that Doomsday second hit sent Superman flying. It was a kick, not a punch -- that's why I didn't post it. But yeah, it did send Supes flying:

http://i.imgur.com/jJrjjUf.jpg

No question about it, Supernan wins easily.

Originally posted by Galan007
Lol, yeah. He dodged the heck out of that question. Why? Well I'd guess it's because Superman and Doomsday were CLEARLY striking one another with FAR more force at the end of the arc, than they were at the beginning. That much is incontrovertible fact. Here are some blatant examples...

From near the beginning of the arc:
http://i.imgur.com/SiqLL6C.jpg


Same comic, a few pages later:
http://i.imgur.com/yPP6OlQ.jpg




Logical deduction aside, it was also outright stated that Doomsday's strength continuously increased during the battle -- which obviously means Superman's strength did the same:

http://i.imgur.com/nwAdaF5.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/RuUWlrF.jpg



...........http://i.imgur.com/dF1BQKO.jpg





*In short, your point/opinion here is the accurate one. LMAO, where in that scan does it say that SUPERMAN was getting stronger??? He said he put everything he had LEFT in that final blow meaning he got no stronger. Learn to comprehend. It's YOU that make that misguided false claims. If anything, he was getting weaker and had to try and end it before DD overpowered his ass, so he put everything left in his near empty tank to try and win.

Originally posted by carver9
Galan,

Post the scan after the first scan you posted. I feel confident that Doomsday second hit sent Superman flying. Of course it sent him flying. You think he was going to post the next one?? He had to try and leave that out hoping I wouldn't notice.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why are you claiming he's a Pendaran disciple ? Pendaran isn't a good person and he's too gutless to leave cbr. How I usually respond to JBL.

There was no holding back.
The DoS arc showed that Superman had to go beyond his limits. It was always like that. Supermans strength makes this world appear like it is made out of paper. He could kill with a light clap. He has to hold back, else he might kill by accident. Once he sees that someone can take a hit he hits harder. So yes, he becomes stronger or decides to hit stronger, for this he needs to overcome the mental blockades he build over his lifetime that prevent him hurting other fragile beings by accident. Supermans strength is dynamic and has always been. Deal with it.

Originally posted by cdtm
World of cardboard syndrome. Fear of breaking someone.

Peter Parker has the same problem, as the Sin Eater arc showed. He was abducting children, and Spidey beat him within an inch of his life. Much later, he finds out he's free and goes to confront him, and finds a crippled man who can barely function, and was pathetically telling him he deserved every shattered bone, every severed nerve.. It was enough to make Peter dive out of the building in panic..

And that's Spidey. Now imagine the same phobia when you can move mountains.

Not sure what this has to do with anything. Every super powered hero goes through the same thing.

Originally posted by carver9
How fast is this?
After all calculations? About 7650 to 8320 FTL. From the writers perspective? I would guess 2-3 FTL.

Anyways, the winner is ------------

http://bamsmackpow.com/files/2015/07/602910-kurse.jpg

Originally posted by carver9
Galan,

Post the scan after the first scan you posted. I feel confident that Doomsday second hit sent Superman flying.

It proves the point.

DD was getting stronger.

Unless of course, you want to claim that DD.....held back with his punch? DD, the rage monster, held back?

Originally posted by JBL
LMAO, where in that scan does it say that SUPERMAN was getting stronger??? He said he put everything he had LEFT in that final blow meaning he got no stronger. Learn to comprehend. It's YOU that make that misguided false claims. If anything, he was getting weaker and had to try and end it before DD overpowered his ass, so he put everything left in his near empty tank to try and win.

He wasn't getting stronger. He just put all of his energy into one final blow. If he was getting stronger, it would have said it just like it was brought up about Doomsday in the same story.

Originally posted by carver9
He wasn't getting stronger. He just put all of his energy into one final blow. If he was getting stronger, it would have said it just like it was brought up about Doomsday in the same story. Of course he was. Doomsday's base was already higher than Supermans and it grows with rage.

The entire DOS story Superman was trying to play keep up just to go even with him. Telling himself that he needs to be faster, that he needs to be stronger just to keep pace with this being that is stronger than him and continuously growing even moreso and isn't wearing down or slowing down. These were all examples of him cutting down his mental blocks as the fight progressed. The last couple blows-- breaking his bone, and then killing him, were the only ones that actually hurt Doomsday. "Yes! I finally managed to hurt him!" He dug into his power and finally hit the motherload.

Originally posted by Juntai
Of course he was. Doomsday's base was already higher than Supermans and it grows with rage.

