Count Dooku vs Starkiller

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slayne
Prime versions for all.

Force, sabers, and all out -- who wins and why?

Ursumeles
Dooku in 'sabers, 'killer in Force - All-Out; not sure. Prolly 'killer though.

Rockydonovang
Killer being>Dooku would make the gap between ROTJ Vader and Dooku really big btw.

MythLord
Tyranus, honestly.

Big Gerald
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Killer being>Dooku would make the gap between ROTJ Vader and Dooku really big btw.

Why? He's better than both of them, so they could be equal for all we know.

DarthDuelist9
Dooku.

Rebel95
Starkiller takes force and all out in a brutal fight. Dooku humiliates him in sabers only though

DarthDuelist9
Originally posted by Ursumeles
Dooku in 'sabers, 'killer in Force - All-Out; not sure. Prolly 'killer though.

Genuinely interested why Killer would take Force

TenebrousWay
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Genuinely interested why Killer would take Force

Redirecting the descent of a Star Destroyer, even with a very little acceleration is far better than anything Dooku ever did, tbh.

Azronger
Dooku sweeps

Kurk
In b4 we start the cruiser debate again

UCanShootMyNova
Starkiller, honestly.

UCanShootMyNova
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Killer being>Dooku would make the gap between ROTJ Vader and Dooku really big btw.

No it wouldn't. Starkiller's position in comparison to Dooku has no effect on the distance between Vader and Dooku.

Rebel95
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Genuinely interested why Killer would take Force
I'm genuinely interested in why you think he wouldn't

UCanShootMyNova
thumb up

DarthDuelist9
Originally posted by Rebel95
I'm genuinely interested in why you think he wouldn't

Dooku's scaling is better, from being massively more powerful than K'krukh who himself ripped a fully functional ship out of the air to being far more powerful than AotC Anakin who moved a dreadnought. Besides, him throwing around huge cruisers with ease is at least on a similar level as Killer adjusting the StarDestroyer. Even though the SD is 10 - 20 times bigger, Dooku required far less effort while also throwing it around which on itself is far more difficult than slightly moving a falling ship.

Ursumeles
Originally posted by TenebrousWay
Redirecting the descent of a Star Destroyer, even with a very little acceleration is far better than anything Dooku ever did, tbh.
thumb up Also, I guess you can scale him from Rahm.

Originally posted by MythLord
Tyranus, honestly.
Why?

Also, @Syn Hangouts.

Rebel95
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Dooku's scaling is better, from being massively more powerful than K'krukh who himself ripped a fully functional ship out of the air to being far more powerful than AotC Anakin who moved a dreadnought. Besides, him throwing around huge cruisers with ease is at least on a similar level as Killer adjusting the StarDestroyer. Even though the SD is 10 - 20 times bigger, Dooku required far less effort while also throwing it around which on itself is far more difficult than slightly moving a falling ship.
He also grew more powerful after redirecting the star destroyer. And what about Starkiller's feats against Vader, who I think we can both agree is superior to Dooku?

TenebrousWay
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Dooku's scaling is better, from being massively more powerful than K'krukh who himself ripped a fully functional ship out of the air to being far more powerful than AotC Anakin who moved a dreadnought.

It's very questionable if Anakin can actually bring that level of power to bear in his fights at that time, since Ventress, who never showed anything remotely comparable to that, managed to push Anakin around with the force. This is further corroborated when he managed to shield himself and a village from a theta storm - one of the best force feats in the mythos - which Kenobi doubted even Yoda could replicate.



No, no. It's not. Dooku threw cruiser with less than 1/10 the size of the Star Destroyer. A ship of that size, for Star Wars parameters would, if much, be around 1,000-2,000 tons in weight. The Star Destroyer, on the other hand, should weight around 2,000,000 tons and it's already full of momentum, falling into the planet, quite different from the cruisers Dooku lifted up and threw. Don't me interpret me wrong, Dooku's feat is extremely impressive but Starkiller's in on another realm of magnitude.

DarthDuelist9
Originally posted by TenebrousWay
It's very questionable if Anakin can actually bring that level of power to bear in his fights at that time, since Ventress, who never showed anything remotely comparable to that, managed to push Anakin around with the force. This is further corroborated when he managed to shield himself and a village from a theta storm - one of the best force feats in the mythos - which Kenobi doubted even Yoda could replicate.



No, no. It's not. Dooku threw cruiser with less than 1/10 the size of the Star Destroyer. A ship of that size, for Star Wars parameters would, if much, be around 1,000-2,000 tons in weight. The Star Destroyer, on the other hand, should weight around 2,000,000 tons and it's already full of momentum, falling into the planet, quite different from the cruisers Dooku lifted up and threw. Don't me interpret me wrong, Dooku's feat is extremely impressive but Starkiller's in on another realm of magnitude.

