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Starlord...
Gamora...
Drax...
Rocket Racoon...
Groot...

vs

The Reverse Flash...


Battle to the Death or KO with no BFR allowed; standard equipment only...

Fight takes place in Downtown Central City at Night...

Who wins?

RF wins handily, they wouldn't even see him coming tbh

Like RF says to the Legends of Tomorrow, "I could kill you all in the blink of an eye"

Yet with 30 Time Remnants, and about 3-5 minutes of chanting, he still somehow managed to not stop Vixen from fixing the world and snatching the Spear of Destiny from her.

Originally posted by KingD19
Yet with 30 Time Remnants, and about 3-5 minutes of chanting, he still somehow managed to not stop Vixen from fixing the world and snatching the Spear of Destiny from her.

Everyone has there PIS moment...

Based on what we have seen from Eobard, the above is the exception opposed to the rule...

Can RF even kill Groot? He doesn't have normal human physiology, so conventional phase attacks might just annoy him. Also, RF has been tagged by non-speedsters while engaged with other opponents multiple times before. He's fast, one-on-one, but he is also cocky as f***, and can leave himself open to blindside attacks. And that's not PIS. It's simply Thawne's character, as shown throughout his various appearances.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
And that's not PIS. It's simply Thawne's character, as shown throughout his various appearances.

yeah well by that logic the GotG would lose because they always bicker and fight which would prevent them from mounting a proper offence because its in their character to do so

Except they have shown the ability to come up with effective team strategies while bickering with each other. RF has gotten himself tagged by the likes of Green Arrow, Firestorm, the Waverider and more, because he likes to grandstand.

Anyway, not saying the Guardians would win. Just that RF isn't untouchable in fights where he takes on multiple non-fodder opponents at once.

I mainly wonder whether he can actually put Groot down. As I already mentioned, there is no guarantee that his usual phase attack will have the desired result, and I can't think of anything else in his offensive arsenal that will do the job either.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Except they have shown the ability to come up with effective team strategies while bickering with each other. RF has gotten himself tagged by the likes of Green Arrow, Firestorm, the Waverider and more, because he likes to grandstand.


Except he didn't want to kill them. He wanted them too suffer under his new timeline.

He is however fully willing to kill under normal circumstances.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Except he didn't want to kill them. He wanted them too suffer under his new timeline.

He is however fully willing to kill under normal circumstances.

He was trying to kill Flash, Arrow and Firestorm during the end of S1 of Flash. Yet he ended up unconscious and captured instead. He also got tagged by Firestorm in a much earlier episode, when focused on the Flash, and ran away. And he got hit by the Waverider, while focused on Rip, in a LoT episode. And those are just examples off the top of my head. And none of that had anything to do with his new timeline. It's been shown time and time again that all the CW Speedsters can get tagged by non-speedters when distracted. Even Zoom and Savitar got tagged by Killer Frost while they were focused on other opponents.

Reverse Flash got killed by an ice gun. They're not infallible.


Oh, and on the topic of the new reality, Merlin and Darhk told Thawne repeatedly that he should just kill the Legends, but his cockiness made them fail multiple times before he got 30 clones and still somehow didn't do anything worthwhile.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
He was trying to kill Flash, Arrow and Firestorm during the end of S1 of Flash. Yet he ended up unconscious and captured instead. He also got tagged by Firestorm in a much earlier episode, when focused on the Flash, and ran away. And he got hit by the Waverider, while focused on Rip, in a LoT episode. And those are just examples off the top of my head. And none of that had anything to do with his new timeline. It's been shown time and time again that all the CW Speedsters can get tagged by non-speedters when distracted. Even Zoom and Savitar got tagged by Killer Frost while they were focused on other opponents.



Sure when they're distracted. But why would he be distracted here? Assuming he doesn't know know them.

Also Flash and Firestorm together would be a difficult fight for him even if not distracted. And I'm guessing he wasn't out to kill RIP.


You could argue that the chances of getting tagged increase with more opponents, but then when providing past examples we have to look at

1) the quality/strength of opponents
2) if they were actually out for the KO/Kill

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Sure when they're distracted. But why would he be distracted here? Assuming he doesn't know know them.

Also Flash and Firestorm together would be a difficult fight for him even if not distracted. And I'm guessing he wasn't out to kill RIP.


You could argue that the chances of getting tagged increase with more opponents, but then when providing past examples we have to look at

1) the quality/strength of opponents
2) if they were actually out for the KO/Kill

Because, like all the other instances, they focus on a single opponent, and there are five here?

