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Cap has to fight his way through DareDevil as Hydra has recruited him to stop Cap.

Cap loses his shield somehow and Matt Recovers it for the fight to use against Cap unless he loses it during the fight.

With this disadvantage for Cap

Who wins?

Cap wins.

Cap lost the shield in both Cap TWO and Avengers TWO and he still made DUE like the TRUE red, white, and BLUE hero that he is for me and YOU.

Cap wins here TOO: Electric Boogaloo.

Case closed, no need more any more stupid threads from Josh.

Captain wins.

Originally posted by Sable
Case closed, no need more any more stupid threads from Josh.

Lol, you thought i would support Daredevil?

The only stupid thread i see is this one.

Good fight. DD loses. The shield protects DD and makes the fight last a lot longer.

Originally posted by h1a8
Good fight. DD loses. The shield protects DD and makes the fight last a lot longer.

I would think Cap just rips the shield out of DD's hands and then beats him unconscious.

Yeah. Matt can't hold onto the shield since Cap can just yank it out of his hand. If we want to get semantic, OP didn't take Caps gauntlet magnet so he could just summon the shield as soon as the fight starts lol.

Originally posted by Surtur
I would think Cap just rips the shield out of DD's hands and then beats him unconscious. That's if DD has no fighting skill whatsoever. Cap would be hard press to grab the shield, considering DD's skill level and senses.

No, he wouldn't

Of course he would.

h1 your avatar and your signature both suck

Originally posted by h1a8
Of course he would.

Going by feats. No, he wouldn't.

You really need to learn the difference between your biased opinions and facts.

To him, his opinions are facts.

It's not impossible for Cap to grab the shield. It would be fairly difficult (not easy) for him to do so. DD has great evasive and countering abilities.

Also, Cap may not even attempt to grab the shield. Ever consider that?

Has cap ever attempted to grab his shield? Are you serious?

We know you want cap to lose this one but you are acting like moron right now.

Originally posted by h1a8
It's not impossible for Cap to grab the shield. It would be fairly difficult (not easy) for him to do so. DD has great evasive and countering abilities.

Also, Cap may not even attempt to grab the shield. Ever consider that?

Per Feats, it would be relatively easy for Captain America to retrieve his shield. Not that he would need it as he already wins 10/10.

Originally posted by h1a8
That's if DD has no fighting skill whatsoever. Cap would be hard press to grab the shield, considering DD's skill level and senses.

Um...no all Cap has to do is grab the shield and take it from him. It's not like DD can ninja flip out of the way of that. The first time he tries to use the shield will most likely be the last time he uses it. The moment he tries to use the shield to hit Cap or defend himself..Cap will just grab it off him. He has no way to physically prevent this, unless he wants to just fling the shield far away from both of them. But then Cap would still just beat him down for that.

Prove that Cap can easily grab the shield.

You're the one that made the original claim, that means the burden is on you.

Cap stomps.

Originally posted by h1a8
Prove that Cap can easily grab the shield.



HAHAHAHA..

Oh and Cap shitstomps

Is this going to turn into the next Winter Soldier vs Bane thread?

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Is this going to turn into the next Winter Soldier vs Bane thread?


Most likely

Originally posted by h1a8
Prove that Cap can easily grab the shield.

Okay: Captain America is far stronger than DD and thus once he gets his hands on it DD will not be able to hold onto it. How exactly do you imagine DD prevents that from happening?

Originally posted by Silent Master
You're the one that made the original claim, that means the burden is on you. I guess you are stupid. A poster initially claimed that Cap can just grab the shield, as the reason he would win easily.

Originally posted by h1a8
I guess you are stupid. A poster initially claimed that Cap can just grab the shield, as the reason he would win easily.

You didn't dispute the claim that Cap would retrieve his shield, thus Surtur has no burden of proof. We are dealing with your claim that Cap will have a hard time getting he shield back, that means the burden is on you.

