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odin-
https://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldatabase/images/9/95/Odin_Borson_%28Earth-616%29_by_Immonen.JPG/revision/latest?cb=20120129203152

v.s.

progenitor-
http://www.cosmicteams.com/legion/profiles/images/Legion2/Element_LegionLost_11_2001.jpg

I'd probably be inclined to side with Progenitor.


He created an entire galaxy just to keep him company:
http://i.imgur.com/50gqdWw.jpg

He also contained the 'Omniphagos' -- a creature that was already galaxy-level, with the potential to consume the whole of existence:
http://i.imgur.com/vEZDQBL.jpg


*For those unfamiliar with Progenitor: he is essentially Element Lad with billionS of years of experience mastering his powers, thanks to a rather unfortunate series of events:
https://i.imgur.com/kUwU1f8.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ybLbhHj.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/TJCQdWL.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/DTqtHMG.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ESbkYb5.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/ZI7nGlC.jpg

He's no less than a high-end Skyfather, imo.

Odin wins pretty decisively. Far more experienced in combat and Jan's best feats in this incarnation are pretty shitty compared to some of Odin's greatest ones (Galaxy level vs. Multi-Universal). IIRC he was implied to have created a galaxy (Which is cool) but he was around for billions (?) of years and he was going from world to world, manipulating cultures etc. I don't remember him snapping his fingers or casting a spell and creating a galaxy for example.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Odin wins pretty decisively. Far more experienced in combat and Jan's best feats in this incarnation are pretty shitty compared to some of Odin's greatest ones (Galaxy level vs. Multi-Universal). IIRC he was implied to have created a galaxy (Which is cool) but he was around for billions (?) of years and he was going from world to world, manipulating cultures etc. I don't remember him snapping his fingers or casting a spell and creating a galaxy for example.
Has Odin created a galaxy? He needed time to create Asgard after all.

Odin restored everything he destroyed as Infinity.

He was amped by the sliver of abstract Infinity. And they were planets at the end of universe. Not galaxy.

Yep.

Silver Surfer's evolved life. Odds are, given enough time and the materials to work with (As Jan didn't create the base components, he simply manipulated them), he could create his own species too.

The Omniphagos containment is really impessive though. I believe that same material allowed Jan to survived through the Big Bang.

Originally posted by cdtm
Odds are, given enough time and the materials to work with (As Jan didn't create the base components, he simply manipulated them), he could create his own species too. He definitely can...because he did:

http://i.imgur.com/BXKQAym.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
He was amped by the sliver of abstract Infinity. And they were planets at the end of universe. Not galaxy.

No he wasn't.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
No he wasn't.
Yes, he was retconned in Quasar 19 to tapping the power of Infinity to do so.

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix7/infinityodin06.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
Yes, he was retconned in Quasar 19 to tapping the power of Infinity to do so.

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix7/infinityodin06.jpg

I know all about that panel. It implies that the rogue aspect of Odin was a portion of Infinity not just a crazy aspect of Odin called Infinity* wrecking havoc across the Universe but what does that have to do with Odin restoring all the damage with a wave of his hand after he defeated Infinity?

*Not sure which is more impressive but the story was retold with no mention of the cosmic abstract Infinity after Quasar #19 so it's moot anyways.

Progenitor.

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Odin restored everything he destroyed as Infinity. do u have this feat handy? i'd like to see it.

Originally posted by Zack M
Progenitor.

Odin.

Odin.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
do u have this feat handy? i'd like to see it.
http://oi67.tinypic.com/2uzp25v.jpg

http://oi66.tinypic.com/29f475l.jpg

how extensive was the damage caused by infinity, cuz all the scans says is "on every world where carnage hath occurred" ?

and why did odin use his power scepter to undo the damage? could he have done that without it?

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
how extensive was the damage caused by infinity, cuz all the scans says is "on every world where carnage hath occurred" ?

and why did odin use his power scepter to undo the damage? could he have done that without it?
Asgardians tend to put emphasis on weapons and tools, but the scepter is generally a tool to channel the Odinforce. It's been stated more than once that his true power resides deep within himself. Iirc the scepter's first appearance, it was all but useless when Loki tried to use it and was explained later where the Odin's power really resides.

A good portion of the universe was messed up going by the arc and handbooks.

so minus the scepter do u think he could have still undone the damge? how much more difficult would it have been for him solo?

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
so minus the scepter do u think he could have still undone the damge? how much more difficult would it have been for him solo?
Sure.. Don't see why not.
He does seem to bequeath some of the Odinorce into these trinkets and such giving emphasis on them, but I guess it differs from writer to writer. Some writers just love to place emphasis on tools when it comes to Asgardians and gods in general.

He fought Infinity without any tool, fought Forsung w/scepter, he fought Thanos with Gungnir, fought Galactus without a tool, etc...
In the end it's all Odin and the Odinforce.

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
how extensive was the damage caused by infinity, cuz all the scans says is "on every world where carnage hath occurred" ?

and why did odin use his power scepter to undo the damage? could he have done that without it?