Starlord, who has blasters that can tear through alien ships and obliterate Ego's avatar, plus can fly and has other gadgets.
Gamora, who has superhuman stats, arguably better fighting skill than anyone Thawne has taken on, with the possible exception of Green Arrow.
Groot, who has super strength, superhuman toughness, and can stretch his vines out over large distances. And no one has, as of yet, given solid evidence that RF could even put him down.
Drax, who is way tougher than anyone Thawne has ever fought, much stronger than him, and a skilled fighter.
And Rocket, who always carries things like explosives, beyond his guns, and is great at improvising on the go.

And all of them have shown that they are more than willing to kill. So, tell me, when has RF ever beaten a group of that caliber, and done so without getting tagged once?

Oh, and he was definitely trying to kill during his S1 fight with the trio. He even tried his chest phase attack on Arrow at one point. Whereas the team was fighting to KO him.

I am tempted to give Thawne a skill edge simply on the basis that he managed to fight and even gain a temporary advantage over League Oliver without his powers. Then again it may be due to.my personal bias.

Skill edge? Gamora is one of the most skilled and desdliest fighters in the universe. As is Drax.

5-0 in favor of Eobard...

So we all agree that the Reverse Flash wins?

Oh You're doing that thing again. No. He doesnt even win half.

Originally posted by KingD19
Oh You're doing that thing again. No. He doesnt even win half.

That's not what the voters think...

It seems some people have a really hard time admitting MCU characters can possibly lose.

I will say it again November is going to be a bloodbath.

It seems some people have a really hard time admitting DCEU characters aren't nearly as unbeatable as they want them to be.

I will say it again, November is going to be hilarious.

Thor without mjolnir is going to suck ass

He got taken down by a net, lmao. Hela is probably going to be strong though

Given Thor's feats, if he is at 100% and the net takes him down. that just proves how powerful the net is.

Originally posted by playa1258
It seems some people have a really hard time admitting MCU characters can possibly lose.

lol at you trying to make it a DC-Marvel thing. And then go off topic about films in November. And you accuse others of trolling?

But seeing as you are so convinced RF wins, tell me, will you answer the question posted multiple times relating to Groot? Because phase attack is not gauranteed to work, considering his unique physiology. Hell, Flash used an RF-style chest phase on Solovar and it didn't kill him either, which implies that enhanced durability increases survival rate.

Originally posted by Silent Master
It seems some people have a really hard time admitting DCEU characters aren't nearly as unbeatable as they want them to be.

I will say it again, November is going to be hilarious.

RF isn't unbeatable, but with PIS off and bloodlust on...it's just hard to see why he loses. Yes, he got killed by an ice gun and he does have these low end feats. We also know, though, that he does have the speed to blitz this team before they can do much of anything.

I'm guessing the only Guardian who doesn't have to worry about getting a fist phased through his brain is Groot.

I complained about the PIS myself, RF *could* have easily snatched the spear of destiny, the way it ended made no sense. The reason he didn't literally boils down to: cuz the plot. Either that or temporary amnesia. That is the problem when dealing with speedsters, their defeat usually comes down to something retarded(unless it's another speedster defeating them).

Originally posted by Surtur
RF isn't unbeatable, but with PIS off and bloodlust on...it's just hard to see why he loses. Yes, he got killed by an ice gun and he does have these low end feats. We also know, though, that he does have the speed to blitz this team before they can do much of anything.

I'm guessing the only Guardian who doesn't have to worry about getting a fist phased through his brain is Groot.

I complained about the PIS myself, RF *could* have easily snatched the spear of destiny, the way it ended made no sense. The reason he didn't literally boils down to: cuz the plot. Either that or temporary amnesia. That is the problem when dealing with speedsters, their defeat usually comes down to something retarded(unless it's another speedster defeating them).

Where in the OP does it say bloodlusted?

And no one has still provided a decent argument for him killing Groot. If someone can, I can agree with him taking the win. But, until then, I remain unconvinced.

Bloodlust isn't on though and while we generally ignore PIS, we do take CIS into account.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
lol at you trying to make it a DC-Marvel thing. And then go off topic about films in November. And you accuse others of trolling?

But seeing as you are so convinced RF wins, tell me, will you answer the question posted multiple times relating to Groot? Because phase attack is not gauranteed to work, considering his unique physiology. Hell, Flash used an RF-style chest phase on Solovar and it didn't kill him either, which implies that enhanced durability increases survival rate.

Especially since he claimed that I was unable to admit MCU characters lose and his proof was me not giving Baleman a BJ while performing a reach-around on Bane.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Where in the OP does it say bloodlusted?

And no one has still provided a decent argument for him killing Groot. If someone can, I can agree with him taking the win. But, until then, I remain unconvinced.

I guess I assumed a battle to the death meant they were bloodlusted.