If you're going to throw around intelligence based insults, it would help if you were in the right.

Originally posted by h1a8
I guess you are stupid. A poster initially claimed that Cap can just grab the shield, as the reason he would win easily.

Cap could either A, yank it out of his hands as he is stronger than Matt by far and if you think he can't get his hands on the shield you're wanking DD so hard his eyes started working again.

Or B, use the magnetic gauntlet on his wrist to pull it back. Did you forget he had that?

https://s11.favim.com/orig/160701/avengers-captain-america-chris-evans-gif-Favim.com-4477536.gif

H1 hasn't seen the movies, nor does he know how debates actually work.

Cap wins with shield. Cap wins without shield.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You didn't dispute the claim that Cap would retrieve his shield, thus Surtur has no burden of proof. We are dealing with your claim that Cap will have a hard time getting he shield back, that means the burden is on you.

If you're going to throw around intelligence based insults, it would help if you were in the right. I did dispute it. It doesn't have to be disputed in order for the burden to be on him. Making up rules are we?

Originally posted by KingD19
Cap could either A, yank it out of his hands as he is stronger than Matt by far and if you think he can't get his hands on the shield you're wanking DD so hard his eyes started working again.

Or B, use the magnetic gauntlet on his wrist to pull it back. Did you forget he had that?

https://s11.favim.com/orig/160701/avengers-captain-america-chris-evans-gif-Favim.com-4477536.gif Matt won't easily allow cap to even touch the shield in that way.

Originally posted by Robtard
Cap wins with shield. Cap wins without shield. agreed.

Originally posted by h1a8
I did dispute it. It doesn't have to be disputed in order for the burden to be on him. Making up rules are we?

No you didn't, you agreed that Cap would get the shield back, you just claimed it wouldn't be easy.

Here is Surtur's comment.

Originally posted by Surtur
I would think Cap just rips the shield out of DD's hands and then beats him unconscious.

Here is you agreeing that Cap could get the shield back, but claiming it wouldn't be easy.

Originally posted by h1a8
That's if DD has no fighting skill whatsoever. Cap would be hard press to grab the shield, considering DD's skill level and senses.

Thus the burden is on you.

Originally posted by Silent Master
No you didn't, you agreed that Cap would get the shield back, you just claimed it wouldn't be easy.

Here is Surtur's comment.



Here is you agreeing that Cap could get the shield back, but claiming it wouldn't be easy.



Thus the burden is on you.

"It won't be easy." doesn't imply that it will happen.

Originally posted by h1a8
"It won't be easy." doesn't imply that it will happen.


It's admitting that it can happen, thus Surtur doesn't really have a burden to meet. that brings us to your claim.


Provide proof.

Originally posted by h1a8
Matt won't easily allow cap to even touch the shield in that way.

Are you ignoring the mag-gauntlet? Even if you are, I dont care what Matt will "allow". Cap is his express superior in all areas by several levels. Matt has no choice in when and how he loses the shield.

Also Matt has 0 feats fighting with a shield.

Originally posted by Silent Master
It's admitting that it can happen, thus Surtur doesn't really have a burden to meet. that brings us to your claim.


Provide proof. Of course it can happen. This does not mean that it will happen. Again, it is not easy.

Originally posted by KingD19
Are you ignoring the mag-gauntlet? Even if you are, I dont care what Matt will "allow". Cap is his express superior in all areas by several levels. Matt has no choice in when and how he loses the shield.

Also Matt has 0 feats fighting with a shield.

Yes, because Cap does not have it here for obvious reasons.

Originally posted by h1a8
Of course it can happen. This does not mean that it will happen. Again, it is not easy.

Prove that it won't be easy.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove that it won't be easy. DD has excellent speed, senses, agility, and fighting ability. Cap doesn't have any feats to show that it would be easy.

Originally posted by h1a8
DD has excellent speed, senses, agility, and fighting ability. Cap doesn't have any feats to show that it would be easy.

