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http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11117/111178634/4788315-luke.jpg
vs
http://static4.comicvine.com/uploads/original/10/105264/4107939-timeline08revan.jpg
Rules
* Luke as of Dark Empire
* Full heal after each round
* Morals on, but willing to kill
* Standart gear
* Fight takes place on Byss. No nexus.
* Starting distance : 8m


Round one:
Mandalorian Wars Revan

Round two:
Darth Revan

Round three:
Darth Revan

Round four:
Reedemed Revan

Round five:
Revan Reborn Revan]

--- Break ---
Foundry Revan

Boss:
SoR Revan

1: Luke with ease
2: Luke with a little challenge
3: Same as Round 2
4: Luke, little bit more challenging than 2 and 3, but not much
5: Revan
6: Either way
7: Revan

You think the gap between KoTOR is so big that KoTOR is a little/decent challenge to Revan winning?

Originally posted by Ursumeles
You think the gap between KoTOR is so big that KoTOR is a little/decent challenge to Revan winning? Yeah, I don't think Revan saw a terribly significant amount of growth between his time as Dark Lord and his time as a Jedi during KOTOR.

Luke sweeps.

Luke clears.

Down at 5.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Down at 5. Maybe the boss round. Unless Leia wasn't using Battle Meditation during the Battle of Pinnacle Base.

He loses sooner than later.

I should've gone with "he loses at 5 unless he wasn't amped during his fight against Sidious."

Height of stupidity right there. I do tend to type before thinking.

'Cause a Meditation-amped Malgus could probably take out novel Vitiate. I don't see why an amped novel Revan couldn't take out DE Sidious.

Luke clears with SoR Revan being a very good fight.

But then people'll start complaining "novel Revan isn't > DE Luke!"

Slaughters every fight, Revan isn't all that great.

So now DE Luke is greater than SoR Revan.

I'm starting to think it's everyone else whose opinions are fvcked up.

DE Luke isn't even > Vader nevermind > Revan Reborn.

Yeah, it's not like Vader > Revan Reborn is a valid opinion.

When Revan's comfortably absorbing and redirecting lightning of Nyriss' tier, whilst hindered by Dromund Kaas' nexus and years of drugging? Yeh it's not much of an argument.

when mace is factually more powerful than revan and vader can ragdoll folks like starkiller who has mace level tk feats, its a pretty solid argument

Mace is in no way "factually more powerful than revan and vader", Vader is for sure more powerful than Windu, and Revan ****ing ragdolls Windu.

Windu isn't factually more powerful, even if you take Nova's quote seriously, that's pre-mask Revan who is < Reborn Revan.

As far as the quote is concerned premask revan is the same jedi as reborn revan

Revan Reborn hasn't walked the Jedi Temple.

Are we certain Revan's walked the Temple on Coruscant?

He does at the start of the Revan novel, a year after KotOR.

Ah. Well, does it apply to him after he leaves the Jedi Temple?



He may have become a more powerful Jedi Master, but he didn't walk the Temple with that power.

It applies to him as of the time he walked the Temple, which is at the start of the novel. It doesn't apply to SoR Revan or any future incarnations.

Still probably < Yoda.

Then again, SoR Revan was "ultimately neither Jedi nor Sith."

Obviously Yoda's more powerful than any incarnation of Revan. I thought were discussing Mace, who has that quote about being more powerful than anybody who's walked the Temple corridors bar Yoda (until Y: DR inserted a retcon by making Dooku more powerful than Mace).

Originally posted by darthbane77
Mace is in no way "factually more powerful than revan and vader", Vader is for sure more powerful than Windu, and Revan ****ing ragdolls Windu.

Are reborn revan and pre mask revan two versions of the same character?
Yes
So has reborn revan ever walked the corridors of the jedi temple?
Yes, he has
So if mace is more powerful than any jedi who've ever walked the corridors of the jedi temple, does that place mace above jedi revan? yes it does.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Revan Reborn hasn't walked the Jedi Temple.
Yes he has, the quote doesn't discriminate between different versions of characters, it says "ever walked". The only version of revan who is exempted from this is Sor revan as he's not a jedi

Revan Reborn isn't a Jedi either, pre-mask Revan is. Pre-mask Revan doesn't have Reborn's immense Sith knowledge.

According to Drew, Revan already regained most of his memories before acquiring the mask.

The funny thing is that most of us argue about whether or not he's in Plagueis' league, and Rocky's using an ambiguous quote to wank Mace over him.

Originally posted by Geistalt
The funny thing is that most of us argue about whether or not he's in Plagueis' league, and Rocky's using an ambiguous quote to wank Mace above him.
Revan has absolutely nothing putting him in plagueis's league
I mean other than being inferior to plagueis's inferior and having vastly inferior feats

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Revan has absolutely nothing putting him revan league Nice save.

Originally posted by Geistalt
Nice save.

