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This is average Darksied

lol? still darkseid stomps

The same way they have him Job to superman, he'd be written to Job to surfer.

Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
This is average Darksied

Darkseid destroys him.

Lol. Can someone post the hero's on Surfers level that Darkseid has destroyed in battle.

Surfer races around at superspeed and eventually Darkseid kills himself with his own beams.

Originally posted by JBL
Lol. Can someone post the hero's on Surfers level that Darkseid has destroyed in battle.


https://comicnewbies.files.wordpress.com/2015/06/green-lantern-vs-darkseid-5.jpg

A 14 billion year old Surfer should really be powerful.

Originally posted by Damborgson


Nu52 Hal is not on SS' level.

Originally posted by JBL
The same way they have him Job to superman, he'd be written to Job to surfer.

The same way everyone else but Superman jobs to Darkseid, so would Surfer.

Just like Lobo, or Wonder Woman, or Captain Marvel (He jobbed to Kalibak actually)..

Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Nu52 Hal is not on SS' level.

Isn't it still the same Hal that busted rainbow coalition Krona? Or stood up to Parallax Sinestro?

Originally posted by cdtm
Isn't it still the same Hal that busted rainbow coalition Krona? Or stood up to Parallax Sinestro?

yes it is
and with the now the timeline mergin, pre 52 and nu 52 heroes could very well be the same

Originally posted by JBL
The same way they have him Job to superman, he'd be written to Job to surfer.

Except not since Surfer is nowhere near as formidable or powerful as Superman.

Originally posted by panthergod
Except not since Surfer is nowhere near as formidable or powerful as Superman. lol. Surfer is far more powerful than superman.

Surfer wins.

Originally posted by JBL
lol. Surfer is far more powerful than superman.
Surfer has nothing in his existence comparable to Supermans showings of relative power. At best he's more versatile. That's it. Surfer can't seriously hurt Superman via raw power at this point. Cry about it

Originally posted by panthergod
Surfer has nothing in his existence comparable to Supermans showings of relative power. At best he's more versatile. That's it. Surfer can't seriously hurt Superman via raw power at this point. Cry about it Not going to waste my time with superman loving fans. Believe what you want, but it has been proven countless times that Surfer is far more powerful than your version of superman. PS, not crying, but laughing. Thanks.

DS wins

Superman get the privilege to fight DS below his average

Surfer transmutates a newgod sized Radion buttplug

Originally posted by JBL
Lol. Can someone post the hero's on Surfers level that Darkseid has destroyed in battle. .....he manhandled a team consisting of Power girl, Val Zod, Dr Fate, Flash, obsidian, Steel, Jonni Thunder, Huntress, Batman, Aquawoman, red arrow, and Hawkgirl.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-94tpcClVeUI/VRKGdmuwFvI/AAAAAAAJErU/TWsEYMeW7XQ/s1600/p2_5.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-G_eYcFzbi-E/VRKGew6HxwI/AAAAAAAJErw/ovtFbm0-w3c/s1600/p2_7.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-JAcWiSU0Th4/VRKGfGbLQGI/AAAAAAAJErs/_ZmcrQMZXbI/s1600/p2_8%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-f3MZ5R77yKY/VRKGftqqayI/AAAAAAAJEss/RVxNfbCOYZw/s1600/p2_9%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MXHHEvJb3TI/VRKGZ6Zj6II/AAAAAAAJEqU/Yt0PzmDxTy0/s1600/p2_10%2Bcopy.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-anGxeXgNQ7E/VRKGaNpUh0I/AAAAAAAJEqY/KaGUgAQjyY8/s1600/p2_11%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-CUx3qDKTd4k/VRKGcP8zHrI/AAAAAAAJEq4/53WyHvIcxGs/s1600/p2_16%2Bcopy.jpg

You know JBL is gonna come back with "None of them are equal to SS!"

In 3....2....1....

Originally posted by Inhuman
Surfer transmutates a newgod sized Radion buttplug
then proceed to shove it up his own arse

Originally posted by JBL
Not going to waste my time with superman loving fans. Believe what you want, but it has been proven countless times that Surfer is far more powerful than your version of superman. PS, not crying, but laughing. Thanks.
Concession accepted.

Surfer cant seriously harm Superman via raw power.. Period. Continue to weep bitter tears about that fact.

Darkseid one shots him. Easily.

SMH

Just trying to break it down.

Darkseid shouldn't one shot Surfer, but he is capable of doing physical damage to him. I can't see him for example; breaking his arm like he broke Hal's arm. This is a guy that went up against Morg which showed roughly just how strong the Surfer is.

Bringing up the Thor fight would probably hold no weight, because he hasn't fought Thor as an enemy, or serious threat since their first big showdown in this comic.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/9f/ac/43/9fac436f27aa8f19ec8fbf045842612f.jpg.

The Surfer is actually very strong when focused He easily slapped Maestro aside. but then again, the Surfer has power over gamma powered characters, which is what most, if not all positive based stars give off. Not something that he can count on with Darkseid I guess? unless DS operates on a wavelength that he could interface with?

Darkseid's OE could be a serious problem for the Surfer if he didn't know to evade. But luckily enough, that in this case the Surfer is aware of Darkseid's power set, as he is aware of Surfer's according to forum rules at least.

Could the Surfer outrace them? Yes, but he could also be hit by them. If hit, it's over. Cosmic awareness given by the power cosmic would help the Surfer avoid the OE.

If not, can the Surfer's powers hurt Darkseid if he was operating at peak power?

Which Darkseid portrayal are we talking about here as well? I have difficulty believing all of the hype after seeing Darkseid defeated by Superman.