As for Groot, he is a wild card. It's hard to say if getting a fist phased through his head would or would not harm him.

Lets not ignore that while trying to phase a speedster is immobile and wide open to attack.

While bloodlust isnt on, characters fight to the best of their ability in a Forum Fight (unless otherwise stated in the OP) and no PIS is a standard Forum Fight condition...

So, no...none of the Reverse Flashes PIS moments will follow him into this fight.

CIS is still on.

And they only ever have phased people one specific way. So thats the only way they can do it.

I still think it comes down to Groot. Because if phasing doesn't work, RF is going to be right in front of him, and wide open, and Groot has shown that he can expand his roots and vines out very quickly, plus a willingness (almost an eagerness) to kill.

This thread:

http://www.thewebsiteofdoom.com/new/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/tumblr_o1lew0iJN91ue5fuio2_400.gif

Reverse Flash wins this. Groot is the only one that might not be insta-killed but Thawne could likely phase Groot into the ground for a win. And honestly if his own attacks didn't work, he could easily pick up the weapons of the other Guardians to use against Groot.

But it'll be a fist through the chest or face for all the others.

Originally posted by juggerman
Reverse Flash wins this. Groot is the only one that might not be insta-killed but Thawne could likely phase Groot into the ground for a win. And honestly if his own attacks didn't work, he could easily pick up the weapons of the other Guardians to use against Groot.

But it'll be a fist through the chest or face for all the others.

A Flash has never done that. They're not Shadowcat. And he's not making them give up their weapons.

Again, it takes aaaages to actually phase someone as an attack. He would literally be standing still hoping the others didn't make a move while he slowly pushed his hand toward someones chest.

Originally posted by juggerman
Reverse Flash wins this. Groot is the only one that might not be insta-killed but Thawne could likely phase Groot into the ground for a win. And honestly if his own attacks didn't work, he could easily pick up the weapons of the other Guardians to use against Groot.

But it'll be a fist through the chest or face for all the others.

Post a clip of Thawne phasing someone into the ground.

Originally posted by KingD19
A Flash has never done that. They're not Shadowcat. And he's not making them give up their weapons.

Again, it takes aaaages to actually phase someone as an attack. He would literally be standing still hoping the others didn't make a move while he slowly pushed his hand toward someones chest.

Not give up their weapons. Like he would take the weapons from their corpses.

And he can phase and kill quickly. You're assuming that because he likes to take his time and monologue to the heroes he's used to that he does to everyone. There are scenes where he rushes in and kills mofos right away without a word . Hell he pulled Atom's heart out in the blink of an eye. Sure he talked to him first but that's because he knew him. There's no reason to speak to the Guardians.

Originally posted by Silent Master
CIS is still on.

Yeah, but even with his penchant for giving speeches and such...scenes like him failing to snatch the spear aren't in character, they are just stupid.

He will take his time when he wants, but will kill quickly when he needs to:

d6vNCws-LOQ

The #10 feat shows some quick kills, as does the feat that plays right before that.

His attempts to kill Barry's mom show both Flashes fighting while everything else around them is moving in slow motion.

Fight seems to boil down to: Does RF feel like talking? Even with the wild card that is Groot, it's hard to see how Groot actually ever tags him.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Where in the OP does it say bloodlusted?

And no one has still provided a decent argument for him killing Groot. If someone can, I can agree with him taking the win. But, until then, I remain unconvinced.

I have a very decent argument for RF destroying Groot, but apparently no one has been able to think them up, so I'll supply them myself...

1st, RF can hurle Lightning at an opponent just like Flash can; Lightning can burn wood, so thats one way RF can destroy Groot...

2nd, have you all forgotten to read the OP? The fight happens at night in Central City, so let that sink in for a moment, and ask yourself "is there anything in Central City RF can access to destroy Groot?" The only answer an objective person will come to is "hell yes!"

So yeah...the RF can absolutely destroy Groot here.

Edit for spelling...

I hate debating with full-powered speedsters.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
I have a very decent argument for RF destroying Groot, but apparently no one has been able to think them up, so I'll supply them myself...

1st, RF can hurle Lightning at an opponent just like Flash can; Lightning can burn wood, so thats one way RF can destroy Groot...

2nd, have you all forgotten to read the OP? The fight happens at night in Central City, so let that sink in for a moment, and ask yourself "is there anything in Central City RF can access to destroy Groot?" The only answer an objective person will come to is "hell yes!"

So yeah...the RF can absolutely destroy Groot here.

Edit for spelling...

All Speedsters are not equal. Reverse Flash can't throw lightning as he was never shown to throw lightning.