The entire DOS story Superman was trying to play keep up just to go even with him. Telling himself that he needs to be faster, that he needs to be stronger just to keep pace with this being that is stronger than him and continuously growing even moreso and isn't wearing down or slowing down. These were all examples of him cutting down his mental blocks as the fight progressed. The last couple blows-- breaking his bone, and then killing him, were the only ones that actually hurt Doomsday. "Yes! I finally managed to hurt him!" He dug into his power and finally hit the motherload. This is obvious to those of us who...you know...actually READ the story.


If Doomsday were the only being getting stronger as the battle progressed, then Superman wouldn't have been able to continuously keep stepping up in order to keep pace with him. After all, Supes postulated that a kick from Doomsday(when he was still at his WEAKEST levels, mind you) may have been the hardest he'd EVER been hit up to that point:
http://i.imgur.com/jJrjjUf.jpg


IOW, Doomsday's strength continued to grow, thus Superman's MUST HAVE done the same. Heck, the bulk of their battle was about Superman removing his mental blocks so that he COULD become strong enough to win. Numerous bits of dialogue tell us this -- here are a few examples:

http://i.imgur.com/Nxd0iKf.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/mAvpixa.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/uKuqAwD.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/o8x55lF.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Hd4RrZx.jpg



When Superman finally realized that he needed to kill Doomsday to win -- THAT is when he began landing attacks that actually hurt the beast. This culminated with Supes packing all of his strength into one final attack, which 'killed' DD:

http://i.imgur.com/sXfsGqT.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/Jerav8b.jpg

Starting to go all out is not the same as getting stronger.

none

It means he becoming gayer, I.e. Coming out.

Originally posted by golem370
Starting to go all out is not the same as getting stronger. Exactly!! He started to fight like doomsday, giving it all he had. Zero strength increase on supermans part.

Originally posted by Galan007
none
IKR?
That was exactly my reaction while reading this.

Originally posted by tkitna
Not sure what this has to do with anything. Every super powered hero goes through the same thing.

Some less then others. Superman is defined by his humanity and nobility. He cursed himself early in his career merely for breaking someone's jaw.

Iron Fist or Batman wouldn't bat an eye at breaking a few bones. Nor would Thor.

Originally posted by JBL
Exactly!! He started to fight like doomsday, giving it all he had. Zero strength increase on supermans part.

I wonder if that applies to Thor since he has fought Hulk who tends to get stronger by the second and Thor is still able to keep up. Hell, Wolverine has fought an enraged Hulk for hours and it was stated Hulk was growing stronger and Wolverine was still keeping up.

After seeing the same, tired BS for the last 10+ years, the idiotic attempts to lowball/discredit/ignore don't really come as a surprise anymore... It still makes me chuckle, though.

Doomsday grew more powerful as the battle progressed, and in turn, Superman had to become more powerful by removing his mental blocks. These facts were explicitly shown/stated on panel... Yet people are still pretending that Superman's strength didn't increase at all from the beginning of the arc to the end..? ElOhEl.

No one is that stupid, so clearly people are just trolling at this point.

Originally posted by JBL
Exactly!! He started to fight like doomsday, giving it all he had. Zero strength increase on supermans part.

Originally posted by Galan007
After seeing the same, tired BS for the last 10+ years, the idiotic attempts to lowball/discredit/ignore don't really come as a surprise anymore... It still makes me chuckle, though.

Doomsday grew more powerful as the battle progressed, and in turn, Superman had to become more powerful by removing his mental blocks. These facts were explicitly shown/stated on panel... Yet people are still pretending that Superman's strength didn't increase at all from the beginning of the arc to the end..? ElOhEl.

No one is that stupid, so clearly people are just trolling at this point. I actually think some of the people here -are- that stupid but it doesnt make you any less correct.

U guys are actually saying the same thing... Somewhat....

One side is saying Clark is getting stronger because he is gradually letting his mental blocks go. Which means his blows were getting stronger over all. Sounds good to me.

The other side is saying he is not really getting stronger because technically his strength was always there. He just let loose more as the battle called for it and especially towards the end when he really went all out. Can't really argue there.

One side is putting more emphasis on the amount of strength used as the fight progresses and the other side is putting more emphasis on his "real" maximum output(whatever that is).

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
U guys are actually saying the same thing... Somewhat....

One side is saying Clark is getting stronger because he is gradually letting his mental blocks go. Which means his blows were getting stronger over all. Sounds good to me.

The other side is saying he is not really getting stronger because technically his strength was always there. He just let loose more as the battle called for it and especially towards the end when he really went all out. Can't really argue there.