This is not meant to be a blow to Superman, but we truly need clarity on where to begin measuring Darkseid.

It gave me the idea that Zod could also put a hurting on Darkseid, which also happens to bring up myriads of other characters that should be able to do the same.

I truly wonder for example if Despero could physically contend with Darkseid? Or be too much of a physical threat even?

Mangog would devour any character that could be beaten by Zod, who weighs in at approximately a fully powered count Nefaria level character? This is arguable of course but it seems fair.

If any of that is true, can we use it in terms of getting a clearer picture of how physically powerful Darkseid really is, while unaided by the ALE or outside forces?

Is the Surfer strong enough, to physically subdue Darkseid and hold him in place?

If not is he fast enough to make Darkseid hit himself with the OE?

Can the Surfer contend? Why or, why not?

The problem is that you're linking it to Superman.

Who is the cash cow, and fulfills the role Batman has amongst non powered DC heroes.

You wouldn't say 'oh, so and so is weak because Batman has tagged them', just as you shouldn't say 'so and so is weak because Superman has fought them'.

Thanos beats Surfer.

So of course Darkseid does, even worse.

DS 10/10

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The problem is that you're linking it to Superman.

Who is the cash cow, and fulfills the role Batman has amongst non powered DC heroes.

You wouldn't say 'oh, so and so is weak because Batman has tagged them', just as you shouldn't say 'so and so is weak because Superman has fought them'.

Except that Superman has also fought Zod, and Doomsday has beaten the mess out of Darkseid. How would you figure out just how powerful Darkseid is?

Are we truly trying to say that Orion is a Galactus level threat, which by proxy also implies that Darkseid is as well? Which then makes Superman balloon out to proportions unseemly to situations that fully challenge him like Zod and Doomsday repeatedly do. Their most recent fight pitted Superman up against a Doomsday that hadn't yet faced him. He fully knew what type of a beast he was facing, and was still unable to put him away. Does this mean that the Doomsday that Superman most recently faced would crush Galactus?

So how much does Darkseid weigh without the ALE or outside forces IYO?

Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
DS 10/10 is Average Darksied Thanos level?

Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
is Average Darksied Thanos level?

I don't know, I was trying to figure that out myself but it seems as if no one wants to find a method of figuring out how powerful he is? I can only go off of his battles and comparisons that he himself made concerning being peers of Orion and Superman in terms of power.

Then you have other characters that are only Superman's level when Superman is holding back, despite either being Kryptonian, or Doomsday himself.

At this point, where do you begin to form an argument for one guy that has no set level, because of the idea that every time he's made an appearance no one knew if it was really him, or some avatar?

I would say he lower level than Thanos but I also do think he jobs a lot because he when he does show up, it's usually vs Superman

In Darkseid wars, if that's what people consider as his average, than he destroys this match. I would like people to just say what they assume his average is when they conclude who wins

Originally posted by Stoic
Except that Superman has also fought Zod, and Doomsday has beaten the mess out of Darkseid. How would you figure out just how powerful Darkseid is?

Are we truly trying to say that Orion is a Galactus level threat, which by proxy also implies that Darkseid is as well? Which then makes Superman balloon out to proportions unseemly to situations that fully challenge him like Zod and Doomsday repeatedly do. Their most recent fight pitted Superman up against a Doomsday that hadn't yet faced him. He fully knew what type of a beast he was facing, and was still unable to put him away. Does this mean that the Doomsday that Superman most recently faced would crush Galactus?

So how much does Darkseid weigh without the ALE or outside forces IYO?

Why is Orion a Galactus' level threat? He's fated to kill DS,so any showings relative to DS is circumspect.

Again,using ABC logic doesn't work. By that logic, Batman is the greatest character of all time. He's tanked a bloodlusted GoW Wonder Woman when injured and half naked....when a calm WW was able to fight Grail.

He was able to hurt beings that Flash couldn't.

Said Grail had been able to do etc etc etc and do you see what I'm trying to say?

You're using the Carver route,which focusses purely on fight showings. But writers don't give two hoots about power levels, lol. It's why Superman can rise to the occasion, and fight DS. Why Thor can summon the winds from a thousand world's, and hurt Glory/Chaos King. Why Hulk can tire the Inbetweener out. Why Wally can destroy Anti Monitors armour. Why etc etc.

Orion is inhibited by his mother box. The Astro Force has contained universal busting doomsday weapons, and Orion himself dealt with a Lightray who was giving Takion a rough time.

Thanos routinely hands Surfer his ass.

DS does the same but worse.

Originally posted by deathslash
.....he manhandled a team consisting of Power girl, Val Zod, Dr Fate, Flash, obsidian, Steel, Jonni Thunder, Huntress, Batman, Aquawoman, red arrow, and Hawkgirl.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-94tpcClVeUI/VRKGdmuwFvI/AAAAAAAJErU/TWsEYMeW7XQ/s1600/p2_5.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-G_eYcFzbi-E/VRKGew6HxwI/AAAAAAAJErw/ovtFbm0-w3c/s1600/p2_7.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-JAcWiSU0Th4/VRKGfGbLQGI/AAAAAAAJErs/_ZmcrQMZXbI/s1600/p2_8%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-f3MZ5R77yKY/VRKGftqqayI/AAAAAAAJEss/RVxNfbCOYZw/s1600/p2_9%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MXHHEvJb3TI/VRKGZ6Zj6II/AAAAAAAJEqU/Yt0PzmDxTy0/s1600/p2_10%2Bcopy.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-anGxeXgNQ7E/VRKGaNpUh0I/AAAAAAAJEqY/KaGUgAQjyY8/s1600/p2_11%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-CUx3qDKTd4k/VRKGcP8zHrI/AAAAAAAJEq4/53WyHvIcxGs/s1600/p2_16%2Bcopy.jpg

Those E2 jokers are not even close to Surfer though...

