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Rank these MCU characters in order from the most to the least powerful.

Let's rank them in order of who can defeat the biggest number of other people from the list.

Some restrictions:

- Iron Man has no prep time here, but he can use his most powerful suit.

- Doctor Strange is without the time gem.




Iron Man
Scarlet Witch
Thor
Loki
Vision
Hulk
Kurse
Dr Strange
Spiderman

I think to properly do this we need some kind of context. Are we defining this by who can beat who? Who can defeat the most number of opponents on the list? Who can take out the most number of villains with minimal effort? Who's the most useful to the team?

Originally posted by FrothByte
I think to properly do this we need some kind of context. Are we defining this by who can beat who? Who can defeat the most number of opponents on the list? Who can take out the most number of villains with minimal effort? Who's the most useful to the team?
Good point

Ok. Edited the OP.

9. Spiderman - despite being a pretty powerful character, he's still a noob and if he can't even beat Captain America then there's no way he can take out the rest of these guys.

8. Dr. Strange - the problem with Strange is that despite having the most implied power, he's never really applied them much in combat. In combat he mostly goes h2h with some assistance from portals and his cape. It's one thing to teleport Thor and Loki around while at the comfort of your own stronghold and something else to do so in the middle of a fight. So until he shows more power feats during combat, I have to judge him based on what we've seen on screen. His most powerful tool are portals but I don't really consider BFRs as proper wins. It's mostly a stalemate really.

7. Scarlet Witch - She has force fields, she has TK strong enough to rip apart multiple ultronbots and she can mess up your minds. And she's proven herself in combat. The reason she's this low is that she's squishy. A lapse in attention and she can get taken out with a single hit from all the remaining people in the list.

6. Ironman - as long as Tony gets his strongest suit, he actually has a good balance of strength, durability and ranged weaponry. He can easily knock out the 3 characters below him with a single hit as long as he can land the hit. All the other characters above him can tank his hits.

5. Loki - he's one of the most durable characters here. His knives will mess up IM and a single hit from him can KO the bottom 3 fighters. SW and Strange might give him some issues but in the end, none of them have what it takes to knock him out.

4. Hulk - I think IM and Loki can give Hulk a hell of a fight if they play it smart. IM has enough weaponry and maneuverability to pester Hulk, and Loki can utilize illusions and his magical knives to make it a very painful fight for Hulk. In the end though, I don't see how they can take him out permanently.

3. Kurse - I think it's clear with the way Kurse handled Thor in fisticuffs that he's a superior h2h fighter than the Hulk. Plus he's too tough and strong for the rest of the characters in the list to take out permanently.

2. Vision - as long as Vision uses his powers to full potential, he should be able to just phase in and out, rip people apart or blast them with the infinity stone. Plus he's nearly indestructible. The only caveat is SW who's proven she can control the stone, so Vision does get 1 loss to SW which is one of the reasons he gets 2nd place. The other reason is that we've seen Vision get paralyzed with Hawkeye's electric arrows, which means he's in trouble with contender no. 1

1. Thor - to be honest, if Thor plays this smart and just spams lightning from a distance, majority of these characters won't even be able to get near him. Then there's the fact that at his full power his lightning coats him almost like a living thing that automatically attacks anything within the vicinity, which gives him a very offensive shield. That's not even including his capacity to lift the opponent in the air with a tornado and the fact that he's a very skilled h2h combatant with high end strength and durability.

Good list Froth. I completely agree with everything on there.

That's one of the things I like about the MCU version of Thor. they actually show Thor being a skilled warrior. comics seem to give people like Thor and Wonder Woman lip service, but most of the time they either brawl or seem to get matched by people like Superman or the Hulk in the HTH dept.

Originally posted by Silent Master
That's one of the things I like about the MCU version of Thor. they actually show Thor being a skilled warrior. comics seem to give people like Thor and Wonder Woman lip service, but most of the time they either brawl or seem to get matched by people like Superman or the Hulk in the HTH dept.

Yeah, it's good that the MCU doesn't portray Thor like a dumb brawler (most of the time anyway, because he did act like a dumb brawler against Kurse).

In AOU he pretty much ducked and dodged a bunch of blasts from an Ultronbot at near pointblank range.

#1 Would definitely Strange. His magical powers exceed anything we have seen. Even without the power gem, his manipulation over reality is very high!

I don't see how any of the other avengers would fair good against him.

After strange well, I am not really sure as to how the hierarchy falls.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
#1 Would definitely Strange. His magical powers exceed anything we have seen. Even without the power gem, his manipulation over reality is very high!

I don't see how any of the other avengers would fair good against him.

After strange well, I am not really sure as to how the hierarchy falls.

Do you have any actual movie feats where Dr. Strange demonstrated these powers in a fight?

Originally posted by FrothByte
Do you have any actual movie feats where Dr. Strange demonstrated these powers in a fight?

Did you watch Dr Strange? Also per the latest Marvel release Thor Ragnarok Strange has not only improved since his appearance in Dr Strange but is seen using reality warping. Even depicted locking Loki in an illusion!

Loki is considered a very powerful magician and was still dwarfed by Strange

So, yes Strange is #1. I think that should be obvious.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Even depicted locking Loki in an illusion!


I don't believe it was an illusion. I think he really teleported him into the right place/dimension so he could be falling for 30 minutes.

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I don't believe it was an illusion. I think he really teleported him into the right place/dimension so he could be falling for 30 minutes.

Yes my bad.

Else he wouldn't have landed from the roof out of nowhere when Strange summoned him.

Maybe a type of pocket dimension.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Did you watch Dr Strange? Also per the latest Marvel release Thor Ragnarok Strange has not only improved since his appearance in Dr Strange but is seen using reality warping. Even depicted locking Loki in an illusion!

Loki is considered a very powerful magician and was still dwarfed by Strange

So, yes Strange is #1. I think that should be obvious.

I watched Dr. Strange the movie. In the movie, he only ever fought h2h, used some semi-decent shield constructs and a whip, made some portals and relied on his cape for the rest. Keyword here is this is what he did DURING a fight.