One side is putting more emphasis on the amount of strength used as the fight progresses and the other side is putting more emphasis on his "real" maximum output(whatever that is). Fair enough. The problem with this however is in the application of the fact that Superman's limit is not static. He's not only finding this power inside of himself, though he did spend his reserves his well. When Superman is angry or stressed, he draws in and outputs drastically more power. Emil Hamilton noted it during the Ruin arc, being one of DC Earth's experts on how Superman's powers work and kryptonian physiology in general, he learned that Suprmans emotional state amplifies his power in this way.

Originally posted by cdtm
Some less then others. Superman is defined by his humanity and nobility. He cursed himself early in his career merely for breaking someone's jaw.

Iron Fist or Batman wouldn't bat an eye at breaking a few bones. Nor would Thor.

I think your putting too much emphasis on it though. Any super powered earth bound hero deals with the same thing. Characters like Blue Marvel, Captain Marvel, Thing, Cage, Wonder Man, Colossus, etc,,, deal with it everytime they fight or deal with the public. I'm just not sure why this bares so much attention in this thread.

Batman and Iron Fist are street level characters. Thor is an Asgardian God who's regard for human life is probably somewhat less than most characters and yet he still has to deal with it. Simple things like shaking somebodys hand or lifting a glass to drink. Its all the same.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
U guys are actually saying the same thing... Somewhat....

One side is saying Clark is getting stronger because he is gradually letting his mental blocks go. Which means his blows were getting stronger over all. Sounds good to me.

The other side is saying he is not really getting stronger because technically his strength was always there. He just let loose more as the battle called for it and especially towards the end when he really went all out. Can't really argue there.

One side is putting more emphasis on the amount of strength used as the fight progresses and the other side is putting more emphasis on his "real" maximum output(whatever that is). Where this particular discussion is concerned, it doesn't matter to me *how* or *why* Superman's powers increased along with Doomsday's during that battle... I just want people to stop pretending like his strength didn't increase at all. srsly

Originally posted by Juntai
Fair enough. The problem with this however is in the application of the fact that Superman's limit is not static. He's not only finding this power inside of himself, though he did spend his reserves his well. When Superman is angry or stressed, he draws in and outputs drastically more power. Emil Hamilton noted it during the Ruin arc, being one of DC Earth's experts on how Superman's powers work and kryptonian physiology in general, he learned that Suprmans emotional state amplifies his power in this way.

http://i.imgur.com/fUQoWRy.jpg

Originally posted by Galan007

http://i.imgur.com/fUQoWRy.jpg This is also why Mxy started ****ing with Superman repeatedly before Infinite Crisis, and even pretending to die. Mxy could see it coming and knew Superman needed to be stronger and stop holding back.

Originally posted by Juntai
This is also why Mxy started ****ing with Superman repeatedly before Infinite Crisis, and even pretending to die. Mxy could see it coming and knew Superman needed to be stronger and stop holding back. https://s6d3.turboimg.net/t1/34024048_advofsupe630_darthvegas_p13.jpg https://s6d3.turboimg.net/t1/34024049_advofsupe630_darthvegas_p14.jpg https://s6d3.turboimg.net/t1/34024050_advofsupe630_darthvegas_p15.jpg



vin

The more energy he RETAINS? I'm sure everyone here knows what retain mean (keep possession of).

Okay, so he innately sponges up more solar radiation, as he loses control over himself in crisis situations? I can buy that, because it specifically stated in one of those DOS books that Superman questions whether or not Doomsday was actually becoming stronger. He then goes on to defeat him.

The question remains on whether or not DOS Doomsday was as strong, or stronger than this version of Kurse, or even remotely close to his strength level? There's also another question that persists to confuse me. Superman was far weaker during that era than he later became. Could he have been far weaker than Kurse back then as well?

Byrne Superman was still planetary. Causing seismic shocks hundreds of miles away etc.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/f98/t601613.html

Doomsday was strong enough that in his history he stomped over the GLC and a Guardian had to sacrifice himself to stop him.

The Radiant nearly blew a planet apart to stop him.

And Darkseid was scared of him.


The Doomsday that encountered Superman was stronger than all of these, because when he dies he comes back exponentially more powerful. Just as he did after Supes beat him when he returned in Hunter/Prey.

Originally posted by carver9
The more energy he RETAINS? I'm sure everyone here knows what retain mean (keep possession of). So every time he's stressed his powers increase and ignore the times he's been beaten, needed help, etc.

One scan represents every writers interpretation of him throughout continuity and anyone who disagrees is just wrong. Black and white.

Originally posted by Juntai
Doomsday was strong enough that in his history he stomped over the GLC and a Guardian had to sacrifice himself to stop him.

The Radiant nearly blew a planet apart to stop him.

And Darkseid was scared of him.