Average Darkseid = Multiversal power

Highend Darkseid = Omniversal Story made manifest

Originally posted by Board Walker
Average Darkseid = Multiversal power

Highend Darkseid = Omniversal Story made manifest

Still can't beat Dracula with dual Adamantium katanas and his army of wolves bats and other creatures of the Plenilune.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Those E2 jokers are not even close to Surfer though... flash alone pushed one of the female furies into infinity. Power girl has several feats that put her on par with normal Supergirl if not above. When he got serious, Val Zod manhandled an amped clone of Superman. Batman is using the miraculo pills (which put him physically on par with hour man). Do I even need to mention that not even ten seconds after stomping this team, he stomps an amped avatar of the green?

Breaking the arm of a regular human, wow ! impressive !

Originally posted by deathslash
.....he manhandled a team consisting of Power girl, Val Zod, Dr Fate, Flash, obsidian, Steel, Jonni Thunder, Huntress, Batman, Aquawoman, red arrow, and Hawkgirl.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-94tpcClVeUI/VRKGdmuwFvI/AAAAAAAJErU/TWsEYMeW7XQ/s1600/p2_5.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-G_eYcFzbi-E/VRKGew6HxwI/AAAAAAAJErw/ovtFbm0-w3c/s1600/p2_7.jpg
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-JAcWiSU0Th4/VRKGfGbLQGI/AAAAAAAJErs/_ZmcrQMZXbI/s1600/p2_8%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-f3MZ5R77yKY/VRKGftqqayI/AAAAAAAJEss/RVxNfbCOYZw/s1600/p2_9%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-MXHHEvJb3TI/VRKGZ6Zj6II/AAAAAAAJEqU/Yt0PzmDxTy0/s1600/p2_10%2Bcopy.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-anGxeXgNQ7E/VRKGaNpUh0I/AAAAAAAJEqY/KaGUgAQjyY8/s1600/p2_11%2Bcopy.jpg
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-CUx3qDKTd4k/VRKGcP8zHrI/AAAAAAAJEq4/53WyHvIcxGs/s1600/p2_16%2Bcopy.jpg

No manhandling in those scans. Power Girl alone gives him all that he can handle.

Originally posted by krisblaze
Those E2 jokers are not even close to Surfer though...

The Marvel heroes trapped outside of the barrier around Earth are more powerful than that group and they struggle against the Chituari wave. Thanos conquers their entire Chitauri civilization casually by himself.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
No manhandling in those scans. Power Girl alone gives him all that he can handle.
Except no, she didn't. Originally posted by TheHulkster
The Marvel heroes trapped outside of the barrier around Earth are more powerful than that group and they struggle against the Chituari wave. Thanos conquers their entire Chitauri civilization casually by himself.
Entire GL corps was dismissed by Mobius (Without ALE which was powerful enough to oneshot kill him).

Darkseid easily beats him down WITH ALE.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
The Marvel heroes trapped outside of the barrier around Earth are more powerful than that group and they struggle against the Chituari wave. Thanos conquers their entire Chitauri civilization casually by himself.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
No manhandling in those scans. Power Girl alone gives him all that he can handle.

She even snatched his eye out. Punched his Omegas back at him. Withstood an Omega blast to the face, etc... there is a scene missing as well where she out paced his Omegas.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
Breaking the arm of a regular human, wow ! impressive !

So Hal Jordan is a regular human now?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Except no, she didn't.


If Superman did close to what she did in those scans against Darkseid, the forum would be filled with scans of Superman being Universal in power from you. She punched his Omegas back at him. You spam post Superman heat vision stopping his Omegas. Her punching them back>>>>Superman temp holding them back. Stop picking and choosing please.

Originally posted by SquallX
So Hal Jordan is a regular human now?

He has always been.

Once you bypass the forcefield...

Originally posted by carver9
If Superman did close to what she did in those scans against Darkseid, the forum would be filled with scans of Superman being Universal in power from you. She punched his Omegas back at him. You spam post Superman heat vision stopping his Omegas. Her punching them back>>>>Superman temp holding them back. Stop picking and choosing please. Owned.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
He has always been.

Once you bypass the forcefield...

Originally posted by carver9
If Superman did close to what she did in those scans against Darkseid, the forum would be filled with scans of Superman being Universal in power from you. She punched his Omegas back at him. You spam post Superman heat vision stopping his Omegas. Her punching them back>>>>Superman temp holding them back. Stop picking and choosing please.

True

Originally posted by SquallX
So Hal Jordan is a regular human now?

Could be worse.

If DS' low showings are Power Girl snatching his eye out (and healing from it)...

https://static0.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/goodcomics/2015/09/panthersurferdisplay.jpg

Fair's fair, right? All showings included? No picking and choosing, right?

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Could be worse.

If DS' low showings are Power Girl snatching his eye out (and healing from it)...

https://static0.cbrimages.com/wp-content/uploads/goodcomics/2015/09/panthersurferdisplay.jpg

Fair's fair, right? All showings included? No picking and choosing, right?

If I recall with that showing the author later said Surfer wasn't resisting the grip from Panther.

Just found it.

https://i.imgur.com/SG1GL13.jpg

Yeah but I'm alive.

1-0 DS.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
If I recall with that showing the author later said Surfer wasn't resisting the grip from Panther.

Just found it.

https://i.imgur.com/SG1GL13.jpg

True

Glad you pointed this out so it'll stop the nonsense and those misinterpreting the scans for their own agendas. Well done, angry Scot.