And are you basically saying Eobard will BFR himself to find something beyond the battlefield to hurt Groot with? Or are you saying he will go get devices he wouldn't have access to to use in the fight?

Originally posted by KingD19
And are you basically saying Eobard will BFR himself to find something beyond the battlefield to hurt Groot with? Or are you saying he will go get devices he wouldn't have access to to use in the fight?

And he's basically saying that RF needs to go find something that isn't part of his standard gear or abilities in order to take out Groot, even if it means leaving downtown and potentially running all over Central City.

Originally posted by KingD19
All Speedsters are not equal. Reverse Flash can't throw lightning as he was never shown to throw lightning.

And are you basically saying Eobard will BFR himself to find something beyond the battlefield to hurt Groot with? Or are you saying he will go get devices he wouldn't have access to to use in the fight?

Central City is the battleground, so leaving Groots immediate location to find something to destroy him with doesnt constitute BFR'ing himself...

Even though he has an Ego, Eobard is brillant and has a quick mind; it wont take him long to figure something out with what is around him...

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
And he's basically saying that RF needs to go find something that isn't part of his standard gear or abilities in order to take out Groot, even if it means leaving downtown and potentially running all over Central City.

He wont have to leave Downtown...

He may have run away from Groot to get what he needs, but he wont have to BFR himself...

Where did I say anything about BFR? I simply said he might need to run all over Central City.

But indulge me, exactly what in downtown specifically will he find that gets the job done? And "he will find something" is not a proper response.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Where did I say anything about BFR? I simply said he might need to run all over Central City.

But indulge me, exactly what in downtown specifically will he find that gets the job done? And "he will find something" is not a proper response.

You are not creative enough to figure that out?

Starlabs is available to him; if you arent familar enough with what is located there then you shouldnt be in this thread debating...

You didn't answer his question.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You didn't answer his question.

Yes, I did...

There are many ways Eobard can destroy Groot in this senario; those that watch the show will know this immediately...

Especially given the tech thats available to him via Starlabs...

But if you are asking me to supply answers for those that lack knowledge, then I wont do that (I've done enough thinking for you all already)...

I will simply laugh at those attempting to debate without a thorogh knowledge of the source material...

No, answering his question would be telling him what in Star labs can be used to defeat the Guardians.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
You are not creative enough to figure that out?

Starlabs is available to him; if you arent familar enough with what is located there then you shouldnt be in this thread debating...

Is that your new shtick? When you can't actually answer a question, you try to accuse the other side of ignorance? I'm up to date with every single CW DC show. And StarLabs isn't downtown. It's actually much closer to the outskirts of Central City.

What stopping Thawne from picking up the Guardian's weaponry after he dispatches them to kill Groot?

Originally posted by juggerman
What stopping Thawne from picking up the Guardian's weaponry after he dispatches them to kill Groot?

That is an option as well...



Especially considering what Starlords guns were capable of doing to Ego's Avatar...

Originally posted by juggerman
What stopping Thawne from picking up the Guardian's weaponry after he dispatches them to kill Groot?

Well, based on things like how much energy and heat it took, during the team-shielding sequence in the first film finale, to actually take him out, their guns might not be strong enough. But yeah, if he can get his hands on Gamora's sword, he can chop Groot up. We've seen that it can damage him. But thank you for actually replying with a valid argument for RF taking him out. That was all I asked for.

But now I am currently more interested in LoM actually backing his claims, after the condescending attitude he adopted with his false accusations of other people's ignorance (which is pretty ironic at this point). He made the claim that RF will use his super smarts to use StarLabs tech to kill Groot, so burden of proof is on him to show which tech, and how it will be used. Of course, he can choose to try and continue to dodge and deflect, but it will just make him look even worse at this point.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Well, based on things like how much energy and heat it took, during the team-shielding sequence in the first film finale, to actually take him out, their guns might not be strong enough. But yeah, if he can get his hands on Gamora's sword, he can chop Groot up. We've seen that it can damage him. But thank you for actually replying with a valid argument for RF taking him out. That was all I asked for.

But now I am currently more interested in LoM actually backing his claims, after the condescending attitude he adopted with his false accusations of other people's ignorance (which is pretty ironic at this point). He made the claim that RF will use his super smarts to use StarLabs tech to kill Groot, so burden of proof is on him to show which tech, and how it will be used. Of course, he can choose to try and continue to dodge and deflect, but it will just make him look even worse at this point.

My attitude was just; you should know enough about the show to know that whats in Star Labs could be used to kill Groot...

Eobard could just kill everyone but Groot...

Fail to kill Groot as he did the others...

