Drogon vs. Balrog

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



Rebel95
Drogon (Season 7) vs. the Balrog from FotR

Fight takes place in Mordor. Starting distance 50 meters. Who wins?

Darkstorm Zero
The Balrog. Drogon doesn;t really have a way to hurt it. fire won't do jack, and the only reason Gandalf won was due to powerful magical attacks and enchantments.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
The Balrog. Drogon doesn;t really have a way to hurt it. fire won't do jack, and the only reason Gandalf won was due to powerful magical attacks and enchantments.

And how exactly will Balrog hurt Drogon?

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Rebel95
Drogon (Season 7) vs. the Balrog from FotR

Fight takes place in Mordor. Starting distance 50 meters. Who wins?

Well Drogon is bigger and has wings.

The thing is that both beasts use fire and both are inmune to this.

I bet Drogon due to the size and the size of that mouth.

KingD19
You realize the Balrog is made of fire, smoke, and shadow right? There's nothing for Drogon to bite. Gandalf only fought it off because they were the same type of angel and roughly around the same power level. He had to use magic to actually hurt Durin's Bane.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by KingD19
You realize the Balrog is made of fire, smoke, and shadow right? There's nothing for Drogon to bite. Gandalf only fought it off because they were the same type of angel and roughly around the same power level. He had to use magic to actually hurt Durin's Bane.

Well then i dont see a clear winner.

Durin's Bane has no way to hurt Drogon neither.

Also Drogon has wings and can keep distance. OP didnt limit flight.

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
And how exactly will Balrog hurt Drogon?

How do you think? The Balrog can generate enormous hellfire weapons. It starts with a massive flaming scimitar and proceeds from there.

The balrog also has flight, and has wings, and is actually more powerfully built compared to Drogon. It has arms. And trying to bite something made of shadow and flame is.... not going to do anything to it. Gandalf's powers only worked on it because he is also a Maiar who's power diametrically opposes it.

ares834
Originally posted by KingD19
You realize the Balrog is made of fire, smoke, and shadow right? There's nothing for Drogon to bite. Gandalf only fought it off because they were the same type of angel and roughly around the same power level. He had to use magic to actually hurt Durin's Bane.

Physical attacks (at least from magic weapons) hurt the Balrog. You don't need to be a Maia to hurt one. And Westeros dragons are beings of magic. I've little doubt their bites would damage a Balrog.

Of course, with that said, the Balrog does win this. Drogon's fire won't do anything and when he comes down to bite the Balrog thrashes him.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
How do you think? The Balrog can generate enormous hellfire weapons. It starts with a massive flaming scimitar and proceeds from there.

The balrog also has flight, and has wings, and is actually more powerfully built compared to Drogon. It has arms. And trying to bite something made of shadow and flame is.... not going to do anything to it. Gandalf's powers only worked on it because he is also a Maiar who's power diametrically opposes it. '

Except Dragons are immune to fire...So i don't see how any could hurt each other.

However I still support Drogon due to the wings and the size.

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
'

Except Dragons are immune to fire...So i don't see how any could hurt each other.

However I still support Drogon due to the wings and the size.

I contest that the flames of the Doom of Valyria did in fact kill every dragon within the freehold, as per World of Ice and Fire.

So no, complete fire immunity is patently false, or at the very least only applies to mundane fires such as the funeral pyre. Such a thing wouldn't really apply to mystical flames such as the flame of Udun, which supercede things such as the Thrangorodrim or the fires of Mt Doom. Udun's flame was used to shape even fire creatures such as Smaug and all other Dragons of Arda.

And as I mentioned above, the Balrogs are not small by any stretch, and are actually much more powerfully built if not larger than Drogon, plus the Balrogs all have wings and can fly, as was proven when they chased away Ungoliant.

ares834
Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Udun's flame was used to shape even fire creatures such as Smaug and all other Dragons of Arda.


No it wasn't. Dragons were created when Morgoth was chilling in Udun. And "flame of Udun" is simply a term Gandalf uses to refer to the Balrog basically it's calling him a demon from hell.

Also "winged speed" may simply be used as a descriptor for the speed rather than to suggest they literally flew. Though it's a moot point, at the Balrog in the films did have wings and that is what we are using.