"Poor reading comprehension skills." Indeed.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
True All showings are indeed fair game.

Perfect. Am glad Dwayne McDuffie interviews are now canon.

No double standards, people! Either all are admissible, or none are!

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Perfect. Am glad Dwayne McDuffie interviews are now canon.

No double standards, people! Either all are admissible, or none are!

The interview isn't even necessary, just shows what happened in the comic. Much like people who don't believe Sentry wanted to die in the end of Siege.

So the Bendis interview further cements it despite it not being needed. Not everything in a comic, film, music is thrown into your face giving you the exact precise answers.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
The interview isn't even necessary, just shows what happened in the comic. Much like people who don't believe Sentry wanted to die in the end of Siege.

So the Bendis interview further cements it despite it not being needed.

Not quite.

See the next panel. Surfer is actually struggling. Remember, this is a guy some say is able to hang with the frickin' Hulk in h2h.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/99751/1796543-scan0016.jpg

Allowing someone to restrain you, means you're not struggling at all. Like a 5 year old holding onto my leg and pretending to restrain me. I wouldn't be grimacing like that, nor would my words be strained in that manner. Or even that Ahh!

If in the comic, Surfer then goes 'haha I was pretending all along!' like I do when my nephew pretends to shoot me, then sure, the interview backs up what's shown on panel.

Also doesn't bode well for his reactions if again, a human-ish level Panther is able to surprise him with a flip.

Also reminds me of the time Board Walker peddled that rubbish theory that Superman tore a hole in the multiverse. I tweeted the author and he confirmed he was wrong. Didn't need the info from the author but it is there.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Not quite.

See the next panel. Surfer is actually struggling. Remember, this is a guy some say is able to hang with the frickin' Hulk in h2h.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/9/99751/1796543-scan0016.jpg

Allowing someone to restrain you, means you're not struggling at all. Like a 5 year old holding onto my leg and pretending to restrain me. I wouldn't be grimacing like that, nor would my words be strained in that manner. Or even that Ahh!

If in the comic, Surfer then goes 'haha I was pretending all along!' like I do when my nephew pretends to shoot me, then sure, the interview backs up what's shown on panel.

The author describes it himself unless you believe he was lying or is wrong?

By allowing to restrain I mean he isn't actively trying to break out which he wasn't. He wanted Panther to feel like he had an advantage. So naturally grimacing and making noises etc is a pretty good way pf doing that.

In reply to your edit. What you are saying only makes sense if you believe that Surfer wasn't allowing himself to be restrained despite what the comic alludes to and what the author clarified.

So if you are coming from that point of view then I can't argue with that. If Surfer wasn't deliberately wanting to be restrained then I would agree with you entirely. But to me that doesn't reflect what was shown.

I don't know if you remember the Bendis interview but he makes the good point where it really is unnatural to have someone blurt out "if x couldn't do this then we couldn't have went to x".

Not everything is laid bare to you.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
The author describes it himself unless you believe he was lying or is wrong?

By allowing to restrain I mean he isn't actively trying to break out which he wasn't. He wanted Panther to feel like he had an advantage. So naturally grimacing and making noises etc is a pretty good way pf doing that.

Then show it in the comic. Otherwise, this is a prime example of:



If there is dialogue from Surfer saying words to the effect of 'got ya good, T'Charlie! My act fooled even you!' (or words like that. I suck at dialogue), then sure, it refutes what's happening on panel.

Otherwise, until I see it from the comic, it's.....yeah. Completely inadmissible.

That armbar uses your own strength against you

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Then show it in the comic. Otherwise, this is a prime example of:



If there is dialogue from Surfer saying words to the effect of 'got ya good, T'Charlie! My act fooled even you!' (or words like that. I suck at dialogue), then sure, it refutes what's happening on panel.

Otherwise, until I see it from the comic, it's.....yeah. Completely inadmissible.


That's because you are acting like media has to have in big bold writing "BREAKING NEWS SURFER WAS ONLY LETTING PANTHER HOLD HIM". (I don't mean this next sentence rudely).

The way you are debating this it's like you need to be given hints to what is happening exactly otherwise you can't know and will remain bemused as to what the answer is.

Again I said once on the topic of Sentry that when he thought Blue Marvel the lekaing Negative Zzone affected him. Which seems pretty obvious to me but not many believed it. So I ask the author and he says its correct. I didn't need proof. Its pretty natural to connect the 2.

Originally posted by TethAdamTheRock
That armbar uses your own strength against you

Erm....no.

What happens if Surfer straightens his right elbow in that scan? Try it now. Put your right hand behind your back. What's stopping you from straightening it? The bicep of an enhanced human? Imagine you're class 100. Would that enhanced human be able to stop your class 100 tricep from straightening your arm????

Originally posted by quanchi112
Glad you pointed this out so it'll stop the nonsense and those misinterpreting the scans for their own agendas. Well done, angry Scot.


"Poor reading comprehension skills." Indeed.



I think that scene was obvious since right after that, Surfer got pissed when Stardust attacked Panther. It was obvious he allowed him to do that so that Panther would talk.

Originally posted by deathslash
flash alone pushed one of the female furies into infinity. Power girl has several feats that put her on par with normal Supergirl if not above. When he got serious, Val Zod manhandled an amped clone of Superman. Batman is using the miraculo pills (which put him physically on par with hour man). Do I even need to mention that not even ten seconds after stomping this team, he stomps an amped avatar of the green?

Val Zod's fights and feats do not put him anywhere near regular Superman.

Same with any of these. The only one with feats close to Surfer would be E2 Alan, and that would be a case of consistency due to him having so few feats.