In Thor Ragnarok, everything he did was when he was
1. Not fighting
and 2. Inside his mansion.

So like I said, show me feats of Dr. Strange doing these powers while in a middle of a fight.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I watched Dr. Strange the movie. In the movie, he only ever fought h2h, used some semi-decent shield constructs and a whip, made some portals and relied on his cape for the rest. Keyword here is this is what he did DURING a fight.

In Thor Ragnarok, everything he did was when he was
1. Not fighting
and 2. Inside his mansion.

So like I said, show me feats of Dr. Strange doing these powers while in a middle of a fight.

The entire Dr. Strange movie was based on Reality Warping dear!

Dr. Strange is specifically depicted creating portals, using energy weapons, and using other powers and abilities which All fall under Reality Warping and Energy Manipulation.

Furthermore, in Ragnarok we see how Strange put Loki in a sort of pocket dimension. If you forget Loki is a very powerful magical being! And still Strange managed to dwarf him.

Also remember that Strange became the Sorcerer Supreme at the end of Dr. Strange! He had at his disposal thousands of books regarding magic.

His abilities substantially increased!

Strange wins simply because there is no way the other avengers could fight his magic. As simple as that.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
The entire Dr. Strange movie was based on Reality Warping dear!

Dr. Strange is specifically depicted creating portals, using energy weapons, and using other powers and abilities which All fall under Reality Warping and Energy Manipulation.

Furthermore, in Ragnarok we see how Strange put Loki in a sort of pocket dimension. If you forget Loki is a very powerful magical being! And still Strange managed to dwarf him.

Also remember that Strange became the Sorcerer Supreme at the end of Dr. Strange! He had at his disposal thousands of books regarding magic.

His abilities substantially increased!

Strange wins simply because there is no way the other avengers could fight his magic. As simple as that.

Reality warping was done by kaecilius and the ancient one. Show me Dr. Strange doing reality warping while in combat? Unless you consider creating weapons and shields constructs as reality warping, in which case Thor and Loki are also both reality warpers.

What Strange did to Loki and Thor was done while the were not trying to fight him. Again, please post feats that were done while Strange was in the middle of a fight.

I also don't recall Strange being called Sorcerer supreme.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Reality warping was done by kaecilius and the ancient one. Show me Dr. Strange doing reality warping while in combat? Unless you consider creating weapons and shields constructs as reality warping, in which case Thor and Loki are also both reality warpers.

What Strange did to Loki and Thor was done while the were not trying to fight him. Again, please post feats that were done while Strange was in the middle of a fight.

I also don't recall Strange being called Sorcerer supreme. ]

Yes. And Strange became Sorcerer Supreme in the end of Dr. Strange, which gave him ample of knowledge along with time to learn such abilities. He was the chosen one after all! It would be illogical to think Strange did nothing in that time considering his curiosity and aptitude for learning!

What he did with Loki is reality warping. He put him in another dimension.

Are you claiming that Loki willingly allowed himself to be tricked by Strange? LOL!!!!!!

Strange could replicate what he did with Thor and all other Avengers!

He wins this. His magic is beyond all of the Avengers.

He wasn't called Sorcerer Supreme, but he has taken the Ancient's One's job! As clearly seen when Thor is received by him.

Strange is #1. His magic puts him there.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
]

Yes. And Strange became Sorcerer Supreme in the end of Dr. Strange, which gave him ample of knowledge along with time to learn such abilities. He was the chosen one after all! It would be illogical to think Strange did nothing in that time considering his curiosity and aptitude for learning!

What he did with Loki is reality warping. He put him in another dimension.

Are you claiming that Loki willingly allowed himself to be tricked by Strange? LOL!!!!!!

Strange could replicate what he did with Thor and all other Avengers!

He wins this. His magic is beyond all of the Avengers.

He wasn't called Sorcerer Supreme, but he has taken the Ancient's One's job! As clearly seen when Thor is received by him.

Strange is #1. His magic puts him there.

Loki was standing on a sidewalk when Strange drew him in the hole. Again, not fighting. Do you understand the difference between fighting and not fighting?

Tell you what, how bout you just post vids of Strange doing the things you claim he can do while fighting. The movie has been out some time now so youtube clips should be easily found.

I need a recap on vision to place him above hulk. currently thor is definitely above hulk tho

Originally posted by Raisen
I need a recap on vision to place him above hulk. currently thor is definitely above hulk tho


Hulk and Vision are probably on par in terms of overall power, but given Vision's ability to go intangible, Hulk wouldn't stand much of a chance at all against Vision in a 1 v 1 match up.

Strange is probably #1, at least with cape, though that's more of a impression. Thor comes after him, and Vision is probably > Hulk / Kurse due to his intangibility. Iron Man and Loki are close to each other, but I might would put Tony above him in a battle. Spiderman is last, and I dunno about Wanda.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander




Hello Darth Thor!

Ohh don't tell me you are really going to support Thor as #1 Avenger here!!! HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Does your fanaticism reach that level!?




Originally posted by Me
An argument could be made for Strange to be no.1 though via BFR alone though.

We have to clarify with the OP if bfr is considered a win. I don't, because all it really does is cause a stalemate. But I'll let OP make that call.

For all of those who forgot who Dr. Strange is! (FrothByte)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC7Fdp-2-VY

Minute 3:15: Strange is sent to the Everest! His mission create a portal or die on the Everest. Strange succeeded and has clearly mastered Portal creation, which is REALITY WARPING!

Minute 3:30: Strange confirms his Reality Warping abilities!

Minute 5 : Strange is clearly creating minor Mirror dimensions to evade blows from Kaecilious gang. He also create Energy shields! Which falls under Energy Manipulation.

Minute 5:50: Confirmation of his mastering over Energy Manipulation.

Although the fight scenes are minor, you can already witness Strange huge ability for learning! He has already mastered several abilities that would take years to learn.

