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Fight takes place in the Jedi Temple Sparring Arena.

If you think it makes a difference:

1. Just a sparring match

2. To the death

Standard equipment, start 7 metres apart.

Qui-Gon humbles him in the sparring match.
Unfriendly Qui-Gon smashes him to death in Round 2.

God that's really close.

I'd say Jinn wins barely. Both I would say are tier 8, both are described as master swordsmen, Drallig was trained by Yoda, Jinn by Dooku. This matchup is actually so close.

I mean, Drallig has more extensive knowledge of each lightsaber form, but I doubt that would help too much against Jinn's Form IV. I mean, Drallig could attempt to use Form II to exploit Form IV's weakness in defense, but Jinn has sparred with Dooku enough to know how to deal with makashi I'd say. Plus Jinn has been shown to match Maul in lightsaber combat, who was a Juyo specialist.

Forms mean jack shit when it comes to this fight. I'd say it would come down to experience. I guess Jinn takes the cake here in that he's got more combat experience outside of the jedi temple.

Still, I really can't call it though.

I doubt Drallig is an 8 considering how Anakin killed him in seconds.

Jinn beats him, contending with Maul like that is more impressive than a vague accolade from Dooku, and being better than a weapons master is more impressive than being a battlemaster.

It's... not, really, but in this case it is.

Originally posted by samappo
God that's really close.

I'd say Jinn wins barely. Both I would say are tier 8, both are described as master swordsmen, Drallig was trained by Yoda, Jinn by Dooku. This matchup is actually so close.

I mean, Drallig has more extensive knowledge of each lightsaber form, but I doubt that would help too much against Jinn's Form IV. I mean, Drallig could attempt to use Form II to exploit Form IV's weakness in defense, but Jinn has sparred with Dooku enough to know how to deal with makashi I'd say. Plus Jinn has been shown to match Maul in lightsaber combat, who was a Juyo specialist.

Forms mean jack shit when it comes to this fight. I'd say it would come down to experience. I guess Jinn takes the cake here in that he's got more combat experience outside of the jedi temple.

Still, I really can't call it though.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I doubt Drallig is an 8 considering how Anakin killed him in seconds.

I think so. Maul is an 8. I'd put Jinn on the same level as Maul or a slight slight bit below. Drallig has to be a low 8 at least. Cos Tier 7 duelists are Kit Fisto and AoTC Kenobi, and we can be sure Drallig is above those two.

Originally posted by samappo
I'd put Jinn on the same level as Maul or a slight slight bit below.


Maybe you should rewatch TPM

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Jinn beats him, contending with Maul like that is more impressive than a vague accolade from Dooku, and being better than a weapons master is more impressive than being a battlemaster.

^

I've watched it and read the novel. Jinn matched Maul, and the main reason stated why Jinn lost overall was his age and deteriorating fatigue.

Originally posted by samappo
Cos Tier 7 duelists are Kit Fisto and AoTC Kenobi, and we can be sure Drallig is above those two.
He might be above, but I wouldn't say enough for a full tier - let alone the "cheat" tiers of 8 or 9. Fisto's hailed as one of the greatest swordmasters in the history of the Jedi Order (which is Drallig's main claim to fame) and performed impressively against Grievous, after all. Fisto also lasts roughly the same amount of time versus Palpatine as Drallig did versus Anakin, for what its worth.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
He might be above, but I wouldn't say enough for a full tier - let alone the "cheat" tiers of 8 or 9. Fisto's hailed as one of the greatest swordmasters in the history of the Jedi Order (which is Drallig's main claim to fame) and performed impressively against Grievous, after all.

TCW Grievous mind you.

He should be around Drallig.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
He might be above, but I wouldn't say enough for a full tier - let alone the "cheat" tiers of 8 or 9. Fisto's hailed as one of the greatest swordmasters in the history of the Jedi Order (which is Drallig's main claim to fame) and performed impressively against Grievous, after all. Fisto also lasts roughly the same amount of time versus Palpatine as Drallig did versus Anakin, for what its worth.

Very true. Dooku muses (grant that this is an opinion) that Grievous would be ****ed if he came up against Drallig in a lightsaber engagement. Maybe Drallig is more like a high 7 or very low 8?

Jinn.

Yeah, I reckon Jinn wins, but in a great fight. In part because Cin knows Ataru very well and may be able to devise a counter for it, although Qui-Gon is familiar with a wide array of fighting styles himself.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I doubt Drallig is an 8 considering how Anakin killed him in seconds.
massive difference in tiers, and anakin's a tier 9 so...

Originally posted by SunRazer
Yeah, I reckon Jinn wins, but in a great fight. In part because Cin knows Ataru very well and may be able to devise a counter for it, although Qui-Gon is familiar with a wide array of fighting styles himself.

I think it can be either brief or long depending on what happens. Jinn has been known to spar with the previous battlemaster Anoon Bondara and actually win in a brief amount of time on occasion. Bondara was a Juyo specialist, and considering he was the temple battlemaster and instructor before Drallig we can infer that he was not only a master of all forms but also comparatively equal to Drallig.



^ Yup.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Yeah, I reckon Jinn wins, but in a great fight. In part because Cin knows Ataru very well and may be able to devise a counter for it, although Qui-Gon is familiar with a wide array of fighting styles himself.
So... Jinn>Drallig>Galen>>Shaak Ti?