The Doomsday that encountered Superman was stronger than all of these, because when he dies he comes back exponentially more powerful. Just as he did after Supes beat him when he returned in Hunter/Prey.

I understand all of that, but Thor alone has blown up planets. It still remains questionable whether or not the guys that faced DD and were beaten were simply painted as being fodder. It should also be noted that Thor alone has quite an impressive rogues gallery. You should google them. Some of these guys are extremely powerful, and Kurse treated Thor as if he were a child. Just something to think about, or consider when you recall all of Doomsday feats.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
U guys are actually saying the same thing... Somewhat....

One side is saying Clark is getting stronger because he is gradually letting his mental blocks go. Which means his blows were getting stronger over all. Sounds good to me.

The other side is saying he is not really getting stronger because technically his strength was always there. He just let loose more as the battle called for it and especially towards the end when he really went all out. Can't really argue there.

One side is putting more emphasis on the amount of strength used as the fight progresses and the other side is putting more emphasis on his "real" maximum output(whatever that is).

It's semantics. Bottom line is that Superman APPLIED more power than his average self. What good is strength if you can't unlock it? Superman unlocked his full strength. Thus he hit DD far harder at the end than he did in the hours before.

His average self is known to physically compete with other heralds (BA, WW, etc.). This final Superman was operating at a level wayyyy higher than his average self.

Originally posted by Stoic
I understand all of that, but Thor alone has blown up planets. It still remains questionable whether or not the guys that faced DD and were beaten were simply painted as being fodder. It should also be noted that Thor alone has quite an impressive rogues gallery. You should google them. Some of these guys are extremely powerful, and Kurse treated Thor as if he were a child. Just something to think about, or consider when you recall all of Doomsday feats.

When has Thor blown up a planet? I don't recall that.
Thor at times competed well with Kurse and started to actually beat him when using the belt of strength. This is when Kurse was 2x stronger. So someone 2x stronger treating Thor like a child (I disagree that this happened) would mean that any being 2x stronger would treat Thor like a child.

Originally posted by Juntai
The Doomsday that encountered Superman was stronger than all of these, because when he dies he comes back exponentially more powerful. http://orig15.deviantart.net/cb2e/f/2013/038/f/2/doomsday_broly_fusion_by_themexican1234-d5u4uyv.jpg

Originally posted by carver9
The more energy he RETAINS? I'm sure everyone here knows what retain mean (keep possession of). The scan simply means that the more stress Superman endures, the more solar radiation his body naturally absorbs/metabolizes.

That, along with removing his mental blocks and taxing his energy reserves, is why Supes was able to continuously increase his powers during the battle, and keep pace with DD's perpetual rage-boosts.

Originally posted by Galan007
The scan simply means that the more stress Superman endures, the more solar radiation his body naturally absorbs/metabolizes.

That, along with removing his mental blocks, is why Supes was able to continuously increase his strength to keep pace with DD's own rage-boosts during the battle.

Originally posted by h1a8


It's semantics. Bottom line is that Superman APPLIED more power than his average self. What good is strength if you can't unlock it? Superman unlocked his full strength. Thus he hit DD far harder at the end than he did in the hours before.

His average self is known to physically compete with other heralds (BA, WW, etc.). This final Superman was operating at a level wayyyy higher than his average self. Superman strength is set in stone period! He does not get any stronger UNLESS he sunamp or dip. He can use his full strength ANY TIME he wants. Going full strength does not mean he's dropping phoney mental blocks. His mental blocks are there to keep from constantly having to remind himself that regular people or weak villains would be killed if he made a mistake. So he trained himself mentally. Superman arm wrestling CM to see who was stronger was one example. Superman normal or bloodlusted is STILL in the same class as BA, CM and WW is not far behind and there are characters that are stronger than superman by a little and a lot. All this dynamic strength crap is in the minds of his misled fans.

Imperiex probes say different. He valuted from struggling with a single probe, to casually ripping through an army of them. Even he was surprised at how easy it was.

Yeah, starting to use his full strength instead of worrying about Lois will make it seem that way.

Originally posted by h1a8
When has Thor blown up a planet? I don't recall that.
Thor at times competed well with Kurse and started to actually beat him when using the belt of strength. This is when Kurse was 2x stronger. So someone 2x stronger treating Thor like a child (I disagree that this happened) would mean that any being 2x stronger would treat Thor like a child.

The OP is calling for Kurse at 4x Thor strength, and this was the Kurse that treated him like a child. He pretty much had Beta Ray Bill, and Thor beaten. Bill is easily able to destroy planets, and if he can do this, Thor can as well. When Kurse was only 2x Thor, he was getting beaten, which was why the Beyonder gave him another strength increase.