Now taken into consideration that what we've seen occurs 1 year previously to Thor Ragnarok, IT'S OBVIOUS THAT HIS POWERS HAVE DRAMATICALLY INCREASED!

Strange is #1 without a doubt.

Originally posted by FrothByte
We have to clarify with the OP if bfr is considered a win. I don't, because all it really does is cause a stalemate. But I'll let OP make that call.


When Asgard was still around that wouldn't have made a difference to Thor anyway. But guess that's gone now.

Depends on the context of the BFR IMO. If you, for example, BFR someone purely to survive, then yeah, I would say that's more of a draw. But if, for example, you can BFR someone into a volcano and kill them, or 5 miles up into the air and let them plummet to their death, I would say that's a win for you. Or not even something lethal, really. Just in a way where you actually incapacitate them. I mean some characters' entire powerset revolve around teleporting/portals.

Originally posted by FrothByte
We have to clarify with the OP if bfr is considered a win. I don't, because all it really does is cause a stalemate. But I'll let OP make that call.

Thor comes all charged up and Steven just creates a portal and sends him to hell.

Then puts every other Avenger in pocket dimensions until they declare him #1!

I see a clear victor here.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Depends on the context of the BFR IMO. If you, for example, BFR someone purely to survive, then yeah, I would say that's more of a draw. But if, for example, you can BFR someone into a volcano and kill them, I would say that's a win for you. I mean some characters' entire powerset revolve around teleporting/portals.

Yeah.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander


Now taken into consideration that what we've seen occurs 1 year previously to Thor Ragnarok, IT'S OBVIOUS THAT HIS POWERS HAVE DRAMATICALLY INCREASED!




Perhaps but you can't quantify if his energy blasts and shields would be powerful enough to hurt and withstand Thor.

Originally posted by FrothByte
We have to clarify with the OP if bfr is considered a win. I don't, because all it really does is cause a stalemate. But I'll let OP make that call.


Can't see any clear rulings in the movie versus forum. But in the comic versus forum a BFR counts as a win if the one being BRF'd can't return under his own power in a reasonable amount of time.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Perhaps but you can't quantify if his energy blasts and shields would be powerful enough to hurt and withstand Thor.

No, but his Reality Warping makes Thor Powers useless.

Thor casts a punch, and Steven creates a portal sending Thor's punch right back to his face.

We saw how Steven locked Loki in a pocket dimension in TR. That is something he had to learn after the events of Dr. Strange.

Strange cheapshotted Loki. It's impressive regardless tho.

Originally posted by Ursumeles
Strange cheapshotted Loki. It's impressive regardless tho.

It was comical.

I mean Loki was always the one tricking his opponents with magic, this time he was the one tricked.

Loki even rails up against strange when he is brought back from that dimension!

It's evidence Strange is at another level.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander


Strange can create portals! That means he can create a portal between him and Thor's punch! The portal then leads his punch back to Thor's face!


Combat feats are very different to other feats. You have to prove he can do what you just said mid-combat.


Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC7Fdp-2-VY

Check minute 3:30

All he did was pick up a book from a location he'd already prepped for, and within their magical home.

You have to prove he can do that to wherever he likes mid-fight to someone whose so fast that Hulk can hardly land a single hit on him.


Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Just admit Strange beats them all! I think that should be DAMN TOO OBVIOUS.


Originally posted by ME
An argument could be made for Strange to be no.1 though via BFR alone though.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Combat feats are very different to other feats. You have to prove he can do what you just said mid-combat.




All he did was pick up a book from a location he'd already prepped for, and within their magical home.

You have to prove he can do that to wherever he likes mid-fight to someone whose so fast that Hulk can hardly land a single hit on him.

I don't have to prove you anything. I already proved that Strange can create portals with ease. That means he can create portals as he sees fit.

BFR isn't limited. Therefore Strange is #1.

Strange puts them all in a pocket dimension or sends them to empty space where most would die due to the lack of oxygen!

Strange wins.

Some thoughts on Dr. Strange.

1. He needs time to make portals. When he opened that portal on Loki's feet, Loki had a few seconds to wonder what was going on and talk to Thor. In a fight where Loki know's what's going on, he could easily have stepped outside of that. When Strange made the portal to Norway, he had to consult a number of books before being able to create it. In his movie, he had to concentrate and use hand gestures to create portals... kinda hard to do if you're defending yourself. He cannot instantly create portals that I've seen.

2. We have not seen Dr. Strange teleport his enemies inside volcanoes, under water, 100 feet in the air, etc. All of which, had he been capable of doing, would have vastly been effective in his fight against his opponents in his movie. Though these are valid tactics, they are currently unsupported by feats. It seems that Strange needs to know exactly where to teleport someone and can't just wish them away in some random volcano. If anyone has feats to prove contrary then I will acknowledge it.

3. Strange was teleporting without issue inside his mansion but he was only doing so in short distances. He wasn't teleporting through vast distances and he was doing so inside the Sanctum, which in itself is magical. We don't know if he can replicate this in a neutral arena that's unfamiliar to him.

4. BFR's are pretty much the only way Strange can win these fights since he doesn't have the firepower or strength to take out most of the other fighters. But it begs the question of whether he can create portals faster than his opponents can blast him apart, since some of the other fighters have faster "quick draw" moves than him.

5. Creating teleportation portals isn't reality warping. You're simply finding a way to condense time and space, not completely changing reality.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I don't have to prove you anything. I already proved that Strange can create portals with ease. That means he can create portals as he sees fit.

BFR isn't limited. Therefore Strange is #1.

Strange puts them all in a pocket dimension or sends them to empty space where most would die due to the lack of oxygen!

Strange wins.

Strange needs time to create portals. In the time that he creates a portal, Scarlet Witch could easily have torn him up with TK, Vision could blast him with his infinity stone, IM could have hit him with repulsors, Thor could have zapped him with lightning, Loki could have hit him with a knife.