Jinn>>>>Shaak? Meh that actually doesn't bug me that much lel

Shaak is > Galen

And yes Jinn is a stronger swordsman than Shaak Ti. Imo anyway.

Shaak isn't remotely better than end-game Galen, if that's who you mean.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Shaak isn't better than prime Galen.


Galen roughly stalemated her in lightsaber combat in their fight on Felucia, and since then Galen has quotes saying he increased in skill, increased substantially in baseline physicality, and several quotes sprinkled throughout the rest of the book mentioning various power growths he's had since then.

Command of the Force makes difference in a duel. Dueling skills alone are never sufficient.

Yeah I meant Galen at the time he vsed her. My bad. Without doubt prime Galen is better.

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
massive difference in tiers, and anakin's a tier 9 so...
We see how 9s handle 8s with Anakin and Yoda vs Dooku and Palpatine vs Maul.

Anakin's performance is more consistent with Palpatine's handling of a 7 like Kit.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
We see how 9s handle 8s with Anakin and Yoda vs Dooku and Palpatine vs Maul.

Anakin's performance is more consistent with Palpatine's handling of a 7 like Kit.

From what I remember they fought while Vader was choking one student, then we he finished off the padawan they had a short exchange and then Drallig was cut down.

Palpatine cut Fisto down somewhat quicker and even then that's only because Palpatine spend two seconds picking off the other two masters.

Sources vary, but the novel has Anakin killing Drallig in a single strike.

I'll check when I get home, but the VG also conveys something along those lines of great speed.

I'd wager Anakin killed him faster than Sheev did Kit, or at least around that time.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Sources vary, but the novel has Anakin killing Drallig in a single strike.

I'll check when I get home, but the VG also conveys something along those lines of great speed.

I'd wager Anakin killed him faster than Sheev did Kit, or at least around that time.

Only the RotS novel mentions that Anakin strided through and hacked through Drallig's shoulder.



The VG doesn't mention really anything.

Rise of Darth Vader mentions, that he remembers pitting blades against Drallig.



The Unseen Queen mentions that the two fought toe to toe for an instant before he was cut down.



So I'd say yeah, probably roughly around the same speed if you take all into account.

From when Sidious had only Mace and Fisto to fight to Fisto dying is like 4-5 seconds, and that's because he's still gotta mind Mace.

Originally posted by Zenwolf
So I'd say yeah, probably roughly around the same speed if you take all into account.
Seems like a few seconds at best.

By hype, they should be around the same level.

In the TCW rendition, Palpatine killed Fisto much faster.

lol
Cin > Kit > Qui-Gon.

Originally posted by Geistalt
lol
Cin > Kit > Qui-Gon.

Qui-Gon > Cin > Kit ******

Originally posted by Emperordmb
So... Jinn>Drallig>Galen>>Shaak Ti?

Jinn>>>>Shaak? Meh that actually doesn't bug me that much lel

IIRC, Galen was on the backfoot against Shaak on Felucia, and even afterwards, despite "improvements", his struggles against Maris Brood and a paltry Shadow Guard don't lead me to believe that he particularly outstripped Shaak. Maybe by the end of the game he was better, but not by much. Likewise, if Drallig was better, it wouldn't be by too much against Galen. The same goes for Qui-Gon vs Drallig.

When did he struggle with Maris or a Shadow Guard?

In the novel, an apparently weakened Galen is staggered by Maris Brood's assault, although this was on a DS nexus (not that Brood has anything off-nexus). He then switches from Soresu to Juyo, a form which Maris isn't familiar with due to her limited Jedi training, and overwhelms her.

Later on Raxus Prime, he nearly gets knocked flat by a strike from a Shadow Guard and the two later fight back and forth for a while. I posted a quote in the Tyranus vs Vader thread.

Originally posted by SunRazer
IIRC, Galen was on the backfoot against Shaak on Felucia, and even afterwards, despite "improvements", his struggles against Maris Brood and a paltry Shadow Guard don't lead me to believe that he particularly outstripped Shaak. Maybe by the end of the game he was better, but not by much. Likewise, if Drallig was better, it wouldn't be by too much against Galen. The same goes for Qui-Gon vs Drallig.

All we know is that Mace and Jinn were superior swordsmen to Anoon Bondara, and since Drallig could be assumed to be roughly equal to Bondara, the same applies to him.

Just because they were both Battlemasters doesn't mean they can equated. By that logic, HoT ~ Jun Seros. That's just fallacious logic.

Originally posted by SunRazer
Just because they were both Battlemasters doesn't mean they can equated. By that logic, HoT ~ Jun Seros. That's just fallacious logic.

Not sure who they are. But we can at least infer that as battlemasters and instructors of lightsaber combat, they were both masters of all seven forms of lightsaber combat.

Bondara was considered the premiere lightsaber duelist of the order, and Drallig was considered in his own time as unparalleled with the lightsaber.

I can't definitively say they are roughly equals, but both had very similar traits.

Bondara was not confirmed as a Battlemaster. Why do people keep saying he was?

Originally posted by SunRazer
Just because they were both Battlemasters doesn't mean they can equated. By that logic, HoT ≈ Kao Cen Darach. That's just fallacious logic.

Originally posted by Emperordmb
Bondara was not confirmed as a Battlemaster. Why do people keep saying he was?

There's implications. Both he and Drallig were head lightsaber instructors and Drallig became Battlemaster around the time that Bondara died.

Qui Gon