Is it true as well the more bloodlusted Thor gets his strength increases like a beserker rage?

Originally posted by JBL
Superman strength is set in stone period! He does not get any stronger UNLESS he sunamp or dip. He can use his full strength ANY TIME he wants. Going full strength does not mean he's dropping phoney mental blocks. His mental blocks are there to keep from constantly having to remind himself that regular people or weak villains would be killed if he made a mistake. So he trained himself mentally. Superman arm wrestling CM to see who was stronger was one example. Superman normal or bloodlusted is STILL in the same class as BA, CM and WW is not far behind and there are characters that are stronger than superman by a little and a lot. All this dynamic strength crap is in the minds of his misled fans.
Why are you keep arguing semantics? I didn't say anything about Superman getting stronger in my last post. I said he applied far greater force than he did in the hours earlier. Stop with the strawman.

There are several comics explaining Superman's mental blocks. Later on he couldn't release his mental blocks without meditation and training. It's not in Superman's character to fully unleash his might against someone like he did to DD (killing them in a few punches). If Superman hit any Herald like he did DD at the end then they will be dead too.

You can ignore on panel evidence if you want but I wouldn't advise that.

Originally posted by JBL
Superman strength is set in stone period! He does not get any stronger UNLESS he sunamp or dip. He can use his full strength ANY TIME he wants. Going full strength does not mean he's dropping phoney mental blocks. His mental blocks are there to keep from constantly having to remind himself that regular people or weak villains would be killed if he made a mistake. So he trained himself mentally. Superman arm wrestling CM to see who was stronger was one example. Superman normal or bloodlusted is STILL in the same class as BA, CM and WW is not far behind and there are characters that are stronger than superman by a little and a lot. All this dynamic strength crap is in the minds of his misled fans.

As we've seen on numerous occasions over the years: Superman's powers can(and often do) increase astronomically in the midst of battle. ie. when he removes his mental blocks and becomes angry/enraged/bloodlusted, his power grows by proxy. Moreover, when he becomes angry/enraged/bloodlusted, his cells naturally start absorbing and metabolizing more solar radiation than normal, which also boosts his power by proxy.

Any way you cut it, Superman's powers undeniably increase in-battle(the method by which this occurs notwithstanding.) Now does that mean he possesses 'true' dynamic strength in the same way a character like Hulk does? While some instances would allude to yes, more often than not Superman gains this added power when he stops holding back and taps into his energy reserves. So in most cases I would not equate his increases in power to dynamic strength in the typical sense.

The thing about Superman's 'reserves', however, is that they are, for all intents and purposes, unbounded. As his entire character history supports: the guy simply becomes as powerful as he needs to be in order to defeat the threat at hand(no matter how powerful.)


Take from that what you will. g007_sneaky

Totally false. AII heroes get powerful enough to beat the threat at hand. It's call " hero time to win and please the fans"

It's false, yet all characters do it? Interesting. mmm

Yes it's false that superman drops mental blocks and double or triple his strength to win. He's the same as other heroes. Get written to win. Superman DOES NOT have hidden strength he can call upon. If that's the case, writers would not waste their time having him being stalemated or beaten by slightly stronger or many times stronger foes knowing that his fans THINK he can simply drop mental blocks??? LMAO. I can see misguided fans now.... Superman vs Kurse... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get stronger than Kurse and win.. oh superman vs WBH... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get strong enough to win. Arm wrestling CM and getting stalemated yet he has hidden locked away strength to win, writer didn't think so. Plenty other examples but it's a waste of time to tell his fans because that's their way to try and give superman the win in every vs thread he's in. Normal superman??? Going all out superman???? Non-holding back unrestrained superman??? Kurse would stomp each made up version in a contest of strength and laugh doing it and beat them the same easy way. Over power them and crush their skulls. Besides, if he had all this hidden strength, why do he need the rest of the JLA. He could simply drop his little mental blocks and go supersayian God superman and beat anything. Yet he sunamp or dip to get stronger. HA!!

Originally posted by JBL
Yes it's false that superman drops mental blocks and double or triple his strength to win. He's the same as other heroes. Get written to win. Superman DOES NOT have hidden strength he can call upon. If that's the case, writers would not waste their time having him being stalemated or beaten by slightly stronger or many times stronger foes knowing that his fans THINK he can simply drop mental blocks??? LMAO. I can see misguided fans now.... Superman vs Kurse... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get stronger than Kurse and win.. oh superman vs WBH... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get strong enough to win. Arm wrestling CM and getting stalemated yet he has hidden locked away strength to win, writer didn't think so. Plenty other examples but it's a waste of time to tell his fans because that's their way to try and give superman the win in every vs thread he's in. Normal superman??? Going all out superman???? Non-holding back unrestrained superman??? Kurse would stomp each made up version in a contest of strength and laugh doing it and beat them the same easy way. Over power them and crush their skulls. Besides, if he had all this hidden strength, why do he need the rest of the JLA. He could simply drop his little mental blocks and go supersayian God superman and beat anything. Yet he sunamp or dip to get stronger. HA!!