The portals will work great on the pure brutes like Hulk and Kurse, won't work so well with those with range attacks that are launched faster than Strange can create portals.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
I don't have to prove you anything. I already proved that Strange can create portals with ease. That means he can create portals as he sees fit.



No it doesn't.

Go learn the difference between combat feats and non-combat feats, then come back to me.

Originally posted by FrothByte
We have to clarify with the OP if bfr is considered a win. I don't, because all it really does is cause a stalemate. But I'll let OP make that call.

No, BFR is not a win.

KO, submission or kill would count.

^ Then Dr. Strange is pretty low down. Maybe at the bottom for now.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Some thoughts on Dr. Strange.

1. He needs time to make portals. When he opened that portal on Loki's feet, Loki had a few seconds to wonder what was going on and talk to Thor. In a fight where Loki know's what's going on, he could easily have stepped outside of that. When Strange made the portal to Norway, he had to consult a number of books before being able to create it. In his movie, he had to concentrate and use hand gestures to create portals... kinda hard to do if you're defending yourself. He cannot instantly create portals that I've seen.

2. We have not seen Dr. Strange teleport his enemies inside volcanoes, under water, 100 feet in the air, etc. All of which, had he been capable of doing, would have vastly been effective in his fight against his opponents in his movie. Though these are valid tactics, they are currently unsupported by feats. It seems that Strange needs to know exactly where to teleport someone and can't just wish them away in some random volcano. If anyone has feats to prove contrary then I will acknowledge it.

3. Strange was teleporting without issue inside his mansion but he was only doing so in short distances. He wasn't teleporting through vast distances and he was doing so inside the Sanctum, which in itself is magical. We don't know if he can replicate this in a neutral arena that's unfamiliar to him.

4. BFR's are pretty much the only way Strange can win these fights since he doesn't have the firepower or strength to take out most of the other fighters. But it begs the question of whether he can create portals faster than his opponents can blast him apart, since some of the other fighters have faster "quick draw" moves than him.

5. Creating teleportation portals isn't reality warping. You're simply finding a way to condense time and space, not completely changing reality.

1 & 2: That's assuming there is prep time and basic knowledge on their foes. Strange's existence is only known by Thor and Loki. Loki who's magic is way above the Avengers isn't taking part in this fight. Thor would likely focus on Hulk or IM.

An exact point in Norway, not the same as teleporting someone at a random place in space/ocean/volcano. Maybe Strange needed the coordinates of Odin's location.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmSb4VYAUhU

Minute 2:00: Strange creates a portal in less than 10 seconds and without need to read a book.

Strange was basically a noob when he faced Kaecilious and Dormammu, and still in his limited time to learn was able to dominate the Eye of Agamotto and master teleportation. Now give Strange another year of practice and knoweldge. It would be unwise to think that his powers haven't MASSIVELY INCREASED.

3. No he teleported from the Everest to the Mansion...That's not a short distance...

4. The very fact that Strange had to make a portal from EVEREST to the SANCTUM proves that he doesn't have to be INSIDE the sanctum to make such, and also proves that distance isn't limited neither.

5. .............EHHHHH......Condensing time and space is reality warping........If you manage to change reality you are a reality warper....

Originally posted by FrothByte
Strange needs time to create portals. In the time that he creates a portal, Scarlet Witch could easily have torn him up with TK, Vision could blast him with his infinity stone, IM could have hit him with repulsors, Thor could have zapped him with lightning, Loki could have hit him with a knife.

The portals will work great on the pure brutes like Hulk and Kurse, won't work so well with those with range attacks that are launched faster than Strange can create portals.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmSb4VYAUhU

Minute 2:05 proves he can do it quite fast.

That's assuming all avengers know of Strange's existence and ability and DECIDE to take counter measures.

Furthermore, the Cape of Levitation and Stranges Energy Manipulation still give him a good defense meanwhile he warps them all into pocket dimensions.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
^ Then Dr. Strange is pretty low down. Maybe at the bottom for now.

Not really.

He won't BFR them, he would send them to places where they'd die. e.g. Outer Space, to the Earth's core, to the deepest part of the Ocean.

Strange is still number 1.

Originally posted by Stigma
No, BFR is not a win.

KO, submission or kill would count.

Agree.

Considering how nerfed Dr. Strange is, it's impressive he is still capable of claiming #1.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Not really.

He won't BFR them, he would send them to places where they'd die. e.g. Outer Space, to the Earth's core, to the deepest part of the Ocean.

Strange is still number 1.

Care to back up those claims with feats? I don't recall Strange ever doing those things.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Care to back up those claims with feats? I don't recall Strange ever doing those things.

I don't recall Strange not being able to create portals to places.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
1 & 2: That's assuming there is prep time and basic knowledge on their foes. Strange's existence is only known by Thor and Loki. Loki who's magic is way above the Avengers isn't taking part in this fight. Thor would likely focus on Hulk or IM.

An exact point in Norway, not the same as teleporting someone at a random place in space/ocean/volcano. Maybe Strange needed the coordinates of Odin's location.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmSb4VYAUhU

Minute 2:00: Strange creates a portal in less than 10 seconds and without need to read a book.

Strange was basically a noob when he faced Kaecilious and Dormammu, and still in his limited time to learn was able to dominate the Eye of Agamotto and master teleportation. Now give Strange another year of practice and knoweldge. It would be unwise to think that his powers haven't MASSIVELY INCREASED.

3. No he teleported from the Everest to the Mansion...That's not a short distance...

4. The very fact that Strange had to make a portal from EVEREST to the SANCTUM proves that he doesn't have to be INSIDE the sanctum to make such, and also proves that distance isn't limited neither.

5. .............EHHHHH......Condensing time and space is reality warping........If you manage to change reality you are a reality warper....


1. Loki is in this fight. You're right, there is no prep, meaning Dr. Strange would be at a disadvantage because he needs prep to make his portals. If I'm not mistaken, this fight is not a free for all rumble. It's a 1 on 1 round robin.