It was never specified how much damage he had done so far it was very extensive across the Universe. Hela had released that aspect of Odin to literally destroy creation and return it to her dimension of death (Hela was Death before Death at this point). The story lasted from #182 to #188. It was a really fun arc, recommend read. The last Stan Lee Thor story.

For example: Galaxies were said to be destroyed as a side-effect of Odin's duel with Infinity so we have some perspective.

The Scepter is nothing but a worthless trinket unless Odin deems otherwise. Loki discovered this first hand.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
It was never specified how much damage he had done so far it was very extensive across the Universe. Hela had released that aspect of Odin to literally destroy creation and return it to her dimension of death (Hela was Death before Death at this point). The story lasted from #182 to #188. It was a really fun arc, recommend read. The last Stan Lee Thor story.

For example: Galaxies were said to be destroyed as a side-effect of Odin's duel with Infinity so we have some perspective.

The Scepter is nothing but a worthless trinket unless Odin deems otherwise. Loki discovered this first hand. okay cool. thanks.

why would odin use the scepter if it is worthless? almost seemed like he required it because he specifically chose and used it. maybe the scepter is just worthless in the wrong hands like thor's hammer?

Originally posted by DeadpoolXXX
okay cool. thanks.

why would odin use the scepter if it is worthless? almost seemed like he required it because he specifically chose and used it. maybe the scepter is just worthless in the wrong hands like thor's hammer?

The scepter is a symbol of Odin's throne, power and can be used to channel the Odin-Force like Gugnir or Mjolnir but it is ultimately powerless without Odin. That isn't even the original scepter for example. The original one Loki claimed because he thought it would make him all powerful like Odin:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/139933/3836976-am+7.jpg
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/139933/3836977-am+8.jpg

Ah the old days. When being a wise but stern and strong yet thoughtful patriarch didn't equate to being a sexist ******* moron.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I know all about that panel. It implies that the rogue aspect of Odin was a portion of Infinity not just a crazy aspect of Odin called Infinity* wrecking havoc across the Universe but what does that have to do with Odin restoring all the damage with a wave of his hand after he defeated Infinity?

*Not sure which is more impressive but the story was retold with no mention of the cosmic abstract Infinity after Quasar #19 so it's moot anyways.
Odin absorbed the Infinity aspect of himself after that fight and then restored the planets.

Ergo amped.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
It was never specified how much damage he had done so far it was very extensive across the Universe. Hela had released that aspect of Odin to literally destroy creation and return it to her dimension of death (Hela was Death before Death at this point). The story lasted from #182 to #188. It was a really fun arc, recommend read. The last Stan Lee Thor story.

For example: Galaxies were said to be destroyed as a side-effect of Odin's duel with Infinity so we have some perspective.

The Scepter is nothing but a worthless trinket unless Odin deems otherwise. Loki discovered this first hand.
No galaxies were destroyed there despite one sentence from Odin. Only planets.

Originally posted by abhilegend
No galaxies were destroyed there despite one sentence from Odin. Only planets.
Were the planets even destroyed? I thought they were BFRed?
https://s21.postimg.org/dwt1j4emr/1848903-thor_188.jpg

That entire arc was a clusterphuck.

Originally posted by zopzop
Were the planets even destroyed? I thought they were BFRed?
https://s21.postimg.org/dwt1j4emr/1848903-thor_188.jpg

That entire arc was a clusterphuck.
The planets were destroyed in fight of Odin and Infinity. No galaxy was destroyed.

No.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Odin absorbed the Infinity aspect of himself after that fight and then restored the planets.

Ergo amped.

He reabsorbed a rogue portion of himself and as of that story the entity known as Infinity seized to exist.

You think that after Infinity was defeated the retcon was intending for Odin to still be connected to Infinity?

That flies completely against the spirit of the retcon (And doesn't make sense).

It would also mean that Odin got a permanent upgrade as that aspect was never separated again so it doesn't change anything for the validity of the feat. Clearly this is stupid as that was never the intention in either comic but it's the only logical conclusion.

Originally posted by abhilegend
No galaxies were destroyed there despite one sentence from Odin. Only planets.

Odin said galaxies were destroyed. The scale, art and stakes of the comic totally support this.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
He reabsorbed a rogue portion of himself and as of that story the entity known as Infinity seized to exist.

You think that after Infinity was defeated the retcon was intending for Odin to still be connected to Infinity?

That flies completely against the spirit of the retcon (And doesn't make sense).

It would also mean that Odin got a permanent upgrade as that aspect was never separated again so it doesn't change anything for the validity of the feat. Clearly this is stupid as that was never the intention in either comic but it's the only logical conclusion.
The sliver of Infinity was absorbed by abstract Infinity not long after.

Odin by himself was helpless to restore the worlds hidden by Infinity.Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Odin said galaxies were destroyed. The scale, art and stakes of the comic totally support this.
Odin said he will not fall even if galaxies fall. That's it. The official index for the issue states only planets were destroyed in the fight.

https://s6.postimg.org/r02w3u641/aven64.jpg

No galaxies were shown or stated to be destroyed. Even the scientists inform that the planets were disappearing one by one.