Yeah, miscalculation on my side. Either way, the momentum of the SD was downwards while SK moved it more horizontally so it's not going to influence it that much. On the other hand, by throwing the ship Dooku needed to counter gravity and move it (thus performing a far more complicated set of movements) while also doing it with joyfull ease contrary to SK, who needed all his power. I find it more impressive, especially if you take into account Anakin's dreadnaught feat (someone Dooku at that point extremely outclasses).

UCanShootMyNova
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Dooku's scaling is better, from being massively more powerful than K'krukh who himself ripped a fully functional ship out of the air to being far more powerful than AotC Anakin who moved a dreadnought. Besides, him throwing around huge cruisers with ease is at least on a similar level as Killer adjusting the StarDestroyer. Even though the SD is 10 - 20 times bigger, Dooku required far less effort while also throwing it around which on itself is far more difficult than slightly moving a falling ship.

Being better then people who moved large ships doesn't mean he can move a ship exponentially larger then the ones his inferiors did.

And for your claim regarding the Korriban feat to be true we'd have to

1. Disregard the fact that he accomplished the feat on a DS nexus and

2. Assume the cruisers Dooku manipulated were 80-160 meters long.

3. Ignore the fact that prior to guiding the Star Destroyer's decent Galen had powered a blast that destroyed a superstructure which dwarfed 1600 meter long ships.

Even doing all that that wouldn't make throwing those ships around better then manipulating a million ton object that has gravity accelerating the force of its descent.

UCanShootMyNova
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
while SK moved it more horizontally

:/


https://media.giphy.com/media/x2gNRfK0kGakg/giphy.gif

UCanShootMyNova
He moved the Star Destroyer not only against gravity but the the accelerated force of its descent as well when he upended the ISD after it impacted with the ground.

TenebrousWay
Originally posted by DarthDuelist9
Yeah, miscalculation on my side. Either way, the momentum of the SD was downwards while SK moved it more horizontally so it's not going to influence it that much. On the other hand, by throwing the ship Dooku needed to counter gravity and move it (thus performing a far more complicated set of movements) while also doing it with joyfull ease contrary to SK, who needed all his power. I find it more impressive, especially if you take into account Anakin's dreadnaught feat (someone Dooku at that point extremely outclasses).

I honestly fail to see how Dooku throwing cruiser is more impressive and I'm quite acquinted with calculations. Dooku lifted and threw far smaller and far lighter ships. Even if Starkiller only applied a effective force in, let's say, 1/10 of the mass of the Star Destroyer, it's already an order of magnitude greater than Dooku's feat, at minimum. Not to say Starkiller had unfavorable circuntances as the descending ship obviously limited his choices in what to exactly do in that circunstances, while Dooku had just to lift some cruisers from the ground.

UCanShootMyNova
Exactly. Even if the ships Dooku manipulated WERE 1/10 the length of the ISD they would still be far less then 1/10 the weight since they don't share it's height, width or depth ( not to mention all the equipment and ships it holds ).

Rockydonovang
Originally posted by TenebrousWay
I honestly fail to see how Dooku throwing cruiser is more impressive and I'm quite acquinted with calculations. Dooku lifted and threw far smaller and far lighter ships. Even if Starkiller only applied a effective force in, let's say, 1/10 of the mass of the Star Destroyer, it's already an order of magnitude greater than Dooku's feat, at minimum. Not to say Starkiller had unfavorable circuntances as the descending ship obviously limited his choices in what to exactly do in that circunstances, while Dooku had just to lift some cruisers from the ground.
I thought he just pushed them?

TenebrousWay
Originally posted by Rockydonovang
I thought he just pushed them?

I tought Dooku lifted them up first (there's a passage in the book where Anakin and Obi Wan see the floating ships like "ghost ships", believe) and then he throws them. I can be misrememberig things, however. If Dooku just pushed them the feat clearly loses a good portion of it's hype.

TenebrousWay
Originally posted by UCanShootMyNova
Exactly. Even if the ships Dooku manipulated WERE 1/10 the length of the ISD they would still be far less then 1/10 the weight since they don't share it's height, width or depth ( not to mention all the equipment and ships it holds ).

Yeah, I already stated that the ships Dooku manipulated are around 800-2,000 tons in weight, while a Star Destroyer is a multimillion ton beast

UCanShootMyNova
thumb up

Deronn_solo
Dooku takes 'sabers, 'Killer takes everything else.

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