2. You said Strange takes less than 10 seconds to make a portal. Well, Thor, IM, Wanda, Vision and Loki only need a split second to launch their attacks and unless Strange puts up his shields, he'll be dead way before he gets to finish his portal.

3. He teleported from Mt. Everest by making a portal, not just teleporting at will.

4. See #3. There's a difference between making a portal and casually teleporting yourself with but a thought.

5. If that's what your definition is for reality warping then Thor, Vision, Wanda and Vision are all reality warpers.

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. Loki is in this fight. You're right, there is no prep, meaning Dr. Strange would be at a disadvantage because he needs prep to make his portals. If I'm not mistaken, this fight is not a free for all rumble. It's a 1 on 1 round robin.

2. You said Strange takes less than 10 seconds to make a portal. Well, Thor, IM, Wanda, Vision and Loki only need a split second to launch their attacks and unless Strange puts up his shields, he'll be dead way before he gets to finish his portal.

3. He teleported from Mt. Everest by making a portal, not just teleporting at will.

4. See #3. There's a difference between making a portal and casually teleporting yourself with but a thought.

5. If that's what your definition is for reality warping then Thor, Vision, Wanda and Vision are all reality warpers.

1. Sorry, i didn't saw Loki. OP didn't state prep time, so no.

2. Strange will defend himself ofcourse. He will use his energy manipulation to defend and counterattack. When the moment is apt he will create the portals. He can also fly, and keep distance.

3. Well it shows he can create a portal regardless the place and to wherever he wants.

4. He teleported through a portal.

5. No they are not. They are Energy manipulators.

RW has to do with manipulation of the time/space fabric. Turn a rabbit into an Elephant, bend space by creating a portal, etc.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
1. Sorry, i didn't saw Loki. OP didn't state prep time, so no.

2. Strange will defend himself ofcourse. He will use his energy manipulation to defend and counterattack. When the moment is apt he will create the portals. He can also fly, and keep distance.

3. Well it shows he can create a portal regardless the place and to wherever he wants.

4. He teleported through a portal.

5. No they are not. They are Energy manipulators.

RW has to do with manipulation of the time/space fabric. Turn a rabbit into an Elephant, bend space by creating a portal, etc.

1. Acknowledged.
2. Strange needs his hands to perform the actions when creating a portal. He also needs them when making shields. He also needs them when making weapons and attacking. Meaning he can't attack, defend and create portals all at the same time. So how is he going to create a portal while getting hammered by very strong forces from his foes?

3. Correction, he can create a portal to a location that he knows. Has Strange ever created a portal to a place he hasn't been to or at least researched about (like he did for Norway)?

4. Correct. Which means he had to create the portal first. He couldn't just teleport on a whim.

5. If you consider bending time and space as reality warping then the bifrost is a reality warper, same with Odin, same with all the spaceships that can travel through space in a short amount of time.

Originally posted by FrothByte
1. Acknowledged.
2. Strange needs his hands to perform the actions when creating a portal. He also needs them when making shields. He also needs them when making weapons and attacking. Meaning he can't attack, defend and create portals all at the same time. So how is he going to create a portal while getting hammered by very strong forces from his foes?

3. Correction, he can create a portal to a location that he knows. Has Strange ever created a portal to a place he hasn't been to or at least researched about (like he did for Norway)?

4. Correct. Which means he had to create the portal first. He couldn't just teleport on a whim.

5. If you consider bending time and space as reality warping then the bifrost is a reality warper, same with Odin, same with all the spaceships that can travel through space in a short amount of time.

2. He keeps distance, his cape still protects him and seems to have knowledge of the surroundings.

Strange uses his RW abilities to create various illusions, and when the time is right creates portals.

Also remember that it's an ALL VS fight, isn't like they are all attacking Strange at the same time. So he could create portals for the ones not fighting him too, which makes it easier.

3. An exact location in Norway. I don't think Strange would find problems creating portals to a random place on space/ocean/center of the earth.

4. Yeah. But he can create portals in the floor, as seen when he captured Loki. Also he can create portals in front of him, any attack would be wasted.

5. Cars aren't considered reality warpers. But in that aspect they would fall maybe under space manipulators.

Reality requires the full package.

It wouldn't surprise me if Strange has already learnt how to create mirror dimensions, which would pose a major problem for our other heroes.

Strange is definitely #1 for the time being.

No other Avenger have shown to possess Reality Warping so far except for Strange.

Reality Warping is a serious power.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Well if Hulk or Thor comes after him, then he creates a portal just before them.

By the time they stop to realize what's happened, the portal is closed!

It's really stupid to assume Strange wouldn't be able to do so.



facepalm

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. He keeps distance, his cape still protects him and seems to have knowledge of the surroundings.

Strange uses his RW abilities to create various illusions, and when the time is right creates portals.

Also remember that it's an ALL VS fight, isn't like they are all attacking Strange at the same time. So he could create portals for the ones not fighting him too, which makes it easier.

3. An exact location in Norway. I don't think Strange would find problems creating portals to a random place on space/ocean/center of the earth.

4. Yeah. But he can create portals in the floor, as seen when he captured Loki. Also he can create portals in front of him, any attack would be wasted.

5. Cars aren't considered reality warpers. But in that aspect they would fall maybe under space manipulators.

Reality requires the full package.

2. Strange's cape has never protected him from attacks as strong as the ones the top hitters in this fight will be launching. And no, this isn't an ALL vs. fight. What various illusions does Strange make?

3. An exact location in Norway that he already knew about before hand and had to read books to prepare for.

4. Yeah he can create portals on the floor and in front of him. He still needs time to make them.

Originally posted by FrothByte
2. Strange's cape has never protected him from attacks as strong as the ones the top hitters in this fight will be launching. And no, this isn't an ALL vs. fight. What various illusions does Strange make?

3. An exact location in Norway that he already knew about before hand and had to read books to prepare for.

4. Yeah he can create portals on the floor and in front of him. He still needs time to make them.

2. He is a Reality Warper, the ones he sees fit. Like creating a pot of tea, or filling Thor's Jar with more bear!

3. Yeah, he needed a portal to take him to the exact location of Odin. Isn't like he would teleport them anywhere in Norway!