Get an idea on how to beat him (heat/fire being the logical choice against a foe made out of wood), go to Star Labs and use the technology there to make another Heat Gun for example (its not like Groot will know where he went or how to find him, so Eobard has all the time he needs to make it)...

And that's just off the top of my head...


So please, just accept that Groot isn't some special character that's beyond Eobards ability to defeat...

The man is far faster than Groot, far smarter than Groot, and would have complete control of any fight he and Groot would have...

I personally think RF wouldn't even need Star Labs tech to beat Groot honestly as I see no reason why Eobard couldn't burn Groot down with Lightning...

Hell, for all we know, Eobard could conceivably kill Groot by drenching him with gas and then lighting a match...

Without PIS being a factor, there is nothing Groot could do to stop it...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
My attitude was just; you should know enough about the show to know that whats in Star Labs could be used to kill Groot...

No, it wasn't. Acting in a condescending manner while refusing to back a claim you made is not just. It wouldn't matter if I knew what the writer's personal feelings were while they were describing StarLabs in every episode screenplay. The burden of proof is on you to back your claim.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

Eobard could just kill everyone but Groot...

Fail to kill Groot as he did the others...

This bit doesn't even make any sense.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

Get an idea on how to beat him (heat/fire being the logical choice against a foe made out of wood), go to Star Labs and use the technology there to make another Heat Gun for example (its not like Groot will know where he went or how to find him, so Eobard has all the time he needs to make it)...

And that's just off the top of my head...

Cisco built the Heat gun. Not Thawne. Just like Cisco built the Cold gun and the Alchemy gun.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

So please, just accept that Groot isn't some special character that's beyond Eobards ability to defeat...

I said that I question whether phasing would work, but said that I was open to hearing alternative strategies. And I already admitted that Juggerman's strategy would work. So, why are you intentionally trying to misrepresent my statements?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

The man is far faster than Groot, far smarter than Groot, and would have complete control of any fight he and Groot would have...

I personally think RF wouldn't even need Star Labs tech to beat Groot honestly as I see no reason why Eobard couldn't burn Groot down with Lightning...

Trying to give RF an ability he hasn't actually shown onscreen (hmmm... deja vu).

The 1st part makes perfect sense; Eobard would likely kill the others with phase attacks or just beating them to death at superspeed...

There is a real possibility that the above wouldn't do the trick against Groot, so Eobard would have to attempt another tactic...


And yes, Cisco built the Heat Gun, but Eobard comes from a time more than 100 years ahead of Cisco and Star Labs technology...

That Heat Gun (while high tech to Cisco and the world at the time of The Flash) is ancient tech to Eobard...

If you think Eobard cant build it "just because" he hadn't, you are really being dense and ignoring his great intellect and engineering background (the guy is a genius even by future standards)...


As pertains what would be needed to beat Groot, you thought about phase attacking and stopped there. Your thought process on the matter stalled was unable to come up with any other solution that Eobard could use to beat him...

No creativity...

Groot is wood and Eobard is a genius with bleeding edge modern tech at his disposal; if you think there is nothing in Star Labs that he could cook up (he built a particle accelerator for gods sake) to beat Groot, then you need to open your mind a bit more...


I'll give Eobard an ability that he's used many, many, times on screen: the ability to think...

He has to destroy a being made out of wood; for a man of his intellect with the technology available to him, that wont be hard...

Once again, it could very well be as easy as just drenching Groot with gas and lighting a match...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
The 1st part makes perfect sense; Eobard would likely kill the others with phase attacks or just beating them to death at superspeed...

There is a real possibility that the above wouldn't do the trick against Groot, so Eobard would have to attempt another tactic...

Then you need to phrase your sentences better. Because the way you typed it made it sound like a contradiction.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

And yes, Cisco built the Heat Gun, but Eobard comes from a time more than 100 years ahead of Cisco and Star Labs technology...

That Heat Gun (while high tech to Cisco and the world at the time of The Flash) is ancient tech to Eobard...

If you think Eobard cant build it "just because" he hadn't, you are really being dense and ignoring his great intellect (the guy is a genius even by future standards)...

Cisco's tech (dampener cuffs) also countered 64th century tech (against Abra Kadabra). Being a smart guy from the future (or even having tech from the future) does not make you capable of doing everything. Thawne still needed Cisco to build a lot of stuff while he was pretending to be Harrison Wells.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

As pertains what would be needed to beat Groot, you thought about phase attacking and stopped there. Your thought process on the matter was unable to come up with any other solution that Eobard could use to beat him...

No creativity...