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by ares834
No it wasn't. Dragons were created when Morgoth was chilling in Udun. And "flame of Udun" is simply a term Gandalf uses to refer to the Balrog basically it's calling him a demon from hell.

As in Hellfire, as in Morgoth's Flame Imperishable. It's a figure of speech for the most part, but Morgoth had to pour some of his own power into his creations and mutations to make them. Thats why come the time of say his confrontation with Ungoliant, or Fingolfin he is considerably depowered than when he was during the time of the Song.

ares834
Sure. But it's never called the "flame of Udun" or "Morgoth's Flame Imperishable". As far as I'm aware, Morgoth's power is never once referred to as a "mystical flame".

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by ares834
Sure. But it's never called the "flame of Udun" or "Morgoth's Flame Imperishable". As far as I'm aware, Morgoth's power is never once referred to as a "mystical flame".

Well, in actuality it's a corrupted version of the Flame of Arnor/Secret fire/The Flame Imperishable, IE the flame of creation that is Eru's power. it exists in the heart of Ea, and is what comprises the souls of all things in creation, Valar and Maiar included. the Flame of Udun is merely Melkor's perversion of his own Flame.

ares834
No it's not. The Flame Imperishable is the power of creation which is something Tolkien has deliberately and repeatedly stated Melkor does not have. And I've seen nothing suggesting that souls are made from pieces of it.

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by ares834
No it's not. The Flame Imperishable is the power of creation which is something Tolkien has deliberately and repeatedly stated Melkor does not have. And I've seen nothing suggesting that souls are made from pieces of it.



http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Secret_Fire

I'm pretty sure that covers it.

ares834

Darkstorm Zero

Darkstorm Zero
Damn, quote and edit are down again... Anyways, aries834, this is off topic and completely detached from the thread topic. Not gonna derail any further on this as it is unimportant.

ares834
Because you realize you're wrong and have no other evidence then a fan wiki.

cdtm
Balrog wins. A better fight would be Night King.

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by ares834
Because you realize you're wrong and have no other evidence then a fan wiki.

Awww, another poster who believes that having the last word is winning. But please, continue to focus on the least relevant thing for that phyrric victory you love so much.

That is the lats bit of shit I have to give. Enjoy.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
I contest that the flames of the Doom of Valyria did in fact kill every dragon within the freehold, as per World of Ice and Fire.

So no, complete fire immunity is patently false, or at the very least only applies to mundane fires such as the funeral pyre. Such a thing wouldn't really apply to mystical flames such as the flame of Udun, which supercede things such as the Thrangorodrim or the fires of Mt Doom. Udun's flame was used to shape even fire creatures such as Smaug and all other Dragons of Arda.

And as I mentioned above, the Balrogs are not small by any stretch, and are actually much more powerfully built if not larger than Drogon, plus the Balrogs all have wings and can fly, as was proven when they chased away Ungoliant.


The Doom of Valyria was a Cataclysm! It was the explosion of a Massive Volcano! The temperatures of such a thing would exceed anything a Balrog could replicate!

I believe that the OP is refering to Durin's Bane here. Who can't fiy. As seen in the fight with Gandalf.



Furthermore, it wasn't a Volcano eruption but an explosion!

The Dragon's Death isn't specify. But i would doubt it was the fire. The explosion would have been MASSIVE, the amounts of smoke and toxic gases would also play a role.

So saying that the Dragon's died merely due to the heat isn't that realistic.

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
The Doom of Valyria was a Cataclysm! It was the explosion of a Massive Volcano! The temperatures of such a thing would exceed anything a Balrog could replicate!

I believe that the OP is refering to Durin's Bane here. Who can't fiy. As seen in the fight with Gandalf.



Furthermore, it wasn't a Volcano eruption but an explosion!

The Dragon's Death isn't specify. But i would doubt it was the fire. The explosion would have been MASSIVE, the amounts of smoke and toxic gases would also play a role.

So saying that the Dragon's died merely due to the heat isn't that realistic.

You are wrong. In a lot of ways. Utumno and Angbad/Trangorodrim, which react to Balrogs mean they influence volcanic activity.

And Durin's Bane was one of the Balrogs that chased Ungoliant. Also, it is how the Balrig was able to scale the distance between the pits of Kazad-Dun to the pinnacle of Zirak Zigil.