4. 10 secs the most. The Avengers wouldn't know what hit them! They would be fighting each other while portals appear from nowhere sending them to their graves.

Strange is on top here.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. He is a Reality Warper, the ones he sees fit. Like creating a pot of tea, or filling Thor's Jar with more bear!

3. Yeah, he needed a portal to take him to the exact location of Odin. Isn't like he would teleport them anywhere in Norway!

4. 10 secs the most. The Avengers wouldn't know what hit them! They would be fighting each other while portals appear from nowhere sending them to their graves.

Strange is on top here.

2. Show a feat of Strange creating illusions in the middle of a fight.

3. In short, he wasn't able to create a portal without knowing the place first.

4. 10 seconds at the most you say. Wanda can rip him apart in under a second. Thor can blast him in a blink of an eye. Vision and IM can blast him multiple times before 10 seconds is up. Again, this isn't an all vs. all fight. It's a round robin 1 on 1 fight. And even if this was a royal rumble, why are you acting like everyone will just ignore Strange?

Originally posted by FrothByte
4. 10 seconds at the most you say. Wanda can rip him apart in under a second. Thor can blast him in a blink of an eye. Vision and IM can blast him multiple times before 10 seconds is up. Again, this isn't an all vs. all fight. It's a round robin 1 on 1 fight. And even if this was a royal rumble, why are you acting like everyone will just ignore Strange?

Yeah, 10 seconds is an awful long time in a fight. Even some MCU street-levelers/low-metas (below the people on this list) have feats of dropping multiple opponents in that space of time. Daredevil, Iron Fist, Luke Cage, Captain America etc. And Strange is just one guy. And I don't recall any feats of him maintaining active shields while also making portals. He'd basically have to hope that his cloak can protect him while he opened a portal.

Originally posted by FrothByte
2. Show a feat of Strange creating illusions in the middle of a fight.

3. In short, he wasn't able to create a portal without knowing the place first.

4. 10 seconds at the most you say. Wanda can rip him apart in under a second. Thor can blast him in a blink of an eye. Vision and IM can blast him multiple times before 10 seconds is up. Again, this isn't an all vs. all fight. It's a round robin 1 on 1 fight. And even if this was a royal rumble, why are you acting like everyone will just ignore Strange?

2. He RW a beer for Thor in Ragnarok! That proves he can create "illusions". Who said his abilities are limited by combat?

3. Not the place, the exact location. Besides I already showed a clip where he creates a portal without the need of a book.

4. I used 10s as the maximum amount of time he could create a portal. Per seen in the video I posted, he created the portal in 4-6 seconds.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
2. He RW a beer for Thor in Ragnarok! That proves he can create "illusions". Who said his abilities are limited by combat?

3. Not the place, the exact location. Besides I already showed a clip where he creates a portal without the need of a book.

4. I used 10s as the maximum amount of time he could create a portal. Per seen in the video I posted, he created the portal in 4-6 seconds.

2. A lot of martial artists can do a triple flip kick in demonstration. Yet they could never do one in the middle of a fight. There is a huge difference in being able to do something in the calm of your own home and doing the same thing when someone is trying to kill you. Besides, what's he going to do, throw a beer at Thor while he gets zapped with lightning?

3. What I'm asking for is proof that Strange can open a portal to a location he's never been to and do so without needing a lot of prep to do it.

4. 4-6 seconds is still a lot longer than 1 second or half a second.. which is the amount of time a lot of these guys can tear up Strange with their own powers. Ok let's keep this simple. How do you think Strange stops Wanda from tearing him apart with her TK?

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
Yeah, 10 seconds is an awful long time in a fight. Even some MCU street-levelers/low-metas (below the people on this list) have feats of dropping multiple opponents in that space of time. Daredevil, Iron Fist, Luke Cage, Captain America etc. And Strange is just one guy. And I don't recall any feats of him maintaining active shields while also making portals. He'd basically have to hope that his cloak can protect him while he opened a portal.

And against the kind of firepower some of these guys have, his cape is not going to be enough. Even if it can somehow protect him from being killed outright, he'd still be knocked around enough that he won't be able to complete that portal.

Originally posted by FrothByte
And against the kind of firepower some of these guys have, his cape is not going to be enough. Even if it can somehow protect him from being killed outright, he'd still be knocked around enough that he won't be able to complete that portal.

Yeah, guys like Iron Man, Vision, Thor, Scarlet Witch (and even Spidey) have attacks that can be executed in about a second or less. So, based on feats, they could tag Strange repeatedly in the time it takes him to open a single portal.

Originally posted by FrothByte
2. A lot of martial artists can do a triple flip kick in demonstration. Yet they could never do one in the middle of a fight. There is a huge difference in being able to do something in the calm of your own home and doing the same thing when someone is trying to kill you. Besides, what's he going to do, throw a beer at Thor while he gets zapped with lightning?

3. What I'm asking for is proof that Strange can open a portal to a location he's never been to and do so without needing a lot of prep to do it.

4. 4-6 seconds is still a lot longer than 1 second or half a second.. which is the amount of time a lot of these guys can tear up Strange with their own powers. Ok let's keep this simple. How do you think Strange stops Wanda from tearing him apart with her TK?

2. He is a sorcerer, he can Warp Reality. We have seen him do it. You saying he can't do it in combat is irrational.

3. I already give you such. Check previous messages.

4. When has Wanda tore apart someone? He still has his Energy manipulation. He can still use his energy weeps and energy shields.

His Cape also still protects him. We have seen his cape attacking Dr. Strange's foes when feeling threatened. It also allows Strange to fly.

All Strange needs is a couple of seconds of distraction for him to make one and done.



Originally posted by FrothByte
And against the kind of firepower some of these guys have, his cape is not going to be enough. Even if it can somehow protect him from being killed outright, he'd still be knocked around enough that he won't be able to complete that portal.