I was arguing based on his standard powerset. It is not my job to make arguments for the other side about what Thawne would do otherwise. That's the job of people arguing in favour of him. Like Juggerman did (and I agreed with). And he did so while remaining completely civil, and without trying to belittle people.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

Groot is wood and Eobard is a genius with bleeding edge modern tech at his disposal; if you think there is nothing in Star Labs that he could cook up (he built a particle accelerator for gods sake) to beat Groot, then you need to open your mind a bit more...

Firstly, Groot is not just some tree. He is an alien being with tree-like characteristics, but it still took re-entry level temperature to damage him.

And again trying to misrepresent what I said? I never said there is nothing there that could potentially work. I said the burden of proof is on you to show it, as you made the claim.

And so what if he built the particle accelerator? He had help from people like Ronnie, Hartley and Cisco, and it took years to get it finished.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

I'll give Eobard an ability that he's used many, many, times on screen: the ability to think...

He has to destroy a being made out of wood; for a man of his intellect with the technology available to him, that wont be hard...

Once again, it could very well be as easy as just drenching Groot with gas and lighting a match...

No, you were trying to give him lightning bolt throwing, even though he has never actually done it onscreen.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Then you need to phrase your sentences better. Because the way you typed it made it sound like a contradiction.



Cisco's tech (dampener cuffs) also countered 64th century tech (against Abra Kadabra). Being a smart guy from the future (or even having tech from the future) does not make you capable of doing everything. Thawne still needed Cisco to build a lot of stuff while he was pretending to be Harrison Wells.



I was arguing based on his standard powerset. It is not my job to make arguments for the other side about what Thawne would do otherwise. That's the job of people arguing in favour of him. Like Juggerman did (and I agreed with). And he did so while remaining completely civil, and without trying to belittle people.



Firstly, Groot is not just some tree. He is an alien being with tree-like characteristics, but it still took re-entry level temperature to damage him.

And again trying to misrepresent what I said? I never said there is nothing there that could potentially work. I said the burden of proof is on you to show it, as you made the claim.

And so what if he built the particle accelerator? He had help from people like Ronnie, Hartley and Cisco, and it took years to get it finished.



No, you were trying to give him lightning bolt throwing, even though he has never actually done it onscreen.

Cisco's cuff countering Abra Kadabra doesn't change the fact that Cisco's tech is more than 100 years behind what Eobard is used to...

So my point stands; Cisco's Heat Gun is ancient tech by Eobards standards...


Also, Eobard didn't need Cisco to do anything for him...

Eobard was masterminding a scheme to get back to his time, and that plan required people to think he was helpless when he was anything but helpless the entire time...


As for Groots protection feat, lets get the feat straight.

It was not against the heat of reentry (the ship was well within the planets atmosphere when it began to fall); the feat was as pertains the ship impacting the planets surface...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpTG-O8JlaQ


So yeah, Groot doesn't have any feat of withstanding the temperature of reentry...zero.

What we do know he that he is organic and wood; last I looked, that was a flammable combo...

For all we know, gasoline and a match would end Groot; as of this moment, there is no feat of Groots that would suggest otherwise...

Gas and a match is something Eobard can absolutely get his hands on given the fight parameters...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Cisco's cuff countering Abra Kadabra doesn't change the fact that Cisco's tech is more than 100 years behind what Eobard is used to...

So my point stands; Cisco's Heat Gun is ancient tech by Eobards standards...

The tech is over 4000 years older than what Abra Kadabra was used to, yet that didn't help him. Prove that it being older tech automatically means Eobard can replicate it.

Even in the real world, there are past inventions that even the smartest minds on the planet have been unable to replicate today.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

Also, Eobard didn't need Cisco to do anything for him...

Eobard was masterminding a scheme to get back to his time, and that plan required people to think he was helpless when he was anything but helpless the entire time...

Prove that he could have built everything on his own. Hint, your personal speculation about his self-imposed limits is not proof.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

As for Groots protection feat, lets get the feat straight.

It was not against the heat of reentry (the ship was well within the planets atmosphere when it began to fall); the feat was as pertains the ship impacting the planets surface...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpTG-O8JlaQ


So yeah, Groot doesn't have any feat of withstanding the temperature of reentry...zero.

What we do know he that he is organic and wood; last I looked, that was a flammable combo...

For all we know, gasoline and a match would end Groot; as of this moment, there is no feat of Groots that would suggest otherwise...

Gas and a match is something Eobard can absolutely get his hands on given the fight parameters...

So, to sum up, you are assuming that Eobard being a smart guy from the future automatically means he can replicate any of Cisco's tech, but are completely dismissing the fact that Groot is not actually an Earthling from how it might affect things compared to actual Earth-based lifeforms? Gotcha.