I mean, sor revan is half the man he once was

Revan Reborn is a Jedi, indeed. He's listed as a Jedi Master in the dramatis personae, identifies himself as a "champion of the light", and is referred to as a Jedi Master in TOR, IIRC.

However, he still hasn't walked the Jedi Temple's corridors.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Revan Reborn is a Jedi, indeed. He's listed as a Jedi Master in the dramatis personae, identifies himself as a "champion of the light", and is referred to as a Jedi Master in TOR, IIRC.

However, he still hasn't walked the Jedi Temple's corridors.
He has walked the jedi temple, as post kotor revan, two versions of the same character are still the same character

Post-KotOR Revan is a very broad term. You can't classify Revan a year on from KotOR with SoR Revan for instance.

What about when he was no longer a Jedi Master? Then the quote no longer applies, right?

Originally posted by Geistalt
What about when he was no longer a Jedi Master? Then the quote no longer applies, right?
yea.
That being said, the fact files were off a pre shatterpoint mace

Originally posted by SunRazer
Post-KotOR Revan is a very broad term. You can't classify Revan a year on from KotOR with SoR Revan for instance.
You can't classify revan a year post kotor revan with sor revan as far this quote is concerned because sor revan is not a jedi. As far as the quote is concerned classifications of pre sith revan don't matter

Decided to call this an issue of semantics before I searched up "ever" for its precise dictionary definition, the first of which was "at any time"'.

So yeah, Dooku & Mace > Reborn Revan, lmfao.

Originally posted by SunRazer

So yeah, Dooku & Mace > Reborn Revan, lmfao.
https://2ch.hk/v/arch/2016-04-20/src/737502/14611397000520.png

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Are reborn revan and pre mask revan two versions of the same character?
Yes
So has reborn revan ever walked the corridors of the jedi temple?
Yes, he has
So if mace is more powerful than any jedi who've ever walked the corridors of the jedi temple, does that place mace above jedi revan? yes it does. Revan has been in the Jedi Temple you dumb****. He visited the Jedi Archives in the Revan novel.

Revan Reborn is more powerful than Windu or Dooku. The quote doesn't apply to him.

Revan as of SoR isn't a Jedi by any stretch of imagination, so it definitely doesn't apply to him.

AP's completely right though: the Jedi Temple in the quote isn't the same one that Revan walked in anyway.

To clarify my last point, the main entrance corridor was canonically destroyed with the Sacking of Coruscant and redone later. There's no proof Revan walked any other corridors. The Jedi Council chamber and the Jedi Archives are not corridors, and from what I can tell, there's no indication walking additional corridors besides the main entrance corridor is necessary in reaching these places - just turbolifts.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Decided to call this an issue of semantics before I searched up "ever" for its precise dictionary definition, the first of which was "at any time"'.

So yeah, Dooku & Mace > Reborn Revan, lmfao.
and that was a pre prime mace and pre prime dooku these quotes were referring too as this was before dooku's turn and before shatterpoint

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Revan Reborn is more powerful than Windu or Dooku. The quote doesn't apply to him.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCYyNbQq_vo

Actually, based on this video, the Jedi Temple was *completely* rebuilt - the areas that Revan walked through especially.

You're in denial; going back to feats and arbitrary interpretations over quotes.

What?

You said the quote doesn't apply because Revan Reborn is more powerful than them (which is your opinion, not fact). However well-supported by evidence and other users it is, it's still an opinion, not a fact. So you trying to use that to trump factual accolades is hilarious.

Revan's more powerful because his feats and accolades are better. Neither Windu nor Dooku have anything beyond Revan. Windu walking in a different Jedi Temple, let alone being compared to a different incarnation of Revan, doesn't qualify, sorry.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Revan's more powerful because his feats and accolades are better. Neither Windu nor Dooku have anything beyond Revan. Windu walking in a different Jedi Temple, let alone being compared to a differen incarnation of Revan, doesn't qualify, sorry.
Just because you rebuild something doesn't make it a new building. And all those incarnations are off the same character

The quote states Yoda and Mace Windu are the most powerful Jedi to walk "the corridors of the Jedi Temple," not the Jedi Temple itself. Whether the quote is referring to any corridors ever established, or specifically the existing ones, is ambiguous. Revan walked in a completely different Jedi Temple than Mace Windu and Yoda, after all. For one, it's silly to place such famous and important characters over another over something so unclear like that. And that's not even the main point:

The fact the incarnations are off the same character are irrelevant. Revan walked in the Jedi Temple, but during the moment he walked in, he wasn't more powerful than Yoda or Mace Windu. Thus, Yoda and Mace Windu were the most powerful Jedi to ever (referring to the history of the Jedi Order (although even that is up for debate based on your response to this post), not the history of the characters in question) walk the corridors of the Jedi Temple. If you wish to stretch the meaning of the quote beyond what is explicit, then Mace Windu is more powerful than RotS Anakin Skywalker and FotJ Luke Skywalker as well.