Strange still has his energy shields.

Again we need to take into consideration that Dr. Strange had 1 year of practice until Ragnarok. His powers and abilities have widly increased.

I would bet Strange already knows how to create mirror dimensions!

Strange is #1. His powers and abilities put him there.

That is pure speculation.

Assuming standard gear from the most recent movies:

1. Dr. Strange (with the time stone)
2. Scarlet Witch (unsure where to rank her tbh, but by implied and potential power, I'd say she's near the top)
3. Vision
4. Kurse
5/6. Hulk
7. Iron Man
8. Loki
9. Spiderman

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Again we need to take into consideration that Dr. Strange had 1 year of practice until Ragnarok. His powers and abilities have widly increased.

I would bet Strange already knows how to create mirror dimensions!

Strange is #1. His powers and abilities put him there.

In short you're speculating and don't have proof. Got it.

Originally posted by FrothByte
In short you're speculating and don't have proof. Got it.

Valid speculation per movie timeline!

Just admit putting Strange at #8 was a poor judgement of yours.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Valid speculation per movie timeline!

Just admit putting Strange at #8 was a poor judgement of yours.

I backed up my stats with valid proof, screen feats and logic. You backed yours up with opinion, assumptions and favoritism. Just admit that you completely suck at debating.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Valid speculation per movie timeline!

Just admit putting Strange at #8 was a poor judgement of yours.

Correction, massively biased speculation based on who you like more.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I backed up my stats with valid proof, screen feats and logic. You backed yours up with opinion, assumptions and favoritism. Just admit that you completely suck at debating.

The fact that he considers his personal speculation valid evidence shows that he still doesn't understand the concept of "screen feats only".

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
The fact that he considers his personal speculation valid evidence shows that he still doesn't understand the concept of "screen feats only".

Well, when someone doesn't understand the difference between doing something in the comfort of your own home vs. doing it in the middle of a fight, you know you're not dealing with a very logical person.

Originally posted by FrothByte
someone doesn't understand the difference between doing something in the comfort of your own home vs. doing it in the middle of a fight

Frothbyte list I agree with.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I backed up my stats with valid proof, screen feats and logic. You backed yours up with opinion, assumptions and favoritism. Just admit that you completely suck at debating.

You backed up your claims with poor logic and lack of basic knowledge!

You forgot that Dr. Strange takes place 1 year prior to Thor Ragnarok. You decided to omit such information and now I have to open your eyes.

Just admit you are too stupid when analyzing information!

Originally posted by FrothByte
Well, when someone doesn't understand the difference between doing something in the comfort of your own home vs. doing it in the middle of a fight, you know you're not dealing with a very logical person.

And you have 0 understanding over logic. Clearly evidenced when you decided to place Strange in #8.

It's clear by now that you are BUT A MARVEL FANBOY with 0 knowledge on the character's powers and abilities

It's evident that debating such topics with you is but to debate with a Kid about University stuff.

Strange is #1. His powers have put him there. After Ragnarok it's clear his magic has improved.

In your massively biased opinion which is based off speculation

A feat for Loki that kind of went under the radar in Ragnarok, was his mental manipulation powers.

He mind wiped/controled the all father for a significant amount of time. Even Odin was impressed.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
You backed up your claims with poor logic and lack of basic knowledge!

You forgot that Dr. Strange takes place 1 year prior to Thor Ragnarok. You decided to omit such information and now I have to open your eyes.

Just admit you are too stupid when analyzing information!

And you have 0 understanding over logic. Clearly evidenced when you decided to place Strange in #8.



It's when you say stuff like this that proves you don't know how feats and proof work. Doesn't matter if it's been a year or 10 since we last saw Dr. Strange, bottom line is you don't know what he did in that time. You can guess at what he did. You can speculate that he's improved, but in the end you have no concrete proof just how much he's improved. No measuring stick.

See the difference between us is you base your argument on what you think happened behind the scenes. I base my arguments on what is actually shown on screen. For example, I know that it took Dr. Strange a number of seconds to make that portal at Loki's feet. I know he had to consult multiple books before he opened that portal to Norway and that he still needed to make hand gestures in order to open that portal. And all this was done after this supposed 1 year that you keep mentioning.


Originally posted by Josh_Alexander

It's clear by now that you are BUT A MARVEL FANBOY with 0 knowledge on the character's powers and abilities

It's evident that debating such topics with you is but to debate with a Kid about University stuff.

Whether or not I'm a Marvel fanboy has little relevance here considering all the characters here are Marvel. Or did you not realize that?

Originally posted by FrothByte
It's when you say stuff like this that proves you don't know how feats and proof work. Doesn't matter if it's been a year or 10 since we last saw Dr. Strange, bottom line is you don't know what he did in that time. You can guess at what he did. You can speculate that he's improved, but in the end you have no concrete proof just how much he's improved. No measuring stick.

See the difference between us is you base your argument on what you think happened behind the scenes. I base my arguments on what is actually shown on screen. For example, I know that it took Dr. Strange a number of seconds to make that portal at Loki's feet. I know he had to consult multiple books before he opened that portal to Norway and that he still needed to make hand gestures in order to open that portal. And all this was done after this supposed 1 year that you keep mentioning.




Whether or not I'm a Marvel fanboy has little relevance here considering all the characters here are Marvel. Or did you not realize that?

I noticed how his last post directed at you was little more than attempts at insults.

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
I noticed how his last post directed at you was little more than attempts at insults.

Yeah, one wonders how old he is. Because that last line



is quite frankly, pretty weak and petty. No self respecting adult would ever get insulted by that.

Originally posted by FrothByte
I backed up my stats with valid proof, screen feats and logic. You backed yours up with opinion, assumptions and favoritism. Just admit that you completely suck at debating.

@ TheVaultDweller

Here is the one who started the insults as usual.