Abhi u need help.

Pretty sure there's a reason u didn't include #188 where it stated that he returned the universe to normal.

Originally posted by abhilegend
The sliver of Infinity was absorbed by abstract Infinity not long after.

Odin by himself was helpless to restore the worlds hidden by Infinity.
Odin said he will not fall even if galaxies fall. That's it. The official index for the issue states only planets were destroyed in the fight.

No galaxies were shown or stated to be destroyed. Even the scientists inform that the planets were disappearing one by one.

Where did this happen? Can I have an issue number please.

I would like to note, that this a logical continuation of your argument. I don't at all believe Infinity was at play in anyway after Odin reabsorbed it even if we include the retcon.

A summary in a handbook NOT stating that Galaxies were destroyed does not counter Odin flat out stating that Galaxies were destroyed.

"Odin states Galaxies were destroyed"
*Posts Handbook not going into any detail into the destruction*
"No Galaxies were said to be destroyed"

Are you simple or just a liar? The scientist were observing Infinity's progress systematically earlier, what does that have to do with the fight between Infinity and Odin? Scientists from Earth were able to view the fight and Infinity's destruction due to the cataclysm being wrought:
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/2/28708/799959-odingalaxy.jpg

Also multiple times during that issue the word worlds were used and we see Infinity snatching up a Star System (A Sun with surrounding planets) etc. And 3 issues mentioned many times how extensive the damage to the Universe was and how all of the cosmos was in peril. Infinity had absorbed so many worlds and was doing it increasingly faster, everything from Asgard to Earth was suffering cataclysmic events as the death of the Universe approached.

For the record, I'd like to see a scan of Odin absorbing Infinity and getting a "power-boost" as well. Because in Thor #188, he blasts Infinity and destroys him in a single attack.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Where did this happen? Can I have an issue number please.


Not shown on panel but stated so in her bio.

Infinity was a sliver of abstract Infinity, how was it not in play when Odin absorbed it again?

WTF are you talking about? That's the official index of the issue, not a handbook.



And they stated that the planets are vanishing one by one.

http://i.imgur.com/2EDgbgm.jpg

When Odin restored the damage, he did it to world's ravaged, not galaxies.

"Galaxies fall" is a standard Stan Lee hyperbole never shown or repeated again.



Yes, worlds. Not galaxies. It makes Odin below Guardians of the universe level who were stopping galactic level destruction and then restored entire universe (Stars and planets included).

group of skyfather level beings.
http://i.imgur.com/t60EDo6.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/5X2jPFh.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/M7OudER.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ZR4jb8V.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/kIuAMZb.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/pKQww1M.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/2FAISY5.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend
Not shown on panel but stated so in her bio.

Infinity was a sliver of abstract Infinity, how was it not in play when Odin absorbed it again?

WTF are you talking about? That's the official index of the issue, not a handbook.

Scan please. It doesn't matter (But I always ask with you being a known liar and everything) because you don't know when was this sliver reabsorbed or how long after do you?

Because we never saw him having it removed and we never saw him even absorbing the corrupted version of himself in the first place. It was destroyed in #188. Unless I'm missing something and if I am, scans would be appreciated.

Originally posted by abhilegend
And they stated that the planets are vanishing one by one.

When Odin restored the damage, he did it to world's ravaged, not galaxies.

"Galaxies fall" is a standard Stan Lee hyperbole never shown or repeated again.

Yes, worlds. Not galaxies.

What does that scan have anything to do with what I said? The scientists are observing parts of Infinity's destruction. I'm not arguing that Infinity wasn't absorbing worlds one by one. He was, but he was doing so at an increasingly alarming rate and not just planets but worlds (Aka systems etc.) to the point that the Universe was in danger of soon collapsing. Therefore, Odin restored a great deal more than just planets as the damage was Universal. This is further highlighted because the simply side effect of their fight destroyed Galaxies (Not the first time under Stan Lee mind you) and that wasn't nearly as ferocious as Infinity's constant feeding.

Odin does not usr external power sources unless explicitely announced, dependibg in the items and story.

He adds his power to artifacts, weapons, characters and even places. When he is seen using or holding items, while engaged in an actiin that requires more power, he is actually tapping into his own power source.

I forget where i read it, maybe one of u knows. But, a portiin of his power is fed directly into the 9 worlds. Which is y, at times in certain stories, such a big deal is made of him needing to take back some of his power from this or that. He is tied into everything.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Scan please. It doesn't matter (But I always ask with you being a known liar and everything) because you don't know when was this sliver reabsorbed or how long after do you?


It was in her bio in OHOTMU.

You are such a renowned debater, eh?



This is just laughable. Odin was intended to feeding on the sliver in that story only as a retcon.

Later writers ignored it as they do for most amps.

Can you prove Odin still has that sliver of Infinity in his power?

World's are suddenly solar systems. Makes sense.

He restored the planets one by one.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/13/139933/3595749-thor+188+-+19.jpg

Key word, "Worlds", not galaxies.

There is no Galaxy destroyed. Are you talking about his fight with Foresung? There was no galaxy destroyed there either.