If you think of any these are on Surfer's level I'd consider getting your brain checked or choosing one of them to BZ me, or any of Surfer's real fans who I'm sure would be more than delighted at the idea.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
That's because you are acting like media has to have in big bold writing "BREAKING NEWS SURFER WAS ONLY LETTING PANTHER HOLD HIM". (I don't mean this next sentence rudely).

The way you are debating this it's like you need to be given hints to what is happening exactly otherwise you can't know and will remain bemused as to what the answer is.

Again I said once on the topic of Sentry that when he thought Blue Marvel the lekaing Negative Zzone affected him. Which seems pretty obvious to me but not many believed it. So I ask the author and he says its correct. I didn't need proof. Its pretty natural to connect the 2.

This is gonna sound weird....but yeah, I am saying exactly that.

Because comics aren't written for battleboards. Dwayne/Hickman/Morrison et al don't care two hoots about what happened in issue #253 of Amazing Adventures, published in 1974 (actually, Morrison prob does lol). Power levels mean nothing for them, if it makes for a good story/exciting visuals.

PIS/CIS etc are all our inventions. Tierings are all of our inventions. What has happened exactly? Deathstroke has stabbed Flash. Batman has tanked WW's punches. Spiderman has defeated Firelord. A literal brick has KOd Surfer. Hulk has been choked out by a snake. Superman has been KOed by a gas station. Hyperion was KOed by an electrical socket.

My point was, using PG as some kind of low showing for DS, when he regrew his eyes pretty quickly AND then owned her, well....low showings for both sides won't be a good way to go.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
The interview isn't even necessary, just shows what happened in the comic. Much like people who don't believe Sentry wanted to die in the end of Siege.

So the Bendis interview further cements it despite it not being needed. Not everything in a comic, film, music is thrown into your face giving you the exact precise answers.

Exactly !

Scott 2 - 0 Darksaint

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
This is gonna sound weird....but yeah, I am saying exactly that.

Because comics aren't written for battleboards. Dwayne/Hickman/Morrison et al don't care two hoots about what happened in issue #253 of Amazing Adventures, published in 1974 (actually, Morrison prob does lol). Power levels mean nothing for them, if it makes for a good story/exciting visuals.

PIS/CIS etc are all our inventions. Tierings are all of our inventions. What has happened exactly? Deathstroke has stabbed Flash. Batman has tanked WW's punches. Spiderman has defeated Firelord. A literal brick has KOd Surfer. Hulk has been choked out by a snake. Superman has been KOed by a gas station. Hyperion was KOed by an electrical socket.

My point was, using PG as some kind of low showing for DS, when he regrew his eyes pretty quickly AND then owned her, well....low showings for both sides won't be a good way to go.

That was a Skyfather snake though to be fair

But then don't forget the normal gorilla that seemingly raped the Hulk.

===

On our discussion there isn't much more that can be said in my opinion. So I'll leave it at that.

Originally posted by carver9
I think that scene was obvious since right after that, Surfer got pissed when Stardust attacked Panther. It was obvious he allowed him to do that so that Panther would talk.

Strange how you allow McDuffie's word, but then....

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11118/111184648/4137398-7599812665-10ict.jpg

I thought it was clear, personally, that it was just her opinion. But you seem to focus on it as if it were fact.

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
That was a Skyfather snake though to be fair

But then don't forget the normal gorilla that seemingly raped the Hulk.

===

On our discussion there isn't much more that can be said in my opinion. So I'll leave it at that.

Fair enough. As it stands, and whilst this may sound like me being a d!ck, I'll try and not, because it is not my intention.

But as things stand:

1. Panther armbarred Surfer, who went all 'Ahhhh!' and had gritted teeth and strained words.

2. You have an interview from McDuffie saying Surfer allowed it all.

3. Interviews are inadmissible, ESPECIALLY if there is no comic dialogue to refute what has been shown, i.e. Point 1.

As I said, not being a d!ck, not with you. But as it stands, all we have is Point 1.

--------

Back on topic, if we ARE to use low showings (PG) then sure. Let's use low showings for both sides.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Strange how you allow McDuffie's word, but then....

I thought it was clear, personally, that it was just her opinion. But you seem to focus on it as if it were fact.

Where did I mention the interview? I said the "scene" is obvious.

Then you have a scan contradicting my post, then?

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
Also reminds me of the time Board Walker peddled that rubbish theory that Superman tore a hole in the multiverse. I tweeted the author and he confirmed he was wrong. Didn't need the info from the author but it is there.

Wrong, child.

Superman did tear open a hole in the multiverse, as I demonstrated it was not the sun due to positioning and lighting.

On panel showings are the highest level of canon, not the words of a tweet that completely contradicts what is on panel.

That person's online tweet you are quoting is not canon, please try harder.

Originally posted by Board Walker
Wrong, child.

Superman did tear open a hole in the multiverse, as I demonstrated it was not the sun due to positioning and lighting.

That person's online tweet you are quoting is not canon, please try harder.

Like I said to Darksaint I have no more to say in this debate. We both have our opinions. Both well established. I'm going to leave it there.

Originally posted by Board Walker
Wrong, child.

Superman did tear open a hole in the multiverse, as I demonstrated it was not the sun due to positioning and lighting.

On panel showings are the highest level of canon, not the words of a tweet that completely contradicts what is on panel.

That person's online tweet you are quoting is not canon, please try harder.

Your opinion is canon but not the guy whom wrote the comic book ?

Originally posted by RealityWarper
Your opinion is canon but not the guy whom wrote the comic book ?