I didn't ask for your opinion.

Originally posted by h1a8
Matt won't easily allow cap to even touch the shield in that way.

How exactly is Daredevil going to stop Cap from activating a device he has built into his uniform?

Originally posted by Silent Master
How exactly is Daredevil going to stop Cap from activating a device he has built into his uniform?

Apparently because OP states Cap lost his shield and Matt picked it up, h1 thinks Cap doesn't have it here.

But the gauntlet is just for Cap being lazy. He doesn't actually need it to beat Matt down and just yank it back. Matt is nowhere near strong enough to hold onto it, and he's been hit by so many people if you think Cap won't land a hand on him, you're being h1.

Originally posted by h1a8
DD has excellent speed, senses, agility, and fighting ability. Cap doesn't have any feats to show that it would be easy.

Cap is too strong.

Consider DD as Cap. Cap is Hulk.

That is how strong Cap is in comparison to DD.

0 chances for Matt here h1a8.

This thread should never have made it past the first page. We've already seen what happens when Matt fights a superhuman opponent, as seen during his first fight with Black Sky Elektra. And I use this fight because it's the only one where neither knew who the other was (at least right up until the end), so it's the best comparison. And Matt showed that while he has the speed and skill to compete, he does not have the strength to hurt his opponent (he actually landed way more hits than Elektra, but they had little real effect) or durability (both super strong hits Elektra landed caused him visible trouble). Matt just does not have the strength and toughness to compete here.

It's rather amusing that h1 still hasn't figured out the difference between his opinions and facts.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I didn't ask for your opinion. Cap doesn't have any feats to show that it would be easy. If you disagree then prove me wrong.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
This thread should never have made it past the first page. We've already seen what happens when Matt fights a superhuman opponent, as seen during his first fight with Black Sky Elektra. And I use this fight because it's the only one where neither knew who the other was (at least right up until the end), so it's the best comparison. And Matt showed that while he has the speed and skill to compete, he does not have the strength to hurt his opponent (he actually landed way more hits than Elektra, but they had little real effect) or durability (both super strong hits Elektra landed caused him visible trouble). Matt just does not have the strength and toughness to compete here. He loses, no one here is saying otherwise. The argument is basically how fast does he lose?
What kills me is that posters don't actually read the posts. Otherwise they would see EVERYONE said Cap wins. Thus, they wouldn't debate against themselves.

Originally posted by h1a8
Cap doesn't have any feats to show that it would be easy. If you disagree then prove me wrong.

Nice attempt to shift the burden, it's not going to work.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Nice attempt to shift the burden, it's not going to work.

A negative not proven doesn't make the positive true. So at best, neither the arguments that Cap can or cannot can be argued here.

And negatives can be proven by lack of evidence.
There is no evidence that Cap can grab the shield easily. Therefore the negative is proven.

You not being aware of Cap's feats doesn't mean they don't exist.

IOW you can't back up your claim, so you're trying the shift the burden.

Originally posted by Silent Master
IOW you can't back up your claim, so you're trying the shift the burden. How can you prove A negative other than with the absence of evidence?

Originally posted by h1a8
How can you prove A negative other than with the absence of evidence?

Nobody is asking you to prove a negative, we are asking you to back up your claim and that would be done by you proving that DD's stats and skills place his fighting formidability close enough to Cap's, that Cap wouldn't be able to easily disarm him.

Seriously, why do you continue to require people to explain basic concepts to you?

Cap is several levels above Matt.

This is should have ended long ago.

This is a little more even now after defenders since DD fought the wanked Black Sky to a stand still. Impressive showing which keeps it from being an outright stomp but I'd still say Cap.

Originally posted by Arachnid1
This is a little more even now after defenders since DD fought the wanked Black Sky to a stand still. Impressive showing which keeps it from being an outright stomp but I'd still say Cap.