Also:

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Doom_of_Valyria
http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Doom_of_Valyria
http://iceandfire.wikia.com/wiki/Doom_of_Valyria

Read these

The poem of the event specifically references how the Dragons died in flame.

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
You are wrong. In a lot of ways. Utumno and Angbad/Trangorodrim, which react to Balrogs mean they influence volcanic activity.

And Durin's Bane was one of the Balrogs that chased Ungoliant. Also, it is how the Balrig was able to scale the distance between the pits of Kazad-Dun to the pinnacle of Zirak Zigil.

Also:

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Doom_of_Valyria
http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/Doom_of_Valyria
http://iceandfire.wikia.com/wiki/Doom_of_Valyria

Read these

The poem of the event specifically references how the Dragons died in flame.

None of LoTR volcano would match that of Valyria. Furthermore, as said before, the Supervolcano exploded. It was a cataclysm not a normal Volcanic Eruption. And Durin's Bane hasn't been depicted controlling Volcanic activity. Not on screen atleast.

No. Durin's Bane couldn't fly as depicted in his fight against Gandalf. Even the several sites have described Durin's Bane wings as mere decorative.

None of the sites you gave say that the Dragons died due to the fire. I read them before and just did now.

As i said before, the Doom of Valyria wasn't an ordinary Volcanic activity. It was a massive explosion. Fire isn't the only factor here, you also need to consider the toxic gases, and the blast produced by such activity.

It's impossible for a Balrog to EVER Immitate such an activity. Even Morgoth himself would have trouble replicating the Doom.

So, again Durin's Bane has no way to harm Drogon.

Darkstorm Zero

Josh_Alexander

Josh_Alexander

Josh_Alexander
Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
That's a poem! It is metaphorical and not literal!

Description of the Doom of Valyria :

On the day of the Doom, every hill for five hundred miles exploded, filling the air with ash and smoke and fire, which killed even dragons. Earthquakes destroyed palaces, temples, and towns, while lakes boiled or turned to acid. The Fourteen Flames, the fiery mountains of Valyria, sent molten rock a thousand feet into the air, and red clouds rained down dragonglass. The cataclysm fragmented the Valyrian peninsula surrounding Valyria into numerous smaller islands and creating the Smoking Sea between them. East of Valyria, Velos and Ghozai on the Isle of Cedars were destroyed by a tsunami.
It is commonly believed that the Doom was a natural calamity caused by the eruption of the Fourteen Flames, although some septons believe the polytheistic Valyrians delved too deep to the seven hells. Alternatively, Septon Barth and some maesters believe that Valyrian spells controlling the Fourteen Flames faltered. Other explanations include the curse of Garin the Great, the fire of R'hllor, or infighting dragonlords assassinating fire mages.

/\ That is what you should be reading and taking literal, not the Poem! How the dragons died exactly isn't described! So you they didn't necessary died to the flames.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUREX8aFbMs

That is the explosion of a Volcano in New Guinea, whose size isn't that big, but you can already see how powerful that eruption/explosion was!

http://www.iflscience.com/environment/whats-the-most-dangerous-volcano-in-the-world/all/

Here is the list of the Biggest/Most dangerous super volcanoes on Earth! Yellowstone Caldera is #1

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsUkEMgLY0U

https://www.livescience.com/20714-yellowstone-supervolcano-eruption.html

Here is a simulated eruption/explosion of the Yellowstone Caldera! Along with an scientific article to explain how destructive such an eruption would be!

Such an explosion would only be rivaled by a couple of Nukes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yellowstone_Caldera

Here is Yellowstone Caldera's size, being of 45 miles the most.

NOW IMAGINE A 500MILE EXPLOSION/ERUPTION!

So it's clear you are not talking about a normal thing! Such explosion would be massive. The amounts of fumes and gases released..Unimaginable! The amount of rocks and objects being casted a the sky would bring down any flying creature! The water sources would evaporate!

Again, Dragons didn't just died to normal flames!

Morgoth could mold the landscape! He mainly molded the Middle Earth Landscape as depicted in the Silmariliion. However he has never replicated an explosion the size of 500miles! So no.




Again i don't see a Balrog being able to kill a dragon. No real evidence.

Ignore this post, I made a color mistake and they didn't allow me to edit it, so i just corrected it in another reply beneath that one.

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.