Originally posted by FrothByte
It's when you say stuff like this that proves you don't know how feats and proof work. Doesn't matter if it's been a year or 10 since we last saw Dr. Strange, bottom line is you don't know what he did in that time. You can guess at what he did. You can speculate that he's improved, but in the end you have no concrete proof just how much he's improved. No measuring stick.

See the difference between us is you base your argument on what you think happened behind the scenes. I base my arguments on what is actually shown on screen. For example, I know that it took Dr. Strange a number of seconds to make that portal at Loki's feet. I know he had to consult multiple books before he opened that portal to Norway and that he still needed to make hand gestures in order to open that portal. And all this was done after this supposed 1 year that you keep mentioning.




Whether or not I'm a Marvel fanboy has little relevance here considering all the characters here are Marvel. Or did you not realize that?

Okay okay Froth. Whatever you think.

You are entitled to your opinion in the end. Strange is number 8

Nice judgement.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
Okay okay Froth. Whatever you think.

You are entitled to your opinion in the end. Strange is number 8

Nice judgement.

^ the answer of someone who knows he's been out-debated, is unable to counter the arguments presented, but refuses to admit he was wrong.

Originally posted by Stigma
Rank these MCU characters in order from the most to the least powerful.

Let's rank them in order of who can defeat the biggest number of other people from the list.

Some restrictions:

- Iron Man has no prep time here, but he can use his most powerful suit.

- Doctor Strange is without the time gem.




Iron Man
Scarlet Witch
Thor
Loki
Vision
Hulk
Kurse
Dr Strange
Spiderman

I never addressed your question properly.

1. Dr. Stephen Strange:

His powers over reality clearly put him there. The simple fact that none other character in this list have ever faced a sorcerer means it's gonna be troublesome for them.

Strange proved to be a good learner when he faced Kaecillious. Despite being relatively new to magic, he was able to stand on top of Kaicillious and his gang.

Dr. Strange is a quick learner, and also a motivated one. Taking MCU'S Timeline into consideration, the Dr. Strange we saw in Thor Ragnarok had 1 year to learn and become more powerful.

It's evident that Strange has learnt new tricks and improved. He was able to lock Loki in a Pocket Dimension with quite ease. Even a MASTER OF MAGIC like Loki was easily captured by Strange.

We also witness Strange's Reality Warping when he out of nowhere gave Thor a Beer, and furthermore refilled it out of nowhere.

Strange clearly takes #1 place due to his powers. Powers which no other character in this list have ever faced. There isn't really a way to know how would they counter Dr. Strange's powers.

2. Thor/Hulk/Iron Man: #2 would most likely be a tie.

Iron Man would likely use his Hulk Buster Armor.

Hulk would find no trouble going against Iron Man, however he might have issues with Thor.

On the other hand, Thor would likely have trouble against the Hulk Buster armor, since his lightening would have 0 effect as seen in The Avengers.

I'd put them in a tie, just because this would be like a rock, paper scissors scenario

3. Vision: Although we really haven't seen much from Vision, it's sure to say that having an Infinity Stone on his head definitely grants him this position.

Vision was able to one-blast bring down War Machine! An impressive feat. Also he manage to rip apart and crush several Ultron bots with quite ease.

4. Scarlet Witch: Her TK abilities are impressive. She could certainly give a hell of a fight.

Although she has done quite well against the Vision i doubt she could keep it the same against other characters in this list.

5. Loki : Since the OP never stated the gear for Loki i'd place him here. Since the Mind Gem is attributed now to Vision, it means that Loki doesn't possess his scepter (Unless otherwise stated by the OP).

Loki is still a very formidable opponent without the Scepter. His knowledge over magic and his tricky behavior would likely give him an advantage. However without a proper weapon to aid him, Loki isn't that formidable as to put him higher on the list.

6. Kurse: Fighting the God of Thunder certainly grants him this place.

7. Spider-man: The reason i gave Spider Man this spot is the fact that he is relatively young. He is still immature and even childish when fighting.

Also the fact that the Vulture manage to give him a hell of a fight shows that Spider Man has still much to learn.

It's certain however that in future films Spider Man will definitely climb up the ladder.

Originally posted by FrothByte
^ the answer of someone who knows he's been out-debated, is unable to counter the arguments presented, but refuses to admit he was wrong.

The answer of someone mature who knows that you don't understand what you were claiming.

I'd keep myself from arguing rather than keep proving how mistaken your original claim was.

Originally posted by Josh_Alexander
The answer of someone mature who knows that you don't understand what you were claiming.

I'd keep myself from arguing rather than keep proving how mistaken your original claim was.

A mature person would have addressed the points I raised with counter arguments supported by feats and proof. Not run away from them.

Originally posted by FrothByte
A mature person would have addressed the points I raised with counter arguments supported by feats and proof. Not run away from them.

I did. And when you had no concrete evidence to counter them you attacked me!

Check page 4 and see for yourself.

Originally posted by FrothByte
It's when you say stuff like this that proves you don't know how feats and proof work. Doesn't matter if it's been a year or 10 since we last saw Dr. Strange, bottom line is you don't know what he did in that time. You can guess at what he did. You can speculate that he's improved, but in the end you have no concrete proof just how much he's improved. No measuring stick.

See the difference between us is you base your argument on what you think happened behind the scenes. I base my arguments on what is actually shown on screen. For example, I know that it took Dr. Strange a number of seconds to make that portal at Loki's feet. I know he had to consult multiple books before he opened that portal to Norway and that he still needed to make hand gestures in order to open that portal. And all this was done after this supposed 1 year that you keep mentioning.




Whether or not I'm a Marvel fanboy has little relevance here considering all the characters here are Marvel. Or did you not realize that?

Here's my last reply, the one that you conveniently sidestepped. So stop going around the bush already and just adress the points raised.

Originally posted by FrothByte
Here's my last reply, the one that you conveniently sidestepped. So stop going around the bush already and just adress the points raised.

The only one going around the bush here is you.

I never said Strange wins because his knowledge increased in that year.

I said Strange wins due to his powers PLUS the Year he was given to train/improve.

So stop modifying my words.