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I recently perused through Fact File #120 and found something interesting.

https://i.imgur.com/W7XKAwLl.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/G3yi4ts.jpg

Luke is stated to be more powerful than peak Vader as of RotJ, and DE Luke is "immensely" more powerful than that. What are your thoughts on these quotes?

Thoughts are that Legends was all over the place.

Hoping to get a more consistent answer for this (Luke's power level as of ROTJ) in Canon.

Because of his rage that sent him over the edge to best Vader which made him more powerful as even Sidious noted that in the movie. Luke wasn't more powerful as he was normally. The quote is more directing at the final blows, not the whole thing.

Originally posted by Zenwolf
Because of his rage that sent him over the edge to best Vader which made him more powerful as even Sidious noted that in the movie. Luke wasn't more powerful as he was normally. The quote is more directing at the final blows, not the whole thing.

I don't recall the Emperor ever comparing Luke and Vader's power in the movie. On the contrary, the quote is stating that the Emperor expected Luke to be more powerful even before the duel began, making no special note about rage.

Luke proved more powerful while enraged.

Originally posted by MythLord
Luke proved more powerful while enraged.

Of course, but that doesn't abrogate the idea of calm Luke being more powerful too.

Originally posted by Azronger
I don't recall the Emperor ever comparing Luke and Vader's power in the movie. On the contrary, the quote is stating that the Emperor expected Luke to be more powerful even before the duel began, making no special note about rage.

Well he didn't compare the two, I was going off his line.

"Your hate has made you powerful!"

Which seems to go along nicely with that quote there.

Also it does? Because I'm not seeing that there, it's just going off after Luke went all ham over Vader with his lightsaber and disarmed him.

He expected Luke to be more powerful sure, but this only came after he tapped into his rage, it's not something that he normally was.

iirc luke admits that he was less powerful than vader in shadows of mindor. thor is right, its inconsistent just like almost everything else in sw

Originally posted by ChocolateMuesli
iirc luke admits that he was less powerful than vader in shadows of mindor. thor is right, its inconsistent just like almost everything else in sw

It's not really inconsistent, since Luke was more powerful due to his rage which does give boosts, it isn't how he is normally.

that he ''proved more powerful'' doesnt really suggest that it refers to his amp imo but okay

Originally posted by Azronger
I don't recall the Emperor ever comparing Luke and Vader's power in the movie. On the contrary, the quote is stating that the Emperor expected Luke to be more powerful even before the duel began, making no special note about rage.

The Emperor could have expected Luke to give into his rage. Not really contrary.

Originally posted by Zenwolf
Well he didn't compare the two, I was going off his line.

"Your hate has made you powerful!"

Which seems to go along nicely with that quote there.

Also it does? Because I'm not seeing that there, it's just going off after Luke went all ham over Vader with his lightsaber and disarmed him.

He expected Luke to be more powerful sure, but this only came after he tapped into his rage, it's not something that he normally was.

The Emperor isn't saying Luke's hate made him more powerful than Vader. He's saying Luke's hate made him powerful.

If the Emperor expected Luke to be more powerful, he must have obviously known how strong Luke roughly was. In TESB he states he can feel Luke growing in power from across the galaxy, and in RotJ he says "he has grown strong" to Vader, while Luke was on Tatooine, so it's pretty apparent the Emperor has been observing Luke's power level for the past year through his Force Senses. His insight then led him to expect Luke was more powerful than Vader. Nothing about Force Rage is implied anywhere.

Just because Luke happened to be in an enraged state when he bested Vader doesn't mean he couldn't have beat him normally, or that he wasn't more powerful. Luke didn't want to fight his father until provoked, so obviously he's not going to prove anything if he doesn't want to.

Originally posted by ChocolateMuesli
iirc luke admits that he was less powerful than vader in shadows of mindor. thor is right, its inconsistent just like almost everything else in sw

Luke admits he was less powerful than Vader in The Courtship of Princess Leia, although I'm inclined to call that into question given how the guy runs from droidekas and thinks he can't beat a few wild beasts in his Grandmaster years.

In SoM, though, Cronal muses Luke is more powerful than Vader, and Kar Vastor opinionates that Luke is better than Windu. Though their worth is debatable, of course.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
The Emperor could have expected Luke to give into his rage. Not really contrary.

The quote doesn't say the Emperor expected Luke to tap into his rage, or that he expected Luke to be more powerful than Vader when tapping into his rage. It simply says the Emperor expected Luke to be more powerful than Vader.

Originally posted by Azronger
Kar Vastor opinionates that Luke is better than Windu. Quote?

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Quote?

I remember seeing it in NewGuy's old Luke RT, which has for some reason disappeared.

Originally posted by Azronger
It simply says the Emperor expected Luke to be more powerful than Vader.

Regardless, this gets even muddier when you factor in how Luke felt he would have fared against Vader's force powers, how Luke fared against Gethzerion's power, and then the various quotes implying Vader > Gethzerion.

There's is no specific quote claiming that Vader had more power than Geth, and certainly not factoring in dathomir.

IIRC there's a quote from an Insider and another one stating that Vader is second in power only to the Emperor himself.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
IIRC there's a quote from an Insider and another one stating that Vader is second in power only to the Emperor himself.

The impression I get from those is that they refer to political power.

Besides, Sidious outright feared Gethzerion's power and IIRC, barricaded Dathomir so she wouldn't escape. That's more precautions than he ever took against Vader.

1) Luke suffered Gethzerion on Dathomir. So Vader being personally more powerful ins't going to make a difference to how well Luke does against her on said planet.

2) Right, but both of those are at least partially because he's the Emperors right hand man. The wording of both quotes seem to imply it's more than Force power being discussed here.

ninja'd by az

Fair enough.

Regardless, Luke is at least as powerful as Vader by ROTJ. Being less skilled in the ways of the force and wary of powers he hasn't experienced in practice, doesn't mitigate that fact his augmentation matches Vader's in combat.

Originally posted by Azronger
I remember seeing it in NewGuy's old Luke RT, which has for some reason disappeared.

I vaguely remember the quote you're referring to. Pretty sure he said "you are the greatest of the Jedi," which in context was not necessarily related to power.

Just another SW inconsistency. Perhaps Luke really was more powerful than Vader, but I doubt it. There's more evidence that puts Vader>Luke at this point in time, at least without his rage amp

Yea, it's referring to Luke when he was enraged

Originally posted by NewGuy01
I vaguely remember the quote you're referring to. Pretty sure he said "you are the greatest of the Jedi," which in context was not necessarily related to power.

I may be unaware of the context, but I do also remember Luke tanking Kar Vastor's attacks without flinching. That'd be a pretty blatant showcase of meliority to Windu if my memory serves me correct.

Originally posted by Rebel95
Just another SW inconsistency. Perhaps Luke really was more powerful than Vader, but I doubt it. There's more evidence that puts Vader>Luke at this point in time, at least without his rage amp

What do you mean?