On panel showings are the highest level of canon, and I presented factually and mathematically why it was not the sun, and likely a hole in the multiverse.

The tweet from the person online stated in his opinion it was the sun, but that was proven factually incorrect.

Quotes only are taken into consideration when they do not contradict what is on panel, his did thus his tweet wasn't canon or DC sanctioned.

All I know is OAS has challenged me to a BZ, with an amalgam of his fists,Thunder and Lightning.

I forfeit.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Then you have a scan contradicting my post, then?

Yes, Surfer being pissed that Stardust intervened and Black Panther doing what Surfer wanted him to do and that was talk. They were literally talking to each other while Panther had the hold on him and Surfer didn't want Stardust interfering.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
All I know is OAS has challenged me to a BZ, with an amalgam of his fists,Thunder and Lightning.

I forfeit.


Don't let them get you down, or cause you to feel as if your viewpoint is the of the minority, you are doing good in presenting an objective viewpoint for interpreting all on panel showings fairly.


Your stance is once based in fact, and that on panel showings are the highest level of authenticity.

Some people such as OAS like to use biased tweets or quotes from supposed writers online, that were asked with a biased question to begin with to garner a biased answer.

Either way those quotes have never been and will never be canon or allowable according this forums rules, on panel trumps a random quote that contradicts what is seen on panel.

Originally posted by carver9
Yes, Surfer being pissed that Stardust intervened and Black Panther doing what Surfer wanted him to do and that was talk. They were literally talking to each other while Panther had the hold on him and Surfer didn't want Stardust interfering.

No where on panel does it show or hint that Surfer had intended or wanted to continue being forcefully restrained by Black Panther, it was only when Stardust saved SS that SS could now utilize his powers since he was free.

SS is the weakest high Herald on terms of hand to hand fighting, and durability in close combat.

Originally posted by Board Walker
On panel showings are the highest level of canon, and I presented factually and mathematically why it was not the sun, and likely a hole in the multiverse.

The tweet from the person online stated in his opinion it was the sun, but that was proven factually incorrect.

Quotes only are taken into consideration when they do not contradict what is on panel, his did thus his tweet wasn't canon or DC sanctioned.

Thanks for proving that a a random laser heating at 5000 degrees is multiversal then !

Originally posted by RealityWarper
Thanks for proving that a a random laser heating at 5000 degrees is multiversal then !

No idea what you are referencing

Originally posted by Board Walker
Wrong, child.

Superman did tear open a hole in the multiverse, as I demonstrated it was not the sun due to positioning and lighting.

On panel showings are the highest level of canon, not the words of a tweet that completely contradicts what is on panel.

That person's online tweet you are quoting is not canon, please try harder.

This...

So a laser at 5000 degrees is multiversal ?

Originally posted by carver9
Yes, Surfer being pissed that Stardust intervened and Black Panther doing what Surfer wanted him to do and that was talk. They were literally talking to each other while Panther had the hold on him and Surfer didn't want Stardust interfering.

He was also literally grimacing, and straining through gritted teeth.

Can't get clearer than that. So you have zero proof that he was able to break out of that hold.....that's ok.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
This...

So a laser at 5000 degrees is multiversal ?

Provide scan or reference or you are just spouting nonsense.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
He was also literally grimacing, and straining through gritted teeth.

Can't get clearer than that. So you have zero proof that he was able to break out of that hold.....that's ok.

In space where it is easy to completely cancel BP's leverage and where the Silver Surfer can boost his own strength or just release a little energy projection in an area of effect to get rid of BP...

Sure that he wasn't acting at all.

Originally posted by Board Walker
Provide scan or reference or you are just spouting nonsense.


Noooo.

Superman is totally a threat to the multiverse.

I'm taking good note of that point once we need a character able to kill others through dimensions with a 5000 degrees laser.

Originally posted by RealityWarper
Noooo.

Superman is totally a threat to the multiverse.

I'm taking good note of that point once we need a character able to kill others through dimensions with a 5000 degrees laser.

Reported for trolling, as you aren't providing any sort of scan or reference to give context to your repeated statement.

Injustice Superman had a Yellow lantern ring, and was inducing so much fear that he became more powerful than one of the strongest guardians.

The guardians are sky father level beings, who have shown on panel universal feats of manipulation and power, superman eclipsed that power immensely.

Superman tore a hole in the universe when he killed Ganthet, that makes the feat multiversal as more than a single universe was now visible on panel.

Board Walker is transcendent

Originally posted by Board Walker
Reported for trolling, as you aren't providing any sort of scan or reference to give context to your repeated statement.

Which trolling ?

You are the one whom said that Superman tore a hole in the multiverse, not me.

Where are your scans ???




I'm totally convinced by your far fetching of the feats.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
He was also literally grimacing, and straining through gritted teeth.

Can't get clearer than that. So you have zero proof that he was able to break out of that hold.....that's ok.

Lol...so you're saying he should've been smiling and giggling while trying to dissect information from Black Panther? That make sense. That's not the approach I would take when acting but I guess people handle things differently (lol).

He wanted to talk to Panther, sure.

But Panther surprised him with his speed, and with his skills. Once he was armbarred, he was helpless.

I mean, with class 100 strength, even an accidental spasm would crush Panther lol.

That grimace is as clear as day. If you have anything, ANYTHING, refuting that, which is admissible.....by all means, post it.

Otherwise you're really just adding stuff that isn't present in the comic.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
He wanted to talk to Panther, sure.

But Panther surprised him with his speed, and with his skills. Once he was armbarred, he was helpless.

I mean, with class 100 strength, even an accidental spasm would crush Panther lol.