Oh, btw, for someone who acts like they are so much better clued in on things than the rest of us, you actually keep missing a much more obvious solution. I didn't want to say anything, because I wanted to see if you could "open your mind" and show some "creativity", yet you keep failing. Mercury Labs is in fact closer to downtown than StarLabs is, and contains weapons and tech than even StarLabs doesn't have. Admittedly, they might not have rebuilt everything yet, but RF knows Tina McGee, so could likely figure out a way to get access to her stuff regardless. He's forced her to do stuff for him before.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
The tech is over 4000 years older than what Abra Kadabra was used to, yet that didn't help him. Prove that it being older tech automatically means Eobard can replicate it.

Even in the real world, there are past inventions that even the smartest minds on the planet have been unable to replicate today.



Prove that he could have built everything on his own. Hint, your personal speculation about his self-imposed limits is not proof.



So, to sum up, you are assuming that Eobard being a smart guy from the future automatically means he can replicate any of Cisco's tech, but are completely dismissing the fact that Groot is not actually an Earthling from how it might affect things compared to actual Earth-based lifeforms? Gotcha.

Oh, btw, for someone who acts like they are so much better clued in on things than the rest of us, you actually keep missing a much more obvious solution. I didn't want to say anything, because I wanted to see if you could "open your mind" and show some "creativity", yet you keep failing. Mercury Labs is in fact closer to downtown than StarLabs is, and contains weapons and tech than even StarLabs doesn't have.

So, give me some examples of 100 year old tech that the smartest minds on Earth today cant replicate...

Go ahead...I'll wait.


As for Groots durability, you are speculating that he wouldn't burn (and you were dead WRONG about it taking reentry heat to take down Groot)...

Well we know that he is organic and is made up of wood; that is fact...

Until you can provide evidence to counter that, wood burns when drenched in gasoline and a match is used to ignite it...


But none of this matters anyway; you agreed that Eobard defeats the Guardians of the Galaxy...

All hail the Speed Force!!

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
So, give me some examples of 100 year old tech that the smartest minds on Earth today cant replicate...

Go ahead...I'll wait.

Where did I say 100 years? I didn't. But there is tech that is decades old by now that people can't replicate. They might never be able to. And you are ignoring the actual point. Just because something is old, doesn't automatically mean any smart person can replicate it. Cisco builds things that are way ahead of virtually all other tech built in his era, and even builds things that straight-up defy logic (like the Alchemy gun). So, your argument for Thawne is nothing but a fallacious assumption.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
As for Groots durability, you are speculating that he wouldn't burn (and you were dead WRONG about it taking reentry heat to take down Groot)...

Well we know that he is organic and is made up of wood; that is fact...

Until you can provide evidence to counter that, wood burns when drenched in gasoline and a match is used to ignite it...

There is no actual proof that Groot has the exact same composition as normal wood. So, you are speculating in that regard. While you are also speculating that Eobard can replicate tech simply by virtue of being a smart guy from the future.

Do you really want to do the "wrong" thing, considering you were wrong about the location of StarLabs, and about Thawne throwing lightning?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

But none of this matters anyway; you agreed that Eobard defeats the Guardians of the Galaxy...

All hail the Speed Force!!



Ah, so this is what it comes down to. You didn't actually care about creating a competitive thread that resulted in a proper debate. You just wanted to make another thread where one of your favourite characters wins. It also explains the attitude the moment others didn't immediately jump on the bandwagon. I would say that I'm surprised, but I'm really not.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Where did I say 100 years? I didn't. But there is tech that is decades old by now that people can't replicate. They might never be able to. And you are ignoring the actual point. Just because something is old, doesn't automatically mean any smart person can replicate it. Cisco builds things that are way ahead of virtually all other tech built in his era, and even builds things that straight-up defy logic (like the Alchemy gun). So, your argument for Thawne is nothing but a fallacious assumption.



There is no actual proof that Groot has the exact same composition as normal wood. So, you are speculating in that regard. While you are also speculating that Eobard can replicate tech simply by virtue of being a smart guy from the future.

Do you really want to do the "wrong" thing, considering you were wrong about the location of StarLabs, and about Thawne throwing lightning?



Ah, so this is what it comes down to. You didn't actually care about creating a competitive thread that resulted in a proper debate. You just wanted to make another thread where one of your favourite characters wins. It also explains the attitude the moment others didn't immediately jump on the bandwagon. I would say that I'm surprised, but I'm really not.

I initially stated that Eobard was used to tech that was more than 100 years ahead of Cisco's Heat Gun...

That is fact...

You then said the smartest minds blah, blah, blah...

That doesn't change the fact that Eobard is used of tech that is more than 100 years ahead of Cisco's...so my point still stands.


You cant prove anything either as pertains Groots durability...

We do know he is wood and is organic...