This would go similar to Cap vs Batroc or Cap vs Crossbones IMO. Matt can make a nuisance of himself, but will go down hard once the kid gloves come off.

There is actually a deleted scene from CA:CW where Cap does similar to Black Widow. She manages to taser him in the face/neck, and even disarms him of his shield, but the moment he gets fed up with her shenanigans, he quickly restrains and gets rid of her. Now, that specific showing is not canon, but it is consistent with how normal people tend to fair against Super Soldiers. And, like the Crossbones and Batroc fights (where Cap was not using his shield against either when he actually beat them), it shows Cap can manage fights against humans without his shield, without any serious trouble.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
This would go similar to Cap vs Batroc or Cap vs Crossbones IMO. Matt can make a nuisance of himself, but will go down hard once the kid gloves come off.

There is actually a deleted scene from CA:CW where Cap does similar to Black Widow. She manages to taser him in the face/neck, and even disarms him of his shield, but the moment he gets fed up with her shenanigans, he quickly restrains and gets rid of her. Now, that specific showing is not canon, but it is consistent with how normal people tend to fair against Super Soldiers. And, like the Crossbones and Batroc fights (where Cap was not using his shield against either when he actually beat them), it shows Cap can manage fights against humans without his shield, without any serious trouble. DD is above peak human when it comes to reflexes at least. That scene where he flipped between the russians close quarter full auto fire (aim dodging likely) and fighting evenly with the Black Sky who was durable enough to take the Iron Fist, fast enough to block bullets with her sword, and strong enough to KO Iron Fist (as she took out all the defenders at the same time; I'm pretty sure Cage was effected by the gas but still impressive), not to mention some pretty great damage soak and his scenes against the ninjas. I'd put DD above the human enemies Cap has fought

Originally posted by Arachnid1
DD is above peak human when it comes to reflexes at least. That scene where he flipped between the russians close quarter full auto fire (aim dodging likely) and fighting evenly with the Black Sky who was durable enough to take the Iron Fist, fast enough to block bullets with her sword, and strong enough to KO Iron Fist (as she took out all the defenders at the same time; I'm pretty sure Cage was effected by the gas but still impressive), not to mention some pretty great damage soak and his scenes against the ninjas. I'd put DD above the human enemies Cap has fought

Fair enough. Even without gear, he did WAY better than the 10 armed Hand ninjas who tried to take her on in the dark during her training (who she defeated in about 10 seconds, despite starting unarmed lol). And he has also improved a lot in terms of not getting hit in fights. People as skilled as Iron Fist and Murakami were struggling to tag him, and Bakuto couldn't manage it at all, even two-on-one. Even Elektra wasn't having it easy. And I honestly don't recall a single fodder tagging him throughout Defenders (though, if there is an instance, feel free to point it out). Though, in terms of Crossbones at least, the guy did have the piston arms with the blades, dead nerves/pain resistance, and was decked out from head to toe in thick body armour.

And I think in the scene where she KO'd Luke, the gas was still playing a big factor. In no other scene in the entire show does she actually knock all of them out cold like that, especially with that level of ease. Hell, Danny got KO'd by the gas alone (despite the fact that it had already dispersed quite a bit) upon contact, just as he was about to Iron Fist out. Or just look at DD himself. A single superhuman hit to the chest in that encounter laid his ass out, whereas he took two comparable hits during their very first fight (when he got punched like 15 feet through the one glass pane, and then later kicked probably about 10 feet across a room into a bookcase, breaking some shelves on impact) that, despite clearly hurting him, didn't actually KO him.

Stick mixed up the gas, so it was likely something from the Chaste that he was already immune to (he specifically mixed it up to clear the path to Danny, so makes no sense to poison himself). As to why Black Sky was not affected? Stick did raise her and she was also a Chaste member until her death, so it might be similar to Stick. Or maybe the fact that she is the resurrected superhuman Black Sky might make her more resistant to those kinds of things. Or it is bad writing. Because them getting KO'd like that is inconsistent with all the other fights.