That grimace is as clear as day. If you have anything, ANYTHING, refuting that, which is admissible.....by all means, post it.

Otherwise you're really just adding stuff that isn't present in the comic.

Lol... believe what you want to believe Dark. Panther put him in the arm bar and Surfer couldn't do anything and Stardust blasted Black Panther off of him and Surfer got mad at Stardust for saving him. I'm not here to change your mind and I'm sure the ones that have mentioned this scene as not being relevant isn't going to take the time to sway your decision (Angry gave up on it). So I'm going to do the same. As long as you know there are people that does not agree with you. Your world is your world though. Nice debating.

Originally posted by carver9
Lol... believe what you want to believe Dark. Panther put him in the arm bar and Surfer couldn't do anything and Stardust blasted Black Panther off of him and Surfer got mad at Stardust for saving him. I'm not here to change your mind and I'm sure the ones that have mentioned this scene as not being relevant isn't going to take the time to sway your decision (Angry gave up on it). So I'm going to do the same. As long as you know there are people that does not agree with you. Your world is your world though. Nice debating.



Let's be consistent.

Surfer wasn't there to fight Panther.

Darkseid wasn't there to fight Earth-2:

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/111336/4663846-8143958748-4be29.jpg

He was only after Earth-2, to prep for the AM.

It is relevant, because if you are seriously thinking that PG is some kind of low showing, then we should take all things into context, and take all showings into account.

You say Surfer was only there to talk to BP, and was acting all the time. Despite all the scan evidence pointing to him being hurt, and him being surprised.

So I can say, DS was only there to feed, and didn't actually care about fighting. Despite all the evidence pointing to him being hurt, right?

Except the eye-snatching was healed in like an issue, and PG>> BP.

But hey, DS is weak cos of PG!

SMH.

Panther and Surfer should be general considered to be as valid as Spidey and Firelord.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Panther and Surfer should be general considered to be as valid as Spidey and Firelord. we can still talk about Dracula, red hulk, Thor, Loki, the Mexicans, and so many others.

the mexicans??

Bueno Excellente would have had his way with Surfer right there.

ooohhhhh THOSE mexicans.....

i can't believe you read that scan.

Don't forget about Manuel the Mighty and his friends:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/3/35945/1654890-m9aaep.jpg

Damb is a youngn' who can read small text.

Unlike you old man. uhuh

Originally posted by One_Angry_Scot
That's because you are acting like media has to have in big bold writing "BREAKING NEWS SURFER WAS ONLY LETTING PANTHER HOLD HIM". (I don't mean this next sentence rudely).

The way you are debating this it's like you need to be given hints to what is happening exactly otherwise you can't know and will remain bemused as to what the answer is.

Again I said once on the topic of Sentry that when he thought Blue Marvel the lekaing Negative Zzone affected him. Which seems pretty obvious to me but not many believed it. So I ask the author and he says its correct. I didn't need proof. Its pretty natural to connect the 2.

This was clarified I don't debate with people who ignore the writers intentions of their own canon work while making up their own fanfic.

Originally posted by Board Walker
Provide scan or reference or you are just spouting nonsense.

https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/7/72524/3622979-4110882172-34276.jpg

Originally posted by TheHulkster
https://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/7/72524/3622979-4110882172-34276.jpg
That's about as valid as Surfer's entire power only able to destroy a space station and him being exhausted after that. Or a few trees.

http://i.imgur.com/pkEpmuQ.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/xYOcGz6.jpg



http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t1/16888072_Spider-Man_Team-Up_02-25.jpg http://s3d4.turboimagehost.com/t1/16888073_Spider-Man_Team-Up_02-26.jpg

Wait a minute... when did killing a Herald become Skyfather level? Then, it wasn't even a one shot.

Originally posted by carver9
Wait a minute... when did killing a Herald become Skyfather level? Then, it wasn't even a one shot.

We are dealing with Abhilogic. Morbius has to work to accomplish this.

Originally posted by abhilegend
So does this mean Odin is getting beaten silly by Jane Thor?

https://s6.postimg.org/unv1t03n5/35_02.jpg
https://s6.postimg.org/ahrju47zl/35_03.jpg
https://s6.postimg.org/kgciglhf5/35_04.jpg
https://s6.postimg.org/id238xhm9/35_10.jpg
https://s6.postimg.org/usyt2oay9/35_11.jpg
https://s6.postimg.org/ifqk9ianl/35_12.jpg
https://s6.postimg.org/qz9y79j01/35_15.jpg

Odin is unable to even do that to Jane Thor. Also lulz at killing someone means you're not able to incapacitate someone. That's just lulzworthy.

If two fighters are fighting evenly and one lands a punch KOing the other, the winner can beat the uncontious openent to death. But the fight ends with the KO and beating him to death is extra BS. Thus, the fight ends with UM being incapacitated. The sustained energy thingy is extra BS.

Odin faces an active god tempest in Mjolnir. Try again.

Originally posted by carver9
Wait a minute... when did killing a Herald become Skyfather level? Then, it wasn't even a one shot.

UM is universal, brah.

Yeah, if KOing UM is a feat, those Mexicans are abstract tier.

Assuming we're using low showings.

Originally posted by carver9
Wait a minute... when did killing a Herald become Skyfather level? Then, it wasn't even a one shot.
Then tell me of an instance where even a skyfather/Galactus level character disintegrated a Superman level being. I'll wait.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
If two fighters are fighting evenly and one lands a punch KOing the other, the winner can beat the uncontious openent to death. But the fight ends with the KO and beating him to death is extra BS. Thus, the fight ends with UM being incapacitated. The sustained energy thingy is extra BS.