That's a fact...

Until we have a concrete reason to believe otherwise, Eobard can steal some gas, drench Groot in it, and burn him and Rocket alive...




And so...you consider Eobard Thawne vs the Guardians of the Galaxy to be a mismatch?

Do you believe that EeeOh-bard will do the following to Gamora?

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
I initially stated that Eobard was used to tech that was more than 100 years ahead of Cisco's Heat Gun...

That is fact...

You then said the smartest minds blah, blah, blah...

That doesn't change the fact that Eobard is used of tech that is more than 100 years ahead of Cisco's...so my point still stands.


So, you made an irrelevant point. Because being used to newer tech does not equate to being able to replicate any older tech. So, kudos, I guess.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

You cant prove anything either as pertains Groots durability...

We do know he is wood and is organic...

That's a fact...

Until we have a concrete reason to believe otherwise, Eobard can steal some gas, drench Groot in it, and burn him and Rocket alive...



Again, assuming he will react like an Earth wood because it looks similar, despite being an alien.

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder

And so...you consider Eobard Thawne vs the Guardians of the Galaxy to be a mismatch?

Never said that. I am saying that it's obvious that you made a thread that you thought would be an easy win for him. And I am not going to indulge your circle jerk any further. You can have fun tossing Eobard's salad all by yourself. For your sake, I just hope he wipes thoroughly.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
So, you made an irrelevant point. Because being used to newer tech does not equate to being able to replicate any older tech. So, kudos, I guess.



Again, assuming he will react like an Earth wood because it looks similar, despite being an alien.



Never said that. I am saying that it's obvious that you made a thread that you thought would be an easy win for him. And I am not going to indulge your circle jerk any further. You can have fun tossing Eobard's salad all by yourself. For your sake, I just hope he wipes thoroughly.

Why you mad?


As pertains Groot burning, please tell me that you are not trying to argue that he cant burn; that's...not a good argument.

His bark is his flesh, and flesh can burn...period.

Groot being alien doesn't mean a damn thing; he can burn...case closed.


And no, I didn't make a thread where my guy gets an easy win...

I like the Guardians too; I was just wondering if Thawne could take them...

The voters decided he could...


So just relax...

Thawne wins and you agree with this...

Cheers!

lol really? The "you mad" "relax" thing? Surely you can do better than that.

Also, never said he can't burn. Just pointed out that he might not burn as effectively as normal wood, as he is an alien.

Sure you did. Because unnecessarily posting chest-phase pics and calling RF "my guy" totally shows objectivity. Anyway, have fun.

Constantly referring to him as "Eobard" does not help matters, who doesn't want to see a guy named "Eobard" lose?

Originally posted by Surtur
Constantly referring to him as "Eobard" does not help matters, who doesn't want to see a guy named "Eobard" lose?

The guy who made the thread on RF's home turf (despite usually using a "featureless plain" to supposedly not give anyone an advantage in that regard), was quick to point out that RF gets access to pretty much anything in Central City, has shown a complete willingness to throw even characters he likes (Khan, for example) under the bus if it served a higher agenda, and acted like the purpose of the thread was just some innocent unsure curiosity, despite boldly claiming that RF would either phase kill or beat 4 out of the 5 Guardians to death, and that there were multiple "immediately" obvious ways with which RF could destroy Groot?

Or maybe all of that is just one huge coincidence.

Well, looks like the voting is finished and the arguments are finalized...

Eobard Thawne wins...

People voted for Trump. Doesn't mean it was the correct choice.

Originally posted by KingD19
People voted for Trump. Doesn't mean it was the correct choice.

Eobard isn't Trump...

Eobard is far, far, superior to Trump...

People voted correctly this time...

Wait. OP says "Standard equipment only". So RF can't use anything lying around the city or any of the labs.

Originally posted by KingD19
Wait. OP says "Standard equipment only". So RF can't use anything lying around the city or any of the labs.

Standard equipment is what a given character typically has on his/her person...

All characters may use whats in a given environment however...

This battle happens in Central City, so whatever the characters can get their hands on in Central City is fair game...

Per the Op, the battle takes place downtown. Which means the labs are off limits.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Per the Op, the battle takes place downtown. Which means the labs are off limits.

Labs are on the outskirts...

Not that it really matters; all RF needs to put down Groot are a few gallons of gasoline + a cigarette lighter...

Originally posted by TheLordofMurder
Labs are on the outskirts...

Not that it really matters; all RF needs to put down Groot are a few gallons of gasoline + a cigarette lighter...

Lol.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Lol.

Funny how he skews the stips in RF's favour, and then gloats about the result, but tries to act as though this thread was purely made out of innocent curiosity.