Originally posted by JBL
Yes it's false that superman drops mental blocks and double or triple his strength to win. You're mixing arguments, lol. I never said that Superman can become "x times" more powerful when he cuts loose or whathaveyou... Just that his power DOES increase when the situation calls for it. That much is incontrovertible fact -- we've seen it time and time again, regardless of what title you opt to give it.

Originally posted by JBL
Superman DOES NOT have hidden strength he can call upon. Depends how you're defining 'hidden strength', I suppose.


Anywho, you should probably calm down a bit. Your hatred is blinding you.

http://blacknerdproblems.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/mGgoeaO.gif

Originally posted by tkitna
Not sure what this has to do with anything. Every super powered hero goes through the same thing.

Don't want to derail the thread, but why wasn't anyone else able to do what Superman and Doomday did to the Imperix Probes?

Why were their entire comic books written about superman training to remove this blocks. This shows that his blocks are on a whole different level of blocks than anyone else.

Originally posted by Galan007
This is obvious to those of us who...you know...actually READ the story.


If Doomsday were the only being getting stronger as the battle progressed, then Superman wouldn't have been able to continuously keep stepping up in order to keep pace with him. After all, Supes postulated that a kick from Doomsday(when he was still at his WEAKEST levels, mind you) may have been the hardest he'd EVER been hit up to that point:


IOW, Doomsday's strength continued to grow, thus Superman's MUST HAVE done the same. Heck, the bulk of their battle was about Superman removing his mental blocks so that he COULD become strong enough to win. Numerous bits of dialogue tell us this -- here are a few examples:

*** sorry deleted your scans to save room****



When Superman finally realized that he needed to kill Doomsday to win -- THAT is when he began landing attacks that actually hurt the beast. This culminated with Supes packing all of his strength into one final attack, which 'killed' DD:

http://i.imgur.com/sXfsGqT.jpg



Back in the 90's they used to show superior strength in a battle of mercy. Used to happen all the time in wwe with Hull Hogan and others. Here Superman has him locked and breaks bones causing Doomsday pain. So it is clear superman was getting stronger and had caught up to doomsdays strength leve

Originally posted by Diesldude
Don't want to derail the thread, but why wasn't anyone else able to do what Superman and Doomday did to the Imperix Probes?

Why were their entire comic books written about superman training to remove this blocks. This shows that his blocks are on a whole different level of blocks than anyone else. Doomsday didn't give a rat's ass about anything. Superman was so worried about freaking Lois until he was told to basically fight like doomsday... Focusing on killing, destroying at ALL cost. In other words... Stop being this distracted, loving, caring punk and get your ass out their and destroy. He got no stronger, he just stopped being a b*tch and fought like DD.

Originally posted by Diesldude


Back in the 90's they used to show superior strength in a battle of mercy. Used to happen all the time in wwe with Hull Hogan and others. Here Superman has him locked and breaks bones causing Doomsday pain. So it is clear superman was getting stronger and had caught up to doomsdays strength leve Clear huh? Where is that stated here? Or that's your assumptions?

Originally posted by JBL
Yes it's false that superman drops mental blocks and double or triple his strength to win. He's the same as other heroes. Get written to win. Superman DOES NOT have hidden strength he can call upon. If that's the case, writers would not waste their time having him being stalemated or beaten by slightly stronger or many times stronger foes knowing that his fans THINK he can simply drop mental blocks??? LMAO. I can see misguided fans now.... Superman vs Kurse... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get stronger than Kurse and win.. oh superman vs WBH... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get strong enough to win. Arm wrestling CM and getting stalemated yet he has hidden locked away strength to win, writer didn't think so. Plenty other examples but it's a waste of time to tell his fans because that's their way to try and give superman the win in every vs thread he's in. Normal superman??? Going all out superman???? Non-holding back unrestrained superman??? Kurse would stomp each made up version in a contest of strength and laugh doing it and beat them the same easy way. Over power them and crush their skulls. Besides, if he had all this hidden strength, why do he need the rest of the JLA. He could simply drop his little mental blocks and go supersayian God superman and beat anything. Yet he sunamp or dip to get stronger. HA!!