Odin faces an active god tempest in Mjolnir. Try again.
Where did you find that Mobius and Ultraman were fighting equally? Mobius flattens Ultraman with one blast and then casually disintegrated him while Ultraman was conscious and pleading for help.

There is no mention of God tempest in the Odin fight. You are just making excuses now.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Then tell me of an instance where even a skyfather/Galactus level character disintegrated a Superman level being. I'll wait.

Galactus disintegrates a Watcher indirectly from star systems away. Odin disintegrates Seth during their battle.

Originally posted by carver9
Wait a minute... when did killing a Herald become Skyfather level? Then, it wasn't even a one shot. Ultraman on Knite is Trans Tier

Darkseid stomps.

This is a non-fight.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
Galactus disintegrates a Watcher indirectly from star systems away. Odin disintegrates Seth during their battle.
Galactus had been amped and the same blast didn't even ko Annihilus or Nova.

Odin transformed Seth into energy, he didn't disintegrate him.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Galactus had been amped and the same blast didn't even ko Annihilus or Nova.

Odin transformed Seth into energy, he didn't disintegrate him. I thought you didn't have the time to post here ? Hmm.

You asked for an example but prove he was amped since we all know you ignore the examples while continuing to exaggerate certain characters.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Galactus had been amped and the same blast didn't even ko Annihilus or Nova.

Odin transformed Seth into energy, he didn't disintegrate him.

Galactus had not been amped. You completely made that up. He is repeatedly stated to be weakened.

When you disintegrate something, you transform it into energy. Same difference.

Originally posted by abhilegend
Then tell me of an instance where even a skyfather/Galactus level character disintegrated a Superman level being. I'll wait.

Disintegrating a Herald level character makes one Skyfather?

How many examples are there of someone being disintegrated?

Originally posted by abhilegend
Galactus had been amped and the same blast didn't even ko Annihilus or Nova.

Odin transformed Seth into energy, he didn't disintegrate him.

How is defeating a Death God (Amped his entire pantheon) less impressive than what Morbius did to Ultraman? Seth is a Death God and cannot truly die permanently.

Originally posted by krisblaze
How many examples are there of someone being disintegrated?

I don't know, but we better buckle up! Apparently that's the line in the sand now. The Phoenix disintegrated Terrax an entire planet and a little while later Thor fought it relatively well.

Thor = Skyfather level?

For someone so incredibly busy you can't do a BZ, you seem to be an incredibly active poster.

Originally posted by TheHulkster
Galactus had not been amped. You completely made that up. He is repeatedly stated to be weakened.

When you disintegrate something, you transform it into energy. Same difference.
No, he was amped as shown on panel.

Transforming him to energy does not equates to disintegration. Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Disintegrating a Herald level character makes one Skyfather?
It does not? How many beings have disintegrated a herald? Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
How is defeating a Death God (Amped his entire pantheon) less impressive than what Morbius did to Ultraman? Seth is a Death God and cannot truly die permanently.
Seth wasn't amped by his pantheon. I have heard that but nobody has been able to show a scan for it.

That version of Seth's body was destroyed far easily by Bloodstrike and he struggled with Loki just two issues ago. Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't know, but we better buckle up! Apparently that's the line in the sand now. The Phoenix disintegrated Terrax an entire planet and a little while later Thor fought it relatively well.

Thor = Skyfather level?
Pretty well means getting stomped again and again?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
For someone so incredibly busy you can't do a BZ, you seem to be an incredibly active poster.
Posting on the phone has its perks.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I don't know, but we better buckle up! Apparently that's the line in the sand now. The Phoenix disintegrated Terrax an entire planet and a little while later Thor fought it relatively well.

Thor = Skyfather level?

And Thor disintegrates Durok. SKYFATHER!

Originally posted by TheHulkster
And Thor disintegrates Durok. SKYFATHER!
Thor killed Durok as what is described as "mother lifting cars to save her kid".

It's called an outlier in the very same comic and Durok isn't disintegrated.

He killed him though. Thor skyfather.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
. The Phoenix disintegrated Terrax

Terrax is Iron Man level. He sucks

Originally posted by TheHulkster
And Thor disintegrates Durok. SKYFATHER!

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
For someone so incredibly busy you can't do a BZ, you seem to be an incredibly active poster. Do not ever waste your time taking a battlezone challenge from his seriously again.

http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris1.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/gallery/http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris2.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/galanphotos/media/cGF0aDovYnJiX2ZlbnJpczMuanBn/?ref=
http://photobucket.com/gallery/http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris4.jpg.html

Skyfather!

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris1.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/gallery/http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris2.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/galanphotos/media/cGF0aDovYnJiX2ZlbnJpczMuanBn/?ref=
http://photobucket.com/gallery/http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris4.jpg.html

Skyfather!

Post him killing the being (can't remember his name but it's the one who was juggling planets and was amped by chaos king) and turning him to dust that was the size of a couple of Jupiter's. What does that make Thor? Abstract?

Originally posted by carver9
Post him killing the being (can't remember his name but it's the one who was juggling planets and was amped by chaos king) and turning him to dust that was the size of a couple of Jupiter's. What does that make Thor? Abstract?

You mean Glory mate?

Would post scans but I'm travelling at the moment.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris1.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/gallery/http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris2.jpg.html
http://photobucket.com/gallery/user/galanphotos/media/cGF0aDovYnJiX2ZlbnJpczMuanBn/?ref=
http://photobucket.com/gallery/http://s673.photobucket.com/user/galanphotos/media/brb_fenris4.jpg.html

Skyfather!
BRB killing Fenris after a dozen of blows is analogical to this?

And where is Fenris disintegrated?