Cap wins 10/10 and it's not even close.

Cap wins 10/10 yes. But each fight takes much longer than the Batroc fight, especially since DD has the shield.

The Batroc fight only lasted seconds after Cap stopped holding back. so yay, DD can last more than a few seconds.

Originally posted by h1a8
Cap wins 10/10 yes. But each fight takes much longer than the Batroc fight, especially since DD has the shield.



Matt having the shield means nothing, all of us ecept you have seen the films so we know how strong Cap is. Cap easiily gets his shield back.. however he really need his shioeld against Matt. Cap stomps pure and simple

Originally posted by h1a8
Cap wins 10/10 yes. But each fight takes much longer than the Batroc fight, especially since DD has the shield.

I would agree that it takes longer. I think Matt could evade a couple of punches.

But Cap is just TOO STRONG for this to even be considered a fight.

Matt has 0 chances.

Originally posted by Silent Master
The Batroc fight only lasted seconds after Cap stopped holding back. so yay, DD can last more than a few seconds. If both fought just h2h then I would say Cap wins in about 20-40 seconds . But giving DD the shield then the fight lasts a minimum of 60 seconds (possibly more than 120 seconds).

Originally posted by h1a8
If both fought just h2h then I would say Cap wins in about 20-40 seconds . But giving DD the shield then the fight lasts a minimum of 60 seconds (possibly more than 120 seconds).

DD has zero exp using the shield or any similar weapon, it's far more likely that trying to use it will only hinder him.

Originally posted by Silent Master
DD has zero exp using the shield or any similar weapon, it's far more likely that trying to use it will only hinder him.

It's easy to use the shield. Just block with it. It has a much larger area.

Originally posted by h1a8
It's easy to use the shield. Just block with it. It has a much larger area.

Seriously? using a shield effectively takes actual training and skill. especially against someone like Cap.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Seriously? using a shield effectively takes actual training and skill. especially against someone like Cap. No it doesn't. I can use the shield effectively. It's extremely easy. Just strap it to the left arm and block with it.

Originally posted by h1a8
No it doesn't. I can use the shield effectively. It's extremely easy. Just strap it to the left arm and block with it.

Prove it.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove it. Just put the shield on my left arm and use it to block when someone throws a punch or kick.

Originally posted by h1a8
Just put the shield on my left arm and use it to block when someone throws a punch or kick.

Prove it.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove it.
Prove that I can use the shield to block?

You can't prove common sense. It's an axiom.

Originally posted by h1a8
Prove that I can use the shield to block?

You can't prove common sense. It's an axiom.

Prove that you've never had any training to use a shield and then prove that you can use it effectively against someone that has massive exp using one and is > you in stats.

h1 is always good for laughs

With regards to the shield usage, in terms of Matt, he would probably have a much easier time getting the hang of it than a normal person who isn't specifically trained for it. Just in terms of tosses, Matt has already shown extremely good aim with his billy clubs (despite not actually being shown training with them in that manner), being able to ricochet them off multiple opponents and surfaces accurately, similar to what Steve does with the shield. Because his senses give him damn-near perfect spatial awareness.

Not that it matters here. Even if Matt can learn to use the shield effectively in a brief amount of time, the moment Steve gets a hold of it, and it becomes a tug of war, Matt is losing it. Matt is nowhere near strong enough to try and match strength with Steve.

Agreed. Steve might be able to grab the shield eventually (if he decides to try). But it would take some time.

Originally posted by Silent Master
Prove that you've never had any training to use a shield and then prove that you can use it effectively against someone that has massive exp using one and is > you in stats. I bet I can last longer against Cap with the shield than without it, especially if he moves at acting speeds.

If by eventually you mean, within a few seconds.


Originally posted by h1a8
I bet I can last longer against Cap with the shield than without it, especially if he moves at acting speeds.

You might last .000001 seconds longer.