1. Rebuilding something desn't mean you're making something new. Its a new version of the same temple
2. it doesn't matter which corridors are being walked on, all said corridors are corridors "of the jedi temple"
3/ Its silly to rely in feat/accolade comparisons across era's when you have factual statements to go by

4. Except the ever is not needed for the statement to apply to a character overall. If you take out ever you get "yoda and mace windu were the most powerful jedi to have walked the corridors of the temple", the "to have walked" still allows for the statement to apply to a jedi's history. Heck even if it was "yoda and mace were the most powerful to walk the temple", you could still intepret it as the above sentence. The "to have walked" alone explicitly indicates that the statement applies to a charcter's history, The "ever" explicitly indicates that this applies to the order's history. Even without the ever you could intepret the statement as taking beyond the current time period and all time, but because of the ever, it clearly applies to the history of the jedi.

5. Uh no, this quote is referring to aotc yoda/mace. As the quote is in past tense, it refers to anyone chronologically up untill aotc. It doesn't include characters who chronologically come after aotc. Otherwise it would have to indicate something about the future liek say. "yoda and windu are the most powerful jedi to have, and who will ever the corridors of the jedi temple".

Then you would surely agree that Luke Skywalker walked in the same temple as Mace Windu, then.



The question is whether the quote is discussing all corridors or simply existing ones. Either way fits the qualifications of the quote



No, what's retarded is using a quote before Revan was ever conceived by a character from a foreign company with numerous mistakes in their entries in the past, likely because they aren't fact-checked like other Star Wars books.

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
The "to have walked" alone explicitly indicates that the statement applies to a charcter's history

What the hell? How the hell does that mean it's referring to the character history. The tense means that these events happened in the past - something you even point out.




No it doesn't? Why the hell are you arbitrarily listing AotC. It's past-tense because all Star Wars encyclopedia's are past-tense. Why? Because Star Wars happened in the past..

The Fact Files doesn't exclude characters in the future when discussing earlier events. For example:

http://i.imgur.com/i1H90ds.jpg

The date marks the post at 32 BBY, but it nonetheless references events way beyond that date.

The same applies to this instance. The fact the current tense emphasizes 32 BBY doesn't mean future events are ignored.

As it stands, your interpretation demands Mace Windu > FotJ Luke Skywalker.

Refusing to accept Windu's superiority is textbook hypocrisy, since you already said: "Its silly to rely in feat/accolade comparisons across era's when you have factual statements to go by." After all, there are no quotes stating Luke Skywalker is the most powerful Jedi in history, so this quote would hold.

It's also worth noting the context of the source. The Fact Files recognizes Mace Windu as a Jedi who is on par with Yoda in the Force. When most read the quote, the assumption is Yoda is #1 and Mace Windu is #2, but the Fact Files sees them both sharing the #1 spot - that is what the quote is suggesting. This interpretation of Mace Windu's status is inconsistent with the far more sources stating that Yoda and / or Anakin Skywalker is the most powerful Jedi. Thus, the quote can be outright dismissed under that merit.

http://i.imgur.com/iFY3fLa.png

Sometimes this happens. Not all sources recognize individuals on the same power levels. Statements regarding these characters have to be assessed via looking through the lens of the source.

Well there goes that one.

I approve.

1. Sure, but luke was only born decades after mace's time

2. Both existing corridors and corridors that were there count as "the corridors of the jedi temple". Nothing about the quote hints at the exclusion of any corridors that fits the description.

3. Continuity is not retroactive. There's no relevant facts regarding revan to check against

4. "to have walked in" isn't dependent on tense. The statement can read, "jedi a and b are the most powerful jedi to have walked in the corridors in the temple". The use of "were" puts it in past tense. Anyone who has "walked in" the jedi temple's corridors are included in the quote. What pre sith version of revan it is doesn't matter, as all versions of revan post him walking in the temple "walked in" the jedi temple. "Ever" isn't needed for that. "Ever" makes it clear the quote applies to past jedi as well

5.The "were" means that mace and yoda "were" the two most powerful jedi ever to walk the temple. Just because they "were" the most powerful doesn't mean they still are the most powerful. All it means is that at a certain point, they were more powerful than anyone before who walked the temple. This will apply to past dudes because they chronologically came before yoda/mace. However this doesn't apply to dudes who came after because a new jedi surpassing mace or yoda doesn't contradict that they "were the most powerful".

6. You do realize the statement in the example you've posted is set in present tense?:
"the emperor's palace is the most prominent structure in coruscant" "and is perhaps the largest building ever constructed in the galaxy". Note how it says "is" instead of "were"
7. There are multiple statements that have retconned the part of the fact file you are isolating, but that in no way invalidates the statement being discussed unless you have something retconning it.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
http://i.imgur.com/iFY3fLa.png

This could, and should, likely mean influence given the context of the quote. And indeed, Mace's influence/power over the Jedi Order does indeed rival Yoda's.