Originally posted by JBL
Yes it's false that superman drops mental blocks and double or triple his strength to win. He's the same as other heroes. Get written to win. Superman DOES NOT have hidden strength he can call upon. If that's the case, writers would not waste their time having him being stalemated or beaten by slightly stronger or many times stronger foes knowing that his fans THINK he can simply drop mental blocks??? LMAO. I can see misguided fans now.... Superman vs Kurse... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get stronger than Kurse and win.. oh superman vs WBH... Oh, Superman can drop mental blocks and get strong enough to win. Arm wrestling CM and getting stalemated yet he has hidden locked away strength to win, writer didn't think so. Plenty other examples but it's a waste of time to tell his fans because that's their way to try and give superman the win in every vs thread he's in. Normal superman??? Going all out superman???? Non-holding back unrestrained superman??? Kurse would stomp each made up version in a contest of strength and laugh doing it and beat them the same easy way. Over power them and crush their skulls. Besides, if he had all this hidden strength, why do he need the rest of the JLA. He could simply drop his little mental blocks and go supersayian God superman and beat anything. Yet he sunamp or dip to get stronger. HA!!

Wait a minute, Superman and Doomsday wasn't getting more powerful as the story went on in DOS? Either they was or, under your comprehension of the story, Superman would have had to stay the same and Doomsday would have had to start getting weaker so Superman could take him down, that's backwards!!!

Originally posted by JBL
Totally false. AII heroes get powerful enough to beat the threat at hand. It's call " hero time to win and please the fans"
You're right. All heroes do get their time to shine and exhibit "hero time".

Thing is Superman probably has the most extensive description of how his power fluctuates when compared to other heroes. They just can't be ignored.

Originally posted by kevdude
Wait a minute, Superman and Doomsday wasn't getting more powerful as the story went on in DOS? Either they was or, under your comprehension of the story, Superman would have had to stay the same and Doomsday would have had to start getting weaker so Superman could take him down, that's backwards!!! False. You think superman dropped mental blocks or did he start going for the kill like doomsday was. He had to put everything he had left into that final blow. That alone tells you he wasn't getting any stronger. Get it? Everything he had left means the tank was running dry and there was NOTHING being added. Oh.. say like... Strength. Get it now?

So the last dregs of an empty tank could do what all his previous attacks couldn't?

That's like breaking the 100m world record, at the end of a triathlon.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So the last dregs of an empty tank could do what all his previous attacks couldn't?

That's like breaking the 100m world record, at the end of a triathlon. Did he put everything he had left into those previous attacks? (No)... That final all out blow was enough. Becausesssss??? Bingo!! It had everything he had left in it.

4x Thor Kurse would win with ease if Superman tried to trade blows. Supes only chance is to try and BFR.

Originally posted by JBL
Did he put everything he had left into those previous attacks? (No)... That final all out blow was enough. Becausesssss??? Bingo!! It had everything he had left in it.

So if I don't give it my all in the triathlon (but still complete it), you're saying I can smash my PB in a 100m by using the last dregs of my energy?

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Thing is Superman probably has the most extensive description of how his power fluctuates when compared to other heroes. They just can't be ignored.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So if I don't give it my all in the triathlon (but still complete it), you're saying I can smash my PB in a 100m by using the last dregs of my energy? Stop making excuses. Supermans final blow was the most powerful blow he had left and it was enough. Get it. He put EVERYTHING he had left into it. A FINAL blow.. the last strike, if this doesn't do it I'm done strike, etc???.. Guess why??? He knew he was not going to have anything left. No more strength or anything else. Running dry. No more gas ( strength) coming in, all being used up. Before I run out I better put EVERYTHING I have left into one ALL OUT strike to try and end this? Good story that book was.

Originally posted by Galan007
As we've seen on numerous occasions over the years: Superman's powers can(and often do) increase astronomically in the midst of battle. ie. when he removes his mental blocks and becomes angry/enraged/bloodlusted, his power grows by proxy. Moreover, when he becomes angry/enraged/bloodlusted, his cells naturally start absorbing and metabolizing more solar radiation than normal, which also boosts his power by proxy.

Any way you cut it, Superman's powers undeniably increase in-battle(the method by which this occurs notwithstanding.) Now does that mean he possesses 'true' dynamic strength in the same way a character like Hulk does? While some instances would allude to yes, more often than not Superman gains this added power when he stops holding back and taps into his energy reserves. So in most cases I would not equate his increases in power to dynamic strength in the typical sense.

The thing about Superman's 'reserves', however, is that they are, for all intents and purposes, unbounded. As his entire character history supports: the guy simply becomes as powerful as he needs to be in order to defeat the threat at hand(no matter how powerful.)


Take from that what you will. g007_sneaky

http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/RogerSternNovelisation.jpg

Great story indeed

Thanks for that philo. It clearly shows superman starting to use his full strength just like I said. He got no stronger at all. Worst thing you could have put up trying to defend superman. Thanks.

Great that he died, yes.

Yes, now we just need to know what his full power is. What is his limit.

As he hasn't hit that limit with anyone else, does that mean we take his highest of highs, and extrapolate upwards?

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Great that he died, yes. True, you don't get stronger and more powerful and then still die in one final blow. Hulk can show supes how to do it.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yes, now we just need to know what his full power is. What is his limit.

As he hasn't hit that limit with anyone else, does that mean we take his highest of highs, and extrapolate upwards? You saw his limit. HE DIED didn't he???

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Great that he died, yes.

Originally posted by JBL
You saw his limit. HE DIED didn't he???
And no one else has done it, before or since.

So EVERY high end feat he has EVER done, was him NOT at his limit.

So take whatever high end limit abhi likes. Restarting the big bang or whatever. Pushing XYZ. Lifting ABC. All those....were not done at his limit as he didn't die.

Originally posted by JBL
You saw his limit. HE DIED didn't he??? If you want to get technical, no, he actually didn't.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Yes, now we just need to know what his full power is. What is his limit.

As he hasn't hit that limit with anyone else, does that mean we take his highest of highs, and extrapolate upwards?

Well, extrapolations wouldn't get us nowhere, since at his highs he has has lifted infinity, plowed through time stop, tanked the bleed/blackholes etc. The only consistent limit he seems to have is "slightly slower than Flash" - and Flash is basically limitless, so that's no good.

As for battles, his powers 'surging' with his emotions has been played repeatedly, I believe the Ruin scan has already been posted. He had the same power surge against Mongul, once he got emotional enough:

http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/supesmongultraining5.jpg~original

Superman regulating his powerlevel, both on a conscious and subconscious level, is quite consistent throughout his history. On top of that, he also has the "absorb more solar radiation when your emotions are fluctuating"; as a consequence, I believe he has literally all the levels of holding back one can have.

Originally posted by Philosophia
Well, extrapolations wouldn't get us nowhere, since at his highs he has has lifted infinity, plowed through time stop, tanked the bleed/blackholes etc. The only consistent limit he seems to have is "slightly slower than Flash" - and Flash is basically limitless, so that's no good.

As for battles, his powers 'surging' with his emotions has been played repeatedly, I believe the Ruin scan has already been posted. He had the same power surge against Mongul, once he got emotional enough:

http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx28/PhilosophiaKMC/supesmongultraining5.jpg

Superman regulating his powerlevel, both on a conscious and subconscious level, is quite consistent throughout his history. On top of that, he also has the "absorb more solar radiation when your emotions are fluctuating"; as a consequence, I believe he has literally all the levels of holding back one can have.

http://i.imgur.com/3uLSpbV.jpg

Jesus Christ I wish people could comprehend what a statement means. Superman was taught to stop hold back and being distracted by thinking of others while fighting a foe that was trying to kill him and everything else. You CANNOT be effective with distractions. Superman is not use to fighting like DD and that's what it took to win. Superman now had to not Give a Damn and try and kill. Something he had tried to avoid All his life. The whole point of that training was to get superman to stop being a b*tch and KILL. DD had no problem Killing.

Guys who do you even bother and try? kinda He has his opinion and no amount of facts will change it.

lol it is sort of funny watching them beat their heads against what is literally a wall of ignorance and intransigence though.

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Guys who do you even bother and try? kinda He has his opinion and no amount of facts will change it. What facts??? Lol.

Originally posted by JBL
What facts??? Lol.


Originally posted by leonidas
lol it is sort of funny watching them beat their heads against what is literally a wall of ignorance and intransigence though.

It's also funny watching you come agree with known superman fanatics. But I expect no less.

Originally posted by JBL
So you and h1a8 now write for DC comics? Congrats, hope to read more of your comic's.
So, you didnt answer me. Remind me what has Kurse done that was so impressive?

Originally posted by abhilegend
So, you didnt answer me. Remind me what has Kurse done that was so impressive? You think superman will go head to head with Kurse and win??? Bfr is the only thing that would save his life, other than that your regular, OWAW, normal, non-holding back, unrestrained, retarded whatever you want to call him superman would get his skull crushed if he engaged Kurse like he did doomsday. Hell, he died then.

OWAW Supes loses? Really? What proof are you basing this on? What incredible feats that trump OWAW Supes does Kurse have? Cuz the only feats that count to you JBL seem to be A) being from Marvel and B) Not being Superman. You seem to give anyone a win against Supes as long as they can claim one of those things.